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10:00 PM
I need to talk to my engineers to go easy on the not + xor gates.
 
morning
 
@DeadMG How was your trip to Japan?
 
wot?
I assure youthat I have never, ever been to Japan
 
Oh, It is 7 am in Japan so I just assumed :)
 
I only wake up at 12-2pm anyway
 
10:09 PM
I seemed to recall you being from that continent, thats why had to go to Japan for a humorous (debatable) remark.
 
@DeadMG Still a student, eh?
 
@EtiennedeMartel Until I finally accumulate the balls to quit :P
 
@DeadMG Really? Just send the potential employer your SO summary and (Joel) they will hire you =)
 
Hi guys!
 
lol
 
10:14 PM
@CaptainGiraffe Wait, you send your SO summary and Joel?
 
@user1131997 Welcome to GOLDRUNNER!
 
Okay, sure, let's kidnap Joel.
Shouldn't be that hard.
 
@EtiennedeMartel Has more than one time stated it is a good argument for employment. I would agree.
 
If my Linux can't see in dmesg info about wireless driver ( wlan0 ), what shall I do?

lspci | grep Wireless

I'm getting info about driver

But in dmesg, there is no info, using command: dmesg | grep Atheros
 
@user1131997 AskUbuntu and check ethtools, ifconfig might help.
 
10:17 PM
iwconfig
it's wireless
 
@user1131997 nothing there?
 
dmesh must return info, what could it be, if in dmesh there is no info about driver?
*dmesg
dmesg tells infro from kernel and etc...
 
What kind of wireless usb? lsusb.
 
wlan0
wi fi
 
built in card on Motherboard? if so it should be in dmesg, or a bug report should be appropriate.
 
10:21 PM
PCI Express Adapter from Atheros
 
Disable it in bios, boot. copy dmesg to file | diff to dmesg with it enabled, that should reveal enough.
 
AR242x
don't know is it built or not :(((
 
That should be enough for google or the Ubuntu guys.
 
:2651093
 
Ell
naww
 
10:22 PM
@user1131997 lspci might be of use.
@DzekTrek YES THAT IS DOG!
 
@CaptainGiraffe I have used
lspci | grep Wireless
from lspci it return info
but not from dmesg (((
@DzekTrek Darova brat! :)
 
This is not the proper place for troubleshooting wireless linux stuff. and stop with the grep!
 
Why for killing processes in Linux used -9 option? :) Who does know? :) Why nine and what does it mean?
 
Zdarova, brat! :) Kak ti segodnya? @user1131997
 
@user1131997 Look at the constants for killing processes. Its a simple google. it is a bit pattern signal to a process.
 
Ell
10:26 PM
@user1131997 I think it means kill as opposed to sleep or something o.O
 
@user1131997 kill is the program that sends signals. -9 specifies that the signal SIGKILL (on those systems where 9 is SIGKILL) is sent.
 
@DzekTrek figovo :( wi fi na Ubuntu ne mogu postavitj :(((
 
Zachem takoe, brat?
 
@user1131997 Here you have a comprehensive list of all the signals (wikipedia probably does it better) linux.die.net/man/7/signal
 
Ti sprosil zdes kak mozno sdelat eto?
 
10:29 PM
@DzekTrek Please english.
 
@CaptainGiraffe Just for you. ;)
 
Thanks.
 
@CaptainGiraffe where do you come from?
 
About 2000 km north and about 3000 km west of you. Roughly
 
... Trinidad and Tobago?
 
10:33 PM
@DzekTrek narod ne znaet :)
 
1000 west, my geography is not what it used to be.
 
I know man we spoke on Skype, you are from Chicago
Listen, I need you to find me 5 web programmers in css, could you do it?
@user1131997 Druzya, did you ask it on SO?
 
@DzekTrek nope
 
@user1131997 Ask there, 'cause to be honest I am not familiar with that case too, but you can always check the google. :)
Nation without good leadership is doomed to fail in providing it's citizens with full benefits of the modern time. ( me )
Druzya, posmotri sdez, habrahabr.ru/blogs/linux/89420 @user1131997
 
@DzekTrek I very much prefer my elected officials with working brains trying to do the best to give me full benefits.
 
10:41 PM
@CaptainGiraffe I'm glad you think it like that. :)
 
@DzekTrek now, now, now, please guess where I'm from !!!!!!!!one!1?!!!
Crap I'm so lucky
 
ARGH
 
:P :)
 
Windows headers Y U SO CRAPPY
 
use file(3) command in your favourite shell.
 
10:44 PM
Did anyone hear/talk/see /about/to/ Litb?
He is off for more than 2 days...
 
