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3:00 PM
1) I doubt US as a state cares about private US businesses that much to spend their own money on it. 2) This "Ukraine's biggest natural gas company" could still be orders of magnitude smaller than US biggest natural gas income".
 
it's not that much of a private business
or rather it is
but the son of the prime minister or something is in the board of directors
 
That's why there's a board of directors. And not just one guy deciding for everybody.
 
I'm also pretty sure their aim is not to fill in some sort of resource gap
let's say Russia is indeed trying to take over Ukraine. not saying it is, but let's suppose it is
 
Wars cost. A lot. If countries don't get much gain from it, they don't start a war. All the possible bullshits of "OMG they have a different religion" or "let's bring peace over there" don't really count.
 
@Puppy EU and UN do only what USA allows them to do. and while USA supports Ukrainian government - nothing will happen.
 
3:03 PM
allowing it to do so would grant it territory immediately close to pretty much all of Europe
as the US, if I saw Russia trying to take on more territory and resources
even if it's not a lot
 
@AlexM. You should be saying it is.
 
I wouldn't let it
it's not like Russia is this tiny country
it's huge, and allowing it to grow even bigger is a danger
 
@Abyx So basically, your argument boils down to "The rest of the world is in the pocket of the US".
 
And still, people living west from Poland seem not to notice what Russia is doing :/
 
@Griwes They notice, they just don't really know what to do about it.
 
3:06 PM
it's not much they can do unless everyone comes to an agreement about it
Russia can act on its own all it wants
Poland can't act on its own unless in secrecy
because they'd be breaking military crap agreements of NATO
 
The biggest problem with the Ukraine is, on the west there are nationalists, on the left there are socialists (?) and people saying they are Russians. But not quite, since they have mixed together quite a bit in the last 20 or 30 years. So they can neither split not live together, really.
 
well, Russia is a dictatorship where Putin controls the media, so he can do what he wants and trivially hide it or justify it to the people of his own country.
 
@Puppy basically your government can't do anything important against US will. USA says "go to Iraq" - your army fight in Iraq. USA says "Syrian terrorists fight for freedom and democracy" - your media says so. Then Syrian terrorists invade Iraq and make ISIL and your media shuts the fuck up.
 
the leaders in the EU have to be accountable.
 
@Abyx sorry our countries are not as big as yours
 
3:07 PM
it would be funny unless it's very sad.
 
@Abyx I guess you don't actually know what our media says, because our media have been saying since the start of the Syrian war that it's problematic that half the opposition groups are crazy terrorists.
 
BREAKING NEWS: Every country's propaganda machine most effective on own citizens. Who knew?
 
and right now they're being super critical of the US for failing to act about what Israel is doing.
 
Nah, military. Our MoFA was calling out for diplomatic support in Ukraine, and suddenly, some newspaper (sitting in Russia's back pocket) published recordings of him saying things we all know and are talking about when drinking beer, while he was drinking beer, and suddenly he's the bad guy.
 
@Puppy but didn't your country supply them with weapons?
 
3:09 PM
posted on August 01, 2014 by Raman Sharma

A while ago we posted about how the distribution and deployment of C++ Runtime as a dependency was handled through the Windows Store. That mechanism works for apps that are themselves distributed through the Store. However, there are cases in which you...(read more)

 
(Why people fell for this? I didn't know you can be such an idiot, hypocrite and an asshat.)
 
@Abyx Which group and at which time?
 
@Puppy Libyan and Syrian "fighters for democracy" when they destroyed Libya and tried to destroy Syria
 
@Abyx There was a UN resolution to support the LIbyan rebels, which we did participate in, as did nearly everybody else.
as far as I know, we have taken no serious action in support of any Syrian group.
 
3:11 PM
@Puppy you sure it wasn't "USA resolution"?
 
yes, I'm pretty sure.
 
UN doesn't really do anything.
 
I'm not sure if the Libyan people have succeeded in creating a better state for themselves afterwards, but Gaddaffi deserved to get his ass kicked.
 
It has about no authority anywhere.
 
Hello, sorry to interupt, but I was going to "read the rules to aviod getting bit" and the link is dead. Are there rules?
10
 
3:12 PM
the link seems to be dead indeed
> [abef7cda] 2014-08-01 15:12:29: Fatal exception of type Scribunto_LuaInterpreterNotFoundError
 
@2cents there is the only rule - don't ask
 
"UN has used their most powerful form of reaction: they voiced their disagreement."
 
@Griwes Tell that to Gaddaffi, who was happily using his air force to own the Libyan rebels, until the UN resolution against him.
 
