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7:05 AM
@johnathon: Really ? How does it handle the encoding when converting from one to the other ?
 
@ereOn i was wrong, going from char to wchar_t does not seem to be supported
@ereOn however the wchar_convert is in <local>
@ereOn and , i correct myself again codecvt<wchar_t,char,mbstate_t> converts between the native character sets
for narrow and wide characters. from the stadandard
 
The one thing missing is going from one of the native character set encoding to (or from) Unicode.
 
@er0n 22.4.1.4.1 and 22.3.3.2.2
@LucDanton no, codecvt handles that, it's implimentation defined but it's there
 
@johnathon There's no specialization for it.
 
@LucDanton i thought it was too, but in looking at it, the wording defiantly suggests it goes from char to wchar_t , and back
@LucDanton what do you mean no specialization for it? as in a particular code page of the unicode set?
 
7:16 AM
Wut?
There's no such thing as Unicode code pages, right?
 
@RMartinhoFernandes yes, there is.
 
@johnathon Specialization of std::codecvt. Much like there's the one specialization for char and wchar_t that converts to and from the two native set encodings.
 
I thought the whole point of Unicode was not having to deal with code pages.
 
@LucDanton true, you have to know what your converting from/to
 
7:18 AM
Just so we're clear: wchar_t is not Unicode.
 
can anybody tell how to open mac terminal from asp.net website
 
@RMartinhoFernandes no, the point of unicode was so that we could represent all the different character sets of the worlds languages
 
And then you can know all you want that wchar_t is so-and-so encoding at the time the program is running but if it's not Unicode then you're screwed.
 
@NajeebullahShah I can tell you how to read the name of this room.
2
 
@RMartinhoFernandes and no, wchar_t is not unicode
 
7:19 AM
So what the heck are you talking about?
 
@LucDanton i wonder if there is a way in the standard to determine the type, utf-8 an so forth
 
What's a Unicode code page then? Can you link to me docs?
 
np
@RMartinhoFernandes "@NajeebullahShah I can tell you how to read the name of this room." LMAO
 
7:25 AM
@NajeebullahShah: Coming into the C++ chat room and asking about asp.NET is like entering a nursery and asking for a blowjob.
2
 
@NajeebullahShah Coming into the C++ chat room and asking about asp.NET is like asking about gay marriage in a catholic chat room
 
@johnathon: Not quite, because it would be on-topic then.
 
@ereOn the response would be about the same though :))
 
@ereOn Sadly that article seems to mention code pages only in passing and only in the introduction. (Despite the prominent mention in the title and the URL)
 
@RMartinhoFernandes what system are you running , posix, bsd, or windows?
 
7:28 AM
@RMartinhoFernandes: Wrong recipient for this message ?
 
Dammit.
That's the third time today that happens.
@ereOn Yeah, sorry about that.
 
No problem ;) (at least for me)
 
@johnathon Windows.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes and what language do you have your system set to use?
@RMartinhoFernandes better yet, open up character map
 
I always have charmap open.
 
7:30 AM
morning all
 
@NajeebullahShah Coming into the C++ chat room and asking about asp.NET is like asking Britney Spears if she's a virgin on your wedding night. Sorry, am I too late to contribute?
 
@RMartinhoFernandes and have a play around with it. Unicode has different code pages, ranges that it uses for displaying the characters, and 0x00ff means one character on one set, and something tottaly different on another
 
Can you name two of these code pages?
I see a list of fonts, and a list of character sets.
 
@johnathon: Unicode and codepages ?! Aren't you confusing things ?
 
No mention of code pages in the UI.
 
7:31 AM
@RMartinhoFernandes i can name the flaggs that the windows api uses to convert from one to the other
 
@thecoshman: Morning.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/desktop/… for more information
 
So a code page is just a character encoding?
 
and different pages represent different character encoding,
which is HIGHLY important if your dealing with the worlds various languages
take even the variance between the US characters, and the British ones
 
@johnathon If I've learned anything about encodings, it's that it's better not to try to figure it out yourself
Even the initial bytes for UTF-8 encoding differ according to if its big-endian or little-endian for instance
 
7:37 AM
@Neil yea, better yet, try to explain it to folks that don't use it on a regular basis
 
@Neil: Isn't that for UTF-16 ?
 
So, exactly what conversions did you say the standard supports?
 
@ereOn Ipso facto.
 
first world problems over here. Can't get my arm rests to be equal height
 
@Neil: I mean, UTF-8 is byte based, how can endianness matter ? For UTF-16 I see, but for UTF-8 ?
 
