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10:00 PM
The ridiculous part is that they should not have "prohibited" in some legal weasel-word document, they should have secured the API against this. And they could have, to a large extent. (Of course, they could have authorized 3rdparty apps that later turned out to be fraudulent, but in that case, they have a strong legal point)
 
Ell
If I have Parent, ChildA and ChildB, the latter two inheriting from the former, is there a type trait that given ChildA and ChildB will return Parent? Ie, return the common base class of the given types?
 
std::common_type
 
@sehe Yes, that would have been helpful. However, someone could have almost just as easily trapped people with an app that didn't even send images to Snapchat itself. People need to think about what they install. Maybe this can be used as a lesson in that, instead of just glossing over it, calling it the service provider's fault.
45
Q: Does streaming use the same amount of bandwidth as downloading?

stemieAssuming the content is of the same quality (ceteris paribus), does streaming media (i.e. video, audio) use the same amount of bandwidth as downloading it? Say I was to download an HD movie from Amazon or stream it, would it be the equivalent use of bandwidth?

 
Ell
@LucDanton Huh. I thought that was just for arithmetic for some reason
I also just found this stackoverflow.com/a/8709647/303662 by xeo
 
^that’s what I should use instead of std::is_base_of.
 
10:06 PM
For example, I would never even dream of putting anything through FB Messenger or Snapchat or the email system, that I didn't want anyone other than my intended recipient to see. I don't think I need to be a software guy to realise that sending this material to some company is not a great idea.
especially when it's all for free
you shouldn't be expecting you're entitled to any sort of protections
you get what you pay for, etc etc
people seem to have forgotten fucking common sense
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Like I said. Snapchat should have also taken responsibility. After all they were the once who thought it would be good to have a picture-messaging app with self-destructing messages. They specifically created the entire market for that. Security cannot be a side-thought then.
 
I guess we'll have to agree to disagree because you're either missing my point entirely or believe completely differently
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit I completely agree. However, in this case, the public is entitled to some sort of protection. It's just not possible to uphold that, and certainly not prevent the breaches.
 
"wah wah it's not my fault my naked pictures got leaked i blame the company i used cos i broke their terms and thought i was safe and it's their fault because they lulled me into a false sense of security" jesus really?
 
Which means, in practice, you should be weary
> cos i broke their terms
 
10:08 PM
@sehe the public is entitled to precisely fuck all
 
^ that's not necessary
@LightnessRacesinOrbit I think you're not a lawyer
 
@sehe no, but (a) it's blatantly obvious, and (b) no service provider has ever been successfully sued for this scenario, so...
you simply can't claim entitlement from a company that does a thing for you for free. you just can't. ever.
 
bar?
 
this "free service" mentality has corrupted everybody into thinking nothing's down to them any more
it's so sad
 
Ell
10:10 PM
Wait.
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit They're not actually doing it for free, of course.
 
@sehe The point is that the users are not paying any money whatsoever.
 
Ell
I forgot a ::type
 
@sehe And, actually, Snapchat makes no profit at time of writing. So they basically are.
 
@Ell std::common_type_t ;)
 
10:11 PM
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Yeah, and that's the fault of...
 
@sehe What?
What does it matter whose fault it is that Snapchat isn't monetizing? How is that relevant to the fact that users do not pay and therefore are entitled to absolutely nothing?
 
Ell
@LightnessRacesinOrbit you can if you enter a contract with them and in the contract they say they will provide something
well. I don't know if you can in the real world
 
@Ell Show me a Snapchat user who's signed a service level agreement.
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit I mean, they're a business. They're in it for the money. Doesn't matter whether they already succeeded at it
 
Ell
but I think you ought to be entitled to the thing both you and the company mutually agreed on
 
10:12 PM
@Ell yeah, granted; "for free without an SLA" then
 
They can't be (trying to) make money off uneducated users making false promises. Not even if they don't pay.
 
Ell
I don't know what a service level agreement is :3
 
@sehe That doesn't matter...... the point is not that they will one day make money. The point is that the people complaining about being entitled have not parted with any.
@Ell it's basically what you said
@sehe No? Half the market does that. 74% of worldwide sales of anything are achieved through misleading marketing and coersion (figure made up)
 
Ell
@LucDanton oh yeah :P
 
why is it magically different for a free photo sharing app?
i've started trolling a bit now because we've diverged so far
 
10:16 PM
@LightnessRacesinOrbit You may well be right, that I overestimate the extent to which those practices are illegal.
@LightnessRacesinOrbit But I'm really miffed by your reasoning. Do you believe in a profoundly mafia-ruled world: if you don't pay, you don't have rights?
@LightnessRacesinOrbit It is because they offered a unique service for private picture messaging, including a solid promise of self-deleting content.
 
