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12:18 PM
@KonradRudolph Ooh really? Didn't know there was a practical failure in the wild.
 
have some india (or don't, if you don't want to see corpses and human filth in general, obviously NSFW): chinasmack.com/2010/pictures/…
 
@KonradRudolph Indeed
 
I can't believe people like that actually exist
they dump corpses in the river
they bathe around the corpses
drink the water from around the corpses
jesus christ
 
@KonradRudolph Yeah, when you send a link to that question to colleagues and have to follow up the link with "but I know jalf and opinion has changed in the years since", something is wrong ;p
well, I can't speak for jalf specifically so I don't know for sure that his opinion has changed, but still..
@LucDanton Yeah. Lots of people seem to think, or used to think, that because a[5] is *(a+5) and because &* dereferences then takes the address of the resulting object, those two symbols magically evaporate and you have no dereference any more. With no evidence whatsoever to back up that outlandish claim
 
it's not really outlandish, it's fairly accurate, in terms of implementation.
whether or not it is that way by Standard is another question.
 
12:27 PM
well, no, it's not "another question". it's the precise thing we're talking about.
 
@rubenvb -fdiagnostics-color is not working for me. Help.
damn.
 
12:49 PM
@AlexM. Maybe the water-cooler is broken?
 
lol
 
1:01 PM
You guys are being very quiet today.
 
RARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR
I'm on hold to British Gas because their boiler repair failed. 25 minutes and counting...
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Maybe it is a tea time?
 
Maybe large corporations are incompetent
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit It's summer. Why do you need a boiler?
 
@MartinJames I like to wash myself and clean the dishes every once in a while. Plus, winter is coming...
Wish I had some kind of assistant to handle all this crap for me
 
1:07 PM
hmmm
NASA confirms that reaction-mass-less relativity drive actually appears to produce thrust.
 
@Puppy Gotta little linky?
 
the Nasa paper is here
not sure where I found a more English version.
 
@Puppy Ah... Shawyer EM drive. I wondered if that would go anywhere, (sorry).
 
@MartinJames Well, it sounds like a total crackpot, except for the part where when NASA tests the drive, it produces thrust.
Chinese researchers had the same result in an industrial-grade ion drive test harness
apparently, it can produce better than 10 times the thrust per mass than an ion drive, but since it has no reaction mass, it could theoretically fire indefinitely as long as you have power.
 
got halfway through giving my mobile number and booking a date and the line went dead. now when I call them even the automated voice is crackling up. always been a bad line to that number grr
hmm much better from my mobile. costs tho
 
1:14 PM
@Puppy I read about it some years ago. Shawyer says his maths show that the drive does not violate conservation of momentum.
 
for me, I'm less convinced by what the original inventor says, since they're often crackpots.
more convinced when NASA says it works.
 
@Puppy I'll be more convinced if the drive is put on an actual spacecraft and, when powered up, causes acceleration.
 
well, arguably true.
 
It was tested in a vaccuum chamber... at standard atmospheric pressure
4
really useful test for space flight viability.
 
@SamDeHaan lol
 
1:18 PM
right, booked in. hopefully they can actually fix it -.-
 
@Puppy I'll be convinced when it's implemented in KSP
 
lol
gotta admit the ion drives in KSP could probably use a buff.
they need to be radial so you can stack them together, especially.
 
> Thrust was observed on both test
articles, even though one of the test articles was designed with the expectation that it would not produce
thrust. Specifically, one test article contained internal physical modifications that were designed to produce
thrust, while the other did not (with the latter being referred to as the “null” test article).
 
Xeo
Hm. emplace_back, y u no work with aggregates :(
 
perfect forwarding and aggregate initialization problems, ain't it?
 
Xeo
1:30 PM
It uses T(...), which obviously doesn't work for aggregates
 
@MartinJames snigger
 
Xeo
It'd need to be T{ ... }, but that has its own problems
 
so glad that Wide does not have this problem.
 
no feature - no problem?
 
no, I have a comparable feature
 
1:36 PM
> Test results indicate that the RF resonant cavity thruster design, which is unique as an electric propulsion device, is producing a force that is not attributable to any classical electromagnetic phenomenon and therefore is potentially demonstrating an interaction with the quantum vacuum virtual plasma.
sigh
 
Well I don't know what it's doing. Must be quantum (virtual?) plasma.
 
forgot the vaccuum
 
I don’t think it’s right to regard it as an putative space drive, since we don’t have a clue what’s happening. I’m certainly looking forward to what will be figured out though.
 
obtw @Xeo I have a problem with ADL.
I implemented operator+ as an expression yesterday but it occurred to me that operator+(x, y) doesn't properly replicate the semantics of x + y because operator+ only looks up at the call site, and doesn't perform ADL (no arguments)
 
Xeo
Yes?
 
