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2:00 PM
I had not noticed you had not noticed
 
robot got promoted?
 
I had a look at meta chat users, I was like "woah who are those newbs with ♦ next to their names" ...
 
Promoted from CEO of fixing off-by-one-pixel bugs to CEO of fixing animation bugs.
 
if this is the case, I am on track with my bet:
-11
A: How much money does Stack Exchange make?

chmod 711 telkittyWe will find it out when it does IPO in next year or two. I mean, eventually it will go float, unless it 1) bankrupts or 2) gets bought by another company. 1) Don't think that will happen, but it is just a personal opinion. 2) If another company buys SE, it would be the like of Microsoft or ...

 
Wait, what's cooler? CEO or VP?
 
2:06 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes ¬_¬ never mind
 
VPEO
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes assistant junior vice CEO
 
lol that reflection proposal I asked opinions of how much support it would get and everyone said none
> Overall, the general direction of the proposal had basically unanimous support
 
@chris isn't "no one supports this" unanimous support (against)?
 
@thecoshman No, I'm not assistant of those tasks. I'm the real thing.
 
2:07 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes proxy
 
:lol: that flag
 
Missed it.
 
@thecoshman Fair point. The context was positive, though.
 
in Sandbox, 6 mins ago, by zigi
@Jhawins if you talk to mod and they ban me, I will go to UN and tell them about this 1% discrimination you are applying to me as a citizen of EU!
 
I've declined it :E
 
2:08 PM
@chris After dynarray nothing should surprise us as getting through Committee.
 
Oh. That zigi guy gets kicked out of everywhere.
 
@CatPlusPlus no; this scheme sits on top of serial numbers and is used for other kinds of devices that have other serial number formats, or even no serial number at all (e.g. MAC or IPv4 used instead)
 
@Puppy Luckily we have national bodies as some kind of safety net.
 
@CatPlusPlus the 10000 prefix "selects" the decoding method to use
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Didn't realize they were any saner than Committee.
 
2:10 PM
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Yeah, but why
It looks like an URL
 
@Puppy Reminds me of Herb's "Making return explicit" proposal.
 
@Puppy dynarray <3
 
> This proposal was relatively controversial; it passed with a weak consensus in EWG, and was also discussed in the Library Evolution Working Group (LEWG), where there was no consensus for it. I was surprised that EWG passed this to CWG, given the state of the consensus; in fact, CWG indicated that they would like additional discussion of it in a forum that includes both EWG and LEWG members, before looking at it in CWG.
 
?device_id=<serial>&id_type=serial
 
@Puppy They blocked dynarray, didn't they?
 
2:11 PM
eventually, they decided to move it to TS.
 
Just seems needlessly overcomplicated
 
@Puppy Well, it's something :S
 
but I was in LWG in Bristol when it was discussed and I was the only one who voted against.
 
Well, it's completely stalled now.
 
@CatPlusPlus in this example it is a GET parameter, yes
I was trying to show it used in context
 
2:12 PM
@chris Dynarray or "Making return explicit"?
 
@CatPlusPlus opposed to ?device_id=<otherFromat>&id_type=otherFormat o_0 odd... very odd...
 
> ARBs themselves are ready, but we don’t want them without a library wrapper, and no proposal for a library wrapper (or mechanism that would enable one to be written) has consensus.
@Puppy Dynarray (the TS in general)
 
@CatPlusPlus not when the device ID is also a primary key in the DB
 
@Puppy which of course meant you looked like a nut case :P
 
@chris What's an ARB?
 
2:12 PM
a lot easier to just encode it as a 128-bit number, once (upon device discovery) then only handle a single number for the rest of time
 
You can have a complex primary key
 
I know but I don't want to
this is easier
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Array of runtime bound
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes bit like an ARM
 
2:13 PM
one ID, one field, one value
 
Looks like they still want VLAs and some library wrapper.
 
Just need a better proposal before they jump on it
 
the web usage is tangential - it's used for non-web in far more places; mainly as associative container key in performance code, where a single 128-bit number is more wieldy than a pair
 
@CatPlusPlus I guess if all you have is a string, you can't really encode that in it... unless you use a prefix of some sorts...
 
2:13 PM
If I had things that need a ID scheme I'd probably just generate UUIDs for them
Anyway I wouldn't worry about nerds who can decode it
 
When is this Urbana meeting taking place?
 
