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16:00
did we get frozen? i missed all the fun
@RoelvanUden @KendallFrey @Amy @mikeTheLiar @Sidney @tweray: gist.github.com/ArtOfCode-/f4314b3f9ea59124988842154c4e221c
user47589
we did.
@SteveG just like Philip J Fry
oh wow
It's the death of panini all over again, x10
user47589
16:02
don't worry, the panini will return more powerful than ever
looks like terrorism finally hit the chat
What is this panini
@Failsafe that's two questions noob
@mikeTheLiar Huh?
I didn't write that
noob
lol I know I'm just being an ass
16:04
noob
i gtg to lunch bbl
I'm going to play LoL now, where the realy salty community lives, laters all. Thanks for an interesting introduction to the chat
free for someone to post, 'cos it doesn't work if I do it
Does anybody else want to weigh in on the potential meta question?
Fuck this project
micdrop
I'd be happy to contribute when it goes up
user47589
16:05
not until it becomes an actual meta question
@Sippy B&D
@Amy the question was written by a mod for us to post
If we agree that the question is an accurate portrayal of the issue one of us is supposed to post it
Wheres the meta question at
2 questions, can i still drop f bombs, and wheres the meta question at
user47589
i guess that's it
up to you lot if you wanna post it, with or without modifications, I just wrote it 'cos it might be more neutral than someone involved might write
@ArtOfCode thank you for taking the time
@ArtOfCode thanks for taking time on this mess, really appreciate that. i would share you my pizza slice if you are on long island
user47589
16:12
!!pizza 200 300
user47589
mmmmm
Thats not a panini
!!pizza my belly
@mikeTheLiar Input not matching /(\d+)\s(\d+)/. Help: User-taught command: 'gives <>http://lorempizza.com/$1/$2#.png
16:12
Long Island? Oh, I'm only a very few small tiny little itsy-bitsy several thousand miles away!
I think this settles it. I'm going to the pizza truck for lunch today.
user47589
i'm gonna get fish tacos
user47589
FISH TACOS YEAH BABY YEAH
@CapricaSix that's looks gross
@bluefeet just checking, do you know that Cap's a bot?
16:13
looks pretty gud to me
I become hungry. So good pizza
It does, the cheese looks plastic and I don't like mushrooms
@CuddleBunny mushrooms?
@mikeTheLiar WHAT?
yeah I know
@bluefeet everyone gets a different image
16:14
really?
shrimp on a pizza ... yuck
it's random
@KendallFrey that explains a lot
@bluefeet shrimp is amazing
@KendallFrey oh so if I reload the page I'll get something else
16:14
ranch dressing on pizza = godlike
shrimp + steak on a pizza
@mikeTheLiar if it doesn't cache, yeah
not totally, one size might have 5-6 different pic's
@SteveG ewww gross
user47589
!!pizza 400 150
soooo good, you don't know what you're missing
@Amy that looks delish
i putting ranch on pizza instead of tomato is such a waste
@KendallFrey maybe, but not on pizza
I see a pizza
who else sees a pizza
@SteveG I know exactly what I'm missing, my mom makes ranch pizza
16:15
you know what else is good, real maple syrup on chili dogs
real maple syrup is good on pretty much anything
including nachos mmmmmm
^
oh i've never tought of nachos before
...on nachos? :|
user47589
@KendallFrey but you would say that, wouldn't you, mr canada?
talking about hot dogs, do you know burger king double downed on that stupid hot dog idea?
16:16
@Shoe I was short on salsa
user47589
this is just a plot to sell more maple syrup
i should try maple syrup on poutine
@Amy good price. really.. come to me not Kendall
now there's whopper dog
16:17
it probably wouldn't be great
I treat you good , eh
isn't that you just find a random tree in canada and drill it you get 70% chance to get some maple syrup?
user47589
i have coin if you have syrup
fuck windows 10 sticky corners feature for multiple monitors
There's not even a registry key to disable it or anything
user47589
huh
16:19
short on salsa, uses maple syrup?
@MikeAsdf Are you talking about the snapping? I could have sworn that was optional.
Weekend of serious drinking commencing in 3...2...
