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user1804599
12:00 AM
@StackedCrooked yay
 
@StackedCrooked Not yet. AFAIK it's a Lisp on the JVM.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Yeah and with STM.
 
Ell
But doing something without monkey patching doesn't make something better than doing something with monkey patching
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes C++ has done it for years without open classes either. Coplien discussed methods of supporting it in his book. If I'm not mistaken, he stated pretty clearly that they were doing it in code for telecom switches back then.
It does usually use a little support from the OS though.
 
user1804599
@StackedCrooked I find protocols more exciting.
 
user1804599
12:01 AM
They let you implement interfaces for existing types, which is a huge win.
 
@Ell It does, because monkey patching is ripe ground for mistakes.
 
user1804599
> const_cast also be used for handling polymorphism. You can only go through virtual inheritance.
 
(And in any case, Ruby's community does abuse monkey patching in terrible ways)
 
Ell
Yeah I know its abused a lot
And it sucks. Like abuse of any kind
 
user1804599
Programming ain't monkey business!
 
Ell
12:02 AM
Unless you're into that
 
@rightfold They could be used for generating getters and setters.
 
Ell
@rightfold Andy prowl was suggesting something similar a few days ago I think?
 
@JerryCoffin Yeah, I don't find that hard to believe. Erlang is, however, a much more accessible and more convincing example.
 
user1804599
@Ell similar to what?
 
Ell
Did he call them "virtual concepts" or something?
@rightfold protocols
 
user1804599
12:04 AM
No idea.
 
@StackedCrooked interesting
 
sbi
@AlexM. You might find this predictable, but my take on this is: You consider it ugly now, others might disagree. And, who knows, maybe when you look back in 30 years you are glad you didn't just "have fun" yourself for six years, but actually got something done and learned a lot? It might save you a decade further down the road. (or it might not. Who knows?)
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I'm certainly not going to try to argue that point. In particular, Erlang doesn't require that you mess with stuff from the OS to do it.
 
user1804599
@StackedCrooked uninteresting
 
Damn there goes my euphoria.
 
sbi
12:05 AM
@thecoshman I couldn't care less what you call Herbst. Should you ever get your language sort out, I am happy to switch.
 
@StackedCrooked From what I hear, Ecstasy is not a good substitute either.
 
@sehe In the same talk I linked earlier, they gave benchmarks of VS's sprintf implementation over time. It used to be embarrassingly slow.
 
Ell
Hi @sbi :)
 
sbi
Lo @Ell.
 
Ell
I wonder if we could keep drinks ice cold by keeping them in high pressure cans
 
12:07 AM
Today I had a cocktail served in an Erlenmeyer flask.
 
@Borgleader wow my programs are going to run so much faster now
 
@rightfold it's imaginary (yeah I though, that's making it complex...)
 
@Borgleader I guess? Not sure how that will interact with their weird MSVC bugtibility mode.
 
@StackedCrooked This talk partly explains why MSVC is so late in getting new features. Their codebase is absolute shit.
 
user1804599
@CatPlusPlus he's in pupperty
 
Ell
12:08 AM
Do teens in Germany drink just to get drunk?
 
@Borgleader wahaha
 
@Ell a pressing question indeed
 
user1804599
Elixir also has protocols like Clojure does.
 
Ell
@stacked I forgot where you live. Id ask you the same though
 
sbi
@sehe None of the books I recently read contains much that could have happened in real life. As long as the character development seems plausible, I can live with enjoy such things.
 
Ell
12:09 AM
Really I'd just like to hear about alcohol and drinking culture in different countries
 
@sehe Explains the reason for the slow down is IIRC because they reused fprintf by wrapping the buffer in a bogus FILE* or some such thing.
 
@Borgleader You haven't seen a shit codebase man.
 
sbi
@R.MartinhoFernandes You seem to have found your way into the darker, more steampunk-y parts of Berlin.
 
I wanted to take pictures, but the phone was running out of battery.
 
sbi
12:10 AM
@Ell Actually, what with you being a Brit, you should "just like to hear about alcohol and drinking culture", no further qualification necessary.
 
