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4:00 PM
@Catija Eh, why is it confusing? The tooltip showed "the displayed score is capped at -1, but we still accept votes that affect how the system handles this post, and that affect your reputation" (in not as many words/as much clarity, I admit).
 
This is where moving away from rep for privileges comes in, too... to be honest. If a privilege is granted and revokable because it's not tied to rep, that means that people who repeatedly act in poor faith - whether that's in flagging or commenting or close voting or whatever... you can rescind that permission (or have automations that do, on SO scale, anyway).
 
Moving away from rep for privileges where possible would help alleviate some of that issue
 
that's kinda why i wasn't necessarily against removing the rep hit of a downvote. it's... an insignificant amount of rep, doesn't remove what the purpose of the vote was (or should have been,) and doesn't ding the user twice (both -rep AND -score)
 
It'd be amazeballs if mods had a "permissions" tab on user profiles where they could just toggle individual permissions off/on (with audit info for "last toggled <current status> by <moderator or staff member> on <UTC datetime>")
 
@TylerH I guess I don't see how it was helpful. If your question is at -4 and you only see -1... maybe you're less demoralized and maybe you're more willing to edit rather than deleting and trying again... but the outcome doesn't really change. You're just being lied to about the actual score of your post.
 
4:03 PM
but, the rep hit is the only... permanent-ish penalty of posting something that attracts downvotes
 
@TylerH Sure, we just have to decouple things from rep first and build a way to award privileges that isn't manual :P
 
@Catija The outcome wouldn't necessarily change at -4 because that's where posts are hidden from the front page (but not on other question pages)... but users don't know that
If they see a negative score they hopefully would be motivated to improve the question, which means future readers might be more inclined to upvote it
 
we keep saying over and over on meta that downvotes are on the post, not the user, but it's the user that feels punished by it, not the post
it's simply not true that it's not personal. They made the post, it's theirs,
 
I guess targeting downvotes now is another step towards less quality control. It fits in nicely with more rep for questions (because getting an answer in itself is no reward and you can gain rep through even the most useless contribution), unlimited Steward badges to encourage robo-reviewing, the flag dialog (totally off-topic question "Needs improvement"? People choose VLQ flag, it gets declined, they are discouraged) etc.
 
they're the one that gets dinged for it
 
4:05 PM
@KevinB I'm pretty sure I've said in here that I personally feel like it's personal... so I'm really not the sort to make that argument that it's about the post. I wrote the post. You're judging my work. If it's downvoted, that means my work is bad, which means I failed. It's personal.
You can probably find me parroting this somewhere on meta if you look but ... I don't think I have recently. I just don't agree with it. I agree with the sentiment - that it's maybe a "perfect world" view of things... but that's not actually the impact it has, so by saying that it's not personal, what we're really doing is absolving us (as downvoters) of the impact of those votes, and invalidating people's responses to them - we're not actually helping people.
 
put another way, I'd not necessarily be against a solution that somehow mitigated that issue while still leaving in tact the ability to rate content in a way that over time results in poor content getting removed without having to go through the full closure process
Just because a question warrants being answered, doesn't necessarily mean it's worth keeping around forever, like the majority of debugging questions
i can't look at SQL tags. there's so many questions that are just variations of other questions where i so desperately want to close it as a dupe, but the difference is.... just enough to kinda justify not
 
@JeanneDark No? This whole BS that Jeff came up with that "the answer was the reward" is such an elitist way of thinking - asking a good question is HARD and by diminishing it by saying that the true reward is the answer is so petty and treats askers like second-rate citizens. If those questions didn't exist, the answers wouldn't either.
 
like this one is to slice the the value of a column up to a delimiter. There's dozens of questions that ask to split a column into multiple columns, which is the exact same techinique, but this one wants the same thing, only without caring about anything but the first column
which... means you can also solve it with the regexp method
what bothers me about it is i can easily search and find the solution... and i can't put myself in their shoes to understand how they weren't able to do the same
 
@Catija The way I understand Jeff is that you should ask questions to get answers, because you do have a problem. This most likely leads to people asking questions useful to many other people. You shouldn't ask questions just to gain rep (still you always received rep for questions, just not that much). And I've seen questions literally asking for upvotes and receive them, eg. to be able to comment.
 
