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4:00 PM
@rdlowrey LOL
@rdlowrey :D
user895378
jo
io?
I wish
4:04 PM
Hi PHPers!!!
@ircmaxell yeah
how can I get the RECEIVED headers in a curl request
?
@NikiC would be awesome
@Ocramius this path should have mapping files?
nope, mappings are read from what you already configured. This is the path where the entities will be dumped
user895378
4:06 PM
Who wants to see something awesome?
user895378
$myApp = function() {
    return [200, 'OK', $headers = [], '<html><body><h1>Hello, world.</h1></body></html>'];
};

$server = (new ServerConfigurator)->createServer([
    'listenOn'      => '127.0.0.1:1337',
    'application'   => $myApp,
    'mods'          => [
        'websocket'     => [
            '/chat' => new Chat
        ],
    ]
])->listen();
user895378
^ Serve regular php apps and websockets faster than node.js :)
@rdlowrey btw, did you already try out node 2?
@rdlowrey You beautiful bastard. When can I use this?
user895378
@Jimbo Probably be a good month or two before the repo will stop being private.
4:08 PM
nice one
@rdlowrey That didn't answer the question ;) hint hint
Ah it's all good, looking forward to it
user895378
@Jimbo Within a week or two I'm going to recruit a few people on the condition that they use it and give me feedback.
Convince me to use it :P
user895378
@NikiC If it's come out more recently than ~3-4 weeks I won't have benchmarked against it, no.
@rdlowrey came out a few days ago
maybe now its super awesome fast?
:P
user895378
4:10 PM
Let's hope not :)
user895378
I don't want to go back to micro-optimization hell for another month to catch up.
jQuery 2 is out too, coincidence? :P
@NikiC would you accept a composer.json PR for phlexy?
@igorw yeah, why not
I'm going to have an interesting blog post next week "The next few months" with some really interesting talks and stuff coming up
4:14 PM
@NikiC can I add a branch-alias for 1.0-dev?
@rdlowrey not parsing URLS?
@igorw sure
user895378
@ircmaxell Not sure I know what you're asking.
@NikiC alrighty, done
user895378
@ircmaxell That handler is just a dummy to demonstrate the functionality if you're referring to returning a 200 response for all requests. The websocket mod simply captures all requests for /chat and reroutes them to the specified ws handler before they hit the regular application callable.
user895378
4:19 PM
In actuality, the $myApp handler is passed a standard CGI-like array describing the request environment as well as a unique $requestId so the application doesn't have to respond immediately to the request when invoked.
user895378
A real application would specify an object-based callable as the request handler, inject the HttpServer instance and call HttpServer::setResponse($requestId, $response) whenever it actually finishes generating the response.
@igorw and merged :)
thanks
@rdlowrey right, but is the request URI parsed at that point?
user895378
@ircmaxell yes.
or is it just a ping-echo style server
Ah, ok... That's cool then
4:21 PM
@Ocramius then I probably misconfigured something. For testing I placed mappings into same directory where Entities should be created. Should I specify this pass for mappings somewhere in code?
@rdlowrey you ever looked at mongrel2?
user895378
@igorw I have not.
@rdlowrey you should ;-)
it's basically async fcgi over ZMQ
user895378
I haven't looked at much of anything -- I've just created the server that I wanted :)
I LOVE the StackSort
user895378
4:22 PM
@igorw I've basically done that without the ZMQ with my own custom process manager.
The panicsort is scary
user895378
Because async blows.
@Eugene what metadata driver are you using?
@Ocramius \Doctrine\ORM\Mapping\Driver\AnnotationDriver
@Gordon if I flag a mod, is that going to create a black-hole?
4:24 PM
Who moderates the moderators?
user895378
Same for websocket endpoints -- you can do async with them if you want to, but I prefer to delegate the work to a pre-existing pool of processes so I don't have to worry about blocking even in a shared-everything websocket app context.
@ircmaxell Stack sort? Is that when you post your list to stackoverflow and ask them to sort it?
@Eugene and how can that work with no entities yet? ;)
@NikiC There's title text on the image. Go hover.
@Charles The administrators. But who administrates the admins?
@Charles ah, i see
4:25 PM
@ircmaxell no. only the LHC and googling Google on Google will create black holes
@NikiC Nope, check out the alt text
:-D
@Gordon what about running PHP on PHP?
@Ocramius YamlDriver?
