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11:00 AM
@Rapptz The actually important parts of the value are encoded in the type, not in its values.
 
Ripley's Believe It or Not! is an American franchise, founded by Robert Ripley, which deals in bizarre events and items so strange and unusual that readers might question the claims. The Believe It or Not panel proved popular and was later adapted into a wide variety of formats, including radio, television, comic books, a chain of museums and a book series. The Ripley collection includes 20,000 photographs, 30,000 artifacts and more than 100,000 cartoon panels. With 80-plus attractions, the Orlando-based Ripley Entertainment, Inc., a division of the Jim Pattison Group, is a global company with...
 
Pretend all those expressions happen in a decltype world (even though they don’t have to, strictly speaking).
Then the values and side-effects and results don’t matter.
 
Lol, one day I'll make a talk about cpp-sort.
> It's super cool, but you probably can't compile it anyway.
 
I intend to proposa a talk on variadic pack expansion for the next C++Now.
 
11:05 AM
@LucDanton I get that
 
@ScottW morning <3
 
The big plan is to first say "we are going to use GCC5" or something, and then in the middle of the talk hit the silly bug where it can't expand lambdas, say something bad about it, yell "Clang to the rescue" and carry on.
 
@Rapptz that’s it then
 
@ScottW Hey sweetheart :)
 
ic
It's the overloaded operator==
 
11:06 AM
@ScottW sup?
 
@Morwenn Oh, you're using the EnableIf... thing. Poor soul.
 
Wow 2015 and Clang still can't compile it?
 
Just be a man and replace ... with = something :D
 
@Griwes What? No, I'm not :o
 
Good shit.
 
11:07 AM
@Rapptz oh yeah I guess my using == was misleading :(
 
> I am currently trying to get the library to compile with clang++ 3.8 but it seems that the mechanism described in this article is not currently supported. Since one of the most important features of the library rely on it, I guess that it won't be clang-compatible until clang++ supports the idiom.
 
point was to show foo(x) and how its result is usable, i.e. foo plays the role of the original operator==
 
Then what are you referring to in there?
 
@Griwes It's about select_overload, not about EnableIf.
 
@Morwenn Err, that works in Clang.
 
11:08 AM
@LucDanton Yeah I get it now.
I had forgotten that operator== is indeed a function.
 
@Griwes Last time I checked, I couldn't compile the examples.
 
auto foo() -> void ugh :P
 
@Morwenn I remember select_overload not working in Clang too.
 
Sorry: it compiled but it didn't select the appropriate overload.
 
@Morwenn Yes, for a different reason: template<unsigned N, EnableIf<is_multiple_of<N, 3>>...> doesn't work in Clang.
 
11:09 AM
@Rapptz Maybe we shoud language-lawyer the idiom and submit a bug report?
 
@Morwenn Woot? Show me an SSCCE.
 
So why doesn't Clang support that?
It's 2015 friend-o.
 
Because I'm using it quite extensively in some parts of my code and it definitely works there.
@Rapptz The EnableIf... thing?
 
@Griwes Aw~, I don't think I care enough to do that right now -_-
 
@Rapptz wording isn’t strong enough, they don’t have to
 
11:10 AM
it's a litb-class bug
 
@LucDanton Literally worse than hitler.
 
the same way [](){ Ts t; }... seems to be a litb-class bug.
@LucDanton Wait, for EnableIf...?
 
I don’t like to blame the implementers when the spec is flawed
@Griwes yeah
 
I was sure that it was determined to be a Clang bug in the comments under the bug report.
 
@Griwes On the other hand, if you can find the actual problem, solutions are welcome :D
 
11:12 AM
do I suck for liking this song youtube.com/watch?v=YBHQbu5rbdQ
 
where is that bug report anyway
 
No "the wording is ambiguous" comments.
 
> Note that as a result of this bug, clang fails to compile libstdc++'s implementation of <experimental/optional> (the affected code is here [1]).
nice
 
Current status: looking at this Json library for C++ again:
Jan 5 at 12:11, by sehe
> Serious Testing: Our class is heavily unit-tested and covers 100% of the code, including all exceptional behavior. Furthermore, we checked with Valgrind that there are no memory leaks.
 
@Rapptz wasn’t intended
@Griwes trying to freshen my memories via transcript but nothing so far
 
11:17 AM
@sehe oh that json lib
 
What's the verdict?
 