@KevinB sometimes I understand, but if I can return 50 good results from the first google query off the top of my head, then yeah
 
4:13 PM
@Catija I'm with you here. I think good questions can are still valuable. I mentioned it elsewhere but I tend to upvote questions when I use them as dupe targets. Especially if I do so repeatedly.
 
it's just such a simple task, fortunately that means now we have a clear question written in the simplest form possible with direct answers
 
@JeanneDark I don't really understand how that matters? People shouldn't be answering questions "just to get rep" either but I'd bet you it's exceedingly more common for people to say "don't forget to upvote/accept my answer if it helped you" than for people to ask for upvotes on a question.
 
and then... the first posts queue is auto-commenting on some of these answers because they're "too simple" effecively
 
@Catija It might be worthwhile to run an A/B test for 2-4 weeks to see if downvoting questions not causing a rep penalty for askers has an effect on their outlook (with SO staff reaching out to a small set of those users to see how they felt about it, along with reaching to some users who did get a rep penalty felt about it)
 
when that's.. by design, it's a simple question, it needs simple answers, there's no explanation needed
 
4:16 PM
Yeah people dislike seeing "their work" downvoted, but I wonder what difference there would be if they didn't also see a red "-2"
of course that's an imperfect test anyway because a lot of users who would be hit by it are at 1 rep anyway
 
@TylerH We certainly could - If I can make a conjecture - I'm going to guess that, for the most part, it's not going to matter much since so many askers don't have rep anyway?
 
Yeah exactly
 
i'll share the question so that it's clear what i'm talking about,
 
@TylerH Most heavily-downvoted questions are from (very) new users. So, for them (at 1 rep), there is no reputation penalty. Further, the order matters, IIRC. Post Q (rep = 1); three downvotes (rep = 1) and then one upvote (rep = 11).
 
i wouldn't be surprised if there were an actual dupe out there that i just can't find
 
4:17 PM
Haven't really thought deeply recently about a way to track question quality in terms of "when should the system block this person from asking more questions" without also counting their question score. I don't think closed/deleted status would be enough, personally, but a test or some actual system data there could maybe show that my gut is wrong
 
but if there is, this one is likely a better target anyway
 
@AdrianMole Yes that order of operations can be frustrating sometimes
 
@Catija The point is: Anyone can ask a question, but SO wants (wanted) to have the experts here to answer them. So the gamification system incentivized answering more than asking.
 
@KevinB Which is a dupe
 
right? i'm almost positive it's a dupe. but i can't find it
 
4:19 PM
I took care of it
 
at least, not one that's better than this question at getting to the point
 
@TylerH Honestly, that does bother me. Not as much as it did before but it's still disturbs me. I don't really care for rep but getting downvoted when I believe the post is useful is irritating. I have one post sitting at -1 after I told a user how a 24 clock worked. Shortly after I got a D/V on my answer to the same question. I know the "don't assume" thing but I'm fairly certain it was them.
 
@JeanneDark Sure - "anyone can ask a question" - but that doesn't mean they do, or that it's asked well. Most of those "anyone"s ask questions exceedingly poorly and get downvoted for it. The reality, it takes a lot of effort and thought to ask a question well and, for the most part, asking is underappreciated as it is. Most answered questions have higher scores on the answers than the questions, so we were doubly penalizing askers - depressed voting and lower reward.
 
@Catija I agree asking a good question is hard and should be rewarded (and of course answers couldn't exist without a question existing in the first place)... but I don't think the two are equal. People come here to get answers... sometimes people do come to find interesting questions, but it's so that, again, they can either think on what the answer might be themselves, or read existing answers... In summary I think it was a mistake to increase answer rep from 5 to 10.
 
But it does highlight something I think a lot of folks miss: what do you call the various parts of syntax? I often find dupes are simply because they don't know the terminology to search on (and SO search isn't smart enough to figure it out like Google can)
 
4:20 PM
The question was something about time and their answer was that since hours are zero-based, the value 10 meant 9 AM. That wasn't the cause of the problem, though. Nor how hours work.
 