> STATUS READ ONLY — THIS IS A TRANSITIONAL READ-ONLY MIRROR OF THE WIKI. DETAILS ON @LOUNGECPP OR CHAT.
 
@Puppy yeah, they definitely live better now
 
3:13 PM
whoops, didn't read the homepage
 
@Puppy oh wait
isn't it exactly what Ukraine does?
 
So ITT @Puppy thinks UN can actually do something.
 
well, arguably, they do live better now, and they certainly had the opportunity to create something better.
 
@CatPlusPlus You broke the Wiki on the only day ever that a newbie actually went to read it
20
 
whether or not Libya will fall back to chaos is another question
 
3:14 PM
@Abyx That is not the rule.
 
@Abyx Not really.
 
or did you miss the part where the Ukraine rebels used Russian anti-air weapons to shoot down a passenger jet full of civilians?
 
@Puppy yeah and they'll live even better with ISIL
 
@Abyx That's in Syria/Iraq.
 
3:15 PM
what have I started
 
@AlexM. A shitstorm.
 
@Abyx You appear to be more than a little confused.
 
MediaWiki sucks
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Is it really only broken today? That's amusing.
 
@Puppy and Levant. and growing.
 
3:15 PM
@2cents Pretty sure it was up yesterday
 
@Griwes I wonder if it will turn into a discussion about nazis
 
@Abyx Levant is Syria/Iraq.
 
@AlexM. You just did.
 
personally I suspect that they'll eventually get their asses kicked by the West.
 
nope, it's not the original discussion about nazis
 
3:16 PM
You know, UPA was basically a nazi sub-state.
 
I mentioned nazis which means it was like
a meta discussion about nazis
 
@Puppy not really what?
 
Fixed
 
@CatPlusPlus Thanks.
 
@Abyx Well, firstly, the Ukrainian rebels are packed with anti-air weapons from Russia (you know, the ones they used to murder a plane full of civilians), so despite the use of the Ukrainian air force, they're not making much progress.
 
3:17 PM
@Puppy Sounds like you believe the shootdown was deliberate. It's widely accepted that the targetting of a passenger airliner was accidental.
 
@Puppy so far rebels shot down like 10 planes. so Ukraine was using aviation at least 10 times =)
 
no, I do believe that the targetting was a mistake.
 
Also I find it amusing that the US is so quick to condemn Russia for selling the weapons to the rebels, yet they defend US gun manufacturers as much as humanly possible when kids get shot in schools. "It's not the manufacturers'/shopkeepers' fault."
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit I absolutely agree with this.
 
Rampant hypocrisy right across the board over this entire thing. It's sickening
 
3:19 PM
@Puppy In that case, the usual wording would be "manslaughter" rather than "murder".
 
so far, I'm coming to believe that as long as you only brutally murder and repress your own civilians, you mostly get a free pass.
 
The campaign of hate against Putin is remarkable. I can barely go anywhere without people bullshitting about him as if they've known him personally for years. "He wants to do this" "he wants to do that" what!!
 
but when you start murdering other people's civilians then the rest of the world starts to get pissed off and might do something (but might not).
 
I don't think "murder" means what you think it means.
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit it's because those rebels don't fight for democracy. Libyan's did fight for democracy, so it was OK to give them weapons.
 
3:21 PM
Here again comes @LightnessRacesinOrbit with his PoV that Putin just wants his citizens' safety. :F
 
of course eastern Ukrainians did hold a referendum about separating from Ukraine, but it's not democracy, right?
 
@Abyx Depends on the circumstances.
 
so Ukrainian army came to punish them for not being so democratic
 
if you have a referendum which is genuinely free and fair, then that's totally democratic.
we have one going on in Scotland right now.
 
@Abyx ;p
@Griwes I do believe that, but that's not what I'm saying here
 
3:23 PM
but if Putin rolls in the tanks first, the opposition groups boycott, and they have 1 day of campaigning, then that's clearly not free and fair and it's not democratic.
 
@Puppy yeah I know. I wonder how it will end
 
@Puppy and it's retarded because the average Scottish people are not qualified to know what economic and political system is best for their country
that's why we [ostensibly] elect experts to do that for us
 
@Puppy Because a free and fair voting can happen in the eastern part of Ukraine. Yeah, right. :P
 
there are actually no truly democratic states in the world; just a lot of republics
so all that "democracy" rhetoric is amusingly wrong
 
@Griwes Right, I believe that there could be a free and fair election, but only after the war is over and it'd have to be pretty heavily moderated by the EU/UN.
 
