« first day (943 days earlier)      last day (4221 days later) » 

19:00
@CatPlusPlus no scrollbar means under limits
I just restarted after a blue screen with technical information: 0xDEADDEAD
anyway, enough of terra (for now)
I believe it's trying to kill me.
@BartekBanachewicz It's still too big
19:00
@R.MartinhoFernandes That's nothing compared to the little incident where I turned my entire Windows partition into a boot partition
What should I do?
@R.MartinhoFernandes :/
@CatPlusPlus come on, have you heard about this amazing language yet?
@R.MartinhoFernandes or you're getting a visit by the DEA soon :)
4-5 lines is the reasonable upper bound
@BartekBanachewicz I've heard of it, I'm not interested in the slightest
If any new strongly/statically typed functional/concatenative thing surfaces you can let me know
19:03
Terra is the best strongly/statically typed functional/concatenative thing on the planet, because it works with Lua.
It's neither functional nor concatenative nor interesting in any way
Who invented Terra?
best is as subjective adjective as it might get
But hey have fun
19:04
is that Zoidlang renamed or something?
@CatPlusPlus it's multiparadigm obviously, but with strong functional possibilities.
@CatPlusPlus I will! :)
It's low-level C-like
yeah, but the template invocations are made from Lua
That's enough for me to shelf and forget about it forever
Apparently, Cat doesn't like Lua.
19:05
I think you are looking only at the Terra, which obviously is only a half of the solution.
When you start your language description with "like C" then ugh
@BartekBanachewicz Why?
@TonyTheLion Too primitive for me
What does Cat like btw?
@R.MartinhoFernandes why first or second part?
19:06
Second.
@Morwenn Haskell
I know for sure
and Pizza and Sushi
@R.MartinhoFernandes well, lambdas, closures, infinite recursion possibilities
Yeah, doesn't cut it.
(see C++)
That sounds like a sad and lonely life.
what else would you want?
19:06
Bet he loves Curry too.
Lemme grep it.
it's, as cat pointed out, primitive
but I am pretty sure you can make monads and whatnot in Lua
lolwut?
You can in C++ as well. It's completely uninteresting.
@R.MartinhoFernandes depends. Lua is much more flexible than C++
19:07
Why would I want to reimplement crucial functionality in Lua if I can use a language that already has a very good support for it
May 3 at 13:43, by R. Martinho Fernandes
I've grown to think that "has lambdas => supports functional programming" is total bullshit.
@CatPlusPlus you don't have to reimplent everything, you know. There are things called libraries. And in Lua libraries effectively extend the syntactic possibilities.
May 3 at 13:58, by R. Martinho Fernandes
@DeadMG Right now I think first-class support for all these are leagues more important that lambdas, in no particular order: higher-order functions, lazy evaluation, generators/continuations (as in, not fucking CPS).
@R.MartinhoFernandes lua has higher-order functions too
Also pattern matching
19:08
Does make_unique take an allocator/deleter by argument?
do notation
@R.MartinhoFernandes I approve of your last quote.
@ThePhD nope
Ah.
That explains a lot.
@ThePhD You can use one that does
19:09
I could, but I'm getting a serious matching error
@ThePhD which make_unique?
Where it's trying to set my deleter to graphicsdevice
Which is pretty lulsy.
@R.MartinhoFernandes Also aren't generators less powerful coroutines? Appropriate reference
@CatPlusPlus Yeah, do-notation is good. I don't see pattern matching as very fundamental, though.
Well it is :<
19:11
I often avoid it in Haskell.
apparently my university now has an ownCloud thing set up for students.
If you have a float 5.0, 5.5, and 65.5, how can you printf " 5", " 5.5", and "65.5"
@JonnyRo by an appropriate ostream manipulator or by Boost.Format
basically i'm wondering if there is a mode that will lop off the .0 on even floats
@JonnyRo by printing the float..?
19:12
I'll look into the ostream manipulators
@JonnyRo std::cout << 5.0 would print 5.
@BartekBanachewicz I don't know why are you pushing Lua so hard
It's really nothing spectacular when it comes to languages
Lua has a pretty small footprint if you want to imbed it i have heard
Plus there is a version that can be embedded inside a java app as well
So does Forth and it's infinitely more interesting
eeeek
i have seen Forth
19:13
Hell, you can write an OS in Forth
you cant sell that to people
Forth is a stack-based language, Lua is relatively high leveled and easier to understand
I'm not interested in selling anything to anyone
I wonder how relevant the footprint of an interpreter is.
I should try to write Forth.
19:13
Technically, you can write an OS in everything.
@CatPlusPlus I like it a lot. It's the absurdly small size combined with extraordinary readability and ease of use, yet with extreme capabilities and great speed
Hence why its small footprint is really the only thing it has going for it
:|
Forth is more of a language platform