Maybe an increase was warranted, but the same as answers just seems too much to me
 
Yea, and that might contribute to why i couldn't find a dupe. I know sql, but only as a self taught dev who had to use it to accomplish a goal
 
@Machavity and terminology questions are largely off-topic, most of the time
 
terminology isn't my strongpoint
 
@Catija That's a very SO-centric view. After all, when the question was not low quality they likely received answers and a solution to their problem, which all of this should be about. Not the gamification should play the main part.
 
4:22 PM
@TylerH We should probably get that changed, but it would be quite an uphill battle
 
@TylerH You mean question rep, don't you?
 
the problem with terminology questions is the people who need them don't know the terminology to find them
 
@JeanneDark I don't think anyone's ever accused me - someone who's not a dev and came to this platform to use the Gaming and Movies sites and stuck around for ELL and Meta - that I have an SO-centric view. :/
 
@JeanneDark er sorry, yes. The last sentence is about question rep, not answer rep
 
And cooking.
 
4:23 PM
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
 
@Catija Do I receive a badge now? ;)
 
@Machavity Well yes, if we could ever get a question regex that blocked things like "should" questions, it'd be a lot easier... ;-)
the important thing is to have a clear distinction between "what is the name for this" and "what should I name this" questions
 
i'd like "best practice" to be blocked from everything
 
M&TV completely removed a category of questions (ID) because asking them well was so difficult, that the site was overrun with unanswered, low-quality ID questions. ELL is full of people trying to ask how to understand English and struggling because... they're having to ask in English!! ... it's not just an SO problem.
 
blog posts included
 
4:25 PM
@KevinB My kingdom for such a regex
@Catija Earth Science also did that for rock/mineral ID questions which was very sad. I think they might survive but like 90% of the questions there were ID questions
 
that's kinda analogous of SO and debugging questions isn't it?
 
Or typos
 
debugging questions are the most common, and most useless, questions we get.
but people love answering them
 
but that's also the problem of everybody and their mother creating a Stack Exchange site for some topic... not every topic has enough interest online
 
mumble mumble crypto mumble mumble
 
4:28 PM
and there's still the discoverability issue... every programmer is probably gonna know about SO or read about it when they read about programming online. But are geologists and meteorologists etc. gonna be talking about EarthScience.StackExchange wherever they meet online?
@Catija Yes well let's not get into that. Taryn has enough issues with crypto sites X-D
 
Also, typing "mumble" is hard because I use the same finger for m and u and b.
 
well, mathoverflow seems to have not had that issue
 
@Catija Hmm, interesting. I use index finger for M and middle finger for U
 
but i think that was helped by a few very influential people in the field being very public about using that site
 
@KevinB Yeah, some sites are big enough and old enough (and the more scholarly sites tend to not have that issue because scholars/academics are so incredibly/desperately thirsty for interacting with their peers)
 
4:30 PM
@TylerH Really? Huh. Middle for me goes to I.
 
@Catija Well, sure my middle finger types the I key too... but it can do U as well :-P
 
Typo questions: Confusing = with ==, extra semicolon, missing brace/parenthesis/bracket etc. If they don't deserve downvotes, then I don't know what could...
 
I'm stupid fast at hunt and peck. My teachers teaching keyboarding hated me :P
 
well, that's also a question type that has a close reason
without downvotes they'd still get closed
 
From the "home row" keys of asdf jkl; the middle finger rests on K, so when the hand rotates a bit to type the M key, the middle finger is in the perfect position to lean in and press the U key
 
4:31 PM
I tried to learn using Mavis Beacon but I didn't really get good until I was using forums online and wanting to respond quickly - so I just slowly got better until I stopped having to look at the keyboard.
 
I took two keyboard/typing classes in middle school back in '01-'03, which is probably two more classes than most people take, though :-P
 
What? The home row is clearly aoeu htns =P
 
@Calculuswhiz what is that, dvorak layout or something?
 
i took 1, but it was no different than downloading a typing learning app and working through it
 
Middle school in the oughts? :P
 
4:32 PM
@Catija Yes yes, I'm a wee babe
the ripe young age of 31
 
@TylerH Yeah, dvorak. I switched a while ago, but I think it just made me slow in both qwerty and dvorak.
 
hehehe
that's why I haven't ever tried to switch
(and finding a keyboard for it)
 
The funny thing is that I'm not that much older but there's this weird dividing line between people who graduated from high school before 2000 and after. Technically I graduated in 2000 but I still feel like a 90s kid.
 
