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9:01 AM
If it works, it works!
 
Ven
9:11 AM
THIS. MOTHERFUCKER. https://t.co/At2ZieDxWw
@Barry Sorry, what was your paper?
 
aah fuck
just woke up and saw referendum result
 
9 hours ago, by Puppy
so I can stay up all night.
 
Ven
@Griwes Thanks <3
 
How irresponsible
 
yeah I had to call that at about 4am
 
9:14 AM
:)
Sucks to be young in UK
 
Hi.
Any advice about on which stackoverflow site could I ask about links/lists of presentations/talks about a certain language.
 
Ven
@Griwes what'd that look like ? struct A { int c[3]; }; A a = {.c{..}};?
 
I'm non-binary. I wasn't "born in the wrong body," I was born into a society that's bad at gender diversity. https://twitter.com/nqttcn/status/746064729521655812
3
That's actually pretty thoughtful.
Framing adds useless bias
 
@Ven There's examples in the paper, dammit. In a table in the paper!
Like, that's the most accessible way to spell something out.
 
@sehe Hey, I guess I can relate :D
 
9:17 AM
@2501 None that I know of. I'm not convinced there should be an SE site for every question
 
Ven
@Griwes oh, those, okay
sorry :c
 
@sehe Certain sites permit asking about lists.
 
@Ven making pointers to members callable (P0312)
 
still
 
The question is actually: there are plenty talks about the C++ language online(youtube), mostly from C++ conferences: GoingNative, CppCon, but there are zero such talks about C. I'm looking for those.
 
9:20 AM
on the upside, those Brussels guys sure got a kick in the teeth about their utter failure to renegotiate in the spring
@2501 That's because C is a pile of abject shite that nobody respectable really wants to talk about.
 
Ven
Whereas C++ is amazesauce!
 
Why would you need a C talk? People actually understand it already.
2
 
@2501 Great. I don't see how that is relevant though
 
@Barry The bad thing is that at 2am you don't feel compelled to go to sleep when you actually want to wake up early.
I for one will welcome being back in Poland, this weird sun thing is kind of tiring. :P
 
This person from the bushwalking group is running late for the 2nd time in a week. I am super annoyed
 
9:27 AM
@Griwes So, when is the full committee vote to include stuff in C++17?
 
@Morwenn Plenary starts in 2 hours.
 
Yay.
Can't wait for the minutes.
 
@Morwenn How do you follow that?
 
API Design / How Not To #745:
        std::insert_iterator< std::deque<rfc822address> > ii(deq, deq.end());
        parse_rfc822_addresses(&ii, input);
 
@2501 Hardly.
 
9:31 AM
But my old friends are all busy & quiet, so kind need new people to hang around with
 
@Morwenn I was asking in what way do you get the information?
 
@Telkitty Come to France. I know people who like chicken.
 
Blog, posts, video...
site, url..
I'm also interested.
 
@Morwenn I hope you mean live ones πŸ˜‚
 
@2501 isocpp library issues bugzilla, blog posts for reports, chat with people who are actually at the meeting, Twitter accounts from the same people, etc...
@Telkitty Yup.
 
9:33 AM
@sehe lol
butt severing
 
@Morwenn So there is no official channel, so to speak?
 
aka brexit
 
brexit is just so fuckin' dumb
this is Americans refusing to pass gun control dumb
 
@2501 Nope.
 
I'm feeling pretty depressed right now
 
9:34 AM
Ok, thanks.
 
@Morwenn β™«β™«β™« wiki is all you neeeeeeeed β™«β™«β™«
 
@Griwes I don't have access to the wiki :(
 
Come to a meeting, you badlet.
 
No time + no money.
 
Ven
^
 
9:38 AM
the thing is
 
nah
 
this is the EU's own fuckin' fault for failing to compromise over immigration.
 
no
 
if they'd conceded a little more in the renegotiation at the start of this year, it would have been a lot easier for the Remain guys to argue that this could work.
 
It's UK people's fault for falling for an argument that wouldn't even be bought up had we all been logical.
 
9:39 AM
eh that's not really true
there were lots of reasons to vote leave, most of which were shite, but immigration basically had no contest from the Remain camp because there was little they could say or do about it.
 
