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3:00 PM
@fredoverflow Even I upgraded from WinXP
 
user784668
@fredoverflow Not really.
 
@fredoverflow Security, not as far as I know. Privacy, yes.
 
@TonyTheLion It's better together.
 
mmm
that looks good
 
@ButtifulButterfly
 
3:00 PM
one chicken butte
 
user406009
@ElimGarak People hate change. You could plate their houses with gold and you still hear complaints about how the walls get too cold.
 
@набиячлэвэлиь Come on let's use Gentoo.
lel
 
@Nooble Go fuck yourself
 
@ElimGarak Effort, my desktop has Windows 7 Enterprise and I still haven't got the upgrade notification yet. My Laptop has Home Edition Win7, but contains a lot of important shit I don't want to lose in an upgrade potentially.
 
Windows 7 64 bit 36.67% -0.81%
Windows 10 64 bit 26.42% +2.43%
Looking good, tho.
 
3:01 PM
@TonyTheLion That's already fucked, though.
you can't assume that your laptop will keep functioning... it could fail at any time.
 
@Puppy What exactly is fucked?
 
@jaggedSpire I didnt know owls were so huggable
 
you should have backups of anything critical, regardless of Windows upgrades or not.
 
@TonyTheLion morning <3
 
@Puppy ah yes, I need to back up stuff. thanks for reminding me
 
3:01 PM
relying on one machine to not fail is just begging for trouble.
I upgraded to Win10 no fear ;p
 
@Borgleader morning fine sir :) <3
 
@TonyTheLion Time to purchase a new HDD.
 
user784668
I upgraded to Win10 but it was a VM so
 
@Nooble Got a NAS
fuck random lose HDDs
 
I say a 100TB array will be enough to hold half of your porn.
 
3:02 PM
I literally have to just copy stuff from one place to another.
 
Ell
@Nooble do it
or use funtoo for even more fun
 
@Nooble Downloading porn is so 1997
 
@TonyTheLion Yeah I remember 1997.
 
why actually keep porn on your hard drive?
 
@Nooble me too.
 
3:03 PM
I keep my porn on my hdd
it's mostly pics tho
 
@Puppy donno. Its an overrated idea
 
@Puppy For power outages. When the lights are out.
 
I find that my imagination is much better than the imagination of any porn movie scenarist ever
 
@Nooble Then so is your hard drive ;p
 
You can just print that shit and wank like in the good old days :P
 
3:03 PM
@TonyTheLion Dude, dead trees? blech
 
Puppies usual reaction to paper
 
@Puppy Laptop!
 
@fredoverflow hahahahahahah
that's funny :)
 
3:05 PM
He probably didn't push his changes.
6
 
speaking of which
 
Oh I have an idea.
 
I did not push my latest changes to Wide.
 
@ElimGarak I always shelve my changes. Always.
 
3:06 PM
A porn repo.
 
Ell
the new john lewis ad is v cute
v kawaii
 
@Nooble its called pornhub.com
it already exists. Welcome to 2015 Nooble :)
 
> shelve
 
@Puppy Since august 2012?
 
Guise, there are illicit services which stream 1080p+ premium content. Don't ask me how I know, but I do.
 
3:06 PM
@TonyTheLion :(
 
what are you, tfs scum?
 
@Nooble sorry for the bubble burst
@AlexM. yea I had to use that thing for a while. ewww
 
@Puppy Where's your remote repo?
 
I use it too but I think the shelveset thing is really silly
 
@AlexM. so, that's why I imagine a HDD full of porn. Much easier to maintain
 
3:07 PM
@sehe Nope
@fredoverflow github
 
Also, everything is fucking encrypted in this preload, I can't even poke around.
 
@AlexM. never used the feature. Don't really know what its for
 
@Puppy Nice. I'm too ashamed to publish my code on github :)
 
@TonyTheLion I think it's the equivalent of stash in git
you just take your changes, group them into this thing called shelveset and keep them there so you can get back to them later
problem is if I have too many tasks I get lost in shelvesets easily
 
user1804599
@fredoverflow I implemented Booleans!
 
