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8:00 PM
@JerryCoffin That's not how it works at almost every establishment in the States, though.
 
The restaurant pays them for you.
 
I've waited tables before. Tipping is income.
 
user3010322
^ Not how it should be.
 
It can be changed.
 
I mean, I got $3.xx an hour, but I made what I needed to make from my tips (closer to $20/hour).
 
8:00 PM
@caps Yes, I mentioned that in my previous comment -- but to reiterate: "...that's really not how things should be."
 
It could be changed, but we're talking about how it IS.
 
user3010322
Burden of proof is now per-customer, rather than per-restaurant.
 
The thing is.
 
It's fine to talk about how things should be, but I thought we were talking about how things ARE
 
You should be doing good at your job anyway.
 
user3010322
8:01 PM
Restaurant can charge you an arm and a leg for a meal, collect maximum profit, then underpay workers.
 
Ell
@caps this is america right?
 
Why would I pay for mediocre service?
 
user3010322
Then just say "well, you should tip people!"
 
If in my opinion you are doing very well, and I enjoyed it, then by all means I can tip, but it does not mean I am forced to.
 
user1804599
8:02 PM
@sehe lol
 
Ell
@sehe holy shish kebab
 
user3010322
> on another large library that may have to be downloaded and installed
 
user3010322
STL = downloaded and installed library <__>
 
You act as if servers are a third party here.
Which, as you pointed out, is how they are treated.
 
@Pawnguy7 Everything about that entire situation is frustrating.
 
8:03 PM
@ThePhD That was probably written back in 1996.
 
user3010322
Probably.
 
user3010322
wxWidgets is old
 
@caps yes. My point was, basically everybody does this in some form or another
 
Really, reading that paragraph, I can't help but think that wxWidgets is old as shit.
 
user3010322
And it's what Code::Blocks is builty out of, bless its tiny soul.
 
8:03 PM
We are in a revolution generation of sorts.
 
Also.
> In addition, use of templates can lead to executable bloat, which is something wxWidgets is strenuously trying to avoid.
@R.MartinhoFernandes ^
 
user3010322
ZING!
 
Where are weapons are not military, but protest.
 
@Pawnguy7 Does what in some form or another? Can you sum up your point in just a sentence or two? It's spread out and I don't follow how the parts are connected.
 
> The standard C++ string class is not used, again because it is not available to all compilers, and it is not necessarily a very efficient implementation. Also, we retain more flexibility by being able to modify our own string class.
 
8:04 PM
You will treat people based on who they are, rather than in the specific case.
For example, let's say your server is a racist.
Are you inclined to tip them anymore?
 
user3010322
@EtiennedeMartel Now I know where executable bloat arguments originated from.
 
user3010322
God bless Code::Block's soul: this explains why it's such a shitty editor.
 
Summary of my points (which may be unrelated to yours): in the States, if you go out to eat at a place where you have a dedicated server, you should, by default, leave a tip for the server. 20% unless they do a bad job, then you can tip less. You are paying the restaurant for your food, and the server for the job they did serving you. Their personal opinions and lifestyle are irrelevant to the job they do serving you food.
 
user3010322
"I hate jews"
"Me too! Have more money."
 
If you want to protest their lifestyle or beliefs, then ask for someone else to serve you, or don't visit that restaurant.
 
8:06 PM
@Pawnguy7 you are brushing the godwin's law there
 
@ThePhD this describes political campaigning :D
 
@caps In Quebec, the convention is 15% for a good job, 10% for an okay job, and on a per-case basis for any other situation.
 
@caps I am guessing people would hate that more than this
Not to mention, you still get no tips.
 
user3010322
@EtiennedeMartel What blows my mind is in the states, 20% gratis is included in the bill.
 
user3010322
So they include that gratis,
 
user3010322
8:06 PM
and THEN ask you to tip the waiter.
 
user3010322
Wat.
 
user3010322
So, I'm giving 40% tips? Or is the restaunrant taking the 20% gratis?
 