Okay, in other words: do you think that UK has had a migration problem?
2
 
@Puppy I bet Turkey wants out of the EU now!
 
well, yeah.
 
Ven
well maybe if there were a bit less UKIP-voting racist bigots it'd be easier to argue logically
 
our schools and hospitals are rammed to overflowing and we can't build houses fast enough
 
9:41 AM
Where's that diagram that shows how that works... never near when you need it.
 
not to say that I don't want or like migrants, in principle I'm happy to accept all those people
 
Okay, Griwes out, at least for this topic.
 
it's simply that our infrastructure can barely cope with our own damn people
 
Too tired.
 
the EU should respect that you can't cram a never-ending number of people into one place
 
9:42 AM
Serves UK well for trying to cram a never-ending number of people onto another continent.
hides
 
wat
 
Australia
I was making a silly joke, lol.
 
@Puppy Oh. Turkey should have been using that excuse line.
(I'll tweet Erdoğan - seems the most surefire way to attract attention of Turkish officials)
Clearly, what the EU has been doing is sending all refugees and asylum seekers to the UK.
 
arguably Turkey could close its borders to migrants at any time
 
Stupid of us.
 
9:46 AM
the problem is that for e.g. Syrian refugees, if you don't take them in they'll face some really nasty shit
 
@Puppy You, sir, forget that we don't all live on convenient islands :)
 
whereas it's hard to argue that Polish people would have to ... live in Poland would be such a terrible thing.
 
@Puppy but it’s so full of poles
 
besides
 
@Puppy Are you. Serious. Your schools and hospitals are crammed ... because of the Polish?
 
9:47 AM
... no.
 
Anyhoops. I'm gonna work. Good luck.
 
10:01 AM
I think our luck ran out yesterday.
 
Ven
Days since last "const & extending lifetime" accident: 0.
 
I don't like this feature
 
Welcome to C++.
:P
 
Ven
it's even worse in MSVC.
 
Days since last pain caused by whitespaces between const and &: 0.
/cc @Griwes
 
10:11 AM
@AndyProwl const T & andy;
 
why do I even cc you
 
:D
 
Ven
:D
 
user1804599
10:23 AM
@Puppy they don't because they want to blackmail EU
 
user1804599
which they're already been doing and will keep doing until they become a member state
 
@Puppy there is bartek
 
ok yeah
taking Polish people is a humanitarian situation then
 
10:40 AM
BREAKING: European Network Hard-Forks Due to 51% Attack, Currency of Divergent Chain Tumbles to 31-Year Low https://t.co/sqsri2YHFD
 
Maybe having a highly unrepresentative system will save your asses again.
Undemocratic systems frustrating UKIP again.
 
@Puppy Ouch
 
preaching to the wrong crowd there; I'd fix our system if I could
and I voted Remain
 
75% ages 18-24 voted Remain
 
25% voted Leave.
 
10:52 AM
it's the old that climbed the ladder and are pulling the ladder up behind them
@R.MartinhoFernandes sadly :(
well, at least you got dem immigrants taken yer jobs real good
 
I don't buy this gerontocracy bullshit. It's fraught with cherry-picking.
@orlp or maybe it's the old that have more experience living within the EU (and some also outside the EU) that think they made a mistake in 1973.
 
generally my friends & family are well educated, so for me it's always a bit of a shock when I go outside of my social circle
 
The old are part of a democracy, too.
 
I don't think that the average (or well, median) person should vote, but I don't know a system that works better than democracy
every other system always got shit on by corruption
 
And fwiw, having a degree seems to be a better predictor of the vote than age is.
 
10:56 AM
@R.MartinhoFernandes that's no surprise to me
 
are you against the brexit robot?
 
My point is that there's a correlation between age and having a degree so it's not fair to paint it as gerontocracy.
 
TIL gerontocracy
forgotten tomorrow
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes it is a gerontocracy, but that's also to blame on the young people
they don't vote
(I was to blame for that in our last elections here in NL as well, won't be for the next)
 
eh
I think that our educational system is at least partly to blame for that.
 
