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Xeo
7:00 PM
you know what Taiga really likes?
Lying on my lap.
 
getEventTime :: Event -> Time
getEvenTime (EventError           _ _ t) = t
getEvenTime (EventWindowPos       _ _ t) = t
getEvenTime (EventWindowSize      _ _ t) = t
getEvenTime (EventWindowClose     t) = t
getEvenTime (EventWindowRefresh   t) = t
getEvenTime (EventWindowFocus     _ t) = t
getEvenTime (EventWindowIconify   _ t) = t
getEvenTime (EventFramebufferSize _ _ t) = t
getEvenTime (EventMouseButton     _ _ _ t) = t
getEvenTime (EventCursorPos       _ _ t) = t
getEvenTime (EventCursorEnter     _ t) = t
how very terrible is that
 
yeah I know this
 
on a scale from "very" to "rightfold"
 
Xeo
Puppy
 
7:01 PM
and there's nothing you can do about it
unless...
 
@BartekBanachewicz Haskell y u no variadics
 
you're willing to do Prism magic
 
Don't keep time inside the event
Make event (time, data)
 
@ScarletAmaranth can Prism do get<Time>?
@CatPlusPlus fucking
 
@BartekBanachewicz I am pretty sure I've seen it somewhere; but I can only use Lenses
 
7:01 PM
unless you give me a good reason I'm not editing this shit
(which means I thought about that and did that the other way)
 
Xeo
You know what else Taiga really likes?
 
Also getEvenTime is a typo
 
Xeo
Lying on my chest.
 
@CatPlusPlus haha
 
Why is it getEvenTime and not getEventTime?
 
7:02 PM
haha bangs head on the wall haha
 
Why are you slow
No but really this sucks and duplicates shit
Time is metadata
 
@CatPlusPlus It's really supposed to be getEvenTime. Never gets an odd time.
 
wow I don't think I've seen as blatant plagiarism as this:
 
@JerryCoffin that would be very odd indeed
 
0
A: Word variable when assigned to int type variable,it has ffff in front of it...why?

andrew1 down vote A WORD is a signed 16 bit value. 0x8400 in 16-bit signed integer is -31744. WORD devId = 0x8400; // devID is now -31744 Thie line sets a (a 32-bit signed integer) to -31744. -31744 is represented as 0xFFFF8400 in 32-bit signed integer format. int a = devId; // a is now -31744

 
7:04 PM
Get even time with odd code
 
@CatPlusPlus or is it
what if the user wants precise time for some unexplicable reason
 
@BartekBanachewicz so what are you up to now?
 
@BartekBanachewicz Then... what?
 
Still looking for a job?
 
It's still there
It's just not part of the event data
 
7:05 PM
@CatPlusPlus shouldn't he get that directly in the event?
@BenjaminGruenbaum interviewing. Working on Hate atm.
 
Event a is (time, a)
 
I love interviewing, both ends.
 
@Mgetz wat
 
@CatPlusPlus hmpfh
 
You have everything you need, but you don't need to pattern match on eeeevery fucking event data bit
 
Xeo
7:06 PM
@BartekBanachewicz type EventData = EventError ... | EventWindow ... | ...; type Event = (Time, EventData)
 
@AlexM. they literally copied the answer above (badly) added "1 down vote" to the top and posted it
 
clenches teeth let's do this
errorCallback           tc e s            = time >>= atomically . writeTQueue tc . EventError           e s
windowPosCallback       tc _ x y          = time >>= atomically . writeTQueue tc . EventWindowPos       x y
windowSizeCallback      tc _ w h          = time >>= atomically . writeTQueue tc . EventWindowSize      w h
I have to change all those
mmmm could I compose with (,)
@BenjaminGruenbaum dunno. I suppose I'm going to find something
 
Okay, has anybody had a problem where VS randomly wants to recompile crap, and you have no clue why, except that you know the files didn't change?
 
The problem is VS
 
7:09 PM
@BartekBanachewicz how long have you been doing Haskell?
 
