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21:00
lolwut
Is that like the Onion?
sometimes US politics is funnier than satire
oh yeah, Phorm didn't get anyone into trouble
they only had to completely abandon the whole thing
and only escaped prosecution by the thinnest of loopholes
CPS said "any offending was the result of an honest mistake or genuine misunderstanding of the law" - not likely to hold much water with a traffic cop for "sorry, I didn't realise this was a 40 zone"
@R.MartinhoFernandes Well, it looks like a serious site. Or it is too much of a subtle humour for me.
@kbok It's serious.
21:04
@R.MartinhoFernandes I wonder where you are from, you seem surprised that a politician lacks common sense
SILENCE!!
It HAS BEGUN
what.
woof
boo
@DeadMG hey
6
A: Bloated echo command

Jonathan LefflerIn their article 'Program Design in the UNIX Environment', Pike & Kernighan discuss how the cat program accreted control arguments. Somewhere, though not that article, there was a comment about 'cat came back from Berkeley waving flags'. This is a similar issue to the problem with echo deve...

21:16
The tasks manager's process sorting by network activity is awesome.
@Cheersandhth.-Alf wow
@AmadoMartinez Who are you?
I'm your 7th grade teacher
I had a sex change operation.
weirdo
21:31
what, non-weird people can't have sex change operations?
@DeadMG He's French, which means he's transphobic by definition.
(If that wasn't clear, I'm not actually serious)
lol
wait
I thought all racist generalizing remarks were automatically serious
like "All Americans are fat."
That's not racist.
It's over-generalization, but not racist.
21:37
"racist" is such a loaded word.
damn
fine
"All black people are fat."
2
happy now?
That's racist !
"Black" isn't a race.
if "All black people are fat." isn't racist, then dafuq do you think is racist?
"race" isn't a valid concept for human beings
21:39
@DeadMG My father had a sex change operation... not even kidding.
"Black" is a socially-based racial classification.
But not a race.
"African-American" is the word you're looking for.
@Chimera Is she still your father then?
Actually I think it's more of a skin colour
Not in North America.
@Kache Yes... he fathered me.... still my father.
21:41
Yeah, everything is politically loaded in the US... :(
Being "black" is just a biological phenotype, however.
@kbok nonsense, an albino "black" person is still considered to be "black" by virtually everyone. It doesn't actually have anything to do with the skin color.
@jornak not in the way we're using it.
"All Americans are fat." is not racist because "American" is not a race.
@Mysticial culturalist? socialist? countryist?
@MooingDuck Like, Michael Jackson ?
21:42
@MooingDuck maybe...
@kbok right
Like I said, it's purely over-generalization biased towards a nation.
user406009
I believe the correct word is prejudiced.
@EthanSteinberg that's too general. Whats the word for people from a country?
@MooingDuck Well, then it's probably a matter of language and how the word "black" is used. Nobody would say in France that Michael Jackson was black.
21:43
@kbok ah. Didn't know that.
Is there a std search for a vector?
In mean in the late part of his life.
  int  n = std::find_if(pSurface->concurrentTriangleList.begin(),
                           pSurface->concurrentTriangleList.end(),
                           [=](const int& node)->bool{return node==it->second.at(i) + 1;});
I think this is wrong.
@Drise looks verbose, but correct
Well, I know it is, because G++ gives me cannot convert '__gnu_cxx::__normal_iterator<int*, std::vector<int> >' to 'int' in assignment
Nice avatar btw, almost fooled me into thinking you were Al. or something.
21:45
is ->bool mandatory ?
@Drise oh, right, find_if returns an iterator. The arguments are right.
Oh.
Is there a c++ compiler in this chat like c++ on freenode?
So I just need a ->first?
would be kewl
@Kache No, we usually use ideone or liveworkspace
@Drise Presuming that the find succeeds.
And if it doesn't? nulptr?
nullptr what?
@MooingDuck It's almost Xenophobic... but not really
21:46
@Drise You get end().
Ok.
and accessing the result of that is UB.
@MooingDuck Yeah, "xenophobic remarks" is about as close as you'll come to it.
@jornak wikipedia doesn't seem to have a term for it. "Discrimination on the basis of nationality"
@MooingDuck Ethnocentric bias?
21:48
@jornak that's still ethnicity. "indicating race, people, or culture"
nationalism?
I love auto
Ethnicity: "The fact or state of belonging to a social group that has a common national or cultural tradition."
