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9:00 PM
@Pawnguy7 Man that book is old
@Morwenn Depends what you mean by existing, if you use the liberal approach that Etienne has then sure.
 
user142019
@TonyTheLion Dat mustache.
 
I know right
 
> In gender studies, "cisgender" and "cissexual" describe related types of gender identity where an individual's self-perception of their gender matches the sex they were assigned at birth.
 
@Pawnguy7 Frindle := Male empiricist claiming to support feminist research.
 
@CaptainGiraffe say what?
 
9:01 PM
@CaptainGiraffe It's a book
 
@Rapptz Languages change and evolve. New words appear all the time.
 
@Rapptz The word does represent something we don't have simpler words for. And yeah, words exist because people use(d) them; it should not be the other way around.
 
@EtiennedeMartel The way it usually i.e.?
 
@CaptainGiraffe Most people are cisgendered.
 
9:02 PM
No, most people claim to be cisgendered.
 
@Morwenn "simpler" words for? The word was made because people were offended by the scientific definition of it.
 
@EtiennedeMartel Is cis an acronym?
 
@CaptainGiraffe I don't think so.
 
@Rapptz When I say "simpler", i mean "there isn't any short and accurate word to replace it".
@EtiennedeMartel Nope, since comes from some greek or latin root.
 
@CaptainGiraffe cis is a latin prefix meaning "on this side of"
 
9:04 PM
@EtiennedeMartel So I'm a guy is now, I'm a cisgendered male? it is an odd new world competeing with twitter.
@Rapptz Ah, thanks.
 
Does anybody want to see my line particles?
 
@CaptainGiraffe If you were born male and you identify as male, then you are a cisgendered male.
If you were born male but identify as female, then you are a transgendered male (or female? It's confusing).
(In that regard, @Rapptz is right)
 
;_; don't go around calling yourself a cisgendered male
 
@EtiennedeMartel Transgender is wider. What you described is transexual.
 
@Morwenn Maybe. It's so fucking complex.
@Rapptz Why not?
 
9:05 PM
Transgender is more generally "having gender identity disorders".
 
@EtiennedeMartel An oddly long statement to make for what is probably >>99 percent of the population.
 
@CaptainGiraffe Yeah.
 
If you were born male and identify as female, you're a trans female. That's how it works, yeah :)
 
@Pawnguy7 ooh particles :D want to see
 
And kinda pointless. For me, "male" means you identify as male, no matter what your actual biological gender is.
 
9:06 PM
I don't feel like arguing about it
 
@EtiennedeMartel Well, that's exactly how it is.
 
Any examples in scientific terminology using "cis" as a prefix? I can't recall any.
 
For instance, she is female, even though she wasn't born that way.
 
@CaptainGiraffe No
 
@CaptainGiraffe It's mostly a made up term as a way to have a "us" vs "them" type discussion.
 
user142019
9:07 PM
I just call people whatever they want me to call them, except when they're noobs or morons in which cases I call them "noob" or "moron", respectively.
 
Ell
To me male and female is biological. I've never come across anything else
 
Oh fuck that, If they want to do Frindle squared, by all means be a misunderstood lot.
 
Ell
I know cis & trans from IUPAC naming chemicals
 
man
 
Ell
9:09 PM
E.g. cisbut-2-ene or transbut-2-ene
 
creating a decent lambda syntax in a value-typed language sucks.
 
@Ell Actually, if you know a little bit about gender studies, biological will be called "sex" while the psychological will be called "gender".
 
Ell
With geometric isomerism
 
@Morwenn That makes sense.
 
Ell
I don't really know anything about gender studies
 
9:10 PM
I know a little bit.
 
Ell
I find it a strange situation
 
@DeadMG Hehe we just did syntax in a grammar lecture today and I pointed out the trickiness of lambdas =)
 
Not the best picture.
 
@CaptainGiraffe Thing is, there are just a lot of things to specify if you can't rely on a GC to take care of everything for you
 
Ell
@deadly what is "value-typed"?
 
9:11 PM
@Ell Once you get used to the fact that transgender people do exist, you start not caring about many things... or you're utterly revolted.
 
I mean
right now, I'm thinking along the lines of function(args) { stuff; } for default capture by value.
 
Ell
I think disbelief would come first
 
then you could do function(args)[&] { stuff; } for default capture by ref, or function(args)[&, value := initializer] { stuff; }
 
I live in a fantasy world where people shouldn't be offended by dumb things
works 9/10 times
 
@Rapptz Transgender isn't dumb, it's perfectly logical.
 
9:14 PM
I am talking in general.
 
@DeadMG There is a detailed c++ grammar description online. @DeadMG yep that seems like a good first call.
 
