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1:00 PM
@rightfold What did you think?
 
user1804599
It was fun until I discovered implicit virtuality.
 
Xeo
really?
 
user1804599
I don’t like that. :(
 
user3010322
Fucking std::forward not being part of the core fucking library has to be in another fucking header JAYSUS FUCK.
 
it's not bad if compiler do devirtualization
 
1:00 PM
I've not discovered implicit virtuality. :o
 
user1804599
C++’ and C#’s greatest strengths!
 
Xeo
@ThePhD mimimi
 
user1804599
I always forget if std::advance is in <algorithm> or <iterator>.
 
@Xeo you're too cute for that Accelerator avatar.
 
@Abyx It's annoying if you want to write decent interfaces.
@ThePhD Just static_cast vOv
 
Xeo
1:05 PM
@Abyx wat
 
@Xeo dunno
 
user1804599
I made software today.
 
@Xeo Ugh, unsigned.
 
Xeo
I like unsigned :<
 
1:08 PM
@thecoshman what
@Xeo completely illegible. fuck C++
 
@rightfold One software?
 
user1804599
I made exactly one software today.
 
Xeo
@LightnessRacesinOrbit It was supposed to fit in 20 lines, of course I've written it in an illegible way.
 
user1804599
Reminds me of Konrad. (Sorry Konrad.)
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit what?
 
user3010322
1:09 PM
I can't do it.
 
user3010322
I can't handle the nested types
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes By the way, I was thinking of a new Wide feature that I might look into.
 
Xeo
Btw @R.MartinhoFernandes, where's your post about tuple_cat for your optimal tuple?
 
where you can pass parameters to destructors, essentially.
 
@Xeo Not done yet.
 
1:14 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes wrt to letters, what is the 'bow'?
 
user3010322
I
 
user3010322
I can't
 
user3010322
I can't GLUE THESE PARAMETERS TOGETHER
 
user3010322
WHY IS THIS SO HAAARD.
 
why are you so suck :P
 
1:16 PM
C++
sucks innit
 
@thecoshman Some feature of glyphs. It rings a bell, but I'm not sure what it is.
@ThePhD Why do you need forward?
std::get is forwarding enough.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I think it's the curved part... but not sure if it means the complete curve you would get with letters like 'd p b' or just the more horizontal parts, as apparently 's' would have two bows... but it might also depend on the script...
 
Xeo
@R.MartinhoFernandes To forward the tuple to std::get
 
Ah right.
Hmm, so basically I have 12 lines to write the index generation. Meaning six specialisations max.
 
user3010322
std::tuple<> <--- legal, no?
 
Xeo
1:26 PM
ya
 
why not
 
MainWindow& g_wnd = *new MainWindow; -- oh my, I just wrote so cunning code
 
Xeo
@R.MartinhoFernandes hm?
 
@Xeo Need four lines for the public function, and four lines for the expander.
The rest is just magic indices.
 
just use the indices accepted in Bristol :P
 
Xeo
1:30 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes Oh. Same (if I move the braces into one line with the body), but I also have 1 line for the basecase.
 
user3010322
Can I double-template ?
 
@Xeo My expander doesn't recurse.
@DeadMG No, I need special ones for this.
 
user3010322
template <typename T>
template <typename X<T>>
struct { ... };
 
user3010322
^ Not possible, right?
 
With seq<ix<0, 0>, ix<0, 1>, ix<0, 2>, ix<1, 0>, ix<1, 1>>, it's easy.
 
1:32 PM
@ThePhD what even are you trying to do.
 
user3010322
Nothing. :c
 
user3010322
Nevermind...
 
Xeo
@R.MartinhoFernandes Oh... you pack the arguments into another tuple and do get<I>(get<J>(args))?
 
user3010322
Fucking
 
user3010322
templates
 
user3010322
1:33 PM
why does the meta language have to be so ridiculous obtuse >___<
 
I must admit, I have never observed a template to fuck another.
 
Xeo
@ThePhD Use Haskell as a pseudocode language :D
 
@Xeo It's basically the same strategy I used for my tuple cat (but there I had even more pressing reasons to do it like that)
Just build the right mapping, and double get it.
 
user3010322
Arrrrrrrgh
 
user3010322
1:35 PM
I can't dig thes enumbers out of the indices template
 
user3010322
Whhhhyyyy
 
user3010322
Why can't I access template parameters straight from the outside >___<
 
user3010322
Why all this deduction nonsense?!
 
WTF are you smoking?
 
user3010322
I wish I was smoking 20 thick stacks of reefer. :|
 
user3010322
1:36 PM
That's what I wish I was doing.
 
