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8:01 PM
I like how the "on hold" SO update didn't change a bit of the way questions are closed/reopened (except for "Too localized").
 
user1804599
Did anyone ever use NASM as a library?
 
user1804599
@StackedCrooked I like it.
 
user1804599
It that anime good?
 
It's ok.
 
user1804599
8:04 PM
> 7.67/10
 
Very funny at times. But it can get a little boring as well.
@not-rightfold That's not a bad rating.
 
user1804599
@StackedCrooked Sounds like Haskell.
 
@StackedCrooked Do you spend most of your free time watching Anime?
 
The best anime of the moment is Attack on Titan. Followed by Hunter x Hunter.
@TonyTheLion Nearly all of it.
 
oh woah
 
8:06 PM
Apart from hobby projects. Like Coliru and stuff.
Occasionally I sleep as well.
 
It's a sign you need to sort out all the cables around your room when you hit the floor.
In other news, FUCK THAT HURT.
 
I hope you learned your lesson.
Did you fall flat on the floor?
 
@StackedCrooked Traitor!
@StackedCrooked Too many cables to break the fall
 
I feel bad about it.
 
@StackedCrooked My wrists broke my fall.
 
8:12 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes ...and what broke your wrists?
 
That sounds painful.
He wouldn't be typing if he did.
 
@JerryCoffin I'm not that heavy.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Thank goodness.
 
ohai Robot!
Been a while I've been online and you were here too
IIRC.
 
8:15 PM
oh I'll have to watch it
 
Xeo
According to a buddy, the anime has been increadibly boring and long-wided lately
Still waiting for the manga to update again :<
 
@TonyTheLion What news?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Not much. Been occupied with job and life in London and kind of not much been here much. How's your new job?
 
@Xeo Hell no. The anime is incredibly good.
The latest episodes have been extremely intense.
 
Xeo
I see
I've read the manga, so I wasn't watching the anime
not that I've actually watched any anime this season :<
 
8:17 PM
You might like Blood Lad.
 
@TonyTheLion Still getting a feel for the codebase. Coworkers are nice.
 
@StackedCrooked Meh, I don't like it at all. OP1 is better IMO.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Cool.
I was trolled by one of my coworkers the other day
 
@TonyTheLion lolwut? How?
 
Xeo
So how many people here have switched jobs in the last month now?
3?
 
8:20 PM
@Xeo Does my finishing a contract so I'm back home instead of hanging out in San Francisco count?
 
@Tuntuni I said out loud: "This VBScript is giving me a brain heamorrage" and he skyped me, "Oh, other coworker's brother died of a brain heamorrage" and I'm like "Damn, I regret saying that now", then I Skype with said coworker and he's like "Wut?" and meanwhile I find out from that guy who said that to me that he was joking. Damn :|
@Xeo I know about me, Robot and Sehe
 
@TonyTheLion hahaha
 
Xeo
@TonyTheLion Would be bad if you didn't know about yourself.
 
@Xeo Yea that would be bad
 
> Some incompatibilities have been removed by the 1999 revision of the C standard (C99), which now supports C++ features such as line comments (//).
wat
C didn't have line comments?
 
Xeo
8:22 PM
nope
 
nope
 
Xeo
Nein.
 
Ne.
 
8:22 PM
So it only had /* */ style comments?
 
Xeo
@R.MartinhoFernandes Translation, nao.
:P
 
@Jefffrey ...and #if 0.
 
@JerryCoffin The safest kind.
 
What a beautiful language.
 
Xeo
8:24 PM
I've been doing that sometimes to comment out code since it keeps the highlighting.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes ...other than fork, delete-line, check-in.
 
@Xeo That is smart.
 
@Xeo Hmm, I like when it doesn't.
 
Xeo
Hm, Robot, still got that capslock -> Esc registry entry around?
I switched it at work, and now that I'm actually doing a lot of stuff in vim, reaching for Esc is annoying.
 
@Xeo Then your syntax highlighter is broken underpowered :/
 
Xeo
8:27 PM
wut
 
("Leone" is italian for "Lion")
 
user1804599
Wtf chrome.
 
Xeo
VS keeps the highlighting, but shifts it towards gray.
 
Oh. That's nicer
 
user1804599
8:28 PM
If I click the save button in PDF view it starts downloading the PDF again.
 
Xeo
@R.MartinhoFernandes Thanks
Now I just need to find an opportunity to reboot.
will probably happen in a few months
 
@LewsTherin darn. I received so much spam from syncfusion in just 3 days. It's amazing
@Xeo logoff/logon?
 
