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7:00 AM
@Rapptz I'm compiling with -Wall -Wextra -pedantic-errors. (Details: compile.sh.)
 
Weird, it didn't catch that warning.
but on my MinGW it did
 
I guess I need to add support for user configurable command line..
@sehe It's like Santa came by! :D
I wonder if coroutines could be useful.
 
@StackedCrooked they're so useful that in the 90s people implemented coroutines on top of Java threads, with all that thread overhead
but nowadays more people are familiar with continuations and stuff than general coroutines
few know that windows supports coroutines directly (called "fibers" in the api)
 
I'm not familiar with the concept and I can't seem to tune my brains to their frequency.
I can't seem to find a useful way to use them.
coroutines make me think of those "almost" perpetual motion machines that depend on gravity and stop when the weight reaches the floor.
Clever attempt at perpetual motion :D (I wonder where the energy is lost in this case...)
Ah, iteration over two arrays could probably be done with coroutines. Routine 1 iterates over [A, B, C] and yields on each iteration to Routine 2 but prints the current element before doing so. Routine 2 iterates over [1, 2, 3] and yields to Routine 1 on each iteration, but also prints the current element first. The result will be A1B2C3. If my reasoning is correct..
Ok. Not sure if useful yet. But I'll probably be able to think of a few interesting use cases in the coming weeks.
 
7:25 AM
fibers have their own stack, but they share the same thread
it's like cooperative multitasking isn't it, like Win3.1
 
@StackedCrooked they could, obviously
7 hours ago, by sehe
@doug65536 asynchronous IO, event based parsing, responsive GUI programming, readable state machines.
 
@StackedCrooked Erm, friction?
 
user142019
@StackedCrooked magnet demagnetizes.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes So the friction will cause the magnet to eventually lose its grip on the ball?
 
The friction causes loss of energy in the form of heat.
 
7:31 AM
@Zoidberg I guess that's true. But that's not a loss of energy (like a battery) IIRC.
 
@StackedCrooked What's the difference?
Battery have potential, magnets too.
 
I don't know enough about the topic matter to discuss about it. But I do seem to remember that magnetism is not a source of energy. (And thus a magnet is not like a battery that becomes empty after x hours of usage.)
I could be wrong though.
Feel free to humiliate me :D
 
> I do not think that someone who has got up on a stage to give a presentation about their subject has given the world carte blanche to comment on the presenter’s appearance. Personally, in my case, I will have Amazon rush send you a box of all the fucks I give. - also speaking up
@StackedCrooked It is not a source of energy. It is a force field. Much like gravity. Now, is gravity a source of energy?
Anyways, Skeptics.SE, Physics.SE...?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes But the friction would be constant. So if the magnet is strong enough to keep the ball for, say, 10 seconds then it should be strong enough to keep it for any amount time.
 
7:38 AM
@StackedCrooked Assuming nothing changes
 
@StackedCrooked Who cares. The system is losing energy at a constant rate, and you have to put it back in somehow.
 
@sehe That's what I'm wondering. What causes the cycle to stop?
 
@StackedCrooked Well. The magnet isn't infinite, is going to be your most likely answer. I mean really, could there be heat dissipation otherwise?
 
I have to thread very carefully here not to give the impression that I'm trying to claim perpetual motion is possible in order to avoid a major shitstorm targeted at me.. :)
 
@StackedCrooked If nothing else, it will heat up the room to the point that everything melts down.
 
7:41 AM
@sehe I also believe it's not infinite. But the magnet is also not a source of energy. It doesn't line up nicely..
@R.MartinhoFernandes It will get us through another Thuesday.
 
@StackedCrooked Assumptions. Why do you keep asserting the same thing, while it is obviously a point of contention?
 
(Of course that won't happen because the room leaks heat like a bucket)
 
@sehe Is it a wrong assertion?
 
@StackedCrooked Nothing. I asled why you keep repeating the assertion?
 
Because it seems to be the main question (in my eyes).
 
7:42 AM
Looks to me as something that could be checked instead of re-asserted.
5 mins ago, by sehe
Anyways, Skeptics.SE, Physics.SE...?
 
Anyway, have to leave for work now.
 
0
A: (-2147483648> 0) returns true in C++?

Bhaskarintegers limit is -32768 to 32767 and the above is greater then zero .

