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4:00 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes Yes, both with VC10 and VC12
 
hhahahahahahhahahahahahahaah
 
(also with november 2013 CTP)
 
It's the two-phase lookup bullshit.
 
@rightfold yeah, all those shiny tools. Perl is still my hammer of choice those most of the time :D mostly because I know it winds up so many people that I choose to use a thread clawed hammer to saw through glue :P
 
user3010322
Having worked with VC++ for a long time, I am very convinced it is a bug in VC++ with its two-phase lookup shit. This bites me all the time when I'm refactoring const static variables or const globals and I get fucked up when I finally call the function a day later. — ThePhD 45 secs ago
 
user3010322
4:01 PM
=[
 
So. My girlfriend wants me to teach her how to program.
 
user3010322
Compiling my code with GCC is gonna be the worst.
 
user3010322
@EtiennedeMartel She may only learn while she's sitting on your dick.
 
user3010322
She'll quit within an hour.
 
@ThePhD Considering how much she likes that, I'm not sure.
 
4:03 PM
@EtiennedeMartel woo. Lua bestest 1st lang ever.
 
@BartekBanachewicz Oh fuck off.
 
tested on my GF
 
user3010322
@BartekBanachewicz I thought your girlfriend hated coding?
 
@EtiennedeMartel pff. haters gonna hate
 
user3010322
@EtiennedeMartel Give her like, uh. C# and shit. Gots all the good library shit.
 
4:04 PM
@ThePhD yeah well before she started hating it she tried it
 
user3010322
There's also Python.
 
there's also haskell
 
@ThePhD There's a joke in there.
 
user3010322
Haskell is pretty math heavy. If she doesn't like math, that's not gonna fly.
 
user3010322
@EtiennedeMartel Snake Charmer, at least for you. :b
 
4:04 PM
@EtiennedeMartel IT'S A TRAP!
 
Pick a project for her to work on that she'll be interested in. Pick the language based on the project.
 
@ThePhD She is a snake charmer.
 
@thecoshman You beat me to it. Recipie for disaster...
 
user3010322
For realsy reals?
 
@AndyProwl Oh god...
 
4:06 PM
@MartinJames yeah, I am glad my misses has no interest in knowing these things
 
@ThePhD It's about my dick.
 
@EtiennedeMartel Find another one.
 
@StackedCrooked ;)
 
Too many cynics in here.
 
user3010322
I'm not cynical!
 
user3010322
4:06 PM
I think she could do well.
 
@EtiennedeMartel ah, so you've got a hooded cobra?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Et tu, Brute?
 
user3010322
Just, take it slow.
 
user3010322
Especially if she has no math background.
 
@ThePhD gigady
 
4:06 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes Yes, makes sense, but I'm wondering if this is really forbidden by the Standard. 14.6.3/1 says "Non-dependent names used in a template definition are found using the usual name lookup and bound at the point they are used", which seems to support your point, but is the compiler actually required to emit a diagnostic for default arguments if the template is never instantiated? I do have some memories about strange issues with default arguments
 
What's a good night out? a) Meal in swanky restaurant, couple drinks then sex. b) Debugging haskell/Lua/Perl shit.
 
@thecoshman Except it doesn't bite.
 
@AndyProwl Every non-dependent name has to be looked up before instantiation.
 
@MartinJames First choice, of course. Sex beats Haskell any day.
 
user3010322
@MartinJames I would do (b).
 
4:07 PM
@EtiennedeMartel ... spitting
 
user3010322
The stipulation would be that if she successfully debugged the problem, I would eat her out.
 
user3010322
I would then enjoy her debugging frustrations greatly.
 
@MartinJames some people are in to some kinky shit... I'm sure someone somewhere gets off on fixing bugs...
 
user3010322
And when she gives up, I'll patronizingly pat her head and tell her she tried her best. :3
 
@thecoshman Right.
 
user3010322
4:08 PM
Just to get her angry.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Ah, I see. I'm trying to figure out where the Standard specifies this
 
@ThePhD What the fuck.
 
@ThePhD so how is single life treating you?
 
user3010322
@thecoshman Great, actually.
 
@thecoshman <3
 
4:09 PM
@EtiennedeMartel Ask her what she wants to do
 
user3010322
Interview tomorrow. u.u
 
man... I've nearly rep capped on my rage about the plink sound :D
 
user3010322
@CatPlusPlus That's what I said! She probably has some problem she wants to solve.
 
user3010322
If you can give her the skills to solve htat problem, she'd love programming.
 