@Mikhail I didn't.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum 2 years now?
 
@BartekBanachewicz do you think it's a problem for a language if you have a hard time to make these calls after working in the language for 2 years?
 
@CatPlusPlus It's the MS touch of doom.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum it's because I change the data structure and idea
also I should refactor that duplicate shit out of it
it's a code I stole from somewhere and never fixed
 
7:10 PM
@BartekBanachewicz Isn't that what ~encapsulation~ was supposed to solve? :P
 
No, I mean the fact you still have to ponder about how to do things and think which alternative is more clever.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum it's really not that "big of a decision" - it's almost a stylistic choice (that, admittedly, avoids some repetition)
 
@Xeo woof.
 
@milleniumbug there's no encapsulation here.
 
@BartekBanachewicz Yeah, that's my point (a bit sarcastic, no offence)
 
7:11 PM
@BenjaminGruenbaum I don't think 2 years is that much. I still ponder in C++, and I've been doing it for more than 10 years.
 
@ScarletAmaranth I don't know :P I just find the way a lot of people code haskell (cleverly) annoying... I think a big part of Haskell's problem is the community and resources liking clever choices. I'm just venting.
 
@milleniumbug I could've used Lens to generate data accessors and work with it in a much different way. What you seeing is as "raw" as you can get, mostly because those events never needed much work.
 
Xeo
I've been doing C++ for... roughly 6 years now?
 
@buttifulbuttefly Hedge funds are ethically suspicious IMHO. They're source of a lot of problems we see today. So no I'm not interested, and never would be on my stance.
 
@BartekBanachewicz I don't ponder in C++, it's usually obvious what's the simplest/correct way to do stuff in that scale (what function to call, not architecture or algorithms etc).
 
7:12 PM
@BenjaminGruenbaum well, there is a thin line between clever and concise :P
 
@buttifulbuttefly Hedge funds are ethically suspicious IMHO. They're source of a lot of problems we see today. So no I'm not interested, and never would be on my stance.
 
That's why I like Python, because they put "making the right thing obvious" as a design goal
 
for a 4chan driven game, it had some nice pieces
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum Constant deep copies aren't obvious...
 
@Mikhail lots of stuff in Python isn't obvious, but they put it as a design goal so a lot also is.
 
7:15 PM
@BenjaminGruenbaum also it's dynamically typed... so you know... bad vOv
 
Python has a type system now so there's that.
 
I want a statically-typed Python :D
 
My biggest beef with Haskell is how the type system is advertised.
 
writeWithTime tc e = time >>= \t -> atomically . writeTQueue tc $ (t, e)
errorCallback           tc e s            = writeWithTime tc $ EventError e s
there we go
 
7:15 PM
@BenjaminGruenbaum glued-on
 
@milleniumbug that's just... Python, it has a type system.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum What, it used to not have a type system?
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum it's much better than in most languages.
 
My fridge's empty :-(, it's end of the month and I'm out of money, and Bartek's online. Well, how much worse that eve will get??
 
@ScarletAmaranth so what? I find flowtype (for JS) a very nice and helpful type system that's much better than a lot of what static languages have. I like TypeScript's typesystem too.
 
7:16 PM
@BartekBanachewicz so many definition points!!!
 
so many arguments; go full (retard) point-free on it :D
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum Python's popularity comes from existing scientific packages, lexical parsing packages and the easy with which you can use tuples. With the exception of the later these feel independent of the language. Indeed C++, could benefit from easier tuples/lists
 
Pointless style is pointless
 
yeah it was mostly meant in a trollish fashion
 
7:17 PM
@ScarletAmaranth I have to put that tc before the ctor :/
 
May 17 at 12:57, by milleniumbug
@ScarletAmaranth From now on "pointless style = unreadable poop smear" to me
 
@BartekBanachewicz well, the biggest beef is how you make stuff obey a typesclass an then it "makes sure that if your code compiles it works" but you have to manually make sure it obeys the laws of the algebraic structure you claimed it is. A lot of Haskell code I saw doesn't do that and gets type errors - except they're logical errors.
 
