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2:00 PM
So, the course have a few automated tests where the students are required to supply their implementations of various things (such as a std::vector clone, but not as advanced). The deadline for the "bonus" points (resulting in a higher grade) is in about 30 hours, and I now realized that the tests are a bit.. incomplete
it doesn't fail students who do stupid things such as having a single T& operator[](std::size_t) const, instead of one const, and one non-const
when updating the automatic tests, we can choose to either resubmit every previously accepted one, or just simply leave them as accepted.
The students really should know that two overloads of operator[] shall be present, but I'm not sure if we should just fail them this close to the deadline
 
@FilipRoséen-refp Er, is that a problem?
 
instead I'm thinking that they, during the oral presentation of their code, will resubmit their implementation and if the automatic test fails then, they will have to explain why it complains, and why they shouldn't have implemented it as they had in the first place
 
On the level of ethics, anything goes, as long as the terms are fair and were clearly agreed upon by the students. (I'd say, once you hand them their grade you cannot change their test outcome)
 
Or better, do you think it's useful to try and detect all such things?
 
@FilipRoséen-refp It might be nice to break up the assignment into different steps next time. I've seen test-driven online code challenge that work that way. They are awesome.
 
2:03 PM
@sehe the grade is weeks away, but it's the bonus thing that worries me, it is basically; "if you have gotten an accepted test on the automatic-test-service, you are entitled to the bonus points"
or well; more specifically, "if you have a sane implementation, and it is accepted by the automatic-test-service"
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes this confuses me, you mean the false positives and errors or the errors when assigning grades to the students?
 
@FilipRoséen-refp or if your hack works :)
 
where focus is on "sane implementation", they can still miss the bonus point if they implement the std::vector as a linked-list, as an example
 
@MarcoA. I mean basically trying to do code reviews with such a system.
 
@FilipRoséen-refp Yup. You already answered your question. That was the deal, then that's the deal. If you warned them that the tests are only conclusive from a certain date, then you might have some leeway
 
2:05 PM
@sehe it's more of the continued message, the "if you have a sane implementation, and it is accepted by the automatic-test-service"
so I'm a bit.. well, I'm not sure how to handle it
 
I don't see what's complicated. "if you have a sane implementation, and it is accepted by the automatic-test-service" is pretty conclusive.
 
a lot of students are doing weird things, such as doing delete [] _data_ptr; _data_ptr = new T[_capacity] (); _size = 0; when implementing vec.clear ()
@sehe conclusive in what way, that we can automatically resubmit the approved tests?
 
(I personally feel that it's not fair to expect students to hand in their solution in 30 hours for bonus points, if the assistent is allowed to spend more than that amount of time tinkering with the tests, so that it might still not pass.)
 
@sehe because having a single operator[] instead of a const and non-const, as well as a single begin/end/etc in my book isn't sane, and doing the delete-reallocate dance in clear() isn't exactly sane.. either
 
@FilipRoséen-refp You can, but they had submitted a sane implementation and it has been accepted (by a prior automated test, but still).
 
2:07 PM
@sehe I'm more of a course leader, than an assistent
 
meh. you don't tell, we have to guess. please ignore my use of the word assistant
 
@sehe was it a sane implementation, just because it passed the test? I mean, the test doesn't check if they just wrap std::vector, or use a linked-list internally; which would lead to -bonus on the oral presentation
 
@sehe *assistant might be better
 
4 mins ago, by R. Martinho Fernandes
@MarcoA. I mean basically trying to do code reviews with such a system.
 
@FilipRoséen-refp It adds a lot of value to have a more complete test, and it makes a lot of sense to provide them with the feedback. But you cannot deny them their cookie after they earned it, by your own logic:
10 mins ago, by Filip Roséen - refp
@sehe now, where the heck is my cookie?
 
2:10 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes it would save the assistants doing the oral presentations a lot of time if kattis (the automated test-thingie) would just spit out a "this is not sane"-message, instead of they having to manually read through the code
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I have no experience of code reviews with such systems, we used to do that "manually". If you have I'd gladly hear how that performed. I suppose pretty well
 
@sehe they will however not get the cookie just because the test was previously accepted, unless they can explain why their implementation is not sane (on a good enough level that it's possible to "let it slip")
 
You can't automate code reviews
You can automate testing the code
 
@FilipRoséen-refp They have to argue why their implementation is not sane?!
 