@MooingDuck That's usually used more as "My country is awesome by default", rather than "People from the other countries suck".
@DeadMG yeah, I think ethnicity is the best we got
@jornak better just say negro. it is hilarious how people can find things to react to. just a few years ago in norway they wanted to forbid or rewrite a lot of children's songs, because they involved e.g. pygmy cannibals, or the like. and they did! fucking idiots everywhere
21:51
@Cheersandhth.-Alf in USA, virtually any word used to categorize "Africans" is offensive by definition. Makes safe communication virtually impossible :(
just to give an idea what it was about, the hugely popular and classic "Pippi Langstrømpe" was deemed racist
@Cheersandhth.-Alf heh, that's pretty silly
@MooingDuck What's wrong with just "African"?
"Hip hip hooray" means "let's go kill some jews"?
21:54
@DeadMG Mostly that it signifies that they're different in some way than everyone else. Just like any other potential word that could be used to classify.
@MooingDuck it's just politics
lol "Ruby on Rails is easy to install" "Oh, you're on Windows ? Yeah, you have to install a custom build of MinGW and update your PATH to compile the native module dependencies"
@Kbok that's not fair, hah
I remember trying to install django on windows
I gave up
You know, I think a correct word would be... Xenogeneralism <_<
21:57
@kbok python works ok in windows
@Cheersandhth.-Alf Yeah, python is far easier to setup IMO. But ruby is way more popular in the local job market nowadays.
Ok, the rails server is now running. It wasn't that hard, but I'm pretty sure a noob would not be able to do that.
Rails on Linux?
Not very intuitive.
really? no endless supply of tutorials all over the internet?
No, I'm on windows
I want to keep the ability to go play skyrim anytime
virtualbox linux
22:03
http://www.codekana.com/
Anyone know an alternative to this that works with VS2010 ? (That doesn't cost a bunch)
@Borglead productivity power tools, something or other
I despise virtual machines.
why, linux runs pretty light
linux is the boss
only thing that might be a bummer with VMs is possible disk thrash
but that's pretty much it
other than that, linux feels like it takes more effort to stay up to date
so many decisions >_<
22:08
That's weird, I compiled something under VS2010 and everything went fine. I tried the same same solution under VS2012 and I get link error on operator delete...
I told Mohamed how to install linux three days ago and he hasn't been on SO chat since :(
That's a bad sign, right?
@kbok I use Virtual Box and Linux runs quite well in it on a Core i5 machine running Windows 7.
@MooingDuck Mohamed surely wants to know ALL the details.
fuuuuu
y u linked me to cracked?
@MooingDuck No, it's a good sign
@Chimera Yeah, performance isn't really the problem, it's the config and OS switching which bothers me. If I want to run linux I would do it natively anyway, I really don't mind spending half an hour on an install
22:14
@MooingDuck It means he figured out there are better things than lurking around on the interwebs. You can actually do man scanf and waste spend your time :)
Actually I think he did come back, I remember him saying linux was beautiful or somethign
@Chimera depending on distro and hardware, config can be a breeze
@Chimera Right :) Pathologically
@kbok Ah. I would prefer to run Linux natively at work, but our IT people won't let us install Linux native and we off course need access to Windows software.
@Kache He was referring to the questioning style of said person
22:16
@sehe Yep.... the phrase, missing the forest for the trees comes to mind.
oh
@Borgleader oh, now that I went to his profile, he has been on. Good.
2 days ago, by Mohamed Ahmed Nabil
I wanted linux because it is beautiful
@Chimera Yeah, it's a recurring problem :( In this case, well, virtual machines are great. But i'm working on my machines right now so I'm not bothered by people telling me what I should install or not :)
There is nothing beautiful about linux.
@MohamedAhmedNabil NETBEANS IS THE DEVIL
@kbok Actually, there's a lot of things beautiful about it. There's also quite a number of... confusing/disappointing things.
22:18
It is practical. Like a truck. A truck is not beautiful.
But inmy experience, never quite so much as with your average windows installation
Half way to rep-cap from that SIGFPE question. :-)
@kbok I can't believe you'd let that bother you. Just ignore what they say, and install what I tell you to!
Xeo
Xeo
6
Q: Why do std::count(_if) return iterator::difference_type instead of size_t?