@milleniumbug pointless? right. point-free? super cool.
 
@milleniumbug yes it's relatively new.
 
@BartekBanachewicz you could flip... and partially apply (.)... :D
 
7:17 PM
@πάνταῥεῖ get a job :D
 
@ScarletAmaranth srsly
 
@milleniumbug pointless style, lol.
 
@BartekBanachewicz ^^
 
seriously it's fine
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum I have one??
 
7:18 PM
@milleniumbug I like point free where appropriate - but I hate its overuse. People should write Haskell code that is obvious to the reader and often they don't do that.
@πάνταῥεῖ then why no money and no food?
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum just like they do with any other language
it's not a problem of Haskell in particular
 
In the JS room we buy each other pizza occasionally, then again we also don't hate each other.
You guys should try that sometime.
 
you're in the JS room? aaah man, my plonk list has been growing rapidly recently ^^
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum I'll order a pizza with preapplied ketchup for jeffory /cc @Jefffrey
 
@ScarletAmaranth suit yourself see if I care :D
 
7:19 PM
@AlexM. partially applied pizza
4
 
@BartekBanachewicz well, but they advertize it as if the language takes care of it for you where it's impossible.
 
@BartekBanachewicz ahahah - have a star
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum Well, that was a bit high level lamenting, I can use my credit card of course ;-D ...
 
@πάνταῥεῖ lol
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum Haskell sets high standards vOv
the fact it doesn't meet every single one of them everytime, well. It's still a very nice and useful language.
JS is also very useful but I find it much less pleasant to use so there's that.
 
7:20 PM
@BartekBanachewicz it sets high standards for the developers to follow, which they don't which makes me swear a lot when I use Haskell for real stuff at work and makes me feel uneasy as I justify a delay to my boss.
 
I'm kinda getting over the languages thing
 
I really like well thought out static type systems
 
I want to learn them all at some point anyway
 
@BartekBanachewicz JS is just not very interesting on its own.
 
so who fucking cares about what you use
 
7:21 PM
@AlexM. Wait, Jeffffffrey puts ketchup on his pizza?
 
@ScarletAmaranth I think we all do.
 
Bartek Rightfoldchewicz
 
@BartekBanachewicz good :)
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum Henk2000 anyone?
 
@BartekBanachewicz Compilers will drag you down at earth level of course ...
 
7:22 PM
@AlexM. the more you know the easier it is
 
@ScarletAmaranth did you actually use that?
 
but IDRIS
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum About writing obvious code: I once spent 6 hours debugging 7 levels of jQuery callbacks I wrote previous day.
 
that's hardly obvious
 
@milleniumbug don't write 7 levels of callbacks o_0, don't write 3.
JavaScript is so easy to abuse as a language. I hope that changes with the new standard.
 
7:23 PM
too much callbacking
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum ikr, that was my first time
 
btw @benji i haven't told you about the last app I was writing in js
this time totes determined to not use jQ
 
jquery deferred is fairly reasonable I found
 
with jQuery and JS in general
 
@AlexM. Bartek "Vlad" Rightfoldchewicz
 
7:23 PM
my mind goes into alternative solution finding mode really hard
when things like "callbacks"
and "events"
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes is this Q stackoverflow.com/questions/2977174/… missing your github.com/rmartinho/vim-cpp11? Or has it become obsolete?
 
are proposed
 
@Puppy it actually has some issues, I have a post literally titled "problems inherent to jquery deferred" somewhere.
 
well of course it has some issues
 
7:24 PM
usually you can avoid them and have code that's easier to follow
 
    hooman.limbs.forEach(function(limb) {
        var tr = document.createElement("tr");

        var appendTd = function(txt) {
            var td = document.createElement("td");
            td.innerText = txt;
            tr.appendChild(td);
        };

        appendTd(limb.name);
        appendTd(limb.jointA.name);
        appendTd(limb.jointB.name);
        appendTd(Math.floor(length(limb)));

        table.appendChild(tr);
    });
what do you think
 
there's a large gulf between that and not being useful
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum yes I have; it's unusable unfortunately... I think "we" need to first make a useful dependently typed language and just get the whole lambda cube working; then we can move trough calculus of constructions on to pure lambda calculi; Henk and Sage are in some way revolutionary
 
jabbascript
 
whoops, pasted wrong thing.
 
