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2:00 PM
(And this, kids, is why you should all go to hell with your monomorphic operator() inspection bullshit; this thing is too good to be wasted with those shenanigans)
 
user3010322
@R.MartinhoFernandes Hey, that's necessary for some non-template-accepting implementations!
 
@CatPlusPlus shit doesn't run unless its diarrhea
 
stop bluffing cat, it took me an hour ... but I was using a cracked version of Mac osx on the VM
 
@TonyTheLion You just need to whip it harder
 
2:01 PM
lol
 
@ThePhD I hear it's warm in hell.
 
user3010322
@R.MartinhoFernandes I already have a clamp in the namespace. Should I call it clamp_t after the standard instead?
 
user3010322
@R.MartinhoFernandes Yeah, well, at least shit can get cooked down here. D:<
 
_t things are reserved
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Riight, except for we still only have monomorphic lambdas in C++11! :)
 
user3010322
2:01 PM
By the std:: or by POSIX?
 
I make an operators namespace with all the polymorphic op stuffs.
 
Xeo
by posix
fuck posix
 
@ScarletAmaranth Irrelevant. C++ has add polymorphic function objects since the first standard.
 
That's only in the global namespace. At some point it will be confined to posix::.
 
Wasn't it reserved by C++ too?
 
2:02 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes why is it irrelevant? won't polymorphic lambdas generate templated operator()?
 
user3010322
@R.MartinhoFernandes For brevity, I'll call it "ops" #savemyfingers
 
I remember it being funny
 
Xeo
@ScarletAmaranth lambdas a re not special
 
I know they're not special
 
Xeo
@CatPlusPlus nope
 
2:02 PM
I am just saying the committee forgot
so people can forget
 
Oh well
 
user3010322
@CatPlusPlus I don't think so, not particularly. I believe it was just Posix and C++ uses it for some standard library tag types and using-alias type traits.
 
Xeo
@ScarletAmaranth they didn't forget
 
Anyway, posix reservations only apply in a TU which actually uses posix, which often is not many in a given project.
 
Xeo
concepts blocked polylambdas
 
2:03 PM
@Xeo what was the reason they're not in yet, then?
really
 
You have little control whether you use POSIX or not
 
@CatPlusPlus Only in the global namespace anyway.
 
@Potatoswatter Wait, you expect POSIX to care about C++ at any point? They are a bunch of morons, they won't, not in close future. :F
 
No one uses the global namespace.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Haha
 
user3010322
2:04 PM
Blah now I feel the pressure.
 
@Xeo poλys!
 
@Griwes Exactly. POSIX has no idea about C++, therefore C++ is free to define a Posix binding and not vice versa.
 
user3010322
If Robot uses operators then I should too, to make sure consistent code. ;~;
 
@Potatoswatter Good luck with that.
 
@ThePhD Actually I call it op.
 
user3010322
2:05 PM
AHAAA
 
user3010322
My initial inclination was right.
 
@Griwes Maybe you missed the bit where there was some discussion going on between the two.
(I don't care if it was not fruitful; it debunks your "never care" theory)
 
@Griwes Microsoft apparently succeeded in prefixing all posix names with underscores. It's certainly possible to improve the situation on a platform by platform basis… what more can you really ask?
 
@Potatoswatter C++ can just namespace all POSIX names. (namespace posix is reserved after all)
 
2:06 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes I just said that. Griwes is just being cynical.
 
@Potatoswatter I wasn't countering you, just adding more info.
 
user3010322
template <typename T>
	void color_clamp( const RRgba<T>& pixel ) {
		RRgba<T> clampedpixel;
		std::transform( pixel.data( ), pixel.data_end( ),
			clampedpixel.data( ),
			op::clamp() );
		return clampedpixel;
	}
 
you can now use bitcoins on fiverr.com
 
user3010322
by-value returns and shit. Was kind of tempted to use out parameters so I could make it work on *this
 
how lovely
 
2:08 PM
@ThePhD why are you doing that on CPU side btw?
 