@Pawnguy7 ...but it does give at least a chance that somebody else (who might tip) will be sitting at that table instead.
 
If you don't like what Starbucks or Chick-Fil-A supports, then don't go to Starbucks or Chick-Fil-A. You can't go to Starbucks or Chick-Fil-A and get a coffee or chicken sandwich and then say "You know what, I know you just provided me a service, but I don't agree with your opinions, so I'm not going to pay you" or "I'm only going to pay what it would cost me to buy the coffee beans or chicken breast from wal-mart, etc."
 
8:07 PM
@JerryCoffin if they don't go there. I was addressing the asking somebody else to serve you point.
 
@rightfold I particularly like this punny one twitter.com/sehetw/status/405427609187536897
 
@caps the company is not the waiter
 
@Pawnguy7 Works out the same way -- if they're not serving you, they may pick up a different table that's more likely to tip.
 
You don't know what the waiter stands for in advance.
 
@Pawnguy7 Uh, so?
The point is that you are paying them for a SERVICE.
 
8:09 PM
@caps how can you boycott it in advance?
 
If it matters to you what they believe or how they live, ask them beforehand, just like you would look at a company's website.
 
Ask who beforehand?
 
The server.
 
You were describing companies, though.
 
@Pawnguy7 I was making an analogy.
 
Ell
8:10 PM
@Pawnguy7 Are you proposing not paying for a service upon finding out their values? o.O
 
@Ell Basically.
 
@caps analogies don't go so well when they are both instances :D
 
Ell
I want some chocolate cake :(
 
@Ell depends how we are thinking of this
The waiter works for the restaurant.
Thus, it should pay them.
 
@Ell "I don't like what my waiter believes / how my waiter lives, so I am not going to tip them, even though they brought me my food, refilled my drink, and otherwise provided acceptable or better service."
 
8:11 PM
Do you tip airline people?
 
@Pawnguy7 No, the airline pays them.
 
What are they called :\
 
Pro _Tip_: Don't go on the internet moaning about the bad lifestyle of your waiter. It's bad (life) style.
 
Ell
@Pawnguy7 Right
 
user1804599
Hmm.
 
8:12 PM
Now.
 
Now, cut it out, or I'll get really grumpy
 
Ell
@caps Well, it depends where you come from
 
If you are only saying tip them because of this fact.
 
@Pawnguy7 Yes, it should pay them, but it does not. The system is designed to have the customers pay the servers directly. Whenever you're in that system, you should go along with it.
 
Ell
In the usa it is socially obligatory to tip?
 
8:12 PM
Then fix the problem at it's base.
 
Ell
It's not like that in the UK
 
> Did anyone spot in Bjarne's 'essence of C++' presentation that the slides were labelled 'Going naive 2013' - naive!
 
user1804599
How do I pass arguments to ctors of elements if I use new[]?
 
This is like providing services for drug addicts, but giving them drugs still.
 
^ I hadn't noticed.
 
8:12 PM
@Ell more or less
 
@StackedCrooked Many of us. In fact several other presenters made a note of that and even copied it, I think
 
user1804599
new T[count](foo)?
 
user3010322
@rightfold To all elements?
 
user1804599
Yes.
 
@rightfold lol. You don't. There's a reason make_unique sfinaes out for array types too
 
user3010322
8:13 PM
Uh. Cascading construct?
 
@caps if I had a choice, I could get my food and drink myself
 
@Ell Depends on the restaurant. Some places pay the normal minimum wage (or better) and tips go into a jar that gets split to everyone. Most places, though, pay their servers a lower "server-minimum wage" and expect the customer to tip the server to make up the difference.
 
