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1:00 PM
I might give it a try one day
 
user1804599
@ʎǝɹɟɟɟǝſ If you have a function call f(x), and the type of f can be determined to be a function type F from code that precedes the call, then the evaluation strategies of the parameter types of F are used. Otherwise, all parameters are assumed to be by-value.
 
Letting me add custom puzzles (even without scrambles for them) would be nice, since I have a bunch of weirdoes.
 
what are custom puzzles?
like, specify the exact cube configuration?
 
Xeo
@R.MartinhoFernandes So, just custom timing categories?
 
user1804599
This does make let f = ...; f(1); let g: (byname Int) => () = f a type error, but I think it's still sufficient for almost all use cases.
 
1:01 PM
@AndyProwl No, just essentially letting me add extra named categories.
 
Just for record keeping.
 
sounds like an easy addition
 
Though I can envision how even custom scrambles for those could work.
Provide an alphabet of turns, and desired min/max scramble length
 
now I feel like downloading some IDE and the SDK and do shit
but I should work
damn it
 
1:03 PM
Wouldn't quite work for things like copters with jumbling, but would be good enough.
I'm not sure one could easily generate random jumbled scrambles without partially simulating the puzzle.
 
@AndyProwl can I just add that I managed to get the GNU wget program working on my Android phone.
 
sure, feel free to add that
 
Hah, or Ghost Cube scrambles. Those would definitely not work.
 
Xeo
aren't these the cubes that look horribly distorted when scrambled?
googles yep.
 
Generally when games allow you to change the FOV is it the horizontal or vertical FOV value thats being shown?
 
Xeo
1:05 PM
@Borgleader horizontal, i.e. width
 
@Xeo thx, for some reason opengl's function decided to take the vertical one as input
so i have to "convert" it
 
user1804599
@AndyProwl do good work instead of shit
 
@AndyProwl Yeah, but surprisingly always missing :(
Dunno, I always get the impression that the people making those apps aren't cubers :< It could just be that my feature set is not as natural as I think it is, I guess.
 
@elyse yeah I should acquire that skill
 
user1804599
Oh, you lack it? You suck!
 
1:08 PM
pretty much
 
@elyse That doesn't seem to solve the original problem.
 
user1804599
It does.
 
user1804599
It infers the parameter and return types like usual, but copies the evaluation strategies from the already (partially) known type if such a type exists.
 
if a move constructor were present, that would be enough
so the copy constructor being deleted by itself shouldn't be the cause right?
 
1:12 PM
@elyse But in your example no previous context exists before the function call (which is the moment where you seem to make the decision).
 
user1804599
So in f(1), f is initially inferred to be of type (Int) => ?. Then it looks whether f already had a known function type before this inference. If it did, it copies the evaluation strategies from that.
 
user1804599
@ʎǝɹɟɟɟǝſ In that case, parameters are assumed to be by-value.
 
Which would still break...
> ... if f is actually of type (byname Int) => Int
 
user1804599
Yes, it would break if you unify f with (byname Int) => Int after the call.
 
Oh, you mean that in inferring the type you previously look at the type information you have of f? So that if you have defined f to be (byname Int) => Int, then it would take that in consideration, otherwise it would assume by-value?
 
user1804599
1:16 PM
let getF : () => forall a. a
let f: (byname Int) => Int = getF(); f(1) // works
let g: (Int) => Int = getF(); g(1) // works
let h = getF(); h(1); let i: (Int) => Int = h // works
let j = getF(); j(1); let k: (byname Int) => Int = j // type error
 
user1804599
@ʎǝɹɟɟɟǝſ yes
 
user1804599
it should work very well
 
user1804599
Ah, another nice case of the need-a-stack-use-the-call-stacks.
 
@sehe I shall never desist!
 
user1804599
1:22 PM
I shall never exist!
 
I don't understand how it's 13.3.1.7 [over.match.list] that makes atomic<int> x = {0}; valid
 
well bugger me, I done did generate some xml how I wanted first time. What is this which craft!?
¬_¬ I'll leave that be
 
Xeo
@thecoshman which craft?
 
@Xeo hahaha
 
user1804599
I like how zero initialisation does initialisation.
 
1:24 PM
@Xeo hey, I said I was going to leave that be
 
@Xeo Wow, I didn't expect a pun like that from you.
 
did I ever ask?
You pleaded ignorance before
 
From Borgleader, maybe, but not you.
How many has Borgleader infected with his punny tendencies while I was gone? ;~;
 
@elyse you're a failure, because you are.
 