Wait, is that a single pixel?
 
user3010322
@BartekBanachewicz Ray tracing.
 
user3010322
I'll move it to the GPU... when it actually works.
 
still stands
 
user3010322
@R.MartinhoFernandes Uh, yeah.
 
user3010322
2:09 PM
It iterates over the components of the pixel.
 
Ah. I see.
 
user3010322
Which is why I get the idea it might be overkill to use std::transform
 
user3010322
But, alas. vOv
 
because as we know, RGBABCDEF format is very common
 
hm exam of "typesystems of programming languages" is in one month
 
2:09 PM
It returns void, btw.
 
user3010322
WOOPS
 
@ThePhD Then you can't clamp the channels to different values… the image has to be in the final color space/gamut first?
 
much to learn
why can't we have type system of c++ as exam
 
user3010322
@Potatoswatter Uh. You've lost me.
 
@ThePhD Nvm. Echoes of DTP from high school newspaper club.
@JohannesSchaub-litb I thought you were in "industry" now.
 
user3010322
2:11 PM
When the pixel gets sent to the image format, clamp needs to happen otherwise overflow and underflow of 1.0 and 0.0 will screw up any integer-based pixel types (like most image formats which have 0 to 255 range).
 
user3010322
Ooh, that's why you asked.
 
user3010322
My bad. :c
 
user3010322
I wonder if std::transform is... purrformant~
 
It's an inlined loop.
 
2:12 PM
@Potatoswatter only by 50% !
 
@ThePhD Yeah, I thought it was a vector of rgba or something.
 
@JohannesSchaub-litb Hmm, hope your boss and your professors have a mutual understanding…
 
it's so difficult for me to switch from industry to university.
 
@ThePhD it's most certainly slower than SIMD
 
the one are like "just slap it in as long as it works" and the other are "dude, first proof that this won't overflow!"
 
2:13 PM
also you have just said you know this part shouldn't be done by CPU
so why are you wondering about the performance anyway?
 
@BartekBanachewicz Is it?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes in this case, I strongly believe it will be
 
Maybe on MSVC.
 
@JohannesSchaub-litb There are always other industries. Don't assume everyone is the same as the job you found from an ad.
 
@BartekBanachewicz Why?
 
2:14 PM
unfortunately, in restrict(amp), I can't std::stransform :(
 
user3010322
@ScarletAmaranth =[
 
Xeo
@BartekBanachewicz msvc can potentially vectorize that loop
 
@Potatoswatter i didn't find it from an ad aaahaha
 
@ThePhD so I have a... wait for it... raw loop
 
okay, let's not speculate then
 
2:15 PM
@JohannesSchaub-litb Y U back in uni?
 
let's benchmark
 
user3010322
@ScarletAmaranth G-G-G-Gasp!
 
@ScarletAmaranth because i wanna have masters.
 
user3010322
Ooph.
 
bachelors seem to be thought of as beginners..
 
user3010322
2:15 PM
I can't call the struct in op color_clamp and the function color_clamp.
 
user3010322
C++ freaks out. =[
 
@JohannesSchaub-litb what
 
i think that's mean.. but i think that'S the case
 
user3010322
How do I resolve the naming woes?
 
@BartekBanachewicz Don't bother. Just generate assembly.
 
user3010322
2:16 PM
Maybe I'll call the struct color_clamper
 
if i were a boss, i wouldn't care whether people have bachelors or masters as long as they can do stuff
 
user3010322
Give them noun-y names.
 
@JohannesSchaub-litb and masters are not?
 
user3010322
Or just color_clamp_t I guess. ._.
 
@JohannesSchaub-litb exactly
 
2:16 PM
@JohannesSchaub-litb did you actually run into a particular situation that made you decided that?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes also GPU solution will be faster anyway
 
Xeo
@ThePhD err, why? both in the same namespace?
 
@ScarletAmaranth nopes
 
user3010322
@Xeo Different namespaces. MSVC still balks.
 
@BartekBanachewicz Not sure. It's one pixel.
 