ForEveRThere is algorithm std::count/std::count_if in standard C++. template<class InputIterator, class T> typename iterator_traits<InputIterator>::difference_type count(InputIterator first, InputIterator last, const T& value); template<class InputIterator, class Predicate> typen...

I never imagined it would get upvotes.
Xeo
Xeo
22:18
close votes with flagging for merging maybe
@kbok There's beauty in pacakge dependency management. There's beauty in compile from source. There is beauty in pay-for-what-you-need. There's beuaty in choose-what-you-want-as-frontend
Beauty is in the eyes of the beholder.
Xeo
Xeo
@kbok The terminal is the most beautiful thing ever.
@sehe I love the package managers, wish Windows would do that too :(
You see beauty, I see pain.
22:20
@kbok What if you are blind?
@kbok You choose what you see
I see productivity.
@sehe Also, Windows frontend is replacable, just nobody bothers to.
I see money.
lol
I see dead people.
22:21
@kbok Me too. That is beauty. I love that you can (near) arbitrarily change-root into different installations. That X is modular. That most things have textmode interfaces.
@Chimera I saw that coming
@sehe LOL... yep
@MooingDuck My favourite frontend replacement is mintty; screen -DR; killall explorer.exe
@sehe I agree there are elegant and aesthetic features in the linux architecture. I just find it a bit awkward to write "linux is beautiful" like it's a woman or something.
@kbok Oh well. I find it awkward saying that about women too.
@sehe Well, or "nice" or "cute" or whatever, it's very hard to translate that kind of thing.
22:23
This list of alternative shells for Windows includes graphical user interface shells that can replace the Windows Shell or Program Manager in Microsoft Windows. An alternative shell may afford the user a desktop environment with different functionality, a different workflow, or customization options. {| class="wikitable sortable" |- ! Shell !! Proprietary/Open source !! OS |- | Calmira || Open source || 3.1 |- | Emerge Desktop || Open source || 2000, XP, Vista, 7 |- | GreenGnome || Open source || XP |- | LDE(X) || Open source || 2000, XP |- | LiteStep || Open source || 95+ |- | SharpEnviro...
2
Xeo
Xeo
@MooingDuck, how often did we tell you not to change your ava! :P
@Xeo 'bout once a month
pft, it's still the same duck
Xeo
Xeo
Although that one is stylish
he's just got on a sweet coat
GANGNAM STYLE
@MooingDuck Have you considered evolving into a Golduck ?
22:25
@kbok pft
@MooingDuck but the background looks muddy
@kbok Need experience to evolve, can't get experience unless evolved.
@sehe yeah :( Some guy drew it and some other guy put it on my facebook wall
(BTW the French names are Psychokwak and Akwakwak and I think they're way better)
@MooingDuck brb lemme check
@kbok We all do.
22:27
@LucDanton Thanks :)
@sehe X being modular is one of those things that seems like a good idea, but is also a source of nearly endless pain and suffering. Lots of problems with Linux can be traced back to the X server being a (normal) process instead of part of the OS.
@sehe I just added a simple textmode interface to one of our work products, and almost nobody bothers with the GUI anymore :D
@JerryCoffin How so. I can list soo many benefits
oh, wait I see
@sehe TY. just waiting on cache now
22:31
@MooingDuck That one ought to be better. You were a bit late on supplying the original, you know :0
@sehe The problem is fairly simple: being a process, the X server executes with its own priority, separate from that of the clients. Getting it to (for example) display video in one window and something interactive (e.g., a word processor) in another is massively more difficult with X than, say, Windows or MacOS.
I know they have sped things up, but JRuby creators at the time must have thought "Hey, let's create the slowest interpretor ever."
@sehe I didn't realize what you were doing until well after you showed me the result
@sehe And the second won't be any better than the first, since gravatar crops it anyway. :(
@sehe Can you lighten up the colors also ? Just curious.
@JerryCoffin Huh. How would that manifest? In my experience, linux is vastly more performant in graphical tasks like that. I mean, linux doesn't break a sweat with several vids running simultaneously on several desktops with several soundcards, and you can do 3D cube animations at the same time. Yes, my desktop is spiffy, but my i7 8GB mediacentre sure has trouble responding with it's puny DWM or what's that called in Win7
@MooingDuck Well it's more than just the crop. It's resolution as well. looks a lot cleaner
@kbok Of course. You can, too
22:35
@sehe I don't know (yet) how to do that.
@MooingDuck gimp FTW
4
Q: What is an undefined reference/unresolved external symbol error and how do I fix it?