3:24 PM
Sure.
 
chucking it down with rain and hail. good time for a smoke. since I have to go downstairs and close the patio doors anyway
 
don't smoke man
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit I kinda agree but kinda disagree. The core problem here is that the experts don't know either, so it's hard to argue that they're better off. And fundamentally, I feel like having a few decide the fate of the majority is begging for trouble when the majority decide they don't like it.
personally I think that if we fired everybody in the House of Lords and hired a bunch of scientists to sit there instead, it would be a fair balance.
 
@Puppy ...which won't happen (the last part), since the eastern part of Ukraine basically "wants" to live in Russia.
 
I heard that most of UK natural resources are concentrated in Scotland
 
3:27 PM
@Griwes Yeah, except nobody actually knows that, because they never had any kind of proper political process on the matter.
 
@Abyx Separating from a country is rather a different situation, as a rule. Consider: I take a vote (among myself) and unanimously agree that I'm no longer part of the US, so I'm no longer subject to its laws. [feel free to substitute any other country you choose.] If I then proceed to break the country's laws, do you think I'm going to get any kind of free pass because I decided to secede from that country?
 
@Puppy Basically; the eastern part of Ukraine is pretty much Putin, and the western is pretty much Hitler.
 
@Griwes not really. they rather want to separate from russian-hating Ukraine
 
lol no
They don't want to separate, they "want" to be swallowed by Russia.
 
@Griwes It's really not that basic at all. Even if you were ethnic Russian, considering that Putin is basically Hitler reincarnate but without a big enough economy to pull off WW3, it'd be pretty rational to vote against being annexed by Russia, especially when the alternative is a free democratic EU.
 
3:28 PM
@Puppy possibly
 
Or rather Putin wants that, which makes them "want" that.
 
@Puppy possibly. but now your science bias is showing
 
@Griwes actually yes. because easten Ukraine is populated with russian-speaking people
 
nevermind
 
3:29 PM
@LightnessRacesinOrbit No such thing.
 
and then Ukrainian government banned Russian language and legalized nazis
 
I'll leave this discussion, since you seem to have no contact with people who lived in Ukraine back during or after WW2, and even less contact with people knowing what's really going on in there right now, while I have contact with both.
 
of course eastern Ukrainians wanted to leave.
 
The ethnic situation in Ukraine is fucked up, but you are really underestimating the Russian influence there.
 
@Griwes A few contacts? Worthless anecdotes. Free, fair referendum, or there's no relevant data.
 
3:31 PM
@Puppy "Free, fair referendum" in Ukraine? No such thing.
 
@Griwes Then there is no relevant data.
 
You have NO idea what is going on in there, I have some.
I maintain that some is better than none.
 
your "some" is none.
 
@Griwes Russia has a great influence in Abkhasia and South Osetia, but they didn't join Russia. Same would happen with DNR and LNR.
 
I'd rather trust the EU, whose job it is to know these things and get it right, rather than random anecdotes, which are not actual evidence of anything.
 
3:32 PM
Yeah, sure. How didn't I know that people living further from the thing will have idiotic PoV on the complexity of the problems.
@Puppy LOL
 
yes, I agree that physical distance is an incredibly relevant metric. Gosh, it must take a whole 10 extra milliseconds to cross the gap.
 
@Abyx This is one of those points that initially sounds like a statement of fact, but is actually much less so than it may initially seem. In fact, Ukrainian and Russian are quite closely related, to the point that (for example) there's probably more difference between my "English" and Puppy's/LRiO's than there is between Russian and Ukrainian (and quite possibly as much difference between LRiO's "English" and Puppy's "English" as between Ukrainian and Russian).
 
@Puppy Your idealism is even more silly than mine, and that's a huge achievement.
I'm out.
 
ok I didn't really think this through. can't get to the ashtray
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit I would laugh at you, but
screw it, lol
 
3:35 PM
Feel free to do it.
I'll do the same thing back at you.
 
LRiO always reminds me that the English I speak is different from the English he speaks :(
 
he has his own english
 
Annnnnd cut.
You were all fantastic.
 
lol
I'll never bring up wars again here
 
@JerryCoffin No, you don't really get it. While historically Ukrainians were really close to Russians, not they completely diverged. And it's easy to tell who is who - there are people call Russians "russian" and people who call Russians "moskal".
 
3:41 PM
I said "cut".
Stop.
 
@Jefffrey he pasted.
 