15
A: How to disable sticky corners in Windows 10

harrymcThe thread How to disable sticky corners in Windows 10? from answers.microsoft.com treats this same problem : When moving the mouse from the left monitor to to the top left of the right monitor the 6 pixel corner will catch your mouse. I have similar problem in windows 8.1 and changin...

@TomW omg share one
my boss said yesterday we're allowed to have a couple at work
@MikeAsdf you can't even reject install it, yet you still hope you can disable one of its feature?
16:22
@Shoe I didn't want dry nachos
So, meta question - anybody?
@mikeTheLiar about chat?
i would, but i have a feeling it'd just be fuck every other word
@tweray registry hacks have done some good things for me so far
Right. There was one that was written up in a gist
16:22
We don't need it anymore
2 hours ago, by rlemon
It would be nice if the Moderation team took a single stance on expletives, many have said they are fine if not used to insult or degrade anyone / group -- others seem to think any swear word is unacceptable.
Apparently this guy wrote a program that circumvents sticky corners jawfin.net/?page_id=143
thats the issue
Guess I'll hope it's not a virus
half of the mods say one thing, the other half say the other, and it's not their fault, they're doing their best, but when there are no guidelines to follow, it's the wild wild west
16:23
i am allergic to that guy's politician tone, i opt out
@mikeTheLiar Working on it. I'll post it here first to see if anyone has any opinions.
@SteveG there are guidelines, we have a Be Nice policy and this guide to moderating chat
and it changes between SE sites too, i said fuck once in that gaming room and i got banned and had two mods called on me, i say it all the time with mods in here and not a word, just inconsistency all across the board
@bluefeet ambiguous guidelines
user47589
mirror mirror on the wall, who is the nicest of them all?
> Taking out the trash

> If unsuitable messages are being posted, then you have the ability to move the messages to the trash can. A “trash” (or “bin”) is just a room created for the sole purpose of holding unwanted messages. Users who have their messages binned aren’t punished but are implicitly encouraged to stop whatever they were doing. This keeps the transcript free of inappropriate, offensive, or spam messages.
16:26
ain't no mirror round here
user47589
did you faceroll on your keyboard again
@Amy yes
user47589
you might be able to program like that but its no way to chat
@bluefeet then the moderation team needs to get their story straight. I can if need be find quotes from moderators who do not share the opinion that all expletives are flag worthy
it's in the fucking guide to moderating chat how to deal these message
GRRRRRRR
16:27
if there was a hard rule, I'd be happy either way
same here, because at least i'd know when i, or somebody else was crossing the line
"gut feeling" it when mods have different gut feelings is very very strange to be in
I halfway wonder if someone didn't mean to star @mikeTheLiar's message and accidentally didn't flag it.
user47589
ya
16:28
> Call a Timeout: Moderators have the ability to place the chatroom in a timeout. By selecting timeout from the room↓ menu, you will be presented with:
I think now would be a great time to call into question the actions taken by mr moderator
> When should I freeze a room? Freezing a room should be reserved for situations that are unmanageable otherwise. If a room is producing inappropriate, offensive content and a timeout didn’t reign in the behavior, then it should be frozen until the situation can be resolved.
LITERALLY NONE OF THE THINGS THAT ARE IN THE GUIDE TO MODERATING CHAT WERE DONE
@Sippy the actions of the said moderator aren't what caused the issue, it was a symptom of the issue and should be dropped
A symptom that is equally worrying.
16:28
Honestly, we got something like a timeout, it's just that TLM didn't know to timeout the room instead of freeze it.
And I am not the only person worried by it.
There was a WPF guy in here literally for the sole reason that he saw some powertrippin'
@Sidney a mod not knowing how to mod is not an excuse.
(low voice) as long as the kraken is gone, i'm fine
anyways, I am not trying to add fuel to the fire. I'll wait patiently now for a meta post and present my arguments there. @bluefeet thanks for sticking around, @restofmods thanks for handling this in a fairly quick manner
@Sippy we have no say in how the moderator will be dealt with, or if he'll be dealt with at all, it'll just look like we're attacking a moderator, and other moderators will stick up for other moderators
but yes, i'll drop it, sorry
i just missed it all
16:29
Single mod is not the problem imo.
i don't want to try solve a long lasting SO issue here, i am no hero
They invented some watercooler with rainbows and shit that does not exist.
user47589
SO has mod elections. we should also have recall elections
Not saying he's a bad mod, not saying he shouldn't be one
16:30
^
I am just saying, if the meta post goes up, this aspect should not be ignored.