7:24 PM
does anyone ever write code like this
 
@BartekBanachewicz Needs more React/jquery/both
 
I like native DOM APIs
they are cute in their primitiveness
 
Said nobody ever
 
7:25 PM
native DOM APIs are spectacularly awful
 
here's the thing if you want to play with it
 
it's a giant sore spot every single time I have to mention document in my code.
 
@ScarletAmaranth I never played with Henk2000 seriously, I did look at Henk. I think there needs to be a balance between how usable the type system is and how restrictive it is. I think we're just not good enough at expressing constraints yet and we need a radical rethinking of how to express behavior through types.
 
@BartekBanachewicz What does it do it doesn't do anything
 
@Puppy for a good reason, it's a global.
 
7:26 PM
and because Document is shit
 
@CatPlusPlus you can click and move joints. Shift and click and move adds rotation. It's a medical app
 
Doesn't work
 
it's a prototype anyway
 
Good job
 
doesn't worketh
 
7:26 PM
@BartekBanachewicz Wouldn't that be easier to just do in HTML? Zirak is a fan of building stuff in code but I'm not really a fan.
 
@CatPlusPlus browser?
 
Firefox
 
firefoxd
 
didn't test on Shitfox yet
 
7:26 PM
@BartekBanachewicz on a side note use .textContent, .innerText is non-standard and quirky and a relic from old IE.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum fuck
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum Just use jQuery.
8
 
It's not a big deal, it's just something to note.
 
@BartekBanachewicz Doesn't work (I use Firefox with NoScript)
:D
 
Unwrapped files
function X() {} sucks
 
7:27 PM
remind me to test on firefox
 
@Puppy I haven't used jQuery on a big project in a long time. I rarely need to. It doesn't really solve anything for me - selectors are crazy anyway - querying your own presentation layer to find something you put there instead of just having a reference is an insane coding scheme.
 
<canvas> needs a closing tag
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum It's not as useful to me as React is, but it's still handy when you need to actually interact with DOM elements directly.
 
<body onload> sucks
 
and selectors are stupid.
 
7:28 PM
Scripts should be at the end of <body> not in <head>
 
Cat is secretly a web developer
 
@Puppy I use React a lot and I enjoy it. So I can't argue against it too much, someone from the JS room (well, he's not a reg anymore) wrote a similar framework called Mercury which is pretty decent.
 
here's a living proof
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum I agree - maybe we should invest some time in teaching more logic to CS people; start with basic natural deduction of first order, add universal and existential quantification, show how that maps trough Curry-H isomorphism to dependent types, explain the lambda cube up to CoS and continue to pure calculi
@BenjaminGruenbaum - go in increments; I am not surprised there's so much "mystery" around dependent types when quite frankly people couldn't prove "uncurry" with natural deduction or a sequent calculus or whatever
 
7:29 PM
@CatPlusPlus I actually ran into an annoying problem with that recently.
 
@BartekBanachewicz cat is just stating the obvious, things web developers have known for many years except idiots. Then again a lot of web developers are incompetent hacks and most web work is really boring.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum React has it's downsides, but it seems like a mostly smart idea.
 
It's only a problem when you use document.write (lol) or can't get your dependencies right
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum thanks (fucker)
 
@πάνταῥεῖ Bartek "Cicada" "Vlad" Rightfoldchewicz
 
7:30 PM
@CatPlusPlus Actually, it was neither of those things.
 