@ThePhD Premature Misnomer
 
user1804599
@sehe I’m using make_shared. :v
 
I only need the restaurant to cook and provide supplies.
But I cannot cut out the middleman.
 
user3010322
8:14 PM
template <std::size_t n, std::size_t m, typename T, typename TAlloc>
		void cascading_construct ( T* p, TAlloc&& alloc ) {

		}

		template <std::size_t n, std::size_t m, typename T, typename TAlloc, typename T0, typename... Tn>
		void cascading_construct ( T* p, TAlloc&& alloc, T0&& arg, Tn&&... argn ) {
			alloc.construct( p, std::forward<T0>( arg ) );
			cascading_construct<n, ++m>( std::forward<TAlloc>( alloc ), ++p, std::forward<Tn>( argn )... );
		}
 
Ell
@caps isn't that illegal? To pay less than minimum wage
 
user3010322
Something like that.
 
user3010322
Albeit, I'm using an allocator.
 
user1804599
I know that new[] is bad in general. Let me. :v
 
@Ell you would think
 
8:14 PM
@Pawnguy7 Get your own damn cook. Now get out of here. You're being a spoilt brat. Don't tip if you feel like. But don't keep arguing about how you don't need to go to a restaurant. Because, indeed, you don't have to.
 
This story wasn't about me?
 
@Ell It's a special exception for waiters. They report their tips. If for some reason they didn't make enough in tips to equal what they would have made in minimum wage, then their employer makes up the difference.
 
@Pawnguy7 Irrelevant. It's a whiney line of reasoning. No need to keep perpetuating that. Especially on behalf of fictitious "others".
 
The difference in payment method is usually based on methodology--the places that divvy up the tips usually don't give tables a dedicated server. All the servers serve everybody. Whereas the places that expect the customer to make up the difference usually have specific waiters assigned to specific tables.
 
@caps why is not getting tips a problem, then?
 
Ell
8:16 PM
I wonder how that system got there in the first place
 
SLAVERY
 
@Pawnguy7 Because waiters usually make better than minimum wage.
 
BragAlert(TM)
 
Sometimes a little better, sometimes a lot better.
 
@sehe I failed to see how I am a spoiled brat here.
 
8:17 PM
Ex: minimum wage in OK is something like ~$7.75, but after tips I made $20/hr waiting tables on a busy night.
 
user3010322
@sehe You're really into classical music and even play some yourself, yes?
 
Hmm. Yes
 
@caps if you get minimum wage, why would you ever complain about not getting payed?
 
user3010322
If I ever visited you, would you play something for me? :D
 
@ScottW Ok, by that logic, I should admit I'm half-dead
 
8:18 PM
@Pawnguy7 Huh?
 
@ThePhD I sure as hell wouldn't stop for just that reason :)
@ScottW 50 pushups would kill me
 
@caps if, no matter what, you get payed minimum wage, why do you care if they tip you or not?
 
user3010322
I haven't tried push-ups in a long time.
 
Are you entitled to get more as a waiter or something?
 
user3010322
I think the last time I tried to max out on pushups, I hit like 47?
 
8:19 PM
@ThePhD It's best if you bring your own /sheet/ music though. I like that
 
user3010322
@sehe Well, I dunno if you'd like my music...
 
Ell
@ScottW What if they have no arms or legs or a head?
 
user3010322
I mean, this might be nice to listen to (I even have it in lossless FLAC): youtube.com/watch?v=LtY_RXoF1wA
 
@ThePhD edited
 
@Pawnguy7 Because I need(ed) more than minimum wage to pay my bills at the number of hours I was working.
 
user3010322
8:19 PM
Oooh.
 
user3010322
I only have SOME sheet music. Not a lot. Not anything worthy of a professional either. @___@
 
Ell
@ScottW I don't have any arms or legs or a head.
I type with my penis
and think with it too.
 
@Pawnguy7 You're kind of starting to piss me off, which I never expected you to do.
 
user3010322
@sehe One day, I'll learn to read sheet music. =[
 
@ThePhD Flac would get a lot of flak were it not lossless
 
Ell
8:20 PM
Also I'm on pawnguys side now - as long as you get minimum wage then it's okay
 
user3010322
ZING! Da punz.
 
user3010322
And it's not even Friday.
 