Luchian GrigoreWhat are undefined reference/unresolved external symbol errors? What are common causes and how to fix them? Feel free to edit/add your own.

Hmm, will dig later
@Feeds since when does feeds just link random questions?
22:37
@Feeds Wut. Why does feeds list crappy Stack Overflow questions?
Ah -
@sehe C++-faq auto link drivebys?
@MooingDuck Yup. Which is good, since now we can moderate the tag
Yeah, all new Q are linked here
@sehe hmm
Now we know to add the when we want to drive-by without actually driving-by.
22:38
@kbok Nope. Just things -- note 'faq'
@sehe Of course :)
I remember once (while working at a video game store) telling someone to go to gamefaqs.com, except due to my poor handwriting, she reported me to my boss thinking I wrote gamefags.com :(
3
Is that a bad use of the tag?
posted on September 24, 2012 by Artur Laksberg

Back, at the end of April, we announced our first release of Casablanca as an incubation project on Devlabs. Since then, we are glad to have received a positive response from the C++ community. At the end of June, we refreshed the bits for support of Visual Studio 2012 RC and Windows 8 RP. Those builds are now rather long in the tooth, and many have been asking for a refresh for the most recent

@MooingDuck lol
22:40
I totally read that as 'Casablanca Tits' the first time around
@LuchianGrigore Mmm. It's usually discussed here before just including it
Ok, didn't know that. I thought it was for all things faq :)
Removed
@LuchianGrigore Nah. I think it would be a nice faq topic!
Seemed faq-ey (TM) to me.
Not so sure it is at the necessary level of newbie-friendliness
I met a Stack Exchange staff member this weekend.
22:42
@LuchianGrigore I think so too
Pronounced faq-eey
@LuchianGrigore In fact, it would be common in such a situation to list the 99% most common case(s) in the first answer, and split the rest up in separate answers. Added benefit: if people like your effort, more upvotes :)
He was on a visit in Paris to find more companies to advertise on Careers.
@kbok Poor you
There are two new openings today, So I think he has done his job :)
22:44
I hate it that you can't easily spell how to pronounce words in English.
@sehe Why ? He's a nice guy.
In Romanian, you pronounce words exactly how you spell them.
@kbok Just a generic response. This is lounge, remember
With few corner-cases, like "chi" or "che"...
He gave me a Stack Overflow sticker, lol
22:45
@kbok Santa Claus!
Also they're hiring
@sehe totally. it was like being 5 again
@LuchianGrigore As it is, it is an impressive braindump, but the target audience (namely: noobs that don't know about compiling/linking) will probably either commit suicide or proceed to dump their question regardless
Hey :)
hi
@sehe which points would you say are not noob-friendly?
22:46
@LuchianGrigore also, your cases miss the C++/CLI stuff:
Actually, when you compile pure-managed assemblies with C++/CLI then mkbundle.exe should work. However, mixed mode assemblies are pretty much guaranteed not to work with mkbundle.exe. (PS. you did install the correct Target Platform version on the install client, right?) — sehe 20 mins ago
(troll ^)
(after a while, you can't tell anymore)
@sehe IDK C++/CLI stuff
There is a shortage of C++ developers so we really don't want noobs to commit suicide.
@LuchianGrigore Looks like someone didn't like your question ... 1 downvote
Meh
@kbok there's a shortage of good C++ developers
@LuchianGrigore Oh boy. I'd need to revisit it now. The sheer volume, that's the biggest hurdle (how can a newbie be supposed to figure out which bullet describes his case? Right: he'd file a question on SO)
22:47
@LuchianGrigore Those start as noobs too :)
Regardless, that's a good thing.
Do you know how many COBOL programmers are left? And do you know how much they're paid?
@LuchianGrigore Also, anything template needs to be 'non-essential' here, as it is certainly not the 99% audience for this type of problem
Just imagine... 20 years from now...
@LuchianGrigore Like I said:
2 mins ago, by sehe
(troll ^)