7:38 AM
UTF-8 is has only one endianness.
 
@ereOn Ugh, now you're making me wiki it, but I thought I remembered something like that.
I could have easily confused it with UTF-16 though.
 
@Neil: I think so, yes.
 
This encoding thing is madness.
I wish we could keep UTF-8 and drop everything else.
 
I had understood that UTF-8 was just the typical ASCII table if you're using western character set, which is why everyone tends to favor it in America
though it can have multiple bytes, so how does it manage endianness in those cases?
 
7:41 AM
@Neil: I'm in Europe and I would favor it too.
 
@Neil The bytes must be in the order specified.
 
@ereOn think about this for a second.. if you would.. Every string data i get over a socket for a particular protocol that i have to implement HAS to be converted from it's ascii data to VARIOUS different encoding for the end users language ... joy joy to me :|
 
@johnathon: Sure joy indeed.
@Neil: You consider bytes in order. You read the first one then, and only then, you can know what the next means.
 
@Neil More obvious: each UTF-8 code unit is one byte. There's no issue with endianness with a single byte.
 
@ereOn Yes, but endianness is irrelevant if you're dealing with 1 byte.
 
7:43 AM
@Neil to get it the whole byte order thing, consult a reference on socket api, particularly htonl, htons, ntohl, and ntohs
 
If you're dealing with multiple bytes to allow characters beyond ascii table, order becomes very relevant
 
@Neil: My point exactly.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes Enlighten me.
 
In UTF-8 you always deal with one byte at a time.
 
7:45 AM
Some Thailand specific characters can take up to 6 bytes. The first one indicate that the second indicates that the third indicates that... the last is ค
 
Basically character encoding has become the new x86 ISA. Variable-length characters littered with escape codes and such...
 
It is in a way similar to the different OSI level protocol stack : One byte in the Ethernet stack indicates that the next is IP, then one byte in IP indicates the next stack is UDP
Except instead of stacks you just have bytes.
 
and it gets worse than that
as mystical pointed out, escape characters
it dosent matter if it's a single byte character set, the endianess MATTERS
 
UTF-8 is hell but it's heaven compared to other formats
 
@johnathon: That's what I just explained: either a character is an escape character, or a meaningfull (last) character of the sequence.
 
7:48 AM
So special byte indicators which suggest that it doesn't really want to read that byte but that and several bytes which follow in order to make up a character
Did I understand correctly?
 
@Neil: Exactly.
 
@ni
shit
yea
it's all joy joy :| for real.
 
@ereOn This changes nothing! I'm never making a text editor! Never you hear me!?
 
@Neil lmfao
 
@Neil: Haha.
This is my last day at my current job.
I have nothing to do, everybody is working his ass out.
And can do whatever I want.
Feels good.
 
7:50 AM
@ereOn what do you do?
@ereOn better question is what are you going to do?
 
@johnathon: I'm currently working for a big banking company. I changed for a smaller one (around 50 people)
And a one that does not do banking.
 
@err
damnit
 
Those companies have a lot of money, but never use it for the IT department.
@johnathon: You know you can edit your messages after you posted them :)
 
Banking company that doesn't do banking? That's got to be an interesting job.
 
@ereOn i have some deep condolences for you , you've worked in the banking industry ... i know your pain
 
7:52 AM
@Neil: Yeah, my sentence was ambiguous. I'm changing for a company that is not a bank.
 
@ereOn yes, i do, however , on a laptop, touch pad.. and no touch screen..
 
@ereOn Naw, I know what you meant. I'm an asshole like that.
 
@Neil: Ok then I hope you will have to work in a banking company too ! I'm an asshole too !
 
@ereOn and, to wit, i disable the touch pad because it has a tendency to pick my my left palm, and place the cursor outside the box
 
I think the definition of an ideal programming job means working for a company which has a vague idea of what you do, meaning, banking is out.
 
7:55 AM
Neil, the only companies that have a vague idea of what you do are software companies, and even then it's no picknick
 
If you get backed up by 5 managers who want this new software out by Tuesday, and you've only just finished making the skeleton of the program, it's tough work.
 
@Neil at point in time work comes home with you.. usually.
 
I'm changing for a software company. Hurray !
 
@johnathon Oh I know, but it's one tick on a long list of prerequisites for an ideal programming job.
 
I the best thing: I was told I could work on Linux.
And that, actually, half the team already did.
 