Xeo
Not much difference from a restart, still closes all the things :/
 
@FredOverflow Have you used Maven in Intellij?
 
There is a twitter account for the idiotic statements we utter on a daily basis?
 
8:36 PM
Yes
 
Genious
 
@ÓlafurWaage This should go on it.
 
hehe
who runs it?
 
@Tony, I think.
 
> Since I started working with the Snowden documents, I bought a new computer that has never been connected to the internet. If I want to transfer a file, I encrypt the file on the secure computer and walk it over to my internet computer, using a USB stick. To decrypt something, I reverse the process. This might not be bulletproof, but it's pretty good.
 
8:49 PM
How the hell do I add maven goals to an intellij run config T_T Found it
 
Five weesgegroetjes.
 
user1804599
I still don't really understand how immediate operands are encoded.
 
user1804599
@StackedCrooked Wees gegroet, rightfold, vol van genade.
 
Holy virgin rightfold.
 
user1804599
> Heilige Maria, Moeder van God,
 
user1804599
8:52 PM
So, Maria is the mother of God, so her husband is the father of God, but he's also the father of Jesus, and so is God.
 
user1804599
Epic wincest.
 
user1804599
x86 is weird.
 
I like x86 ._.
 
user1804599
> NOTES: * Don’t care about value of REX.B
 
user1804599
8:54 PM
lol
 
@not-rightfold Where did you find this, in a file called "recipes-for-disaster"?
 
Xeo
> YCM has no official support for Windows
:<
 
x86 is awesome. It's so retarded sometimes it's just awesome.
 
user1804599
@Griwes Intel® 64 and IA-32 Architectures Software Developer’s Manual Combined Volumes: 1, 2A, 2B, 2C, 3A, 3B, and 3C
 
xD
Sounds close to "recipes-for-disaster".
 
user1804599
8:58 PM
I decided to write an assembler.
 
Yes, that was quite long time ago, I recall.
 
@not-rightfold it's not easy to write a decent assembler.
 
A rewrite of mine is stuck because my Spirit imitation doesn't yet have enough features to allow sane error messages. :F
 
because it has to support preprocessor and compile-time expressions
 
user1804599
But it's fun, and that's the only thing that counts.
 
9:00 PM
@Abyx It's not that hard.
 
user1804599
@Abyx I'm not writing a parser or anything like that.
 
user1804599
Just an API.
 
meh
 
@Xeo Windows suxorz.
 
> In essence, ycm obsoletes the following Vim plugins
In other words, "ycm does something that somebody else was already doing, and now I'm pretending that it automatically means you should use my version instead of theirs."
Nice marketing trick.
 
9:02 PM
@LightnessRacesinOrbit It supersedes them.
 
Xeo
It does the same as all of those, and more. So really, I don't see the "trick".
 
"Supercedes" is better. It is not up to the author of program B to declare that program A is now obsolete, as if there is a linear progression of tools that everybody must use
 
Why did you put the unusual spelling in quotes?
 
There are no unanswered questions at the moment.
 
Ell
9:07 PM
On SO?
 
for that tag
 
Hmm, accepting an answer made my rep a non-multiple of 5... damnit
 
if Qt sucks donkey cock, what should I use for GUI on Windows?
 
@Abyx MFC? :E
 
meh... maybe I should just use WinForms and C++/CLI to interop with them
 
JBL
9:13 PM
@Abyx I would argue that Qt isn't the worse thing you could end up with for developing a GUI on Windows :<
 
nah, not MFC. it's kinda boring and I want something fresh
 
user1804599
I'm still puzzled by immediate operands; I don't understand how PUSH imm16 and PUSH imm32 can have the same opcode.
 
@not-rightfold its decoding depends on current data size mode
 
user1804599
9:16 PM
@Abyx Ah, state.
 
@FredOverflow So, both sentiments echoed there
 
Xeo
@FredOverflow Wait, normally STL likes being ultra evil
Like, breaking user code. He loves doing that.
 
Why is it psychotically dangerous?
 
Xeo
people might think the now-lvalue sticks around
 
If you can't tell, you're a psychopath.
 
9:19 PM
@Xeo Ah, makes sense.
 
Xeo
@R.MartinhoFernandes NIPPLE SALADS?
 
so std::lvalue_cast (once again) would make more sense
 
@Xeo Casts never change something "in place".
 
@Xeo I'm kinda sad that here is the only place that doesn't draw blank stares.
 
uhm, wait, so &static_cast<T&>(1) is a valid code?
 