@CaptainGiraffe I know, but I don't intend to imitate the C++ grammar.
 
I didn't even mention transgender there
what the hell
 
@Rapptz Considering that the subject of the discussion at the time was transgender, it does not seem an unreasonable inference.
 
A bit jumping the gun though.
considering the statement is generalised
 
9:15 PM
That reminds me.
there was a joke about being politically correct.
drug dealer is unlicensed pharmacist or something.
 
@Rapptz No, DeadMG made the false assumption that your statement included a semantic of "transgendered is dumb". Your statement did however carry a semantic of "I think these people are people too"
 
@TonyTheLion what is it?
 
waves
 
That was my first thought, but it looks... wrong.
 
Ell
9:19 PM
Transgender is a medical issue isn't it?
 
Transgendered people aren't dumb. I just find people who get offended over really dumb, minuscule things need to relax a little.
 
@Ell It's considered a mental desease since the body is healthy but the problem can not be resolved without some body modification.
 
btw this reminds me of this image
 
Or brain washing. Your pick.
 
Ell
Well that sucks for them :/
 
9:21 PM
Yes. Anyway.
At a time, homosexuality was considered a mental desease. However, homosexual people's bodies are healthy and do not need anything besides acceptance by the society.
 
Ell
Hmmm. Interesting
 
The Pony level has been adjusted. Moderators... moderate.
 
@Morwenn It's not a mental disease.
 
Does that also apply to murderers?
 
@Pawnguy7 What part?
 
9:25 PM
@Morwenn this
Wait. Ack. Did that wrong :\
anyway, that part
 
@DeadMG I once tried to find the exact definition of mental disease and it seems to be quite a mess actually. So, I can safely assume you're right.
 
Well, only 0.3% of the US population identifies themselves as transgender.
 
@Rapptz That's a lot higher than I expected.
 
For such a low percent, there sure is a bunch of news about it.
 
@Morwenn If it isn't in the DSM IV then it isn't legally a mental disorder or mental disease.
 
9:27 PM
@Rapptz I expected about 0.05%
 
@Morwenn Well, virtually all mental illnesses have biological causes in the brain or DNA (or both).
so where do you draw the line between a mental disorder and a physical one?
@Rapptz Pity that the DSM V just got it's arse kicked back to Hell.
 
@CaptainGiraffe We cannot be sure either. Most of them just don't know what's wrong with them or just do not want to admit it.
 
It's being published this month.
 
@Pawnguy7 Isn't most news about things that are statically insignificant?
 
@Rapptz And utterly ignored by the US mental health body.
 
9:28 PM
doubt it
 
@DeadMG I dunno. My line was that if you don't have anything to do and it's fine, it's not a mental illness.
 
@andre that is actually a pretty good point
 
@Morwenn True, and sometimes one diagnosed condition readily allows the person to identify with that condition. It is tricky.
 
Gender identity disorder (GID) is the formal diagnosis used by psychologists and physicians to describe persons who experience significant gender dysphoria (discontent with the sex they were assigned at birth and/or the gender roles associated with that sex). It describes the symptoms related to transsexualism, as well as less extreme manifestations of gender dysphoria. Individuals with GID are commonly referred to as "transgender". Though no recent research has been conducted, the prevalance of GID is estimated to be approximately 1 in 30,000, though some researchers suggest that the p...
just throwing that out there
 
@Morwenn Well I would certainly agree that a minimum definition of "illness" would have to be "negative consequences".
 
9:29 PM
Oh. My. Gawd WARNING: Not pleasant to look at. Came from r/WTF
 
It's said that many autistic people do not even know they are.
@DeadMG Thing is, they suffer. Hence me calling it an illness.
 
know they meet the diagnosis or know they are different?
 
@DeadMG And even if the society accepts them as they are, without some body modifications, many will continue to suffer.
 
can we stop with the "only feels not reals" I feel is going on here ;_;
 
@Pawnguy7 The diagnosis is a comfort.
 
9:31 PM
meh fuck it. Back to coding.
 
so the latter?
 
eh, it's Morwenn who said "If you don't have to do anything and it's fine", which kind of implies "If you're not suffering".
obviously if you are suffering then you do have to do something and it's not fine.
 
@Pawnguy7 No not at all, but it is a problem in the measurement
 
besides
 
Well, that's kind of what I meant, but I'm still not really good a handling correctly long sentences.
 
9:32 PM
my original point was, you've drawn a pretty arbitrary line between a physical condition and a mental one
 
@CaptainGiraffe I am confused
 
Well, probably. Actually, I do not care whether this is a disease or not. I was just trying to figure it out since someone asked.
 
