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3:01 PM
this is getting ridiculous
 
@JerryCoffin I did see that question and immediately put it in the 'stupid-ignore' pile.
 
What's ridiculous about interest groups
 
@CatPlusPlus genderization
 
Ell
lambdaladies :L
 
@BartekBanachewicz ..
 
Ell
3:03 PM
that's such a cringey name
 
> there's too little women in FP community, so we've created FP community only for women
either I don't get it at all, or it's absurdly fucking dumb.
 
If you feel alienated by a community, then having another community that might suit you better is a good option to have
It's an integration issue
 
@BartekBanachewicz looks like some kind of gender discrimination to me
 
> We would appreciate it if you would spend around 15 minutes to complete a survey on developers' feelings
 
Ell
it is of course gender discrimination
but I think it's okay
 
3:06 PM
lol
 
Ell
just like having men only golf clubs is okay
 
Are we doing a contest of 'whose opinions are the worst'
3
 
> Lambda Ladies is an online community for anyone who identifies as a girl or woman and is interested in functional programming.
 
that's sexist
 
> identifies as a girl
 
3:06 PM
lol
 
I want to join Lambda Ladies
without being a lady
 
@AlexM. go to Casablanca first
 
I feel marginalized
 
and objectifiueaianblabla
 
Ell
3:07 PM
@AlexM. just identify as one
 
If I were a woman I wouldn't want to hang out with horrible nerds like you either
 
I may be horrible
but I'm not a nerd
 
^ same
 
Ell
I'm an unhorrible nerd
 
#lyingtoyourself
 
3:08 PM
just published this, possibly related: hpcwire.com/2014/11/05/…
 
@AlexM. you're just a fat otaku, IIRC
 
Ell
What kind of horrible are we talking?
 
@Ell the kind of horrible that would put Catt off if he were a woman
 
All nerds are horrible
 
#whateverthatmeans
 
Ell
3:09 PM
Then I'm not horrible
 
We all are
 
Ell
maybe I'm not a nerd then :P
 
NVIDIA usually says the contrary: i.imgur.com/MY6Xh.jpg
 
That's why women prefer to have their own communities
 
(notice the fb nickname)
 
Ell
3:10 PM
@MarcoA. wetcraft :L
wow
 
I blame Bartek for starting this shit
I just woke up aaaa
 
bbbbb
 
I want a cheeseburger
or a shawarma
or something
 
I want to go home and sleep
I'm tired of hearing the support people explaining to customers how to use a computer
 
QA is busy so we can't get my lib tested yet
 
3:13 PM
@CatPlusPlus it's 4pm dude
 
so we just started chatting randomly about dota
 
Are times in transcript still UTC or local time I never fucking know
Or in history
 
@BartekBanachewicz He's living on US West Coast time
 
Fuck this chat
 
there was a dota 2 championship inside the company before I was hired
 
3:14 PM
Discodevs be gone
 
I missed that one :(
 
@MarcoA. such bullshit, why don't they also try to get 50% of mover jobs?
 
@TonyTheLion lol srsly?
 
Well the SQL was done by a newbie
Woo my memory isn't complete shit
We need to do some fukken opsec training or whatever
 
@BartekBanachewicz well its about morning there now
 
There's an upside.
At least I can now easily spot idiots in interviews now.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes it's so catchy.. when will the movie be released?
 
Ell
Yeah I remember rust having sigils
I thought it still had them until now
 
@TonyTheLion join ussss
 
3:46 PM
@EtiennedeMartel What? They mention Blow's language?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Yes.
 
Ask them if closures are high impact
 
I mean, without that they'd probably go and say something silly 15 minutes later.
But my time is precious.
 
hello there lounge
 
3:50 PM
Top comment in his latest video is some 30 lines of going on about how much we can change the syntax if you don't have to be compatible with C.
GUYS SYNTAX MUST PRETTY NO ONE CARES CLOSURES.
 
Good job Blow
 
Ell
 
did I miss something?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes the comment got one thing right tho
> The language should have a pretty syntax for the techniques you're supposed to use.
 
I think making a language right isn't just pretty syntax
 
3:54 PM
nobody said "just"
 
> You want the initial water that hits the ground coffee to be very hot - 90C or higher. This helps prevent the extraction of excessive sour tastes, and also aids in keeping the caffeine extraction down by 5-10%. (Caffeine = bitters in the cup)
woah
 
there's things like type inference that also don't make you repeat yourself
 
@BartekBanachewicz AKA kiddies will be brewing coffee with ice cold water
 
@BartekBanachewicz I take any advices in any cooking instructions with a load of salt
@BartekBanachewicz a lot of pseudoscience going on
 