4:09 PM
@ThePhD It's not
 
user3010322
@CatPlusPlus Tootally is.
 
@CatPlusPlus woah there casanova, you don't go giving bitches a choice like that. Do you have any idea how long it takes them to decide if they want chicken or steak?
 
user3010322
Albeit, I've only ever interacted with Haskell by reading a JPEG decoder in Haskell, so. u.u;
 
I'd say that without preconceptions about programming functional programming is way easier than imperative
 
Functional programming isn't as intuitive as imperative programming, at least for those without a math background.
 
4:11 PM
There are studies on it.
 
Of course there are
 
@EtiennedeMartel (and they show you wrong)
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Well, damn.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes well that settles everything. There are studies people! studies ಠ_ಠ
 
@thecoshman Read on?
 
4:11 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes lol, best argument ever
 
Studies made by boring people?
 
@Jefffrey Read on?
 
FLOAT ON
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes studies ಠ_ಠ
 
The big trouble about learning functional programming is paradigm shift
But if you don't know any paradigms, that's not a problem :v
 
user3010322
4:12 PM
If there's no paradigm, there's no need to shift.
 
user1174868
Is this the new C room?
 
@EtiennedeMartel jell off (I never did work out what chavs meant when they say that)
 
@thecoshman I thought you were all for "some guy with a Ph. D. said it".
 
No, it's not a new C room
 
@ripDaddy69 there's a new C?
 
4:12 PM
@ripDaddy69 yup
 
user1174868
damn
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes studies ಠ_ಠ
 
What about it?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes studies ಠ_ಠ
 
4:13 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes studies ^_^
 
There is a point somewhere
 
This is getting boring pretty fast
 
@EtiennedeMartel urm
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes You didn't name the guy with the Ph. D. that said it
 
4:13 PM
How does that science thing work
2
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I have no idea... I'm just ready to go home *_*
 
user1174868
If I malloc a char** how large does it need to be? Is it merely holding the pointers or is it holding all the strings that I am about to shove into it?
 
@EtiennedeMartel Heh, I called the HR guy, they're not hiring fresh graduates atm. =/ I guess I am the exception that confirms the rule :P
 
user3010322
@Borgleader For Ubisoft?
 
@Borgleader Means you can't suck worth a damn.
 
user3010322
4:14 PM
Will they accept unbaked non-graduates? >.>
 
@Borgleader lame
 
@ripDaddy69 switch to C++
 
user1174868
@Jefffrey Can't
 
y
 
user1174868
WELL
 
user1174868
4:15 PM
GUESS MY WORK HERE IS DONE
 
Great, bye
 
user3010322
Buhbye! See you soon! :D
 
Amazing.
 
bye
 
user1174868
Oh IM NOT LEAVING
 
4:16 PM
@ripDaddy69 future reference, this is certainly not a C room. This is a lounge first and foremost. If you have a question, ask it on Stack Overflow.
 
user3010322
Oh, well then.
 
Has it gone yet? Can I come back up?
 
user1174868
I am question banned on stack overflow
 
It's never been, and never will be a C room
 
@MartinJames not yet
 
4:16 PM
You're question banned here, too
7
 
user1174868
I am only lite-question banned here
 
@EtiennedeMartel It's a typical way of imperative programmers to say "but we deal with imperative algorithms in every day life!" (like cooking recipes). However, if you look at (at least some) problems in SE, they are expressed in terms of input and output; if the requirements had steps, it would naturally imply implementation. For example, "given a list of numbers, print them sorted" is different from "given a list of numbers, sort them and print them". I think the first should be preferred.
 
@ripDaddy69 I'm guessing there is a reason for that. Coming here is not the anser.
 
@thecoshman Ignore him. He's a known vampire here.
 
we know
 
user1174868
4:17 PM
meow
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes ah right so. Going home soon any way
 
Xeo
kay, even with the opioid-based painkillers, I can only sleep 6h at a time before waking up due to leg pain, it seems. They're supposed to work for 12h. :<
 
@BartekBanachewicz Good points. But I think it boils down to what kind of problem you're trying to solve.
 
I wonder why he's not on the MiniFame, though.
 
... that 'o' changes context quite a bit.
 
user1174868
4:19 PM
What is the C room? I can never find it
 
@EtiennedeMartel very much. That's why I am not insisting on teaching every newbie programmer using FP. I just think that both imperative and functional programming can be really intuitive, basing (exactly!) on the problem being solved. And it's actually quite the same with experienced programmers picking a solution for a given problem, because some are better solved with FP and some with IP.
 