9:21 PM
Yes.
 
Xeo
no?
@sehe I'm still a strong proponent of as_rvalue/as_lvalue, aswell as as_const
 
I like move.
 
C++ experts often have names starting with an S like Scott, Stefan and StackedCrooked.
 
SWaage
 
That's not your name.
 
9:21 PM
hm... so it will pin that 1 to a variable ant take its address
 
Xeo
> [23:21:47] <Xeo> clang-bot -c { &static_cast<int&>(1); }
[23:21:49] <clang-bot> error: non-const lvalue reference to type 'int' cannot bind to a temporary of type 'int'
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes There's a song about that
 
@Abyx You can't really emulate non_std::copy like that. You need to bind 1 to a named rvalue reference to get an lvalue.
 
meh. C++ is so weird.
and even weirder.
no.
 
9:23 PM
int&& r = 1;
 
I'm not baring anything with you. Nothing personal, but you're not my type. — R. Martinho Fernandes 14 secs ago
 
@ScottW Done.
 
@FredOverflow &copy(1).
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes too much meat, huh?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Sure, but don't do anything with that pointer after the end of the full-expression.
 
Ell
9:24 PM
So can you cast a literal to an value then assign to it?
 
@Ell No, the casts won't work. But you can bind them to a named rvalue reference, which is an lvalue.
But still, non_std::copy(1) = 2; won't have any observable side-effects. You'd just change a temporary.
 
Ah, we're even now :)
 
@ScottW, btw, is XNA still alive?
 
@Abyx Who cares, I still use TinyPTC :) It's been more or less left to rot 9 years ago or something.
 
9:27 PM
What do you guys think of this? stackoverflow.com/revisions/19013591/3
 
@FredOverflow omg I don't even know what TyniPTC is, probably I'm too young
 
@sehe did that heli already airlift those criminals back to jail?
 
I know that the pipe is bitwise or, but what is the difference between | and |= such as in this example: val |= byte << 2 vs val | byte << 2. Does "|=" first compare the sequence of bits in the two bytes and if any one of them have a bit set (1), then it reassigns 1 to val, whereas the other doesn't reassign a value to "val"?
 
@Abyx minimal framebuffer library
 
@JohnMerlino |= is to | as += is to +.
 
9:28 PM
@JohnMerlino a|=b is a=a|b.
 
I love how I managed to explain that using only two-letter words.
 
bravo
 
thanks for response
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I hate bad tagging, so good edit
@R.MartinhoFernandes and == is to = ? ;-)
 
room topic changed to Lounge<C++>: Please show your apprecaition. [c++] [c++11] [c++-faq] [no-questions]
2
 
9:32 PM
"apprecaition"?
@not-rightfold What architecture?
 
user1804599
@FredOverflow x86-64.
 
Are these pre escaped backslashes you are offering?
 
How can two different operations have the same opcode? Doesn't make sense.
 
@ÓlafurWaage Offer's off.
I'm inspired tonight.
 
@Borgleader I have never used Maven, and I have never used IntelliJ.
 
9:35 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes I noticed that too. Delicious
 
@FredOverflow that can make sense if you think of "a+b" and "b+c" as two different operations
 
user1804599
@FredOverflow Depends on state.
 
@FredOverflow they have same opcode in different CPU modes.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes :(
 
@FredOverflow x86 is sorta like a bunch of different architectures in one.
 
9:36 PM
@FredOverflow you are a lucky man
 
@TemplateRex I sure hope so. Either that, or they went for beers
 
Ell
I always wonder if x86 is "well designed". We sometimes look at c++ or php as badly designed
 
it was. but it has the same problems as C++: it's kept every single legacy feature from a far past. which cripples the feature set and makes it much more complex than necessary
 
@sehe otoh, it can run those old legacy apps just fine :-)
 
@Ell it just suffers from compatibility with legacy stuff
 
9:41 PM
@Ell It isn't. If you want well designed, look at RISC processors.
 
Ell
I know nothing about architectures really :/ I've never managed to get that deep. I tried a bit of fasm but couldn't resist the temptation of going back to c++
 
Well, Intel did try to drop the legacy. Itanium happened.
 