@EtiennedeMartel srsly
 
Good job then
 
@Jefffrey it's ok joff
we all have our quirks
 
I was doing work related to ranges in a temporary div at the end of document.body
 
@ScarletAmaranth I'm actually taking a course at imperative construction of a lot of stuff I do with functional programming in the university now. It's pretty nice to see FRP from the other angle (imperative reactive programming actually working - with a direct translation to monadic second order logic).
 
7:30 PM
@Jefffrey Aren't you bringing forth great shame to your family?
 
What kind of monster do you think I am?
 
turns out that some range function requires finding the previous visible character.
 
@Jefffrey not a monster joff
 
You can't assume anything in DOM exists when scripts first run
 
just... special
 
7:31 PM
cue iterating through 577 script tags before finding the actual document body
 
@ScarletAmaranth you also have to prove it's more useful than teaching them Java, which isn't as obvious as it sounds.
 
Also that's dumb
 
Fucking hell, your people invented pizza, and the first thing you do to your heritage is shit on it.
 
@BartekBanachewicz lol, was talking about onload, and where you place scripts and so on :P
 
Regardless of anything else
 
7:31 PM
:/ What is even going on here
 
Today I had ordered pizza with extra ingredient: pineapples
 
@EtiennedeMartel Personally I prefer to bulldoze it.
@CatPlusPlus Yep.
 
@EtiennedeMartel I have never put ketchup in my pizza.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum is this such a big deal though?
 
@Jefffrey PHEW
 
7:32 PM
@ScarletAmaranth wanna see? Ihttp://moodle.cs.huji.ac.il/cs14/file.php/67663/all.pdf is it accessible from the outside?
 
I would probably be terminated on the spot too.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum yeah this is a very hard barrier to get around; potentially insurmountable actually - how to convince "them" to change the way it's taught?
 
So it's just Alex being dumb.
 
man
 
@Puppy Wow so edgy.
 
7:32 PM
Put ketchup on pizza erry day
Or better yet garlic sauce
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum yeah it is; funny you use moodle, my uni uses moodle as well ^^
 
I saw an article today on the BBC bitching about some historic storefront being proposed to be demolished
 
> Put ketchup no pizza
That's my point
 
@ScarletAmaranth with business points - you have to show them there is a good reason to use languages with strong type systems. This is hard given how productive people are in languages like Python. In some domains it makes sense.
 
@CatPlusPlus Garlic on pizza is good. Ketchup on pizza is a sacrilege.
Italy should invade Poland just for that offense.
 
7:33 PM
> > Etienne believes when I say Jefffrey likes ketchup on pizza
 
Italy should shut up
 
lol
 
> > I am dumb
 
@EtiennedeMartel I'm curious to know what interaction you've ever had with me that makes you think that being edgy or not is at all part of my character.
 
@EtiennedeMartel sacrilege = sacrifice + privilege?
 
7:33 PM
ketchup on pizza is good people
especially if it's nice ketchup
 
@ScarletAmaranth anyway, it's a fascinating course (so far). It assumes you took an introductory course in logic and an introductory course in automata but it gave me a whole other angle on what people do in FRP. It's also apparently really useful in practice as it's used for formal verification of hardware a lot.
 
Italy should also invade Romania.
 
bool Load(bool l){/*do stuff*/ if(someAwfulParameter){ return Load(l); }}
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum They're only really productive in the short term.
 
speaking of Italy invading
 
7:34 PM
We can barely keep our territory at the moment.
 
@BartekBanachewicz Also p sure <meta author> doesn't exist
 
a hundred years ago this week Italy decided to go to war against the austro-hungarian empire
 
Only charset is special-cased
 
@DonLarynx bool bool(bool bool){ /* bool bool */ bool(bool){ bool bool(bool); } }
 
@CatPlusPlus fuckers
 
7:34 PM
@BenjaminGruenbaum I don't think strong type systems necessarily need to make things impractical; we just don't know YET how to remove a lot of the cruft that's explicitly required right now even in language like Idris that sell themselves as "pacman compatible"
 
so I'm finishing my 2nd beer and even grouping events by time feels hard
shit
 
Reminds me of that running gag about the not holy, not roman and not imperial Holy Roman Empire.
 