@caps get a higher-paying job, or get another part-time job?
 
Ell
If you aren't satisfied with your wage, ask for a pay rise, consult your union, or find a new job
 
Pastiche. And over-pompously arranged :)
The atmosphere is prolly nice for the intended use
 
8:21 PM
@Ell There is no waiter's union, restaurants don't hand out pay raises to waiters because waiters get tips
 
Ell
@ScottW want a pic?
@ScottW I can't hold a camera :/
 
user3010322
@sehe It was a dire, insta-death kinda situation, so I guess it fits.
 
user3010322
Um, for nicer things...
 
@Ell People take waiting jobs because they pay better than most other "low-skill" jobs. (Although waiting tables does take skill, esp. to get good tips)
 
user3010322
@sehe This is a bit nicer: youtube.com/watch?v=JiA9EdfML14
 
user3010322
8:22 PM
There's an even nicer one for that soundtrack, but.
 
@Ell You too! I knew I wasn't crazy
 
@caps I fail to see how. Anyway, if it upsets you, you are free to drop the conversation.
 
@ThePhD lot's more interesting. More honest. And real skills. Not the best string quartet, but craftsmen
@AnkitSrivastava Yeah. Downvoting is my favorite too
 
user3010322
@sehe Ahh. The same people made this one too, which I like a lot. The sound quality on these videos is a little bleh though. <_>: youtube.com/watch?v=COdT65OD7-w
 
4 messages moved to bin
 
user3010322
8:25 PM
... I think that's it for violiny stuff I have that I can find on Youtube.
 
The bin is one box
 
user3010322
One Box to rule them all.
 
@ThePhD lol. Try "violin" in the search box. Perhaps with "concert" or "sonata" :)
 
@ScottW I'm already over it, it was a mild thing.
 
someone suggested me to use this chat room,topics may not be necessarily c++
 
8:25 PM
@AnkitSrivastava Yeah, well, no-questions here.
 
0
Q: Database of Artist image which allow license for selling?

Ankit SrivastavaI wanna know if there are any online data base which provide artist images,which can be used in a commercial app.Basically i was using the api of last fm ,i even developed code for that and i contacted them for a commercial license key and they said that artist images cannot be used for commercia...

 
@ScottW @sehe was getting pissed at him too, though...
 
@AnkitSrivastava lol. We sincerely thank "someone". You're welcome to read the newbie hints loungecpp.wikidot.com/owners:newbie-hints
 
user3010322
@sehe Mixin of piano, choir, and just about everything else, but the leading strings are really nice: youtube.com/watch?v=vCxnWJSWBT0
 
@caps sehe has done that several times. Bad choice of person.
I mean, we are in a place where you get insulted for helping people.
 
user3010322
8:27 PM
s/people/vampires/g
 
@Pawnguy7 We don't. Ever. Only if we do so very badly
Nothing should get to you. It's useless. Emotions are best spared for sunsets, rainbows, eclipses and unicorns
 
@sehe insult was probably a hasty choice of word. But there is a millitant anti-help vibe.
 
You mean, there's a puppy.
 
user3010322
Esp. Double Rainbows.
 
There's a proactive anti-leech vibe
Nothing against help. Ask Mooing. Ask Me. Ask Ell. Hell, even the lobster was nice today
 
8:30 PM
I think there is value in teaching to, say, google things.
 
@sehe help me then
 
user3010322
I help on occasion. Other times, I troll. >.>
 
But the execution is not good at teaching this.
 
user3010322
It's a bad habit, but I can't help it ;~;
 
user1804599
lol
 
8:31 PM
@AnkitSrivastava No.
1 min ago, by sehe
There's a proactive anti-leech vibe
 
user1804599
@sehe ignore him; he asked in the functional programming room too.
 
Surprise
Nov 21 '11 at 8:05, by sehe
@KerrekSB: Re: @sehe: Thank you for helping us help you help us all
 
Oct 6 at 19:35, by not-rightfold
I once told him he should kill himself and since then he suspects me from downvoting his questions so he got question-banned.
 