7:57 AM
@ereOn That's a blessing, if all your software works on Linux.
@ereOn That said, count your blessings.
 
@Neil: It does.
 
lol
linux, windows, you guys got it nice and easy
imagine working in the constrained environment of embedded
im lucky enough, i deal with the end user side of the software
 
@johnathon Imagine working at Mc Donald's. There is always worse.
:p
 
the folks that implement the the actual automation side.. no thanks
@ereOn there are days that Mc Donald's almost sounds appealing
LOL
 
#include <mcnuggets>
chicken::box<9>;
 
8:00 AM
Embedded software development with constraints isn't bad.
 
exaclty!
 
@johnathon My software company works with an old IBM database mainframe back in the days when you didn't choose the operating system to go with the computer. The only way to access it is by terminal, and to code it requires that you do the equivalent of using SQL to insert lines of assembly code to be run.
 
@classdaknokt depends on what it's trying to run. And on how many different flavors of hardware is mingled into the product design
 
Thank god, I don't have to program these machines, I just have to access it for data.
 
@Neil as400 ?
 
8:01 AM
@johnathon Bingo.
 
@Neil yea... whats that damn scripting language that ibm put out for those? (i have one btw, in the corner :)) )
 
@johnathon let's say they show a 3D graph using OpenGL. The data was downloaded from the Internet. I've done it and it was quite fun.
 
@johnathon It's called RPG, and it haunts me in my worst nightmares.
 
@Neil mine too, so much so my subconscious forcefully made me forget it
@classdaknokt lets say your writing and designing a control module to bind togather about 16 different machines, and throw them over a network to a user interface software that can remote control those said machines
 
@johnathon You were an RPG programmer?
 
8:03 AM
@classdaknokt an each of those machines uses a different interface, one rs232, one usb, ect
@Neil No, i was an RPG fuck up fixer.. do not get the two confused
 
@johnathon why would you use a computer with constraints for that?
 
@RMartinhoFernandes Hey man
 
@classdaknokt its industrial automation, the platforms have to survive in intense conditions , when i say embedded most people think consumer, im taking molding macines to augergs to what ever, from PLC, PLS , to real embedded, running embedded os's to bind it all togaher and going to ethernet for netowork
@classdaknokt well not so much ME, i just work on the app that talks to the damn thing
 
@johnathon I think that's all programming in RPG means. The first person writes the program, and the next 20 years of touch ups and rewritings are about kicking it until it does something vaguely reminiscent of what it should
 
@Neil LMAO pretty much
 
8:08 AM
Now I'm obliged to ask: Can you even write C++ on these constrained machines ?
 
@Neil and the worst part is within that 20 year time frame theres been 15 others before you
@ereOn yes. it's embedded c++
 
@johnathon: What is the difference ?
 
@johnathon Figure that our company was founded offering services for this platform, so we still use it heavily. I touch up a program which uses that database to perform a quality monitoring service for production lines.
 
@ereOn go look up how to use c++ in kernel mode
@Neil you poor soul
 
@johnathon Do you use indicators too? We have indicator 99 which is *ON if there's some sort of error...
 
8:10 AM
@Neil sighs i did. i no longer touch that shit.. and im a much happier individual for not doing so. Point in case, do you know how many different dialects of RPG there is?
 
Along with indicators 1 through 98 which have various meanings depending upon which program is being run and when.. easy to understand, right?
 
@Neil 0oh yea. Kinda reminds you of the old dos days with system interrupts
 
@johnathon I'm thankfully ignorant of this. Lots of dialects?
 
@Neil yea, for every major os version ibm put out on those things it had a different version of RPG for it
@Neil and if you think ms compilers are bad about throwing in shit thats off the wall and proprietary, ibm within their own language did so heavily
 
@johnathon And oh, I got the best end of the bargain. Wait 'til you hear this. Our company wanted to leave RPG behind once and for all, right? So Java was proposed.
 
8:12 AM
=))
 
Well, there were too many programs to simply drop, so a converter was found...
 
im seriousy laughing my ass off
please continue
this is funny already
 
@johnathon So that's what I have to deal with on a daily basis. Not even RPG but converted rpg, which I can only guess what it really meant in RPG, which has since been modified to be used in a web application.
 
@Neil know java much?
 
A web application of all things.. It'd be like proposing to use QBASIC code to support Silverlight or something
 
8:15 AM
@Neil dude when you said java, i KNEW it'd be a web interface
@Neil hence me bursting with laghter over here, seriously
 
@johnathon Yeah, I know Java well. I try not to look at the code whenever possible. It's so complicated that I just treat it like a black box and be done with it.
 
