« first day (1412 days earlier)      last day (3538 days later) » 

12:00 PM
v0v
 
hmpfh
passing choice or select_overload{} manually is yuck
 
@sehe the tracking.... it burns my eyes!
 
Mehrdad Afshari, Palo Alto, California
207k 38 575 655
is this another mehrdad?!
 
so I just removed the static assert "error" overload for now //cc @Xeo
 
I honestly can't tell.
Oh, it is.
What a twist.
 
12:05 PM
ugh, msdn's code examples are the worst
 
if they have any
they usually don't :s
 
well, the ones they do are horrible
 
and when they do, they're terrible
yeahh
 
if(pbElement = (BYTE*)malloc(cbElement))
{
     printf("Memory has been allocated. Continue.\n");
}
else
{
     MyHandleError("The allocation of memory failed.");
}
 
12:06 PM
in a sample trying to describe how to get certificates from the certificate store
 
"Hey, let's spend 8 lines on nonsense for a fucking malloc call"
 
@jalf ACK using printf without arguments make it burrrrn
 
@Mgetz who cares about that :v
 
well, 11 lines
 
12:07 PM
point taken
but still
 
I skipped the leading comment explaining the malloc call
 
Ell
I want a new phone
 
ugh
fucking useless flags in the javascript room
 
:| just need one more upboat
 
12:12 PM
I need 396 rep.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes omg
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes vOv relatively speaking I need more (maybe... didn't do the maths)
 
user image
9
 
@Jefffrey you use it to bind her?
 
@Jefffrey lol, subtle
 
12:22 PM
Oh. The sample uses void main(void) too :|
 
I had to read that several times to get it.
clearly I should expedite those glasses.
 
@Puppy nooo, just angry and shout
 
You should just skip blindness.
 
Hm
Next version of PHP will be PHP7.
It seems they're actually going to skip PHP6.
 
what happened to PHP6?
 
12:25 PM
@Jefffrey look, boy, I have other browsers too :)
 
Jul 21 at 0:47, by Jefffrey
TIL PHP people cannot count to 6.
 
@Jefffrey Yeah. I remember that. But it was closed remember?
 
@Jefffrey Heh. I refuse to believe that some of the Engrish is not deliberate.
 
@Rapptz Yes, they closed it because more people wanted it to be called 6.
 
12:27 PM
No?
Read the history. We discussed this.
 
And democracy does not exist in PHPLand.
 
@chmod711telkitty that's a relief
 
How are you misconstruing what you said in the past?
 
I'm just very good at it.
 
@Puppy they realized it was going to suck :p
 
12:28 PM
> This previous attempt at a new major version was also developed under the name of PHP 6 and as such there are various resources referring to it, including a number of books.
 
as opposed to any other version?
 
PHP7 seems reasonable enough
 
@Puppy hope springs eternal!
Since php7 isn't out yet, they can hope that it won't suck :D
maybe when it's closer to shipping, they'll realize it still sucks, and rename it PHP8
 
what are they going to call it "PHP6, the new PHP6, not that old PHP6 that we started and failed at"
 
PHP6 was the one that was intended to get basic unicode stuff right, wasn't it?
 
12:29 PM
@jalf and failed
 
dunno don't care
 
@jalf it sucks due to lack of existence
¬_¬ one of the reasons for php7... there is no good reason not to
 
@Rapptz As they should.
They same way we skipped C++1x, but on a larger scale.
 
agreed
 
Yeah I'm not really disagreeing.
 
12:32 PM
I had a look at the reasons for skipping and they seem pretty sound to me.
 
@Puppy shhh, we can't admit they did something sensible
 
lol
 
@jalf Failed to gain consensus, IIRC.
 
> started in 2005 and abandoned in 2010 due to difficulties in the Unicode implementation
sigh
 
guess just linking ICU was too much effort
 
12:34 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes idk, I haven't followed it :)
 
ah, fuck.
I just realized that you can add new productions, but no new errors.
 
@jalf like I said, failed
 
Well, unicode support for PHP would make it sensibly less sucky
 
Oh, "consensus" is not right.
"support" is more accurate.
 
let's face it, not being PHP would make PHP less sucky.
 
12:37 PM
@jalf Reasons starting at slide 67: slideshare.net/andreizm/…
 
PHP7 apparently won't have unicode support anyway.
 
The developers don't have enough interest to actually do it.
Plus lack of mindshare.
/**
* Shall return the number of unicode code points
* @return int
**/
public function length();
@Jefffrey :S
 
hmm
hey robot, if I mark a function as imported, do you think that defaulting it makes sense?
 
Defaulting to what?
 
the imported body.
I guess it doesn't really matter because you can only define them as imported as an implementation detail.
 
12:42 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes I don't know enough about unicode to spot the problem. I guess code points != single character.
 
It's just that it's not useful.
 
