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12:00 PM
Yes. It is a cast after all.
 
'There is a brilliant flash of swirly light, and you materialize in a darkish room. Sunlight streams through the grimy windows, revealing ancient pipework and bar furniture. A group of people are huddled round two tables covered in beer bottles. They seem to be making jQuery jokes. One young man of aparrently Mediterranean descent speaks German with a Portuguese accent in an almost robotic manner: "Hi, you wanna beer?"
 
@BartekBanachewicz and it is that logic that gave us Perl
 
no seriously, good use of macros is ok
 
@MartinJames Where's that from?
 
I like how the author says "Stop using JavaScript compilers!" and farther in the text "Here's how you use the Sweet.js compiler".
 
JBL
12:00 PM
> They seem to be making jQuery jokes
Haha !
 
I wish abortion was legal after birth sometimes
 
@Purrformance yeah that's retarded
as is inability to spell the word "retarded"
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I was thinking about using concepts to forward- like, if an lvalue reference is an Lvalue, and an rvalue reference is an Rvalue, then both those concepts are a Reference, so you could just do like f(Reference(int) r) or something.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Fairly clearly 'future Berlin':)
 
but then I realized that you lost the information about whether it was originally l or r value so you can't forward.
 
12:01 PM
Another shitty.js project
 
but I could just do a horrible language hack.
 
@DeadMG Oh, I like that.
 
and get some extra-conceptual information.
@R.MartinhoFernandes Right. But the concept rules state that you can't retrieve information not exposed by the concept you're using, and Reference(int) doesn't expose whether the source was an l or r value.
 
The nice thing is that you can actually have forward(x) without an explicit type.
 
js is actually ok to write.. but it is write only.. part of the write only cloud
 
12:03 PM
@Xeo did you fill in the poll?
 
Xeo
@DeadMG how not? it should by the fact that it ends up as either an lvalue or an rvalue ref
 
@Xeo I'm dropping reference collapsing as a type-system feature.
 
@starmole No.
 
Xeo
@DeadMG and that is relevant how?
 
well, Reference(int) does not end up as either an lvalue or rvalue ref.
 
Xeo
12:04 PM
the Reference concept instantiates as either lvalue ref or rvalue ref, no?
 
right.
but you don't know which one.
 
Xeo
decltype(param)?
 
the concept rules say that if you have a Reference, then you could have anything that is-a Reference.
@Xeo Gives back Reference.
 
Purforma: No as in you don't believe in the write only cloud, or no, you can read js?
 
Xeo
wtf
 
12:05 PM
well
 
@Xeo you should tag the last commit you made while in the jam.
 
it gives back Lvalue or Rvalue modified by Reference, to be more accurate.
 
Xeo
@R.MartinhoFernandes yeah, I should
how do you do that? :D
 
damn
you get hungry if you only eat 800 calories a day for months on end.
 
hg tag or something.
hg tags suck.
 
12:08 PM
> AppWizard has created this Shit application for you.
6
 
lol
 
rofl.
 
Opening a c++ solurion, keep the bin ready
 
eheheh
> This file contains a summary of what you will find in each of the files that
make up your Shit application.
this is hilarious
 
@starmole You're not pinging me by the way. No as in JS is also unwritable.
 
12:09 PM
@starmole I can read JS I write because I write readable JS
 
you know
 
Which reminds me it's time I should change nickname
 
it would be a lot funnier if it was named "shit" rather than "Shit".
 
yeah
 
It's still good.
 
12:10 PM
I concur.
 
yes, so
once I have fixed the fact that everything, ever, right now is broken
then it's on to concepts
for I'm pretty sure that I have constructed the necessary infrastructure to support them now
 
#build failed
 
you know
I think I am overusing StateT a IO ()
 
That awkward moment when you realise the website you found with a search for "something berlin" is about something in Wisconsin.
 
12:12 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes "awkward"?
 
You mean there's a berlin not in wisconsin?
C-c-could it be?
 
