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00:00
I'm still an advocate for fine grained locks... some defaults that are the most usual and then a bunch of check boxes that are optional for votes, edits, deletion etc...
(it's rare but I think a delete lock but allow everything else would be useful sometimes)
@CodyGray Okay I can see that. I still think it's a disappointing user experience to click a button I should be able to get and receive an error message.
It's also not the design in wider usage. Hiding things you can't use/don't have access to seems to be the primary design for all privileges. The close button isn't shown in a disabled state to users without close privileges and have it give them a notice explaining why they can't close the question. It's just hidden until they're able to use the button... Same with review queues, 10k tools, etc
So you can read the extremely thorough rationale.
There is also a discussion on our own UX.SE (a resource that the SE team has criminally under-utilized), and someone else who has some thoughts.
00:22
@CodyGray Especially because 99% of content dispute locks are a dispute between the poster and a moderator, and so the lock is applied when the post is in the "correct" state.
@CodyGray With such in-depth detailed explanation who could disagree with that.
I've seen an everybody-stop-editing-and-talk-this-out-on-meta lock, but they're rare (and heck, it could have a default-off "disable votes" checkbox)
@RyanM Was it the croissants post?
@RyanM I can't tell if that is agreeing or disagreeing that voting should be locked!
@CodyGray Uhhhh. That doesn't ring a bell, but now I'm curious...
@CodyGray disagreeing. the dispute about the post's content has already been resolved by applying the lock; users should now be free to vote on that content.
Oh, that post.
"I don’t care whether the croissants stay or go anymore, just stop changing it." might be my new favorite quote from a moderator intervention.
00:43
If the croissants aren't relevant to the question, they can go away and stay away.
(or answer, for that matter)
I find it hard to believe that question hasn't cycled through delete > undelete > delete > undelete more times than that.
In fairness, there is quite a high threshold of users needed to deleted it
And it was not undeletable the entire time it was mod deleted.
> 9 more votes are needed to undelete this post
3 + (53+115)/20 = 11.4. TIL that maximum requirement is 10.
Did it used to be 5 for undeletion or something?
00:50
always been 10 (well since I've been around - I think!?)
Yeah, it was to prevent the formula to get up to absurdly high numbers, from popular but otherwise worthless watercooler scraps of content.
And it was not always max 10.
I remember the day I got to 10k and Cody linked the joke thread... ah the good old days. That thing would probably take like 100 delete votes otherwise.
It was undeleted by 5 people after being deleted by 10. Was tom redfern a moderator?
Several watercooler questions happened first
@IanCampbell this is still one of my favourite deleted posts :p
00:53
Wow, that's a treasure.
01:10
@RyanM In general, I'm more of the opinion that those should be a suspension of the problem user rather than locking the post when it's a single user wanting the state of the post to be some way which is either against policy or in conflict with how multiple other users feel it should be. Obviously, it's situational, but if it's just one user...
01:44
@StephenOstermiller is this on-topic for Webmasters? Seems decent.
(also if you would prefer not to get pings about these here please let me know)
 
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1 hour later…
04:23
@RyanM Woo! Look at that regex matching! I'm not sure the favicon is really all that great; it doesn't show up very well, at least for Webmasters, considering the transparent background, but I thought it was worth a try.
04:45
@StephenOstermiller It would be a nice change of pace. The normal letters we mods get contain very little "love".
@AdrianMole If it's something you want SD to continue catching, then it's a TP.
@JeanneDark @blackgreen @AdrianMole To clarify, while I still think it's completely inappropriate and literally the definition of "abusive" to fill a post with gibberish in an attempt to bypass our quality filters, that's probably not a good reason to raise a R/A flag, and is likely to result in one of the other mods declining that flag. The exception would be if that gibberish/filler text is the only text that the post contains (other than code or images).
If you can remove the gibberish/filler, and you're left with something that just needs to be closed but not immediately deleted, then that doesn't qualify as R/A and shouldn't be flagged.
04:59
Should we keep or not this question What's the relationship between Style Transfer and GAN?? It's offtopic, however the answers add some value...
@Cristik Sounds like you answered your own question?
somewhat :)
the anwers add value, but the question being off-topic should we keep it on SO?
We're under no obligation to delete everything that is off-topic. The only requirement is that we close off-topic questions. If the existing answers add value in spite of the question being off-topic, then it's OK to keep it around.
6
sounds good!
05:21
huh.. arent vandalised post supposed to be reverted? stackoverflow.com/posts/72023560/revisions
Oops.
Reverting them relies on a moderator noticing that there is something to revert.
05:44
@CodyGray I agree with you
Reagrding the discussions above, I see my del-pls request from yesterday for this typo question (arraysOfInts != arrayOfInts) is still around. Do you think the question and its answers are useful and the request should be binned?
Sorry, no, not necessarily. I just slept for a wink, so I must have missed one of your requests.
Thanks
Unfortunately, it'll probably happen again.
Don't be so pessimistic ;)
This is actually optimism for me: I'm optimistically assuming that I'll take the time to get some sleep.
06:34
@WiktorStribiżew or other regex super gurus, do you have a duplicate target for this?