@AlexM. they had stolen our pizzas and jammed our soccer tv signal
 
@Puppy that has not been my experience, there are lots of fields of computer science (like Machine Learning and vision) where developers work often in Python on large projects. Not to mention huge projects are written in Python like the entirety of OpenStack.
 
Ell
@EtiennedeMartel what's wrong with putting ketchup on a pizza?
 
7:35 PM
@ScarletAmaranth static, right?
 
@MarcoA. I don't know yet
 
@Puppy Are there any studies about that?
 
Ell
Do you also think a well done steak is sin?
 
the show isn't there yet
 
just because they're written in Python does not mean that they produce more.
 
7:35 PM
@BenjaminGruenbaum right
 
@Ell Nothing
 
My personal Hell is a small room filled with you fucking heathens who put ketchup on pizza.
 
@Ell nothing
 
@fredoverflow Almost certainly not.
 
Ell
@EtiennedeMartel food snob :P
I don't fyi :L
 
7:36 PM
everybody knows programming is an art and not a science
 
btw mumble now?
 
Ell
programming is a craft
 
Programming is shit
 
@Puppy It looks fine, ship it
 
@Puppy "everybody", as in, any one who doesn't want to actually spend time learning the science behind it.
 
7:36 PM
@CatPlusPlus I love your cynicism :P
 
Ell
@BartekBanachewicz We have no mumble server any more vOv
 
programming is a art
 
Ell
I don't think
 
@Ell G+ group videochat?
 
@ScarletAmaranth we'll get there, we're getting a lot better I think. It's just that it's funny Haskell, a language with so many small mistakes in the type system (not to blame anyone, it's 20 years old) is so touted for it. I think we should do a lot better. After using Rust and Swift I'm pretty happy with with their type systems and as systems languages that's quite pleasant (room is going to stone me now, I know, I'll manage).
 
7:37 PM
With horrible nerds arguing about things that don't matter like Application classes
 
does that mean that I can scientifically prove that my colleagues are muppets?
 
Or ketchup on pizza
 
Ell
@BartekBanachewicz I'd rather not add everyone on g+
 
Just remember that 12 years ago most mainstream languages were static and people didn't use generics.
 
Ell
too much effort to set up circles etc.
 
7:37 PM
So we're at least progressing.
 
Ell
skype would be the easiest for me
 
fuck skype
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum 12 years ago C++ had templates.
 
not using that shit ever
total boycott
 
7:38 PM
I have to use skype everyday
 
Ell
teamspeak? :S
 
@Puppy That's one language, not most
 
everyone at work uses it so I have to too :\
 
we moved to slack and it was the best thing ever
 
Ell
Oh wait that needs a server too
 
7:38 PM
@milleniumbug What about Eiffel? ;)
 
I have a TS3 server
 
Ell
@BenjaminGruenbaum What are the mistakes in haskells type system?
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum yeah, we simply need to iterate on what we have, there is no way around it; it's good there are some revolutionary examples (Henk2k, Sage, Yarrow and to some extent even Idris, Coq, Agda and maybe even Haskell to small extent) but they may be a little bit too "fast" for general / common adoption
 
@Puppy I know. I wish I could tell you most C++ code I saw 12 years ago actually used them where appropriate. Maybe in other places people were writing excellent C++ everywhere.
 
@milleniumbug true
 
Ell
7:38 PM
@BartekBanachewicz before we attempt a conference, do we know that people have something to say?
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum That's less "people didn't use generics" and "people were stupid" which is occurring just as much today.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum hahahahahah ano
 
Ell
Because I have nothing :P
 
@fredoverflow That's not mainstream
 
@Ell map vs fmap, stuff being enumerable where it shouldn't be, a lot of implicit things, records, records again because frustratin and so on.
 