Admit it, you just use that as an excuse to plug Lua.
 
@ripDaddy69 C programmers are not nice or interesting enough to be able to form long lasting communities. As such, all C rooms eventually wither and die.
 
I think that Lua is a good language for beginners for many other reasons
 
Nice thing about Haskell is that it can do both functional and imperative
 
4:20 PM
@BartekBanachewicz Feels like 1993.
 
And my experience when showing it to beginners seems to confirm that
 
@EtiennedeMartel lol
 
Not so nice thing is fucking bindings to everything
 
@thecoshman it's the truf
 
Esp on Windows
 
4:21 PM
so should I order Intel Galileo?
 
user1174868
maybe C programmers are just too efficient for chat
5
 
@Jefffrey ... did I doubt it?
 
user3010322
@ripDaddy69 Well, I guess you're fucked then.
 
@thecoshman just making sure :)
 
user3010322
4:22 PM
@BartekBanachewicz What is that?
 
@ripDaddy69 Or too caught up in their segfaults waiting to happen to have time to chat.
 
@ThePhD something like RPi but on x86
 
user3010322
Ooh.
 
user3010322
I might need something like that.
 
@CatPlusPlus I would say something about web browser apis and haste again, but I am afraid you'll hit me this time.
 
4:22 PM
@Jefffrey no you weren't... you starting?
 
@ThePhD $55
 
That API with million string types is not a good API for beginners
 
user3010322
Good to know.
 
well that isn't very much
let's order one
 
@ThePhD what ever it is, you don't need it.
 
4:23 PM
I always wanted a dev kit
 
int main (int argc, char** argv[]) // That's what he usually did in class.
 
@CatPlusPlus s/ for begginers//
 
user3010322
My professor wants me to make a DSP for like 88 incoming analog signals.
 
user3010322
I was going to use Raspberry Pi.
 
user3010322
But I think Intel Galileo might be better, just because I could maybe do C++ with the usual x86, 32-bit assumptions
 
4:24 PM
@thecoshman yes
 
@ThePhD FPGA or one of the other other doofers...
@Jefffrey <face slap>
 
@ThePhD You have a fab plant at your uni?
 
home!!!
 
user3010322
@MartinJames fab plant?
 
@thecoshman I don't even know what you mean, but yes.
 
4:25 PM
@ThePhD A foundry
 
@ThePhD 'make a DSP' :)
 
user3010322
Digital Signal Processor.
 
Where magical blue smoke is being put into metal shells
 
user3010322
He wants me to add like Phlanging (sp?) and Echo and Vibrato and Reverb and shit to the outgoing sounds.
 
Phlegming
 
user3010322
4:26 PM
I figured it'd be good to try for when I start wrapping up FMOD or my own sound engine for doing real-time DSP on sounds.
 
@CatPlusPlus hehe, magic smoke.
 
@ThePhD 88 A>D convertors? You'll have fun writing the driver for that.
 
eh Galileo has 256MB of RAM
new Pis have 512 IIRC
so kinda meh
 
OTOH, maybe there's already a board with loads of ADC on it.
How many PCIe slots does Raspberry Pi have?
 
None?
 
4:31 PM
anybody know how can I make KDevelop's menubar appear like gnome applications menu ?
 
Do you know any modern C++ noob tutorial i can send to my friend that puts him on the right track directly?
 
The right track is not C++
 
@DavidKron Yeah, it's called a book.
 
Says Cat Plus Plus
 
@DavidKron C++ Primer
 
4:32 PM
@DavidKron Don't listen to @Cat and @rightfold, they hate everything.
 
@DavidKron he's right
@CatPlusPlus Galileo has one PCIe
 
(Just avoid C++ Primer Plus, it's awful.)
 
@ThePhD it's "Flanger", not "Phlanger"
 
@Griwes The c++ programming language is great and modern, but its probably way to big to throw at a noob.
 
@BartekBanachewicz I have seen ADC boards for PCIe, but only up to 64 channel.
 
4:34 PM
@DavidKron We don't want noobs in the language (you probably want to check the difference between "noob" and "newbie", btw.).
 
@DavidKron it requires attention to detail
BTW @Griwes I have a Q for you, just don't shout on me like on the other guy because it's OS related
 
And we all know we learn by trying, not reading books.
 
@BartekBanachewicz ?
 