But not the review
 
2:11 PM
@MarcoA. I mean that you can't automate code reviews and I just find the whole effort silly.
 
@sehe during the oral presentation? yes. why is that a problem?
@R.MartinhoFernandes you can automate parts of it, this is the way we specify tests: codepad.org/Enlqf7qr
 
7 mins ago, by sehe
@FilipRoséen-refp Yup. You already answered your question. That was the deal, then that's the deal. If you warned them that the tests are only conclusive from a certain date, then you might have some leeway
^ again, it's about what you agreed when you gave the assignment. You can't change the rules during play. You'll just have to work with the bonus earned, and deduct more points for any inacceptible insanities
 
their implementing template<class T> Vector which is, in many aspects, a clone of template<class T> std::vector
 
That's not a review
That's just unit tests
 
@FilipRoséen-refp I don't get it. I assumed the goal was for them to come up with a sane implementation. Why should they have to argue the opposite?
 
@sehe if they previously submitted an implementation that got accepted, but with the new test fails I expect the students to be able to show why they failed the test, and why such test was put in place.
 
@FilipRoséen-refp Ah. Now I get it. You meant "what was wrong about their solution" rather than "why their implementation is not sane".
 
@sehe it's one of the alternatives: 1) leave the test alone 2) update test, resubmit everything accepted 3) update test, leave accepted as accepted, and resubmit during oral presentation to see if there's anything worrying in their implementation
@sehe in my book those two go hand in hand, but yeah
@R.MartinhoFernandes of course such things cannot be caught, be we can catch other more obvious and "more trivial to catch" faults automatically
 
@FilipRoséen-refp Why asks for a reason. There can't really be a good reason if the goal was "make a sane implementation" (by and large)
 
the test-thingie I pasted does some magic, and creates an interpreter that can read input files where we may specify in what order we run the different instructions and with what arguments etc etc
 
2:16 PM
@FilipRoséen-refp 3) resubmit during oral is very nice; you'll catch any plagiators that way too.
 
@FilipRoséen-refp This was not related. Don't mind me.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes oh, I thought it was (because such uses of casts are also enough to fail some of a students work, because they should know about the casts in c++); nevermind me then
@sehe we have a "if a student can reason about a problem, and come up with a solution, during the oral presentation, one may still pass"-policy
 
It's just some annoyingly silly thing I found.
Such context-sensitive semantics are just unacceptable :<
 
@FilipRoséen-refp actually, with the "we upped the tests" approach it seems they might still flunk it even though they did initially satisfy the test
 
@sehe yes, and they might flunk during the oral presentation, the automatic testing is not everything
... and the automatic test will not fail an implementation, that shouldn't have "failed" (or been asked about) during the oral presentation
 
2:22 PM
seeing this discussion makes me feel good because our professors take it easy
 
it's just a first step on getting there; one needs a PASS to be able to schedule an oral presentation
 
I'd probably abandon college otherwise
 
Unit tests still not reviews
 
@CatPlusPlus sure, unit tests, but when have I ever written "review"? I've consistently been using "automatic testing" (or variations on such).
 
@AlexM. Doing things with well-defined test cases is actually easier, provided that you can debug your code when it fails (so none of that online judge shit nonsense)
@FilipRoséen-refp Somewhere above :v
 
2:23 PM
@FilipRoséen-refp Can't catch things like wrapping vector without a review.
 
@CatPlusPlus I haven't, as far as I can remember; so I'm not sure where you got it from (that's why I ignored your message the first time around)
 
@CatPlusPlus take it easy as in
"eh, it works? ok you're good. next."
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes exactly, but we can catch having a single T& operator[](std::size_t) const, instead of two
 
I'm able to pass with minimal effort that way
 
Maybe it was Robot vOv
 
2:24 PM
@AlexM. ... and with minimal knowledge
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Do you think it would not be useful?
 
@FilipRoséen-refp hey, if knowledge is your goal, that's fair
 
I would not survive uni bullshit if I couldn't cheese with minimum effort
 
I prefer to learn things when they're needed and concentrate more on, you know, outputting programs
 
@AndyProwl I've mentioned why I think scopeguardists are all nuts before. Lemme see if I can find a succinct version.
 