@Borgleader Yeah, I've seen the talk :)
 
I quite liked it actually and not just because i got to laugh at microsoft :P
 
@sbi I wouldn't call it steampunk-y at all. The bar is meant to look like some kind of mad chemist lab or something.
 
user1804599
I like Google video search.
 
@sbi lol. I didn't mean like anything fantasy or SF. I meant like people acting very simplistic. And... what character development. Let's just say, it was a bad book. :L
 
sbi
12:11 AM
@R.MartinhoFernandes This "I am not unfit for this world at all, it's just that these accidents seem to be happening to me all the time" seems a recurring theme, huh? :)
 
Plausible character development? That was the whole problem with it
 
sbi
@R.MartinhoFernandes That!
 
It didn't run out of battery, but if I started taking pictures, it would.
So I skipped on the pictures. I don't understand where the accident is.
 
@Borgleader You know, the macros suck, but at least there's a consistent formatting. There is no commented out source code. There's no dead branches. There's no missing return statements. There's no wrong comments. There's no cocky comments about a clever piece of code that is actually stupid.
 
12:13 AM
(Also, for I-have-no-idea-which-reason, my phone won't let me take pictures at all with less than 5% charge)
 
You don't know where I've been man :P
 
@StackedCrooked Oh I never said it was the worst codebase, I just said theirs was shit.
 
Ell
Berlin sounds great
@r.martinho maybe the flash was on?
 
@Ell No, that's at <15%.
 
Ell
12:15 AM
Having said that I dont know what's wrong with that either
 
@Borgleader It's not shit IMO.
 
sbi
@sehe Yeah, that I can follow. When my daughter gave me The Hunger Games a few years ago, I could see what attracted her to the story, but the development of the main characters seemed to be so implausible that it seriously put me off. (She advance to watch the movie with me, adoring J. Lawrence, who looked familiar to me. I went to IMDB and found out where I knew her from, and showed her Winter's Bone. That seriously blew her out of the water.)
 
(However, if I turn the flashlight on manually and then use the camera, it works; it's stupid)
 
@StackedCrooked I hate ifdefs with a passion =/
 
Me too.
 
Ell
12:15 AM
But but include guards :O
 
@sbi :D
 
@sbi it's more about the wasted opportunity
what I could have done then I cannot do now
 
That song is good on so many levels. Vintage Chet Baker
 
@Borgleader One of my colleagues uses them as his primary abstraction mechanism. It drives me to, erm, insanity? :)
 
sbi
@R.MartinhoFernandes I find myself with <10% of charge about once or twice a month, usually when I'm at home, close to a charger.
 
12:16 AM
(new company comes with new rote typos)
 
sbi
@sehe Have you seen Winter's Bone? (If not, log off immediately and go watch it!)
 
@sbi Adding it to a list... :(
 
@StackedCrooked He should watch that talk ;)
 
sbi
@AlexM. As I said, this is just one POV. Another is that it gave you opportunities.
 
@sbi And I was having the last drink of the night, ready to head home right after :S
 
12:17 AM
some things are only possible during certain periods of life
playing games and wasting time all day w/o any worry is specific to those 6 years
 
The solos are not as atmospheric as in the recording I have in my collection though
 
I carry a spare battery in my backpack, but today I didn't bring my backpack.
 
@Borgleader I mailed McNellis previous talk (on the same topic) to the team. But I don't think anybody watched it.
 
sbi
@sehe Don't. Really. Skip the list and watch it. I went to see it with two friends, who recommended it. We ended up seriously drunk in some bar afterwards, mainly because we didn't know what to talk about after seeing this movie.
@R.MartinhoFernandes Ah, you were drinking. Add that to the recurring-theme thing. :)
 
@sbi I don't deny that it gave me opportunities
 
12:19 AM
@R.MartinhoFernandes sometimes I think your brain is unbalanced, since you always got lost, catch wrong trains and forget things...
3
 
it's just the price they came at that I think was too big
no idea
 
@StackedCrooked Bummer :(
 
@chmod711telkitty In all honesty, I enjoy being lost. That's one of the reasons I don't try to correct that.
 