So the meetup is not in Wisconsin? I already bought my flight tickets
damn
 
Do you think someone can get banned for having a nickname such as "Rape sauce" (which is obviously about the plant)
 
@Purrformance aw.. if you can write c you can write js. it's a bit fucked up that you have to do the compilers job by testing every code path for typos. but you can fix that by just going and never checking.
 
@AndyProwl No excuse.
> The big event will take place on June 7th, in Berlin, Germany. The 7th because it's Saturday and it's prime. June because it's summer time. Berlin because it's not the geographical average of all our current locations.
 
12:15 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes Isn't it Germany, Wisconsin?
 
@BartekBanachewicz Again: emulating terminal with a grid filled with bitmap fonts. All the terminal feel with no terminal shit to deal with :v (Windows console subsystem is awful awful awful awful)
 
I think we will allow graphics anyway
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes ..and it's stuffed full of bars and beer gardens.
 
Fuck people who overwrite my good edits with shitty edits
 
> if you can write c you can write js
wow, trolls these days are weird.
 
12:20 PM
what
 
If you can write c you can write cc, ccc, cccc...
 
Thank god for rollback
 
'If you can write shit you can write shit'.
 
I think I'm done with my nominations.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I don't see my name
At least nominate me in the section "not nominated"
Paradox
I thought that was funny
 
Xeo
12:22 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes k, there's a 'jam_end' tag now
 
@Xeo is it normal that "hack" doesn't do anything atm?
 
Xeo
'hack row col'
 
Xeo
I should add a readme
 
ah, I just downloaded main.cpp
but maybe I should check that out
 
12:25 PM
The games require a documentation suite? I'm going off the idea.
 
Xeo
there is no readme yet :p
 
wow, just noticed that you actually put all your code in main()
 
Xeo
@StackedCrooked and inside main :D
 
I think I was the only one that used more than one file.
 
Xeo
12:26 PM
couldn't be bothered
 
So Enterprisey.
 
@Xeo that used to be horrible
 
Xeo
it was less than 200 lines anyways
even if I didn't have it all in main, I'd still have it all in main.cpp
@StackedCrooked lambdas <3
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes That's another issue. I don't think it's possible for me to write much without modules/libs/CU's that I have accumulated. I would not wish to publish all that source, (and nobody would read it anyway).
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes how is this trollish? i did not mean it to be. this was in reply to js being hard to write. good js is hard to impossible to make. but basic stuff is like c.
 
12:30 PM
Does MSVC's tuple optimise empties?
 
Xeo
for the first element anyways, I'd guess
 
@starmole so you really are a mole
 
Meh.
Suckage.
 
@Purrformance of course
 
that explains the blindness
 
12:32 PM
Can we move 'Berlin' to tomorrow?
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/uk-weather-februarys-rain-set-3119511
 
caps in title
0/10
 
Not sunny today. But still ok weather.
I have a sequence of ints, part of which is known at compile-time, and the rest is not.
 
Which are known at compile-time is known at compile-time.
Wait, that's obvious.
 
.... I don't wan to meet @sbi any more :(
 
12:34 PM
I want to store the ones that are dynamic, and skip storage for the static ones.
 
@thecoshman ewwwwwwwwwwwww
 
So I thought tuple<stored_or_not<I>...>.
 
@MartinJames <looks out window> nope, I'm all good for now.
 
But of course... that will never work in MSVC, not even if I write my own tuple, will it?
 
I'd be inclined to define commands as tag types and use a demangler to register them. Then I'd define run_command function and overload on command tags. (For the benefit of nothing. Lately I've been a little obsessed with this style of code.)
struct move : command<void(direction)> {};
it even allows for automatic Help text generation :)
If only there was a std::demangle
 
12:39 PM
you can use cxxabi.h if you're ok with depending on Itanium.
 
Xeo
I like my string -> function maps
 
user1804599
@StackedCrooked if you are doing these kinds of things, dlsym and dladdr may be of use too.
 
@Xeo I had those too
 
Xeo
that also allows me to do binding, commands["left"] = std::bind(move, 0, -1);
 
@Xeo I had them when I had more involved content.
 
12:42 PM
@rightfold what does it do?
 
user1804599
@Xeo I used a switch with regexen.
 