10:58 AM
28% didn't vote. If those are all the young people, they're a minority.
 
in public schools you don't really do any political education of any kind.
it's like, for the first 18 years it's a complete police state, then suddenly democracy
 
you teach art instead
 
not really a surprise that young people don't engage with democracy since it didn't exist for them for a long time.
 
@JohanLarsson I have always been primarily against the referendum itself. Fuck "democracy". I want educated policy making, not get together and see what's now popular.
 
there's a fair few on both sides expressing that opinion
 
11:00 AM
I think referendums are fine if you use a supermajority
not a 50-50
 
especially since there was little public demand for the referendum to begin with
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Are you optimistic about seeing it soon?
 
Cameron only called it because he couldn't make his own party members shut up about the EU otherwise
although arguably that's a bit of a counter-argument to that opinion in the first place, since our supposedly educated policy maker completely cocked it up
not to say that the British people have not just totally cocked it up
 
6 mins ago, by orlp
I don't think that the average (or well, median) person should vote, but I don't know a system that works better than democracy
how do you get educated policy without corruption/a ruling elite?
I really don't know
 
Er.
I always found that argument specious.
 
11:03 AM
the only thing that can save us is early general elections
and then a strong result for a party promising to overturn the referendum result.
but that's pretty fuckin' unlikely.
 
We've have decades upon decades of non-democracies (i.e. republics) doing relatively well.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes what argument?
 
And every time I see a democratic decision being made (i.e. general referendum) outside of Switzerland, it's crap.
Even in Switzerland, it's hit and miss.
I don't think democracy works better, basically.
 
I see republics hit and miss as well
 
It just feels like it should.
 
11:05 AM
I think the netherlands is mainly a republic
and it works, because it seems that our politicians are generally okay
but then you have the USA shitshow
 
I think the problem with non-democracies is that they don't last as long
 
because their politicans are generally not okay
 
eventually you end up with a leader who's just fuckin' crazy and everything goes to shit
whereas I think that democratic systems have a better capacity to survive epic blunders like Brexit
and now the Scottish guys want to call another referendum.
 
And fwiw, pretty much all republics are fucked up and stunted by broken electoral systems.
The US and the UK are pretty strong offenders.
 
I gotta say though
 
11:11 AM
first past the post is good and fair /s
 
I did like the simple majority vote employed in the referendum
none of this constituency bullshit
 
@Puppy I think such gross changes should require a supermajority
 
brrrrits, you don' goofed
 
well
 
@orlp is that 55%?
 
11:12 AM
@ScarletAmaranth definitions vary
usually 60-70%
 
regardless of the target mark, the simple system was good
 
@ScarletAmaranth anything >50% required. Typically two thirds.
 
@Puppy was it?
did it lead to sensible policy?
 
well, no, but it's a hell of a lot more representative than our general elections ever were.
and massive turnout
71.8% is way better than expected
I think it's the highest turnout since the 1920's or some dumb shit like that
 
Sweden might want its Sexit now.
 
11:15 AM
sorry, but it would have to be swexit
I did hear that many other EU countries' right wings are now calling for their own membership referendums
 
@Puppy No fun allowed :(
 
Of course. They were all filing their knives.
 
they will at least wait to see how it turns out for brrrits
(and then they will reconsider)
 
They probably wouldn't want that.
Quick cash-in on Brexit seems more effective.
 
yeah
 
11:17 AM
Collect those votes now, worry about the issue later (or not at all)
 
Some say it'll be the end of the 4th Reich.
 
the massive market shocks happening now are probably extra ammunition for their respective Remain campaigns
 
 
I hope those market downs remain at least long enough to convince Parliament of the foolishness of this.
 
so how does this referendum get enacted btw?
 
11:18 AM
andf what then
 
when are they outside the EU?
 
Parliament must pass various legislation to start the process of negotiating the exit.
 
I mean, they can't choose to not leave now, right?
 
@ScarletAmaranth pretend nothing happened and carry on as usual
 
Leave camps say it could be 3-4 years before we actually exit.
@ScarletAmaranth Yes, they can.
the result of the referendum is not legally binding.
but pretty much everybody thinks there's no way that Parliament would tell the electorate to fuck off at this juncture.
 