@Catija there was a big difference in digital nativity there
 
i'm not sure what feeling like a 90's kid means
 
4:34 PM
2000s and earlier had very very little tech exposure in school, whereas 2000s and after (really after the dotcom boom), tech and email and everything really skyrocketed
 
Yeah, we had some computers but I think our typing classes in HS were actually using typewriters... Obviously we had computers and I had one at home but the internet was still in the dial-up world and AOL and stuff like that.
 
i graduated in 06, but a lot of the things people my age were interested in... wasn't an interest of mine it seems. it's almost like i went through things in an opposite order. a lot of my peers were heavy into gaming, shooters, gta, and pokemon, i did't do any of that
i didn' get into gaming till after highschool
 
I started playing chess or kid-oriented games in a Macintosh II around '94 or '95. Started getting exposed to the internet in '97 or '98. Neopets and Runescape were my big initial experiences in the internet. What a time it was at the turn of the millennium
 
i played a little ut99, which got me into IRC and mIRC scripts in middle school, so it's not like i wasn't exposed at all to computers before then, it just wasn't... what i did all the time
i spent a lot of time outside
 
@TylerH OMG Neopets was how I learned HTML.
... what limited HTML they allowed, that is.
 
4:38 PM
Yep. Their forums, shop pages, profile pages, and then the personalized neopets/neofriends sites
 
i don't even know what that is
 
@TylerH Honestly, I don't think it's worth switching. There's a lot of GUI stuff that works very well in QWERTY (copy paste), and it's really nice in music notation software to be able to type "ABCDEFG" with one hand. Having to switch between typing and shortcuts for one application is really more of a hassle.
 
@KevinB same; was in boy scouts and sports (soccer, cross country, etc., then band) as a kid, but spent as much time as I could also reading and online because of the opportunity to explore imaginary worlds. Was big into fantasy (and still am)
 
yeah, boy scouts was a big deal
also did a lot of reading
band
 
@Calculuswhiz Yeah, I don't struggle at all with typing or typing speed so I have very little incentive to switch anyway. I am fairly well aware of when I am making a typo even when touch typing without looking at either the keyboard or screen
 
4:40 PM
but no sports
 
hey, band is practically a sport at some schools :-P
 
we were primarily about marching season, had a blast going to competitions
the winter/spring season was... more or less a time killer with the more classical music stuff
 
Same. Our school had stupid amounts of money and hired a lot of band instructors from JSU in Alabama which is a big music school and (at the time) had a drum corps based out of it too, so we were very big on competitions and precise/demanding drill and music
we had winter guard and indoor drumline for the off season
@Catija I still visit on some rare occasions (like once 2 years) and get swept up in nostalgia but it's a far, far cry from what it once was
 
we had this one instructor for ever, was an old drill sargent from a military band
great guy
 
You know the company behind math blaster/reading blaster (might have been too late for you) ended up buying Neopets a while back. But it's a dump of a site now because most of the site never got upgraded from Flash dependency
 
4:43 PM
he could be very mean, but in a way that somehow inspired rather than discouraging
was weird
he'd never get by in today's standards
lol
 
@TylerH The death of flash has been hard for them. I keep my accounts alive but I don't do much else.
 
@Catija Wait, there are backchannels?
 
right here
 
@Braiam You're in one. Didn't you know?
 
@Braiam Chat rooms, Meta, off-site communication with users like on Twitter or Discord, etc...
 
4:54 PM
o/
 
I'm sorry, what is that a link to?
 
... I'm a bit concerned about why we're sharing forms with weird URLs.
 
@Catija I still see that as a solution in search of a problem. People game reputation, they will game anything. And if you put that on hands of humans, the problem just gets worse (moderator X is prosecuting me and doesn't want me to use my marbles!)
 
whoa
that form was posted in a lot of places
 
@Catija That's on google, they own the .gle and .google TDL.
TLD* (I hate TLA's)
 
4:57 PM
It's a Google form, but... he posted that all over. Not cool
 
we were helping that user last night with a question
 
Well, that's par of course for those things.
 
or, trying to anyway
 
@Arcanis-TheOmnipotent I've suspended you from chat for an hour. Posting the same link in many rooms is not OK - regardless of whether the link is legitimate or not. If you need help with something, find a single room that relates to what you need and give context and wait. In general, this is not the place to get people to fill out forms or surveys for you.
 