Lost for words eh?
 
12:20 AM
I love to be in the middle of no where, but I don't enjoy getting lost
 
I once got lost. But then I found my way again.
 
@Borgleader Oh my, that was one of the stupidest deus ex machina ever.
 
@Borgleader Haven't seen that, but it seems they just have to go back.
 
sbi
@AlexM. The price of not being able to throw away a few years for "having fun"? As I say, if you look back later, you might be thankful. (Or you might not. Only time will tell.)
 
12:22 AM
@StackedCrooked It's from Lost
 
Ah, I've never seen that.
 
After they weren't lost anymore, but decided to go back because visions or some other bullshit, and then went back in time and OMG THAT SHOW IS BAD.
 
Ell
I enjoy getting lost also
 
sbi
@TonyTheLion Sometimes you're brilliant! :D
 
Is this Bjarne's vision on C++?
6
 
Ell
12:23 AM
As long as there isn't too much money or future at risk
 
@sbi in a way I am thankful right now
 
Ell
Ie I'm going to miss a plane
 
in another, I'm not
 
sbi
@StackedCrooked That is one gorgeous piece of art!
 
@AlexM. If it was different, you'd probably feel the same, except with different "a way" and "another". It's something about cakes.
 
12:25 AM
@Ell dammt, you reminded me of this song.
 
in any case, I'll just drop it for now, it's mostly pointless to concentrate on what could have been
 
sbi
@AlexM. What the robot said.
 
> I would chisel myself the BIGGEST dong. Like an unhealthy size penis.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Oh reddit...
 
sbi
12:27 AM
@StackedCrooked :)
@AlexM. Thinking about what could have been once in a while might help you to shape what will be.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes ah. this summer holiday's absolute BEST feature was: taking long walks through the woods and climbing the hillsides. That uncanny feeling when you go off the routes and watch the sun for bearings. Yup.
My wife gets anxious when I do that. But we both agreed in hindsight that the kids had a marvelous time and she's getting more used to it :)
 
sbi
@sehe You went hiking in the Dutch Mountains?!
 
aka Belgium.
 
@sbi Belgian/French. And, yeah. Gotta start somewhere, right (youngest is still wee)
At one point she made me look up information about some badly maintained hike we had bumped into and decided to follow. (lo-and-behold I was able to find it on some wiki and confirm that, indeed, it was a circular route)
That was the only time I cheated.
 
I once got lost atop a mountain in fog that would let me see about a metre ahead.
That was cool, though upsetting.
 
12:34 AM
@R.MartinhoFernandes Sounds like a great way to almost die.
 
lol
Why?
Fog is not toxic.
 
Yeah, if there's real danger, then being a parent forces you back into responsible-first mode reaaaal quick. Not that I ever really lose sight of that. It's just, I'm prepared to put up with a modicum of inconvenience/set-back in exchange for the adventure.
 
Ah, it was not a cliffy zone.
More of a plateau-ish thing.
 
@sbi The great mountains of the Nether lands :)
 
12:37 AM
there was a lot of fog yesterday morning i could barely see a few meters away through the window in the train, twas cool :)
 
@StackedCrooked We walked a tiny hill last weekend. With my grand-mother in law, who is 90 years old. It was her birthday present :) Lovely weather
 
sbi
@StackedCrooked Aka Dutch Mountains.
 
@sehe The highest point in Belgium is 694m. So no mountains here.
@sehe That's cool :)
 
(And dear lord, she uses a stroller for safety but she sure has enough energy; she's the kind that picks up the keys for you when you dropped them before you can say "No!")
 
sbi
@thecoshman Ouch!
 
12:40 AM
@StackedCrooked Yup. Best idea for a b'day present I had in a while. I think ultimately the best part was for her to actually see the kids in their 'natural' habitat. The rest was just excuses to be out together
 
I think Kamikochi is a great place to walk and that is also doable for older people. Distance might be a problem though :)
 
@sehe I don't often drop my keys, but when I do, I make sure I drop them down a deep hole.
5
 
@Feeds copy cat
 
Or a garbage container.
 