3:08 PM
@AlexM. ah yes
 
@Elyse Nice! Did you call them booles?
 
I probably would too
 
Boobeans
 
user1804599
@fredoverflow No, just bool.
 
and you have to use the TFS power tools if you want to do something like moving a shelveset from a branch to another and ugh
 
3:09 PM
@Elyse I thought you didn't like the name bool?
 
VS can't do it for you
 
user1804599
val true : bool.
val false : bool.
 
@AlexM. Perforce mate.
 
if the changes are few in number it's easier to just diff your shelveset and copy/patse the changes manually
 
Ell
I am not a fan of shortenings
 
3:10 PM
@Borgleader IC
 
Ell
but they are so practical
 
user1804599
@Ell Ah, hence your name Ell instead of Elliot, right?
 
Ell
@Elyse touche :P
 
user1804599
@fredoverflow type erasure brings so many optimisation opportunities!
 
user1804599
I can implement UTF-8 encoding a string just as the identity function, since strings are represented the same was as byte strings with UTF-8 encoding!
 
3:12 PM
I have to make so many checks in my injection dll for eavesdropping on apps talking with D3D12 because there are so many ways for people to fatally fuck up.
Error: How the fuck did you manage to do that?
3
 
user1804599
val Encode : string -> ByteString.
let Encode = UnsafeCoerce.
 
user406009
@ElimGarak how are you doing the dll injection?
 
user406009
Also, doesn't dx12 have like a bajillion API methods? Making the whole process a pain.
 
@Lalaland Yes, precisely. With D3D11 it was only the context and the device for primary tracking. Injecting the DLL is not the problem, wrapping everything is the issue. As for the injection explanation, how familiar are you with the basics?
 
I'm not at all familiar.
 
But the primary point of interest is tracking the command lists, obviously. And an additional hurdle is the bindless model making it a bit of a chore to find the relevant resources, popping the hood of the root signature and stuff, working your way back.
 
> pl
 
Google, please.
 
3:23 PM
I actually use google.ro too but not because I want to
google keeps pushing tings to me in my language
 
Yeah, I hate the localization forcing.
 
I wish there was like a global button "give me everything in en-us" for browsers
 
I have my browser set to EN_BR
 
Ell
@ElimGarak why did graphics move away from "command list" style of thing in the first place?
 
now it started showing me the romanian wiki pages in results first
 
3:24 PM
Google's location based
 
hmm
 
Ell
Dx 7 had execute buffers or sthng didn't it?
 
instead of en pages
 
the Wide parser now triggers an ICE in 8 places.
that's a new record.
 
@набиячлэвэлиь ugh
instead of concentrating on forcing everyone to speak one language
 
3:24 PM
@Puppy Nice.
 
@AlexM. (or so it looks like, anyway)
 
@Ell Well, there are a bunch of command lists, with their backing allocators and there are execution queues. These are all free for threading fun and allows truly deferred dispatch of work to the GPU, maximizing utilization, especially now when you have machines with like 16 logical cores.
 
im telling you
the world would be a better place if everyone spoke one language
(english since it's already a good candidate)
 
@Nooble At least 8 places. Maybe more.
 
English sucks tbh
 
3:25 PM
so does your mom
 
@набиячлэвэлиь What about it.
 
@Nooble It's too simple
too trivial
 
@набиячлэвэлиь Examples.
 
Synthetically trivial
 
The deferred contexts of D3D11, like the ones of OpenGL 4.4 were pretty much a dud, as they had a whole bag of ifs associated with them.
 
3:26 PM
@Nooble Nah
 
@ElimGarak Like what? I didn't know why they didn't take off.
 
@Puppy Gotta love VS.
 
user1804599
Verenigde Staten
 
@Nooble cl.exe, actually. But to be fair, I've pushed the compiler quite hard here with nested polylambdas with multi-return inferred return types, and suchlike things.
 
Ell
@ElimGarak But I mean, wasn't "command lists" the original style of writing code for gpus?
Until opengl had an api which meant the developer didn't have to think about that
 
3:29 PM
@Ell Those execute buffers you're thinking of are nothing like the command lists we have now.
they were shaders v0.1.
 