1:41 PM
I wonder if the desirable semantics are as now, or perform ADL on call.
so operator+(x, y) would be strictly equivalent to x + y.
also you can now use operators on modules, since they now have operators as members, which I should really fix.
 
my god
 
Trying to write code that can take Erlang messages and spit out useful Java objects so I can fire them towards the Java DB interface is messy
so very messy
 
my docking station arrived
 
docking stations are nice
 
1:47 PM
this one is really small
 
simply, but so handy
@BartekBanachewicz they seem to be that way these days
 
@thecoshman this is not an attachable one
 
@BartekBanachewicz what is that?
colorgcc?
 
hmm how is it not working?
 
1:54 PM
@BartekBanachewicz huh?
 
@rubenvb everything is white
 
lol ok
 
that's not a docking station is? Normally they are just a fancy 'pad' that you plug the laptop down onto
 
Uhm, I don't know immediately.
 
@thecoshman you just hook up that big-ass cable and that's it
 
1:55 PM
I use clang or an IDE to actually read error messages :-p
 
@rubenvb I set GCC_COLORS in bash; should I set it in Windows?
 
@BartekBanachewicz oh I see
I think I still prefer the 'plug down' method, sounds like that cable will be nontrivial to get lined up
 
hmm
the Wide git repo is like, 6-7MB
 
@thecoshman lined up?
it's just a cable
 
but what if you try to plug it in upside down?!
that's like, over 1.5 seconds you've wasted
 
2:01 PM
fuck it
 
-.-
 
guys
is -Wall sensible?
 
yes
but only if you treat all warnings as errors
and treat some things that are perfectly legal C++ as warnings
and eat fish for breakfast
 
why was that starred?
 
not sure...
 
2:07 PM
because it doesn't make any sense to me
 
why?
I was asking if warnings generated are worth looking at
 
You may want to check it yourself, but yeah, -Wall is mostly sane.
 
what does "sensible" mean in the context of a compile flag?
 
btw until recently I thought that -pedantic is an useful option, but then I learned that it barks at trailing comma in enums, e.g. enum X { a, };
 
@Jefffrey if it's worth enabling :v
 
2:08 PM
It is.
 
@BartekBanachewicz I think they're inherited when you start MSYS...
 
Enable -Wall, and disable the warnings you dislike later.
 
@rubenvb so if I set it in .bashrc, it should still work
 
coliru enables it by default
I trust coliru with all my guts
 
@Jefffrey you don't have any.
 
2:10 PM
@BartekBanachewicz depends how you set it :P
 
lol
 
lol, seems we might have a bug because someone failed at implementing a singleton
 
;lol;
 
at least you can rip it out as part of the fix
 
wanna hear a fun fact?
 
2:14 PM
hell no, I'm not working on that mess :P
 
our codebase compiled with std=c++11 on first try
 
@Puppy fixed the singleton's bug. solution: removed the singleton.
seems appropriate
 
delete singleton;
 
that's.... not especially impressive.
C++11 really didn't contain much in the way of breaking changes.
 
@Puppy still
 
2:17 PM
hmm
how do I pause the process in GDB?
ctrl+c put me back to the GDB prompt but if I Ask it for backtrace or anything, it says the target is still executing
 
breakpoint, i dunno
 
I have no idea where it's executing :P
 
@Puppy ... put a break point where you want...
 
@thecoshman Where I want is wherever it is right now
unless you want me to break in every line of the program looking for infinite loopage :P
 
visual studio has something called break all
yay visual studio
 
2:22 PM
yeah, you just push the "Pause" button and it just pauses the program
 
@Puppy paste the actual message
 
(gdb) bt
Target is executing.
(gdb) break
No default breakpoint address now.
(gdb) until
Cannot execute this command while the selected thread is running.
 
try halt
 
2
A: gdb step not working as expected

Employed Russian What could be the reason of this behavior? It's a bug in GDB. It sets a temporary breakpoint and expects it to be hit. But the breakpoint doesn't get hit (possibly because it was set in the wrong place), and GDB's internal state machine gets all confused. Is there any workarounds besides...

maybe
 
2:24 PM
btw handle sigint stop
 
hmm
I killed it, then ran again, and everything seemed nominal.
I think I might well just mark that down to some GDB bug
 
also debugger is for puppies, true men use unit-tests
 
and when the unit tests fail, you...
 
wat
 
@Puppy you write more tests
 
2:27 PM
what, you don't fix the failing tests?
 