Seems like in your imagination someone saying "hey here's an app" is equivalent to "I promise to be nice" is equivalent to "I am entitled to the app maker taking precautions to protect me from a malicious third-party app that I downloaded instead without thought or reasoning".
It's really quite a leap.
I see no reason at all for anyone to be defensible "entitled" to anything here, unless you have paid [edit: no you're right it's more like] signed an agreement such that the other party has promised to "look after you"
with paid services or other SLAs that comes into play
not with some free app you downloaded off the internet last night and started using to share naked selfies with your tosser Uni mates
 
Ell
lol. my ascii "art" (if you can call it such) bodged up what I was trying to show here coliru.stacked-crooked.com/a/cd56b988a05eca51
 
I don't care how the app was positioned in the free app market. I don't care how they market it and what features they announce.
 
Ell
Who'd'a thunk backslashes would be such a problem :P
 
Users should think before going to a cheap knock-off version and sending personally embarassing data to god knows where on the internet, to some company you have no agreement with. It's ludicrous to expect anyone else to take responsibility for that action!
 
Ell
10:20 PM
@LightnessRacesinOrbit but don't you enter a contract with the app company when you click agree to that thing which pops up?
 
@Ell As far as that's relevant, the Snapchat terms of service expressly prohibit what these guys were doing
 
Ell
When you say sign, do you mean physical signature?
 
@Ell So even if you want to invoke it, it only goes to further back up what I'm saying
 
Ell
@LightnessRacesinOrbit yeah I'm not disagreeing :)
Just asking really
 
Ell
10:22 PM
@LightnessRacesinOrbit They aren't entitled to anything and they themselves should be held responsible as they broke their terms that they agreed to, so the company can't be held responsible. This is what you're saying right?
 
I guess my point all comes down to: if you want to invoke Snapchat's 'promises' then the best you can do is their terms of service, and their terms of service banned this practice. You can't violate the terms of service then accuse Snapchat of betraying you. And if you don't want to invoke the terms of service, then you're left with diddly squat and so there are still no expectations or entitlements to be had. Either way, the user needs to stfu and be more careful sending selfies to companies.
 
Ell
@LightnessRacesinOrbit I agree with this wholeheartedly
 
that's because you're right :D
 
Ell
Haha
 
It really makes me mad that so-called experts are going on the news and blaming the company, rather than taking this fantastic opportunity to EDUCATE said noob users that their actions have consequences. Instead, they're just making the problem worse by re-inforcing the silly notion that nanny internet shall protect you. :(
You want to send a naked selfie? Email an encrypted ZIP or something. Fuck.
 
Ell
10:24 PM
@LightnessRacesinOrbit yeah it's sad
I know I used to keep nude pics that I received in a gpg'd tarball :L
because I'm careful and sensible and I think it's only decent of me to protect other people's privacy :P
damn I'm drinking coke again
I'm getting addicted
 
@Ell time to share
 
Ell
@LightnessRacesinOrbit haha I don't think so
 
Ell
I can't really see what it does
It's too late
 
there's no need :)
basically it takes an incoming network packet and maps it to a "handler" function
but very rough draft
 
Ell
10:40 PM
I was going to say it looks like pattern matching
or multi methods
 
I've created many variations of the concept. This is just my latest one.
@Ell kinda
 
Ell
I was just going to write a multi method dispatcher myself
but just working with types, no matching on values or anything
but I can't even get std::common_type to work :P
 
@Ell Try ChildX&?
 
user1804599
97
Q: We have a [flappy-bird-clone] tag? Really?

CullenJhttp://stackoverflow.com/questions/tagged/flappy-bird-clone I think this tag should be burninated, as I can't see it being useful to anyone, but maybe I'm wrong on this?

 
10:45 PM
Trying the ternary operator by hand it seems there is no common type to the two types (well, we know there is one of course).
 
@StackedCrooked A few years ago I started on something vaguely similar, but quit before I even got it this far.
 
user1804599
Wat.
 
user1804599
I just created a tag on Stack Overflow and it already has seven followers.
 
user1804599
(What the fuck is a follower?)
 
@rightføld The opposite of a leader.
 