Ell
For me the attraction of c++ is the lack of overhead, not necessarily for performance but because I feel if something can be done at compile time, it should
 
@TemplateRex meh. dosbox etc ftw. it's all software emulated
 
actually, today almost all x86 applications use x32 or x64 code, so Intel can redesign x16 opcodes. (OS loaders use x16 code, but it's quite easy to recompile them)
 
9:44 PM
No way, I want my mov ax,bx :)
 
I raise you my mov al,0xff
 
you still will have it, but not in x16 mode
 
@sehe I wanna see your cwd.
 
most useful: xlat
 
@FredOverflow /home/rmf/dev/ize
 
9:52 PM
I was thinking of that too for a second
 
@Abyx And you can run x32 code in IA-32e mode or whatever it's called.
$ got log
-bash: got: command not found
$
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes In compatibility submode of long mode. Well, most of 32 bit code will run fine in 64 bit submode of long mode, but surely not all of it.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes use GUI, have no typos
 
Ell
Griwes, you're writing an OS, right?
 
@Abyx use GUI, be unable to copy :P
 
10:04 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes :'(
 
@Ell Yep.
 
Ell
Did you write a boot loader?
 
10:15 PM
Yes.
Not really a good one, but it works and provides me everything I need at the moment.
 
Ell
Does that run in 16 bit protected mode?
 
No, why would it?
It has bits in real mode, which is inherently 16 bit, and 32 bit protected mode.
 
Ell
I don't know. I was trying to remember the mode it starts in
 
Doing anything in 16 bit protected mode when you have 32 bit protected mode would be... weird.
 
Ell
my question was going to be, why doesn't it just start in the most "advanced" mode in the first place?
And why are there modes at all
 
10:22 PM
CPU starts in real mode, which is 16 bit, and linear address = segment * 16 + offset.
For ~~backwards compatibility~~
 
Ell
Oh right
 
You can still run anything that was written for 8086 on the latest microarch.
 
Ell
the old c word
 
47 mins ago, by R. Martinho Fernandes
@FredOverflow x86 is sorta like a bunch of different architectures in one.
 
That is, as long as BIOSes aren't fully obsoleted by UEFI.
Which will take few more years, I guess.
Yeah, it essentially has real mode, 16 bit protected mode, 32 bit protected mode, 16 bit compatibility submode of long mode, 32 bit compatibility submode of long mode and 64 bit submode of long mode.
 
10:25 PM
There's the virtual 8086 thingy too.
 
And since the whole thing is already there, and the mode switches are dead easy to code, it makes almost no sense to remove that stuff. Plus BIOSes.
Yeah, v86 and that weird thing called "unreal mode".
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes That's not really a separate CPU mode though -- that per-task running under normal protected mode.
 
And compatibility submodes of long mode aren't really separate CPU modes. :P
 
@Griwes Quite right -- they shouldn't really have been listed either. :-)
 
But listing just three modes wouldn't really show how the whole picture looks like ;P
 
10:28 PM
Sometimes I wonder how much space all those compatibility stuffs take, and then I remember cache.
 
:D
 
@Griwes Quite true -- there are four: real, 16-bit PM, 32-bit PM and long mode.
 
@JerryCoffin If you are listing 16 bit and 32 bit protected modes individually, you'd need to also list submodes of long mode.
The 16/32 bit thingy is just achieved by using a different code segment.
Same with 16/32/64 in long mode.
 
Xeo
> [00:18:16] <neuromancer> it's hard to watch this http://channel9.msdn.com/Events/GoingNative/2013/An-Effective-Cpp11-14-Sampler
[00:18:39] <d0k> neuromancer: but the glorious hair!
[00:18:41] <neuromancer> can't stop laughing at his har
lol
 
@Griwes Not really -- 16- and 32-bit PM really are entirely separate modes. I'm not sure it's true any more, but at least at one time, 16-bit PM still included some bugs that didn't exist in 32-bit PM.
 
10:32 PM
> <neuromancer> it's not like bjarne has fantastic hair, but at least i was able to focus on his content :)
 
@JerryCoffin lol
 
Oh come on, Scott wasn't that hard to follow.
 
Xeo
@Griwes If you're laughing non-stop, it can be hard to follow anyone.
 
@Xeo heh
 
@Xeo He can't really change his hair style now. He would have to change names.
 
10:34 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes Made sense in a twisted way -- the (only) existing 16-bit PM OS at the time (OS/2 1.x) depended on them...
 
Xeo
heh
How did the quote go? "You have to call into question any statement a man with such hair makes."
 
@JerryCoffin Well, the actual mode switch between 16 bit PM and 32 bit PM is just a far jump, so I'd mostly call them submodes of protected mode.
 
Xeo
@R.MartinhoFernandes Just imagine: "Scott Meyers cutting his hair for a better world standard!"
 