@Neil your doing better than me bud, i know enough java to say i hate it, with a blazing passion.
@Neil ya know to wit, i had a college hound the shit out of me recently to come take their cs classes
@Neil and i asked what language they used
@Neil java
 
@johnathon Heh, at least it's not RPG.
 
@Neil lol. I'm in a similar position with my job. The code works, some how, but we still need to update it, so any changes are done trying to change as little as possible. It's like we are replacing the mines in the middle of a live minefield
 
@Neil yea, well i completely fail to understand how a college is going to teach computer science in a language that fails to represent the machine properly.
@Neil to wit, it'd be about like trying to use QBASIC to support silverlight
 
8:19 AM
@thecoshman Funny you should say that. I was telling my colleague the other day that if I had been writing software used in a nuclear plant, I think I would refuse to deal with this level of complexity.
 
@johnathon what? that's silly logic. One of the core idea's of CS is that we abstract away more complex ideas so that we can work in a simpler and/or more intuitive way
@Neil KISS: Keep It Simple, Stupid
 
@johnathon I would propose a better example, but that would be using RPG to support a web application.
 
@thecoshman ok, then explain to me , what the this pointer in java is
 
@thecoshman The university doesn't teach you how to deal with already complex code. It starts off with the assumption that you're writing the code to begin with.
 
@Neil i bet that java code has a funny resemblance to some type of Fourier transformation code than it does to database access
 
8:22 AM
@johnathon that's half my point. Java abstracts the notion of pointers away. It is an easier language to get things done in, at the cost of things not being done that well
 
In theory, before you could even consider simplifying the code, you must first understand it in its entirety. That alone has sent men stark raving mad and has been many a casualty to programmers, poor souls.
 
@thecoshman well thats my point, how is someone going to grasp the concept of whats being done if the machine model is abstracted away completely
 
@Neil oh yeah, if I was going to do interview questions, I would definitely have the candidate work on a small section of really bad code and ask them to add something to it. See how well they can cope with the shit they will have deal with on the job
 
@johnathon We do it everytime we write code. It's never assembly, so we never know exactly what the CPU does.
 
@thecoshman: And what if the interviewee says he wants to rewrite it all ?
What would you think then ?
 
8:24 AM
@ereOn What he said.
 
@johnathon you do not need to understand the internal mechanics of using a petrol engine vs a diesel engine. They both provide the same interface to you
 
@Neil no, but at least when we write code , we have a more concrete idea of what the machine is, and we can shure as hell easily understand what the this pointer is.. ion java it has different contexts depending on how it's used.. and that's just bad
@thecoshman actually they dont.. but this is neither the time nor the room for me to go into detail as to how they dont
 
@ereOn he's working to a dead line, if he can re-write it with in the time, and it still works then fair play to him. I would be more paying attention to how they do what ever they do. If they argued it well, I wouldn't be opposed to them saying the changes cannot be done
@johnathon you know what I am getting at though :P
 
@thecoshman and you know what im getting at, there is a point in abstraction when it's bad for trying to understand the details of some of the aspects surrounding computer science, and even you cant sit there and tell me that it's not, and you still havent told me exactly what the this pointer is in java :P
 
@thecoshman I consider myself pretty decent at remodeling bad code. I think the trick is knowing how to model the code in such a way that you guarantee it would work the same as before. This way you don't even have to understand it entirely.
@johnathon I've programmed in C++ that I cannot forget what a pointer is, nor can I forget how it comes into play in Java, even if it's better hidden.
@johnathon Though maybe that gives me an edge over other Java programmers, I don't know. Maybe it's a disadvantage even.
 
8:30 AM
@Neil and that, is what allows me to write some java
@ScottW that sir is where you are sadly mistaken
@ScottW it's just hidden from you
 
@johnathon oh yeah, to much abstract (like anything) is a bad thing. I just think it is silly to write of a uni just because they use Java. It's a forgiving language that makes it easy to teach concepts in. A pointers are not in java, at least not like C++ knows them. It has references
 
@johnathon: Java's implementation uses pointers. It does not have them.
 
@ereOn @ScottW thats my point exactly.
 
