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14:00
@LucDanton But it will provide a library of constraints which will either become useless later, or result in breaking changes, or all kinds of weird alternate naming schemes :S
@DeadMG You can't put breakpoints in empty lines, I guess.
> The implementations are not the same. What will happen in either implementation if a and b are equal?
lol
Eh. The proposal is far from being incorporated. Make sure to voice that opposition though, e.g. having the 'almost-but-not-quite-concepts' put in std::experimental_concepts or whatever.
Maybe because > is implemented in terms of <. The > implementation needs to swap the arguments. So maybe < does this for consistency.
Well, "the crap from concepts lite" == "constraints" if you want.
Ya know I really skipped over that part. All I had running in my head by that point was "And I can feed it all of my annex/type_traits.hpp!". (And I guess now annex/concepts.hpp, yum yum.)
14:02
@TonyTheLion May I suggest finding a different place to work?
Yo anyone has experience with function templates and constexpr? Is constexpr foo<T> make_foo(T&&); a good thing or not?
Basically, I don't like the idea of dropping beta features in standard text unless they are completely unusable (export), because then people will use them, and then have pressure from backwards compatibility limiting the final design. I admit may be too conservative on this matter. So, concepts lite as a basis for brainstorming? Yeah, sure, go on. As a proposed extension to C++? Please, no.
What about std::tr1? I thought that went smoothly :s
Sorry, I guess I should have been more explicit: not just putting in another namespace, but also making it a separate document like for <filesystem> and whatnot. So no touching the Standard!
Fuck it I'll put constexpr wherever I remember to put it.
@R.MartinhoFernandes I suppose the one important difference is that the 'primitive' composite have associated types, e.g. filter returns filter_range.
Fuck the Uni.
Still, I've made those public for the time being because I really have no idea whether it'll be useful or not. So I won't worry about all that until it comes up.
@LucDanton I am not putting those types in detail, but I don't think I'll document them.
huh
14:16
Oh right initial motivation was "what if someone wants to reach inside and grab the embedded container in there to retrieve the left-over stuff". A bit complicated because e.g. you can't know which elements were visited or not but I'd rather have it than not have it.
also, when I push Debug, VS doesn't rebuild changed files.
that's surprising and quite irritating
@LucDanton The slow process running on the back of my head has hinted before that I will need such functionality, but I have been trying to ignore its warnings until I really do need it :S
Ye I think it makes sense for tasks like parsing, which decoding is not too far from.
At least in the Haskell world I always see mentions of 'leftovers' when parsing is in sight.
Ah, can't write span until I have saving. No matter.
I used Flask today, and I loved it! :D
I never thought that what I just said would be a convo killer.
:P
14:31
Dammit, I'll need ref support on my optional.
@R.MartinhoFernandes Do you actually want something deliverable (I can target 4.8.1)? Or proof-of-concept is enough? Because I'm a bit all over the place and at this point I'm implementing what ever is my fancy.
What, are you implementing something for me?
No. But if you ever want to compile the stuff and want to toy with it better tell me sooner than later though.
Ah. I can easily get a gcc-snapshot, so don't worry about it.
@DeadMG usually it opens a little dialog and asks you if you want to rebuild or not - maybe you checked the "never ask me again" checkbox, and selected "no"? :p
14:35
Right. Should tell me if there's any feature you'd like to see also because I might not think to implement it.
Ell
Ell
Hmm I forgot why constexpr can't be inferred
I have following this advice for a couple months now.
I usually shave naked.
Gets rid of that problem.
Ell
Ell
I don't use shaving cream
Gets rid of that problem
I used to cut myself a lot but now I'm pro
I'm pro at cutting myself.
Ell
Ell
14:44
I'm a pro at being a n00b
o_0 I stopped shaving... seems to have worked quite well so far
Xeo
Xeo
I should get to shaving again
This beard is getting annoying
just burn it off :D
GCC failed to build...
> error: unused variable ‘slot’ [-Werror=unused-variable]
FFS
lol
14:48
Anyone knows what should I do to disable warnings as errors in the build?
Xeo
Xeo
-Wno-unused-variable? :P
Remove -Werror or -Wno-error=unused-variable?
Xeo
Xeo
Oh, you can also no- that -Werror=?
I am not typing the build commands.
I am looking for a configure flag or something.
Sorry I'm not familiar with configure/metabuild systems.
14:52
Ah, --disable-werror.
When a problem crops up I tend to google around and someone else has a workaround :s
And now back to slicing. I'll bring take/drop/split later.
15:07
0
Q: Java and PHP rant

ShireAlmost every news I'm reading lately regarding programming has to do with bashing on PHP or Java. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3748961 This poll shows the most disliked languages and clearly PHP wins this with Java right behind it trailing by 2 points only. IMO these two langua...