I was just about to say
I bet that there are not many ways in which that function can actually be used.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes How so?
 
@Jefffrey Name one use of the number of codepoints in a string.
 
Dunno how to answer that without just asking what uses it can have.
 
12:44 PM
If code points == single character, then length returns the length of the string. And that's widely considered useful?
 
they're not equal, and that's still not useful.
 
It's a common red herring.
Number of bytes is more useful than number of code points, but the number of bytes is often seen as a sign that "it does not support Unicode".
 
if it was number of bytes you could arguably use it for some memory management or something.
 
Ell
A "Unicode Character" is one code point isn't it?
or was it code unit. Damnit I always forget :p
 
@Puppy Exactly. The number of bytes is useful for preallocating buffers, or for marking field lengths in serialisation scenarios.
 
12:46 PM
this really depends on which of the thousand meanings of the word "character" you take.
 
user3010322
> only affordable by rich oil companies
 
user3010322
lul
 
How is the length of a string not useful?
 
What do you use it for?
 
@Jefffrey There's nothing useful you can actually achieve with it.
 
12:46 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes For printing it?
 
don't need to know the length.
 
That's not the number of codepoints.
 
user3010322
@Jefffrey at no point in the existence of forever does counting the number of characters in a string prove useful to anyone.
 
only the number of bytes.
 
That's the number of pixels the glyphs use.
 
12:47 PM
@ThePhD Except twitter, I guess.
 
or that.
 
Ell
@Puppy Isn't it defined in the unicode spec? What is this: fileformat.info/info/unicode/char/0300/index.htm ?
 
@Jefffrey Well-known to be broken in the case of Unicode.
 
Ell
Oh wait it says Unicode Character nvm
 
is a single Twitter character a glyph, or a codepoint, or what?
 
12:47 PM
@Puppy It's not.
 
"Well-known"
 
ok well let me re-phrase that.
 
I think that it's not equitable to count "character" as either glyph or codepoint.
if you count them as codepoints then languages with many combining marks will get screwed over, since a single glyph with many combining marks will be many characters.
if you count them as glyphs then they get extra characters, effectively.
 
user3010322
Then maybe they shouldn't have invented a shitty language where lots of combining marks were necessary.
 
12:49 PM
@Puppy They count code points in NFC. The number of languages that suffer is small.
 
yes, I'm sure that they reasonably foresaw, hundreds of years ago, that way in the future they would need to be represented by digital binary systems that were built to favour other languages.
@R.MartinhoFernandes I actually don't know how many post-combine forms are in NFC.
 
So technically, due to combining code points, code points do not reflect the number of what we would call a character?
 
not at all.
 
Even if you ignore that.
 
12:51 PM
not to mention codepoints that don't actually represent any user-visible glyph, like RTL overrides or zero-width spaces.
 
user3010322
The closest you could maybe get is running the thing through a full-fledged renderer
 
user3010322
and counting each visible character
 
Got it.
 
Twitter's use case is a completely artificial restriction that they imposed upon themselves.
 
wait... why would café be 5/6 bytes? shouldn't it 4/5?
 
12:51 PM
well, the whole idea of "a character" is just fucked and useless.
 
sure, if you don't have any
 
@thecoshman I guess è takes two bytes.
 
(Yes, I know it has origins in SMS, but SMS don't use Unicode)
 
@Jefffrey It's outside the ASCII plane, so it must take two bytes.
the decomposed form takes one byte for the e, and the combining mark is also outside ASCII so again, two bytes.
 
And the third one is probably an e + '
 
12:53 PM
@Jefffrey é has single UTF-8 byte representation doesn't it?
 
Apparently no.
 
@thecoshman The whole point of the Twitter article he linked to is that it doesn't.
 
@Puppy ah yes
 
@thecoshman Anything trans-ASCII doesn't.
 
@Puppy I know that it has two representations, one that takes another byte.
 
user3010322
12:53 PM
Ooops
 
> The examples on this page will be provided mostly in the Ruby programming language
oh dear
 
user3010322
PHP6 chose UTF16.
 
@thecoshman A code point can take up to 4 bytes IIRC
 
@ThePhD there's your problem
 
user3010322
ICU must've tricked them in those early days.
 
12:54 PM
@Jefffrey it can yes
 
I thought Latin e with a grave could fit in one byte since it's Latin-1?
 
@thecoshman Meh, that was far from their real problem. It was a people's problem.
@Rapptz If you encode it in Latin-1, yes.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes sure
@Rapptz é is not e though
 
@thecoshman I don't get it either. Their own example shows 4/5 bytes.
hah, no it doesn't
can't count
 
there's nothing wrong with UTF-16.
 
12:56 PM
> Version 6 is generally associated with failure in the world of dynamic languages
 
Perl
Python.
Oh wait.
 
lol
I was just about to say
 
TIL Python 6.
 