Like Lisp except without obnoxious parentheses everywhere
@BartekBanachewicz why not just use C?
The footprint comes in handy when you have a multi platform product and you need the same scripts to run on each platform/VM
19:14
I kid I kid don't shoot me
@melak47 duh.
@Rapptz Kind of a poor selling point if you ask me.
@R.MartinhoFernandes Honestly the only people who use it are those who work in game development from what I've seen
memory footprint is quite important on low end cellphones
So yeah.
19:15
the footprint, ease of reading, and ability to embed in multiple platforms (C based, and Java based) make it attractive for the gaming industry
Great
Still not interested
@Rapptz Its features are particularly well-suited for games
That's all it's well suited for tbh.
I haven
I wouldn't use it for something other than that
19:15
't been able to understand a piece of lua code for a long time.
I'm not sorta thinking about writing a scripting host that uses Forth though
If I wanted to write scripts I'd use Python
@CatPlusPlus That's perfectly fine. Hey, tell us about something awesome you can do with Forth? (NOT_SARCASM).
@JonnyRo Third point is kind of... well... pretty much the opposite of unique...1
i'd rather embed python, but lua has been what we've used in the past
19:16
TBH C/C#/C++ have really warped my perception of Syntax. That and Haskell.
@BartekBanachewicz Hijack syntax completely
@JonnyRo or javascript
I can still read Actionscript and write it pretty well though.
Cannot read Javascript to save my life.
Bartek, agreed, also very accessible, plus spidermonkey and its ilk have been around forever
@ScottW You can write an OS in many things.
19:16
@CatPlusPlus so it's like reflective syntax?
Cut a part of your program and move it to a new function without changing anything
@BartekBanachewicz Tell us something awesome you can do with Lua. :|
@ThePhD That's weird considering AS and JS are cousins
@Rapptz In everything.
How do you make a "bored" smiley?
19:17
@BoltClock Really?
@R.MartinhoFernandes :|
I can't make out what's going on in javascript ever, really.
@R.MartinhoFernandes I think my Contrlua does a few nice things. But was that for real or are you just mocking me?
@R.MartinhoFernandes :<
19:17
@R.MartinhoFernandes ._.
@ThePhD ~.~
3
@ThePhD Yep, both ECMAScript dialects
@BartekBanachewicz For real.
@ThePhD It has very similar semantics
19:18
@Rapptz That's a good one.
@CatPlusPlus If they do, I don't see it. xD
I very much like type hinting in AS3 although I find the syntax a little awkward
Which scripting language has the best debugging support?
Koreans would use ㄱ.ㄱ
AS3's type declarations are weird as shit.
19:18
Anyone know an OSS alternative to Simulink?
Also I'm going to be a hipster and make an ActionScript 3 game this year while everybody else eagerly awaits Flash's demise
debugger is for the weak
Johan Larsson, see QUCS
@JohanLarsson Why would you do that to yourself
var meow:int <--- post-typing, which means you always have to write var. Every singel goddamn time.
19:19
DON'T REMIND ME SIMULINK EXISTS TIA
@R.MartinhoFernandes I've created distributed network framework that's able to move applications at runtime accross the nodes. Nice part is, the target node doesn't have to have the app installed; the binary is moved alongside the serialized data, and for client it looks like nothing happened. You can also freely change parts of running applications, and rollback changes if something goes wrong
@BartekBanachewicz I really have never seen a single thing that impressed me about Lua.
@JohanLarsson QUCS is the closest I have found. Quite Universal Circuit Simulator.
@R.MartinhoFernandes arrays start from 1
@CatPlusPlus how do you mean?
@Abyx Ok, that is impressive. In a way.
Pff, Pascal could do that
Arrays from 1 always made me sad.
Even when I first started CS it seemed natural to start from 0.
Hell they could start with whatever you wanted afair
19:20
While looking up do notation I stumbled upon this
@CatPlusPlus in Lua it's also purely a convention.
@R.MartinhoFernandes I like how you can create things out of basically thin air as I like to call it
Yeah, Lua has that PHP-ish weird amalgamation of an array and a hashmap
> You certainly also agree that [...] is more complicated than [...]
Who writes documentation like that?
@JonnyRo ty checking it out, found xcos for Scilab also
19:21
So weird.
@R.MartinhoFernandes I don't think it makes sense to try to convince anyone to use it. Other than writing nice stuff in it, perhaps.
It's not documentation, it's a whitepaper.
It's neither
It's a wiki page
It's not a documentation, it's a wiki
Was Haskell invented by mathematicians or what?
19:21
So I'll stick to my Lua-Terra toys, and let you play with Boo and Cat with Forth.
@EtiennedeMartel Yes
@EtiennedeMartel It's titled "Haskell programming tips"...
@Rapptz So a wiki cannot serve as documentation?
@EtiennedeMartel It was invented by Mathemawankers.
@EtiennedeMartel It isn't "documentation".