He's about to get shit on real hard.
Wow.
Someone find a dupe.
dammit
too late
I upvoted his question, just to troll the tidal-wave of downvotes.
Ooofff
Removing my downvote set this guy to 18
@ThePhD You did not.
15:09
Well, good luck bro.
@R.MartinhoFernandes I did, for like 1 minute. :D
Then i changed it.
aww, I can't see the history?
Xeo
Xeo
Too fast :|
15:16
Should I care about slice<To<4>>(r) where r is forward?
Eh, that's what take is for.
which one is more repulsive: perl or php?
6
both?
probably still better than asp
@Mysticial Why can't I see the edit history on that?
Ninja'ed before 5 minutes.
15:26
Shat.
@Telkitty猫咪咪 ASP was cool for its time... but it's garbage now.
Hi :)
Does anyone know how to make clang tell you what cannot exactly be substituted when you get a substitution failure?
Xeo
Xeo
Normally it should tell you in a note.
What's your version?
svn
from last week
15:28
question anyone know how to import softhidreceiver.hiddevice com object in an atl com class? I tried to import it but visual studio creates a *.tli and *.tlh file that is malformed but the dll source code compiles fine and I can reference it fine from managed code. weird. :S
@Xeo the note tells me, "substitution failure"
and thats it
@jeffery Did you say COM?
vomits
note: candidate template ignored: substitution failure
@ShotgunNinja yes but it works on windows 8 and com is still used for device drivers in windows.
note: candidate template ignored: substitution failure
  [with T = int]: type 'int' cannot be used prior to '::' because it has no
  members
Looks like so normally.
15:30
I've posted a question in case anyone wants to go for it
yep
most of the times, it tells you why
sometimes it doesn't
it tells you the types that were deduced tho, but those were the types I was expecting
@jeffery That doesn't mean it isn't gross.
I was hoping there was a pragma or something such that I could turn out extra output for a single overload
or a compiler flag
but haven't been able to find anything like that in the documentation
Xeo
Xeo
If it doesn't tell you what caused the subst. failure, it may just be too complicated of an expression.
There are few flags that control that sort of output. IIRC there's one for how many instantiation contexts to display before skipping them. Unlikely to be helpful here.
for my overload it outputs two lines :/
15:35
@R.MartinhoFernandes ^GCC is contagious.
file.hpp:111:32: note: candidate template ignored: substitution failure [with T = double, nd = 4]