Note, that the user can't read the messages from chat if they are banned. AFAIK, it shows you a "you are not allowed" message
That's why I say that kicks + messages makes no sense.
 
5:00 PM
They'll see the message in their inbox, after some time (6-8 somethings).
 
I... was pretty sure that suspended users could still read chat messages.
 
I wouldn't know
 
I can suspend you for an hour, too, so you can report back? :P
 
... I guess. I've never (yet) been kicked/banned from chat, but I do see pings in my inbox after a certain time.
 
I guess I could revert it after the fact.
 
5:01 PM
yup
 
Try banning Machavity.
 
@AdrianMole If you have faster notifications preference turned on, you'll get them within a minute. If you don't have it enabled, they come in within 15 minutes or so.
@AdrianMole It doesn't work on mods.
 
What, not even Super-Mods can ban mods?
 
as if chat had a notion of super mods
 
Moderators basically have no checks on many things.
 
5:03 PM
@KevinB Well, the ElectionBot thinks Sam is a super mod. ;-)
 
I volunteer Adrian for tribute
 
... can't figure out why.
 
:-)
 
@AdrianMole Nope. We are equivalent in many ways here.
 
The ban seems to be for 2 hours
 
5:05 PM
Ah! The Principle of Equivalence. Always struggled with that, at school.
 
@Vega Yeah, because someone flag deleted two of them. I only manually deleted the others plus a single hour suspension.
Where are all of my periods going today? That's the second message that is missing one. :/
 
I got confused about how many I flagged.
 
I often purposely omit periods as to not seem so... point of fact
 
@Catija maybe you switched to a different keyboard layout?
 
@Catija Does it work on ROs who aren't mods?
 
5:07 PM
@AdrianMole Yeah.
 
hehe
 
I'm not volunteering
 
@AdrianMole I see what you are doing ;)
 
i mean, being an RO doesn't change that you're not a mod, the mute/suspension is server-wide not room specific
even kickmutes are server-wide, right?
 
@AdrianMole Diamonds cannot be kicked or suspended. The one time I know of where that came to a head, a diamond had to be yanked first.
 
5:08 PM
OK - I was confused about terminology. So, "kicked" = room-specific; "banned from chat" = network-wide.
 
Mods in chat are a special classification of RO. Mods are, by default, ROs in every room - which is why we tell mods that being an RO is pointless for them.
 
like you get kicked just from the room, but the kick comes with a mute
 
But it's on the order of minutes, not hours.
 
30 seconds, a minute, etc
been a long time since i've needed to reach for kick mute
 
The shortest suspensions possible is 30 minutes, and that's only possible through flag deletion of a chat message. Manual chat suspensions are granted in hours, up to 9999 (though you can technically make it longer, the hours field is just only four digits)
 
5:11 PM
1.14 years seems adequate.
 
@rene I certainly hope not! :D The more likely explanation is that I need to trim my nails.
 
i for some reason have a lot of trouble with spaces
and lately been having an issue with reversing letters
 
spacesaren'tcool,anyway
 
@Catija that kind of problems are foreign to me ;)
 
particularly when it's two letters from opposite hands
 
5:12 PM
@rene You don't ever need to trim off some of your leaves?
 
(which may be the same problem as the spacebar problem)
 
I seem to always type probbaly instead of probably.
 
How do you type, anyway, @rene?
 
text just grows
 
I may need an illustration - can you grow me one of those, too?
 
5:16 PM
I'm not a very arty species, sorry.
 
Alas
Y'all should be glad that I'm here typing and you're not trying to listen to me talk - I'm losing my voice so when I do try and talk, I sound like a combination of an adolescent going through their voice change and a strangled goose.
 
You have such a picturesque way with words.
 
Sometimes you do need 3200-year chat bans tho
 
Is this the room where one posts del-pls requests for copy-cat Answers?
 
@Machavity I usually undo those when I see them.
 
5:22 PM
@Scratte You want SO Copycat Version Reviewers three doors down
 
But.. I think this hallway leads to a dead end :O
 
Wrong again. This is the room for arguments.
 