Ell
@AnkitSrivastava What is the problem?
 
8:32 PM
22 hours ago, by Jeremy Francis
Ok thank you rightfold finally someone has helped me
 
@AnkitSrivastava You can.
 
Or, take this guy here now.
 
Invalidated inane flag.
 
8:33 PM
no i can't i already tried that,ended up wetting my roommates jeans
 
6 hours ago, by sehe
lol. help vampire tries upgrade to troll.
favour denied
 
Ell
:13173895 well now this isn't a good way to get help from people.
@AnkitSrivastava what kind of images do you need? Pictures of the last.fm logo?
 
@ll it was not meant for u
 
Anyway, my original point was, hateful is now used for rather mediocre cases. Kind of like censorship has shifted, I suppose. That was all I wanted to say.
 
@Ell Psst. I think he knows :) He's confused. He thinks he just wants attention.
 
8:34 PM
@Ell no,pictures or music artists
 
Ell
@AnkitSrivastava It was still meant to one of the fellow loungers, and that is never a good way to get help
 
5 mins ago, by sehe
You mean, there's a puppy.
 
Ell
@AnkitSrivastava Pictures of what?
 
@Ell pictures of music artists
 
@Ell Please find your ignore button attached to this message. Use it wisely, and it will give you wisdom and a long life
 
8:35 PM
@sehe hm? I was referring to my first comment, the one that started with "TIL"
 
Ell
@sehe I think if someone just helps them, it seems to get them away from the lounge quicker :/ and saves pain in the long run
 
@Pawnguy7 There isn't one.
@Ell Not in this case. Clear troll. Also in other rooms. Let the other rooms wear him out
 
44 mins ago, by Pawnguy7
TIL "I'm sorry but I cannot tip because I do not agree with your lifestyle." is considered hateful.
 
@Ell do u know any online database which provides images of music artist?? which i can use in my paid app and not get sued ?
 
Ell
@sehe Ahh okay, fair enough. My troll detection skills aren't so good :P
 
8:36 PM
@Pawnguy7 I think I actually agree with you there.
@Pawnguy7 Although I responded there, basically: "not hateful, but douchey"
 
user3010322
@AnkitSrivastava What you're asking is a legal question. None of us are lawyers. Go consult a lawyer. End of story.
 
I have lost enough time. I am going just going to leave it with my first comment.
 
@Pawnguy7 Oh. Of course. I didn't realize your eye-blinders are completely noise-shielding. Or maybe you have everyone ignored. Wait. That wouldn't work either. Well. Blimey
 
I haven't ignored anybody.
 
@ThePhD many apps use such databases and layers don't make them right??
 
8:38 PM
@Pawnguy7 I think it fits the bill. Pun intended
 
user1804599
Hmm.
 
user1804599
I need to unpack a tuple into function arguments. :(
 
user3010322
@AnkitSrivastava None of us have developed such apps. Go send mail to THOSE application makers, if you know them.
 
Ell
@rightfold don't you use ... after the tuple for that?
 
user1804599
No.
 
Ell
8:39 PM
(or is that variadic templates?)
 
user3010322
If you get sued, saying "But someone in a chatroom told me it was okay" is not going to stop you from being sued. Quit being dumb and go get a lawyer or contact somebody who knows. =l
 
user1804599
template<typename... Zippees>
class zipping {
    class const_iterator {
        friend class zipping; // can I do this?
    };
};
 
user1804599
Or do I need to pass all the template arguments?
 
user3010322
template <typename... OtherZippees> friend class zipping<OtherZippees...>
 
user3010322
^ I think ?
 
8:40 PM
@ThePhD how m i supposed to know that any of u have made such an app or not??i can only ask
 
Lawyers don't make anything right.
 
user1804599
@ThePhD Nah, Zippees is already in scope.
 
@ThePhD cough - kitties - cough
 
user1804599
That would be friend class zipping<Zippees...>;.
 
user3010322
@rightfold That would only friend the current class though, wouldn't it?
 
