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11:00
@sbi FWIW, I used to take that approach. Seems something changed since then.
Feb 23 at 22:13, by R. Martinho Fernandes
For a moment there, I considered moving the TVTropes link to the Java room.
Hmm.
Xeo
Xeo
@RMartinhoFernandes Can you even do that without being Owner in the Java room?
@Xeo not sure about the JohnSmith though. It would be rather funny:
I've moved stuff from the Haskell room to PHP before.
@RMartinhoFernandes Now that's mean
11:02
But moving a TVTropes link like that would be like openly declaring war.
Xeo
Xeo
@RMartinhoFernandes Maybe we should declare our intent of war in the topic first?
I think that was done before.
@sehe aRggh. Started hitting the chat search throttling.
Nice. People are catching on in the other room:
in Yaarron ki Mehfil...! :), 5 mins ago, by Leena
becoz many guys who have 10 k up reputation visited here
in Yaarron ki Mehfil...! :), 9 mins ago, by jeet
then @MichelleSmith got disappeared
@RMartinhoFernandes Mm. Not nice. Maybe there is a general (site-wide) load factor involved.
Xeo
Xeo
Feb 9 at 23:55, by Xeo
room topic changed to Lounge<C++>: This is a declaration of war: Java sucks. [c++] [c++11] [c++-faq]
Clang y u no generate usable debug info on Windows. There goes my attempt at working a bit on libc++ :(...
11:08
What do you use debug info for (<naive-grin/>)
memory addresses make my eyes bleed.
and a segfault sucks
0x8BA1FAB4
Is it working yet?
@rubenvb That resembles a haiku
@RMartinhoFernandes what, libc++? Or Clang?
The blood. In your eyes.
11:11
Actually, out of them
Arrgh, that in/on/at crap always confuses me.
Typical daknok order of doing things: wants to write a bug tracker, starts with designing a logo.
I wouldn't say working, as in "helping". It's more of a messy side effect of the sucky compiler tools.
My native language doesn't have prepositions to make such distinctions, so I'm not used to think about them.
Well, it's more like the prepositions do exist, but no one uses them.
Everyone uses the generic one.
You already did that joke.
I'm repetitive.
Ell
Ell
is the mumble server loungecpp.sehe.nl?
Ell
Ell
11:23
is anyone on it? I think I'm on a wrong one..
@Xeo now imagine that that was real and you sat there.
user142019
Hey stop the flagging.
Xeo
Xeo
@WTP Those were valid, for once.
Oh. Never mind then.
@Ell I can see you
I'm not on it though
Ell
Ell
11:29
kk, just checking :)
@sehe I though Mumble only did audio. Didn't know it did video conversations too!
@RadekdaknokSlupik Haha. loungecpp.sehe.nl/mumble-server
lol cool
He's got root.
@Ell Watch closely, my phone is online now
But expect the connection to drop any second
Ell
Ell
kk
it reads messages out xD
what amuses me is you can change the accent of the text to speech :L
11:33
Anyways the text message didn't work in my desktop client. It uses desktop notification but they got really garbled. So, yes, it is Voice-only
@Ell So, the puppy's accent was fake? I knew it!
You can just stick around until someone else joins
Ell
Ell
har har I have set it to lancashire
@Ell oh really
@RadekdaknokSlupik He wasn't on TTS.
Ell
Ell
11:34
ah I have to go now anyway :L going to tutor my friend some maths
bye bye!
Oh god. That was a joke
@RMartinhoFernandes That's what he wants us to believe.
@Ell Good! Enjoy
Shall I use monospaced plain text or Markdown for my bug tracker?
11:39
Markdown allows you to inline images and such.
@RadekdaknokSlupik So can wiki formatting, such as used in Trac, MoinMoin. But SO users will favour markdown, obviously
I like Markdown.
Markdown is neat.
user50049
Protip: When running a six way sock puppet voting ring, don't draw moderator attention to yourself by being an idiot in chat :)
6
@TimPost That's a good tip. I'll heed the advice :)
11:47
Wiki formatting feels so inconsistent to me.
Also thanks for the help. So it was a SP indeed?