I warned that same moderator that the worst of the behaviour is a reaction to their interference, and the best way to keep the room in order is to leave it alone. Clearly my advice was ignored
He acted inappropriately for a mod. Bluefeet and Bolt have been in here talking to us like people. I haven't once been spoken to as an equal by that guy
That's how I feel.
user47589
yes
user47589
exactly that
user47589
16:31
^ @Sippy
tbf the only thing I've done so far that was directly related to this whole debacle was unfreeze the room
Man
No
user47589
you've also talked to us like adults
I want to retain the right to bitch about windows 10 being a gigahitler ball of assholes and pickledicks
@BoltClock we love you, i can give my whole slice of pizza to you
user47589
16:32
i said earlier that i feel that @BoltClock and @bluefeet respect us, and i meant that.
if you don't mind i took 2 bites already
LMFAO
@rlemon I know you are not trying to add fuel to the fire. As I said before mods make judgment calls on what to do in the moment. That goes for everything, flags, chat content, etc. If they see something which could be construed as inappropriate, they are directed to act. Chat is a public space and part of the entire network, so we expect everyone to abide by the guidelines in Be Nice. If the MSO question is every asked, the mod can respond specifically there
user47589
I do NOT get that feeling from theLostMind
ironic
16:33
The justification seems to be that flags get raised, which is nonsense. Nuisance flagging is commonplace and doesn't mandate moderation
I feel like this question should highlight the fact that (this guide to moderating chat)[meta.stackexchange.com/questions/271267/… was completely ignored.
@bluefeet Those guidelines need a new bloody title.
The title gives context to those rules.
And "the mod didn't know about it" is an unacceptable response.
No one was being unkind, mike was being nice, he was being extra nice.
i feel like a child having mods called in all the time and having to moderate our room for us. thats not what i want, or anybody else wants. We want the ability to moderate our own chat room via more specific rules provided by the moderator community. I think thats reasonable.
user47589
16:35
Ignorance of the law does not absolve one of responsibility for ones actions
wait wat
we had catered baked potatoes for lunch today, i wonder if there are any leftovers
in C# Chat Gaming on The Stack Exchange Network Chat, 20 mins ago, by SevenSidedDie
Public Service Announcement: RPG.se takes the Be Nice policy seriously. While guests of RPG.se, adhere to it in chat as if you were on the main site. Thanks!
Lol
what if you get the potatoes but no sour cream left?
@SteveG hashbrowns for breakfast
16:37
i'll be super sad
We didn't even do anything in that room .. :/
@bluefeet oh i love hashbrowns
with maple syrup
hashbrowns are like deep fried snot
@Sippy the funniest part about this is that no one wasn't being nice
A cause for self moderation and query on the events of 5/20/16

Early this morning, a regular in the C# chat room posted a crude but inoffensive message wishing everyone a happy friday. The message wasn't hostile to anyone, it was however flagged as offensive. Due to this a moderator came in and banned the user for one hour. This was not well met by the C# room regulars, which are generally liberal with their language. The room culture generally does not flag or punish profanity as long as it is not hostile or directed at anyone. The room owners will also generally move offensive and nsfw t
16:38
As I keep explaining
@Sippy this really wasn't required
I'm tempted to unpin it
It's totally required man
!!c#
May 5 at 15:17, by BoltClock
THIS ROOM IS OUT OF CONTROL
brb more potato needed
Maybe the message was vulgar to outsiders but wasn't to regulars with context. Aka everyone is wrong.
16:39
thats why we need more specific guidelines
nobody is wrong, there just isn't a 'right'
Any thoughts on the above ^^^?
user47589
we should run the room according to pony law
i'm getting real tired of windows updates closing my solutions
Pretty sure @MikeAsdf should be banned by now
user47589
friendship and magic shit is where its at
16:40
His message is about as offensive as the one from earlier.
@SteveG Damnit steve, now I'm hungry. Again.
@Amy i would eat a pony, given the opportunity to try new and possibly delicious food
@Amy oh you scared me
i thought we all have to be vegetarian
user47589
no pony eating, @SteveG.
srsly, any thoughts before I post that to meta? No objections? No additions? I refuse to believe I got everyon's sentiments right on the first try.