@Eugene yep
@ircmaxell people been there and nothing happened ;)
I've googled for Google on Google, and nothing happened
4:26 PM
Hello all. Does anyone know much about XML in here? I'd like to ask a few very general questions, and I don't think it's suitable to post on the main StackOverflow site.
@Dan @Gordon knows all
@Ocramius Catchable fatal error: Object of class Doctrine\Common\Annotations\PhpParser could not be converted to string in /home/sandbox/project/vendor/doctrine/common/lib/Doctrine/Common/Persistence/Map‌​ping/Driver/DefaultFileLocator.php on line 69
@Dan: check out the room description in the upper right corner of the page ;-)
@Ocramius exceptions just keep coming and coming. So tired :(
@ircmaxell Indeed, but I will be using PHP..
4:27 PM
So, @Gordon do we have an alternative yet?
@Dan No, meaning "don't ask if you can ask a question, just ask it. If anyone is around and can help, they will"
@MadaraUchiha to creating black holes?
@Gordon Better! The mysql_* comment
@MadaraUchiha i dont know. Did they put something below the gist yet?
4:28 PM
Shut up and use PDO! Is that an alternative?
Oh, you told em to comment?
Let's check
@Eugene I told you what approach is the easiest :) But anyway, no idea about why that is happening
Nope, nothing there
well, then I guess, we dont have an alternative yet
Well, I know of a certain someone who'd be disappointed :P
4:30 PM
@Gordon I really don't feel anything to change in current comment.. It almost fine for now
@ircmaxell Ah ok. Well in a nut shell...I'lll be on Wordpress...part of the site is populated from a third party via an iFrame (which sucks). They now offer some direct access to the data and I've been emailed a spec sheet but I don't know what I can do with it.
I've got FTP details to a server where one XML file is updated every hour, and some XML spec' details including some location on a C:/ drive. I have not the slightest clue how I'd connect with this data. I've been reading tutorials but I've not seen anything on this kind of matter, so I hoped someone could tell me if this is possible or not. I'm aware I know nothing about this, sorry..
@Eugene you should probably gist the stack trace :)
We have such a crappy internet connection here at the moment, downloads switch beterrn 200B/s to 2MB/s then back down
@Dan Check out DomDocument. As far as the spec, you can use it manually to learn how to interact with the xml document (what to expect, and so on)
Well, I assume with some work I can learn how to interface with it, I just don't know how you connect.
I can't see an address where the data "comes from" if you know what I mean..
4:33 PM
well this is weird... submitting to a page and $_POST and $_FILES being completely empty O_o
@Dan ftp to the server, and download the file locally. Then process it as a local file
@ircmaxell Can this be done with code or is this only done manually?
it can be done with code
:( No matter how much I learn, it seems like I know nothing.
file_get_contents can pull from an FTP location (if you know the path ahead of time). If not, there are libraries that can do it for you
@Dan no matter how much you ever learn, there will always be a ton of things you don't know
4:35 PM
I don't at the moment. Just FTP location, user and password.
@ircmaxell Have you noticed the alt-text?
the key to learning, is to learn how to learn. Then you can know anything by simply learning it
I've got one folder in the root, and nothing else.
Pretty sparse compared to what I'm used ti.
to*
@MadaraUchiha yes, that's why I talked about giving the StackSort in interviews
4:36 PM
oh FFFFFFFFFFFFFFUUUUUUUU! I always forget to tweak the post/file upload size :( Request went throught without request body :\
I R STOOPID
@Ocramius you put the OOP in stoopid!!!
@Ocramius is STID
now, spending 1 hour on something like that really is something btw...
@Eugene one of your passed in paths is wrong
@ircmaxell I see this function: ftp_get() - would that be an option?
you're passing in the annotation reader instead of a path (first guess)
@Ocramius thank you.
4:47 PM
an option? sure
@ircmaxell Ok, I'd like to see if I can get this data on a running on a page, just super basic. I've got ftp details and that's it. I'll see how this goes.
good luck
LOL
Have you guys seen this?
4:56 PM
Interesting post: @mageekguy depicts ZO+ as a trojan horse from traditionalists to regain control over progressives http://blog.mageekbox.net/?post/2013/03/13/A-propos-de-l-evolution-de-PHP
. . .
"Money should never be a reason that a passionate entrepreneur or professional can't attend Makers Academy, so let us help."
Tuition: £5,000
Anonymous
just opened SO, to read that ive got a third gold badge hehehe ;)
@PHPNooB Not impressed with your recent answers using mysql_*
:P
@PHPNooB You're mad.