1 hour ago, by sehe
I strongly suspect neerad, jaffa and michelle are at least linked (@Xeo @sbi)
user50049
Yeah, I'm exploring a rather deep rabbit hole that the flags led to now.
Really?
People are that stupid?
Oh joy. I don't think it is pretty. I just hope it is as harmless as in this room.
Rabbits live in flag post holes?
user50049
11:49
Rabbits and turtles , yes.
@CatPlusPlus They get bored and then they just don't care anymore, blowing their cover
:)
@TimPost Cool :P
Which reminds me, we don't have a rabbit in here, do we?
user50049
I don't know .. anyone wearing hats, please check for rabbits
@rubenvb We sometimes get RabidRabbit and the TheRareBit was one this morning
@TimPost Is that an Alice reference?
Mad as a hatter, that
I think @TimPost is funny for a moderator :)
2
11:51
@rubenvb actually, the rare has a seat next to Shog9 in the user list
ok crap. What do I do when git opens the weird editor thing for a commit message, I pressed ctrl-C and now I get an endless
At EOF
:
user50049
I think my gravatar would be much more awesome if it had a top hat. Good idea.
ok, nvm. I closed the terminal window. Stupid default git editor.
I should remember to change that. How well, I'm outta here.
You dislike Vim?
Welcome to the club!
I can't get past nano. From then it's either kate or kwrite or notepad++. gedit if I really have to.
11:57
You can set up Git to use kate, kwrite or notepad++ (assuming that they can be launched from the command line).
I set up Git to use TextMate for commit messages.
yeah, I know, just always forget when I clean up my VM or install a fresh one :/
sbi
sbi
@RMartinhoFernandes What changed? I always jumped on TVTropes links when I was here. First verbally, but when it got out of hand, I started to simply bin them.
@RadekdaknokSlupik Default git editor != vim
@sehe For me it always was.
Until I changed it for the first time.
Sooo... you agree that it got out of hand when you started binning them?
(SCNR)
12:06
> By default, Git uses your system’s default editor, which is generally Vi or Vim.
Ahh.
@RadekdaknokSlupik That tells you that (a) you had vim installed (b) your OS might have a preference for vim.
Vim was pre-installed.
Git just uses the system default editor (EDITOR, VISEDITOR, sensible-editor and whatnot)
^ you found that out
sbi
sbi
12:07
@sehe then, not when
sbi
sbi
@RMartinhoFernandes In the same way that a rat's nest is neat.
<cries> Why don't people use source control? <cries more> Why are the sending me a file to over rite the current version so I can perform a dif to see the changes
@sbi Well since the events are linked, the temporal reference still holds even if you reverse the link. The causal implication is merely a habitual interpretation.
@thecoshman Why don't people watch their spelling <cries> <cries some more>
sbi
sbi
Out Of Spillchucker Error.
12:09
@sehe to upset about terrible lack of use of source control
<smiles> Why do people use version control? <cries> So that they can host their project on GitHub.
@rubenvb Noticed that now: :q
sbi
sbi
@sehe I am not working on quantum level.
@thecoshman to upset who?
@sehe :'(
sbi
sbi
12:10
@sehe Wouldn't that need to be whom? ICBWT.
@sbi I pondered that for about 3.4s before deciding to go with the more natrual-feeling. WCBWT
@RadekdaknokSlupik <smiles> Why do people use version control <cries> To get lost and trapped inside their system's preferred editors without warning
That's not a reason to use version control (unless you're a masochist.).
More like a painful side-effect.
sbi
sbi
@sehe It's against my natural feeling, though. (That's why I admitted ICBW.)
I think this topic should scare off the guys asking about Java, PHP, and C:
room topic changed to Lounge<C++>: Causal implication is merely a habitual interpretation of temporally referenced events. [c++] [c++11] [c++-faq]
2
@sbi That doesn't count. You are German.
sbi
sbi
@sehe ??
12:13
@sbi German native speakers are so used to applying linguistic cases, it will by definition feel more natural to them
@sbi ROFL
room topic changed to Lounge<C++>: Causal implications are merely a habitual interpretation of temporally referenced events. [c++] [c++11] [c++-faq]
sbi
sbi
@sehe And since we're so well used to doing it, if we feel like it had been done wrong, our opinion doesn't count? Sounds very iffy, IYM.