Laugh at them for wasting time on that
 
@CatPlusPlus GUIDs > UUIDs
 
@CatPlusPlus the IDs also need to be persistent and deterministic though, so they correlate on upstream systems even after a total rebuild of my product :)
 
@thecoshman Same thing
 
2:14 PM
@chris :S I still think whatever goes down that road is crap.
 
@CatPlusPlus :P
can't fool you can I
 
@CatPlusPlus target market is engineers
 
@chris I wouldn't be terribly annoyed with something like gist.github.com/rmartinho/5405354
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes It's kind of convenient having int arr[foo]; over std::vector<int> arr(foo);, but really unnecessary.
 
"It's kind of convenient" is the road to tons of syntax and no new functionality.
 
2:16 PM
... vector?
@R.MartinhoFernandes tons? that makes no sense
 
Or insert DMA complaint.
 
@thecoshman Don't you.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes did you mean tons, tons or tons?
 
@chris No, no it is not.
 
"Too much typing" always was and always will be a dumb argument
If VLAs were just a syntax sugar for vectors, then maybe, but it's an entirely new thing handled in its own way
For really no reason
 
2:18 PM
@CatPlusPlus Yeah, that's a good point.
 
what's wrong with vectors again? too convenient?
 
@thecoshman Free store
 
@chris Suck on custom allocators.
 
And I guess extra functionality if you don't want to change the size later.
 
I still don't know who's the target of that
 
2:20 PM
@Puppy Good point.
 
All badlets that whine about allocations have had their own vectors for years
 
user1804599
Don't complain about lack of conciseness when you use C++.
 
user1804599
@Jefffrey Thanks, Captain Obvious!
 
@chris that's a problem with vectors? go on...
@rightfold to be fair, for the most part it is fairly concise
 
@thecoshman It's just dynamic memory allocation in general when on a platform where it matters, but I doubt std::vector is used there anyway.
 
2:23 PM
@rightfold HTH
 
@chris but your problem is wanting dynamically resized arrays, how does vector not fulfill that?
 
@rightfold that's part of the problem, flask has SO MANY EXTENSIONS... it's both awesome and confusing
 
@thecoshman Not resized, just sized. I haven't really expressed a desire for them, either.
 
hello
 
@chris Custom memory allocators can provide very close to static allocation level performance.
 
2:24 PM
may i request some help?
 
of course, the dynarray paper didn't even consider them when whining about perf.
no.
 
i am trying to use boost/heap
 
Anyway, are we complaining about syntactic sugar or just nicer syntax that actually takes up considerable time that could be spent elsewhere?
 
Jul 10 at 0:19, by Cat Plus Plus
Hi. Rules. Read 'em. Obey 'em.
 
and i got linker errors
 
2:25 PM
@chris Yeah, so some array_ref thingy with pointers to the stack works just fine.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Yeah, it looks much better.
 
@chris Both. Also, the semantics of dynarray are truly terrible.
 
210
Q: What is an undefined reference/unresolved external symbol error and how do I fix it?

Luchian GrigoreWhat are undefined reference/unresolved external symbol errors? What are common causes and how to fix them? Feel free to edit/add your own.

 
thanks i'll check that
 
@chris and vector fails in that how?
 
user1804599
2:26 PM
w
 
@thecoshman It can't alloca.
 
u
 
user1804599
@Crow Flask is terrible.
 
@Crow everything is a singleton in flask
 
2:27 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes so have you moved onto actual reasons now that I should stop blindly fighting and actually learn about?
 
or maybe just the core IDR
 
@Jefffrey everything in flask can have just one value?
 
however, I did link boost/graph without problems. Could boost/heap be c++11 only?
 
@Jefffrey what's wrong with flask?
 
thanks if you have any idea
 
2:28 PM
we don't
 
@Jefffrey What
 
user1804599
It confuses routing with request handling for no reason other than ERMAHGERD SINATRA.
 
Microframeworks are meh in general
 
Esp ones inspired by Ruby badness
 
2:29 PM
@SilouaneGerin I don't think there's any Boost library that is C++11 only.
 
user1804599
WebOb ftw.
 
If anything, Boost has too little C++11.
 
@CatPlusPlus Macroframeworks are MEH in general
 
@Jefffrey That's not a singleton
 
user1804599
Urgh Application Context.
 
2:30 PM
dunno I liked Flask
 
user1804599
Because parameters are too difficult.
 
what's a better option than flask then? I think it's pretty easy
 
but I'd like to try Yesod/Happstack/Scotty
@Crow Scotty.
 