2:17 PM
but I think it's not worse than bachelor
so it's worth a try :p
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes hahah
 
Xeo
@ThePhD then it's your fault
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes wait he's not repeating that on a whole array of pixels?
 
user3010322
@Xeo How is that my fault? D:
 
if it sucks i can still give up
 
2:17 PM
@BartekBanachewicz that was a joke
 
It wasn't.
 
user3010322
I have on in namespaces op an the other one level up!
 
user3010322
The one one-level-up is balking.
 
That transform is operating on one pixel.
 
damnit robot, stop being sub-consciously funny
 
2:18 PM
@ThePhD is it supposed to be iterated over more pixels?
 
gcc.godbolt.org seems to be broken.
 
Xeo
@R.MartinhoFernandes use coliru and -S?
 
Guess I'll try it on manwe.
@Xeo Hmm, that too.
Btw, @Xeo @jalf: tabletopday.com
 
Lolwut. This simple program has some surprising behaviour
int main() { boost::filesystem::create_directories(
       "a/b/c/d/e/../f/../g/../h/../../i/../j/../k/../../../lmnopq/rustvw../../xyz"
    ); }
 
sscce - why won't it call the const std::vector<T> & overload when the variadic constructor takes T&&
 
2:22 PM
@sehe tbh it seems to do what I would hav expected from the code - not knowing boost::filesystem at all
 
@sehe What's surprising?
It's the same behaviour as mkdir -p, btw coliru.stacked-crooked.com/a/d3bbfb99a68c23b1
 
oh wow
@R.MartinhoFernandes you win. (I think)
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes TIL. That's surprising
 
@ArneMertz yeah technically that's correct. :D but why doesn't it compile
 
@doug65536 because you call vector::get in both ways... scnr
 
Xeo
@R.MartinhoFernandes cool, got 2 close to me
 
@BartekBanachewicz not bad?
 
@BartekBanachewicz Took me way longer than it should, but here: GCC is perfectly capable of SIMDifying across calls to transform: coliru.stacked-crooked.com/a/10be7c3becf6c20e
 
@sehe it's pretty damn good
 
@BartekBanachewicz Ah, I see MSVC does too.
 
2:26 PM
@ArneMertz I noticed that but it didn't make any difference
 
@BartekBanachewicz Never underestimate the power of inlining.
 
pretty damn good.
 
@doug65536 you pass a non-const vector to the constructor, so binding it to the vector<T> const& requires adding a const. T&& also includes vector<int>&, so this one binds better than the const-ref one. Try making the vector const and the other overload gets called
 
^
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I even used std::array and normal iterators and everything
 
2:27 PM
@doug65536 or lose the const in the second overload
 
well, C++ can into fast.
 
IOW: don't mix and match universal references with overload resolution unless you know perfectly fine what it is you're doing
 
omg, just read the H2C03 mod nomination, that guy is a first-rate lunatic
 
2:28 PM
@sehe @ArneMertz won't that cause a copy of the vector or can it optimize that out
 
Universal references are just a bit too greedy
@TemplateRex Nice. You just disqualified yourself as sensible nominee too
 
@doug65536 no it will just take it by nonconst reference
 
@sehe how perceptive of you ;-)
 
I have no idea why people want to be mods here
For me everyone on that page is a first-rate lunatic
 
@sehe lemme email his employer too, to make the point
 
2:30 PM
Like a honeypot
 
@doug65536 And yes the compiler would be allowed to optimize ifff the elements were trivially constructible but the chances are pretty dim that compilers would actually do so
 
> Functor = data transformation pattern,
Applicative = combination pattern,
Foldable = combining visitor pattern,
Traversable = structural visitor pattern,
Monad = reprogram the semicolon pattern.
 
@TemplateRex :)
 
I'd rather have Vlad as mod than that acid guy
 
2:31 PM
@BartekBanachewicz "the semicolon pattern". LOL
 
@ArneMertz ah of course, it is still ref. if I want to be able to pass a temporary vector I'd need a second rvalue ref vector overload?
 