4:59 PM
Damn you! He has unsung hero
Anonymous
@Jimbo you cant write impressed and @PHPNooB in the same line ;)
@ircmaxell I'm surprised it took so long for the blog war to start. #phpdrama
I am not getting involved
but I agree
Anonymous
@ircmaxell what about what you said, that happens in this room, is extremely rarely? believe me now?
@PHPNooB huh?
@webarto even better: abstrusegoose.com/249
@ircmaxell :D
user895378
@ircmaxell regarding your earlier question about whether or not the URI had been parsed ... this is what the request environment looks like that's passed to handlers when invoked.
Anonymous
@ircmaxell nvm
@webarto What this "makersacademy" are doing is a complete scam
5:10 PM
@rdlowrey Ah nice. So that handles my issues :-D
I should start configuring boom with my SO answers...
@Jimbo You can apply that to many things (similar ones).
Anonymous
Someone just turned into tiny avatar man. Now that uncle gordon is here around the clock, I can't afford to throw tantrum. :(
@webarto Go on?
I need to finalize my plans for world domination^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^Hteaching people how to develop (test-first and security-first, right from the start)
5:20 PM
@ircmaxell +1 where do I sign up?
I need to actually do it. I just have notes now...
do eeeet
Well, then do I write it as a book
or do I do it as a class
or a video series
or a virtual class (like Grumpy's)
@ircmaxell this
er, video series
5:31 PM
@ircmaxell oh my, it worked. Basic but I have the .xml file on my server.
It takes a little while to download, so I'm not sure what I can do about that, but it's great to see it working.
Would ftp_nb_fget() work better? It says it works in the background.
@Dan Only if you have something else to do while it is running
Anonymous
in oop, what is best method when naming constructor? using the same name as the class or using __construct ?
@webarto lol
@PHPNooB __construct
5:34 PM
@Pheagey maybe, maybe not
@DaveRandom Well, I have no idea. This XML file is updated on another server once an hour, and so I suppose I'd want it once an hour. With Wordpress I think I can use the wp_cron() function to schedule an event. I wonder if this will work in the background or if it will slow the site down for the user?
> As of PHP 5.3.3, methods with the same name as the last element of a namespaced class name will no longer be treated as constructor. This change doesn't affect non-namespaced classes.
Surely it works on it's own, and gets the XML file on the hour, just replacing the one that's on the server currently.
something very strange is happening...
5:35 PM
@PHPNooB Aside from consistency with everyone else on the planet, that's why you use __construct() ^^
phpstorm knows the types of my variables in my view scripts...
but... how?
@Ocramius magic
@Gordon no frikking idea so far. I think it matches variable names within my controllers O_o
scary
@Dan I'm not sure when wp_cron() fires its events. If its at the beginning then yes, there would be some value to a non-blocking call, but if it's at the end (much more likely) then there wouldn't. When it says "in the background" it's only "in the background of the current script's execution environment", if your script isn't doing anything other than the file download or is doing the file download as its last operation, it won't make any difference.
@Gordon congrats
5:39 PM
not even that... I don't have the same variable names in controllers... wtfwtfwtf
@Ocramius Not-so-static code analysis :-P
@DaveRandom idd indeed O_o
/me scratches eyes
International Direct Dialling? I doubt that will help...
@DaveRandom I think wp_cron() schedules an even and it's triggered when the site is viewed.
user895378
5:43 PM
wow ... wp_cron() ... is regular cron not good enough for WordPress? :)
@Dan I know that much, I just don't know at what point during WP's regular request handling procedure it is done (i.e. before the page is generated or after). I would very much hope it's the last thing that the request does because anything else would be insane, but sanity doesn't mean a whole lot to WP developers.
evening all
user895378
@DaveRandom You forgot to put quotes around "WP developers"
@DaveRandom Is WP seen as being a bit dodgy to hardcore PHP developers then?
lol ^
@rdlowrey It's a poor-mans cron, invoked by the request, since WP is often hosted in shared environments without proper cron.
5:44 PM
@rdlowrey "not good enough for WordPress" is funny by itself already :P
It's not a completely ridiculous idea, and IIRC it can be configured to use proper cron if it's available
user895378
I hereby declare all hacks to workaround shared hosting officially dubious.