@DeadMG Do you actually have to deal with windows.h headers?
 
if I want to use the Windows API, then yes
 
@DeadMG My condoleances.
 
thanks
 
MFC was a step up, but I still have nightmares about MFC.
well ok sideways
 
10:47 PM
instead, I've decided to take the P/Invoke-style option and just re-declare the functions I need myself
 
@DeadMG What functions are those you're asking for?
 
atm just some of the simpler ones, like CreateWindowEx andsuch
 
what the, why does opening the audio preferences of "Microsoft Lync" max out my speaker volume?
 
hehe
@DeadMG My headache with CreateWindowEx was always the creation of the Window classes before the call to CWEx.
@MooingDuck feature, not a bug.
 
never had a problem with that myself
 
10:52 PM
@DeadMG good for you. They might have improved, my nightmares have haunted me since 1998.
 
@MooingDuck Hi there. :)
 
eh
the main problem I have is just that the Win API is so damn boring and it's a fucking mess
DirectX is not exactly the greatest thing ever, but at least it does interesting things which tax my higher functions
 
@DeadMG This is why I prefer .NET
 
hahahahahaha
 
It's just easier to create pretty things
 
10:54 PM
yeah, because .NET is so much better
 
For interfaces
 
you get such a nice, clean API, you can't do anything of interest with it
all you can do is say "Yes, sir, I'd like to lick the CLR's boots now sir. What's that, Microsoft forgot to pre-provide the boot licking module? Well, dang, I guess I'm gonna have to go home now."
 
@DeadMG I don't get your point
 
my point is that .NET is not better in any way
the only advantage .NET has over C++ is that Microsoft pre-wrote a few wrappers for you
and if those wrappers happen to be not exactly what you need, then you are just as fucked
if not much more fucked
if I wanted to write this kind of thing in .NET, I'd face the exact same thing, bullcrapping around with the Windows API
 
What are you writing?
 
10:57 PM
gonna whip up my own Tetris clone for now
 
So you don't think that it would be easier to write in .NET
OK it might run slower and it would require a user to install the framework if they hadn't already; but I still stand by the fact that it's easier to write in
 
not exactly
Microsoft don't exactly provide UI libraries that play nice with DirectX
which, in my opinion, is ineffably stupid
in addition, their libraries take away virtually every scrap of control over the inner workings of the program in virtually every way I could possibly imagine
 
@DeadMG Ahh I see, I agree it's stupid, but I was thinking more along the lines of windowed tetris using the System.Drawing namespace
 
that's not even remotely equivalent, realistically
 
@DeadMG So you don't have to write that code and you get the whole thing done quicker
 
11:02 PM
the only .NET existing library which comes close to what I'm looking for would be XNA
 
@KianMayne try doing anything 3d
 
@MooingDuck 3D tetris?
 
but again, loss of control is a pretty big no-no for me
 
I gotta go eat Tacos :D
 
@KianMayne sure
 
11:03 PM
@MooingDuck Why? :L
 
@KianMayne irrelevant
 
@KianMayne Why not?
damn
don't I have any of my old code around?
sure I've already written this once
 
Come on can I get some upvotes stars here: (@MooingDuck, @mootinator)
in Discussion between user1079641 and simchona, 1 min ago, by sehe
On the bright side, you have your first hands-on experience on how not to manage programmers, in case the programming doesn't work out for you (sic)
I think I deserve it :)
 
it's three dashes for strike-through
bitch :P
 
@DeadMG Thanks for the heads up
@DeadMG jerk _P
 
11:07 PM
sir yes sir!
 
@sehe for rooms with a purpose like that one, I tend to star useful and relevant messages to accomplishing the purpose, not observations of the OP's quality of instructions
 
@MooingDuck admirable restraint. I thought I derved a start for whit. Really
 
@sehe I thought about it
 
a start?
a start doing what?
AARGH
 
11:11 PM
A start for staring at stars
 
fuck you static member declarations and definitions
you are the most annoying shit
 
is Microsoft Lync the only IM program that cannot show previous IMs when you open a conversation with a contact? I know of no other that can't do that.
 
@DeadMG Hi have you met people.
 
@CaptainGiraffe Unfortunately, yes.
@MooingDuck Most people would throw a whoopee if they thought that their chat program was saving their chats
 
@DeadMG Again my condoleances.
 
11:13 PM
trust me, I've noticed
 
@DeadMG for most it's an option you have to enable. But Lync has no such option. I habitually close windows I'm not interacting with, so when people respond, I can't figure out what they're replying to.
 
11:32 PM
@MooingDuck I do the same, which is why I got pissed when Microsoft gave recommendations to programmers to not minimise background apps to the tray and just leave them in the taskbar to clog it up (á la OSX) difference being between windows and mac is that mac's dock has a shed load of stuff that stays there forever
 
Lots of apps sit in the menu bar in OS X, which is akin to the tray in Windows - so it's not even really "á la OSX". It's just bad design.
 
