« first day (1187 days earlier)      last day (3761 days later) » 

10:00 PM
HOLY CRABAPPLES! I wasted sooo much thyme!!!
 
@qwertynl it's perfectly ok to do dom manipulation yourself - Angular is not a one size fit all. However, DOM manipulation should be separated from the core business logic.
 
:-(
 
@Jhawins like mentioned, I think if we are going to have this we will implement it as an option.
so people who don't want it can opt out of it
 
user1596138
Wait, what? You said that about the returning messages, not the initial response to !!afk
 
well I wasn't aware that it killed both when I merged, I learned that shortly after. however I see value in it not calling either out (if you don't want it too)
so we'll leave it as is until a proper fix can be made.
 
10:08 PM
Hi. I have a question.

I'm used to PHP I have used it for a while, but I doesn't seem to be what the future is looking for, so I want to know from you.

What are the pros & cons of using Node.js compared with PHP and for use within websites vs. Applications
 
not having the message for people who want it I presume is less annoying than getting two pings when you don't want them
 
@Deniro what are you building?
 
@Deniro pro: it isn't PHP. con: you have to learn a new technology (not really a con, but I had to list something right?)
 
Nothing yet.
 
NodeJS has a big overhead, it's a great tool to solve some things. Life is not a one size fit all and different technologies have different problem domains.
NodeJS is definitely worth learning IMO. It's not very comparable to PHP as both have strengths and weaknesses.
 
10:10 PM
I've noticed you have to get your hands dirty in the command line, I like the sound of that :D
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum then why the limited options for condom sizes? seems to me Trojan thinks life is a two sizes fit all.
 
Personally, I think PHP is quite horrible (as a language) - most people here would disagree. Your only way to judge technologies is to try them out.
 
   wow
such helpful error throw syntax
 
!!doge helpful,error,throw,syntax
<error> jquery-1.10.2.js:1
 
use commas
 
10:11 PM
        wow
very helpful
           so error
                         such throw
many syntax
 
!!doge that way, you can, have split, double, words
 
         wow
                        so that way
very  you can
              such  have split
                            much  double
many  words
 
so smart u
 
PHP has strengths? Do you mean ease of employment, optimization for SQL injections and large amounts of useful and well-written tutorials on the Internet?
 
Well, not sure about most.
 
10:11 PM
But for real.. dat error.. wtf
 
Benjamin, I like PHP, however I do get the impression it's built/modified for amateurs.
 
@RUJordan it is because you are initiating something incorrectly.
 
@rlemon needs split(',').map(function(x){return x.replace(/^\s*|\s*$/g,'')})
 
jQuery is minified so you only have one line to error on
 
@copy ease of employment, trivial to find libraries for things, trivial to find themes for things and solve things fast, lots of tutorials and low entry barrier so it's very easy to get project maintainers that'd do boring but needed things to gain experience.
 
10:12 PM
don't use minifed jQuery in development
 
@rlemon or... and wait for it, learn about source maps :D
 
I don't think I am
 
That's what I said
 
yup, not minified
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum I aint got time for no $5 concepts.
 
10:13 PM
Damn, there's quite a lot of people in here.
 
Do you see anything wrong here?
var flag = 0;
$("#search").on("submit",function(e) {
    if (!flag) e.preventDefault();
    $("input[name='groups']").each(function() {
        if ($(this).prop("checked")) flag++;
    });
    if (!flag) {
        alert("A group was not selected.");
        return false;
    } else $("#search").submit();
});
 
!!afk home time
 
@copy It's only as easy to do SQL injection in PHP today as it is in any other language.
 
So, does anyone know much about how secure node.js is?
 
@RUJordan you use query selectors, that sucks :P Also, why the flag?
 
10:14 PM
Basically I'm iterating a group of checkboxes to prevent form submission if there is no selection
 
Wait, ew.
 
if( foo ) {
  bar();
} else baz();
I hate this
 
Yeah it's a very dynamic page so I might have overkilled it
 
SOO HARD
 
And I'm sure you've all seen that video on YouTube, called something like "Node.js is stupid, and if you use it so are you", what do you have to say about that?
 
10:15 PM
node.js is religion
 
@RUJordan have references, don't query your presentation layer for data.
 
@Deniro the guy who made that is a fucking retard
 
@RUJordan no it's not, it's quire far from it.
 
everyone agrees
 
guys... I'm sick as hell...
 
10:15 PM
@Deniro that's someone trolling. There are much funnier trolls
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum that was a joke lol I've barely used node
 
Hey @BenjaminGruenbaum is is "easy" to make an angular js table tree with a "search" option?
 