@Xeo ("left", move 0 -1)
 
user1804599
@StackedCrooked dlsym returns the address corresponding to a symbol and dladdr does the reverse.
 
@Xeo Yep, I'd need something like `register_command<left>([](direction d) { move(d); });
@rightfold so dladdr returns the symbol corresponding to an address? (not sure what that means)
Oh, I see the docs now.
 
user1804599
@StackedCrooked You give an address and it returns the symbol that you can pass to dlsym to get that address.
 
12:45 PM
Does this require debugging symbols?
 
user1804599
No.
 
user1804599
It’s intended for stuff like plug-ins but it also works for the current executable.
 
if you're just on Linux and are happy with those dependencies, then just use the Itanium ABI functions.
 
Interesting.
 
Xeo
@StackedCrooked it's shared library stuff
 
12:46 PM
Ah, I see.
 
user1804599
Ruby uses dlsym to call <blabla>_init when you require a dynamic library.
 
user1804599
I once wrote a wrapper around it with a C++ interface but I deleted it.
 
lol google
the doodle of today is so politicized
or whatever the word is
 
@rightfold Can this be used to get the type name of a void* ?
 
user1804599
@StackedCrooked no.
 
12:49 PM
Function signature at best.
Partial.
 
hmm
it's amazing how easy it is to get infinite recursion.
 
@rightfold Oh, that makes sense. (The runtime would need to keep track of types at all addresses.)
 
It's not amazing.
 
user1804599
It is used for stack traces too.
 
f () { f (); }
 
12:50 PM
@Purrformance polytitties
 
I meant in the Wide compiler.
 
@DeadMG in my experience infinite recursion ends rather quickly
 
ah
maybe I can just re-order these checks to dodge this particular bullet.
 
I have used a depth parameter a few times.
 
user1804599
@StackedCrooked TCO
 
12:52 PM
^
 
@rightfold Isn't gonna apply through my virtual functions :P
 
@rightfold funny, it never happened to me a that a program hanged because of infinite recursion and tco. it's always stack overflow.
 
> Sometimes tail recursion is a bad plan and guarded recursion is a better fit, i.e. when the result you're building will be needed bit by bit, in portions. See this question about foldr and foldl for example, and test them against each other.
interesting
 
@Purrformance it's just a bit gay is all vOv
 
SAM
Higuys...!
 
12:57 PM
G'day.
 
Xeo
3
Q: Is std::chrono::seconds lightweight?

TNAFor a embedded project I'd like to use std::chrono::seconds to represent timeout values, especially for the reason of typesaftyness. This requires std::chrono::seconds to be fast constructible from an unsigned int type and also passing by value has to be very fast. Is that the case?

...
 
user1804599
@DeadMG dynamic recompilation!
 
voted to close
 
user1804599
Or insert a check to find out whether the virtual function is the same one as the current function. :D
 
mawning
 
SAM
1:01 PM
@MartinJames Good day :)
 
Xeo
The Rank<N> here seems awfully familiar... stackoverflow.com/a/21626087/500104
 
@thecoshman Not only that, but the quotes at the bottom
 
Tempted to answer saying that in Hell++, chrono seconds is at least five times slower because it performs the assignment a hundred times each time you use it
 
Also, is there anything like an iterator wrapping an iterator of T where T is also iterable? Basically flattening. Or do I have to write it myself?
 
Xeo
boost::adaptors::indirected?
 
1:05 PM
It's a bummer that microseconds() = nanoseconds(); is not allowed.
 
Xeo
@Purrformance you mean that on dereference, it dereferences the underlying iterator?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes can it do it though?
 
I would rather have microseconds use a larger Rep field than it needs than this.
 
Xeo
if yes, that's just a transform_iterator which dereferences
(or if you're working with a range anyways, boost::adaptors::indirected, as I said)
 
@Xeo For example flat_iterator<std::vector<std::string>> would lead a character from the first string until its end, then the second string... until the end of the last string of the vector.
 
Xeo
1:07 PM
@Purrformance oh, ok
I think Boost might have something
 
@R. Martinho Fernandes I think profiling is unnecessary since std::chrono::duration is a wrapper class around an integer. That can't be slower than using the integer itself. — TNA 4 mins ago
hahahhaha now I will answer that.
 