@sehe riiiiiiight... I've written at least tens of answers stating the same thing about templates...
Now I'll just link to that
22:49
@sehe It's not a matter of running lots of videos (for example). It's when you combine interactive (need little CPU time, but low latency) with something like a video (that needs lots of CPU time and low, or at least predictable, latency). With modern hardware it's no longer much of a practical problem -- video can now be done primarily by the video card, and process priorities mean little when you have enough cores to run them all concurrently anyway.
@LuchianGrigore Wokay. I'd think it is worth splitting up. Anyone here with links to samples of questions that split up the answer?
I've seen those, but seems like a hassle :D
I'm on it
@JerryCoffin Huh. That's funny! On windows, I usually stare at partially painted windows about half the day since windows are unresponsive during operation. On windows, you can't even bloddy f*cking minimize a window, when it's application is not responding. On windows, you can't move a window when it's process has a modal dialog popping up. Usually in the background... I could go on. none of these issues exist on even the most average Gnome desktop
@sehe do you mean 11 answers?
@LuchianGrigore At least 2. "Basic" (newbie friendly). Which would arleady be quite long, explaining compiling vs. linking 3. "Advanced" (in case you knew this, but are still stuck). Just my toughts, of course
22:53
Sorry to interrupt, I've been looking around on stackexchange and I just can't find anywhere to ask career related questions, for software developers/computer scientists. The few places I tried , resulted in a lot of down votes and closing down of my questions. Does anyone here know where I could post my question(s)? Thanks
@user992055 workplace.stackexchange.com
@user992055 What is that even, "career related questions"?
@sehe I honestly can't tell which are advanced... :))
I remember seeing quite a few of these being higher voted on [P.SE]
@LuchianGrigore Mmm. Let me have a look (TBH: I TL;DR)
@sehe I hate to think how badly you must have munged things to get that. And (since Windows Vista) you certain can minimize a window when the app isn't responding. I'm astounded at the idea of the app not responding though -- where are you getting such buggy crap? If it's happening a lot, it sounds like badly munged drivers, or perhaps a hardware problem.
22:55
@LuchianGrigore Thank you.
@user992055 sure.
@JerryCoffin Oh, just word, visual studio, stuff like that. Don't pity me.
My machine is roughly 6 years old now, and clearly slow by current standards, but I never see issues like any of what you're describing either.
@JerryCoffin I do, all the time. Visual Studio takes 5-6 minutes to close on my work machine, during which time I can't minimize.
@JerryCoffin I'm probably exaggerating a little, but I like to be in control, and on Windows I'm frequently frustrated in that department.
22:56
@sehe You clearly have something else leading to the problem, because I've used those, and they can work just fine.
I work fast?
@JerryCoffin Visual Studio 2008 with a large number of projects is just rediculous
@LuchianGrigore the first part of the question (with the symptoms (various compiler messages) could move to the question, just so that people will recognize their problem from it. (remember, the faqs aren't just for us to link to, they're also for people to browse/search)
@MooingDuck In what way? Yes, it does badly with lots of projects, but not (that I've normally seen) in ways that relate to drawing, minimizing, or anything similar (though I have to admit that drawing problems and such are much more common since it started using WPF).
@sehe Makes sense. What else?
22:59
@JerryCoffin if I hit close, it freezes. If I click the minimize button, then the bar at the top fills the entire screen until MSVC finishes closing.
@JerryCoffin also, his point about modals still applies
@JerryCoffin I still use VS2008 and WinXP

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