Fermati.
Fin.
 
who gives about what you say?
 
giwes what
 
nothing
like literally
 
3:42 PM
@Jefffrey italian sound awesome btw
played through AC2 with italian speech
one of the best experiences I've had
 
lol
 
@AlexM. like Japanese?
 
well I can't hear italian anywhere else
I like how jap sounds too
I also remember having an italian client
his family name was Cacciatore or something
which afaik means hunter
 
it means hunter
 
how cool is that, to be called hunter
Romanian names don't mean shit they're just names
easy to pronounce words that have some resemblance towards words with meaning
well if you study the roots you kinda see how they were formed and it makes sense
 
3:46 PM
Many surnames have been derived from jobs people did
 
but considering modern Romanian, most names don't mean shit
 
john smith
 
nikola tesla
 
Names are just dumb IDs which fail at being unique
 
@AlexM. Back in the day, I'd much rather have hung out with Hunter than be called hunter.
 
3:49 PM
in case someone is curious and didn't google
> The name Tesla is Serbian for "adze," a chopping and digging instrument.
IIRC one of his ancestors was a maker of adzes
 
@Puppy ;p
my ancestors came up with new kinds of orbits
 
and raced in them
 
what, gravitational slingshots around the Moon?
 
welp time to go home
 
Quite again. You guys are not in shape today.
 
3:58 PM
I applied for a job and they emailed me back promptly at 8:30 to say, "We are considering your application".
@BartekBanachewicz: Tried re-sending my registration to codementor but they say I'm already registered. Reset password? Sorry, I'm not registered. Wankers.
 
@Puppy good
 
Puppy stuck in Codementor limbo.
 
@Puppy well
 
Facebook appears to be down for many users. (8:58 a.m. PT)
 
looks like I'mma make a Google Helpouts listing instead.
hmm, intro video? boy, this is gonna suck.
 
4:09 PM
@BartekBanachewicz That's quite a deep subject for such a shallow mind.
 
@Puppy I don't get the joke.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes The joke is a lie. The cake is a lye (that'll eat your stomach).
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Hallelujah
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Yep.
 
> After receiving criticism that no peer reviewed publications on the subject had been made, Shawyer submitted a theory paper to New Scientist, a weekly science magazine which is not a peer reviewed scientific journal.
lol, way to go.
 
@EtiennedeMartel lol, the status page is down.
 
@PolymorphicPotato Not for me
 
@Puppy You know you're a crackpot when a science fiction author calls your science "a real threat to the public understanding of science".
@Puppy I also like how NASA calls it "Anomalous Thrust Production" in the paper title. Does not exude as much confidence as those guys with the superluminal neutrinos.
Why does clicking "Full text" lead me to a PDF with only the abstract :<
 
oh, on the off chance any one cares, Satruday night, sorted
 
What's satruday?
 
4:34 PM
> Platform surfaces
what
 
@Jefffrey When you sat and rued the day?
 
Oh, right.
 
Holding my breath for a Need For Speed sequel that exclusively uses driverless cars.
Best tweet read today: "My daughter asked me what a sex tape was the other day. It took me a while to realise the bit she didn't understand was the word tape......."
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Link?
 
well screw you guys
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit It's like lube, except in tape form.
 
go go go spring into action
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Why can't you just be normal? You know, like the other kids.
> Finally, the government of Romania has a phone. It is they who will be doing the laughing now.
Oh boy. @AlexM.
 
@Jefffrey You asked for a link to the content source. I gave it to you. What's your problem?
 
You are being a disappoint, son.
 
4:47 PM
...
You're a weirdo sometimes.
 
I'm a weirdo all the time
 
user784668
@LightnessRacesinOrbit …
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit haha
a Romanian gypsy stole someone else's phone and started taking pictures of himself and his family
the pictures were autouploaded to some online service
and the real owner placed them on his blog
let me see if I can find them again
 
Daughters asked me "what's a sex tape?" It took me a while to realise that what was confusing them was the word "tape".
 
there's some NSFW in there
 
4:51 PM
Holy shit, Jefffrey. Thanks. You truly are an angel.
 
@AlexM. hah I think I've seen that
@Jefffrey Oh, you wanted a link to the tweet. I thought you were accusing me of stealing my whole message and wanted a link to that. Not sure why.
 
shit, I really started some crap with my ukraine thing
sorry about that
 
Probably it was on my mind because I had :P
 
I promise I won't ever bring it up again
 
Next time be clearer with your questions
 
4:53 PM
srly dude
 
steam keeps on giving me coupons for free
I want free GAMES
not COUPONS
 
use the coupons to get games derp
 
@AlexM. Get a job you lazy bum
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit I still have to buy them
if they want to send me gifts
better make them proper gifts
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes The Chinese guys did it in 2008/10/12 too.
 