@Neil oh christ, I couldn't dare try to understand all of the code the I have to deal with. I just look at what I need to to make the corrections/updates
 
@ScottW There are two perspectives here. There's implementation and then there's abstraction. You're talking about abstraction, while we're talking about implementation. Believe me, there are pointers no matter other name they're given. A rose by any name would smell just as sweet.
 
8:32 AM
@johnathon: I'm afraid Scott W. is right when he says Java doesn't have pointers. Hidden or not, the user should not care.
 
@ereOn This is my sentiment as well
 
@ereOn ok, then YOU tell me what the this pointer is in java
 
@johnathon it's a reference
 
@thecoshman It's a curse maybe, but it lets me say to myself, "Damn, look at that huge method.. Time to split that into two methods and a third that gets called from within the other."
 
@thecoshman to what?
 
8:33 AM
@johnathon: The current class instance.
 
@johnathon ¬_¬ to 'this' object
any way, coffee time :D
 
@ereOn @thecoshman the this pointer is avialable outside the class instance
so i ask again
what is the this pointer in java
:-"
 
@thecoshman Don't drop your coffee cup or it'll get picked up by the garbage collector.
 
@Neil LMFAO
 
@johnathon citation needed
 
8:35 AM
@thecoshman no, this is the c++ room, i feel free to openly say java is gay.
 
@johnathon do you mean that you can pass 'this' to other functions/classes
 
@johnathon: There is no this pointer in Java. There a this reference though.
 
@thecoshman thats just my point , the this pointer isen't always "this"
 
@johnathon oh you can pick on it's flaw all you want; you just can't go making up shit (which unless you can show me an example of what you are on about, is all I consider what you are saying)
 
Pop quiz, guys. What exactly do you think a reference is anyway? In C++ a reference is just a pointer which cannot be NULL. So if a reference is a type of pointer, then what you're calling a reference in Java is a pointer as well, by definition.
 
8:37 AM
@thecoshman see, you fail, syntaticaly the this pointer in java refers to where ever the hell it's at, but a this from class foo, dosent mean it's a this in class bar
 
Or are we talking about a "reference" that I'm not familiar with?
 
@johnathon firstly, stop calling it a pointer, Java does not provide the concept of pointers to the programmer. Secondly, it is a keyword to a 'magical' value that is always set for you
 
@Neil: I guess we are all well aware of what the differences between pointers and references are. It's not like we just graduated.
 
@thecoshman and sir, THAT right there, is where you fail to persuade me that java is a good langauge to use to teach computer science
@thecoshman a "magical" value
@thw
 
@Neil: However, there are two different terms which apply to two different things.
Surely, those are close, but nevertheless different.
 
8:39 AM
@johnathon but when I pass 'this' to a function, that function will capture the 'pointer' a and the object it 'points' to stored via a new variable. If you are using a static function 'this' has no meaning
 
@ereOn How do you define a reference then?
 
I can throw this example right back at C++, what is 'this' in C++
 
lol
that one is very simple
it's the pointer to the class instance passed into what ever memeber function called as the first paramater to the function
which is hidden from the programmer by teh scope operaation on the function decleration
the compiler puts it there
 
@Neil: A reference is a letter from a previous employer testifying to someone's ability or reliability.
 
Go look up C object orientation for a clear example
 
8:41 AM
@johnathon Magically? ^_^
 
or flattening a c++ class out to a c api
nope, not magically
 
@johnathon so let's just swap 'pointer' for 'reference' and oh my sweet fucking god, we are talking about Java's 'this'
 
and it ALWYAS points to the instance of where it is at.
 
@ManofOneWay hey, what's up?
 
@ereOn Those won't help you at all trying to access a class. It'd just tell you how well you did at your previous job and throw a "CantProgramException"
 
8:42 AM
the point is the this pointer in java is not determanistic
 
@thecoshman Java calls them pointers, you know.
 
:-"
 
Because they point.
 
@Neil: You can't get a joke, can you ?
 
If anything, it's C and C++ that got the wrong names.
 
8:43 AM
@ereOn I got it. Just being witty. -_^
 
@Neil: Don't let the fact that you are mistaken affect your ability to debate without insulting my programming skills ;)
 
@johnathon you do know, that even in java, if you pass this into foo.slapThat(object that) with in the function slapThat 'this' is the foo object, and 'that' is the object you passed in, what ever it is
 
:-" and hold a pointer to the that object in foo
or better yet, cast that that object to a lesser that
 
@RMartinhoFernandes Writing a paper.. I'm trying to figure out how to force a \verb|code| to adjust so that it won't go outside the margin. Any idea how to do that?
 