@monokrome I didn't know that, seeing as I've barely used OS; but I was referring to sitting in the dock
 
The dock is more like pinned programs in Windows with the addition that it shows which ones are running or not.
 
@monokrome The Windows 7 taskbar does show which are running and which are not.
 
@DeadMG No, it just shows which programs have a window.
It shows which windows are open, not which programs are running.
 
11:39 PM
on Windows, that's (mostly) the same thing
there's already the system tray for non-windowed
 
Yep, but vaguely different :)
Mac has the menu bar for that
 
meh
Mac has a high enough price tag, it better have at least equivalent features
 
I wouldn't buy Apple products
Because I know I could get an equally powerful, more compatible system for much much cheaper
 
yeah
they're so expensive
 
Also I'd much rather have an Android phone than an iPhone
 
11:45 PM
my brother sold me an iPhone on the rather cheap, so I have one
but I wouldn't have paid for one
 
If you want to write programs for iOS, do you have to pay the $99 or is there a way around that?
 
no idea, but I'm sure as hell not planning on paying $99 unless I'm srsly desperate
 
Apple products aren't that much more expensive than comparable alternatives.
@Kian
Oops, sorry. Thought enter would choose your name from the dropdown.
 
@DeadMG Well you have the choice between $99 and Objective-C or £0 and Java ;)
 
lol
 
11:50 PM
@monokrome I'll see
 
you can write iOS applications in C++
 
@KianMayne You have to pay the $99 or make the app a web-based application. Both options are pretty poor options.
 
@monokrome They really, really are.
the last time I checked, the "Apple tax" was rather massive.
 
@monokrome Ahh I see
 
@KianMayne If you have a Mac - you can make apps without the $99, but only get to use the iOS emulator on your computer. You can't deploy to app store without paying it, and you can't test on a real device.
 
11:51 PM
@monokrome That sucks lots.
 
oh yeah
 
Yep.
 
and then there's the "Apple can destroy your application at any time"
 
Meh. That's not a big issue unless you're making iOS-only apps. It's better to just use a framework to deploy to iOS, Android, etc. with the same codebase.
 
Why do they put Xeon processors in Mac Pros?
 
11:53 PM
you mean, "unless iOS only apps are a significant source of income for you"
 
Don't put all your eggs in one basket, Google could just as easily remove your app :)
 
What does Xeon do better than i7s?
 
Xeon is a pure 64-bit architecture
 
@monokrome They are much less holier-than-thou about it
 
It's not 32-bit with 64-bit extensions
@DeadMG Yeah, but they can still do it.
 
11:54 PM
sure, they can
but Apple does
and Apple dictates the business model of all apps, etc
 
There are about a billion different Xeon models. Xeon only refers to the server version of whatever generation desktop version was current at the time.
 
At the scale of how many apps actually exist on app store (a lot more than on Android) I've never seen any proof that they do it at a higher percentage...
 
probably because they're utterly incommunicado about practically every aspect of such operation?
 
So no, not all Xeons are 64-bit. And Xeon isn't always/never better than i7s.
 
@DeadMG Who cares? Either way, you take a risk. So just take both risks instead of putting all your eggs in one basket.
@Mysticial They make 32bit Xeons now?...
 
11:56 PM
who cares is that I'd bet much more on Google to, say, admit they made a mistake in relatively short order and fix the problem
 
I've never really done smart phone development (I only a phone that's only useful as an alarm clock) but do you have to get an app approved if you want it in the Android market?
 
@monokrome No, the first generation of Xeons were 32-bit. They were merely rebranded Pentium IIs.
 
@DeadMG It's only a mistake in matter of opinion, and it's a debate that never gets anywhere. Not really worth the discussion.
 
Right now, the latest Xeons are merely rebranded Sandy Bridge i7s.
 
that's because there's no debate with Apple
they just swoop in, fuck you over and swoop out
 
11:58 PM
So the word "Xeon" means nothing other than it's an Intel server processor.
 
@Mysticial Right. In modern times, the difference is that they are pure 64, not 32 with 64 extensions. They are also more robustly tested.
 
if you even allege e.g. copyright infringement, there's no burden of proof, they just yank your app because they feel like it
 
@DeadMG Who cares? They have the right. It's their marketplace.
 
OK The best Mac Pros cost $5000. I'm going to do some hunting to match the spec for a non-Apple product
 
I care, because it's my (hypothetical) app which I (hypothetically) put money into developing and publishing and supporting and my (hypothetical) income which has just been buttfucked
 
11:59 PM
@KianMayne Maybe you should use something that is more comparable like the mac mini.
@DeadMG Then (hypothetically) don't put all your eggs in one basket. Wasn't that what I originally said? :)
 
@monokrome I wouldn't say more robustly test. But rather, they are "binned" with larger safety margins than desktop models.
 

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