Ell
I can't integrate ah
 
3:58 PM
@orlp welp they often come from experienc
 
@BartekBanachewicz as I said, pseudoscience
 
@orlp salt is an important ingredient when cooking
 
try putting "from personal experience" as a source in a scientific paper - see how fast it gets denied
 
so be sure to always take some with you
 
4:01 PM
@AlexM. my salt gets stolen in my dorm kitchen :(
 
get an apartment
 
I'm unemployed
 
sux
 
and semi-full-time studying
 
Am I understanding these traits correctly. You basically define a struct, then define how you implement trait foo for said struct, then define how you implement trait bar for said struct. Rather than saying "here is a blob of functions, some are for trait foo, some for trait bar, some are just 'class functions'"
 
4:03 PM
@thecoshman think of a trait as a set of requirements
 
@orlp I know what they are intems of defining them
 
@thecoshman then something that implements the trait fulfills the requirements, and something that expects the traits knows that which he gets because he knows the requirements are true
 
it's how you 'implement a struct implementing those traits'
 
oh
 
struct MyStruct{...} impl traitFoo for MyStruct { ... } impl traitBar for MyStruct { ... }
vs
struct MyStruct{...} impl traitFoo traitBar for myStruct{...}
 
4:05 PM
I don't know
 
what if two traits just so happen to say they both want |int,int|->float?
 
@thecoshman Traits are completely post hoc.
 
Anyone here remember how to do induction? .-. I'm failing hard
 
Structs have only data.
 
@Ell need help?
 
4:07 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes o_0
 
Ell
@rubenvb Yes please <3
 
Each trait defines a specific behaviour.
 
Ell
I don't understand why the image above is true. maybe I'm not providing enough information though
 
@corvid Take a circuit and put a lot of electricity in it, and then put another circuit nearby
 
Ell
the image is taken from a mark scheme btw
 
4:07 PM
Those behaviours don't have to be part of the struct when you define it.
 
@Ell let's chat in a separate room
 
yeah I get the basic trait stuff.
 
Ell
@rubenvb sure :)
 
*mathematical induction
 
4:08 PM
you just have some where a block that say "here I say how this struct can be used with this trait, look at these functions that let that struct 'be' that trait!"
 
@thecoshman There's no conflict because the functions have different names?
 
@thecoshman where would "these functions" be defined?
 
But even then, usually you select the trait you need and only that trait's functions are in scope.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes what if they don't? what if you have two traits that both requires the same function, name args and return type. And you want to implement them both for your struct.
 
@thecoshman You do.
The functions belong to the traits.
 
4:10 PM
ah... so you have foo::f(int)->int and bar::f(int)->int
 
Kind of, yeah.
 
the trait you implement them from forms part of the signiture
and then if you want those functions to use the same code, you just have some 'private' method.
 
Say, a function fn foo<T : SomeTrait>(whatever : T) { whatever.conflicting_name(); } has no conflict because only SomeTrait is in scope.
You could have a conflict if you require two traits that have a function of the same name: fn foo<T : SomeTrait+OtherTrait>(whatever : T) { whatever.conflicting_name(); }.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes yeah, you are getting the 'conflicting_name()' that was explicitly stated as being for the 'SomeTrait' trait
 
And if you have both then you just have to disambiguate probably
 
4:12 PM
But there there is a way to disambiguate.
 
Dunno if you're talking about a real language here
 
well, it'd be like SomeTrait::conflicting_name(whatever) I guess...
 
In C# afair you cast to that specific interface first
 
@thecoshman I'm not sure if you can do that.
 
AFAIK the struct.function() syntax is sugar...
 
4:13 PM
But even if you can't, you can just make fn conflicting_name1<T : SomeTrait>(whatever : T) ... and fn conflicting_name2<T : OtherTrait>(whatever : T) ...
 
@CatPlusPlus Rust... if that's 'real'
 
user1804599
Rust is fake.
 
An extra level of indirection solves everything.
2
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes lol
life motto right there
 
what's a moto
 
4:14 PM
A transportation method
 
=/
 
suck my balls
 
I want a teleportation method
 
I think you misspelled bals there
 
@thecoshman In a different universe I'd troll flag you, but then the mods would come after me
 
4:15 PM
Gordon will ban you forever
 
whos gordon
 
gordon freeman
 
A contender for 'worst SO mod' award
 
@thecoshman linked that a lot of hours ago
 
user1804599
4:16 PM
.@Oreo While you’re seeking that, feast your eyes on the real Milky Way, seen by our missions: http://1.usa.gov/1gT12y http://t.co/dyzD3DPumJ
 
user1804599
top kek
 
@CatPlusPlus what'd he do
 
@orlp well cry me a river.
 
user1804599
@thecoshman are you sure?
 
@thecoshman river = well(me.cry(a))
 
4:21 PM
So should I try Rust for something for real
What's the verdict here
 
Let me roll my die.
 
I presume Rust generics allow you provide special cases... like... thingy(s:&Str){...} thingy(T){...}
@CatPlusPlus It looks very good, but then I'm not a language layer (clearly)
 
R. Martinho "8-ball" Fernandes
@thecoshman I'm not a language layer either
Okay I'll stop :v
 
@CatPlusPlus I see I'm wrong... but no idea the correct word :(
 
Lawyer
 
4:23 PM
lol
 
Well that's fucking retarded (ノಠ益ಠ)ノ彡┻━┻
 
@CatPlusPlus You will be implementing an enterprise data storage facility in the cloud using the lastest encryption and performance standards. You will be using XML, Rust frontend, a PHP backend and the latest tooling available in our office (VS2008).
 