@StackedCrooked That looks like something Telkitty would post.
 
12:42 AM
@R.MartinhoFernandes lol
 
@Sofffia lol, that was the first thing I thought of
 
I must admit it has been an awful long time since I fudged my keys, locked myself out or otherwise became trapped.
 
I must admit it hasn't been too long.
Since the Unconference, actually.
 
I'm very nervous when it comes to my keys.
 
But large part of that is: I stopped carrying much outside a payment card. Life has become quite regular since job+kids and that certainly helps
I just simplify everything to the point that I can't get it wrong.
 
user1804599
12:44 AM
boo
 
nemerle
 
You didn't have job+kids before?
 
2:45am - should be asleep. Night all
 
user1804599
groovy
 
@StackedCrooked Point being that it was all kinds of worse before that time, in particular.
 
sbi
12:46 AM
@R.MartinhoFernandes "What?", you asked...
 
@sehe I see.
 
I thought you already had the jobs thing
 
@StackedCrooked why do you keep removing your messages D:
 
@StackedCrooked lol
 
@Borgleader I have no idea what you are talking about
 
sbi
12:47 AM
Well, I'd better go to bed, too. It's 2:45am and the last of my kids just went to bed...
 
@StackedCrooked I think Bjarne would rather keep the fat for backwards compatibility with old clothes :P
 
I even lived out of a moving box during summer. And the most important thing I carried was sheet music. So I would play gigs here and there (which provided the meals) and usually slept over at houses with pianos and pets that needed looking after during summer.
 
@StackedCrooked you nuked 3 of them in last 10 min =/
 
@sbi Ok, ok, I get it :( Is it bad that I just learned to live with my absent-minded self?
 
It was a blatant cost cut, obviously. No rent for a month.
 
12:49 AM
@sehe That's kinda awesome.
From my POV.
 
@StackedCrooked It was in Delft and I had backup (obviously). I could go back to my mom's place but that would have been the monetary equivalent of "infinite travel costs" away
 
@rightfold That reminds me I want to give Rust a real try.
 
user1804599
Me too.
 
@AndyProwl I think Bjarne would love for C++ to become that svelte princess--but is somewhat concerned about her being caught in cold weather with no clothes to wear at all.
 
user1804599
Rust is on my to learn list.
 
12:50 AM
@StackedCrooked Good memories. Reminds me I should give that trombonist a call. We should be starting jamming this season again :)
 
@rightfold I'm past that phase.
 
user1804599
As is Io.
 
@JerryCoffin Just call her Ella already
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes no longer learns. He judges.
 
user1804599
12:51 AM
And either F*, Agda or Idris.
 
@JerryCoffin Well put :)
 
@sehe Elle was all right, but I preferred Kathy Ireland.
 
user3010322
Whatever sick motherfucker decided to make std::is_abstract part of std::reference_wrapper in VC++ needs to get shot.
 
user3010322
It's probably STL.
 
I am also at the point I should give German a real try.
 
user3010322
12:52 AM
I should punch him.
 
@JerryCoffin ?
@R.MartinhoFernandes Machen wir
 
user3010322
@Borgleader But it would feel good.
 
@Borgleader We're going to Disneyland!
 
@ThePhD "part of" - in what sense, exactly?
 
12:53 AM
@JerryCoffin Google image search for "svelte princess" produces somewhat weird looking girls.
 
@sehe Elle Macpherson: second best swimsuit model Sports Illustrated ever featured. Kathy Ireland: the only one who ever beat Elle (but IMO at the time, did so consistently). Both from nearly the same time, for several years, they showed up in the same magazines.
 
user3010322
@sehe To the point where if I use a forward-declared or partially declared (e.g., inside of the class I want to std::reference_wrap), std::is_abstract inside of the class triggers on the incomplete definitions and throws a compiler error in my face.
 
user3010322
Now I just have to use ugly-ass pointers everywhere.
 
12:55 AM
lol
 
3/10
 
@JerryCoffin Ella, not Elle
 
I have issues with the face.
She is a man in fact.
 