7:39 PM
:D
 
well fuck you @ell
I just wanted to be nice
 
@milleniumbug But the Eiffel tower stands in the mainstream city of love!
 
@Puppy hence I said "people didn't use generics".
 
jk I'll play some hearthstone
 
Ell
@BartekBanachewicz I only want to ensure your effort is not wasted :P
 
Xeo
7:39 PM
> map vs fmap
> type system
 
Too late for that
Hohum
 
Ell
If you set up your server or w/e and then ask "so what's the plan?"
and nobody has any ideas it will have just been a waste of thyme
 
we could just chat so w/e
oooow
 
@ScarletAmaranth well, the fact people like Erik Meijer and SPJ go and bake stuff they figure in languages like Haskell into languages like F# and C# is really nice. LINQ for example.
 
50
Q: Why do we have map, fmap and liftM?

fredoverflowmap :: (a -> b) -> [a] -> [b] fmap :: Functor f => (a -> b) -> f a -> f b liftM :: Monad m => (a -> b) -> m a -> m b Why do we have three different functions that do essentially the same thing?

 
7:40 PM
why don't we try Factorio multi @Cat @Jefffrey @Ell
 
So all and all progress is being made.
 
Ell
1
Q: How to treat bugs that users thought were a feature?

robodude666Question: What is the proper way to address a bug that an end-user thought was a feature? Elaboration: I'm guessing that if a large percentage of users expected it as a feature, it should be left "unfixed" or "fixed" to be more stable? However, what if a very small percentage of users expect i...

^lol
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum When what you meant was "people are stupid"
 
Ell
@BartekBanachewicz I'm doing physics atm actually :/
 
> I'm starting my own proyect reading maps. I found that it could be done using fmap library but I don't know how to get it. As I see, you all have more experience on this and I would like you to give me some reference of how to obtain this lib and how to start using it. Thnks
 
7:41 PM
1 min ago, by Bartek Banachewicz
well fuck you @ell
 
@fredoverflow IOW historical reasons
 
lol, great "answer"
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum oh ye, that's a good point - stuff creeping into languages that are already well-adopted is definitely amazing; only just recently have lambdas (not only in C++) become rather ubiquitous
 
@Cat factorio?
 
Ell
@BartekBanachewicz lol
 
7:41 PM
@fredoverflow nice, I just assumed it was a hindsight/historicalmistake because of the types but I never actually saw a reference proving that it's an historical mistake. Thanks
 
@Puppy I don't think people are stupid, fuck me right?
 
wtf factorio has only Alpha downloads?
 
I don't have time, I have 30 servers to configure and test
 
no thanks I don't swing that way
 
7:42 PM
@ScarletAmaranth yes, all mainstream languages have lambdas now which is pretty great.
 
where are the stables
 
Yes it is still alpha
 
Where's that "people are stupid" xkcd?
 
Stables are alpha
Unstables are also alpha
 
what
ah ok
 
7:42 PM
Stables are for horses
 
lol seriously no one wants to play a factorio game?
 
People aren't stupid, saying people are stupid is avoiding responsibility. I'm just stupid after a day reading Aristo and Plato bullshit about everyone being smart and everyone not being asked the right question :D
 
I am so fucking dissapoint with you now
 
Not this weekend
 
@BartekBanachewicz Insert Meme. Also, what is factorio?
 
7:43 PM
then why did I get drunk in the first place
@fredoverflow holy hell
 
To be drunk
 
@BartekBanachewicz Uni stuff happened
 
It's like with that chicken and road
 
@fredoverflow A highly addictive drug.
 
7:43 PM
I hate you all with passion
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum I had high hopes for Idris, but it's not what it claims to be (or at least it's simply not what Edvin wants it to be... yet; hopefully)
 
It's a long weekend here in Italy. We have national holiday on the 2nd of June, so why not extend it to the first too?
Therefore Italy > Poland
 
"Factorio is a game in which you build and maintain factories." No thanks, I have a DP trauma.
2
 
where's that compiler site everyone uses for c++
the university one?
 