What do you mean by references?
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum have you wanted any of his other reviews.
 
@Deniro Like the "NodeJS is badass rockstar tech" one - that's a lot funnier. Try Node out, it's quite decent for some stuff.
 
10:15 PM
rlemon, yeah I suppose, but is it really total bull?
 
I'm not sure if he is serious or just a really good troll.
@Deniro yes he is total bull in that video
 
@qwertynl if you want to build one, not too much but don't jump too far ahead - take it one step at a time. If you want one look into AngularUI they have an excellent grid component.
 
but really.
GF is waiting
gotta go
 
@rlemon he's not a liar, just a troll. He is being funny.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum Haha I am trying to figure out if we can port angular to our existing app.
 
10:16 PM
Is there any videos or blog post's proving that he's talking rubbish?
 
@Deniro learn new technologies, don't stop at node.
 
@rlemon cracks whip
 
@be
 
@Deniro learn node, build something real with it (even if only one thing) come back here with real questions.
Is a better than b is almost always a poor question.
 
user1596138
@SomeKittens guess what guess what guess what
 
10:18 PM
@BenjaminGruenbaum What's newer than nodeJS?
 
@qwertynl something like this: angular-ui.github.io/ng-grid
@Deniro why does it matter? Node being 'new' is meaningless - if anything that's against Node.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum Pretty cool, but no tree :-( I am sure I will get to it eventually. I am at this chapter currently
 
OK, You just said "learn new technologies", so I was wondering what's new other than node
 
@qwertynl take your time.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum So I shall
 
10:20 PM
@Deniro not new in general, new to you. Learn Node, learn Rails, learn ASP.NET MVC (and Fubu), learn PHP (decent PHP), learn Python and use something like Django and something like Bottle.
 
user1596138
Well I gotta go home... But @SomeKittens it turns out the majority of Mac apps that I use support full screen (legitimate full screen). But the shortcut is cmd+shift+F instead of F11 for some reason (most likely because Apple is full of assholes looking to make their systems ever so slightly more cumbersome than any others). So yeah, cmd+shift+F == complete fullscreen. Even on Snow Leopard.
 
The more you try the better you understand the problem.
Each platform has strengths and weaknesses.
Anyone who'd tell you "always use X" is naive :)
 
oh, ok.
 
I like the fact of Javascript everywhere :)
 
10:22 PM
@BenjaminGruenbaum Not really. Again I will get to it eventually :-) It is a task tree. Right now we use a table.
 
Can we edit messages here?
 
@Deniro me too
 
@Deniro No Yes
 
user1596138
@Deniro Press the up arrow (think console/terminal) or click the arrow to the left of your message onHover and choose edit. But remove @ pings because as you're seeing now it pings onEdit too.
 
Yes, press up or click the leftmost part of a question and edit it.
 
10:23 PM
Click the up arrow?
oh
 
On your keyboard ^^
 
press :) Cool
 
user1596138
Oops
 
It's ok, I click my keyboard all the time.
 
Yeah, I lick it sometimes too
If I'm bored
 
user1596138
10:23 PM
I click it
 
oow, well no one will beat that
 
user1596138
Anyway. Time to go get some Taco Smell and go home. Later all
 
OK, I will try node now, thanks for the opinions!
 
@Deniro good luck :)
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum Thanks :)
 
10:27 PM
@BenjaminGruenbaum angular uses jQuery? Or are they just similar functions?
 
@qwertynl it uses something called jqLite - it is a very basic form, if you include jQuery it'll use that and integrate with it seamlessly.
 
Some guy is validating hidden fields and wants to focus on the hidden field if the validation fails.
> focus on the hidden field
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum hmmm fancy
 
Generally, you should not use jQuery outside of directives at all, and you should not have selectors anyway.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum Yea, it seems that way. So you can only work with element inside a directive it seems, right?
lol He just talked abt jQuery in angular
 
10:30 PM
@BenjaminGruenbaum hi
 
Hi
 
@qwertynl hi
 
@qwertynl you can whenever you want but you only should in a directive.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum Hmmmm can you access the element in a model at all?
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum do you remember me
 
10:31 PM
@qwertynl you can select it (remember, just like jQuery) or do document.getElementById. It's still JavaScript after all, but you really really really shouldn't.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum Hmmmm so only derective directly give you the element (without direct selecting)?
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum ahh! Later. Now on egghead.
 
@qwertynl you can have a reference from the outside but really - the point is that all presentation logic is declarative and in a directive.
@begiPass vaguely
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum starred that for later
 
10:33 PM
@BenjaminGruenbaum what you mean
 
I got a shit ton of work done today.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum you don't remmeber me
 
@begiPass oh I remember you
What's up :) Still trying to solve the halting problem :D?
 