I have issues with the boobs. But I admit it's just the pose/clothes
 
I have an issue with the apparent water quality.
 
12:56 AM
I have issues
8
 
@StackedCrooked And the sunburn, not to mention
 
@sehe too much of the latter? :P
 
JIRA has issues
 
@sehe Yes--not a particularly great picture of her; just the first one that popped up.
@sehe Yes, but Elle was real.
 
@Borgleader To little, in this pose. Call me old fashioned, but this kind of flesh flashing turns me right off.
 
12:57 AM
The shoulder is ok. 8/10
 
user1804599
Maybe I should go with LLVM instead of Lua.
 
> popped up
Because everybody knows that LLVM and Lua have comparable feature sets
 
Here, have your badge.
 
 
1:00 AM
@Sofffia Thanks! Haven't earned a badge since long time
 
@StackedCrooked Their philosophy is "we dont write any"
 
@StackedCrooked I'm scared to watch it
 
This guy is the enemy of C++.
 
user3010322
@StackedCrooked Oh man.
 
wasteland 2 looks like the place to be if you're a vegetarian
 
user3010322
1:01 AM
Why isn't anyone throwing rotten eggs at him?
 
user1804599
@StackedCrooked are LLVM's headers on Coliru?
 
(in-game, those cabbages are roughly 4x the size of a character)
 
@rightfold dunno
 
@sehe I first thought that the girl was apologizing to Ben for "hitting" Chris. Ya know, hitting.
Good morning.
 
1:02 AM
> Codebase Cultivator
 
could be that they got installed along with clang
 
user3010322
He IS one of the three
 
user3010322
who handles the style guide
 
user3010322
Murder list: increased by one.
 
user3010322
Gotta find the other 2.
 
user1804599
Oh it must be #include <llvm/IR/IRBuilder.h>.
 
user1804599
Yaay they are there! :D
 
also I still have no idea how they managed to miss balancing the graphics properly in all areas
 
user1804599
> undefined reference to `dladdr'
 
like, the game looks like crap in the screen above, but move the camera a bit to the right and you see this
which is waaay better looking
 
1:06 AM
@MarkGarcia Don't hit with scissors!
 
@sehe I really like the color yellow.
 
The clue. It's missing me.
 
@StackedCrooked lol
 
@sehe Googling the punchline will help. But only a little bit.
 
1:15 AM
Since apparently you never played Starcraft.
 
28
Q: How do I drug a population in the most efficient way?

FulliI want a whole city to be on drugs secretly, so they don´t know they are drugged by their government. The city is about 2 billion people and roughly structured like a Makropole from the Warhammer 40k universe. This means: Many levels 4 classes (Lower, higher, worker, and government class) L...

^^ um...
 
@StackedCrooked You may enjoy: Starcrafts
 
user3010322
= and NULL
 
user3010322
The Googel Style guide
 
user3010322
says use 0 and NULL
 
user3010322
1:16 AM
versus nullptr
 
user3010322
And to not use streams
 
I don't know why the phrase got popular instead of the Terran or the Zerg versions.
 
user3010322
Why
 
user3010322
Whyyy.
 
@ThePhD Terran was never very popular to begin with.
 
1:18 AM
@ThePhD Not in chromium, at least. chromium-cpp.appspot.com
 
@Mysticial I like these titles theyre like news headlines
 
@ThePhD Where?
 
user3010322
Titus Winter
 
@ThePhD They said that sometimes they do.
 
user3010322
The person responsible for the Google Style Guide
 
1:19 AM
@ThePhD Yes, where exactly did he say that?
 
@StackedCrooked I like playing Zerg tactics on Terran units.
 
user3010322
 
user3010322
No Exceptions.
 
user3010322
Lovely.
 