^^ wut
 
@sehe Do you sometimes type or paste commands into the shell while it is still busy executing the current command?
 
Ratio-wise, I think that question has one of the biggest vote gaps between the top and second top answers.
 
@Mysticial 90 vote difference doesn't seem so extreme.
 
7:44 AM
@StackedCrooked 90 to 3 is extreme.
 
@StackedCrooked Yes. Why?
 
That's 30x.
 
@Mysticial Oh, the things people post while I'm away.
 
@Mysticial If you put it like that.
 
Most questions sit at maybe 3x at most.
 
7:45 AM
...
 
@sehe Never mind :)
I'm just upgrading my server and I'm a little impatient.
I have pre-entered a few rsync commands that I hope will run fine :)
 
Now that I take another look, I'm 925 to 19 = 50x. But that's because I had home field advantage.
 
Forethought: apt-get update && apt-get dist-upgrade and stuff like that
 
@sehe I do that too.
 
7:47 AM
10
A: vim : toggle number with relativenumber

seheBecause I love a logic puzzle, and really love it when a vim command fits on a single line for succinct repeats (@: is a personal favourite): :exec &nu==&rnu? "se nu!" : "se rnu!" This will maintain the same cycle. I think it is mainly because let &nu=1 will implicitly set norelati...

^ proof that developers irrationally prefer short code over readable code
 
I usually prefer && because it breaks on the first failure.
 
@Mysticial Well, the minimum range int is required to support is -32767 to +32767. That was pretty common on MS-DOS, but compilers that old barely resemble C++.
 
@StackedCrooked And then I frequently do: ^Z (suspend) and time fg; echo nextcommand etc.
@StackedCrooked You prefer && over &&?
 
echo nextcommand?
@sehe over ; or multiple statements. depending on the situation.
 
@JerryCoffin Well yeah. But he obviously though it was equal to instead of a min.
 
7:49 AM
Or sometimes I use set -e.
 
@StackedCrooked Well. Funny, because I didn't use ; :)
 
@sehe Ah, I was only mumbling in agreement with your previous statement.
 
@StackedCrooked I do that in scripts.
 
@StackedCrooked Hop hop. Go to work. Grab a coffee :)
i'll do the same
 
7:51 AM
I've been working on an installer script to prepare a Linux machine for Coliru. It's still imcomplete and kind of fragile..
 
> No matter wich video i watched, i ALWAYS end up at this one
^ today was my first time ever watching that vid :)
 
@sehe Oh that's pretty awesome...
 
@StackedCrooked Ah. Cool. You were getting jealous off gcc-explorer.sehe.nl:10240 which was literally a single git clone and a (npm based) install script away?
@Mysticial You too had never seen it?
 
@sehe What!? :D
 
@sehe I don't really trawl on YT much.
 
7:54 AM
@StackedCrooked Yeah. It's really nifty, showing generated assembly code side by side
 
Only when people link me something. Or if I'm searching for something specific.
 
@sehe Can you run code?
 
my coroutine implementation c++ asm with stack overflow problems fixed by updating TIB
 
@sehe For a second I thought you created that :)
 
@StackedCrooked tinyurl.com/ag46cl6 <-- they went the icky route encoding the full source in the url string...
@StackedCrooked Nope.
@StackedCrooked I think the output is below
 
7:56 AM
@sehe Yours is ugly compared to the real site :(
 
@Rapptz I don't care
 
@sehe Well I do!
 
@doug65536 TIB?
 
thread information block
 
gcc.godbolt.org this thing right?
 
7:57 AM
@Rapptz Have fun.
 
at gs: segment
 
@doug65536 Ah like you suggested
 
@sehe yes - it worked
 
it actually doesn't work anymore now or I'm doing it wrong
<No output: Error: maxBuffer exceeded.>
 
@Rapptz I believe so. I got it from the isocpp page. Nothing out of the ordinary
@Rapptz Intermittent? It's working on my end (and I'm connecting over the internet too)
 
7:59 AM
@sehe still definitely not perfect, no TLS or FLS context switch
 
oh it was on Clang
that makes.. sense I think
 
> Because the comment said (paraphrasing) “This talk was so pointless. After she mentioned her kids at the beginning I started thinking of ways to hunt them down and punish her for wasting my time here.” ouch
 
mawning
 
user142019
8:16 AM
And I’m at work again.
 