16:41
@Sidney I like it more than the last one but I think somewhere in between is probably best
user47589
if you eat a pony, we will unleash a friendship maelstrom like none other you've seen.
I think it calls too much attention to the profanity and not enough to the moderator actions.
Which, I will state again, are complete at odds with the posted guide to moderating chat
Bmo
Bmo
I for one am sick of these monkey fighting snakes on this Monday through Friday plane.
user47589
i have three different dbcontexts and i need all of them to enlist into the same transaction alongside another service. but how do i do that? all i see on msdn is how to enter a transaction, but not how to join a DTC
Hey! good morning Guys!
16:43
3 dbcontexts to 3 different database? or 3 different servers?
@mikeTheLiar I'm trying to avoid pointing fingers here. What happened happened and can't be undone. I'm hoping to start a discussion on limiting mods power in the context of the community managing itself (like we do regularly)
@Jean-philippeEmond you can edit messages (arrow up)
user47589
3 different databases
user47589
one of the databases is on another server
user47589
the other service that has to be enlisted is IBM's Filenet, a document repository
16:44
transactionscope
it works for ADO, not sure if works for EF
but worth a shot
@JohanLarsson, thanks.. :P
user47589
yeah i can create a transactionscope per dbcontext using ctx.Database.BeginTransaction()
@Sidney I defer to other room members but I find it acceptable
no, i would try wrap the whole 3 commands with a single transactionscope
I also added this bit to the end. "Generally when a mod attempts to moderate without taking culture and context into consideration, his/her actions are taken as offensive themselves, and are met with a backlash. This leads to more drama and hurt feelings than the original message would have."
16:46
or maybe just create 3 transactions, and only commit and rollback them together
@Sippy now THIS breaches the offensiveness guidelines
user47589
@tweray oh i see what you mean, i think
You are wrong.
user47589
i'll give it a try
user47589
i'm wrong? b-but....
16:46
Proper order of moderator escalation is a separate issue here I'm thinking.
@Sidney I think you would be right
But from where I'm standing TLM dun goofed
Whatever nerds, I'm hungry. Pizza time.
In, visual Studio, I play with something and I'm unable to rollback... How can I remove Magnet align to the border of my apps? I don't have any option available in my design (like "align to grid") enabled.. and because my form is tiny (it is a custom button) each time I try to click-drag my label.. He auto-Align to border of my Form. any idea how to disable it?
user47589
yup, i'm headed out to get FISH TACOS
Posted. Target on my back is now painted.
0
Q: A cause for self moderation and query on the events of 5/20/16

SidneyEarly this morning, a regular in the C# chat room posted a crude but inoffensive message wishing everyone a happy friday. The message wasn't hostile to anyone, it was however flagged as offensive. Due to this a moderator came in and banned the user for one hour. This was not well met by the C# ro...

@Sidney I'm going to move that to MSO
16:50
Be careful of your "room culture" arguments - there's been a lot of flak at people on SE chat for that recently, and mods everywhere are cracking down on "room culture" being used as an excuse for non-Niceness. (Not saying that necessarily applies to you lot, just a warning).
@bluefeet Oops, sorry. Thanks for the move.
@Sidney no worries
Oof! the vote counter is twitchier than a caffeinated crack addict.
Haters gonna hate
@ArtOfCode lol you changed the title to April
16:55
yeah whoops
Bmo
Bmo
Who said that post would ignore the moderator's action and only focus on the use of profanity? They are probably owed nickels.
Responses to.
Sorry.
o/
That was me
Bmo
Bmo
gives @mikeTheLiar a single ducket.
Bon
Bon
oh man... just got caught up. Stuff like this is why I'm a hermit. People and their endless stream of drama are so not worth it.
@Bmo Meta is a sad place, if you don't wear bicycle helmet and sit when you pee you are offensive.
Bmo
Bmo
17:06
I almost wanted to speak up and ask where you draw the line but I just don't think it would be worth it.
over the line donnie
Bmo
Bmo
MARK IT A ZERO
Like, I don't want to participate anymore really. I mean I just started showing up and wanted to be part of this community on here because frankly you guys are hilarious and it makes my day suck less.
question doing well. -5
Bon
Bon
It feels like there are some people would be fine with having explicit rules dictating every aspect of life. Litigating conflicts down to the atomic level of blame or responsibility in order to find what new ways people need to be constrained.