@thecoshman It's a person that does something with law.
 
And by latest encryption standard you mean SSL 1.0
 
@thecoshman Don't think so.
 
4:25 PM
@CatPlusPlus No, we use our private patent pending (R) SecuCrypt, using the latest MD4 and DES encryption
 
@thecoshman You can just implement your trait for the special cases directly, no?
 
It has multidispatch now I think
 
Ell
yah it does
 
I don't see how that lets you do what cosh said.
It's only for trait impls.
 
I've been reading Bjarne's book, about copy and move constructors. Are "copy" and "move" roughly equivalent to "pass by value" and "pass by reference?" Because I understand what a copy constructor is, but I'm not clear on move constructors. What exactly is "moving?"
 
4:30 PM
they're not remotely equivalent
 
It's taking the guts of one object and shoving it into another
 
moving basically implies that you don't need the source object anymore.
 
And then muttering dark incantations to bring the other object to life
 
@RobertHarvey a good example is a std::vector
 
It's basically like template specialisation. I guess you would have to wrap your input as an enum
 
4:31 PM
@RobertHarvey a copy would have to allocate new memory and copy all elements
 
Phone btw, so it's great
 
@RobertHarvey a move can just copy the pointers to the actual data and set them to null in the original object, because the original object is not used anymore
 
Can't help you I'm a phone
 
help I'm a phone
 
I was phone
 
4:32 PM
I, phone
 
Ffs
 
@orlp Ah, right. That makes sense. I'll go back and read that section again.
 
RRust has actually got me excited about programming again :-)
 
4:33 PM
riprust
 
FWIW, I find that C++ is not the obtuse, unapproachable language you guys make it out to be.
But then, I'm only to chapter 5.
 
neither do I
 
Give it few years
 
@RobertHarvey I think the quote about quantum physics applies here.
 
And few actual implementations
Every tool in this ecosystem is either shitty or broken or both
 
4:34 PM
@RobertHarvey If you think you understand C++ (quantum physics), you do not understand C++ (quantum physics).
 
@RobertHarvey Does this help: i.imgur.com/RZp3S.png?
 
@CatPlusPlus Are you russian?
 
Any way, I can't tolerate phone chat any more
 
@Columbo polish
 
@CatPlusPlus That's what the guys in the Whiteboard were saying. It's not about the pristine, new code that you write, it's about the mounds of broken code that already exist.
 
4:35 PM
@RobertHarvey Practically speaking, a move is a copy where you know that the argument you're copying from is no longer going to be needed, so rather than naively copy everything, you can take shortcuts and "steal" from the object
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Yes, that does, thanks.
 
guess I'm late to the party :)
 
That helps too, thanks.
 
a cannibalizing copy :D
I should go find some dinner
seeya
 
Well, actually its called a shallow copy. A normal copy is deep.
Moves are just copying references (e.g. pointers) to resources instead of copying the resources. Because there is no need for two copies of that resource to exist at the same time.
 
4:38 PM
@Columbo that's just one instance of moving
 
@orlp ?
It was about time for language-based move semantics anyway, in a language used for performance-critical applications ;)
 
@Columbo not everything you can move and where moving is useful is a reference
 
@Columbo No, moves also transfer ownership.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Yes, they do. That's the next thing.
 
moves copying references is an implementation detail.
that definitely does not apply in all cases.
far from all cases.
 
4:41 PM
you can for example move threadlocks, move an internal precomputation state, make move-only types to forbid copying while allowing things to be passed around, etc
 
@Puppy I highly doubt that.
 
@Columbo int x = f(); given int f().
 
@Puppy That is not a move.
 
indeed it is.
 
[asks simple question, gets debate]
 
4:49 PM
welcome to reality.
 
user1804599
¡Hola, coños!
 
user1804599
und Bartek.
 
@Puppy Well, okay, you seem to be right. I meant class objects.
 
then you were a moron
 
user1804599
Ugh.
 
user1804599
4:53 PM
Colleague asks me to deploy the software.
 
@Puppy And I'm not a moron anymore? Just five minutes ago?
 
user1804599
WHICH SOFTWARE THERE ARE THREE ONGOING PROJECTS
 
definitely still feeling the moron.
 
@Puppy The only moronic thing is to bring up moronism in a debate.
... which would make me a moron myself by that definition; I retract it.
 
FFS, it's an int.
Link to rules is gone.
 
4:55 PM
I'll try
(Wheres the link? :D)
Ah, got it
 
meta-moronism.
 
std::tie(std::ignore) = std::make_tuple( The Rules );
Meh
Not good
Maybe with ignore? Not better
 

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