mornin
 
Gud noon @all
 
8:35 AM
@sehe isn't there a limit on GET query length? at least gzip and encode it tight
that's your server?
zlib and base64 the source and build a get string from that might be ok
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes template <typename T, typename traits = elem_traits<T> > // свойство по умолчанию class vector { // ... public: typedef T value_type; typedef typename traits::arg_type arg_type; typedef typename traits::reference reference; typedef typename traits::const_reference const_reference; void push_back(arg_type); // ... };Dukales 12 secs ago
Sigh.
Oh, wow, the comment renders properly here.
 
that's a beautiful comment
not gonna lie
I'm like confused how he managed to do that
 
I like how I explain to him that I can't read Russian, and he just copy-pasted the code straight from the Russian website with the Russian comments still on it.
 
what was supposed to happen? comment is corrupted?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes "default property"
 
8:43 AM
@Rapptz Pasted it into the comment box.
#define ll long long
 
I can't believe I edited that post
 
Xeo
Mornin'
 
9:10 AM
Morning
 
moaning
@Rapptz easy
@doug65536 sure. however, it is not my project. Yes it runs on my server. It works for me, same url. Two more things:
1 hour ago, by sehe
@StackedCrooked Ah. Cool. You were getting jealous off http://gcc-explorer.sehe.nl:10240/ which was literally a single git clone and a (npm based) install script away?
1 hour ago, by sehe
@Rapptz I don't care
^ the latter is to be taken with a grain of salt
 
good answer
 
Hmmm, void ns::f() { ... }? Is this ok or an MS extension?
0
Q: Opening Visual studio 2012

RifkiHave installed Visual Studio 2012 Trial, but it doesn't add any icons to desktop. So how do I open it?, and then add the icons to the desktop in Windows 8

Also... amazing.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes That is almost impossible
 
@doug65536 IOW: I deserve no credit. I have no clue why they did it this way. Probably because it is geared to tiny snippets for assembly inspection. It really works awesome for that
 
9:15 AM
@sehe if you use a browser that handles it, it is convenient
 
@doug65536 Ah, that could be a factor. I use Opera
 
Maybe they designed vs2012 so that you have to have a clue how to use a computer to write software for one
 
O hey. Just noticed this old comment. Still kinda funny:
@TonyK: thanks for the hint. I don't now how I copy/hasted that :) — sehe Oct 25 '11 at 12:27
@doug65536 Ssshht. It's a trade secret
@R.MartinhoFernandes Mmm. That's surprising to me
 
Xeo
@R.MartinhoFernandes What seems wrong with that?
 
does this mean that there will be a flood of "how do I open <app>" FAQs everywhere for win8?
 
9:19 AM
ns is a namespace.
 
Xeo
@R.MartinhoFernandes So?
Might aswell be void class_name::f(){}, it's just a scoping thing.
 
why not try it on ideone, that's gcc
 
Xeo
Coliru is also GCC 4.7, that's what I linked above.
 
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes errors in gcc
 
9:24 AM
You're doing it wrong.
 
what, put a::foo inside the namespace a { ?
 
namespace a { void foo() { ... } }
 
@FredOverflow yes, that's the normal way
 
@FredOverflow erm... you might be missing the point here
 
12 mins ago, by R. Martinho Fernandes
Hmmm, void ns::f() { ... }? Is this ok or an MS extension?
 
9:27 AM
@Xeo So it looks weird and this is C++ so don't try to convince me with logic. (namespace ns1::ns2 {} 'nuff said)
@doug65536 No you did not fix it ideone.com/qlf6Fj
 
I was supposed to guess that from ns::f() { .. }
 
You were supossed to guess it from Xeo's example and GCC's error messages.
> error: ‘void a::foo()’ should have been declared inside ‘a’
Also, WTF, it's sunny again.
 
yes, as opposed to it being defined at that moment. I understand. definition needs declaration
 
FWIW I used to try this stuff (defining specializations) and it would not be accepted. The difference, the, seems to be that you cannot be declaring using a qualified name, but you can be defining an already declared object with a qualified name
 
user142019
Man.
 
user142019
9:32 AM
LINQ is so awesome.
 