@TemplateRex Oh gosh. NO! H2CO3 is as abrasive as Vlad, but Vlad ---has-- shows no common sense whatsoever, I'd rather have quality with a rotten attitude than drivel that let's other drivel peacefully coexist
 
@doug65536 depends. If you want to take ownership of the vector's contents, yes. If you just want to read from it, normal const ref does all you want.
 
Does VS12 already have alias templates?
 
2:33 PM
@sehe nah, others can downvote drivel, but who can undo snark?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Nope. AFAIR (VS13: yes)
 
I'd vote on H2CO3, seems like a good comedy option
 
@ArneMertz yay! thanks, cc @sehe
 
@sehe There's no VS13.
 
There's no VC13. There is VS'13
 
2:35 PM
There will be in like 3 months and you'll have to pay for it
:v
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes So, yes, VC12 has template aliases! But no inherited ctors (a CTP seems to have it though)
 
Ah, dammit.
Anyway, what I really wanted to ask was "Does VS12 already have alias templates that actually work?"
You can never be sure.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes If you mean VC12, then yes.
 
Xeo
'yes'
 
alright
 
2:37 PM
@sehe I mean VS12.
 
Xeo
pack expansion with alias templates was borked or something
 
Unqualified 'yes' from my vantage point
 
Don't you try and beat at Microsoft version numbering.
The latest Visual Studio release is 12.0.30110.00.
 
@Xeo Haven't noticed. Mentally grepping codebase. Might not have encoutered
 
2:37 PM
so I figure that if you don't define any copy/move constructors/assignment ops or destructors, then you should qualify for Wide's version of aggregate initialization.
 
@Xeo Oh fuck. This is pretty much all variadics.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Okay. You win. But I stick to VS2013/VC12 scheme
 
I'll have to do lots of testing.
 
Xeo
@sehe I remember that something was wrong
 
2:38 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes that's a given. I've hit a silent bad code gen bug in my work code base. Doing void foo(const std::string& s = {});
 
The solution is p easy
 
@doug65536 yep. but in this case, since you only call size(), the const ref version is all you need ;)
 
Don't use internal version numbers
 
Xeo
oh yeah, and EnableIf alias didn't work, while expanded form worked or sth
 
@CatPlusPlus For the compiler, internal == external :) VC12 all the way
 
2:39 PM
@Xeo I am aware of that one.
 
Compiler is not distributed separately anymore, so not really :v
 
@ArneMertz yes, remember this is a minimized-to-hell test case, the real code does real stuff ;)
 
@CatPlusPlus No difference. The compiler reports only one version, and isn't otherwise branded
 
@sehe The latest compiler version is 17.0.something.
 
(inb4 vcvars*.bat shortcut naming)
@R.MartinhoFernandes Now I'm stumped. No opportunity to check right now. I think I took VC12/VC11 naming from the _MSC_VER macro values then
 
2:41 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes how did you get to that InnerPlatformEffect stuff? Is it related to something you are building?
 
Microsoft (R) C/C++ Optimizing Compiler Version 18.00.21005.1 for x64
 
@sehe If you check _MSC_VER, it's like, 1700-1800 right now.
 
VS2013
 
Wait, that was for VS2012.
So yeah.
 
#!@#!@#!@#
How can my memory of it be so wrong then
 
2:42 PM
@Borgleader I've talked about NanoVG with some friends at Intel and got a nice tip in exchange; Apparently NVidia tried to push vector graphics into core GL and they were able to demonstrate better performance than anything on top of it. (running in driver). It was called NVPath or something. You might want to investigate that topic in your reading spree :)
 
@TemplateRex I read the coining article on TDWTF.
 