template<class T, int nd> auto begin(Eigen::Matrix<T,nd,1>& v) ^(points at the beginning of begin)
@ShotgunNinja I know but I like a challenge. But I have the code in a manageable form if you want to take a look minus the softhidreceiver class which is getting on my nerves.
@StackedCrooked parse1("PUTAIN", "");
Right.
I see you still know some French.
right
all I have to do is fix the offsets from the lexer not being correct for some reason and then I can have nice green comments.
15:37
@EtiennedeMartel I wanted something that would be a common typo for PUT.
an epic achievement, I know
@StackedCrooked Like PIT.
@EtiennedeMartel However, I like the output. It's like the server is angry.
@StackedCrooked Probably PIT is more likely. It doesn't involve hitting three extra characters all over the keyboard.
ITT French is a typo.
user142019
15:38
> fatal: could not read Username for 'https://github.com': Device not configured
user142019
Lolwot?
Admit it, you were looking for a joke.
@Xeo do you know if there is a way to output the expression anyways?
I have no idea what you are talking about.
I deny everything.
Ok, I admit :(
@ShotgunNinja you help me with it I'll trade my life away on any of your c++ projects (I'm a nut because I will code in anything hard sometimes.). P.S. I'm a little rusty but can still program fairly good in c++. Anyways back to main discussion
15:39
@ThePhD Guess what "putain" means?
However, I think code like this will lead to exponential amount of object code if the number of variables increases. (Which probably will shrink when the optimizer kicks in, but still..)
@EtiennedeMartel Not a clue. :D
@ThePhD It means "whore".
Haha
No route for whores.
Very nice.
I wish everyone was as easy to please :)
15:41
I'm sleepy :(
Ell
Ell
What is the study of Turing machines, finite state machines, pushdown automata etc, called?
hello, Jeffrey.
@LucDanton what are those flags? I'd like to try them.
@jeffery I don't have any C++ projects going on atm, and I'm a bit rusty myself.
@jeffery hai
15:42
In theoretical computer science, automata theory is the study of mathematical objects called abstract machines or automata and the computational problems that can be solved using them. Automata comes from the Greek word αὐτόματα meaning "self-acting". The figure at right illustrates a finite state machine, which belongs to one well-known variety of automaton. This automaton consists of states (represented in the figure by circles), and transitions (represented by arrows). As the automaton sees a symbol of input, it makes a transition (or jump) to another state, according to its transi...
My guess.
@Ell Automata
Ell
Ell
Oh right I'm so silly.thank you :)
@jeffery That's not a very good deal, now is it.
lol, why is this textarea resizable?
I wonder if I could write a constexpr demangle function that makes use of __PRETTY_FUNCTION__.
15:45
Does anyone have a tablet?
@Jeffrey Do I look like a bitch?
@EtiennedeMartel why :(
automata theory is exactly what iam doing on my project here (trying to emulate 20 mouse devices and crash my computer by having 20 people steal away the mouse from each other :P): kinectmultipoint.codeplex.com if anywants to take a stab at it I have a c++ wrapper for the dsf functions in the planning link in downloads section which is close to being finished. I still need a reference to softhidreceiver.hiddevice.1 in hidreceiver.dll.
or similar
@EtiennedeMartel I meant Pen tablets not PC tablets
sorry its softhidreceiver.dll. which is included with dsf in the windows 7 wdk.
15:48
@Jeffrey Hm?
@EtiennedeMartel Something like this
@Jeffrey Yes, I know what those are.
I'm surrounded by artists at work.
@gnzlbg Try -ftemplate-backtrace-limit.
I was thinking of buying one for: animations (one of my inner desires) and taking notes and stuff. I was wondering if anybody could suggest me a brand or model...
user142019
mix docs y u no generate documentation.
15:52
@EtiennedeMartel what d'you mean?
Ell
Ell
@Jeffrey I have a wacom bamboo pen
@Jeffrey I work in games.
I was actually planning on using the project above with an xbox Kinect in a school environment (I work at a school as an IT programmer coop student). I just want to see the teachers faces when I implement it. ;}
@EtiennedeMartel cool. what games?
@Jeffrey Casual games on mobile.
15:53
@EtiennedeMartel program games? what platform?
@Ell how is it?
Ell
Ell
Its pretty awesome. I don't use it that much because I don't have the need for it
But I never had any problems with it
@Etienne you broke my not getting nervous streak.
56 secs ago, by Etienne de Martel
@Jeffrey Casual games on mobile.
Ell
Ell
It turns out I'm bad at art though xD
15:54
@Ell Welcome to the club
@EtiennedeMartel just in general multiple platforms or for windows phone or I-phone?
@jeffery iOS, Android.
Iam okay at buildings but suck as human figures.
drawing buildings
WinPhone is simply not popular enough right now.
@EtiennedeMartel wow, OpenGL and Objective-C then...
15:55
I like the new windows phone better even though people do not use it much.
@Jeffrey C++.
There are too many Jeffreys
I still use windows phone 7.5 and see no reason for it to not be of use but like android.
There's some Objective-C++ for the iOS port, and that's about it.
android too
15:56
@thecoshman One is Jeffrey and the other is Jeffery.
@DeadMG He's dyslexic, it's the same for him.
@thecoshman One is cool, the other is not
ones rey and other ery. My name is spelled Jeffery and I have 2-3 family members with the same first and last name
@jeffery Sounds fun.
As in John John and Alice Alice?
15:58
@Jeffrey And we have both a D3D11 and an OpenGL ES 2 renderer.
@R.MartinhoFernandes Tomato Tomato.
@R.MartinhoFernandes St.John-Smythe.
@EtiennedeMartel Wait, what do you use Direct3D for if you have OpenGL on both platforms?
@Jeffrey We have a PC version for development purposes.
16:00
I thought directx used open GL under the hood? I spent too much too look up articles on open gl for awhile on gamastra.
Stupid names
We're also a R&D team, so sometimes we want to try new things and push stuff further. D3D11 wrecks GL ES in that regard.
@jeffery Oh dear.
@LucDanton thanks! I just tried it, and clang still doesn't tell me anything about the error, only "substitution-failed" -.-
16:01
sorry if I got them confused.
Makes sense
@jeffery DirectX has Direct3D. It's an OpenGL competitor.
fuck you, VC++11 debugger. Y U STOP DEBUGGING ON pop eax instruction, when it pops return address?
Like I said, could really do with those English lessons
16:02
It's really fustrating, I know clang knows what cannot be substituted and where, and I know that it deliberately doesn't want to tell me
I just hope I could force it out of it
ollydbg ftw =\
@EtiennedeMartel I thought it was a game from the thumbnail...
@Abyx Your code is probably too dirty.
Oh and grumbles about mobile chat
@Jeffrey Tss tss.
16:03
@EtiennedeMartel it's ok.
Cool though
@Etienne I know I'm acting like a giddy school girl about this, but please email as soon as you here anything.
the other here
i hate clang
also the linker didn't tell me that there was an ODR violation.
fuck all this shit. it super shitty today =\
@gnzlbg rejoice! clang hates you too.
Feb 7 at 23:58, by sehe
@user1690130 grandiosity - makes you think everything is about you. You mean this: /cc @EtiennedeMartel
16:13
oh, now I understand that not-lion joke
omg did cat really leave?
Seemingly so
good. -1 moron
-2
Q: how add two number in javscript/c++