Ell
Oh I see
 
they had nothing to do with concurrency or CPU ops.
 
Ell
Right
that explains it then :3
 
back in the DX7 days you did not have multiple cores to take advantage of, so the issue was very moot.
 
I like how long this discussion is
and it all started from fred not knowing that 3 monitors are used for
 
3:34 PM
@Puppy They were an attempt to use the old high level API architecture with all the automation in the API layer / drivers to increase scaling across multiple cores. CPU-GPU synchronization was largely automated and implemented in a safety first (due to being ignorant of the programmer's intentions). But mostly, it is the issue plaguing all last gen APIs, the ideas the API has do not map to the hardware.
So having a bunch of different contexts submitting lists more often than not flushed the entire hardware state and required reconfiguration of multiple components. Benign changes in the API can have a rippling effect on the GPU. Hence, PSOs were born. So, multiple deferred contexts want to do work, each gets their slice of the Sun and each wants to fuck over the state of the other with some tiny change.
Now you define everything ahead of time (99% load time unless something explicitly exotic) and it is heavily cached. And it prepares a perfect hardware match, a contract for the command lists referencing their overlord PSO.
 
2G1C
 
Ell
> We promised to deliver your order on the 7th of November 2015.

We’re sorry to tell you that there may be a delay in delivering your order.
nooo
 
They did some good in D3D11, but nothing to write home about.
 
@Ell pizza?
I'd be angry too
 
Ell
@AlexM. batteries
 
3:39 PM
I need a game idea.
 
Also, manually defining the a game-ready pipeline state may take up to 500 lines of code (no comments whatsoever) with all its dependencies.
 
Ell
I'm sure it'll be less once you c++-ize the api
 
Yup, but you've got to do the work at least once. :D And there is D3DX12 stuff distributed which can default stuff for you.
 
huh
 
3:40 PM
Imagine a game with a playable ad where the advert gradually becomes the main game whilst the core game becomes the advert.
 
the newest version of LLVM-VS did not barf on my exception throwing.
I have yet to see if it'll actually work, but it didn't error.
 
Winsockets are still utter shite. Doesn't anybody at Microsoft look at stuff and say to themselves: Man, this is kinda embarrassing.
 
@Elyse Use function objects for your std::unique_ptr deleters. That way you won't have to always feed the same deleting function to the constructor, and you might benefit from EBCO.
 
user1804599
Lol, empty base optimisation for Lua states.
 
WriteProcessMemory, because what could possibly go wrong except everything.
 
3:45 PM
@Elyse For unique pointers to Lua states ;p
 
@Nooble I'm srs
the ad idea is great
 
So, can we play with Wide?
 
for an esoteric game
 
huh
and furthermore, as far as I can tell, it actually seems to work.
@ElimGarak Why not? It'll only take you a few hours to build it ;p
 
adoption would be easier if people could just make it
 
user1804599
3:52 PM
you know these people who've never been near civilized world
 
user1804599
I wonder what they think of airplanes
 
user1804599
:P
 
@ScarletAmaranth Way too loud to be a bird.
 
user1804599
they're completely oblivious
 
3:53 PM
@ScarletAmaranth There's unfortunately not a whole lot I can do about the build requirements.
 
user1804599
top kek
 
@Puppy have a web interface then and a working build running server-side
 
user1804599
 
user1804599
3:55 PM
:D :D :D
 
I've been living in a relatively civilized nation and I still get shivers when I see them. :P Majestic plumage. :P
 
@ScarletAmaranth I've been thinking about it, but I can't really afford to run CI for Wide.
 
@AlexM. I can't quite wrap my head around it.
 
@Nooble that's the beauty
it's also a potentially short project
so it's likely to actually finish it
and not become rightfold
 
hmm. ok.
 
3:58 PM
@AlexM. :)
 
hmm
the new Wide parser error recovery seems to do better than I expected
still some cases I need to work on though, mostly terminators (preferably T1000)
 

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