@ThePhD Nope. He doesn't seem to discuss 0, NULL and nullptr there.
 
user3010322
1:23 AM
Guess you should clean your ears out sometime. :>
 
@ThePhD What minute exactly?
@ThePhD If you mean at ~14:40 then he doesn't they say use 0, NULL over nullptr.
Guess you should stop hearing what you want to hear :>
 
@ThePhD a nurse recently did that for me
 
user1804599
1:41 AM
2.	Running pass 'Module Verifier' on function '@main'
[1]    8749 illegal hardware instruction  llc main.bc
 
user1804599
Good job, LLVM.
 
ungrateful b
 
@Puppy I suck so much at PA.
 
It's annoying that 'server' has more syllables than 'star' and so 'To reach the unreachable server' does not scan well:(
 
2:09 AM
@R.MartinhoFernandes PA?
 
personal accountancy?
public appearance?
 
Puppy Argumentation?
 
must be it
 
@Borgleader lol
 
Whch bits are aug.... never mind.
 
user457812
2:49 AM
My brain connected directly to anime (link to image of a flock of pigeons)
 
3:20 AM
lol... first time in a long time that someone flips out at me because I duped their question. Clearly the person didn't even try to read the duplicate that I chose.
 
3:34 AM
hi.m am drunj. night
 
evening
 
 
1 hour later…
4:50 AM
Hmm.. it seems as though LRiO is a little tipsy.
 
5:27 AM
Tip on how to win people: teach them to set their DNS to Google's.
That just happened now.
> Night Lion's founder Vinny Troia told ZDNet, "if you have email addresses [...] you can do a simple lookup against your database of five billion stolen username/password combos."

> [...] According to Trish Wexler, spokesperson for JPMorgan Chase, they say Mr. Troia's example is too simplistic. The spokesperson refuted Troia, saying that Chase does not allow an email address to be used as a username. (http://www.zdnet.com/jpmorgan-chase-bank-hack-it-gets-worse-7000034337/)
Looks like someone needs a lesson on SQL.
Also, dishonest PR won't do any good.
 
 
1 hour later…
6:48 AM
Why this chat has name "Wohnzimmer"?
 
The name is normally Lounge<C++>. Wohnsimmer is the German to something like "living room", so at least vaguely lounge-like.
 
Thank you!
 
Surely.
 
Why the name is German, not English or Danish?
 
@QueueOverflow Because somebody felt like it. Though most of them are undoubtedly sleeping right now, a fair number of the regulars live in Germany.
 
6:56 AM
Hm, is a name of the chat not constant?
 
@QueueOverflow No--it gets edited semi-regularly. The subtitle changes more often than the actual title, but both change now and again.
 
Thanks a lot, I am newbie here and don't know this peculiarities.
I want to clear, is in C++ a mean to combine together a overloading functions and a template functions?
 
@QueueOverflow Yup--most don't. If you haven't read them yet, you might want to glance through the hints for newcomers.
@QueueOverflow I'm not sure what you're asking here.
@Borgleader: Hi. How are you today/tonight?
 
OK, I have a template function:
template <typename T>
void function(T variable) { ... }
 
@QueueOverflow Yup, following so far.
 
7:02 AM
We need to specific the function for strings and I want to overload this function only for strings:
void function(string variable) { ... }
Is it real?
 
@QueueOverflow You can do that, or you can use specialization: template <> void function<string>(string variable) { ... }. Usually you want overloading though. See GoTW 17 for more details. It's old, but still applies.
 
Thank you very much. It works very well.
 
7:20 AM
@QueueOverflow Glad to help. I'm off to bed. Talk to you later.
 
88
Q: Is the operation "false < true" well defined?

duncanDoes the C++ specification define: the existence of the 'less than' operator for boolean parameters, and if so, the result of the 4 parameter permutations? In other words, are the results from the following operations defined by the specification? false < false false < true true < false true <...

I'm probably the last one here to see this question...but I thought I'd post it anyway.
 
morning
how much does it take before a tag's reputation is updated? It's been almost three days and I see no sign of a change (although the network profile is already been updated)
 
7:36 AM
Jerry, good bye!
 
@Code-Apprentice How does such a trivial question get 88 upvotes?
 
Maybe I should ask whether 1 + 2 is guranteed to be 3?
 
mathematically speaking, true and false are not defined as comparable
 
@Code-Apprentice Says who?
 

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