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3:00 PM
Wait, what?!? I got ​thefourtheye@sopython.com... Yippee.... :-)
I thought that you were checking if your mail account works fine... I just checked the to box now.... Yay :-) Thanks @JonClements :-)
 
user4433485
cool!
 
user4433485
Anything I can do to help with Sopython?
 
We're always looking for help. Don't suppose you know how to work with websocket servers by any chance? :P
 
user4433485
Ugh I am afraid not
 
Bleh I'm getting bogged down in specifics here.
 
user4433485
3:06 PM
Gonna make myself a coffee, can take a little while ^^
 
DSM
SciPy sparse matrices could be more convenient. #realtruth
 
@DSM @Zero @Martijn if you want a sopython forwarding email - speak now or forever hold your peace or something...
 
speaks
 
Kevin doesn't get one?
 
DSM
Ehh, what would I do with one?
 
user4433485
3:08 PM
oh back
 
@DSM show off to your friends!
 
@DSM I'm going to use mine for 419 scams.
 
Also means I can remember it more easily without having to dig through inboxes/trello to find 'em :)
@Zero Just 419? Have some ambition... I expect at least 4 digits worth
 
DSM
Oh, fine. dsm@wherever, then. Do I have to set up forwarding?
 
Nope... I'll just forward stuff to the email I have for you
 
user4433485
3:09 PM
@Ffisegydd do you want me to do anything? I am quite bored since my project has been canceled
 
The IMAP server is so secure, no-one can access it at the moment :)
 
@Katherina all our projects are here. I'm not sure what your experience/level is, but if you think there's anything you can help with them feel free.
 
DSM
@Jon: actually, increase the last digit in the email address you have by one.
 
There's always things like common questions and the wiki that wouldn't mind a look over on sopython.com - if you feel a bit editorial/review-y... if you'd like to contribute in that way
 
I'm tempted to hold an sopython meeting soon. Not a full GM but a mini one for sopython-dev purposes. With me being unemployed undergoing a transitional period I'm gonna be cracking on with some code. Would be good to discuss things and try to hash out some ideas.
 
3:12 PM
@Ffisegydd sounds like a good idea to me
 
I'll speak to @davidism later, see if he wants to discuss sopython-site while we're at it or whether we'd just keep it Nidaba/Kesh.
 
(can also introduce people that aren't familiar with the projects to them)
 
It'll probably be a kind of brainstorming session, where I go stream of consciousness on all these ideas I have but have no clue if they're good or not. People can chip in periodically and say "That's crap", "That's crap", "That's crap", "That's crap", "That's crap", "That...is not a bad idea...", "That's crap", "That's crap", "That's crap".
 
I think the brainstorming idea is crap. There we go! Saved time ;)
 
;_; whyyoudothistome.
 
user4433485
3:14 PM
Salut @XavierCombelle !
 
"why you do this tome" ? :p
 
@Ffisegydd I'm a terrible man. A terrible man that needs to push to the repo...
 
I was waiting for some smartass to say "why you dot his tome"
 
cabbage @Katherina and everybody else
 
@Ffisegydd darn it - I'll settle for a half smart arse then
 
3:16 PM
My first plan is to nail down what data we actually have via the API, then we know what features we can get, then we can work from there. At the same time I'm working on getting Kesh semi-working so we're fresh data into the DB.
 
user4433485
Expected an indented block over and over again
 
@Ffisegydd so we now have kafka and spark on the server?
 
We have Kafak, Spark, and Cassandra!
 
w00t!
 
Cassandra isn't set up "properly" though because it's running from a window in my tmux session, so if we restarted the server it wouldn't boot up again.
Neither would Spark for that matter.
Oh, actually, we don't have Kafka, but it's easy to install.
I only have Kafka on my Mac.
 
3:18 PM
@JonClements Sorry, had a meeting.
@Katherina ^
 
That was why I was asking tristan about server setting up stuff, so we can add the startup scripts to <whatever> so whenever we reboot they get going again.
 
@Ffisegydd guess they don't install anything into init.d then?
 
I don't think so, it might be an option to?
I started them up manually using start_master etc.
 
um... I'll have a look later
 
user4433485
Sometimes I think I would be a much better Alcoholic as a Programmer
 
3:20 PM
Because coding drives you to drink?
 
Hi guys
What's up?
 
@Jon I'll install Kafka now.
 
Also - what are we looking for in a server. I have a couple of old EdUni machines that are low power consumption (low spec too)
 
user4433485
Hi @poke
 
@IntrepidBrit well, I think the current server should suffice for a bit
 
3:21 PM
Hey hey
 
Do anyone know about " Unicode Strings" ?
 
@Katherina Yes, I have found that being a programmer makes me a better alcoholic ;-)
 
user4433485
coding can be frustrating
 
user4433485
specially when you just fix 1 error
 
user4433485
and like 10 other errors shows up
 
3:24 PM
Then you have to change your mindset.
 
@IntrepidBrit yeah... we got 6x2.8ghz cores, 8gb RAM and 192gb SSD for the mo'...
 
I am creating a nightmare of callbacks right now :|
 
user4433485
I know my dear Driver
 
DSM
@The_Diver: I'd say most Python programmers do. Is there something in particular causing problems?
 
Diver *
@DSM What do you mean?
 