19:22
@R.MartinhoFernandes Well, well.
@EtiennedeMartel They can, but not this page.
@JohanLarsson What are you simulating, out of curiosity
I stand corrected.
CS is math
@CatPlusPlus truth
19:22
@CatPlusPlus Lies.
Ell
Ell
CS is applied math
@CatPlusPlus My CS degree wasn't very math intensive.
Also this page is written by community
At least, lies by the New Crowz Dictionary of Pffhahahaha.
@EtiennedeMartel Computer Scientists.
19:23
@EtiennedeMartel It's not a very good CS degree :ssh:
which is why i always am amazed that these people always put CS degrees on job postings, they dont really want a computer scientist
C++14 Committee Draft (CD) Published at http://isocpp.org&#8212;Michael Wong http://bit.ly/148fqnd
@JonnyRo They confuse CS for Software Engineering/Development
@BartekBanachewicz You keep talking about how awesome it is and I feel like I am missing something.
@JonnyRo Actually it is colleges at work, just for dimensioning vanilla servo drives.
19:23
@CatPlusPlus At least it's a degree. Do you have a degree?
my $cs = "computer science"
;
@EtiennedeMartel It clearly sucks.
@R.MartinhoFernandes We had the cheapest beer on campus.
user142019
@BartekBanachewicz cool
@BartekBanachewicz I'm gonna start quoting C++14 :P
x = x+++++y is UB, right?
I cba to parse it
19:24
@rightfold knäckebröd, sill och öl!
think it has to be x = (((x++)++)+y)
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Depends on types involved.
@JohanLarsson i'd personally recommend using octave (the matlab clone). You can then create pretty output using gnuplot or something
@R.MartinhoFernandes how come?
@LightnessRacesinOrbit For UDTs with overloaded operators it can be pretty well-defined.
19:25
@R.MartinhoFernandes if the overloaded operators don't modify anything, you mean?
okay, take int x=0,y=0;
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Even then. It gets turned into function calls, and those introduce all the sequencing needed.
@JonnyRo ok, I have not used Octave much, gonna have a look if there is some Simulinkish thing for it :D
@R.MartinhoFernandes I mean, I don't know what would really appeal to you. The features I find great and pleasant to work with are meh for you. Maybe it's just the fact we write different things? Or maybe I just lack experience too see Lua flaws. Or a combination of those. Lua for me just seems so... logical and simple, yet so powerful. I can show my GF some Lua code and she gets it, and then write some hackish runtime updater with coroutines and closures.
Tumblr Code. If I ever see any of you in public, the code is “I like your shoelaces” that way we know we’re from tumblr without revealing
19:28
Guize
I think there are three stages when faced with a new language: at first it's the best thing since sliced bread, then all you see are its flaws, and then you actually see it as a flawed but effective tool that's not that bad to use.
I really need help with this make_ptr.
I can't disambiguate the overloads at all. =[
Cat usually never goes past stage 2.
@EtiennedeMartel It's either second or third
@ThePhD do you mean make_unique?
19:29
Some languages are just bad
I'm not afraid to throw away crappy tools
@LightnessRacesinOrbit (x++)++ does not compile for built-in types.
@ScottW depends.
@melak47 Yesh.
@ThePhD phew, I almost thought you were doing something crazy again
@ScottW is the "download-build-run" integrity critical?
are the assets gonna change a lot?
plink it.
19:31
@EtiennedeMartel I have since realised that the math-related classes in mine have been the ones that helped me the most. I often have a "oooh, I'm so glad I learned that" moments with those. All the C and Java and OO and database and whatever "non-mathy", "more practical" stuff I much less often find myself glad I went through.
Coliru is dead?
view?id=TMP_DIR%20is%20not%20set.
^ part of Coliru's URL
@FredOverflow maybe they'll fix it in C++14
;)
@ScottW damn you dawg, you answered yes, but to which question?
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Right, because failing to compile (x++)++ is clearly C++'s greatest weakness.
@ScottW Keep them in a separate repo
19:32
@R.MartinhoFernandes Most of what I've learned came from the internships I did, not from the classes themselves. Although I enjoyed the AI courses quite a lot.
They'll increase the size significantly and you're not going to fork them all over
Create a repo for assets, a repo for code and a binding repo
Ell
Ell
@BartekBanachewicz where did you learn opengl?
@BartekBanachewicz OMG IT HAS A NAME I AM CRAZY
@Ell in front of my PC
19:33
Or treat code repo as binding one, whatever works better for you
Ell
Ell
:3 through your degree?
I guess it's my way of learning, actually. In French, we say "apprendre sur le tas". I think the most accurate translation would be "learning by doing".
I learned OpenGL in pain
2
@R.MartinhoFernandes here, keep that somewhere handy "積ん読"
Humans still impress me...
19:34
tsundoku?
19
Q: Why is 0 false?