@rightfold oh ok. thanks
 
user1804599
Happstack FTW.
 
2:30 PM
@BartekBanachewicz scotty is so low level, it's not even cookie aware
 
i meant that for @R.MartinhoFernandes
 
Haskell... I can't into haskell, it would be a disaster
 
user1804599
Cookies are low-level.
 
user1804599
@Crow Why?
 
@rightfold yeah, scotty is lower
 
2:31 PM
@Crow then learn it?
@rightfold so you recommend that?
 
Haskell web frameworks are extremely meh
 
user1804599
@BartekBanachewicz Given that decent template engines are basically nonexistent in Haskell, I recommend not doing web development in it at all.
 
For my game.
I don't need a templating engine for it too much really.
 
user1804599
You only need a WebSocket library for that.
 
Apr 11 at 16:35, by rightfold
I never got further than the first few chapters of http://www.happstack.com/docs/crashcourse/index.html.
 
2:32 PM
Sure you do
 
most of the game will be rendered on canvas vOv
the client can well cope with the UI just from statics
 
user1804599
You don't use Happstack client-side.
 
I use Mako in Python and it's just fine
 
user1804599
It would be incredibly pointless to do such a thing.
 
So I don't need a web framework at all
 
user1804599
2:34 PM
1 min ago, by rightfold
You only need a WebSocket library for that.
 
I just never liked syntax like :: Num t => (t, [Char]). I guess I should probably learn it though...
 
@CatPlusPlus I've yet to find a web framework that isn't 'meh'
 
user1804599
Web frameworks all suck because they violate SRP by definition.
 
PHP
it's not meh because it's "OH MY GOD MY EYES".
 
@rightfold :cripes:
 
2:35 PM
@Crow what's wrong with that syntax
besides the fact that syntax is meaningless
@thecoshman I kinda like Django
 
@BartekBanachewicz it's not
 
well lisp syntax is the only syntax that's annoying
 
it's a pair of a num and a string
 
user1804599
@BartekBanachewicz Uh no.
 
C++ syntax is annoying
 
user1804599
2:36 PM
You should try PHP.
 
Yeah\Try\PHP
 
user1804599
$foo[42]() is a syntax error.
 
user1804599
$foo()() is a syntax error.
 
user1804599
(function(){})() is a syntax error.
 
PHP is parsed with REGEXes
 
2:37 PM
I have tried PHP
 
user1804599
PHP generates byte code directly from its parser. :P
 
I know I won't ever work with it ever in my life.
 
user1804599
There's no AST.
 
only a sith deals in absolutes
 
@CatPlusPlus I don't want a typical website though.
Well, in this case more languages might make sense, don't you think?
 
user1804599
2:38 PM
You only need a WebSocket server library.
 
Like Blizzard Armory, for example.
 
user1804599
You can serve the front end with a CDN or Nginx.
 
A python web framework serving stats from SQL
and a game server in haskell responsible for game
working on the same database in totally different ways
 
omg use JS already
 
2:39 PM
@BartekBanachewicz nothing really, just like more... English syntaxes I guess. special characters always bother me, like brackets or colons. Not sure why
 
@Jefffrey ha ha ha ha nope.
 
Why are you so dead-on on having multiple codebases to maintain
 
boredom
 
It is the most annoying thing ever
 
perpetual sleepiness
 
2:40 PM
@rightfold is Angluar.js nice?
 
actually. This haskell demo is pretty nice...
 
Zero reported animations bugs.
I'll start a timer.
 
@CatPlusPlus Because I believe in right tools for the job. And two smaller codebases are easier to maintain that one large one, I think.
 
2:42 PM
No?
I thought smaller, separate components are what we're after in architecture
 
yes, but they also need to mesh together well to create larger wholes.
 
Smaller, separate components, plus tons of impenetrable glue.
 
that typically doesn't work so well if you pick two random general-purpose languages.
 
Unless it's JVM or CLR or something like that, it doesn't apply
You'll end up not being able to reuse a lot of common code
 
hell, even maintaining a C++/Lua codebase is fucking annoying.
 
2:43 PM
Lotsa fun following the debugger across boundaries.
 
user3010322
Not with sol.~
 
Missing the point, I think.
 
~
 
user3010322
Mixed-mode debugging is a nice thing, though.
 
user3010322
IIRC Iron Python actually had mixed-mode C/Python debugging built in for its IDEs.
 