Well, fiddly-muffins. It seems like the gosh-darn canonical answer is that we're all too stinking mean and that we need to clean up our act.
Bon
Bon
17:09
I wish there was only 1 rule. Don't be a jerk. The end.
Bmo
Bmo
Except, since swearing is like a normal part of my vernacular I don't want to get wrapped up in this noise because someone got pretend offended.
@Bon That would require everyone to agree on one definition of "jerk". Which is the hard part
Bmo
Bmo
Sorry,.. I don't want to start the war up again. so....I'm done.
you won't lose rep for meta question downvote
17:11
> Even saying "I've had a shitty day" is something I'd reserve for IRC or a very loose Slack channel.
Good, because I don't have enough of it!
one of the reason i want to just let it go: ppl are just going to come and see the drama, and draw more attention to this room
are Akka.NET and TPL Dataflow essentially the same thing?
The only man to win this debacle is orville redenbacher
Bon
Bon
The corn lobby is insidious.
user47589
17:20
Yup
the room was on lockout?
concrete walls and rebar. literally
@juanvan Yup, total dramabomb, don't go looking, it'd be best of we just forget it.
Best we don't remember the Diaper years, and move on to the Driving years
user47589
That would be wise
Bon
Bon
17:28
Glad that's all over. Now how about a nice afternoon discussion about our political and religious opinions?
Bmo
Bmo
"Make chat great again"
My afternoon is better than that topic
Well, I posted the message. Now I think I need to make an IRC channel.
IRC channels are not fun to set up
well, if you're doing it yourself
Got one running... preferably never again
17:31
Back from lunch
@Failsafe anything good?
I would like a nap for lunch
Chicken salad on a ciabatta roll wit potato salad
local deli :)
no panini?
17:33
potato pancakes for lunch - was good
I'm seeing an MVC.Net API controller fail to receive JSON POST messages that are greater than 65536 characters.
...but only in Azure. Works fine locally with same web.config and everything.
you can raise the limit in the web config, i think
That's it, next time I have a disagreement with someone I'm flinging dead diseased cows over the castle walls.
Wait, when did we start talking about Stronghold Crusader
Bon
Bon
@Mik
17:42
Oh man that meta post.
My inbox is blowing up.
Bon
Bon
@MikeAsdf You tried running on IIS locally and not in Visual Studio and get different behavior?
The "Close vote review" room is actually pretty funny to read about it too.
What a bunch of clock-juggling thundercats.
.....I lulled.
17:44
We should make a generator that replaces swear words things like that ^^
Bon
Bon
Omg yes, some kind of levenshtein curse-word distance algorithm
that would be fun, making it dynamically select replacements, maybe have it exclude prior used words in the last X minutes so it stays fresh
Ah well, it's not like it matters. We'll just continue as-is as we always have and someone at some point will take offense to something again and we'll repeat the whole drama again. Someone getting banned, someone getting muted, and if we ask questions we'll get a room freeze again. But a lot of kudos for actually making the meta post @Sidney. You have a target on your back now, but kudos nonetheless!
@Bon Yeah :D
@RoelVanUden I'm not particularly offensive, so it will eventually wear off, the offended mods will forget I raised hell, and I'll live.
user47589
you know, guys, i just had an idea.
It's really quite amusing to watch how a small, inconsequential drama can turn into a big deal because the room regulars decide to make a big deal out of it.
17:49
@Sidney stop being such a rocksucker
user47589
the XKCD Substitution extension for chrome could be used to allow us to be vulgar to each other by using coded words
Bon
Bon
I know this topic needs to die, but tangentially, I am often displeased by the level of immaturity and unprofessional behavior I see commonly accepted in the larger dev community. I mean, I don't want a hard swing in the other direction so we all act like stereotypical white collar well-to-do persons. But there seems like there is a middleground which could be reasonable.
@Amy to all stupid put all panini in the cloud
user47589
@mikeTheLiar yes yes exactly!
Hah excellent idea. Shall we get started then?