"I have my own so I don't use it"
but I do not like its magic
like how it transparently selects types for you depending on the operation seems bug-prone to me but iunno if it actually does a check before handling it
 
Beyond ridiculous claims on the Readme, I think it's cool they bench with a 53MiB JSON ("JSOB") file that sends most other tooling into the woods indefinitely
Today I coin: "JSOB": J-#sob
 
@sehe joke’s on you the whole setup is tailored around that particular file and other 53MiB files hang the lib just the same as the other
 
Ell
Struggling to get out of bed
 
11:20 AM
I always thought 'Json' sounds like 'Jason'
 
@LucDanton possible
 
@sehe what's so special about a 53mb json?
 
millibits
 
@AlexM. Nothing, IYAM. Why?
 
I was wondering why it makes other libs go wrong
tree size?
 
user1804599
11:23 AM
@sehe Arie Sob
 
Sep 14 '13 at 19:50, by Rapptz
@JohannesSchaub-litb Yeah, I've had a discussion about that with Luc months ago.
spelunking; I’m in deep
 
@AlexM. What do you think? Just braindead coding. What else
 
@sehe The one that can't strings?
 
No idea
I'm still amused at the "false notes" in the Readme though
 
Sep 14 '13 at 19:28, by Johannes Schaub - litb
@KonradRudolph my conclusion is that the spec is not clear on it
oh perhaps that’s more relevant
 
11:24 AM
@sehe It didn't back then.
 
are you talking about my lib?
or the modern json™ one
hey they do the same tests I do
I feel kinda ripped off
 
And lol, at the time it took me whole two minutes to find some (not-even) exceptional behaviour their tests don't cover.
 
So, I'm listening to experimental metalcore and it's actually not that bad.
 
Bunch of idiots.
 
I am curious to see said tests to see how bad my programming is
 
11:26 AM
Guess it's a variation of "move fast and break things".
 
oh ew man wtf
 
"Impressive benches and failed tests"
 
implicit conversions?
 
implicit casts
 
Good morning!
 
11:28 AM
@Griwes yeah I don’t know
 
@Nooble yo
 
> Teemperor implemented CMake support and lcov integration, realized escape and Unicode handling in the string parser, and fixed the JSON serialization.
Oh, nice.
They finally added fucking strings escapes.
 
well afaik my json lib doesn't suck but what do I know
 
They didn't have them back in January. Good luck creating a string with double quotes in it.
 
and I added string stuff because you bugged me about it
 
11:30 AM
Single quotes oughta be anough for everyone
 
It's kinda ridiculous to claim all exceptional behaviour is covered when "\"" breaks your parser.
It's like, not pathological at all.
 
@GregorMcGregor they should come in pairs
 
And it kinda shows they didn't read the fucking spec.
 
also lol @ this breaking the syntax highlighter
 
11:32 AM
@Rapptz it’s still like that, too
 
@Rapptz There you go.
Idiots. Idiots everywhere.
 
@Morwenn Ahhh. I can see your problem.
@Rapptz lol
Guys, is this supposed to work per the standard?
 
user1804599
Needs some more quickcheck.
 
@Griwes Why not?
 
work meaning what
 
11:34 AM
I see nothing wrong.
 
user1804599
You can make a non-JSON generator by taking a random text generator and filtering it with an existing JSON parser.
 
Meaning the select_overload mechanism.
Is it supposed to also work like this?
Because if it is, then there's a Clang bug to file. ;d
 
I don’t get the 'also', what is it different from
 
"Also" in addition to a single argument form that's used in @Xeo 's article. :P
 
user1804599
Then make sure the parser always borks on that and never on anything else.
 
11:35 AM
inb4 I spend today's evening reading through the standardese for overload resolution rules
 
mmmh you can get into ordering issues (lattice stuff) but yeah normally you’re careful
 
"lattice"?
 
@Griwes I think the select_overload is supposed to work. On the other hand, I might have to std::declval the sorter in the return type deduction to work around another problem.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes The funny thing is I remember spending a long time debugging to make it work.
 
@Morwenn I know a way to go around that.
 
11:37 AM
I can't read C++ anymore
 
It's time to retire friend.
 
also where is select_overload
 
Though I'm not 100% sure how to apply it in your exact case.
 
user1804599
Now I know from the type of updateMoles that it will only ever access the moles of the game state, not anything else.
 
user1804599
11:38 AM
And it's more reusable, e.g. in tests.
 
behold @Morwenn
 
I actually can’t tell that it’s fine
 
@Griwes Multiple inheritance.
 
@AndyProwl Right, select_overload is an alias for choive<0> that I actually don't use here.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes naw, ranking (not the term I think) of overloads
 
11:38 AM
Noun: lattice ‎(plural lattices)
  1. A flat panel constructed with widely-spaced crossed thin strips of wood or other material, commonly used as a garden trellis.
  2. lattice m ‎(plural lattici)
Verb: lattice ‎(third-person singular simple present lattices, present participle latticing, simple past and past participle latticed)
  1. To make a lattice of.
  2. To close, as an opening, with latticework; to furnish with a lattice.
 