@ThePhD @sehe is getting pretty good at this punny business
 
1:26 PM
Hrm. I think I was being punny quite while before Borg were assimilated by this lounge
 
Oh, thank god my first class today is 1 PM
I can literally lay here and waste away for a bit.
@Borgleader Why isn't SwapBuffers predicated by gl ? Is that a windows-specific function?
 
Oh, Well, then!
... Wait, there's wglSwapBuffers too....?
 
I use SDL_GL_SwapWindow because I dont write everything myself ;)
 
Still trying to figure out how to make generic bindings work for OpenGL's shaders.
 
1:31 PM
@Mysticial also, what about WD Reds? Any experience?
 
Yet you're using OpenGL at all
 
I really wish OpenGL just put their foot down and defined an order that these things were supposed to be defined in.
 
Though they seem to be like WD Greens.
 
Order of what
 
It really bites that they're always slapped around in some implementation-defined order.
 
1:32 PM
PSST. Anyone want the TSA master keys? imgur.com/a/JQD7l get them while they're still online
 
@CatPlusPlus Attributes (in variables) for shaders. Implementation is allowed to sprawl them out willy nilly and place them in any index order they want unless you nail them down with a hammer.
 
They've been online for months
 
just had a meeting with the IT team
 
@ThePhD Just query the indices?
 
they're going to write everything in C for performance reasons
 
1:34 PM
Crash early crash often
 
@Mr.kbok You put up a good fight, Mr. Kbok. Now rest.
 
@CatPlusPlus They won't be forever. The newspaper articler has had to blur them
 
@Mr.kbok Good premisces
 
I hope I never even the shadow of their code :shudder:
 
@CatPlusPlus Right, you query them, but now its a question of "how do I match index 0 to what is conceptually index 2 of my interleaved vertex data?"... which is a bit impossible without taking some liberties with respect to name and stuff.
D3D just had things work by always laying things out in the order that you specified them. So I could easy-match things.
I can't figure out a system that doesn't have the shader writer making changes to their shader to have it work.
 
1:36 PM
@sehe you can't remove stuff from the internet silly
 
That is a problem why
 
@Mr.kbok What is it about?
 
@Mr.kbok rip
 
@CatPlusPlus Because it would be nice to have variables in some defined order so that I can automatically bind and set them and expect things to show up on the screen without having to borrow the artists and giving them The Big Table Of Where To Index Your Inputs To Work For This Project™.
 
@Rerito Storing large amounts of data to be processed later. I suggested they produce an sqlite file, so they will do it, but it turns out that I won't be overseeing this project at all so the guy in charge now is going to do it... his way
 
1:38 PM
lol sqlite for large amounts of data
 
@CatPlusPlus It's convenient actually. R/W speed is good, not too much overhead, people can look into the file with their beloved sql tool.
 
@thecoshman you can make it harder to find
 
The last part is important
 
And don't call me silly
 
@CatPlusPlus Also what would you use, given the choice? Please don't say "roll your own binary format"
 
1:42 PM
Depends on how large the dataset is
 
I'm having a dejavù
 
Me too
 
@CatPlusPlus 30k matrices of 135k points in double precision
 
Sep 2 at 13:37, by Mai Longdong
I respectfully disagree, SQLite is really nice when you need a simple embedded db
 
That's not large
 
1:43 PM
@ʎǝɹɟɟɟǝſ The Sans Mono kind?
 
I really don't like in Windows 10
 
@ʎǝɹɟɟɟǝſ I wanna get away from this place I do. But I can't and I won't say I try...
 
@CatPlusPlus whatever. That's not small either. What would you suggest?
 
@набиячлевэлиь The Courier New kind
 
That there's no "NOtify me of updates, but let me install what I want"
 
1:43 PM
@CatPlusPlus The data is disposable, ie the day after you throw everything away
 
Is there a "YEStify me of updates" though?
 
It's either "I restart for you" or "You restart", but in both cases its "after I've already installed everything".
 
Adolf Hütter is the new coach of FC Red Bull Salzburg
 
@Mr.kbok If there's not too much processing this seems quite straightforward and I'm sure there are loads of APIs to perform SQLite requests in C. The fuck-up margin shouldnt be that high
 
On modern computers the "turbo button" can be triggered from the command line: # pkill -9 java
3
@R.MartinhoFernandes Interesting news tidbit
 
1:45 PM
@sehe ahahahaha
 
@sehe ahha
 
@Rerito the fuckup is doing it in C
 
C'est la Java bleue
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes FC Red Bull Salzburg is literally Hütter
 
@Mr.kbok The fuckup to me is saying "C[...]for performance reasons"
 
1:47 PM
@Rerito yeah -_-
the guy started by saying that you should not sync disks after each point
:goodjob:
 
@Mr.kbok c instead off... ?
 