You can't learn C++ by trying
 
@DavidKron bullshit
 
4:34 PM
@Griwes Yeah i gues, newbie then. He knows python, erlang and haskell.
 
@DavidKron then why the fuck would he need C++
 
@DavidKron Books are the basis for those attempts, you have to know how and what you should use before you start trying.
 
Sorry, said that wrong
You can't learn C++
 
@CatPlusPlus Lol
 
@BartekBanachewicz I shouted at him, because he asked only questions that are answerable by several google searches :D
 
4:35 PM
@Griwes Can I somehow easily boot android to something very very simple that would allow me to mimic a non-OS behaviour using its kernel so I don't load all the bullshit but keep the IO with stuff?
 
He now came to osdev.org and I have to yell at him again :(
 
It would be cool if there is any book that completely skips raw pointers and only introduces move semantics and unique_ptr instead.
I think bjarnes book does that, more or less
 
3 mins ago, by Bartek Banachewicz
@DavidKron C++ Primer
 
@BartekBanachewicz I have no clue about android, except the fact that its kernel is linux... :D
 
4:37 PM
dam
 
Stay away from Tour of C++, btw.
I have to mention this every time someone mentions Bjarne and books.
 
I think I won't be able to use it reasonably w/o the kernel
 
Answers from Google searches are no good - the profs and TA's spot the copy/paste too easily. Much easier to get some idiot goon on SO to generate a precis for you.
 
You need way more than just a kernel for this stuff to make it usable
 
And stay away from C++ Primer Plus, which is often confused with C++ Primer.
 
4:37 PM
It's a draft version of the first chapters of TC++PL4, sent straight to the printers.
 
@MartinJames :D
 
@CatPlusPlus really?
I mean, dev ARM boards really don't need much
 
@BartekBanachewicz lol
 
So you ask a question like this:
http://stackoverflow.com/questions/21581953/processes-threads-and-concurrent-programming
 
How did you imagine running without a kernel?
(Running an OS without its kernel, that is.)
 
4:38 PM
@Griwes while (true) { /*paste your OS code here */ }
 
See the following message.
 
I didn't want to run an OS
 
@BartekBanachewicz Lol
 
If you want a programmable board, there's cheaper alternatives to hacking open an Android-powered phone and throwing everything but the CPU out
 
I wanted to turn the device into something like a dev board which doesn't need one
 
4:39 PM
Then maybe tell what you want to achieve (but don't fall into the XY trap again :D)
@BartekBanachewicz Define "dev board". A board that will serve as a development target for you?
 
Get an Arduino or somethin
 
BRB I have a bus to catch will answer asap
 
@BartekBanachewicz, there are Bare Bones bootloaders/kernels for SoCs that are most commonly used for development.
 
//Fast os 1.1
int main() {Java* os = new java("mainclass.java");os->run()}
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Yup--that's why the quit working if you apply (for example) too high a voltage--the magic smoke escapes.
 
4:42 PM
@BartekBanachewicz There is also Travis Geiselbrecht's lk that has tons of ports to different platforms and most probably boots your phone.
 
@JerryCoffin Yeah - and it smells really nasty:)
 
@MartinJames Not so terrible with modern G10 epoxy PC boards. I don't know what they used in ancient tube radios, but it smelled a lot worse.
 
user1804599
@Griwes Bullshit.
 
user1804599
I do not hate Perl and Scala.
 
...yet.
You don't hate Perl and Scala yet.
 
4:45 PM
Problem is that most ADC boards come with drivers for Windows, Linux and little else. If you're lucky, you may get a schematic which, if you're OK with digital electronics, user manuals, interrupts, DMA etc, you can build your own driver.
 
Hey, where did the lounge faq go?
 
@rightfold You obviously need to improve your taste--Perl and Scala are both pretty despicable.
 
user1804599
Oni Chichi is sick and funny.
 
@DavidKron To a better place... ;(
 
@DavidKron Some dummy forgot to bold it.
 
4:47 PM
Seriously though, look at the starboard.
 
@JerryCoffin Last chip I got magic smoke from was a 2MB static RAM. It was pretty nasty - had to open the window for a half-hour, (accident while wiring up a 24V 10A power supply:).
 
@Griwes Sorry -- linked to the wrong message.
@MartinJames I actually managed to release a little magic smoke from an Altera CPLD a while back, but little enough that after re-programming, it worked again.
 
@JerryCoffin WOW! Never managed that. The top blew off my RAM chip and embedded itself in the ceiling. It did not work after that.
 
For me it was a hard drive.
 

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