MorwennThis question may sound dumb, but why does 0 evaluates to false and any other [integer] value to true is most of programming languages? String comparison Since the question seems a little bit too simple, I will explain myself a little bit more: first of all, it may seem evident to any programme...

There are plenty of good answers.
@Ell not at all. I aced CG (computer graphics) without reading a paper from uni
Ell
Ell
@BartekBanachewicz Had you learned it by then?
So how come the most-voted one is so uninteresting and stereotyped?
@Ell I started learning OpenGL when I was, lemme count, 13?
19:35
@Morwenn Because it's true.
@DeadMG Don't you mean it's false? :D
and after 8 years I only painfully reallize how little do I know about it.
Ell
Ell
@BartekBanachewicz ah right
@Morwenn Er, no.
@DeadMG And the "well-understood" sounds like a joke for a proper explanation.
I'm not gonna accept such an answer anyway.
19:36
it is a mathematical convention going back hundreds of years
it works well
0 does not evaluate to FALSE and 1 to TRUE in "most of programming languages". It's only that way in bad programming languages that don't have a real boolean type and allow you to treat things that aren't booleans (such as numbers) as booleans. — Mason Wheeler 23 hours ago
This is the correct answer
your only counter-examples are that crappy people can't design APIs.
No it isn't lol
@DeadMG My examples are crappy. Other people answers are still more interesting.
do I really exist, you guys?
19:37
No
Ell
Ell
@Crowz yup
@Ell how do you know? Explain yourself sorcerer
@Morwenn Boolean algebra is god damn old.
Ell
Ell
@Crowz Because I created you.
@Ell oh sup God, how is everything going?
19:37
@CatPlusPlus That comment is indeed interesting. But the bad part is something I just don't like in answers.
Strong type systems forever
@Rapptz Yes, Boolean algebra is quite old.
Ell
Ell
@Crowz Not so great :/ I messed up the whole of earth :(
People think Haskell is a good language :/ but it was designed by the devil :O
thaaaat explains it...
19:38
What
@EtiennedeMartel I also often find myself avoiding certain kinds of mistakes naturally thanks to that mathier background.
@CatPlusPlus No, because the guy is a Delphi programmer, so he can't be right.
So I guess God's favorite language is C++, that's good
@Crowz No, it's Lisp.
Lisp is weird.
19:39
-39
Q: Stackoverflow chat proposal

okokplaying with my biggest friends in the javascript chat, came to my mind, but why the chat can not be limited and therefore benefit users who write less using the following logic: Probably this post will take up many downvotes, cause sort of chat's elites do not agree this, but this will ma...