2:25 PM
that are used by people
 
@FilipRoséen-refp so it's just about handing in /something/ early. I'd keep that bonus, unless it never satisfied even the tests at that time
 
@sehe I'm counting on you know; help me come to a conclusion! (in the end is not entirely up to me, the "real" course leader is the one who can make a definite decision)
 
Mar 4 at 18:07, by R. Martinho Fernandes
@StackedCrooked Robot's Law of Scope Guards: Everything that can be abused as a scope guard will be. Scope guards not exempt.
 
an answer, woho!
 
2:27 PM
QA scares me
 
@sehe oh snap, you are right; we even have a "if you have an accepted solution prior to the deadline, you are free to make more submissions afterwards, and use them during the oral presentation"-policy (we might still take a look at the previous implementation though)
 
I told people the tests done by QA were fine, then QA sent an email speaking about a bug that I already said it was unrelated to the things we were testing
quickly replied so people don't think I'm full of shit
 
@FilipRoséen-refp I was rearranging my server cabinet. So I lost connection
 
I completely forgot about that one, so it's settled; "update test without resubmits, and resubmit during oral presentation if necessary".. wicked!
 
QA guy was like "yeah I know it's unrelated, it was just FYI"
 
2:28 PM
what the heck is QA an abbreviation for?
 
quality assurance
it's a pretty common abbreviation
 
Xeo
@AlexM. they should!
 
@AlexM. Oh I love that. Like when QA insist to keep reopening the same bug, even though it's clearly another issue, just because "it's on the same screen"
 
QA exists to make the product better and your life miserable because you're a bad programmer
 
Quality Assurance (QA) is a way of preventing mistakes or defects in manufactured products and avoiding problems when delivering solutions or services to customers. QA is applied to physical products in pre-production to verify what will be made meets specifications and requirements, and during manufacturing production runs by validating lot samples meet specified quality controls. QA is also applied to software to verify that features and functionality meet business objectives, and that code is relatively bug free prior to shipping or releasing new software products and versions. Quality Assurance...
@Xeo yes but not in that way
I mean in the "yeah I know the bug is unrelated, I just sent the email FYI" way
what the hell does that even mean
 
It means they cared about telling you about the bug more than about the process
 
@AlexM. I knew what I was without the wikipedia page, but thanks anyhow
I just didn't connect QA to Quality Assurance in my head, probably because I'm tired
 
I'll take your word for it
 
Wait. This can't be
sehe@bbs2:/bulk$ sudo zfs list
[sudo] password for sehe:
no datasets available
 
@CatPlusPlus no no, the bug was already discussed between me and them
the email was really just "we encountered this unrelated bug during testing. just mentioning it I guess."
it's an issue because there were others in /cc, people whom I told that testing went ok
and without my intervention, it would have looked like I lied
 
2:32 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes I don't think it's just about scopeguard
You can define your own specific Transaction class that would benefit from that logic
@R.MartinhoFernandes (thanks, I'll look into that)
 
@AndyProwl I find it very distressing that ScopeGuard is presented as a major motivating example (sic!) :(
 
I understand that part, yes
 
46
A: Does ScopeGuard use really lead to better code?

Konrad RudolphIt definitely improves your code. Your tentatively formulated claim, that it's obscure and that code would merit from a catch block is simply not true in C++ because RAII is an established idiom. Resource handling in C++ is done by resource acquisition and garbage collection is done by implicit d...

Shame on @Konrad!
 
now I'm bored, and my feet are mad wet
those two probably have nothing to do with each other.. but it was raining this morning, and I got big holes in my shoes; my feet been soaked ever since (and now they smell funny)
 
@FilipRoséen-refp sandalous!
 
2:38 PM
waiting for the "real" course leader to reply with his verdict regarding the test-updates, and since my charger got stolen when I forgot it in the room of fridays lectures; I can't work from home (all I have is a macbook, and a blackberry)
so now I'm stuck at campus, just.. waiting for a "push it to X|Y|Z"
@sehe entertain me.
 
 
my, sehe, did you dye your hair?
uh, fur
 
@sehe how about, please?
 
That's spelled "pls", fyi
 
@sehe nhaa, plz is the only way
preferably "p'lz'"
 
2:42 PM
2 hours ago, by Susan Sweedyk
pls
Cool name. Aw. Just noticed she (?) is "a 15 year old programmer."
Had I noticed earlier, I might have explained
 
lol
 
@sehe bot warning!
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I don't think scopeguard is bad a priori. In a sense it has benefits similar to those of lambdas when used with standard algorithms: sometimes it makes code simpler if you can inline occasional logic. Of course this doesn't mean that one should not refactor those things into a class with a good name once the same logic happens to be replicated, and probably I wouldn't argue scopeguard is a "major" use case for unwinding_exception, but as a tool it doesn't seem so bad to me
 
@sehe I actually noticed that
I even noticed she asked for help in the C room too
and people there helped
 
2:44 PM
You perv
 
which is why I told her to concentrate on the C room instead
 
@AlexM. I noticed that you noticed that.
 
