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user1804599
1:00 PM
lol
 
user1804599
Changed GUI background from purple to gray when viewing old data.
 
user1804599
 
Ven
:^)
 
Ell
Can anyone recommend a teeny processor? Teeny as in feasible for a class to implement with NAND gates
 
user1804599
Core i7.
 
1:01 PM
18 year old teen processor
you can finish the sentence yourselves
you're welcome
 
user1804599
@Ven y u no IRC
 
Ven
at $work. I'd rather not keep too many "distraction" tabs open
 
@Elyse If it's really old data, change the font color to gray too.
 
user1804599
Sepia.
 
..which reminds me, I have to block that off in my next releases. All my apps have font/background color dialogs, but nothing prevents the font and backgroud colors being set the same. That has now happened and resulted in a support call:( I need to default to black-on-white if that is attempted again.
 
user1804599
1:08 PM
> Indonesian Mother Sews Halloween Costumes For 60,000 Children
 
user1804599
holy shit
 
we're not doing anything for halloween :(
 
user1804599
Good.
 
user1804599
Halloween is haram.
 
1:10 PM
it isn't a concern to me
 
user1804599
Racist.
 
what is is the it's p much the only opportunity of the year to get shitfaced while disguised and I'm missing it
 
Ven
er, is it not possible to bind the typename of a template template parameter?
template<template<typename Child> typename Parent>
using extract_child = Child;
 
@Ven I think it needs to be a metafunction
 
user1804599
You can't put typename there. It must be class.
 
user1804599
1:12 PM
template<template<class Child> typename Parent>
 
user1804599
This will likely be fixed in C++17.
 
Ven
@Elyse mh, doesn't seem to work on ideone
'Child' does not name a type
 
user1804599
Obvious.
 
the fact that
why am I always swallowing words??
 
@ElimGarak I love how you feel the need to go down to mm precision there.
 
user1804599
1:14 PM
@Ven It's like f :: (a -> a) -> a; f g = <read argument to g here>. Just makes no sense.
 
Ven
@Elyse well, not for me. I don't understand why I'm not authorized to do that :)
no, it's like Foo (b Int), no reason I'm not allowed to use b.
 
user1804599
No, it isn't.
 
user1804599
Template template parameters are like function parameters at the type level.
 
Ven
it exactly is. I'm passing both, unlike your example. also, could write f g x = x, that's just flip const
 
Xeo
@Elyse The Child name is only allowed syntactically there, it doesn't do anything
 
user1804599
1:16 PM
No, ugh.
 
user1804599
What you are doing is hypothetical f (\x -> ...) = x.
 
Xeo
a template template-parameter matches (as the name suggests) a template, not a type
 
Ven
@Xeo well, I'd like it to be bound :(. oh well
@Xeo ah, right. got that backwards
 
Xeo
and what's a template? templace<class T> struct Blah{}; now, what would T (aka Child) be if you did extract_child<Blah>?
 
Ven
gotcha
 
user1804599
1:17 PM
template<typename> struct extract_child_helper;
template<typename T> struct extract_child_helper<Parent<T>> { using type = T; };
template<typename T> using extract_child = typename extract_child_helper<Parent<T>>::type;
 
user1804599
Maybe this is what you want.
 
Ven
yeah, thanks. I see now. it's too late in my example, it's not a template anymore, it's been specialized
 
it is too late for you but you will leave this world knowing the answer
 
@JerryCoffin lol
 
@Ell Clone of PicoBlaze.
 
1:22 PM
picoblazes include, but are no limited to: joe, jean, leo, lea,
 
Ven
@Elyse aw, but that doesn't allow me to leave Parent a template param
 
user1804599
Why did they introduce using instead of allowing template declarations on typedefs?
 
user1804599
template<typename> struct extract_child_helper;
template<template<class> typename E, typename T> struct extract_child_helper<E<T>> { using type = T; };
template<typename T> using extract_child = typename extract_child_helper<T>::type;
 
user1804599
maybe this??
 
user1804599
no idea. it'll probably break because C++ is an inconsistent clusterfuck full of special cases
 
Ven
1:23 PM
but then, extract_child_helper doesn't get his second type parameter, does it?
 
user1804599
It takes only one parameter.
 
Ven
template<template<class> typename E, typename T> ?
 
user1804599
> template<typename> struct extract_child_helper;
 
user1804599
@Ven that's for the specialisation and E and T are inferred.
 
Ven
seen that now. ty :)
that works, thanks!
 
user1804599
1:25 PM
You want Dotty!
 
Ven
stop insulting me, please.
 
dotty?
 
please?
 
user1804599
@Mr.kbok Dotty turns class C[T] { } into class C { type T }.
 
[sigh] SO titles: 'I use 'exit(EXIT_FAILURE);', but then I get an error'. Shocking.
 