@SurajRao it doesn't require a mod; at your rep level, you should be able to roll back
but considering that Go has no negative lookbehind, probably this?
@blackgreen trying to use a character class to negate a phrase is a common beginner error, but your dupe looks fine per se
@tripleee when it is spam deleted?
@SurajRao if you can see deleted posts you can revert them too but not sure in this scenario
07:13
@tripleee It was locked due to red-flag deletion, so it required a mod to do it. See the post's timeline for details.
07:26
@blackgreen I think this answer can be helpful.
07:40
is this kind of questions on-topic? The OP made a confusion between two concepts - closure and computed property body. I'd be inclined to say it's offtopic, however, none of the closure reasons seem to match
I know this question doesn't qualify for this chat due to its age, however, it's a typo in a part of the code not even part of the question - the typo is in the rest of the code from pastebin...
What, a sneaky cv-pls? :)
a cv-pls in disguise :)
@AmitJoshi but OP found a solution to the problem by using another kind of permissions/roles, don't think this makes the question a typo/not reproducible one
the answer could benefit from more details, but that's a problem for the answer :)
08:10
@SurajRao In case the answers you got were unclear: yes. In that case, a moderator handled that one a bit too quickly and red-flagged it as gibberish instead of reverting (since corrected). Feel free to raise a custom flag pointing that out if you ever spot that sort of thing in the future; it's a pretty easy fix.
@RyanM yeah thanks :) It was clear...
08:39
@RyanM Yes, you can move that to webmasters. That question is by a user that regularly contributes on webmasters and should know where to ask questions. :( I'm happy to get pings here.
@StephenOstermiller done
@DaImTo Spam is not a close reason, there are flags for it (and 6 spam flags auto-delete a spam post)
08:55
Is this about some other post?
I just saw a comment on a now deleted spam post so I couldn't reply there (the "Intelligent..." SD report above)
I saw this, too! I also saw a comment stating, "Why downvote, just Flag." That's silly, too. Because (A) why not downvote?, and (B) flagging as spam casts an automatic downvote, so the downvoting is unavoidable!
But yeah, some people seem to like to both flag and vote-to-close spam. This isn't necessarily harmful per se (although it may be a waste of a close vote). The bigger issue is that someone might see your auto-generated "I'm voting to close this question because spam" comment and think that that is the appropriate way to handle spam, not realizing they should be flagging it.
@CodyGray you could spam-flag and upvote to compensate? :P
2
@CodyGray Well, people want to do one thing only, instead of all the things. So, I prefer they always do that one thing that actually matters.
@Adriaan Only if it's high-quality spam!
@Braiam Citation needed. Everyone I know likes to do all the things.
But yeah, I mean, obviously if the choice is "should I flag as spam?" or "should I do something else?", then you need to flag as spam.
09:09
@CodyGray One argument might be that downvoting without flagging decreases the spam's visibility to others (once it reaches a score of -4 a post is no longer shown on the front page). But I agree that this is not really a drawback, especially with tools like SD etc. there is no harm in downvoting itself.
@JeanneDark If that were a big concern, then the spam flag shouldn't cast an automatic downvote. I can't marshal a legitimate objection to decreasing the spam's visibility. :-)
@CodyGray Yeah, I do not exactly disagree with you. That's just the only argument I've ever heard against (also) downvoting spam.
Have you not heard the one about hurting the feelings of the spammers by "downgrading" their posts?
@CodyGray Well, you already have people arguing that off topic questions should only be downvoted, not closed. So, yea.
But you aren't "downgrading" their posts, you are "downgrading" them personally! But it's at least not as insulting as closing as a duplicate, which seems to be the ultimate insult and crime.
09:14
@CodyGray yeah... definitely shouldn't downgrade! They're just someone (or a bot) trying to make a living gosh darn it! :p
Imagine if we had a single canonical spam post, and closed all new spam as a duplicate of that.
3
One spam to rule them all
Who volunteers to write the canonical "Why should I buy this totally awesome product and what's their support number?""
@JeanneDark and it needs a video to go with it in the style of youtube.com/watch?v=ab8GtuPdrUQ
@Cristik Well, I am not an expert in MS SQL but I think the way discussed in answer does the same thing - Assign The Permission. The first line in the Microsoft article linked in a question says "An application role is a database principal that enables an application to run with its own, user-like permissions.". Anyway, in any case, question is not related to Dapper.
09:21
;)
10:07
What's the correct flag for: "Get the eff over it already."?
@bad_coder NAA
@Braiam seems too light for a poster who's insisting on being rude. (Isn't there a more serious flag?)
You want the post removed or the author penalized?
@Braiam sorry, I meant to say it's a comment. Well, the commenter who posted that one has an habit of pushing and provoking people.
@bad_coder Then U/U (yes)
10:12
@E_net4 ok, I'll try this one. (There aren't any consequences for it right? At most it'll sum into a statistic.)
Is this on-topic? It smells of either SF or customer support
@bad_coder if there's a pattern, collect data and use a custom modflag pointing out the pattern
@bad_coder Just as you said. But I'd be confident in a U/U here.
what is the canonical for How to access an object property in javascript? stackoverflow.com/q/35820886/2943403 surely this question has been Resolved Elsewhere.