I've been spending the last half an hour trying to understand what makes std::atomic<int> x = {0}; legal. I can't Standard anymore
 
@user2114662 ANYTHING ELSE
 
Ouch. Today's XKCD has pro-level burns on christian poets (all 3 of them)
 
@AndyProwl May The International Standard flow through you!
 
1:49 PM
@Borgleader I don't remember but I wouldn't trust a tree monster that sounds like my grandma anyway
 
it's such an intelligible mess
 
user1804599
weird
 
user1804599
my program crashes if I link to multithreaded Boehm GC instead of the single-threaded one
 
UB/ODR
 
Race conditions?
 
user1804599
1:52 PM
I don't even call a function from it.
 
LOL
 
user1804599
Just, link it to a program with an empty main function and it crashes.
 
Nice.
 
user1804599
Windows doesn't tell me how it crashes, though.
 
@AndyProwl It might {} precedence into just atomic<int> x{0}
 
user1804599
1:52 PM
Only that it "stopped working".
 
I think Scott is wrong. It's not 13.3.1.7, it's 8.5.4.(3.6) that makes it legal
 
@elyse why would an OS tell you why your program crashes?
> wrong
 
@набиячлевэлиь I don't understand
 
Guess who just spectacularly crashed their display driver?
 
user1804599
oh wait
 
1:53 PM
@AndyProwl Well, fuck if I know
 
Hint: <--- this guy
 
@Borgleader Me?
 
user1804599
it works if I link both libgc and libgcmt
 
@Borgleader Oh, well, that's fine too.
 
I've been wondering.
Really proud of you that you took the trouble to _actually_ read that
 
1:54 PM
@sehe is "wrong" the wrong word?
 
user1804599
time to add optimisation passes
 
@AndyProwl It's a bit strong. Implies intentional/misunderstanding. While it could be (likely) simple proof-reading oversight
 
Only thing I know is that {} is super weird and has weird precedence rules over everything else
 
It doesn't. Initializer_list ctors are preferred when you use it, though
 
@Mr.kbok what is it?
 
1:55 PM
@sehe Ok. I meant what he writes is incorrect
 
@AnastasiyaAsadullayeva market data shock generator/feeder
 
@AndyProwl Precisely. That's accurate (and his blog wasn't)
 
Xeo
@sehe 'cept when it's empty, as in, literally {}
 
@Mr.kbok Why not C++?
 
@AnastasiyaAsadullayeva because C is faster, duh
 
1:56 PM
@Mr.kbok lol we call that feeder too
 
Xeo
Which is what @набиячлевэлиь meant, I think
 
> C++ software engineer from Astana, Kazakhstan
lol
 
@Mr.kbok It's about 17% faster (depending on platform and compiler), so yeah totally worth going Linus over
 
haha, C++
 
@AnastasiyaAsadullayeva Well it's called a feeder I think
 
1:56 PM
That would explain why
 
@sehe what O.o
@AnastasiyaAsadullayeva Seems like a reasonable explanation uh
 
@Xeo I don't see how "has precedence rules over anything else" could make sense in that context
@Mr.kbok It is known
 
Xeo
@sehe {} doesn't pick init-list ctors, but the default ctor if available. Any other form of {}-init picks init-list ctors over everything else
 
@AnastasiyaAsadullayeva prepare for conflict of interest legal action :)
 
Xeo
1:58 PM
well, kinda
I hope you get what I mean, I'm kinda busy with stuffs
 
@Xeo The latter being the exception
 
@sehe maybe
 
@Xeo I think so
 
@sehe I think it's not very surprising as the system architecture of these things seems fairly standard
 
@sehe Shirley, you can't be serious!
 