Someday I may have the knowledge to write my own CMS, until then it's WP for me : )
@Dan WP is great for what it is (heavily abstracted, very easy for a complete beginner to use) but it's a far cry from what you might call "real PHP"
@DaveRandom ok, I get the gist. I'm sure someone like me is a total pain on here...I'm well aware my PHP knowledge needs work, and I pick up a book when I can. I'm certainly keen to learn! I'm a designer too, and CSS interests me the most. Can't learn it all (sadly). Anyway, your point on wp_cron() makes sense to me, so I had better try some ideas out.
user895378
5:47 PM
</elitistWordpressBashing>
@rdlowrey I was actually referring to the WP core dev team rather than "userland devs" (as it were) - you can't be too unfair to them because they don't know any better. Probably 95% just do not and will never give a crap how it actually works, they only care that it works. Which is a shame, because it often doesn't.
@rdlowrey PHP Notice: Constant a already defined
user895378
@Ocramius lol
@Dan Most designers suck at developing and most developers suck at designing (at least what I have seen around me)
user895378
@DaveRandom You're right, of course.
5:49 PM
@Dan Actually you are head and shoulders above the rest because you seem to have actually read some docs/done a little research/ask intelligent follow-up questions
Yes, typically. I've seen some SHOCKING design work from developers.
@Dan guilty :D
user895378
^ That's the truth. Researching before you run for help is an epic win in most circles. PHP circles for sure.
; )
I hereby declare @Dan the newbie of the day! All heil @Dan
5:50 PM
Love those:
thx than :) I dont want to create next question and you seems very skilled, I am rebuilding my project to symfony because of performances and security... and i would have just few small question if you could please add me on skype for while "trki_svk_bj" then u can feel free to remove me just for a moment please! :) thx anyway :) — Trki 5 mins ago
*wipes tear from eye
user895378
Heil @Dan!
:-)
I'm sure mum will be proud.
5:51 PM
:-P
user895378
Someone needs to photoshop this man a certificate or something for his refrigerator.
I can do the photoshop bit ok..!
I've debated learning C++ actually, perhaps this would give me a solid foundation for PHP and my Wordpress projects..? How did you guys learn?
5:53 PM
<3 @webarto
@all kindly try and break/improve gist.github.com/DaveRandom/c23d394cb4f1af211b94, I'm going to PR it into this when I have time
@DaveRandom Was dat? Is that about the lovely discussion this afternoon I saw when switching tabs and doing some real work?
@Dan C++ has almost nothing to do with PHP, although I am not discouraging you learning it. I learned essentially by buggering about and making useless stuff, until eventually I started coming up with useful stuff.
Well, I think I'd like to know some OOP
@Dan I learned most by hacking. In school I had also done some c++ / java, the education kinda sucks here on this topic
5:56 PM
And I don't know enough about communicating with MySQL
hacking == hacking together stuff btw
Well, I came from nothing and started with WP early on. The first time I saw the loop I thought "what the f*** is that"
I did some html, then added css and then php. After a while I started messing with jQuery too.
Once I had enough of hacking together stuff I started really learning. After that up to now I just get yelled at in here as a way of motivation
@PeeHaa Indeed. It's basically an eval()-free bitwise expression evaluator. It's a little nasty in a way because it evaluates inner (bracketed) expressions and converts the results back to a string from the inside out rather than parsing it properly, but it does seem to be 100% compliant with what php.ini allows for error_reporting
@PeeHaa @Dan that "clicks" after a couple of years of patching mud together
5:59 PM
@Ocramius Well, I'm two years in I think..
: \
@Dan time to upgrade :)
Indeed. I met my girlfriend a little while ago, that REALLY helps work..
@Dan lol @ The Loop, I love this idea that every page ever only needs one loop. That kind of sums up my big problem with WP: it abstracts things so much that you get really bizarre ideas like this.
 <?php if ( have_posts() ) : while ( have_posts() ) : the_post(); ?>
I love that code sample. No vars, no nothing, just pure magic
@DaveRandom Well, I don't often have a single loop. It will do for basic stuff but after a while you have to make some loops yourself.
@Dan suuuuure :P
6:02 PM
@Ocramius Seriously, you can say goodbye to learning anything when you're with someone.
@Dan Oh I know that, it just amuses me that they have managed to boil such a complex operation down to a tiny fragment like that
@DaveRandom Rather than gets rows from a MySQL table "manually"?
@Dan if you ever find a solution, tell me. I'm still wondering how she gets to distract me even when I have in-ear-canal headphones...
@igorw thanks
@Dan Well yeah, and all the other hundreds of small things going on underneath.
6:05 PM
@Ocramius Haha, we do alright. Quite often we work next to each other..!