2:44 PM
Something like C# + F# for some EDSLey bits might work
 
user1804599
@JohanLarsson Only if you don't have to do anything with other libraries at all.
 
user1804599
Otherwise it's annoying as fuck.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes the only glue is the shared database schema
 
user1804599
@CatPlusPlus Everything runs on V8!
 
@CatPlusPlus because in this case no code would be reused
 
2:46 PM
@BartekBanachewicz And now every schema change needs to be done in two codebases
Good job
 
user1804599
How often I wished to share logic and data structures between PHP and JS with a single code base.
 
@BartekBanachewicz Because it's impossible. You'd be surprised how many bits could be reused in a coherent stack
 
user1804599
@CatPlusPlus schema changes don't exist.
 
user1804599
Jul 29 '12 at 16:30, by Cat Plus Plus
@RadekSlupik If you change your schema, you're doing it wrong.
 
2:47 PM
maybe you're right again
@rightfold ha, that's interesting
 
user1804599
No matter how much a client may change their mind.
 
user1804599
You will never have to change your schema.
 
Don't quote me from 2 years ago
4
 
Also you were using MongoDB :lol:
 
2:48 PM
I want to do this in old turbo c compiler where I don't have std namespace. — Aditya Arora 40 secs ago
 
user1804599
MongoDB is fun.
 
Why on bloody earth would you choose to use Turbo?
 
Just make every table have field1, field2, field3 without names, and then if you need more fields you just use a triply escaped control character to split fields in one field...
 
user1804599
Just have on table with hstores.
 
PostgreSQL with JSON fields is a better NoSQL database than MongoDB
 
user1804599
2:49 PM
ACID. :3
 
hmm
 
@CatPlusPlus hahaha
 
we're thinking of using mongo
 
@CatPlusPlus BTW my game is decided on Postgres if that makes you feel better about that project
 
@SamDeHaan You mean an even crappier form of EAV?
 
2:52 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes Nothing's impossible!
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes An improved EAV, obviously.
 
> The girl on the picture has no connection to me (it was randomly selected).

This is just a test to see how many people will access my profile. On the 20-th of July before posting this picture there were 100 who checked my profile in 1 year and 2 month although I had only been active for the just past two weeks.

Please do not be disappointed with this test, rather upvote my answers if you like the joke :-).
 
Why do students love functional programming? Because there are no assignments! #LoungeCpp
lol
 
I know this guy
 
user1804599
> upvote my answers if you like the joke
 
2:58 PM
@rlemon seems the bot doesn't like letting other robots in the room.
 
@BartekBanachewicz yeah, me too, sadly
 
in JavaScript :: typeof NaN, 17 secs ago, by rlemon
@BartekBanachewicz I'm working on it
 
Did they forget that you can just use room settings
 
the voice especially
 
I should record something new for soundcloud
oh I've posted something privately and I forgot about it
 
3:05 PM
God, bank generated two emails for the same CC charge
Almost panic mode
 
user3010322
Trollbank is troll.
 
PayPal withdrawal took shorter than I expected
 
bah
my phone is broken and replacing it will be nearly my entire monthly income.
 
user3010322
@CatPlusPlus Did they force you to reenter all your information? :P
 
How do I initialize an atomic aggregate struct? struct S{ int x; int y; }; atomic<S> asd{{1, 2}}; doesn't work
 
3:08 PM
@ThePhD No
 
how do I ask a question on SO?
by pushing the big "ASK" button.
how do people keep getting this wrong
 
kfine.
 
@Puppy it's actually surprisingly easy
 
this seemed easier at the moment.
 
@Puppy see, sarcasm does work
@Dave it's also much more annoying for us to have to put up with all the time
 
3:09 PM
@Dave Not for us.
 
Maybe we should try the bot approach, too
 
@Puppy you have an income?
 
@CatPlusPlus this was discussed, we said no bot
@BartekBanachewicz he's a sponge
 
considered but as near as I can tell nobody can be bothered to actually create the bot.
 
@CatPlusPlus we could but LoungeBot would end up the same as LoungeChat
 
3:10 PM
Or maybe just global ignoring userscript
 
@Puppy no, it was decided that we didn't want to have a 'closed' room
 
@BartekBanachewicz Officially, I receive £58 a week (give or take) for my surgical recovery period, and then an essentially identical amount for jobhunting
@thecoshman Using a bot and closing the room are two different things.
 
Actually might work on that
 
the bot is a blacklist, closing the room is a whitelist.
modulo bugs, of course.
 