8:41 PM
@rightfold scan the standard for "injected name"
 
user1804599
Yes. That’s the point. :v
 
user3010322
Oh.
 
@ThePhD i m 20yrs old nd m too poor to hire a lawyer
 
@rightfold Well, it compiles, at least.
 
You're blessed. The rich pay their lawyers.
The poor grow a brain. (Some even check comments at their friggin' questions. After years of practice)
 
8:43 PM
I was thinking, with all these legal questions, there should be a site for them. Then I found this.
 
@AnkitSrivastava Hey, I'm Raghav Sood :)
 
Oblivvvious
 
lool
@sehe thanx
 
vOv
 
tanks?
 
8:45 PM
@Jefffrey get any further on snake while I was arguing about tips?
 
@Jefffrey was that supposed to be funny?
 
The snake's tip moves first
@AnkitSrivastava Do you really want to know? It's not gonna help you find free images, I'll tell you
 
user1804599
ARgh.
 
user1804599
Fucking operator->.
 
user1804599
Implementing iterators is a pain.
 
8:46 PM
@Pawnguy7 Nope, I just found out I might have colon's tumor and that I have to wait until 4th of december to find out, so... the snake is probably the last of my problems right now :)
 
Ow. That's not nice.
(can't help but notice the similarity between snakes and spines)
 
user1804599
Wait.
 
I know. Most of the people who have that, dies, so.
 
thank god I'm a bot.
 
@ScottW not at 21 yo though :P
 
user1804599
8:48 PM
What happens if I don’t return a pointer from operator->?
 
@Jefffrey Really. That's... tense then. You're waiting for test results, or does the test happen on the 4th?
 
@sehe test on the 4th
 
@rightfold You don't get language magic.
 
user1804599
What if I return decltype(*this)?
 
@Jefffrey Results on the same day? Or how long to wait?
@melak47 Consider posting this where it belongs? android.stackexchange.com/questions/57777/…
 
8:50 PM
@rightfold and it doesn't make much sense since a->b is equivalent to a->operator ->()->b when operator-> is overloaded, ie. if operator-> doesn't return a pointer it.. will be somewhat wrong
 
@sehe >_>
 
@melak47 even last fm said that it was free,but when i tried contacting them ,they said yeah its free to use by yourslef and not sell it
 
@sehe why are you @ing me?
 
@rightfold but you don't need to return a pointer, you can hack yourself around it..
 
@melak47 see edit, in case you didn't remember where it belonged
 
8:51 PM
@sehe I have a proctologic visit, therefore I think I'll know more right then. There are not feces or blood tests booked yet.
 
user1804599
What if operator-> could take a member pointer?
 
@Jefffrey Well. Try to hang in there. Anyone else closer by to support you?
 
user1804599
Would it be more flexible?
 
@sehe Oh, yeah. My family is here, don't worry. Thanks for worrying, though :)
 
Good. Stress is bad for your health :)
(I decided to keep on joking for your benefit :/)
 
8:53 PM
Yeah, I know.
 
@rightfold coliru.stacked-crooked.com/a/53b7021a8ec7acb5 here we are not returning a pointer from operator-> in B, but as you can see we only need to return a pointer eventually since ->func eventually will be applied.
 
user1804599
Hmm, I see.
 
I suppose it returns pointers. Smart pointers, maybe.
 
user1804599
@sehe Yeah, that could work.
 
and just to make things perfectly clear; No, operator-> doesn't need to return a pointer.. but a pointer needs to be yield eventually otherwise the implicit ->m that is being thrown in at a later time will fail (in some_type->m, which is equivalent to some_type.operator->()->m)
 
user1804599
8:54 PM
I could return std::unique_ptr. :v
 
user1804599
Thanks!
 
Yay!
 
not sure if I was included in that "Thanks!" but I will reply with a...
@rightfold you're welcome.
 
user1804599
@refp Yup.
 

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