@Jefffrey 60 watt, ftfy
@Puppy whatever I do is unrelated to what I advise to you this topic
 
IC
 
but well, when I can't use debugger I use logs.
 
don't kill trees
 
dude, dead trees? you suck.
those things make the oxygen we breathe
 
2:30 PM
they also consume oxygen.
 
they're net oxygen producers
 
and we have a lot of trees here in Russia
 
in Soviet Russia, trees write on dead humans?
 
dunno, I was too young in Soviet times
 
or maybe dead press/internet freedoms, or Ukrainians
 
2:32 PM
oh not Ukraine again >_<
 
lol
ah, it's OK, everybody has Israel to distract them now
 
huh?
 
can you imagine
if Russia decided to start a war
Abyx would be our enemy
 
no.
 
imagination not required
 
2:34 PM
@AlexM. I can live with that
 
like, collaborating with us would be some sort of treason
 
:v
 
meh
 
if Puppy were to be drafted and Abyx were to be drafted
and if they were to meet
they'd have to fight
otherwise it's treason
 
can you imagine that Germans were enemies until 1945?
we'd better drop this topic.
 
2:35 PM
bah
 
Well, luckily for us puppy could probably get out on medical reasons
 
I had to run the program four times this time for it to finish successfully.
 
@Abyx great analogy
except it isn't
but yeah
it's an annoying topic
and quite frustrating
 
the difference between Germany and Russia is that Germany got the hint after they lost.
and it seems like Russia didn't.
 
here we go
 
2:37 PM
like I said before we should stop talking about this.
 
you can't blame us
technically, your country IS on the point of invading another
yours, not ours
 
oh fuck
ok.
 
Alex M, gonna get plonked at this rate.
 
inb4 "i don't care"
 
nah, I'll stop
 
2:39 PM
Hello. I'm wondering about the behavior of converting an unsigned integer to an integer. For instance, if I typecast a signed 32 bit integer to an unsigned 32 bit integer, what will happen if the value is, say, -500?
 
fuck.
GDB, why do you give different outcomes when I run the program more than once?
 
Seven. At least seven.
 
HELLO PEOPLE
 
BONJOUR
 
hiya
 
2:41 PM
Will a typecast -500 to an unsigned int result in MAX_INT-499?
 
good evening etienne
we were just discussing how Putin is literally Hitler.
care to weigh in?
 
oh god
 
I'm here
 
we should stop though it can spark arguments probably not welcome here
 
I've never had an argument that wasn't welcome here
 
2:42 PM
@AlexM. what's happening in Ukraine now is that Fascist Ukrainian government is actively killing innocent civilians in eastern regions of Ukraine. It is not Russia who makes Ukrainian army launch missiles and shoot shells to the cities.
 
@Abyx Well, actually, it is, since they're the ones arming the rebels and perpetuating the conflict.
 
^ point of no return
 
I dunno man, all I see is a war going on there between USA's and Russia's appendices
 
@Puppy I have no interest in this specific instance of cock waggling.
 
as a Romanian, I'm really worried
because I'm fucking close to everything
and Moldova is Russia's dog
 
2:44 PM
I prefer to stick with the route of "Global media very anti-Putin/Russia, probably half true at best" coupled with "Russian media opposite, probably half true at best" resulting in the conclusion of "I have no idea what's actually happening, therefore I will not attempt to contribute to any conversation in a meaningful manner.
 
ok. so if there is a building with 100 civilians and 1 terrorist - you will blow whole building and kill all those 101 people.
 
and Romania's USA's dog
 
@AlexM. you are close to my heart, that's what matters
 
ok, I got your point.
 
well, if the terrorist is hiding in the building, then what are you gonna do?
 
2:45 PM
@Puppy probably not blow the whole building?
 
especially if he's armed with a rocket launcher given to him by a foreign government for the purpose of destablising your whole country
 
the only thing that's good to be during a war is probably one of the rich guys who want to become even richer because of the war
 
@SamDeHaan Depends on how many soldiers would have to die to clear out the building and how many civilians would die anyway during such an action.
 