@AlexM. you "noticed"? just confess to stalking young girls on stackoverflow, I know that's what you really mean.
 
@sehe that's...
I was going to say sexist but it's not
 
It's an observation :) Some suggestion, season to taste...
 
2:45 PM
@AlexM. pervist.
 
in my defense, I check the profile of pretty much any user I find here, and follow links from there
 
I should have known. ^ gravatars from facebook are not showing on my end
 
nope
uh I mean, younger programmers
 
You didn't just say that, did you?
 
2:46 PM
@AndyProwl While I don't like scope_guard much, it does have the advantage (in this case) of being roughly the minimum code that demonstrates the problem.
 
@sehe I don't want gravatars showing on my end.
..either end.
 
and no, it's not stalking, it's...
finding out more info about the people I talk with (?)
 
@AlexM. "it's not stalking if it's on the web, then it's just making good use of the HTTP-protocol"?
 
@JerryCoffin Yeah, but that's different from being a major motivating example (again, sic!). It's fine to present useless code for demoing, but it's not fine to do so for motivation.
 
well no, it's not stalking because I just open up links from user profiles
so if you put your website on your profile and I end up on it...
sorry for clicking on the link I guess
 
2:48 PM
@AlexM. what's the depth limit, will you follow links from the links you follow?
 
I usually end it where I see some sort of things said people worked on
 
@AndyProwl My biggest issue is that it has incredibly rare true use cases, and so people should just stop advertising it as great and awesome.
 
if it's more than N (where N is a number decided by @sehe), it's stalking.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Yeah, I have no problem with that.
 
so usually their websites
 
2:49 PM
I don't have any links on my profile, not sure if that's a good or bad thing
 
@FilipRoséen-refp shut up
 
anyhow; I'm off for a smoke, I guess
@sehe I thought you'd like setting such N
 
This is not an answer, the code in your question had no such issue, and your types were all deduced by auto. The problem you asked about was your [Undefined Behaviour]() ("makes tmp to handle deleted data") which I explained in my answer. If you fix unrelated things after fixing that, well, that's unrelated. — sehe 1 min ago
^ ffs - didn't even get an upvote. OP even downvoted another answer by the developer of Boost MultiIndex. Go figure.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I agree it's over-advertised
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I think it was used a lot more early on, when people were trying to "graft" RAII onto existing code bases with lots of blocks something like: { do(x); process(); undo(x); }, and scope_guard was an easy way of making the undo part happen even if process threw.
 
2:52 PM
aha. kinda obvious, now that I managed to get through stupid facebook CDN (disabling https)
 
I'm off for a smoke, I guess; and I need some coffee. AFK
 
@sehe That's Susan
Why are you posting a photo of a 15 year old in chat?
/me scrolls up
 
/me was about to suggest as much
 
/me figured
That's the girl whose FB friend request I decided I was probably better off not accepting
6
 
Do you know her from somewhere other than SO?
@LightnessRacesinOrbit lol
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Brilliant
 
2:57 PM
You can pretty much go to jail for that nowadays, I hear
 
For what?
 
Coming within 900 miles of a minor, or talking to them on the internet.
 
Pfft
 
user1804599
You can go to jail for seeing minors.
 
Don't worry, though; if Abyx's right, in a hundred years or so you'll be able to screw them up the arse without ramifications.
 
2:59 PM
I'll stick my neck out: I think her avatar is cute.
 
user1804599
 
-e+ia
+a
now it's even wronger
sehe is not the jailbait in this scenario
 
user1804599
Is her avatar a carpet?
 
user1804599
Because I love cute carpets.
 
@sehe dammit, and with only seconds to spare until you could never edit or delete that
 
3:01 PM
@rightføld you mentioned that /cc @Cicada
 
user1804599
When did I?
 
^^
 
user1804599
:c
 
user1804599
carpetrightfold
 
user1804599
folding the right carpets
 
3:02 PM
> > There's no oxygen for Qt5 yet.
> Then how does it breathe!!
 
user1804599
10
Q: Is it possible for life to evolve on planets without oxygen?