1:27 PM
throw gives me exception
 
user1804599
Exceptions must DIAF FIAF.
 
user1804599
Fly into a fire.
 
user1804599
Because that's what exceptions do. Fly.
 
exceptions must fly, you fool.
 
@Elyse Only if the stack grows downwards.
 
1:28 PM
exceptions don't fly, they just bubble up
 
user406009
@Elyse what do you want people to use instead? Either?
 
user1804599
@Lalaland Anything that is not dynamically typed. So checked exceptions, maybe, either, etc.
 
user1804599
Unchecked exceptions are a missed opportunity for free bug detection by automatic bug detectors (aka type checkers).
 
user406009
I think you would like the std::expected proposal then.
 
an std::expected journey
 
user406009
1:30 PM
But checked exceptions really make it annoying to write generic code ...
 
user1804599
Make it more generic.
 
user1804599
Problem solved.
 
user406009
Sure. I await your generic friendly checked exceptions proposal.
 
user1804599
Then you can wait for a very long time.
 
sbi
Good afternoon.
 
user1804599
1:34 PM
Can you give an example of a generic API you have trouble with because it uses checked exceptions?
 
sbi
If I have a class template nested in a (non-template) class, is there anything I need to know about specializing the nested template? (Other than that I need to specialize it at namespace scope.)
 
user406009
It just makes things much more annoying as you have 3 type parameters instead of two for every function.
 
user406009
Coalescing the exception types is also a pain compared to Either
 
user1804599
1:36 PM
Either I consider one implementation of checked exceptions.
 
I think I'm with bartek on the exception policy
Just use monads
 
sbi
@R.MartinhoFernandes OK. I just tried it and GCC seems to be happy with it. I just wanted to know if there's any pitfalls which are only obvious to those who know the standard by heart.
 
user406009
I wish there was some way for us to vote on proposals.
 
Please no
 
user1804599
nooo
 
user1804599
1:38 PM
morons would vote the dumbest proposals up
 
If everybody could vote we would have for (x : container) by now
 
sbi
@Lalaland At the ACCU 2014, Stroustrup took straw votes from the audience on proposed new features.
 
user1804599
and vote according to Wadler's law
 
user1804599
.. as Jefffrey examplified :)
 
@Jefffrey That makes me think not everybody should vote
 
1:42 PM
We would probably have Bjarne_case as well... because "It's Bjarne! He knows better!"
 
we will have Bjarne_case AFAIK
for concept names
wait or will it be PascalCase
I think I've seen Bjarne_case in the proposals
 
user1804599
OCaml uses Bjarne_case for module names and I like it.
 
user1804599
OCaml_case is great.
 
The worst possible case ever.
 
user1804599
Bjarne said he hates CamelCase.
 
1:44 PM
Even Retarded_Case is better because it's internally consistent at least :/
 
Elyse likes it: unassailable evidence that we should avoid it.
5
 
does Retarded_Case have a name
 
I vote for Retarded_Case as the name. :P
 
I think I'll make an « original research » section in my sorting library's documentation, because it uses some algorithms that I have seen nowhere else and I would hate to use undocumented algorithms.
 
@Griwes we should have use Retarded_Case in your cppcon snippet
 
user1804599
1:48 PM
Oh just found this again, it's great:
 
user1804599
 
> The uploader has not made this video available in your country.
also friday is sad without rebecca :(
 
Saved by GEMA!
 
I announce Lounge<Demise>
 
@AndyProwl There is a replacement for you:
 
1:50 PM
@AndyProwl ooooooh
 
@sehe hey that's me in there
hi me
 
@wilx it's not it :(
 
8 more active rooms
 
@AndyProwl It is better!
 
user1804599
too many
 
user1804599
1:51 PM
@MartinJames I don't get it.
 
@wilx yeah well hard to do worse honestly
but meme
 
@AndyProwl :D
 
user1804599
Party wants to forbid slaughtering without anesthesia.
 
user1804599
I don't understand, why can you only vote for one person? Why not for as many as you want? Possibly restricted to one per party.
 
OK, I'm stuck under my desk. A network cable has got trapped in the castor wheels and I can't roll it back to escape. This may take some time.
11
 
1:57 PM
> Declare a destructor noexcept. That will ensure that it either completes normally or terminate the program.
Aren't destructors implicitly noexcept since C++11?
 
user1804599
Yes they are.
 
> A destructor should be declared noexcept.
idgi
 
user1804599
Make everything default noexcept.
 
> Note that we need to minimize annotations. If programmers must write lots of annotations code gets brittle, errors will be made, and the approach will not scale.
I guess Bjarne didn't like value_ref
 
user1804599
nobody does
 
user1804599
2:03 PM
Baracco Bjarne
 
user1804599
Tobacco Barner
 
@TonyTheLion Happy fucking friday <3
 
@MartinJames Call 911. Report how many of the responders died while ROFLing.
 