Can't reveal my time travelling nature.
 
@Jefffrey people confuse code points and graphemes, they are very different. One is a number that corresponds to a character in the unicode set. The other is what is actually rendered to the screen
 
12:56 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes oh, we all know
 
Python 3 is still pushing ahead, but they're still trying to update so much stuff from Python 2.
 
@Mgetz Glyphs get rendered.
 
I'm still not sure if that whole thing is going to work out but at least they didn't abandon it.
@Mgetz Codepoints do not correspond to a character in the Unicode set.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes odd of you to call that "nature". That tells me that you have seen past 3077 :)
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes At least Python 6 is not going to be a failure. :)
 
12:58 PM
what kind of crappy function name is scalbn
 
C kind
 
not sure what scalbn even means
I know what it does but that doesn't seem to hint at the name..
 
what does it do?
 
Ell
I need to block in javascript, this feels wrong
 
x * FLT_RADIX^exp
x and exp are arguments
 
1:02 PM
scale binary?
 
That's how you say ldexp in BSD.
 
both are standard C99 math functions (and in turn, C++11).
> The function name stands for "new scalb", where scalb was an older non-standard function whose second argument had floating-point type.
 
See, that was easy.
 
Vladmir Putin doing the ice bucket challenge
 
Ell
@LightnessRacesinOrbit haha
those guys are crazy
 
1:06 PM
(it's not really Putin)
it's a real Russian nuclear sub tho!
 
with that potato camera quality it sure looks like him though
screw youtube for forcing the big player
 
@Puppy omg wasted bytes!
@Rapptz lol, spud cam
@R.MartinhoFernandes don't worry, you didn't
 
I find the ALS ice bucket thing ridiculous because apparently it's for some good cause but I still have no idea what ALS is.
 
But I do know that you have to pour the ice down your head and nominate people to do the same.
 
1:10 PM
> 3 Billion Devices Run Java
Yup. And 3 billion humans run from java
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I didn't until someone said it was what in the UK we call 'Motor Neurone Disease'
 
I have this vague impression
that LRIO likes GoT
 
@thecoshman FWIW, British spelling is Neurone.
 
@Rapptz o_0
 
Ell
1:11 PM
@Rapptz lol
that made me giggle
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes rtfm!
 
Amyotrophic lateral sclerosis (ALS)—also referred to as motor neurone disease (MND), Lou Gehrig's disease in the United States, and rarely Charcot disease—is a neurodegenerative disease with various causes. ALS is characterised by muscle spasticity, rapidly progressive weakness due to muscle atrophy, and difficulty in speaking (dysarthria), swallowing (dysphagia), and breathing (dyspnea). ALS is the most common of the five motor neuron diseases. In the U.S., more than 5,600 are diagnosed every year, and up to 30,000 Americans are currently affected. ALS is responsible for 2 deaths per 100,000 people...
Oh. A moment of silence for our beloved translate: feature btw.
translate: It shall be missed.
RIP 2014-2014
2
 
our code design is very complicated
 
Ell
The brown wedding :L
 
Off I go.
Adios mis amigos.
 
1:15 PM
@Rapptz I was going to say my grandpa has that
but his issue occurred after a stroke
 
@AlexM. Get ouT
@Ell A Song of Bytes and Wire
 
> The challenge dares nominated participants to be filmed having a bucket of ice water poured on their heads and challenging others to do the same. A common stipulation is that nominated people have 24 hours to comply or forfeit by way of a charitable financial donation
Wait what
 
Ell
@LightnessRacesinOrbit That's a stretch :P
@R.MartinhoFernandes yup.
 
the problem is, nobody seems to use ice water
 
> Monad--a simple but powerful abstraction, however, considered quite difficult to understand in the imperative circles.
This is the worst sentence ever
 
1:18 PM
@AlexM. loads do...
 
I probably see one or two vids in 10 with people that use ice water
 
@Rapptz RIP 08.2014-08.2014?
 
btw, here's prof x' bucket challenge
#classy
 
That's Captain Picard.
 
I'm too softcore for that
 
1:20 PM
@AlexM. huh
@AlexM. Picard*
oops repost
 
oops repost
 
you and your star trek things :(
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes no, it's Patrick Stewart.
 
Ell
^
 
@AlexM. also, what are you abbreviating here?
 
1:25 PM
Professor Charles Francis Xavier, M.D., Ph.D. (also known as Professor X) is a fictional character, a superhero that appears in comic books published by Marvel Comics. He is known as the leader and founder of the X-Men. Throughout most of his comic book history, Xavier is paraplegic, although his body houses one of the world's most powerful mutant minds. As a high-level telepath, Xavier can read, control, and influence human minds. A scientific genius, he is also a leading authority on genetics, mutation, and psionic powers. Xavier resents the violent methods of the supervillain Magneto and argues...
 
hi :)
I have a macro that creates a namespace at global scope, does anyone know a trick to require a semicolon after the macro?
 