Seriously, what you doing that is so annoying?
 
he wants to turn a template parameter (which is itself an instantiation of X<T>) into X and T.
 
user3010322
I don't want to ask for help until I get something to work, even a little bit...
 
I'm guessing.
 
@ThePhD Well, the right solution is minimally annoying, so it seems you're on a wrong track :P
 
user3010322
1:38 PM
;~;
 
user3010322
~Sigh~
 
Xeo
@R.MartinhoFernandes That makes the expander really neat and concise.
 
so
 
user3010322
^ As far as I've gotten.
 
1:41 PM
do I make my frontend/driver projects depend on my test projects?
 
user3010322
NO I DON'T WANT YOUR ADVICE. D:<
 
@DeadMG Woah, no?
 
nah I wasn't feeling that either
 
@ThePhD Woah, it definitely looks like the wrong track :S
 
Xeo
Now I just need to generate the index pairs...
 
1:42 PM
so yeah... I've wanting to take on some sort artistic writing hobby, something to do that does not involve the computer (not with my current plans god damn it) that would not be a pain to get the stuff out for.
So I was at first thinking just transcribing short stories I like.
 
@thecoshman Most writers these days do it on computers.
 
But that in itself is a bit boring, so mix it up a bit by doing something a bit 'odd'
 
@thecoshman Do gardening, that doesn't involve much computers
 
was thinking maybe calligraphy black letter
 
@thecoshman What, like, with a literal pen?
 
1:44 PM
but now thinking I like the idea of 'ye old English' runes
 
@DeadMG Better than swords.
 
cause you'd be insane to write anything on paper.
 
user3010322
;~;
 
if you want to skip the computer, paint or something.
 
I'm insane and I like it.
 
user3010322
1:44 PM
I've dug myself into a hole. Time to restart...
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes nah, want to do it physically with a real pen cc @DeadMG
@DeadMG see 'not pain to get the stuff out for'
 
user1804599
There is nothing wrong with pens.
 
user1804599
They are nice.
 
I also find my painting is fair too dependent on good light, so this time of year I just can't do it.
@TonyTheLion ¬_¬ hate gardening
 
@thecoshman If you want to do it for the words, do it on a computer. Don't add the pain of editing on paper. If you want to do it for the looks, do it on a computer first, make the looks in the end.
 
user3010322
1:45 PM
flops.
 
user3010322
I give up.
 
user3010322
Throw in the towerl.
 
You don't want to correct typos or rearrange sentences on paper.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I would just be transribing stuff
 
@thecoshman The problem with that is that the result of low labour usually isn't very interesting.
 
1:46 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes I partial want to meditative task of having to plan it out carefully
 
@DeadMG No one cares what you find interesting :P
 
user3010322
I can't express multiple types in a single type type on a template struct,
 
lol
 
@DeadMG it's not really for the end result, but the journey
 
@ThePhD Like I said, completely wrong path.
 
1:47 PM
especially at first
 
user3010322
which means I'm having a hard time doing the expansion bit on std::array, std::tuple, and std::pair =/
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes there is that too :P
 
user3010322
@R.MartinhoFernandes Well, what else should I be doing? =/
 
@ThePhD tuple_cat is only required to deal with tuples though. All the others are optional.
 
user3010322
@R.MartinhoFernandes Okay, so say I pack everything into a special tuple_type, flattened out Now how do I glue those together?
 
user3010322
1:48 PM
Do I just forward even 1-argument types into a tuple, then send them all to the same gluing template?
 
Thinking black letter would be better, at least that can be read again with ease.
 
user3010322
.. That's not a bad idea, I guess.
 
Xeo
@R.MartinhoFernandes Well, it's really easy to actually make it work for all those that support the tuple-protocol, so...
 
yeah, think I shall try to get a set tonight on my way home, failing that might have to get up to dublin.
I did give calligraphy a go when I was younger, rather enjoyed it
 
@ThePhD You're focusing too much on computing the result type.
 
1:50 PM
plus I somewhat hope that my natural handwriting changes into something more interesting... and clearly not just mess.
 
user3010322
@R.MartinhoFernandes That's the only thing that matters. =/
 
@ThePhD It's what matters the least.
 
user3010322
I have to finish computing the result type, and then I have to do the expansion.
 
The result type helps nought with the expansion.
 
Xeo
@ThePhD decltype, and just focus on the expansion
 
1:51 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes with computer, I cannot get the manual control over the angle the nib is on the paper, it is just a point.
 
user3010322
=[
 
@thecoshman ? I meant to write the text on the computer and then transcribe it. I assumed you wanted to write your own stuff
 
user3010322
If I focus on the expansion, I get stuck because a function can only return a packed type
 
user3010322
not several lone types
 
user3010322
so when I hit a std::tuple in the list, it all goes to hell.
 