Ell
@BartekBanachewicz mehhh
 
7:44 PM
coliru
 
I don't get how DP relates to factories.
 
cornell or something?
 
Ell
maybe I'll join
ugh man
 
@TrevorHickey coliru.stackedcrooked.com
 
Ell
No I can't
13 days until first exam
 
7:45 PM
 
Ell
gotta work fast
 
it's fucking two weeks
 
@ScarletAmaranth I have high hopes for rust and swift, they're a lot more modest and have dumber type systems but they're more widespread. I think we won't make significant progress until we make correct typing much more unobtrustive and obvious to do.
 
but w/e I won't stop you
 
@Jefffrey @BartekBanachewicz <3
 
7:45 PM
I'd just like to play together sometime is all
 
I played with Idris a bit after @BartekBanachewicz talked to me about it, it was nice but it didn't feel ready for use for anything.
 
Don't put him and me in the same message ugh
 
same here
 
Ell
@BartekBanachewicz I would too :)
 
@Jefffrey lol
 
Ell
7:45 PM
Just not yet
 
Especially with that heart
 
At least Haskell I can justify for some coding work at work. Idris I'd have a hard time selling.
 
@fredoverflow What's DP?
 
sweet lord
 
@milleniumbug A porn thing
 
7:46 PM
@Jefffrey you don't love me anymore :(
 
Ell
@milleniumbug dependent typing
(I assume)
 
@CatPlusPlus Didn't ask you
 
@Ell lol how the fuck would that work
 
@Ell dude, it's DP not DT
 
Ell
lol
I'm tired :'(
 
7:46 PM
dependent piping
 
He meant design patterns you butts
 
Ell
it's obviously dependency injection
I misread
 
also FUCKING CHAT THROTTLING GOD WHAT THE FUCKING FUCK
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum maybe you're right - but I think the actual next step is something like GADTs in Haskell
 
YOU SHITTY BOT
 
7:47 PM
Factories are essentially std::bind
 
@milleniumbug so they are essentially " " in haskell
 
Ell
I thought haskell had GADTs
 
Uh no
They're nowhere near std::bind
 
factories are stateful vOv
application just binds a constant
 
make_unique is a factory hth
 
Ell
7:48 PM
@BartekBanachewicz I have a lot of content to learn man
 
@Ell hence np.
 
Ell
Cool :)
 
@BartekBanachewicz you should work on yourself.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum nvm I'm just drunk right now
 
@BartekBanachewicz so what?
 
7:49 PM
I'll leave.
4
 
@BartekBanachewicz Factorio looks very stressful.
 
@fredoverflow Defending from aliens is not all roses.
But there's autosave every N minutes (N=2 by default, you can change it in configuration options)
So there's not much you can screw up.
 
Eric Lippert AMA going live any minute now
4
 
@fredoverflow Non-nullable references++
 
What exactly are the C rules for pointer subtraction? I guess p - q returns distance if p > q but what about q - p? UB?
 
7:55 PM
no just negative
 
why are so many great programmers from ontario
 
@StackedCrooked The type is ptrdiff_t, which is signed
 
Oh, right.
 
eric lippert, herb sutter, myself
 
Herb uses singletons
 
7:56 PM
Singleton is a verboten mix of requirements.
 
Single out singletons
 
global access, lazy instantiation and single instance are all fine unless when combined.
 
Xeo
@milleniumbug Eh, an autosave 6 minutes in the past (3 autosave slots) doesn't guarantee you're save from fucking up. :P
You could've fucked up long ago in the basics or something
 
@AndyProwl After checking it boils down to whether calling a function template triggers a function instantiation—if it does, then the main TU can’t produce it, obviously. I had assumed it does, but in truth I don’t know for sure.
 
@milleniumbug Funny how after so many years I still didn't know this. Never needed to know actually.
 

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