<!-- REALLY stop The Loop. -->
 <?php endif; ?>
lol
@DaveRandom don't tell me that's in the repo...
That seems a little bit color: 1px;
@DaveRandom Yes. I do understand your point. It's just to "disconnected" right?
@webarto wow that escape function is supr slick!
6:07 PM
@Dan Precisely, you have no real control over what it actually does, and if something goes wrong it's a black box. But it serves its purpose - it allows complete beginners/people who don't want to know how it works a very simple interface to do something incredibly complicated.
Driving an automatic, right? haha
@DaveRandom I'll pretend I didn't read it
@Dan I would say more like hiring a chauffeur, but yes, that sort of thing
So what do you guys do on a project? Write a CMS?
I'm intrigued to know how a decent developer would go about launching a client-controllable 5 page site.
Depends entirely on the project and the working environment. Small projects often don't warrant all that work (just make it work) and larger projects, unless you are running them, have often made that decision for you
6:09 PM
@Dan writing a simple blog is challenging enough at the beginning :)
I've always though, on a smaller site, I need hardly anything WP does, so perhaps sometime I'll try and make my own.
Eventually I reach a point where it's all too much. I say "balls" and grab a bottle of beer. I love my work, but I love having some kind of life too.
I'm 25, and not getting younger...no going back to study so it's a one way street now.
Hi, I'm needing render a string with smarty. Looks like this is possible using fetch("string:$myString") but didn't worked for me. I think this is because I'm using Smarty 2. Can I render a string, without creating temporary files with Smarty 2? Someone knows?
I remember life. Wasn't a fan.
@Dan you picked the wrong job if you say no going back to study
I just realized something; most of the polyfills for media-queries in IE6/7 are... well, kinda useless. Chances are, if someone is running IE6/7, they haven't yesterday gone out and thought to themselves "Golly gee, I'm buying a 3840x1600 WUXLGASP.NET² monitor"
6:12 PM
@DaveRandom lolo
@Dan I'm 28, gone back twice. Chances are, going again.
@Ocramius I mean paying to go to Uni. I learn every single day. Without fail.
@Bracketworks What are you going to study?
Well, I got 2 diploma programs completed; electronic marketing/web-design, and then general application programming; both 2 years (thankfully they share a 1st, so I did it in 3)
But I'm going to see about going international; Canada here, and some other countries are a bit more forgiving on the lack of a BA for higher education.
@Bracketworks Well, they both sound very useful. I'm a musician.
@Dan What kind of music do you make?
6:15 PM
@Bracketworks And what polyfills..? I don't care much for IE6 and I'm very interested in responsive design.
Buddy of mine went to the same school as I did, mind you for business admin; he's in Germany now doing an MBA
@PeeHaa Loud music :P I'm a guitarist, I used to teach before I started learning to code.
Cool
@Bracketworks Could be an option then..?
@GarouDan Try fetch("eval:$myString"), if it's not working then verify that $myString really does hold the data you think it does
6:16 PM
@PeeHaa It helps to even out the geekiness of being a web designer.
@Dan I dunno, there's alot of media-query.js going around, I just realized that most people running legacy IE aren't (likely) running big monitors. So eff 'em.
@Dan What, for me? MBA? No, but Germany, possibly, provided that they view my schooling similarly.
@Dan :-)
@Bracketworks Well, I've just been writing some cool stuff with :nth-child-of() which IE8 and less doesn't support. This is for the responsive (smaller screen only) version so it's ok.
We (him and I) went to a "college" in Canada; now I don't know how different countries differentiate, but it seems he was eligible for a masters program.
If IE looks "ok" then that will do for me.
@Bracketworks How did the grades compare?
6:17 PM
@Dan Yeah, mobile-only, you're much better off (albeit, not entirely with legacy Blackberry)
Guys, I need some advice.
@Dan You mean, how is he doing now?
I'm not sure how they determined whether or not he was eligible; but I do know he's doing quite well; he's a smart guy, but no prodigy.
@Bracketworks I don't care about blackberry either. Have you checked many analytics results? Most viewers are iOS and sometimes Android. Blackberry users are as common as IE6 users for me.
@Bracketworks Yeah, I was wondering how you may of compared. If you want to do it, and can, maybe you should go for it?
@Dan Eh, depends on the industry you're developing for. I've noticed similar results, but I'm sure others vary wildly.
Come to the UK, it's damn expensive haha
6:19 PM
Pff, yea, I know; not to mention I'd be international.