Stupid workarounds
 
3:11 PM
oh, well using a bot that can auto bin certain people... could work...
 
if you have a bot then the bot only ever enters the equation when we choose to use it against people.
if you close the room everybody has to dick around giving permission all the time.
 
@Puppy well, I thought we had the talk of using a bot like a JS room. The room would be 'closed' but a bot would auto add everyone who calm along, but you could then re-ban them.
 
@BartekBanachewicz Gonna see if I can look into some of that google helpout/codementoring stuff to drum up some extra cash, but God knows how well that's gonna work out.
@thecoshman Afaik, the LoungeBot was intended to just auto bin people that we blacklist and that's it.
 
@Puppy afaik (strictly speaking) any earnings mean no doll
 
@Puppy any real progress in that area so far?
 
3:13 PM
@thecoshman There's a limit, it's non-zero.
 
@Puppy yeah, so not the same as the jsmodel.
@Puppy for real?
 
yes.
it would be dumb for them to stop paying you £58 a week if you earned £10 mowing someone's lawn.
 
it's not a hard cut off though is it?
 
I don't remember what the limit is, exactly.
 
@Puppy yeah, but strictly speaking, you should be declaring that £10 a week income, but who does that :P
 
3:14 PM
@BartekBanachewicz Well, I fixed the problems of a) not having a webcam and therefore not being able to offer the service, and b), having terribly unreliable internets by buying a new adapter.
and I also have an invite to Google Helpouts now
@thecoshman Well, personally, I intend on declaring every penny. I don't know what the cut-off is but I doubt it's very high.
 
@Puppy nice!
 
@BartekBanachewicz Only leaves me with c), swamp internets are terribly slow, d), my father also works from home online so if I use all the bandwidth he can't work, and e), does anybody actually spend money on this stuff anyway.
 
e) Yes
 
OTOH
he only works from home a couple days a week during the day, so I could squeeze stuff in in the evening or weekends.
 
@Puppy well good for you
 
3:17 PM
ternaries are kinda weird
 
@thecoshman Honestly, the jobseeker's income is so low that I really wouldn't need to make much. I could charge a relative pittance, like two quid an hour or something, and earn more. So the prospect of them not paying me anymore really doesn't bother me.
 
@Puppy go for it then
and it's like up to like £3k5 you can earn before you start paying income tax right?
 
That's not how you do scientific notation
 
@CatPlusPlus I didn't say it was
 
@Puppy When I read this "Well, I fixed the problems of a) not having a webcam and therefore not being able to offer the service" I thought "I hope pups isn't considering becoming a camgirl".
Is that good or bad?
 
3:21 PM
Well then it just doesn't make sense :v
 
also, @Puppy perhaps?
@CatPlusPlus electronics uses that notation
 
They're dumb then
 
@MartinJames you've seen '10k1 ohm' notation, right?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Hilarious.
@thecoshman 10k a year now.
@MartinJames fed bailey?
 
@CatPlusPlus I actually prefer it to 10.1k. Having the magnitude right after the integral part seems like a good idea.
 
3:25 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes less typing too :P
 
It also matches an informal way of speaking that I've heard at least in Portuguese: "That's three volts three. (3V3)"
 
@CatPlusPlus it's clearly better, it's only used with three digits of resolution too btw
@Puppy really? zero income tax up to 10k :O
@R.MartinhoFernandes I wouldn't say 'ten k one' though
 
9()
 
Hmm, found two step-up converters on ebay at 1.99 with zero bids, ending in 14 hours.
@CatPlusPlus No, that's wrong.
The k replaces the decimal point.
 
3:28 PM
It is very wrong
It doesn't make sense
 
it's naughty
 
Correct, assuming you ignore all the ways in which it makes sense.
 
It's ugh
 
@Puppy e) yes
 
@sehe He's totally doing it wrong; you don't tell people...
 
user1804599
 
user1804599
Thinking, I was.
 
@thecoshman It was a Lib Dem flagship policy (that they didn't trade off).
 
@Puppy oh, well that's a thing alright
 
they wanted loads of tax relief for the lower-paid, especially after Labour cut the 10p rate.
and they got it.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes well, it's ok if he means 2140
 
3:56 PM
the income tax threshold went up a whole bunch.
 
@CatPlusPlus yes it does, take the three most significant digits, and use the most sensible magnitude.
and fairly sure you prefer the smaller magnitude, so use '666M' over 'G666'
 

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