I like arguments :)
 
I prefer parameters.
 
I knew you were say that :D
 
5:25 PM
Been said before, is not?
 
Never! You're just becoming predictable ;)
 
To my current mission: a del-pls or a flag on This Answer?
 
@Catija FWIW I think I've only issued a 30-day chat ban. I can't imagine 9999 bans on SO chat are common
 
@Scratte Are you flagging again?
 
5:27 PM
@AdrianMole No.. I started gambling though. I figured there'd be a few people in here just waiting to fire off their delete votes :)
 
Is there a "Longest chat-ban/suspension/review-vacation issued by moderators" league table?
 
@Machavity I'd guess that most people who are being annoying in chat are also racking up suspensions on sites.
 
@AdrianMole five pounds, right?
 
Five pounds per hour, yes.
 
@AdrianMole Review isn't really possible any more, since the mod-inflicted ones are capped at a year.
 
5:30 PM
Probably. That user is one of the few who causes a ton of Chat issues, but not much in the way of Q&A
 
As are site suspensions for that matter. Only chat suspensions are unbounded.
 
@Catija But the system can still keep doubling their lengths?
... for failed audits.
 
Currently, yes... I'm not sure how I feel about that, to be honest. :/
 
Do these questions 1 and 2 suggest a spammer?
 
I got to an 8-day suspension, once, a long time ago.
 
5:31 PM
There's one user review suspended until 2024...
 
Yeah, there's a dashboard for review suspensions so mods can see how far out they go.
 
@Machavity OK. I was wondering why Mr Skeet hasn't yet earned his Steward badge.
 
@AdrianMole They suspended you while reviewing your claim of being 13 3/4 ? That's just not nice!
 
@AdrianMole Sounds like a bug. BRB pinging a dev to fix that...
 
@AdrianMole But why? I think we can all agree that Jon Skeet is not called Steward. Why would he need a badge with not his name on it?
 
5:35 PM
More importantly, how does one get the "Skeet" badge?
 
@Scratte Requirements: Be Jon Skeet
 
@Scratte Skeet badge - Snipe four answer accepts from a question answered by Jon Skeet
 
Impossible.
 
@Machavity Ah, so it's safe to just leave the trigger for the badge unimplemented.
 
Pretty much. Jon Skeet can divide by zero. Good luck topping that
 
5:39 PM
@Machavity Oh!.. I guess I'm going for the "Gordon" badge instead first then.
 
Remember, that an user was deleted for not accepting an answer by Jon
 
@Braiam That's not true. He questioned Jon's accuracy. The database server segfaulted as a result
 
@Braiam In fairness, the person behind that account suddenly died in a tragic live-shark-and-blender accident before they could accept.
 
@VLAZ I think that is another case.
 
It is not possible to delete vote Answers unless they have a negative score?
 
5:48 PM
Correct. Answers must be negative score for 20k delete votes
 
^^ Sorry - I misread that as a C++ question and reopened it from review, assuming I would be able to dupe-hammer it.
... must work harder to get that C hammer!
 
@Machavity Thank you :) I'll keep a link for when I'm ready to do that then :)
 
@Machavity Hmm.. mathematics says that I'll get there in 2038. It I keep up my current high activity level.
 
@Scratte Try to reach that before the 19th of January 2038, so you can use the privilege. Just in case everything stops working.
 
5:56 PM
^^ Sp AM (badly formatted spam).
 
Is the SD report spam?
 
Yep, IMHO.
Just hundreds of repeats of the same link.
 
@VLAZ Ha!.. lets hope they invent longs before that then ;P
 
@JeanneDark Oops - just noticed, I gave the wrong flag on it! ... fixed.
 
@TylerH I came across this post in the reopen queue. Since your name is in there: why opinion-based?
 
@VLAZ Yes, discussing that in Charcoal is a good idea, there's quite a few members there who are used to dealing with spam.
 
On a closer look, it might be just Too Broad...
 
9:29 PM
@blackgreen I can't guarantee I remember what reason I used on a review nearly 9,000 reviews ago, but I'm guessing I selected "opinion-based", because the question was opinion-based at the time of closing.
 
@pkamb The question has already received a heavily up-voted answer. What is your purpose in wishing it to be re-opened?
 