Fixed a shitty website because IE7/8. Made an API function. Wrote some intense queries. Uploaded an excel sheet to the database and wrote a script to offer a PDF display of said excel sheet.
Go me.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum you mean the test which you have give me
??
 
10:34 PM
@begiPass did you manage to do it :D?
 
no I don't try after
but I manage to get a project
hohoho
 
@begiPass are you sure, I'm sure that you can solve the halting problem - your attempts looked promising.
 
!!define halting problem
 
thank youfor encouragement
 
10:35 PM
@BenjaminGruenbaum really
 
heyI was reading that D:
 
@RUJordan read elsewhere
 
can i post the xkcd comic about halting?
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum I have found a project with android and I almost finish it
 
@RUJordan no you may not :D
 
10:37 PM
sd
 
@BartekBanachewicz last time I was here he said he's a competent developer and wanted to prove it. After not doing well in my initial test, or the one after that - I told him to solve the halting problem - he tried :D
 
fiiiiiiine
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum such competent
 
oh lol i get it
 
much wow
 
10:37 PM
very skill
 
I nearly fixed my css
 
@BartekBanachewicz he said he made progress, and he almost succeeded with the previous task- event emitter - right @begiPass ?
 
but seriously it's so fucking poor language
 
many style
SASS that CSS brah
 
I earned 130 rep in today
 
10:38 PM
@BartekBanachewicz yeah, HTML and CSS need to be rethought.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum burned thrown out and rewritten, you mean?
 
@BartekBanachewicz I asked a dumb C# question to prove @Esailija wrong, it ended up getting 60 upvotes and an interesting answer from Eric Lippert :D
 
!!stat
 
@RUJordan RUJordan has 3160 reputation, earned 7 rep today, asked 47 questions, gave 194 answers. avg. rep/post: 13.11. Badges: 3g 10s 33b
 
@BartekBanachewicz Did you see Crockford's lecture on that?
 
10:39 PM
eh rep
 
no, it is a long time I have not develop with javascript
 
7 rep today
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum not really
 
oh it's an hour long
 
10:40 PM
and the algorithm he take me I don't do any one similar before
 
scheduled for tomorrow then
 
Worth watching, rips on Microsoft
Not sure that's the right one.
@begiPass but you'll do it right?
 
well my internet today was browsing for motorbikes, mostly
 
you really want that halting problem solved
 
It's not very hard, just write a program that takes a program as an input and says if it halts or not... geez.
@BartekBanachewicz that's not the right one, there is a good one where he talks about LaTeX and Scribe
@BartekBanachewicz here - that's the good one, don't watch that other one it's not that good.
It's "why is JS and the DOM is so convoluted"
 
10:42 PM
woh even longer
@BenjaminGruenbaum JS is "convoluted" beacuse it's a terrible unfinished language released too early
 
@BartekBanachewicz it's not terrible, really.
It's also quite finished, at least since ES3, more in ES5 and it's getting better :) Not the point though.
It's a really nice video though :)
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum compared to other mainstream languages, not much. But if you start studying language theory and design, you can really see how bad it is.
I mean, a few months ago I was pointlessly hating on JS
 
@BartekBanachewicz You keep doing that, you have to stop.. I actually have studied those things you can't pull that shit on me :P
 
Now I have much more stuff to compare it to and much more arguments for that
 
Something true mathematically doesn't make it more practical.
The world is full of mathematical concepts that don't translate directly to 'better' in code. First order logic sounds awesome, very wow very simple mathematical model for coding, but in practice it usually sucks. Propositional logic just as well, tree logic well... :P
 
10:45 PM
@BenjaminGruenbaum I'm not saying "prove" now :). I'm just saying that if you, for example, look at Monads and them sorta map them on JS has you can really see how monads are safe and powerful, and JS is just sorta throwing stuff into this bin.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum are you a javscript/php developer
 
@BartekBanachewicz so what if it is?
 
?
 
@begiPass no, @Jhawins is, he is the best PHP developer I know, he is also quite fond of Java.
5
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum it's a source of the problems that appear in JS code commonly, like people mixing dom and logic
 
10:46 PM
@BenjaminGruenbaum where is jhawins
?
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum is one of the "slower" people we have in this room
 
@BartekBanachewicz people who don't understand basic concepts don't understand basic concepts. Is your point that the entry barrier for Haskell is higher (I'm not convinced that's true btw) so people will not get mixing states wrong?
@begiPass I'll tell you if you solve the halting problem ^_^
 
I wont solve it
 
@begiPass no soup for you.
 