1:52 PM
What?
 
user3010322
Oh, nevermind, I'm not making sense...
 
user3010322
I'll figure it out.
 
user3010322
Eventually.
 
@ThePhD It's all figured out above already vOv
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes oh right, maybe at some stage. I am no linguist, so will just transcribe for now.
 
Xeo
1:53 PM
Hint: std::tuple_cat is only required to work on tuple-like types, not lone types, so something like std::tuple_cat(42, 13.37, true) is not supported.
 
The first big problem to attempt to solve... learning how to adapt an art form that has been 'right handed' for centuries such that my left hand can do it. O learn to write with my right hand :S
 
That would be horrible.
 
hmm
 
user3010322
@Xeo That doesn't make much sense...
 
user3010322
So I can't glue types together that don't start out as tuples?
 
user3010322
1:58 PM
That seems silly.
 
No, it seems sensible.
 
user3010322
=[
 
There's make_tuple for a reason.
tuple_cat concatenates tuples. Simple.
 
user3010322
Then I have to use std::forward_as_tuple =/
 
user3010322
Well, that makes this immensely more boring and lame. =[
 
Xeo
2:00 PM
Ignore forwarding for now
 
Mixing tuples and non-tuples in tuple_cat is the lame approach.
It's the Perl approach.
 
user3010322
It's the primaryexample on cppreference.com
 
user3010322
So I assumed it was a case that was meant to be supported.
 
@ThePhD Erm, no, it's not.
 
Xeo
2:02 PM
uhm
 
user3010322
2 tuples, a pair, and a tie.
 
@ThePhD All tuples!
 
Xeo
tie = tuple, a pair is "tuple-like"
it supports the tuple-protocol
 
tie yields a tuple of references
 
@ThePhD Tie is just a helper that makes a tuple.
 
user3010322
2:03 PM
FML.
 
I wish you had constexpr parameters that you can only pass constant expressions so you could overload for those
 
a common request.
 
user1804599
Cool.
 
Think malloc(constexpr size) in the example of malloc(sizeof(T)).
 
user1804599
MSDN remembers that I hide protected members from the lists of members.
 
2:07 PM
I'm bored
 
user3010322
I hate tuples.
 
I hate you.
:P
 
Xeo
@ThePhD You just suck - but that's nothing new, eh?
 
Some drunk person sat down next to me on the train, read the stuff I had open in VS and asked me "did you define all these Components yourself?! You'll have to rely on other people! You have no idea what you're doing, you're all just users." He kept asking me where I was logged in to, and told me his pinky finger is broken. He also shouted at other passengers to be quiet a couple of times...finally he asked me where the US embassy was. o_O
 
@melak47 lolwut
 
2:09 PM
man
I found a forward declaration for Wide::Library.
that class hasn't existed in like, 12 months.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes gotta love public transportation
 
user3010322
=[
 
user3010322
@melak47 Sounds really strange.
 
@melak47 and not the common decency to offer you a drink? people today!
 
@nightcracker What would that overload do better?
 
user3010322
2:10 PM
Well, at this pint, I still don't know how to expand a tuple into it's basic elements. r something. I don'tknow.
 
he also asked if he should help me, but then said "now it's too late" waving his vodka bottle around :/
 
@ThePhD Oh, so you are drunk.
 
@thecoshman lol
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Use a memory pool for small sizes to prevent fragmentation
 
Being drunk is the only sensible course of action
 
user3010322
2:11 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes Drunk on immense sadness.
 
TEN WEEKDAYS
 
user1804599
What happens on that day?
 
Semester ends
 
user1804599
lol
 
wut
 
user1804599
2:12 PM
nice
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes you could also do this with an if at runtime, but a memory pool implementation can be so small you can actually inline it
 
After that it's just diploma exam in January and fuck uni forever
 
mine ends in like february
 
Meh, I don't see why this would have to be plugged into malloc.
 
It's the last one, it's shorter by 5 weeks
 
2:13 PM
ah
 
@CatPlusPlus you might have to then get a real job though :O
 
I have a real job thanks
 
sure :S
 
JBL
The real question is "Does it involve programming ?"
 
@CatPlusPlus do you drink on trains and offer to help debug people's code?
 
2:13 PM
@ThePhD You cannot have pints of sadness. Sadness only comes in trains.
 
user3010322
The expansion is easy enough, but it just doesn't make.... I don't know.
 