It's in the DSM IV and DSM V.
 
That would be the legal answer.
 
There is criticism from both sides whether it should be there or not (likewise, for a lot of things)
 
9:33 PM
@Pawnguy7 If you are doing statistics, you'd better be sure of what you are measuring. You are likely aware of the saying lies, damned lies and statistics.
 
@Morwenn What the hell do you want then?
 
@CaptainGiraffe I am, yes. I don't know why we are discussing statistics at all, though.
 
An answer of how I feel it should be treated? Because then it doesn't matter.
 
@Morwenn Well, considering that sufferers require medical treatment, I'd have to go with "yes".
 
@Pawnguy7 The grey area in the diagnosis. well ok, end of...
 
9:34 PM
@Rapptz I would only like to wipe out transphobia and to wish transgender people good luck.
 
if it's not a disease then we obviously should not waste the medical profession's time on it
 
On the contrary. I'd usually quietly correct the mistake. Alas, I had no such opportunity (blame bad phone connectivity) and also the thing had (more than) 3 upvotes. That seemed an excellent moment to remind Twitter voters of their duty to actually read their stuff... IOW I was criticizing voters, because criticized the posts is what the buttons are for (i didn't even downvote since I knew someone would fix the obvious oversight in a matter of minutes. Not important) — sehe 2 mins ago
 
but since that's not a viable solution
 
@CaptainGiraffe I beleive you (or was it somebody else? ) said many don't even know. Know what is my question.
 
The treatment part was one of my original points.
 
9:36 PM
@Pawnguy7 Aha, my interpretation was: "That they have that diagnosis" or situation, or even disposition is a word that can be used.
 
But I formulated it so poorly that I mught have confused everyone^^"
 
What a struggle posting ^^ that from a phone....
 
@CaptainGiraffe Most are not aware that they would be diagnosed into that?
 
@Pawnguy7 Yes, that was my interpretation. And I find that a reasonable one.
 
@CaptainGiraffe I agree.
 
9:38 PM
the llamas are drowning in the lake
 
@Doorknob I'm still in the tummy of a Grue from the last game I played. Gimme something better please.
 
@CaptainGiraffe lol, well right now I'm making a game and if you don't save the llama within 3 seconds it drowns in the lake
 
If it is a text based interface I can type "Save llama" in less than three seconds. Is llama a file btw?
 
what the...? I asked for the error message on a random SO question and the OP responded by pasting his entire 700 line project but no error message
@CaptainGiraffe you click and drag the llamas out of a lake :P
 
That's just normal SO proceedings, right, @doorknob?
 
9:43 PM
ye
 
Dragging llamas out of a lake In c++? That sounds like a Visual Basic project.
 
@CaptainGiraffe it's not C++. it's HTML5 and JS.
 
@Doorknob Ahh VB++. Just kidding
What toolkits are you using for the js part?
I'm guessing the game is in a canvas?
 
Woo, I have food again
 
@CaptainGiraffe just plain Javascript with HTML5 canvas
 
9:46 PM
JS? Good luck.
 
@Pawnguy7 so far the llamas drown if you don't rescue them in 3 seconds, and if you do you get points :P
 
@Doorknob Good luck. It is bound to be a good adventure for you at least. Always keep a hard object inside your towel so you at least can inscribe Elbereth.
 
@CaptainGiraffe err... what? O_o
 
@Doorknob You do have a towel at all times don't you?
 
@CaptainGiraffe err... I suppose? how is that relevant?
 
9:51 PM
You are in bad shape dear friend. Just be calm.
 
@Rapptz go do that in the PHP room :P
 
pfft.
 
@Rapptz You need to be cleansed. :)
 
Xeo
I noticed that the tags in chat are also shadow-less now :(
 
9:53 PM
yeah same
very flat.
 
WTF
OH GOD, Metro is coming to StackOverflow?!
 
hey... that tag is good
 
^ Ahh.... it has a shadow.
 
???
 
what the hell :(
 
9:55 PM
Haha.
Rapptz has the Metro Curse. :P
 
;__; what
 
Hm.
 
ahahaha
 
Yep.
Rapptz is cursed.
 
[help-pls]
Hm.. that ain't it.
 
9:57 PM
 
Nope. <3
Just Rapptz
 
Xeo
haha
 
hey, that's pretty fucking weird.
 
Xeo
9:57 PM
haha
 
nope @Xeo :D
 
user142019
He used ncurses.
 
why are mine so flat
 
Metro. <3
 
Xeo
9:58 PM
You like 'em flat as a board, admit it.
 
damn, it's really only me
 
9:59 PM
it's [tag:stuff-here],
 
whatta
 

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