@sbi You don't say :)
Jan 8 at 0:03, by sehe
It adds a nice touch. You see, I'm always serious.
Dead serious, I might add.
sbi
sbi
@sehe Why not?
'Haptic' is a great word
haptic |ˈhaptik| adjective technical of or relating to the sense of touch, in particular relating to the perception and manipulation of objects using the senses of touch and proprioception.
12:20
really should use it more often :D
@RadekdaknokSlupik erm... yes?
Does that mean direct manipulation of virtual objects through a touch screen?
I don't understand the definition.
I say we should all try to introduce new words today to improve our vocabularies.
@RadekdaknokSlupik it can do. Can also include things like force feedback on game controllers
you could say your computer mouse is a haptic input
12:22
New buzzword.
"Did we mention that it's totally haptic?"
@RadekdaknokSlupik not really, it's been around for a good while
Never seen it used as a marketing term.
Text y u not centered.
user50049
28
Q: We're no strangers to code golf, you know the rules, and so do I

PolynomialWrite the shortest program that prints the entire lyrics of "Never Gonna Give You Up" by Rick Astley. Rules: Must output the lyrics exactly as they appear in the above pastebin. Here's the raw dump: http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=wwvdjvEj Cannot rely on any external resources - all lyrics must ...

What shall we do to this question?
0
Q: SSL Heade HMAC calculation

RahulI am working on a coding few packets. For the packets I need to generate HMAC. Now I am actually trying to design it for security purpose and closely following the OpenSSL format fo packets. How to generate HMAC for packets? How to get the key? HOw does openssl get a key for it? I hope you unde...

@Neil Introducing new words has a tendency to weaken the vocabularies (if only due to inflation; on the practical side, the new words are less likely to be able to convey the intended meaning to the other parties involved in communication)
@RadekdaknokSlupik Heptig!
sbi
sbi
12:32
not sure I've said this recently enough, clearcase is really shit
Wikipedia is your friend. Read a book. This site is for programming questions. What have you got? Where you stuck? — sehe 21 secs ago
May 26 at 19:22, by thecoshman
@RadekdaknokSlupik I have to use it at work. Honestly, utter shite
@TimPost Wow the sed version - embedded decompression. Amazing stuff
@RadekdaknokSlupik that was nearly a month ago
12:38
Nearly a monthweek.
@thecoshman six days ain't a month.
Is there an online compiler for this? So we can verify correctness of the program. — sehe 13 secs ago
@RadekdaknokSlupik lol, I just say that it was June and didn't think much more off it :P
sbi
sbi
@sehe I had the same idea when I saw the challenge. Fortunately, I didn't post it.
> That Oracle vs Google judge who learned Java, to understand the case better? His middle name is Haskell! en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Haskell_AlsupIgal Tabachnik
6
At least he's a judge who has knowledge of what's going on.
12:49
@sbi this case get's better and better
sbi
sbi
@RadekdaknokSlupik Yeah, I — grudgingly — have to admit I feel some respect for that guy.
@sbi don't you mean, judgingly :P
@thecoshman gets
@sbi the tweetist missed the chance for "Haskel is his middle name!"
sbi
sbi
@sehe Yeah, I thought that, too. I would make a tweet about that, but I'm no Haskellite.
ty - almost weekend ...
13:00
three day weekend here :D
yo nubs
@DeadMG nips
@DeadMG all time late appearance record
Hi
What? 16 flags?
What's this all about?
@sehe Not really. I've appeared in this channel at all times of day.
13:05
Oh ok. I might have actually done some work then
Sadly 3g reception is exceptionally poor so I can't even hear what you said
sbi
sbi
1 hour ago, by Tim Post
Protip: When running a six way sock puppet voting ring, don't draw moderator attention to yourself by being an idiot in chat :)
Yeah, I'm going through the room's history now.
sbi
sbi
@EtiennedeMartel Just start with the earliest flagged message.