@Zoidberg inb4 it is almost like monads
 
@sehe Why only almost?
 
@FredOverflow because it's supposedly different, and/but I know nothing about monads :)
 
@sehe A subset of LINQ syntax is a counterpart of do-notation. FTFY
 
morning all
I like cake :)
 
9:46 AM
Impressive.
 
Have you guys heard of the b method
 
@NolwennLeGuen Is this about porn?
 
I wish it were
 
Here's a challenge: make this work assuming no more about implementation-defined behaviour than what is on the static assertions stacked-crooked.com/view?id=54ae358975a7a06ca4ddbc8bf881d957
 
@nolwenn welcome back, long time no read
ok... Rosa Parks... she's the chick who didn't take shit right?
 
10:28 AM
@R.MartinhoFernandes We are not allowed to implement secret_sauce? Then how can we ever make it link?
Or is this more of a conceptual question?
 
@StackedCrooked You can implement it for testing. It's just a way to say that it must work for any input (i.e. return "0.5"; is not ok). Basically, assume an unknown implementation within the constraints delineated.
 
Floating point isn't fun...
Can I change it to unsigned integer? :D
 
How would that help?
Oh dammit, I forgot to mention that the test cases are always positive.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I assumed that tackling the oddities of floating point numbers would be the core of the challenge.
 
10:32 AM
hab u guis herd of the b-method? ;_;
 
That's why I limited it to numbers of the form x.x (i.e. multiply by ten, cast to int, and voilá, no floating point arithmetic nasties)
 
viola = raped btw
 
Thank you very much for ruining my typo.
 
My pleasure
 
@NolwennLeGuen Yesterday I learned about type a and type b personalities. But I haven't yet heard of the b method. Reading about it right now on Wikipedia.
 
10:35 AM
Also it's à, not á
The only acute accent in french goes on the e
 
> The B method is method of software development based on B
 
3 mins ago, by Nolwenn Le Guen
hab u guis herd of the b-method? ;_;
Shut up.
 
> The B method is method of software development based on B, a tool-supported formal method based around an abstract machine notation, used in the development of computer software.
Yep, I totally get it now.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes i love you too
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I don't get it.
 
10:37 AM
hi
 
@AndreiTita Which part?
 
So yeah if none of you has ever heard of the b method i guess i am oh so surprisingly attending a useless course
Thanks
 
@NolwennLeGuen I'm sorry :(
Have fun?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes So you want a to_string which will work for any number from 0.0 to 99? Is something wrong with std::to_string or is this an exercise?
 
bint
 
10:40 AM
@AndreiTita 0.0 to 9.9
 
@NolwennLeGuen perhaps if you explain what it is? Then we might say "Oh, it's that useless method, it usually goes by the name C"
 
@AndreiTita Yes, there is something wrong with std::to_string :(
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Ah yes it said less than 10.
 
@NolwennLeGuen shrug the important question isn't whether others know of it, but whether there's something in it that'll be useful to you. :)
 
@AndreiTita You are not required to do it by hand if you can do it with a library function (either std or boost)
 
10:43 AM
hi all
 
(And std::to_string doesn't cut it; neither does boost::lexical_cast)
 
Where does std::to_string fail?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Draw up some samples and I'll look into adding them to Unicode proposal?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes > // you can use boost
 
@AndreiTita The dot.
 
10:43 AM
Ah so we can use multiprecision?
 
@sehe Irrelevant. No number has more than two digits.
 
I've had to take a couple of completely useless courses, and a few that focused on the professor's particular (and generally useless) pet project/theory/toolchain but from which you could still extrapolate some more general (and useful) information
 
:)
I'm just excited that there is something in boost for that now
@jalf Plink her?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes As in 7 instead of 7.0?
 
7,0 instead of 7.0. (or whatever other crazies)
 
10:45 AM
that's a locale error, surely.
 
Wait what?
 
the German locale has , as decimal point and . as thousands separator.
 
Yeah, you need to change the locale first.
 
whereas English is the reverse
so simply set locale to English and you should be fine.
 
Which is sucky.
 
10:45 AM
hsilgnE is the reverse
 
it's unavoidable.
 