1:59 PM
led by the IUnknowing
2
 
@TonyTheLion My beard already shouts PROGRAMMER!!, no need for a hoodie
 
@AnastasiyaAsadullayeva twzzajk
 
Also I don't think C is significantly faster than C++
@sehe Yep, I defused it ;D
 
g/j
 
@AnastasiyaAsadullayeva No but it's significantly more painful
 
2:00 PM
@TonyTheLion yeah, it's funny, but no
 
@Mr.kbok Can I ask what exactly they find "too slow"? What's the latency like?
@TonyTheLion lol and with html tags
good choice
 
@AnastasiyaAsadullayeva The software isn't written yet :o)
 
I meant the software that is deemed "too slow"
 
Also this is basel 3 we don't have latency
 
What's basel 3 is it that leaf you put on pasta
 
2:03 PM
@AnastasiyaAsadullayeva There's no software yet. We asked them to do something for us, and for PERFORMANCE it's gonna be C
 
Basel III (or the Third Basel Accord) is a global, voluntary regulatory framework on bank capital adequacy, stress testing and market liquidity risk. It was agreed upon by the members of the Basel Committee on Banking Supervision in 2010–11, and was scheduled to be introduced from 2013 until 2015; however, changes from 1 April 2013 extended implementation until 31 March 2018 and again extended to 31 March 2019. The third installment of the Basel Accords (see Basel I, Basel II) was developed in response to the deficiencies in financial regulation revealed by the financial crisis of 2007–08. Basel...
 
@AnastasiyaAsadullayeva end tags specifically
 
Performance is nothing without efficiency.
 
I really doubt C is more efficient than C++
Let's ask on SO! See which language gets close votes faster
 
2:04 PM
monetary policies are f*cked up, the global financial system has been in the low interest region for too long
 
Are C questions faster to close than C++ questions ?
11
 
at least previously (like 15 years ago) a country could reduce the interest rate to stimulate the economy
 
@Mr.kbok On-topic on Meta?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Any sufficiently large hard drive is gonna be fast astsequential access due to pure density. I don't have any experience with the WD reds though.
 
@sehe thank you :)
(but global state is bad!)
 
user1804599
2:07 PM
woo my compiler is now an optimising compiler
 
I wish this chat could optimize newblets
 
T_T renderdoc crashed fml
 
do you know why? fix it and make a PR if you're a true gentleman
 
how would i know why
i expanded a drawcall and poof
 
@Borgleader Poor dear.
 
2:11 PM
make a program to debug renderdoc while it's debugging your opengl program
 
@elyse what's your compiler compiling?
 
user1804599
a derivative of lambda calculus
 
What is renderdoc, again?
 
well OK, I'll let it slide today because of dank memes
 
2:12 PM
> Welcome to RenderDoc - a graphics debugger, currently available for D3D11 and OpenGL development on windows.
Sounds like I could use some of that. Wonder how it works.
> Compile GLSL shaders to SPIR-V to generate 'disassembly' (hex dump)
The fuck.
SPIR-V isn't even out yet.
 
@ThePhD Its really simple to use.
just point it to your executable, and then press f12/prntscr to capture
 
Let alone accepted by IHV compilers.
 
Are those sexually transmissible
 
@AnastasiyaAsadullayeva If you get kinky with your gpu, yes
 
Well SPIR-V is very similar to SPIR and the spec, while not official yet, is likely close to final
 
2:16 PM
@Borgleader Huh. Guess I'd better get on it.
I have been sorely missing OpenGL debugging tools.
But I should probably do it later.
 
@Borgleader hey bby u wanna c my big PCI lane
 
@AnastasiyaAsadullayeva bae plz, once you go PCI-E you never go back
 
I need to fix that about my shader system...
 
@AnastasiyaAsadullayeva Agree. However, what you seem to be doing implies it. And the way to get rid of the client verbosity kinda requires it. If you don't like it, just keep with the OO style. I'd still have a free function, though (e.g. auto book = loadfrom(dal, key), not dal.load(key)).
Tastes differ, of course
 
Ugh. Making the fix for this is gonna be tiiiiits.
 
2:23 PM
@sehe Understood. Many thanks for your time and explanations :)
 
Plus, while a proxy can write to multiple variables, reading from multiple variables is super problematic..
Maybe I'll just read from the first one, and if they don't request a const reference, making all the underlying variables as dirty.
 
@AnastasiyaAsadullayeva lel. Sounds a bit like "please stop mansplaining" :/
I know that's not what you mean :)
 
np, next time I'll just go with "k thx" :p
Added a smiley to clarify
 
cheers. Communicaciones mucho difficulte
 
Specially by text
 
2:25 PM
And I love misinterpreting stuff
 
@sehe We all do
 
It's kinda hard for me to spot when I'm not doing it on purpose
 
good day everybody
 
hola
 
@Rerito I think it's arequired disease skill for c++ programmers ("What other meanings could the compiler give to this code I wrote to mean XXX?")
@JonathanMusso Yup - you're regular.
 