11:19 AM
oh then if these economic shocks stay then I think you guys will end up not leaving
scotland will leave though
 
@JohanLarsson not really. I've seem some decent ideas for what I think are pretty good representational systems thrown around, but I don't hope for much.
 
although
the Lords have been known to tell the electorate to fuck off from time to time.
 
@Puppy they totally can. It's an advisory referendum. Glorified opinion poll, basically.
Sorry bad ping.
 
uu, I see
 
@ScarletAmaranth ^
 
11:21 AM
that's intriguesting
 
so yes in theory, Parliament can choose to ignore the result of Brexit, but realistically, the chances of that happening are minimal at best.
 
political suicide for the country! :)
 
well
it's worth mentioning that the Lords are not elected and do not have to answer to any voters.
 
Even if they did, that would just make upholding the referendum the most powerful campaign point in the next election.
 
this is the only time I have ever felt that that may be a positive.
 
11:23 AM
still better than rendering 34134234 treaties void
 
@Puppy yeah, but the EU is undemocratic.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes inorite?
 
who are the Lords?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I very much agree with the sentiment, however how do you decide who is "educated" enough?
 
@orlp Finnish metal band
 
11:24 AM
oh I see
the lords = the Right Honourable the Lords Spiritual and Temporal of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland in Parliament assembled
 
Plenary starts in few minutes, if you could be so kind and stop this uninteresting discussion. :P
 
lel
 
although Commons can bypass the Lords in fairly limited circumstances.
 
do you mean that the Commons can bypass the Right Honourable the Lords Spiritual and Temporal of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland in Parliament assembled?
 
11:25 AM
yep
 
@Griwes Lounge voted "Leave" on "Should Griwes remain?" referendum
 
@AndyProwl you're being undemocratic
 
@AndyProwl ...
@AndyProwl slaps @Andy with const T & andy = *(T *)nullptr;
 
@Griwes don't deref nullptrs pls...
what did they ever do to you?
 
 
11:27 AM
UK just derefed a massive nullptr
now we're in Economy UB land
 
@ScarletAmaranth andymocratic
cross-post from Discord (courtesy of Rapptz):
user image
9
 
@AndyProwl the policies are. Which you can only have through debate, which isn't very feasible in a democracy but is what republics are about.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Yeah, but debate between whom?
 
Andy excluded from educated policy making for poor reading comprehension
 
I guess there have been debates about this
 
11:29 AM
@sehe Bullshit.
 
I'm andycated
 
Too many star-worthy posts.
 
@TonyTheLion the irony is that with the pound so low... the saudi's will probably just buy up the rest of england
 
@AndyProwl :D
 
alright
go go unelected House of Lords, you're my only hope.
 
11:36 AM
@UKers, Cape Breton is a nice place.
 
Ben
I don't know what to say really.
 
Cape Brexiton
 
hmm
now that I come to think of it, coulda gone to bed when Newcastle declared, it pretty much revealed the overall result immediately.
 
There was also this
β€œThe most British thing of all time.” #UKref https://t.co/DCT0OgqpKn
 
rofl
 
11:42 AM
heh, yeah
 
This is a superb comment on the Financial Times. Sums it up perfectly. https://t.co/5i1uzWxUzi
On the nose or off by a mile?
 
I wonder if the Remain vote would have won if London had a turnout that matched the rest of the UK on average.
 
@wilx How so.
 
@wilx Bullshit to you too sir! It's not quite as simple as you might like to believe
 
I don't care wether it's "complicated" - that's a non-argument. I'm curious to what makes the tweet bullshit.
 
11:55 AM
"Your job may be gone but at least an immigrant didn't take it."
lol
 
@Borgleader one side of the debate. And exaggerated. But not off by any considerable distance
 
@sehe can I be original?
I didn't understand the tweet
 
If you say "You are born in the wrong body" that implies something is wrong with /you/. If you say "You live in a society that has a hard time dealing with deviating individuals" is more accurate..
 
depends on the inidividual
if it's "I don't like being treated as a girl", sure
but if it's "I have a penis but want to have a vagina", then that's gender dysphoria, and I think that's an issue regardless of how society looks at it
 
@orlp maybe for subjective perception, but not for facts. There is no right or wrong body. There are just bodies.
 

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