5:03 PM
and it's also coupons for relatively cheap and less popular games
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes They didn't have published reproducing experiments, repeatedly.
 
now if they sent me a... 20% off coupon for a Call of Duty game
hell yeah, I'd buy it
 
@AlexM. Moron.
 
You've misspelled 90%
2
 
CoD is fun guys, honest
 
5:04 PM
maybe if you're three years old
 
:( ok
 
I liked MW2
 
It can be fun
 
back in the days
 
But not fun enough to pay
 
5:06 PM
I think I bought MW2 for 50 eur years ago lol
I got MW3 for free during a winter sale
 
CoD is like a cheap burger from McDonalds
it's OK if you've got nothing else, but it's not something you'd actually want.
 
but yeah, in all seriousness now
 
unless you're a freak.
 
I wouldn't buy another CoD unless 9 eur or less
 
Except for the part where it's cheap
 
5:07 PM
also that.
 
if I had a system to run it, I'd choose to play Battlefield instead
 
BFBC2 and BF3 were fun enough, I still play BF3 from time to time, but BF4 was a disaster
 
I want to get 3 monitors especially for BF3 or 4
flying planes looks awesome on that
actually, the whole game looks awesome
I liked BFBC2 too
 
> penis hat
hahaha
> That's what I called my ex gf.
lol
 
5:14 PM
really smooth
 
speaking of ex gfs, this one got dumped on radio
 
5:29 PM
@AlexM. meh don't wanna listen to much more of that
bad memories!
 
^ Nessie
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit I'm of course on the guy's side
but in some ways I understand her situation too
men tend to get pushy and screw with a girl's mind when they want her, from what I've seen
it's very probable she said "no" but the guy just didn't want to leave it at that
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit inb4 "rape jokes aren't funny, but this one is"
 
the guy being cheated on kinda let all of his rage out at her lol
he should have at least smashed the other guy around a bit for messing with his relationships
 
Ell
5:38 PM
hmm
my hdmi monitor is all fuzzy
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit the only bad memory I have is of this girl who decided to play the "lol you're not going to get me and I'll make you feel bad" game
 
@AlexM. that's cruel
 
Ell
I didn't think hdmi signal could be noisy o.O
 
subsequently I just remembered women are also human
and as humans you can't tell what their motives are and what they think
what's the point in investing in something so improbable to bring any benefits
everyone looks after themselves in the end
it's really sad
 
please don't start again
 
5:41 PM
what with?
 
Ell
I found that once I was over my first girlfriend, they weren't a big deal to me :L
I spent a year and a half being sad
 
I'm pretty sure this is not a controversial topic
 
Ell
then it occurred to me that I'd been wasting my time
 
it's just... a topic
 
Ell
now I'm happy all the time :P
 
5:42 PM
and I personally find it interesting
 
@Ell That's the drugs talking
 
now I'm not even sure what I'm supposed to talk about
damnit I always end up in this point somehow
always
 
The New Pornographers have a new video.
 
what the fuck
 
Ell
5:43 PM
@CatPlusPlus Haha, I don't do drugs (yet)
 
I need a pause
 
@Ell Yeah right
 
@Ell Instead, you sell them.
 
@AlexM. now worries :)
@AlexM. I often am irritable the first few minutes I get home. Don't know why.
 
it's not really the first time this happens to me
I do it whenever I get comfortable enough with others tbh
the things I like to discuss are generally viewed as a source of arguments, and I always somehow end up starting them
 
5:48 PM
no you don't.
 
it's the main reason I got banned on SE, and after that I kinda wanted to stop because I've sort of had enough
but it seems I can't ffs
 
you can
 
What is SE?
 
stackexchange (chat)
 
nothing
 
5:51 PM
stackoverflow chat? Or the entire se?
 
well I'm not banned here
:)
just on the other sites
 
woah fuck me vast rainstorm just came out of nowhere
 
it's drizzling a little here
 
TIL about SE chat.
 
@AlexM. stop
 
5:52 PM
well I did stop
until you told me to stop
now I had to start again to tell you that I have stopped
 
No, I mean, stop worrying about shit like that
 
:O
 
user3010322
@StackedCrooked SE chat?
 
sehe chat
 
@Jefffrey well it generally doesn't end up with me successfully integrating in a community
never did
so I'm trying to fix it
 
5:54 PM
I seriously have no clue what the fuck you are talking about
It's all in your head.
 
lol okay
but I guess I'll drop the topic I started before
it's depressing anyway
 
Unless there are > 4 people telling you to stop, you don't have to worry. At > 6 people you better take a walk. At > 12 just leave forever.
 

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