@LucDanton Look at my "behold" link and tell me if it looks, err, "righter" to you.
 
some overloads are ambiguous i.e. not ordered with respect to one another
 
I might actually end up reading through the standardese for this :X
 
you have to actively avoid that
 
@LucDanton Oh, that. Then "lattice" is kinda misleading, I'd say.
 
11:39 AM
Yeah. And making this a "two phase" call fixes that, right?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes what? it so isn’t (or please explain)
 
    template<>
    struct choice<127> {};
 
You have an external call that controls the dispatch, returns a function that just does this thing.
 
shit friend
 
@Griwes I don't really see what the difference is :x
 
11:40 AM
127?
 
@Griwes I don’t understand the original snippet enough
 
@Morwenn Your function takes all the arguments at the same "level".
 
@Griwes Yeah, but specific arguments should weight more than template ones, right?
 
My functions take the choice<N> at the "first" "level" that returns a function which takes the actual arguments.
@Morwenn That is exactly the part I am not sure of. :D
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes They're not features!
o.O
 
11:41 AM
@Griwes it’s fine to do expression SFINAE
 
@Morwenn Alright. We have a holiday tomorrow, so I'll spend the night reading through the standard.
 
I avoid ambiguities by making every signature the same, modulo of course the expression SFINAE and overload selection machinery
 
I want to actually find out whether your way to do this is correct or not.
I did want to simplify my calls to something like you have, but I have failed miserably due to exactly this.
 
@Griwes Oh, your solution wouldn't work for me: there are some more expression SFINAE things involved in the return type so I can't return a lambda :/
 
@Morwenn Let me try to think. :D
 
11:43 AM
it’s kinda setup like that in the snippet so at first glance I’d say it’s fine, but I can’t really see how it’s used/called
 
@LucDanton Couple lines down
 
@Rapptz yeah but you backtrack etc.
 
@Morwenn enable_if<is_void<decltype(Sorter{}(std::declval<Args>()...)>::value, int>::type = 0 in the template part?
Sure, less nice, but should do the thing.
 
@LucDanton Dunno, I don't think of them more as separate islands instead of 'criss-crossed'. "Archipelago" :P
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I don’t think I’m that visual-minded, even though I know what a lattice is named for :x
cool Wikimedia pic, too
 
11:46 AM
@Griwes How would that be different?
 
imma go to bed now
night
 
ciao
 
err, forgot about void() there :F
 
@Rapptz Good night :)
 
anyway easy thing to try is to make Sorter deduced and not have it expanded, unless that’s really necessary for the task at hand
doesn’t look like it is
 
11:51 AM
Alright, reduced errors to 6. :D
 
@Griwes How did you do that?
 
I did what I was trying to explain :P
 
that’s a pointless enable_if
 
nope
 
@Griwes Oh, I see what you were trying to achieve now.
 
11:53 AM
@LucDanton It replaces the SFINAE in decltype.
 
> E:Zip file is corrupt!
lolwut
 
@Griwes it doesn’t replace anything, you still have a decltype
it’s superfluous
 
And then the install continues.
I think I just nuked my phone.
 
@LucDanton I have decltype(auto), and one level deeper down the call chain.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes as in bricked it?
 
11:54 AM
Without the enable_if you have no SFINAE on operator().
 
@Griwes std::enable_if<std::is_void<decltype(
do you see it
you can switch to typename = decltype( if you want
 
ah
 
@AlexM. Bricking is typically permanent (i.e. it becomes as useful as a brick). I think I can still just flash a brand new system on it.
 
yeah that's fair
 
I still have the old ROM that I originally flashed, so I can stick to that even if the new ROMs are broken.
Rebooting will tell.
 
11:57 AM
@Morwenn anyway, there's still 6 errors, but that's better than over 20 :D
I'll try to hack on it some more later.
 
@Griwes Yeah, I'll check whether it explodes with g++ or not.
 
woof
 
@Rapptz They use an interesting doc-generator, I think. Did you see the @liveexample{} syntax? I didn't see what it refers to just yet
 
@Morwenn It does, but mostly consistently with Clang! :D
 
Could be just Doxygen. But certainly uses more features than I previously knew about
 
12:00 PM
(At least with the "void value not ignored" errors in rebind_iterator_category.)
 
@Griwes Oh right, I forgot that I also had rebind_iterator_category. That library is a clusterfuck of intricated hacks.
 
:D
@Morwenn Do you want me to try to make this work for both gcc and clang?
 