@Puppy hence "probably"
 
@SamDeHaan I think the most important bit is the fact that there's a conflict there
that could drag the whole world in
 
2:47 PM
well, IYAM It's hard to argue that the guy who gave the terrorist a rocket launcher and told him to go blow up the government isn't responsible here.
 
but well in Ukraine it's not a "terrorists and civilians" situation
 
@AlexM. What interest would have "the world" in getting in the conflict?
 
seems to be a "Ukrainian army and Russian army" situation
 
@Jefffrey it's enough for a NATO country to get in there, and the others will be forced to assist it due to NATO's obligations
 
so we have this bonus thing
 
2:49 PM
so, if the US decided to publicly declare war on Russia
all NATO countries would be forced to assist
 
besides, if I were Russian, I'd be more concerned about being next because I didn't vote for Putin
 
@AlexM. What NATO country? And why are they there?
 
The NATO (North Atlantic Treaty Organization) is an international alliance that consists of 28 member states from North America and Europe. It was established at the signing of the North Atlantic Treaty on 4 April 1949. Article Five of the treaty states that if an armed attack occurs against one of the member states, it should be considered an attack against all members, and other members shall assist the attacked member, with armed forces if necessary. Of the 28 member countries, two are located in North America (Canada and the United States) and 25 are European countries while Turkey is in Eurasia...
 
@Puppy it's not only "army vs army". it's also "Ukrainian army vs innocent people"
 
Yeah, which one of the 28?
 
2:51 PM
well if I were to bet my money
I'd say it will be the US or another state used as a puppet by the US
 
@Abyx Yeah, all the innocent people that Russia gave a bunch of tanks and told them to get to it.
 
who else would have interest in ukraine's stuff?
France?
 
@AlexM. Why would the US get into this?
 
because they already are?
 
so I was given a task of preparing a C++11 presentation for the team
 
2:52 PM
@Puppy ugh...
 
Imma need some materials
 
@AlexM. Prove it
 
@Jefffrey you just have to look at the US' reactions
they're publicly throwing sanctions at Russia because of the situation in Ukraine
why would the US care about what Russia does?
 
there's a big stretch from sanctions to actual military action.
 
sanctions for what
 
2:53 PM
@AlexM. WTF? Do you let bullies bully freely?
 
@VáclavZeman It's not like the US is clean on this one.
 
you know
 
@Puppy if the US admitted they sent troops or otherwise weaponry in the ukraine that'd give the enemies of their supported factions a reason to declare war on the US
 
not using VS is really nice
 
@Puppy I'm talking about this - cassad.net/tv/videos/585 [gore] [nsfw]
 
2:54 PM
@Puppy Well, they seem a lot cleaner to me.
 
so you probably won't see the US getting implicated militarily in Ukraine, publicly, anytime soon
 
not having to deal with VS shittiness at all
 
From what I've heard (people I trust on this stuff) nobody gives a fuck about ukraine because there's nothing worth fighting and spending war money for, there.
 
@Abyx One video of some dead people is hardly evidence that the Ukrainian govt is intentionally murdering civilians.
 
the US publicly helping the situation in Ukraine would also allow Russia to say something like
 
2:55 PM
@Puppy you can find more videos. if you want to see "evidence"
 
"we're worried that such a big military power came here, we'll react now."
 
@Abyx Which is still not really evidence of anything.
 
@Jefffrey one example: Ukraine's biggest natural gas company is all owned by US citizens
 
but well it's safe to sit with your eyes closed
 
it's just a bunch of dead people; it's hardly proof of who killed them, why, in what circumstances, or on what scale.
 
2:56 PM
@AlexM. you are proving my point
 
how?
 
I've set -Wno-sign-compare
 
@AlexM. US has not interests in fight there.
 
I feel fairly confident that the EU and UN would be quite capable of identifying any large or institutional brutality by the Ukrainian govt... they're quick enough to do so in Israel/Gaza and other conflicts.
 
erm they kinda do
 
2:57 PM
Why would they?
 
@Puppy lol
 
if those directors lose control over the business, they get pissed
 
right now there's "Russia alleges brutality by Ukraine" and "Absolutely everybody else, ever, alleges wrongdoing by Russia".
 
and the country being occupied by anti-US guys would surely make them lose control
 

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