10:47 PM
1
poop

Proposed Q&A site for people engaged professionally in poo and all the subsequent activities. poo enthusiasts.

Currently in definition.

 
Can’t say I remember the rules off the top of my head, so not too sure what’s going on.
 
@rightføld was likely removed in the past for being SHIT
but followers are defined by front-page filters so the 7 old ones are still there
right?
 
user1804599
Clean is a programming language. :v
 
@JerryCoffin I've been working on this for a while :) (My working stack implementation is getting big and should be shipped with th main product in a couple of weeks.)
 
user1804599
@Mysticial I'm engaging!
 
10:50 PM
32052 loc atm
 
@rightføld stupid name
 
@Ell Modern C++ Design has a chapter on multimethods.
 
user1804599
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Not my problem.
 
I never use Spirit Karma. To my own detriment, it appears stackoverflow.com/a/26308921/85371
 
@rightføld Apparently, it is.
 
10:52 PM
@StackedCrooked Cool. Saturating 100 GbE with ease now?
 
user1804599
It really isn't.
 
then why the shit did you come here moaning about the tag
 
user1804599
And it's waaay better than "Tomalak."
 
user1804599
@LightnessRacesinOrbit That's completely irrelevant to the stupidness of the name.
 
10:53 PM
last I checked, Tomalak isn't the name of a programming language
@rightføld no it's not, and I already explained why
 
@JerryCoffin Closer to 10Gbit :)
 
user1804599
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Of course it's not. What idiot would name their programming language "Tomalak?"
 
Ell
@StackedCrooked I hope they are put into the language
 
your punctuation placement sucks, btw
 
user1804599
10:53 PM
Also plønk.
 
Ell
open multi methods aren't so high in performance cost either
 
o.O
strange little boy
 
Ell
much better than visitor pattern or pattern matching
 
user1804599
Nothing is high in performance cost.
 
Ell
I think it's constant with number of args because it's just a table look up
 
10:54 PM
@Ell we have some things in comon
 
@StackedCrooked I was afraid of that. Then again, as I recall from a few months back, the previous version was barely breaking 2 GBit or so.
 
user1804599
Pattern matching is fine if the type count is bounded.
 
I've never seen any convincing use cases of multimethods
 
22
A: why there are no multimethods in c++?

sbiStraight from the horse's mouth: "I rejected multi-methods with regret, because I liked the idea, but couldn't find an acceptable form under which to accept it." Bjarne Stroustrup, The Design and Evolution of C++ (p297) And later: "Multi-methods is one of the interesting what-ifs of ...

 
Ell
10:55 PM
@Puppy collision, traversing a graph
 
neither of those is compelling.
collision is just as bad as Cat : Animal.
and I have no idea what multimethods have to do with traversing a graph, now I come to think of it.
 
user1804599
Any place you want dispatch based on dynamic type but don't want to put everything in the fucking class.
 
user1804599
They solve the expression problem.
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit You know, it's always this move that impresses me most.
 
regular hash maps offer that already.
 
10:57 PM
It establishes your natural superiority. You rule.
 
Ell
@rightføld in several classes in fact
 
@JerryCoffin Frameblasting mode easily gets full line-rate of the 10Gbps network card. However, this is hard to achieve for TCP. I nearly got there after implementing some agressive tweaks. But those tweaks turned out to destroy fairness. So I didn't get there. However it's ok if the 10Gbps is achieved using parallel connections (it's a 16 core machine so that is easy to achieve).
Next generation will have probably 40Gbps cards. Yay :)
 
I don't think expressing bafflement after that utterly bizarre exchange and sudden "plønking" for no good reason whatsoever is out of order.
 
user1804599
IMO overloading on polymorphic types should always be done on the dynamic type of the object.
 
Ell
10:58 PM
use them any time you want to add functionality to a class where you can't edit the class also
 
You may proceed to engage in your usual platitudes, now.
 
user1804599
Otherwise you have a horrible inconsistency where f(x) and f(dynamic_cast<D&>(x)) (assuming cast succeeds) may do different things.
 
@Ell Perfectly achievable with existing methods.
 
Ell
@Puppy collision is bad?
 
generally not good when puppies collide no
 
Ell
10:59 PM
@Puppy Like what?
 
@Ell No, representing shapes through inheritance is bad.
@Ell unordered_map<typeinfo, function<sig>> works just fine.
 
Ell
how?
this dispatches on one polymorphic type
 

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