@JBL Unfortunately this is still the only thing I can do
 
user3010322
I can't make the function return more than one thing, so I can't use indices gen since I rely on a function to do template deduction for me. =/
 
Xeo
hmmm.... argh, I'm missing something about the index-pair generation...
 
@ThePhD what are you trying to do? o.O
 
2:14 PM
@ThePhD Wait till I write my tuple_cat post. Then you'll finally under—no, wait, that would only make it worse.
 
user3010322
Make tuple_cat =/
 
@CatPlusPlus god damn it! we have been through this, you are polish thus can do building work!
 
@ThePhD And here you are again, thinking about the wrong way :(
 
user3010322
@R.MartinhoFernandes It's not my fault!
 
You don't need to return more than one thing.
 
2:15 PM
That is not even a stereotype, it doesn't make sense and you suck
(Hint: it's plumbers not builders)
Not that it makes more sense but whatever
 
@CatPlusPlus hint: just because you are not aware of the stereotype does not mean there is not one.
 
Aaaaaaand, I just pushed one more goat sacrifice to GCC.
 
It still makes no sense
 
also, jack of all trades
 
It's not even funny, so you still suck
 
2:16 PM
Commit message: "Fix ambiguous bases. Again. Again."
 
lol
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes You've actually read and maintain parts of the GCC?
 
No.
I just know workarounds goat sacrificing rituals for some of its bugs.
 
@CatPlusPlus trust me, head over to england, find any building site, say you are Polish, and they will give you a sack of cement, a pallet of bricks and ask you to start building a house
 
@GamesBrainiac Nobody dares read the GCC!
 
2:18 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes What about clang?
 
@GamesBrainiac Clang has bugs for which I don't know/like the rituals, so I don't use it.
 
hmmm.
I've got as part of my todo list
> Investigate that fucking close bracket
perhaps I could have left myself a more specific note...?
 
Also, it annoys me when everyone just keeps suggesting clang as if it was better by default. It's just a different set of problems.
 
user3010322
I got stuck again. :c
 
@thecoshman Still no comedy value
 
2:22 PM
@CatPlusPlus do I look like I give a fuck?
 
@thecoshman lol
 
room topic changed to Lounge<C++>: Don't read the GCC! [c++] [c++11] [c++1y] [no-questions] [no-reading-the-gcc]
@CatPlusPlus Tony laughed.
 
Repeating unfunny things don't make them funny. Point in case: reddit
 
@DeadMG Past You seems as horrible as Past Me.
 
2:23 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes shh, he might point out that it was at me :S
 
@CatPlusPlus so tell me something you find funny then?
 
@CatPlusPlus It does if done right.
 
well
 
@TonyTheLion poteatoes
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes ... does that mean you look at future you thinking he's a really great guy?
 
2:23 PM
I think that I might finally be starting to decide that this whole "test" and "comment" thing might be a good idea.
 
user3010322
=[
 
@DeadMG hehe
 
I just realized that I have this test and I have no idea what it actually tests.
 
user3010322
I think I'm going to go lie down...
 
@thecoshman No. I look at Future Me thinking "hahaha, you're so screwed, buddy"
 
2:24 PM
@DeadMG then it is a terrible test :P
@R.MartinhoFernandes lol
 
@DeadMG lol
@DeadMG No name?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes 'testThing'
 
@DeadMG What are you using for the tests, btw? I remember you saying you finally got something going, but never saw more details.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I ended up creating my own harness.
it's not ideal but..
 
2:26 PM
yay
20 CPU cycles for an allocation, thread-safe
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes "BreakScope".
I figure that the test only fails if using break accidentally destroys stuff in the wrong scope.
I must have had that as a bug at some point when authoring break.
 
(that's 6 times as fast as malloc on the same PC)
 
> Refactored todo.txt.
lol, refactored.
 
well, it was refactored :P
 
@nightcracker o_0 what on earth are you playing at? counting cpu cycles
 
2:28 PM
@nightcracker Yeah, but "malloc" and pool allocator isn't the same thing.
 
@DeadMG I know
 
My phone just told me it would take me 42 mins to drive home just about now.
Not sure why I need to know that at this moment
 
But a pool allocator is pretty damn handy for a fast tree implementation
@thecoshman welcome to my world ;)
 
@DeadMG give a man a test framework and he tests his code. Teach a man to make a test framework and he never knows if anything ever works or not
 
well
 
2:29 PM
@nightcracker OCD land?
 
the core problem is that the LLVM interpreter does not function, like, at all.
so I have to use the JIT to create machine code to test the run-time behaviour.
 
@TonyTheLion Like, out of the blue?
WTF
 
which implies requiring IPC since a bug in the JITted code would otherwise bring down the testing process.
 