I have an application which includes very large forms (50 fields minimum)
40,000+ CAD per year.
I want to keep the data in the database, to be able to display it later.
oh, it seems like they listened to us
Either way, its a consideration.
6:20 PM
there's a new pope... benny16 is not gonna get back
@Bracketworks Blackberry aren't my bag. I mean, teenagers use BBM because they don't want to ask people for their "real" number and hardcore business people seem to like them, but since all the other smart phones I think they've been left behind. Even the newest blackberry looks a bit pants.
Shame, bring back the Nokia 3310.
Snake was better than all the crap apps that are around.
Is it, or is it not a good idea to just save a json_encoded string in the database?
@Dan +1
@Dan Not to mention you could use it as a blunt weapon.
@MadaraUchiha see NoSQL
6:22 PM
Snake in Fast Tracker 2 was reeeealy amazing
Wait nevermind, I'm thinking a generation or 2 previous.'
@MadaraUchiha If that's the data you are storing, sure. But if it's just a cheap trick to store vectors in a scalar, then I would say it's a terrible idea.
Right, I'magohomenow
laters @DaveRandom
Laterz @all
user895378
@DaveRandom Peace out
6:27 PM
@Bracketworks yes. You know what app I like the most on my phone? The torch - yes, in the loft or the garage this app is king.
@Dan also when cleaning the inners of my laptop
:P
user895378
I don't want to write any CSS. Can anyone suggest a file(s) I can hotlink to for example HTML files that live in a github repo so I don't have to add bloat to the repo?
user895378
something like twitter bootstrap that I can hotlink?
user895378
Basically for code coloring and whatnot ...
6:31 PM
don;t be stupid, write your damned CSS
@rdlowrey twitter bootstrap? :)
you could also have some fun with yeoman, it's gone beta now
user895378
@Ocramius I feel like hotlinking their github would be frowned upon ...
@ircmaxell Didn't read that yet, only saw "Ruby on Rails" in there and immediately concluded that they saved those servers less because the moved to Go and more because they moved away from Ruby ^^
@rdlowrey ah, you mean for serving stuff?
isn't there a cdn for bootstrap?
Hi everyone!
user895378
6:38 PM
I dunno probably. It's been so long since I did anything front-end I'm an ubern00ber.
user895378
> Hey guys, can you help? CSS room is dead.
Anybody know, do Phalcon already have Forms classes?
@Kirzilla hey
There is no word about Forms in official docs.
user895378
6:41 PM
Don't get me started on the inanity of Phalcon.
user895378
People realize that PHP turns into C under the hood, right?
user895378
If your PHP framework is too slow it's because your PHP framework is too slow -- NOT because your PHP framework is written in PHP.
@rdlowrey, not agree with you. Probably you think that DateTime class also turns php into C under the hood? :)
I'm not using Phalcon because of speed
I've just took some look into it
Imho, very nice and easy to understand framework.
user895378
@Kirzilla Then what reason could you possibly have for writing a PHP app with something that isn't PHP?
Great. I'm already out of delv's. Thanks @crypticツ
@DaveRandom, thx. I already tried this. Looks like eval don't work in Smarty 2 =(
@rdlowrey Many people also like CodeIgniter and CakePHP :) Think about that and you have your answer
6:47 PM
@rdlowrey I'm using Phalcon, but I still continue writing in php. Absolutely the same with zf,zf2, symfony etc. We nevel (eh...almost) do not modify root libs, but create our own classes inheriting from framework's classes. The same with Phalcon. I can't get what's wrong with compiled framework concept. PS: Sorry for my English.
user895378
@Kirzilla If you never want to modify the framework code, sure, that's fine. The point is you're giving up a lot of control over what your application does -- that's what I take issue with.
@rdlowrey Ah, you meant that. Sure, I fully agree with you! Modifying Phalcon for personal needs - is wasting of time.
@Kirzilla As long as you are using Phalcon for reasons that are NOT performance, you're good
@NikiC frankly speaking I've never faced applications having problems with php performance. But everyday I face problems with data mining, data saving performance (relational DB, nosql etc.). Code is easy to rewrite, but restructure data is much more difficult.
@Kirzilla aint that the truth...
6:55 PM
hey avatar bro!
hay buddy :)
:-)
@Pheagey I suppose that you're right, but I'm saying about my experience only
@Kirzilla indeed. I think we have all encountered projects we wished we could re-structure from the ground up.
@Pheagey sure! every project, every day :)

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