2:26 PM
@sehe eh?
 
yesterday, by sehe
You're early
 
@sehe Déformation professionnelle :p
 
can one specify both https and ssh addresses for git submodules?
 
Beroepsdeformatie. Why isn't that an apparent idiom in English?
@gnzlbg you mean, as fallbacks?
I don't think so. (Though you can probably have push and pull use different protocols
 
i am behind an ssh tunnel trying to clone a git repo that has submodules
i can only clone through ssh
but the .gitmodules specifies the submodules with https
 
2:28 PM
Dunno, I just figured that it's found as is in english: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/D%C3%A9formation_professionnelle
 
so i cannot clone them without modifying the repo
 
@gnzlbg You can edit them locally
@gnzlbg That
 
(I'ld like to hear it in a conversation)
 
crap i am using that behind cmake
via cmake's externalproject_add
 
@Rerito that's... awkward
 
2:29 PM
it has no option to disable submodule cloning
and it has no way of executing a script after cloning the main repo..
 
Why can't you clone by https? Can't you tunnel that too?
 
@gnzlbg File it upstream. Or use a proxy
 
@sehe Noblesse oblige.
 
@AnastasiyaAsadullayeva i am behind an ssh tunnel, and not really
 
Nooble oblige
 
2:30 PM
24 hours ago, by sehe
@elyse ADL verplicht
@AnastasiyaAsadullayeva Nooble oblique
 
@sehe I see why they prefer https, that allows people without ssh keys to clone the repo
 
@gnzlbg HTTPS to any host on any port can be tunneled like any other TCP connection
 
Oh that reminds me, yesterday I helped a dutch delivery man to find his way. The poor guy only spoke dutch
 
that’s unfortunate
 
Nobody's perfect
 
2:31 PM
@AnastasiyaAsadullayeva gonna check if I can use that to tunnel https to github in ./ssh/config
 
@LucDanton Bah ouais quoi, trop la classe tkt
 
@gnzlbg ? That makes almost zarroo sense. However, what I mean is, you can have a non-http proxy relay to https :) It's awkward, but might be worth it depending on the circumstances
@Rerito where did you find this man? And was he aged 7?
 
@sehe thanks, this stuff gives me headaches
 
@gnzlbg insteadOf
 
@sehe What's the german word for "german", deutsch I believe? So he was either dutch or german
 
2:32 PM
wait what
you suck
 
Though it sounded like "dutch" to me
 
@Rerito Ah. So we've established beyond reasonable doubt that the poor guy was German and spoke German only
 
@sehe That was my understanding as well. Though usually someone will know the word for his tongue in english
 
That’s fortunate.
 
Bayesian Logic wasn't harmed arriving at this obvious conclusion
 
2:33 PM
@sehe lol
 
@Rerito dutch people rarely ever speak one language only - must be german
 
And since I was talking to him in english I couldn't "decide" between "dutch" or "german"
 
@LucDanton U+2019 3>
How does one... :heart:
@Rerito Poor guy
 
Did it feel like he wanted to spit in your face at every word? No: German, Yes: Dutch.
ez
 
Anyway the poor guy ran into me in the street (and here, he would have struggled)
 
2:35 PM
@AnastasiyaAsadullayeva You got that reversed
 
Thanks, fixed.
 
It's like a company hub: nothing but office buildings and a shopping mall (and places to eat)
 
@sehe No, German is just always preparing to spit in your face by clearing his throat, he doesn't want to.
 
> did it feel like
No one mentioned true intent
 
if they didn’t want to spit in our faces, then why it is called Phlegmish
 
2:38 PM
nice
 
I don't speak german so I could'nt clear the doubt
 
Hmm, "We found no body" and "We found nobody" are almost indistinguishable while talking even though they have different meanings
 
@ʎǝɹɟɟɟǝſ ISO C++ and ISO English, maybe
 
I guess you'd insert a slight pause for the first one
 
2:39 PM
@ʎǝɹɟɟɟǝſ Wouldn't the place of the tonic accent change?
like NO body vs noBOdy?
I must not be the only one: my english accent sucks so much and yet my inner voice got a perfect accent
 
We found no... puts on sunglasses body! YEAAAAAAAH
"Close Calls" feat. @TroyBakerVA http://t.co/WJoQeDD8zw
Damnit, I love these two
 
2:58 PM
@ʎǝɹɟɟɟǝſ there's a word for the application of proper pauses that should make the two distinct... pronunciation might cover it
 

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