@DeadMG No, use the C locale.
 
what do you want to_string to do, not respect the current locale?
 
It's iostreams
 
@DeadMG Not require changing global state.
 
10:46 AM
@DeadMG Yeah I'm kind of flustered to.
I reckon std::to_string(T v, std::locale const &) would be king
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Then it should be a simple matter of upgrading to_string to have a locale parameter, rather than replacing it.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes True enough. However, there's boost format, karma, fastformat, sprintf etc.
What does boost::lexical_cast do, anyway? Does it use the locale settings? (I guess so)
 
presumably exactly the same thing.
 
@sehe Uses stringstream. Same suckage.
 
@DeadMG Yep, same here.
 
10:48 AM
@sehe sprintf?
 
well I'll be the first to admit that locales suck balls.
but this is hardly the first instance of such suckage.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Nope. They have been specialized for basic types (int, double...)
 
I'd rather see a proposal to replace them entirely
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes It does exist.
 
Doesn't sprintf use the locales too?
 
10:48 AM
@DeadMG Yeah. Let's all act British
 
yes
@sehe Wat?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Erm. Yikes. Brainfahrt
 
replace(output, ",", "."); // :D
 
@DeadMG How else are you going to 'replace' locales? Locales do exist as well, and there is no way to 'solve that' in a library. They'll still exist
 
in English it's fairly common to not use a separator for thousands, what about Europe and the ilk?
 
10:50 AM
@StackedCrooked But now you have "٠.٥".
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes yeah
but that will come in a later bug report which means I can watch some anime meanwhile
Just kidding :P
 
@thecoshman same here, at least
 
@sehe By issuing new APIs which use a new system. They won't be removed, but people can migrate as possible.
 
@DeadMG What precisely would it "fix" or alleviate?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Let me guess: your company wouldn't touch std::locale with a ten foot pole?
 
10:51 AM
@sehe For one, it needs to have an OS native handle. There's a reason why Boost and ICU have their own locales.
 
@DeadMG But the bigger suckage here is that these are new (i.e. no legacy excuse), and it means that not even the standard library bothers with playing nice with its own locales.
 
@jalf I think it's normal to only start using a thousands separator once you have tens of thousands
 
@DeadMG Well... They should share it, but OS native spells OS dependent behaviour
 
@sehe No, it means permitting extensions, if you're capable of going very slightly lower.
 
this sounds a lot like the xkcd comic about standards :P
 
10:53 AM
@R.MartinhoFernandes I agree. It's kinda the same thing as uniform initialization and UTF-8 literals.
I almost wish C++11 had been delayed further so that these things could have been found and fixed.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes That's mainly it. I think std::locale is... relatively OK. It should just be applied more generally. Also, perhaps, the underlying implementation could reuse OS-supplied facilities better
 
It's one thing for no one to give a fuck about locales. But the standard library?
 
Does localization even belong in the standard library?
 
@DeadMG Sadly, this never works. Things are always overlooked and discovered in the wild
 
@StackedCrooked It is there.
 
Xeo
10:55 AM
sigh, here I am again, wondering how the fuck make works.
 
@Xeo magic
 
@sehe This is true. I'd just rather that they weren't such gaping holes that you can find with fairly simple examples.
 
@StackedCrooked Does to_string belong in the standard library? Should double d; cin >> d; work?
I'd rather have an apple pie right now.
 
@sehe to_string is useful, the same can not be said about locale.
 
@StackedCrooked To be honest, I don't know. Since we write plugins, InDesign handles most of the issues. Only if we do custom serialization might that pop up.
 
10:56 AM
@Xeo tears of virgins
 
@StackedCrooked except you need locales to correctly implement to_string:)
 
The two cannot be untangled.
Your statement is self-conflicted
 
@StackedCrooked What is to_string for if not output?
 
@StackedCrooked I'd say yes. It's a pain in the ass to implement correctly, and it's something that pretty much everyone relies on.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Getting a very slow log10 function (to_string(7894).size() == floor(log10(7894))
2
 
10:59 AM
Jon Skeet sucks at formatting dates nuget.org/packages/NodaTime/1.1.0-dev-2013-31-01. Oh, yeah, almost forgot, that's a package for a date/time handling library.
 

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