Xeo
@R.MartinhoFernandes .... if it can't be slower, why the fuck did he ask that question?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I heard it took a while before compilers were able to optimize simple wrappers.
 
Xeo
Unfortunately I can't find the original thread from which I learned the trick. — Roman Perepelitsa 2 mins ago
meh
 
So in early STL iterators were slower than pointers.
 
1:12 PM
@Xeo oho, MPL
 
Xeo
@BartekBanachewicz not why I'm interested
 
0
A: Is std::chrono::seconds lightweight?

R. Martinho FernandesWhat follows is a possible partial implementation of seconds that can be slower than using integers directly. template <typename T> struct duration<T, ratio<1>> { using rep = T; using period = ratio<1>; duration(T r) : r(r) { this_thread::sleep_for(hours(1)); } private: T r; };

 
ahahahah
this_thread::sleep_for(hours(1));
 
Xeo
@R.MartinhoFernandes infinite recursion?
 
1:17 PM
seems legit
 
Xeo
(hours is a duration :p)
 
Not the same specialisation
 
Xeo
ah, right, specialization
 
I am tempted to upvote you robot
 
"Is yo momma lightweight?" No
 
1:19 PM
oh well, have an upvote
 
wow you guys closed it
 
hm how come this isn't working in my `.bash_profile`?
`alias pm = 'cd /path/to/place/I/Want/To/Go'`
 
user1804599
Vlad voted to close.
 
@rightfold not that Vlad
I have just answered question tagged and
well
 
Now Vlad is reproducing as well?
 
1:22 PM
time to build OBJ renderer in Haskell
 
if you refer to things as “homophobic” or “transphobic” you are directly contributing to the stigmatization of mental illnesses
 
@BartekBanachewicz like both at the same time?
 
@A.H. yea
so then how could I edit my values without the use of update — JoelWaterworth 2 mins ago
 
Hmm long queue at bakery.
I want my cake!
 
@A.H. the guy isn't particularly bright though
 
1:23 PM
@CatPlusPlus If you are post stuff like that, you are directly contributing to mental illness.
 
or maybe has problems with reading answers
 
yay! I have discovered the magic of conditional breakpoints.
 
If you want to construct from unsigned int, why not use std::chrono::duration<unsigned int> instead? std::chrono::seconds uses signed type and may use more bits than you actually need. — user2079303 2 hours ago
 
impressive
 
Not the bits!
Noo
 
1:24 PM
@DeadMG lol really
 
@DeadMG The debugger staggers into life....
 
well
previously I could never convince it to accept any useful conditions.
 
@DeadMG Oh, VS.
 
but I just realized that since I pass location information around now, I can ask it to break when the analyzer has reached pre-defined parts of the test program.
 
@Cat it's an embedded platform so it could have all sorts of issues with that
 
1:26 PM
There are apparently USB missile launchers
 
eh why do I always answer noob questions nobody upvotes
I should just close it probably
anyway I guess we gonna wait for folks from the US to show up and fill the poll before we decide on game jam, huh?
 
> Requires Intel Pentium II or AMD Athlon processor running at 2.66 MHz or higher,
I believe it's supposed to say 266
 
@BartekBanachewicz most likely
 
@BartekBanachewicz No, it's just REALLY optimised
 
1:29 PM
maybe its 2.6GHz
 
ad the game jam
 
@Xeo that is cool though
 
Xeo
@StackedCrooked yes, and it uses Rank, which is why I'm very interested in the original thread
 
that would be your invention IIRC
@BartekBanachewicz yeah don't wanna exclude them unnecessarily
 
@Xeo still haven't filled up the poll
 
1:33 PM
@BartekBanachewicz Can the program observe a difference?
Now feasting on cake.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Is what you did permitted by the standard
 
The standard puts no limits on the time it takes to run.
 
it might on unnecessary operations though
 
Not if their effects are not observable.
 
lol. okay
 
Can you tell the difference between my implementation and one where the assignment truly takes an hour?
E.g. the r member is stored on another machine accessible through carrier pigeon.
 
lol
I got a fatal compiler error on line 666.
 