user2483008hi im new to javascitp/c++, how to add number together to make one number. i have tried some thing here - var new = 3 ++ 4, parseInt(3 + 4), std;; count = 3 + 4; but they didnt work in browser. thanks for answer.

He just randomly gave tony wiki admin and left
@Abyx oh come on...
16:19
0
Q: How can I get more information from clang substitution-failure errors?

gnzlbgI have the following std::begin wrappers around Eigen3 matrices: namespace std { template<class T, int nd> auto begin(Eigen::Matrix<T,nd,1>& v) -> decltype(v.data()) { return v.data(); } } Substitution fails, and I get a compiler error (error: no matching function for call to 'begin'). For thi...

@thecoshman I'll keep you posted, don't worry.
well, it's kinda sad that we have fewer and fewer animals here, and the chat is not like it was like a year ago, but meh, fuck the cat.
hm... I hope it's not getting to the situation where the room will have only @Etienne, his ponies, and maybe some random noobs.
I like programming hard stuff that gives me a challenge. eps me sane in life because I have a mental challenge.
I like that too.
@jeffery eps? Maybe your mental challenge is showing.
16:27
I hate myself for it because it keeps me from doing productive things. It's funny because the productive things I'm doing are also somewhat challenging :v
Sorry my bad sometimes I get sticky keys
And I don't understand why I can't focus on them
ADD doesn't help when typing either so sometimes I have to slow down and think. Try programming with ADD its comparable sometimes to a thousand voices going do this,not that,no this,no that!
Visio or making visual diagrams of everything large or sophisticated I programs helps too.
*I program assists me in development
In theory at a work thing to celebrate latest release, but really not in mood
@Magtheridon96 Because what is distracting you is more interesting. Disconnect the internet and close yourself in an empty room only with your computer... you'll see how focused you'll be
16:34
but equally not in the mood to go home
No internet?
For a measurable quantity of time?

What am I, god?
I'm wondering why the same product should cost 30 euros less in america...
Heres my planning steps: 1. research via google, by word of mouth (is this used much anymore), and bing (yes I have found information from bing sometimes more useful then google depending on the information.). 2. download any documents and/or code. 3. Plan the diagram in visio or other diagramming software. 4. Code, code,code!
Likely because it can cost 30 euros more wherever you're buying it from. (Yes, simply because it can)
oh no, too many Jeffs!
16:40
@Magtheridon96 d'you mean it costs more to produce here (Italy)?
actually it is imported from France
@ScottW what's wrong?
I think he means it simply costs more because they can get away with it :p
@Jeffrey Not necessarily, I just mean that when people have the opportunity to increase the price of things, they do it :P
:D
@Magtheridon96 that's shitty :( I might just as well buy it from America and pay 15 euros for shipping fees...
I'll ship you to it
@ScottW wat
16:42
pop();
Dogs can't ship
Damn, I thought I had a clamp constexpr function.
@ScottW Seriously. You are going to take a wacom tablet from America to Italy just for 30- euros?
@Magtheridon96 Most likely is our infamous IVA tax (+20%)
Yeah, that could be it
apparently is has been raised to +21%... good to know
Holy fuck
So. Who's going to buy this $27000 build.
16:49
@Magtheridon96 sure thing. You built it?
$20 rebate tho
Some guy was seeing how far he could go in terms of high-endedness, and he linked me that
I guess he can add in some more SSDs :D
I can't figure out how to dynamically allocate an array of pointers to int[30] without a typedef. I'm beginning to think it's not possible in C++ O.o
typedef int(*array)[30];
int (**a)[30] = new array[10];

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