13:23
hello
can anyone help me with an algorithm
Depends on the algorithm.
i have a partition
say 1, 1, 3, 4
i have an algorithm that changes it into cycle format
(1)(2)(345)(6789)
i want to create an example permutation that fits that cycle
do we start flagging yet?
oh am I sorry, have you not spent all day trolling?
13:27
i just got here
Arr ye ole pirate. Don't be so harrrrrsh. He just got here.
oh ok then. I'll wait for the obvious sock puppetting shall I?
Please @cosh, get your act together. This isn't funny
i'm not sure if you're trolling me or not but i'm not a sock puppet
i come in here all the time
@thecoshman do you also have a wooden leg?
13:30
can anyone help me with my question or no
¬_¬ have I actually got the wrong end of the wooden leg?
For your info, we had a troll banned earlier, by the name of MichelleSmith, that is why the cosh is acting strange
@JohnSmith Maybe you should ask that on SO proper.
oh, no, not me; just coincidence of smith
@RadekdaknokSlupik well, I don't like to boast
Do you have a third leg?
if I am mistaken, I am sorry
Or is your third leg made of wood?
no problem
@thecosh In all fairness, you do act strange without warning, but since you seemed so out of line, I felt the natural urge to defend you. Go figure.
13:32
53 secs ago, by thecoshman
@RadekdaknokSlupik well, I don't like to boast
I think we all need to get drunk now.
No, it's bad for your brain.
@EtiennedeMartel soon, really soon (watching clock)
@RadekdaknokSlupik not as bad as stress
@thecoshman That doesn't make it good.
13:33
@JohnSmith I’m not sure what you mean by “cycle” here
in a permutation
@sehe I'm at work right now, but I'll try logging in later on tonight.
@RadekdaknokSlupik whilst it shouldn't be your only solution, drink is a great way to help you relax. The relaxation is better for you then the damage of the drink
@JohnSmith You want to get all permutations?
no i have a cycle and i want an example permutation from it
13:35
@JohnSmith Ah. I’m reading up now, I didn’t know this terminology at all …
aqaartgh I itched my eyes
(never worked with permutations beyond their basic use in combinatorics)
@sehe yeah, I wouldn't normally rage so much at some one for just dropping questions. I know I often do give a bit of flak for it, especially this time of day, needing my nap and all :P
@DeadMG silly dog, you can't itch your eye, you mean to say tu scratched it :P
@DeadMG scratch them.
@thecoshman No, you can't itch your eye.
@RadekdaknokSlupik That only makes it worse
13:37
Can I has pointer to latest discussionz?
@DeadMG argh, tis true. Two glass peepers 'n all
@DeadMG Pour some Tabasco over it. That should fixxit.
@DeadMG wash them under tap
@Konrad like if i had the cycle (12)(34) this means first and second element swap, third and fourth swap. example permutation is 2 1 4 3
@thecoshman Personally, I'd have removed this though. That is needlessly rude. We don't like flags precisely because we don't like random (in)justice.
13:38
@JohnSmith I'm not sure I understand what it is you are actually wanting to do
at first i thought i could just reverse everything in each cycle but that doesn't work
@thecoshman I'd still flag for moderator attention, but it'll work a lot better if you do so yourself.
@thecoshman given a cycle, generate a permutation that fits the cycle
@sehe want me to remove it?
If it wasn't obvious: obviously
(don't you?!)
13:40
Don't we all?!
actually you know what maybe i figured out a way
@DomagojPandža Shhh. You should only say "{Falsehood|Justice|Piracy} detected"/"Confirmed"/"Permission Denied"
hold on
@JohnSmith Since no one here appears to understand your idea of a cycle, I suggest this question really deserves a little more introduction, and therefore space. Could you post it at stackoverflow.com instead?
it's not "my idea of a cycle"
13:42
@JohnSmith That's what you said yesterday.
it's the matematical definition of a permutation cycle
@JohnSmith Well, it's clearly not ours either
Seems I am too late to delete it my self, so I flagged asking for mod to delete it. Explained that I was mistaken who the user was and thus was needlessly harsh etc. etc.