I will pay you if you solve it you
 
10:48 PM
@BenjaminGruenbaum haskell is creating a pit of success becasuse of that entry barrier. It requires you to understand stuff you write.
 
@begiPass google "The Halting Problem" :P
@BartekBanachewicz no, it really doesn't :D Code some Haskell for real - seriously. People can, and will get it wrong.
And people do.
 
> google
 
People will gladly abuse systems around concepts they don't understand. That's a fact :D
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum how many, though.
 
@BartekBanachewicz Hah
 
10:50 PM
@BenjaminGruenbaum still, haskell makes that abuse harder and more obvious
 
@BartekBanachewicz I like Haskell, but I really think its strengths are not where you think they are.
 
because monads are "contagious"
 
Or you do and you're just arguing that managing things like DOM separation is their strengths. Which I don't get.
 
@nderscore for(;r=''.split.bind(readline());)print(r('').sort(function(a,b)r(b).length-r(a‌​).length).join('')) works for "Sort by number of occurences"
 
!!define haskell
 
10:51 PM
@RUJordan No definition found.
 
!!urban haskell
 
@RUJordan [Haskell](http://haskell.urbanup.com/1495864) 1 -- A general purpose, polymorphicly typed, lazy functional programming language largely based on lambda calculus.

2 -- A constant source of frustration for those who have been brainwashed by the OO paradigm.
 
@Jhawins HUMP DAAAAAYYYY
 
@BartekBanachewicz not really.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum IO in general
@BenjaminGruenbaum its type system is one of its strong points
@BenjaminGruenbaum code using stuff like unsafePerformIO is obvious, if that's what you mean
 
10:52 PM
@Shmiddty that is horrifyingly beautiful
 
0
Q: Turn jQuery's foo.css('opacity', '0') into foo.alpha = 0

TomI have a background is actionscript and would like to make it easier to set some properties of objects. I'd like to have the ability to set an object's opacity shorthand like so: foo.alpha = 0; instead of foo.css('opacity', '0') Is something like this possible?

eh
 
@BartekBanachewicz Haskell is great because it has awesome pattern matching, comprehension, guards, function typing, partials and common functional patterns out of the box out of the box. It's not awesome because of the I/O monad. The I/O monad is not an elegant solution to a problem - it's redefining the problem in a way that's not obvious and then working around it.
 
@Shmiddty I just wrote another version of "count up digits" and it's still 90 bytes :(
can't figure out a good way to get rid of the second print
 
Oh and lazy, that's also really important in my code.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum what else do you prefer, keeping purity?
 
10:54 PM
Havent seen TheifMaster in a few days now
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum yeah well it's great in general, that's rather obvious :P
 
Where has he been?
 
Managing state in I/O monads isn't why I like Haskell. I like it because it makes writing formulas for math problems I have in real life a lot easier than a lot of other languages I know. Most Haskell I write runs once or twice for a specific calculation or for verifying a general assumption I'm making with a small example set.
 
!!afk train
 
@BartekBanachewicz What do you mean? You have to pass state around and you have to use monads to wrap it because the input/output is not really there - it's wrapped. The I/O monad is quite an obvious solution to the state problem - not obvious in "I would have thought of that for sure", obvious as in "once you see it and use it twice, it's quite clear why it works".
 
10:57 PM
@BenjaminGruenbaum but he is a liar.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum Oh, if you mean that, I think it's a moot point. The language's goal was never to be obvious, let ruby fanboys wank over that, perhaps. It's supposed to make good programs be written in it. And it succeeds.
 
"if you use node.js you are an idiot"
lies!
 
The I/O monad is not used "for purity", it's used because it's the reasonable way to do it, generally monads are a very reasonable thing in Haskell.
 
well obviously IO is impure inside
 
@BartekBanachewicz sometimes.
 
10:57 PM
but because of how this all works, it taints the code
@BenjaminGruenbaum still a few orders of magnitude better than JS
 
Haskell is not a hard language, it's one of the more intuitive languages I coded in (and I'm far far far far far away from an expert) but it does some things really bad and some things really well.
People don't avoid Haskell because they suck and can't code, people avoid it because it's less practical for them.
I use it when it's the easiest tool for me to use.
 
I don't think the worst parts of haskell can be compared with worst parts of JS
And good parts of JS are seriously at least debatable
I can see that you might want to use JS sometimes
I don't see why you insist on telling me it's not terrible
 
Are we "js sucks Haskell is better" again?
 
@BartekBanachewicz I don't want to be a jerk but I sure hope you get it one day.
 
Js isn't terrible.
 

« first day (1187 days earlier)      last day (3761 days later) »