Okay. I'll recalibrate and rewarm my version cache tomorrow
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes tnx
 
so there's a website called cowboyprogramming.com
I'm afraid to click the link
 
Xeo
@sehe IIRC the 18. number includes pre-VC++ era or something
 
2:45 PM
@BartekBanachewicz it's not related to ThePhD :p
 
Just don't use internal version numbers
 
@doug65536 I thought so :-)
 
It's not helpful
 
> I first implemented a system of object composition from components when working at Neversoft, on the Tony Hawk series of games.
yeah, most certainly it's not :P
 
FFS I'm getting 150KB/s downstream because the wireless decided I don't deserve reception today
THIS IS WHAT I GET FOR GETTING UP EARLY ._.
 
2:48 PM
Haha you're using wireless
 
@CatPlusPlus what's so funny in that?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes lol
 
@BartekBanachewicz Cable master race.
haha you're using cables
 
dafuq
 
2:50 PM
yeah, afaic no wired network connection == no network connection, I don't even consider wireless an option
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes for my mouse and keyboard. I also have a 1Gbe LAN, but my router can provide 600Mbps and works flawlessly in general
@doug65536 then you're prejudiced
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Oh neat. Nothing near here though
 
No, wireless is just shit
 
I was thinking the same in the era of cheap routers
 
@jalf The folks I usually play with are organising it here in Berlin.
 
2:51 PM
but if you have good hardware it really works well
bah, we successfully gamed on 3G connection with average ping ~95ms
 
Cool, maybe I should visit Berlin :D
 
We're also maybe sorta who knows organising a convention.
 
@CatPlusPlus it's less shit than putting holes in walls and ceilings. sometimes.
 
That's top secret but publicly known, though.
 
@melak47 Nope
 
2:52 PM
Don't tell anyone! Unless they want to help/sponsor/whatever.
 
@CatPlusPlus let's spread more FUD
 
Walls don't care
It's not FUD, it's years of experience
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes A top secret convention!
 
@CatPlusPlus with crappy hardware
 
alright, I'll give you a pizza if you lay some ethernet cables :p
 
2:53 PM
years ago the hw was crap, that's the point
it improved. vastly
 
I'm not paying for fucking enterprise-class router for home, if I can just lay cables for 0.1% of the cost
 
I'm not saying enterprise-class
 
I have a really powerful router but the signal randomly dips in some spots anyway
It's shit to diagnose, it's annoying to use
I'd rather have 1Gbps LAN and leave shitty wireless to guests
 
@CatPlusPlus oh well I reckon that the signal also drops anywhere off the tip of the cable
 
2:55 PM
Oh gosh, not again.
 
lol
stop fighting, I just want my internets!
 
ah right I forgot he's not using any mobile devices either
nevermind proceed.
 
Not to mention wireless client cards are also shitty and have troubles with bridging and other fun things
But yeah totally great tech :thumbsup:
 
"shitty hardware is shitty"
 
Haven't seen non-shitty wireless hardware in years
 
2:57 PM
maybe step out of the cave sometimes
 
When I get my own flat I'm totally doing fibre in walls
 
lel nevermind, my connection is fine. just that particular thing being slow ._.
 
ah right "I'm not paying $300 for a cellphone that's useless"
 
How is that remotely relevant to anything
 
@CatPlusPlus Consider using the electrical circuit connectors?
 
2:58 PM
@DeadMG Eh, I don't know much about that
 
@CatPlusPlus oh it's not
 
@CatPlusPlus We've got them here.
 
@DeadMG I've tried that, works for small distances, but even then it barely does ethernet speeds, if you're lucky
 
Ell
@CatPlusPlus Here too
 
CAT-5 for life
 
2:58 PM
the connection speed is low but if you're not transferring large files across the network it doesn't make much difference
 
@CatPlusPlus 5...e, right?
 
and it's WAY easier than drilling holes in all the walls.
 
@CatPlusPlus I thought you wanted fibres
so now what
 
I'm plenty happy with the "Enterprise-class" router we have.
 
80 TB/s or bust.
 
2:59 PM
If I wanted slow connections, I'd just use wireless
Walls don't care
 
BUT 1Gb/s IS TOO SLOW YOU NEED MORE
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I'm plenty fed up with the shitty "consumer" one I have.
 

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