Vincent*By life, I mean something more complex than microorganisms. Something closer to what we have on Earth. similar to this question: Is it possible for life to evolve on planets without water? Is it possible for an atmosphere to sustain life without oxygen? Could life evolve with other gases?

 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Being on the same plane, too.
 
oh fuck markdown
 
@rubenvb For the Nth time: people of your preferred sex are a lot more fun.
 
@JerryCoffin lol that's an incredibly politically correct statement. I applaud you for that :-p
 
3:04 PM
@sehe This morning, in America and Asia IIRC
 
Your last name still gives me shudders though
 
@rubenvb When the name was invented, "coffin" apparently just meant a box (or similar). It was centuries later before the word was used specifically for boxes for dead people. I'm not sure exactly why, but I find that mildly comforting anyway.
 
@JerryCoffin Haha so at least I'm not the only one that thinks about these things. Cool trivium to know :-p
I hate latin usage in English
But there's no way around it
data, trivia, quota
 
that's not really Latin any more
they're loan words
 
all of them sound stupid in singular form in English
 
3:10 PM
scientists still say "datum" but that's because they're douches
 
because, well, then they sound posh
 
we do still medium vs media in the mainstream.
 
I say "datum" when I find the distinction relevant.
 
@rubenvb You missed your quota of erotic demonstrations.
 
and, going down the Greek angle, I had a fairly illiterate Maths friend who could not get this concept through his head no matter how many times we told him that the singular is "matrix", not "matrice" (MAY-triss-ee).
 
3:11 PM
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Some do. Others do "multimedia".
 
Of course, if "matrices" hadn't been uttered for a few days, then "matrix" would come out and I figure he reckoned it was just an entirely different word
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit It's clearly matrex, just like the singular of vertices is vertex.
 
matrii
 
3:17 PM
And for more examples: the singular of regices is regex, and the singular of mutices is mutex.
"matrix" makes no sense.
 
Ell
matrices
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit you know, I don't think that "increase length, girth and/or weight" program works on your member quite like it worked on chickens. Also, it looks like it still takes ~½ century
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit it's matrice in Romanian :D
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes perhaps you'd prefer the Old French version.
 
plural is matrici
 
3:21 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes -rix is the female singular nominative; beator/beatores, beatrix/beatrices; etc.
I'm quite sure that etymology doesn't apply well here, but still
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes or @CatPlusPlus can I get permissions to discus proposals please.
 
@sehe Actually, it does. Matrix originates from "mother" or "womb" -- clearly female.
 
Wait, you guys are taking me seriously?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Not me, I'm still sober.
 
I mean, I just said "regices" and "mutices".
 
3:23 PM
Mutii
@thecoshman yes
 
I hate muticees to pieces.
 
@CatPlusPlus thanks :)
 
languages should have a constant plural suffix
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Yes, you were barely short of being arrested for attempted regicide. OTOH, much of the best humor stems from taking silly statements literally.
 
matrix -> matrixP
 
3:26 PM
Just trapped myself again.
 
@AlexM. doesn't Esperanto have something like that?
 
Did SO actually have a lot of fake content in its early days?
So it could solve the chicken-and-egg problem?!
 
@rubenvb Esperanto has cases, so the best you can get is "something like that".
 
@rubenvb Actually, it has many things like that (and does a fine job of demonstrating that "a foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of small minds.")
 
@DemCodeLines *its
@JerryCoffin Are you Tony in disguise?
 
3:29 PM
@rubenvb yeah
 
@DemCodeLines define "fake". It certainly had a lot of content that wouldn't be allowed today.
 
Deftly illustrating the point, @kevinmitnick threatened my friend @freebsdgirl for standing up for seriouspony. http://t.co/6BEixAKASF
WUT
@R.MartinhoFernandes of course
@R.MartinhoFernandes I'm not taking you serious anymore
 
115
Q: What was "the Joel Data"?

Matt JohnsonAs mentioned in the answer to What is the first asked question on stackoverflow?, the first (now deleted) question is "Where, oh where, did the Joel Data go?" I'm sure that Joel refers to Joel Spolsky, but what was "the Joel Data"? I'm surprised this question hasn't been asked before. The answ...

Relevant.
@sehe I don't mean it physically.
 