17:50
Sidney already has a C# chat extension
Bon
Bon
I mean I don't swear when I'm working with others (except extreme circumstances) and I don't think that it is necessary to use them to communicate any idea in the purview of our common work.
I don't begrudge those who use them, but at the same time, a high standard of professionalism has many positive benefits.
Wish there was some way for everyone to be happy, is all.
So, otherwise, I actually do have a question. I have several independent objects, and operate on them in a multi-threaded manner with a thread-safe dictionary. Those objects are largely data independent, but they do share several static cached variables. The variable getter is essentially "Is this object set? If not, set it, and the return the object, otherwise, just return the object". Are static variables thread safe? I feel like they aren't, and I probably need to put a lock on the object.
user47589
i'm out of coffee
user47589
i can't possibly be happy right now
@Bon I always use full IIS and never IIS Express if that's what you're asking. IIS Express is filled with the lies of Satan.
user47589
17:52
static doesn't make something thread-safe
Bon
Bon
@Sidney is it possible different threads may set those static variables to values that aren't the same during the concurrent operations?
@RobertHarvey To be fair, there was no real reason to completely lock down a room, which in essence, is a small community. I miss these folk. And for what? Some profanity from some people? Those were already banned. It was locked down when we asked questions. Not in an assaulting way, just regular normal questions regarding the written conduct. I never got an answer. I still don't have an answer with the meta. Locking the room was drastic, and yes, that leaves a bad feeling.
user47589
I'd like to think I've made some friends in here, even though I've never met any of them.
Bon
Bon
@MikeAsdf Ok, full IIS, confirmed behavior doesn't replicate locally when deployed in release mode?
user47589
And I have a lot of respect for many of the regulars here.
17:53
@Bon No, they will always be set to the same value, although they might be set concurrently.
I'm completely content to simply let this go. But when will be hit again? It's inevitable if we don't know what the actual problem is. So it will happen again, and when we least want it to happen.
@RoelvanUden You literally just said this "We'll just continue as-is as we always have and someone at some point will take offense to something again and we'll repeat the whole drama again.", I don't think you had much intent to 'discuss', as much as to tell the mod how wrong they were.
Because we don't know what the problem is.
@Bon ah I haven't tried release mode locally. I'll do that in a bit
Bon
Bon
@Sidney then you're safe, even if you step on each other toes, that assignment overwrite won't result in anything bad I'm pretty sure, assuming there are no side effects from the getters or setters (other functions called other than the assignment/retrieval)
17:55
I know I'm being a broken record here but the thing that left the worst taste in my mouth was the "guide to moderating chat"
Going to start a new asp.net MVC project. Can't wait to start bothering @Amy
Bon
Bon
@Waterseas I read his statement more as an observation that behaviors of communities don't really change unless enforced. And the enforcement will come in punctuated bursts when someone gets triggered in some manner.
@Waterseas I'd be overjoyed if you could tell me what the problem is. What can I look out for? Do I just kick everyone that swears and that's it? So sophisticated and well spoken individuals talking down on others should be okay then? I'm genuinely confused what is accepted and what is not.
user47589
i'm already bothered!
por que?
lol i havent even gotten started
user47589
17:57
oh, i'm jumping the gun again
lol I love the rhetorical question. "This message wasn't hostile to anyone?" It's literally well wishing.
Bon
Bon
LOL I still haven't even seen what the message was.
@RoelvanUden ArtofCode's answer explains why
Also, I know these people. I can be overly harsh to, say, @Amy or @Sippy and they won't take offense at all. They know me, and I know them. Everyone fools around with friends, don't they? But an outsider will simply see that as crude and hostile.
@RoelvanUden I agree with you that there should be a bit more solidified rules about language and such, I'm simply pointing out the irony of complaining about locking the room when you then proceed to state something like that
user47589
17:58
@RoelvanUden yup
I think the point is that if its interpretable by an outsider in that manner, then it probably shouldn't be said
@Waterseas I'm not wrong, am I? It will happen again. That's for sure. It's a general observation, this happened before, and it will happen again, because there is no consensus on the problem nor its solution. It's a matter of what some person at some point feels and finds inacceptabel, so at some point, there will be such a collision of feelings and current discussion again. It's an inevitable thing unless we know what is and is not accepted.

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