Because having a heavily up-voted answer isn't a reason for closing questions...?
 
wat
 
@pkamb: that may convince you, but if you want to convince others, and the question doesn't get re-opened soon, you might want to present a stronger argument
 
asking for code isn't a reason to close a question
 
9:37 PM
I agree. I just think it probably attracted downvotes and closure because of the slightly abrasive way it's asking for code.
 
@KevinB: I'm not asking about reasons to close a question, but about inducement to re-open. Myself, I want to be strongly convinced
 
right
is it was closed for a reason that doesn't make sense, and doesn't match any existing close reason, not a great reason to reopen it?
i can't think of a better one
 
The OP states that they tried nothing, a contributor says that there are many ways to do this task, the OP says under the answer that the real scenario is more complex. I'm getting Unclear / Needs Focus vibes. If a question should be closed for any reason, it should not be reopened.
 
@pkamb When I want a question reopened, first I edit out all the needless or potentially triggering language in a post, then I post the reopen-plz
 
I agree with @HovercraftFullOfEels I want to be strongly compelled to vote; not guilted into being merciful.
 
9:45 PM
Having good answer(s) is completely irrelevant in my mind to if the question should remain closed. I can see an argument for Unclear/Focus but definitely not the current close reason.
I'll give it an edit.
 
@pkamb: The question that I like to ask myself is that if this is the type of question that I'd like to see more of on this site, and again, in this situation, I'm just not all that convinced
 
@pkamb So much better now. I might even upvote it.
 
10:22 PM
 
You don't need loops to count. — LarsTech 1 min ago
My fingers would like a word with you....
 
Hello 🥰
 
@manro why you post that link ?
 
So many rules((
Really interesting question
 
10:36 PM
@manro please go through the rules and FAQ first and then post a relevant request. We don't just pop up here asking to close/re-open posts in a conversational manner
 
@manro Along the lines of FAQ #15 please do not post links to posts where you are involved unless you are soliciting honest feedback. In this case when you have a pending edit suggestion.
 
@desertnaut i think, that i have already annoyed to you, sorry 😟
 
@IanCampbell ye, sorry. Because i have wanted that it was opened more faster. Interesting, but closed 🧐
Goodbye 👋
 
10:46 PM
@Makyen sorry, maybe I should have flagged them?
 
@desertnaut No, a ping was fine. That was an RO thing, not a moderator thing.
 
@Makyen cool, thanks
 
@desertnaut np
 
11:03 PM
Is this an answer? (No idea what YYC and Vm are, as I don't do Android - but I can see no mention of them in the question).
 
@AdrianMole Flag as NAA. Comment but not an answer.
 
I considered that but I can't see if it's an attempt. (It was my review that left the Bot comment.) Maybe a del-plz in here?
@Shree - Or you could practice your newly-acquired ability to delete-vote answers. :-)
 
Just flag is enough. Mod handle that. No need to delete vote :)
 
11:25 PM
Out of CVs, fun continues in 35 minutes...
 
11:38 PM
 
@AdrianMole I think it is NAA. I have voted to delete as such.
 
I'm not agreeing that is NAA.
 
Well, when, you edit it like that....
 
You save the answer. Retract my flag.
 
I don't really think the edit changed the content of the answer.
It left more of the original words of the answer intact than most of my edits do. :-)
 
11:43 PM
@CodyGray You want to clear the delete votes?
 
I won't be hurt if you invalidate my vote.
 
Done
Although I wasn't necessarily going to do that because I'm not sure that it's an answer worth keeping around if the community sees fit to delete it
 
I withdrew my downvote but we can't retract deletes.
 
But y'all aren't Android experts, so I guess your delete vote doesn't count :-)
 
@AdrianMole yet
 
11:44 PM
@Catija Aha! A hint.
 
Exciting times. I've always felt like delete votes are second class citizens.
 
As soon as the R&D department completes the time machine, the feature will be added.
 
I'm trying to remember but I think we're working on that and the single delete vote per person thing.
 
There will be a few, very unhappy users. And many other very happy users.
 
Hey @Catija! we don't see you here often
 
11:47 PM
What a nightmare, the last PyCharm update broke all my projects.
 
@desertnaut ... maybe you don't. Haha. I feel like I'm always here. 😅
 
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