@JerryCoffin Well something like Reddit did in its early days. Put a lot of content that actually wasn't very genuine or were actual questions that someone wondered and instead were more placeholders and fillers so the site could look busy and incoming traffic would use the site.
 
"My hardware doesn't support doubles how can I use doubles?"
 
3:32 PM
@Cicada Upgrade your hardware!
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit This topic sounds kinda familiar. Oh wait...
haha jk
 
@AggieHH @JamesMcNellis @LineP @many Alsoꜝ look﹗ atꜞ the richnessꜟ of #UNICODE߹ My favourite: ႟ #loveit❣
@R.MartinhoFernandes Oh. That's a first!
 
@DemCodeLines I don't know of any that was explicitly done just to make the site look busy--at the same time, the definition of "topical" has been tightened (repeatedly) over the years, so a lot was allowed then that certainly wouldn't be now.
 
> I still wish Qt were a C++ library or produced native looking UI :/ Billy O'Neal
Dat burn
 
@sehe IDGI. It does both of those things, no?
 
3:41 PM
Well, it does remind me more of Java. And it's so macro-infested that you could argue about it. And the "native looking" is OK by my standards, but clearly not for the gritty UI zealot. (Gimme my terminal, thank you)
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit It's not a C++, not a library - let's start from that :P
 
Oh yeah. Library vs. Framework. But, I'd be willing to skip that. I can use Qt Core as a lib if I want
 
@Griwes It is C++, and frameworks are basically libraries.
 
3 mins ago, by sehe
Dat burn
 
3:42 PM
Often, it means that there is some implicit judgement that's a little harsh
 
How is making a clearly incorrect statement a "burn"?
 
That's up to you, my dear friend.
 
Is he saying that Qt is too shit to be deemed a library, or breaks C++ idioms too much to be deemed C++, or produces too ugly UI to be considered native-looking?
 
Ell
@LightnessRacesinOrbit When you write java in c++, is it c++?
 
All those things are still false, and he's still talking about of his arse.
@Ell "when you write java in C++"???
 
3:43 PM
Next time I see someone making unfair / harsh judgement in a flippant way, I'll be sure to ask whether you agree that we can call this "burn".
 
Ell
you know. Like writing haskell in c++, or java in c#
 
@sehe I'm not saying you need my fucking permission. I'm asking you what is going on
 
Ell
When you write using java idioms in c++
or java idioms in c#
 
what are you on about
 
Ell
when you think in language A but the actual code is language B
 
3:45 PM
then you're writing language B, clearly, albeit non-idiomatically
 
Ell
@LightnessRacesinOrbit never mind :)
 
@sehe It's not, really.
 
like people writing C-like C++ code
 
Ell
@LightnessRacesinOrbit yeah, but people say you're writing A in B
 
Sep 11 at 16:28, by R. Martinho Fernandes
Help. I'm trapped in pictures of halos.
 
3:45 PM
@Ell and those people are wrong
 
Ell
@LightnessRacesinOrbit No you don't understand
it's an idiom
to say that
 
@Ell I don't understand why they choose to say things that are wrong, no
right, well, in that case
 
♫ Let it go ♪
 
2 mins ago, by Ell
@LightnessRacesinOrbit When you write java in c++, is it c++?
 
Ell
@LightnessRacesinOrbit it's an idiom in the english langauge in the field of computing
 
3:46 PM
1 min ago, by Lightness Races in Orbit
then you're writing language B, clearly, albeit non-idiomatically
is the Q and A
 
Ell
I assumed you knew the idiom
which is my bad
 
yeah, I do ;)
 
"Real Programmers can write Fortran in any language."
 
it's a disgraceful bastardisation which we should erase from all written material
 
Ell
@LightnessRacesinOrbit you're hard work sometimes :p
 
3:47 PM
@Ell "sometimes"?
 
Ell
Point in case :p
 
case in point*
 
Ell
coint in pase
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit ITT, "metaphor" is no longer a legitimate literary device.
 
don't worry about the vase
 
3:54 PM
 
@Bilal Caption correct, but depiction nonsense. Here's how it was really done: pdp8.net/pdp8i/pics/small/pdp8i_frontpanel.jpg. The row of switches on the bottom were set to 1 or 0, then one toward the right was toggled to enter that word (one word) into memory. Repeat as needed.
 
Ell
@JerryCoffin that's odd. Why are they divided into groups of 3 and not 4?
 

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