Larry Wall says it's Perl.
> playing with my biggest friend
Now with 100% more list-in-code-block
It's my second least favorite, right after Bash.
19:40
not costructive maybe i mispelling what i mean, you assumed i'm trying to ask somenthing malicious, it is not i'm sorry — okok 30 mins ago
What. The Fuck. Does that even mean?
When I saw all that answers with different ways of thinking and all that stuff, I just want to throw all of that away and go back down to "arbitrary convention + blind education".
"I don't know English"
> 1 - stackoverflow servers will breathe little bit more
wAt
Awww he cares about SO servers
19:41
How cute.
@CatPlusPlus Sounds reasonable.
It's so transparent that oh god
=/
Coliru has been bugging out lately.
@KnightswhosayNi This is not a baby site, deleting those answers will impact smaller DB size — Mr. Alien May 10 at 5:19
Is the load getting too heavy for it?
Bloo bloo they kicked me out and I can't bother them with my crappy questions ;_;
19:42
So, uh
Now, there was a message back there that I wanted to reply to... Where is it?
@BoltClock Don't you love when your users are more concerned with your disk space than you
The second overload gets called almost all the time.
user142019
4 mins ago, by FredOverflow
19:42
@EtiennedeMartel I'm gonna begin "A Canterlot Wedding". Away from here for an hour.
user142019
Perhaps. :v
70
Q: make_unique and perfect forwarding

FredOverflowWhy is there no std::make_unique function template in the standard C++11 library? I find std::unique_ptr<SomeUserDefinedType> p(new SomeUserDefinedType(1, 2, 3)); a bit verbose. Wouldn't the following be much nicer? auto p = std::make_unique<SomeUserDefinedType>(1, 2, 3); This hides the new...

@rightfold very likely
@ThePhD TDx is not a good name
How could there be such an oversight?
Also it should be first
19:44
@FredOverflow Yeah, but what about for the deleter?
@Morwenn Watching the episode? Prepare for massive feels
Wait, no
What is the problem, actually?
@Morwenn It's going to blow your mind.
@BoltClock I hope so. More feels than on this chat at least.
19:45
@BoltClock awww
When I watch MLP, I wonder why I've even been doing other things before.
@ThePhD It's made with new, why would you not want to delete it? Arrays?
ITT Our Unicorn mod is awesome.
But before all, I've to last for this Elvenking song to end.
@ThePhD That, again, just smacks of zero planning.
19:47
I am listening to "50 greatest Wagner pieces"
It has mistakes that are obvious the moment you think about it for a minute.
or, as my roommate put it, "the nazi party"
@BartekBanachewicz Heavy
Look, just because your crazy doesnt mean you cant make some kickass music. See Whitney Houston for contemporary
mine crazy?
user142019
Man.
user142019
19:48
I'm bored.
@R.MartinhoFernandes =[
@ThePhD Get a use case first, and the error of your ways will be obvious.
"kick" actually already exists, although it doesn't do much beyond literally kicking someone out of the room. They can join right back if they'd like. — Anna Lear 2 mins ago
Is this available to room owners?
19:49
nope
@BoltClock Nope.
We have no real power.
@BoltClock Nothing is
@rightfold Join us in the FP room, we are currently whining about our life without life :)
I'd have a lot of fun with this
Even if they can join again
@R.MartinhoFernandes I was going to use it with a std::allocator and a allocator_deleter<TAlloc>, but I guess I can just not worry about it.
@ThePhD Now pretend your implmentation works and see what happens...
@R.MartinhoFernandes I know my implementation doesn't work, that's why I was asking for help...
So hey, who likes systemd
19:52
(Screw the implementation; your interface is broken)
... So, yeah.
make_unique_deleter and make_unique
@FredOverflow exactly
@ThePhD You can't just change the name, though.
Wait, you can only post a thousand messages per day?
I'm gonna have to restrain myself.
user142019
19:55
@EtiennedeMartel fu now I wanna play D&D.
@FredOverflow That was a proposal. I don't believe it is the case currently.
-39
Q: Stackoverflow chat proposal

okokplaying with my biggest friends in the javascript chat, came to my mind, but why the chat can not be limited and therefore benefit users who write less using the following logic: every day you have for example 300 posts available if on day x the user has only posted 10 messages of his 300, the...

user142019
Neat.
I have no idea how systemd works
19:56
@Rapptz nice, tell that cplusplus.com
> Construction of arrays of known bound is disallowed.
whut
> Constructs an array of unknown bound T. [..] The function is equivalent to unique_ptr<T>(new typename std::remove_extent<T>::type[n]())
then wtf is n?
unknown bound might mean runtime evaluated
@LightnessRacesinOrbit T[N] can only be stack-allocated and can't be passed as a return value. No way to properly allocate a compile-time array on the heap.
a what now?
and how exactly are we supposed to allocate memory for an array of unknown bounds?
You know, int n[42]; <-- they're dis-allowing that for make_unique.
19:59
you mean int* n = new int[42]
why would you do that?

« first day (943 days earlier)      last day (4221 days later) »