@thecoshman Thanks. I think that was the right to do
it's a common concept, easily googled
13:42
Buuut we're here to chat. Not google your problems
If we wanted to do that, we'd be on SO, not chat.SO
didn't ask you to; i already provided the concept
@JohnSmith I could give you some hints using the same line of reasoning :)
I don't think there are many of us here who are that well versed on this funky maths shit. Either way, no one here at the moment knows what you are on about
Maaaan. What's with the wording. Get a break
"Funky maths shit"?
13:44
it's not funky maths shit
Good golly miss Molly :D
it's.... super basic stuff here
Funky maths shit :D
if you aren't versed in math then just ignore the question
@sehe I wouldn't hold it against you if you wanted to also flag it
13:44
@JohnSmith We don't do basic stuff here. If it's not template wankery of VBA php bashing...
My god, is there any room on top of that high horse of yours?
Most people aren't going to know exactly what you're talking about from a single example.
@thecoshman I wanted to. I didn't. You already know why
@EtiennedeMartel There is room for an ignore button
@JohnSmith We can help with a little problem, but your asking for help that is beyond what chat can work for. Take our advice, use the main site
you're telling me you are not capable of understanding when i say "like if i had the cycle (12)(34) this means first and second element swap, third and fourth swap. example permutation is 2 1 4 3"
i find that hard to believe
13:46
@EtiennedeMartel me?
"There's always room for an ignore button" feels like the kind of thing that would be good at the end of a PSA.
sbi
sbi
> If you think resource management in C++ is complicated, try to implement C#'s IDisposable interface. It's a major #PITA stackoverflow.com/a/898867/140719sbi
@thecoshman No, our John "Math Genius" Smith guy over here.
@EtiennedeMartel what?
@JohnSmith I find it hard to believe you want listen to us telling you that we don't know enough about your problem domain to help you
13:46
i'm not a math genius; i just don't appreciate unnecessary snark in my direction for absolutely no reason
especially when i gave a clear example and didn't tell people to "google my problems"
@JohnSmith Link us to the definition of cycle you mean. Most of the time in CS with a cycle we mean a path in a graph that leads back to the source node
if you don't want to help, don't. but don't act like i'm asking something crazy because you're too lazy to read.
@JohnSmith we don't appreciate people expecting help. Think of this as a pub, we are just trying to hang out and have a few pints, you are fucking us off with shitty boot leg DVDS
you're the one who jumped on my face for literally no reason when i got in here, coshma
sbi
sbi
@EtiennedeMartel And that's the guy who wrote "There's no need for condescension" to me the other day.
13:48
Everyone calm down.
@sbi yes because you were throwing condescension my way
@JohnSmith Irrelevant
i came in here asking a simple question with a simple example, didn't attack anyone
It seems @JohnSmith is now the owner of this lounge :)
@JohnSmith That was a case of mistaken identity, and I apologised for that. We are telling you we can not help with your problem, you are better of on SO
13:48
coshma told me to fuck off for no reason
He always tell everyone to fuck off for no reason.
@sbi Indeed it is a convoluted, messy minefield
@sehe not irrelevant.
sbi
sbi
@JohnSmith What about "That was a case of mistaken identity" don't you understand?
@JohnSmith The question is obviously not simple. The example seems so however, but I'd still like to see a definition of partition/cycle first.
13:49
@JohnSmith because I mistakenly thought you where a serious troll we had this morning
Also, if you want an answer to a question, go to the main site, not to a chat room that starts with the word "Lounge"
Most of the people here know what a permutation cycle is, but what of it? What is the actual problem? While we enjoy mathematics, this still is SO/Lounge<C++> and nobody is obliged to answer. Furthermore, nobody is restricted from trolling here.
@JohnSmith Oh. Plonk
If your problem is purely on the mathematical side, try math.SE
@sbi I had to Google "PITA", because I was pretty sure you were not talking about that delicious bread.
sbi
sbi
13:50
fuck it, I don't want to get banned for being pissed of at some one not listening to the best advice we can give him. ignore
@Domagoj funny, because apparently people here think a permutation cycle is an outlandish question
@JohnSmith Chill out now man.