@ereOn Nobody is accusing anyone of having inferior programming skills. I simply asked for a definition because it's important to clarify terms.
 
8:45 AM
@ManofOneWay Sorry, that's beyond my skills. I'd try searching on TeX - LaTeX, and asking if not found.
 
@ScottW thats where this all started
 
@Neil: Let's admit the two concepts are the same : if so, I can exchange any reference with a pointer and it will work the exactly the same, right ?
 
@ScottW that's where this discussion started
 
@RMartinhoFernandes Yeah I'll try to find out somehow =) Are you working on any projects at the moment? The torrent-client?
 
@johnathon me neither. It still dose not prevent you learning CS theory. you can still learn about sort algorithms and likes with java
 
8:47 AM
@ereOn You mistake me then. A reference is a type of pointer. I didn't say a reference is a pointer.
 
@ScottW or with this
 
@ManofOneWay I'm working (as in business-working, not hobby-working) on an Android project.
 
@Neil Is like, not is a type.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes Cool :)
 
8:48 AM
It may behave the same in many case, but could be implemented in a very different way.
 
@ScottW Yes.
 
I'm not saying it is the case in any existing implementation, but that it could.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes hurt's doesn't it
 
@ScottW Java is not funny.
 
@thecoshman if cs was all about sort algorithims i'd agree with you, however it's not, and yea, java can be used to show some fairly deep aspects of computer science , but it fails in so many ways of showing a cs student the real concept it's trying to convay
 
8:49 AM
@ereOn I don't follow. I said "type of" not like
 
@johnathon care to give an example?
 
@Neil: Yes, and I said it should rather be "like" than "a type of"
 
@RMartinhoFernandes However, you become very productive in Java.
 
@thecoshman i take it you took your cs courses in java?
 
@ManofOneWay Meh, Java cramps my style. It feels primitive.
 
8:50 AM
@Neil: Anyway this concludes the initial problem : Java has references, references behave like pointers in many ways, but Java, from a user PoV has no pointers.
 
I'm not sure if that helps productivity.
 
@johnathon I did my degree with C++ we had one very shitty 'oop' module that used Java (because apparently you can't do OOP with rectal bleeding)
 
@thecoshman :))
 
@ereOn If you prefer like, then fine. The point is that references behave in all the same ways that references work in C++.
 
@ereOn From a user Prisoner of War?
 
8:51 AM
@Neil: And I never said otherwise.
 
@Neil Not really.
C++ references are not rebindable and not nullable.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes: Haha, good catch. Thanks.
 
Coffee time.
 
@johnathon: I was tought CS with C++ and Java. A crappy C++ lesson/teacher is no better than a crappy Java lesson/teacher.
 
@thecoshman every cs class ive looked at, ive seen the kinda stuff that a java cs class does from helping a friend of mine through his college , it's bullshit, he hit his second round for his associates degree, after taking a few c++ classes mind you, and i had to reteach this guy about pointers, the stack, and inheirance
 
8:53 AM
@ScottW: Yep, well said.
 
And FTR, Java calls them things pointers, not references.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes i know, you know.. but yea
 
@johnathon: Inheritance isn't the first thing I would teach.
It would even be one of the last.
 
@ereOn his classes were picking up where the first one's left off
@ereOn so it was either get him re accustom to it, or watch him fail
 
@johnathon oh god yeah, the inheritance model in Java sucks so badly.
 
8:55 AM
@ereOn to note, he ended up graduating at the top of his class
 
@johnathon But this is the C++ room! Pedantry is king.
 
@ereOn which, point in case, the college that was hounding me , did ONLY java..
@ereOn and i politely told em to fuck off :))
 
Anyway, I don't see why we argue here: we all agree on what matters: "Java is a better language than C++ in all regards."
5
 
room topic changed to Lounge<C++>: Java is a better language than C++ in all regards. [c++] [c++11] [c++-faq]
I hope no one revokes my owner privileges for doing this.
 
%&!$ singletons
 
8:57 AM
@RMartinhoFernandes they are 'reference types', i've not yet seen them called pointers
 
@thecoshman So you have never read the spec.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes pft, no :P
 
:))
 
you're a funny robot :P
 
8:58 AM
now
 
I've always thought of them as pointers though. If the spec called them fangles, I'd still think of them as pointers. It is what I knew first
 
Do not get me or take me wrong
java has it's place
a cs class is just not the place for it
intro to programming ... maby
cs .. NO
 
@jalf Where?
 

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