@thecoshman Obsessive–compulsive disorder?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes yes, pretty much.
 
2:30 PM
and Catch, which I liked, doesn't provide for interproess isolation.
 
@nightcracker bingo
 
@thecoshman Nah, my world is just a fascination for low-level stuff and how to make things fast
 
@nightcracker meh, we are past micro optimizations
 
@thecoshman DID?
 
Xeo
@R.MartinhoFernandes Okay, I got my index-pair generation sorted out. Total lines: 31 :(
 
2:32 PM
@nightcracker o_0
 
@nightcracker So malloc in blocks of six :P
 
@nightcracker in the worst case? The time required for an allocation tends to vary quite a bit. Sounds impressive though
 
@jalf average case, worst case is determined by malloc (I have to allocate at some point)
 
@thecoshman people who write performance critical code aren't
 
Xeo
I'm sure I'm missing something about the generation: coliru.stacked-crooked.com/a/c7b087f5b313c175
 
2:34 PM
alright.
 
@jalf no, because they refuse to just add more hardware :P
 
I should pick something pretty trivial and implement it.
 
I'm not sure what to think about this?
 
user3010322
I can only have one index pair at a time, I think...
 
@DeadMG cat?
 
2:34 PM
I'm sick of staring at this massive-effort stuff like "Implement exceptions".
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes and how am I going to free that?
 
Hmm, cat requires standard streams. Probably too much effort too.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Well, this morning, I implemented if (var := false) { return var; } else { return ~var; } as a test.
@R.MartinhoFernandes Before I work on I/O, I need strings (really, you can't do "Hello, World" without strings) and probably exceptions too.
and before I work on strings, I need, well, a shitload of stuff.
 
@thecoshman eh... I get that you don't care (or need to care) about performance, but some people do, and the endless bashing of people (not by you specifically) who dare to try to optimize their code gets kinda old
 
user3010322
2:37 PM
Good night
 
@DeadMG print('H'); print('e'); print('l'); print('l'); print('o'); print(' '); print('W'); print('o'); print('r'); print('l'); print('d'); print('!');
 
Code being slow is not in itself a desirable goal
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Heh. Could do something like that already.
 
@jalf it still needs to be done :P
 
it wouldn't be nice or useful or desirable, but it would function.
 
2:38 PM
@ThePhD ?
What is that?
 
I might go for implementing some of those short forms, like module X.Y.Z {}.
 
@Xeo Hmm, I think I can do it in less.
 
Xeo
@R.MartinhoFernandes As I said, I feel like I'm missing something
 
Working from home is the best
Been working pretty much uninterrupted for the past 4 hours. That normally never happens
 
oh guess I was wrong
thread-local storage is NOT expensive
was doing something wrong I guess
 
2:42 PM
@jalf Yes :) I love working from home.
I actually get stuff done
 
@nightcracker depends on how you use it (and which OS you're on)
 
Hi guys
 
@nightcracker on Windows, the __declspec approach is super cheap (but has some quirks where it doesn't work in dlls on XP or older), whereas the Win32 API TLS functions are significantly slower. On OSX it was just universally slow (last I tested it, a year or two ago)
 
I've looked at the chat favourites, and it seems you talked about learning and knowing C++...
 
Of course, "slow" is relative, and what was expensive in my case might be perfectly acceptable in yours
 
2:44 PM
What would you consider knowing C++?
 
@MikeM Right now, I know C++ and I'm considering lunch
 
@jalf Considering lunch is more important ;-)
 
c:\program files\mingw-builds\x64-4.8.1-win32-seh-rev5\mingw64\lib\gcc\x86_64-w64-mingw32\4‌​.8.1\include\ia32intrin.h:101:32: internal compiler error:
 
Xeo
Currently working on a revision, sec
 
2:47 PM
Actually, that's eight lines + one empty and one #include.
 
How would you judge, that you know C++ to a certain degree?
 
Get rid of the empty line, add the eight for the wrapper-expander pair, and that's still three lines less than 20. /cc @ThePhD
 
0
Q: Why gcc and g++ produces different code

Mikhail KalashnikovIs it possible to see what is going on behind gcc and g++ compilation process? I have the following program: #include <stdio.h> #include <unistd.h> size_t sym1 = 100; size_t *addr = &sym1; size_t *arr = (size_t*)((size_t)&arr + (size_t)&addr); int main (int argc, char **argv) { (void) arg...

Since 2011 it's not valid C++ either, because of that while(1);. — BoBTFish 9 mins ago
huh?
 
@MikeM hang out here - if you know what people are talking about....
@nightcracker what basic strategy are you using?
 

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