@EtiennedeMartel hahahahahh
13:51
huh, now I want to 'un-ignore' to see what I just missed :D
@EtiennedeMartel lol
@JohnSmith Funny, because you already ignored my question to link to a definition of a permutation cycle twice. So I can only conclude you're trolling...
@KillianDS I already explained what it meant earlier.
how is that insufficient information
your (very unclear) explanation is NOT a definition
13:52
@sbi oh, clever :P
how is it unclear?
I honestly don't see why someone would get worked up because a bunch of C++ bigots don't readily understand something he thinks is easy from an example.
does it still count as leading by example if no one follows your example?
Would it matter so much if we really were phonies and didn't understand?
sbi
sbi
@KillianDS I suggest you now take this to some other room. It's easy to set one up.
13:53
OH "one of our big problems with our bug tracking was no inlining of images so it was hard to place memes everywhere, this is now solved"
4
@sehe Shhhh!!
sbi
sbi
@thecoshman Um, what are you taking about?
@sehe I thought you plonked the guy?
4 mins ago, by thecoshman
fuck it, I don't want to get banned for being pissed of at some one not listening to the best advice we can give him. ignore
@sbi I changed. I even binned some TVTropes links myself. Now I do the opposite.
@JohnSmith you only talk about a partition and a cycle, which are very general concepts in maths and programming. Then you throw in some notation with members that could again relate to anything from graph theory over set theory to space partitioning. That is unclear
13:54
@sehe it was a reply to me.
@sbi hmmm. I can talk to plonked people :)
@RadekdaknokSlupik Oh, those subtle back arrows :)
I'm currently writing a spec.
@thecoshman Do you think we don't read your messages?
oooh, you mean 'plonk' as in ignore, I was thinking of the stupid plinking noise
@RMartinhoFernandes was corrupted by TVTropes. Now he is one of their agents, going around the Web, sharing links in the hopes that more people will be corrupted by its dark essence.
sbi
sbi
13:56
@thecoshman Yeah, but I still have no idea what your statement is supposed to mean, or even apply to, FTM.
I need a burek. Or a kebab.
sbi
sbi
@RMartinhoFernandes Shrug.
@thecoshman Plonking makes that distinctive plonking noise, of course
@sbi I chose to ignore him rather then carry on raging at him till I got banned
@DomagojPandža Please, don't make me hungrier than I am now.
13:57
@sehe yeah, I'm with you now
@DomagojPandža Or a nikab
@DomagojPandža what's a burek?
sbi
sbi
@thecoshman I understood this. But what does "does it still count as leading by example if no one follows your example?" apply to, and what does it mean, dammit!
Börek of burek is een deeggerecht dat gemaakt wordt in veel landen die ooit hebben behoord tot het Ottomaanse Rijk. Vaak wordt het gemaakt met blader- of filodeeg en kan gevuld zijn met kaas (meestal beyaz peynir), gehakt of groente (meestal spinazie) Naam Börek komt oorspronkelijk uit de Turkse keuken. In het Turks wordt het woord börek gebruikt voor diverse deeggerechten, terwijl het in talen die het woord hebben geleend meer specifiek gebruikt wordt. Börek (Turkije) In Turkije is een su böreği ("waterbörek") een lasagneachtig soort, meestal gevuld met beyaz peynir (een soort feta). ...
sbi
sbi
@thecoshman Presumably close to what the Turks here call a börek.
13:58
@thecoshman The most delicious thing on this planet. upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/bf/Burek_trokut_3.gif
@sbi Oh, I didn't realise you had also ignored him and where continuing to listen to his inane stuff
@DomagojPandža Does it have meat?
The contrast in these pictures reminds me of that photo set that @sbi linked some months ago
@RMartinhoFernandes Well, for it to actually be the most delicious thing on the planet there must be bacon involved.
13:59
oh god they sound good
sbi
sbi
@thecoshman FWIW, you can also tell by the order of the avatars whether someone has said something recently.
@RMartinhoFernandes It's all about meat, baby! Burek by definition is with meat. Some people also call burek with cheese a burek. But that's a pita.
@SamDeHaan True dat.
@DomagojPandža Ok, then it is possible that it is the most delicious thing.

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