        /// object (stored with pointer to save storage)
        object_t* object;
        /// array (stored with pointer to save storage)
        array_t* array;
        /// string (stored with pointer to save storage)
        string_t* string;
uhuh. Saving storage by adding extra pointers
 
I kinda don't have time to start working on anything major of mine, but this kind of hacking would be welcome :D
 
@Griwes That would actually be of great help. I have some template-fu, but yours seems higher :)
 
12:07 PM
this is a reimplementation of the same but without the automatic unrolling/expansion etc. right?
 
user1804599
I just used git cherry-pick and it was a delightful experience.
 
> /* fuck constructors */
:D
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes do you remember what is wrong with the string business? From what I'm seeing it has pretty impotent configurable string storage (that can't essentially change beyond s/std::string/std::vector<char>/ AFAICS), but it looks like it might do UTF8 right...
@Elyse I use it all the time.
 
@sehe It used to be "\"" and other escapes.
But according to the README some good soul added that.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes What. WOW
That's... used to be retarded then
 
12:10 PM
"\"" would result in <slash, double quotes> (rendered "\\\"" in C++).
 
Consider it equivalent to std::ifstream ifs("test.json"); // open test.json for reading. It is extra explicitness. Code is not only meant to be compiled, it has also to be efficiently readable by a human. — YSC 25 mins ago
that guy
 
@LucDanton Yeah, it looks like it's the same thing.
 
YSC ... for one sec I thought of YCS
 
user1804599
@sehe More alarming is the use of broken APIs.
 
@LucDanton jesus
 
12:14 PM
@Elyse which one...
 
@GregorMcGregor ?
 
user1804599
@sehe C++ I/O streams.
 
the horror
 
@GregorMcGregor I dunno, there are three well separated concerns, two of which are standard fare
 
@Elyse ga toch fietsen
 
12:16 PM
@sehe ça veut dire 'va donc fister' ça je suis sûr
 
user1804599
@sehe nee, mijn fiets is kapot.
 
@LucDanton exactement
@Elyse ga toch weg, damindenie!
 
va te faire foutre, dame en déni
c’est si poétique
 
user1804599
@sehe okdoei
 
@LucDanton and applicable
 
user1804599
12:23 PM
git pretty-chick
 
@LucDanton Ok, so from that sample, it seems that clang supports the idiom and I probably used EnableIf the last time I tried to use the select_overload trick...
Which probably means that my problem comes from somewhere else ._.
 
user1804599
afleidingsmanoeuvre
 
whatup all
 
@LucDanton Well, I understand what it does, it just takes me a really long time to break down mentally (like a good 5 mins)
I hate to admit that I suck at C++
7
rip
 
@GregorMcGregor I would have thought you’d already used overload tbh
or seen it here in the chat
 
12:34 PM
I've seen the version by Robot
 
and Xeo has a nice article on the select_overload machinery
 
Or was it Xeo
@LucDanton Yeah that's what I was thinking of
Never used it in an actual code base
 
Ven
@Morwenn Mach7 looks like your typical boost hack. A very clever, but also totally disgusting hack.
 
@Ven yes - that's exactly what it is.
 
Ven
@sehe is that a doxygen feature to embed code?
 
12:42 PM
@Ven I was asking @Rapptz about that (Rapptz is making/has made his own doc-gen thingie)
 
Ven
@sehe ah, oke :)
 
Youre french is showing
> Okee
 
user1804599
Ok.
 
@Rapptz you know Arabic and use Windows, right?
Do you ever type it?
 
@GregorMcGregor You're not alone
 
12:48 PM
chill folks, it’s like learning an API you can’t just look at client code and figure out what it does
 
debugging through code is the best way to learn it ... sometimes
 
I knew this from before, so I can now read it fluently enough, but if I were seeing this for first time, 5 mins would be a very loose lower bound
 
does anyone use vim?
 
@AndyProwl I know but that’s normal
 
@LucDanton Isn't that what you did though? :p
 
12:52 PM
@LucDanton I guess it is; I was just trying to tell Gregor I'm more or less at the same level
 
redditcirclejerk.gif
 
shouldn't std::move work? — deW1 2 hours ago
lol. "How to transfer ownership of Win API synchronization objects?" - "Try std::move". Made my day
 
@Dean No, vim is dead. No one uses it since yesterday.
 
I am sure some people have used vim today already
But I am in a different time zone, so my opinion doesn't count
 
Ell
12:58 PM
Boy its hot
 
Note the insertion cursor.
It has a dent marking the text direction.
Neat feature.
 
maybe not the prettiest (when zoomed in) but looks very functional
 
Ell
I want to be able to read the HarfBuzz mailing list without being on it :3
 
720p60 videos on YT are cool
 

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