> c:\program files (x86)\microsoft visual studio 14.0\vc\include\memory(40): error C2628: 'std::bad_weak_ptr' followed by 'char' is illegal (did you forget a ';'?)
Daily dose of MSVC-induced rage.
 
user1804599
lol
 
user1804599
2:16 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes I like that policy.
 
@Elyse Well played!
 
@wilx OK, I'm free. I got out by creeping out feet-first under the desk and out the other side. The mains distribution blocks on the floor, bristling with black-box wall-wart power supplies, were a difficult and painful obstacle:( I have also freed my chair, but I now have to fix my network. I have lost connectivity with Anne's laptop and the TV server box downstairs.
 
@MartinJames Heh.
 
@MartinJames Office Horror Story
 
@Rerito I'm sure someone will make a movie out of it.
 
2:21 PM
@MartinJames Or a series :p
 
..though I'm fairly sure that it was not a malicious act and that my network is not trying to kill me, (well, not physically, anyway).
 
Xeo
@R.MartinhoFernandes ... what
 
Shit.. some LEDs are out that should not be out. Fuck it, I'll go walk the dog to calm down.
 
Goddammit, libc++ has become terribly polluting.
 
@sehe What's your livecoding stream schedule?
 
2:32 PM
I find missing headers all the time when compiling with VS.
 
user1804599
mif :: Monad m => m Bool -> m a -> m a -> m a
mif c a b = (\c -> if c then a else b) =<< c
 
@Xeo when your tokens are characters, you can lex anything!
 
user1804599
do { ...; mif blah a b } instead of do { ...; blah' <- blah; if blah' then a else b }!
 
user1804599
mcase is trickier though.
 
> Don't define a default constructor that only initializes data members; use in-class member initializers instead
Dislike
This leaks implementation details into the class definition. I agree it has its own advantages, but shouldn't be a core guideline IMO
 
2:49 PM
@Rerito did I have one?
 
@MartinJames IRTA I'll fuck the dog to calm down. Dyslexia++
 
@AndyProwl like. If you care about those details I'd go pimpl all the way
 
user1804599
 
@sehe Dunno, just asking in case I could catch you up sometimes in the weekend :)
 
> doppleganger
stops reading
 
user1804599
2:54 PM
lol
 
user1804599
Noun: doppleganger
  1. Misspelling of doppelganger....
 
Haha, I wouldn't like to find my doppelganger.
 
What's wrong with Visual Studio?
 
user1804599
@AndyProwl NSDAPs NSDMIs are terrible.
 
2:55 PM
@Mysticial that it's required to have to compile with Microsoft compilers
 
@MartinJames I have a nack of getting my shoe lace tired up in such a wheel. Happened twice at my previous office. It's really tricky to get loose. You can't really undo your whole shoe either
 
Xeo
@AndyProwl I so love doing that.
 
@Mysticial I'm not hating on Visual Studio the editor - I just really hate that the compiler (until now) wasn't available standalone
@Mysticial also, this is a good step towards source distributions
 
@orlp I actually don't know how true that is. But I do know that if you install the Intel Compiler, it integrates into Visual Studio and you can select it from a drop-down - thereby replacing Microsoft's compiler.
I'm not sure if you can do that with other compilers though.
 
2:57 PM
@orlp That's cool :)
 
@Mysticial wrong analogy
 
@Xeo Why that?
 
@Mysticial He means you can't get cl.exe without devenv.exe, not the other way around.
 
@AndyProwl nobody enjoys boilerplate
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Oh.
 
Xeo
2:57 PM
^
 
@Mysticial assuming this didn't exist - how would you compile your project using cl without also installing Visual Studio
 
Xeo
@R.MartinhoFernandes Eh, didn't they ship cl.exe with the Windows SDK or something?
 
@LucDanton Ok. Personally I don't enjoy it, but I don't mind it in this case.
 
@Elyse double ganger;
 
It's the fruit -> banana, banana -> fruit thing
 
2:58 PM
@Mysticial Yesterday, I wanted to check whether some Code::Blocks project compiled with MSVC (it can be done from Code::Blocks). In order to do so I'd have to install the full Visual Studio just to get the build tools.
 
I don't mind an editor being bound to a single compiler (too much, at least, still better if it can be swapped)
 
@Xeo Stopped shipping the SDK without VS.
 
I do mind a compiler being bound to a single editor
 
Xeo
@R.MartinhoFernandes ah, okay
 
user1804599
@fredoverflow doppelgangster
 
2:59 PM
Oh, once again, it isn't fucking able to install itself.
 

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