They also help unearth any pattern.
@Adriaan ok, some good ideas here. I'll go U/U this time and look out for it.
thanks guys :)
10:14
@Adriaan It's programming?
was originally a bit of a cliff hanger of a question :)
11:32
It's a phishing attack when someone is trying to impersonate someone else to get me to execute a trojan?
The definition says "no".
> You can buy old and new Gmail accounts at a low rate. They provide the best quality Gmail.
Yeah, I wouldn't want one of those second rate Gmail
@VLAZ Didn't you read the spam??? It specifically said "best quality."
12:51
Is this spam? Can't verify that it is or isn't a common author but two links in one link-only answer smells funny. It's certainly at least NAA.
@AdrianMole I think it's NAA. They've made other NAA before
OK. I'll stick with the non-red flag, then.
13:38
@Vega looks like a homework question to me, is Dart now used in CS courses?
semi-rant :) clearly a NAA
@Cristik It crossed my mind that it could be a HW, but no idea about the course. I left the school desks before Dart was invented, haha
@Vega gone are the days when students learned C and ASM :)
You are making me cry
14:22
Should we burninate the tag? Discuss
4
@Machavity That sounds like a pit fight.
I don't think anyone would find a opposing view
@Braiam Well, go to Meta and assure them they hold a quality position ;)
14:37
@desertnaut I think the OP just bungled their markdown formatting
@Adriaan most probably, but this is not a reason for them not to review after posting and rectifying
 
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jps
jps
16:36
code-screenshot of the day i.sstatic.net/CON5l.jpg
@jps How many people tried to tilt their heads trying to read....
Meh. I just picked up my monitor and turned that through 90 degrees.
16:56
I wish I'd thought of that before taping a bunch of prisms together to view the image.
^ it's not just no a number, but also not an answer ;)
but yeah, seems I replicated the wrong letter in that abbreviation :P
17:58
@jps Yeah, and if I was asking for help for hosting on my shopping site, I certainly wouldn't link to some sub-page.
 
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19:29
@DavidW So the "opinion-based" prescribed reason probably fits there
user17242583
20:00
In the Low quality answers queue, would you choose "Recommend deletion" for this one?
Hm, I'd flag it as NAA
That said, the post itself seems to be missing a question and is thus unclear.
@Turing85 So do you mean yes you would Recommend deletion? LQA is supposed to handle NAA flags.
@richardec I would because it appears to be mostly a question and the author acknowledges that it is a clarification question
@HenryEcker as I said: the post itself is unclear to me. Thus all answer are "not answers".
I know that there is a canoncal for this question, but cannot seem to find it. Does anyone have the canonical by any chance?
@Turing85 okay found it (or rather: QBrute found it)
user17242583
20:48
What do we do with answers that are identical to other answers on the question but not necessarily plagiarized?
user17242583
e.g. this one
@richardec If it's an answer the correct action in LQA is "Looks OK" duplicate answers can be mod flagged. Just say it's a duplicate and be sure to link to the initial source. Duplicate answers in Low Quality Answers: (Re-)Flag or Delete?
user17242583
@HenryEcker Thank you! That's a nice question to have bookmarked.
@richardec Should've bookmarked it the first time when you made your edit XD
user17242583
20:55
@HenryEcker LOL, you're right! Funny though, at the time it was posted I didn't pay attention to the content much :P
@richardec Yep, I mod flag like Henry suggested. Link to the answer it copies and mention it is an exact copy
sometimes mods may decline depending a couple things: if the score of the copy answer is low, and if you have 20k rep, they may want you to downvote and delete-vote yourself
but for answers that are highly scored or when you don't have 20k, I have usually had pretty good success so long as I am clear about it being a 100% repeat and being sure to link to the answer it copies/repeats
user17242583
Gotcha. Flagged (and downvoted).
user17242583
In the Late answers queue, the "Recommend deletion" options says "... or cannot be improved." - Does this apply to link-only answers? From what I've seen, they aren't considered real answers, but they can be improved by copying the relevant excerpts from the link source.
@TylerH I really don't see why one's reputation should make a difference to whether or not such a flag should be declined. Yes - 20k+ can down- and delete-vote but, as a duplicate answer, it should still be flagged.
21:10
@AdrianMole The argument I recall is "you can start the process of handling this yourself"
along the lines of "mod flags are for things you can't handle yourself"
I agree with you though
meh
do both
what's a declined flag
@TylerH Then flag the mod's response - i.e., start a rant on Meta.
lol
Is it considered a conflict of interest to post a reopen-pls request on something that I'm considering answering (but haven't answered yet)?
21:28
@EJoshuaS-StandwithUkraine No
if you are not currently involved, you may post a reopen-pls request for the question
That's generally a good reason to do so, in fact: you have personally determined it is answerable.
@RyanM Yeah, it has a straightforward answer actually.
Curious that three people voted to reopen that, but none of them felt that an upvote was worthwhile. Just sayin'.
 
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