@AlexM. yes, but that would be prof' X, not prof X'
 
the ' after X says the challenge is his, or something
 
I choose something.
 
it's like professor's but for stuff that ends in particular letters the s is not written
 
user3010322
1:28 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes Wait... you don't pour the ice on your head AS a way of donation, you just pour it on your head as a way of foregoing the payment?
 
@AlexM. Wat... really?
 
user3010322
I... I don't think most people follow the foregoing the payment bit, but...
 
Ell
@ThePhD You're supposed to pour it on your head and donate
 
@Jefffrey uh yeah
@ThePhD you can donate and not pour it but most people donate and pour it so they look good in front of their friends
meh friends
like, oh hey I'm doing this because I'm such a good mate and I ALSO donated.
 
@Ell I think the original idea you basically challenge people to do it, or if they are wimps they donate.
 
Ell
1:31 PM
@thecoshman I don't think so
 
vOv I haven't tracked it back to the start
 
well so far the only 4th TGLGJ suggestion is "bartek is terrible"
 
if you just donate, you're a wimp, if you just ice, you're a cheap skate.
 
@Jefffrey Yes, those particular letters are... the letter S.
 
just S?
 
1:32 PM
And according to some, only those that indicate plurals.
 
so Alex's something is valid
 
"Indiana Jones's whip".
 
it sounds weird
 
So "people's head" and "potatoes skin" are correct?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes IIRC, whilst you say the two 's' you don't spell them...
 
1:33 PM
hmm
 
1 min ago, by R. Martinho Fernandes
And according to some, only those that indicate plurals.
 
the Helpouts thing pinged me and told me I was no longer available for instant help.
 
@Jefffrey the latter is not.
 
@Jefffrey the potatoes' skin
 
not sure how that's supposed to work.
 
1:34 PM
@Jefffrey You keep the apostrophe.
 
right
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes o_0 maybe I should read context more
 
Ell
@Puppy How come?
 
user3010322
I like removing the s when there's already an s present at teh end of the name.
 
user3010322
But that's Bad English or whatever.
 
1:35 PM
@Ell No idea.
 
@Puppy wut
 
the Helpouts help page doesn't actually say in any way what happens when somebody tries to request help from you.
it only tells the people how they're supposed to request help.
 
@ThePhD I just pick whichever matches the way I pronounce it.
 
it doesn't say, I dunno, "We send you an email when someone tries to schedule help", or, "We ping a loud noise if someone asks for instant help" or something.
 
1:38 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes that generally is not too helpful :(
 
I say "Indiana /dʒoʊnz/ whip", so I write "Indiana Jones' whip". /dʒoʊnzɨz/ sounds weird.
Makes me think of "the Joneses".
 
Ell
meh. I don't like "private by convention"
 
I don't like private in general.
 
Or maybe it should be /dʒoʊnzs/? But I can't properly do the z-s transition since it's only a voiced/voiceless transition.
 
List possible changes, updates, additions for php6.

...
*) C++ Usage
...
 
1:43 PM
If I try it just degenerates to having the two merged into a single consonant.
 
Now I see why they failed.
 
@Jefffrey There is no php6, they had a two week long argument about it and they decided to name it php7
 
user3010322
Now I'm reading about Word Press and The Loop.
 
user3010322
This is all, ugm.
 
user3010322
Well.
 
user3010322
1:45 PM
Hm.
 
user3010322
If this is the kind of stuff Cat deals with, I can see why he's regularly incensed.
 
"The Loop"?
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit You should let him know. He'll be thrilled at the achievement
 
@Jefffrey while(true) {}
 
@thecoshman same difference
 
@AlexM. genitive (just think of a popular word to remember)
 
> <small><?php the_time( 'F jS, Y' ); ?> by <?php the_author_posts_link(); ?></small>
I can't but laugh every time I read wordpress code.
 
the_ is a very very expressive identifier prefix
 
They should make a version that replaces the_ with le_.
> <small><?php le_time( 'F jS, Y' ); ?> by <?php le_author_posts_link(); ?></small>
 
user3010322
top_lel_pruhgrums_bruh
 
1:50 PM
Thanks for the legwork there. I truly had a hard time imagining that substitution.
Perhaps try s/the_/le_/ next time for brevity
@ThePhD tip_lol_pogroms_uh
 
np dood
 
0
Q: std::thread vs AfxBeginThread

Andrey ProOf course it's not a new topic, for example: Difference between Afxbeginthread and CreateThread But in such questions std::thread is never considered as an option and I wonder why? Additionally the answer may be different for each situation. So here is mine: I have a simulation application. I ...

 
@sehe one is real, one is not (for some meanings of real)
 

« first day (1412 days earlier)      last day (3538 days later) »