@Griwes Yes and no. If you were in 32-bit PM, you could go to a 16-bit PM task with just a far jump. Actual 16-bit PM was entirely separate though (and if you started by switching to 16-bit PM, trying to run a 32-bit PM task would just fail).
 
@JerryCoffin Well, the second you set the protected mode enable bit in cr0 (it was cr0, right?), you are in 16 bit protected mode... unless some essential bit of my knowledge got lost one day.
(It makes sense, since 286 was 16 bit PM and it's all backwards compatible...)
 
Xeo
10:40 PM
ew, some guy in #llvm is debugging some code and is only able to get the repro down to 30k lines of llvm IR. That must be horrible.
 
Ell
@jerrycoffin when you say it would just fail, what would happen? CPU interrupt?
 
@Ell Interrupts are always (well, not really) external, you mean exceptions :P But not really, retf or iretd will easily get you to 32 bit PM.
(The "not really" part is about "self IPI" thingy x2APIC has.)
 
Ell
Oh exceptions okay
I think I need a lot more knowledge of this to ask and get answers to sensible questions, so I'll just sit and listen :P
 
@Griwes Hmm...given how undependable my memory is any more (and the fact that I can't find the right book to check on things at the moment), I'll (at least provisionally) retract my previous disagreement -- something about it doesn't sound quite right, but I'm not sure what and hesitate to argue without something to back up my crappy memory.
 
Are overloads of a subclass bad?
 
Xeo
10:44 PM
... what?
 
@Ell Just grab those beautiful 3k pages of Intel manuals and read. :P
 
you cannot overload a class
 
Xeo
@JerryCoffin No back-up storage in there? :P
 
Apparently that thought did not come out correctly. I meant to say, it feels wrong to make overloads for every derived type of something, but it fixes problems.
 
@Xeo Unfortunately, no.
 
Xeo
10:45 PM
@Pawnguy7 virtual functions?
 
Sounds like virtual functions.
 
I thought so as well. But what if you want ownership of what the caller passes?
 
Xeo
unique_ptr<Base>?
Or if you want a clone, value_ptr<Base>? :P
 
Ell
I'm sleeping now. Night guys!
 
@Xeo Not sure what the various implementations of that do.
 
10:48 PM
Right now?
 
Right now
 
Xeo
Left now
 
Are overloads evil?
 
I spent 20 minutes fixing WCF error message decoding to see what's causing it
And the message is
The server encountered an error processing the request. Please see the service help page ...
 
Xeo
lol
 
10:50 PM
FUCK YOU WCF
 
@Pawnguy7 Not really. Depends on the "something" and the general architecture.
if the base class is more of a mixin
 
I think I discussed this with you before.
 
This sounds cool io9.com/…
 
Woah. I feel like I'm inside that picture.
 
I like the contrast between the tagline "Science and entertainment from the world of tomorrow." and the almost century-old pics.
 
10:59 PM
Indeed.
 
Is Star Trek Into Darkness a remake of Wrath of Khan?
Wondering if I should watch it.
 
Xeo
maybe (return ()) (process) maybeA -- With my monad over Maybe (`My (Maybe a)`)
There should be something better than that
since a == String in my case, I guess I could abuse the empty string for that, but meh
 
nothing is modern
 
Hmm, Winter is coming.
 
Who's he
> Interesting, but the animation is really fucking annoying. Thanks Obama.
 
11:14 PM
@sehe Who?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes "Winter"
 
The Capitalization (hehe) suggested a proper name
 
11:17 PM
Ahaha one of the newest API things I wrote still takes a minute to process.
I hate this project.
 
@CatPlusPlus That means ... about nothing. API's don't usually take time. (It's an interface). Also, why would you be processing an API? What does it mean?
@CatPlusPlus The warm bath of recognition and familiarity :)
 
STATUS 200 OK
TIME 38663 ms
Fun.
 
^ THIS IS SIMPLY TOOOOO GREAT
 
WTF ~39 seconds?
 
can something be complexly too great?
 
11:27 PM
The strange thing is I had al but completely forgotten about such happenings in the churches from my youth. "Falling in the spirit" was a serious thing. You almost didn't "belong" if you didn't experience it once.
 
@ÓlafurWaage Hmmm...Haskell or Erlang, perhaps.
 
@CatPlusPlus you trying to abuse UNO from within a webserver?
 
No, that's just fetching data from MySQL.
Also UNO was there for years, I'm not trying to do anything
 
Wokay. What are you trying to get then :) Searching the NSA records?
 
No, it's just shit and needs to get everything
 
11:41 PM
Uhoh, I just landed a goldmine of undiscovered yt gems
 

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