Wide is evil.
 
a programming language created by the devil puppy himself.
alright
now I got a bit better results.
26 passing tests.
 
ugh fuck having to install libxrandr
 
1:42 PM
Today is not very good day for working
 
@DeadMG wait the whole language has 26 tests?
@CatPlusPlus agree. Let's do a game jam :D
 
Drinking in few hours, right now I really want to play Crawl
 
@BartekBanachewicz 26 that pass
 
@BartekBanachewicz No, that's 26 passes.
 
1:42 PM
also
 
And by few hours I mean 2
 
some of those are false positives because if you choose not to debug a crashed process, the process returns 0 which I interpret as success, I think.
 
lol
So it's even less?
 
Success: error
 
Xeo
Error: success
 
1:45 PM
> Partial list of applications using Urwid

Hachoir binary stream viewer/editor
Pymissile USB missile launch controller
 
Xeo
also, that Rank thing is going to nag me
 
heh @Cat that explains a bit
 
@CatPlusPlus That's a truly apalling approach, totally against the overall morality of software development. I use Sleep() calls.
 
Xeo
I wanna know if that was inspired from my post, or discovered independently
but I can't find it on the boost mailing archive
 
@MartinJames Then it wouldn't be a speed-up loop.
 
1:48 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes Eh, I often find that one or two bugs can cause many tests to fail.
 
Unless you sleep(1) in a loop, I guess.
 
for example I'm pretty sure that every single C++ interoperation test right now is failing due to the same bugs.
 
Xeo
@DeadMG so remove C++ interaction as a feature, and you'll have a lot less failing tests!
 
nah
I'll probably just fix the bug :P
I did end up removing a couple of features to prioritize working on the others.
but I'm pretty sure those existed before I even started authoring tests.
 
1:51 PM
how can I resolve ambiguous module import in Haskell?
 
Xeo
@Cheersandhth.-Alf why would it?
 
jobVerifyPool.pop(@jobVerify,INFINITE);
client.tempTransact:=tempTrans;
jobVerify.setupFromVK(tempTrans.job,tempTrans.reg,tempTrans.hose,tempTrans.PIN,tempTrans.keypad,VKsendJVreply,Client);
tempTrans:=nil;
Sleep(CprogressDelay);
foJVchoose.verify(jobVerify);
 
@BartekBanachewicz Don't duplicate module names?
 
Xeo
@BartekBanachewicz import qualified Bla as Abbr?
 
it's a simple technical question with a ditto answer. it can't be un-closed until it's un-deleted.
 
Xeo
1:52 PM
or do you mean the modules themselves?
 
> 20% of experts say YO MAMA.
 
@CatPlusPlus not my fault
there's GLFW and GLFW-b
 
Xeo
@Cheersandhth.-Alf it's a shitty question, tbqfh
 
1:53 PM
and GHC states that (well, yeah) there are two GLFW exports
 
it seems to be written by a Very Young Person, living in Myanmar which is an ungood country.
 
Xeo
> Thus, I can't use MVS, QT, eclipse, U++ and other IDE because these IDE need to restart computer( i can't restart computer at internet cafe).
too localized
 
@BartekBanachewicz Hide one
-hide-package
 
@BartekBanachewicz Don't export them?
 
that has nothing to do with location or using specific tools, it is what he can't use
 
1:55 PM
@Cheersandhth.-Alf Yeah - rather sad, really.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I just have two bindings installed at once
 
@DeadMG How could you!
 
@CatPlusPlus very many thanks Kind Sir
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes inorite.
 
omfg it works
I have a triangle
I shit you not
 
1:58 PM
:|
 
I migth have not written a pure GL app for a while I admit
Funny how I've built a webGL renderer API and didn't even think about it
 
@Purrformance you quote the bottom
 
for this question, the obvious technical solution is to use only tools that can be installed without restarting computer. and for windows, with economic constraints described, it reduces to g++ and Windows API. no room even for opinion.
 
and now I have a triangle and it's like the most magical thing ever
 
i hate when people close questions because they can't answer them
 

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