3:25 PM
@JonClements Well, that just spanks my machines. I'll keep schtum ;)
 
DSM
@The_Diver: a few minutes ago you asked "Do anyone know about " Unicode Strings" "? That was my response.
 
@IntrepidBrit well - until nidaba is up and doing stuff - a Minecraft server is fairly resource intensive :p
 
Oh, sorry. Thanks for the response.
No. I happen to see the phrase almost everywhere and the problem is that i don't actually know what it means.
 
Do you know what ASCII is?
 
Yes
Kinda.
 
3:27 PM
@The_Diver strangely - just typing "python unicode strings" into google gives as a first link: docs.python.org/2/howto/unicode.html - how about you start there?
 
DSM
[Off-topic: yesterday I was at the 95th percentile in a certain competition. Today I've fallen to 87th. #madness]
 
It's a style of representing characters .
 
@Ffisegydd use supervisor to start those services, since it's already there for sopython-site
 
@davidism cool beans.
 
@JonClements: OH YES! Actually i have seen the link several times but i thought it might be about something else and doesn't explain the definition.
Thanks guys.
 
3:29 PM
Sounds like you're zoomed in. Press Ctrl+0 or use the menu to reduce zoom to 100%. — davidism 2 hours ago
 
Aaaah
Lazy Friday is about to commence
 
user4433485
30 minutes till weekend
 
DSM
No, Lazy Friday can't start until this report is done..
 
Cabbage, all. Been a while ...
 
Bunny chow networking event? Oh alright then
 
3:31 PM
wb @holdenweb - how's life treating you?
 
cbg @holdenweb
 
user4433485
cbg @holdenweb
 
@JonClements pretty well thanks. Just been in the UK looking around the South coast for somewhere to live
 
@holdenweb oh - where abouts?
 
Hey up holdenweb.
 
3:32 PM
Wrong side of the country holden ;)
 
I gotta go guys. See you later.
 
@Ffisegydd hi Fizzy
 
Take care
 
user4433485
Geordie @IntrepidBrit ?
 
3:32 PM
@IntrepidBrit I have my reasons :)
 
@Katherina More North m'dear
 
@Katherina Worse than that ducks and runs
 
user4433485
lolz=D
 
Was looking at the Hasting area. Seems to be a possibility, trains are likely to get better
 
@JonClements Why I outta!
Right. I'm offended, I'm off ;)
(or my RFID code has passed all the tests )
 
3:34 PM
@IntrepidBrit have a great weekend matey
 
@IntrepidBrit the second reason is more believable :) Have a good weekend
 
Cheers, you too. (and that goes for the rest of you merry reprobates)
 
Say what you like about OS X. To get Kafka running I ran 3-4 commands. I'm looking at a 3-4 page out-dated blog post for Ubuntu >_>
 
user4433485
enjoy your weekend mate
 
@holdenweb Hasting's isn't too bad... haven't been there in years though
 
@Ffisegydd so naturally you will be writing new Ubuntu install instructions as you go, right?
 
OP doesn't want to expand their textarea.
@holdenweb You're a traitor to your birthplace ;-P
 
@ZeroPiraeus yeah, I acted too fast there
 
@Zero err... which country are you living in now - remind me? :p
 
coughs, mutters unintelligibly
 
3:39 PM
@ZeroPiraeus sorry, I won't be manipulated that way - Yorkshire has a rich tradition of tolerance, even for the blighted South. Bottom line: my gf (who is also from my home town, go figure) has lived around London for > 30 years and has family and friends around there. I am returning from 20 years in the USA and have few connections oop North. QED. Any more questions?
There was a smiley at the end of that, dunno where it went
 
DSM
Aww, the conversation moved on before I could suggest "Why aren't colourful aglets more popular?"
 
I do occasionally feel out of place with my thick pseudo Welsh-Yorkshire accent.
 
user4433485
Is there a way to get line error logs with Python?
 
user4433485
like unexpected .... on line 21 or something
 
3:40 PM
@ZeroPiraeus sorry, didn't get your answer to @JonClements' question ...
 
looks around in mild panic, decides to change the subject ... So, what about those debates, eh? The trouble with Cameron is, he always tries to walk it in ...
 
Didn't see them, but it sounded like Miliband finally started to come across as a capable human being, and Cameron (who got an easier time from Paxo and co) was something of an arsehole who dodged any difficult answers. Does that sound about right to viewers of said debate?
 
I caught about 10 mins of it
 
user559633
updates customerdata_holdenweb.txt
 
Zero is a citizen of the world :-)
 
3:44 PM
@Katherina not sure what you mean by "line error logs"
 
Bah... for those interested and invited - email jon@sopython.com with the address you want (easiest if you do so from the address you want it forwarded to)
 
I forgot it was happening – would have probably streamed it via [a nameless proxy] otherwise. Reaction seems mixed: polls favour DC, social media EM.
 
user4433485
@holdenweb well, like php errors in browser, "unexpected syntax on line 22" those kind of error logs
 
user559633
invited to what @JonClements?
 
@Katherina not a PHP user. What's the purpose?
 
user4433485
3:46 PM
easy to track the line with the error
 
user4433485
so you know where the problem is
 
user559633
you'll get those in a traceback
 
user559633
>>> fsdafdsfsda
Traceback (most recent call last):
  File "<stdin>", line 1, in <module>
NameError: name 'fsdafdsfsda' is not defined
 
user4433485
hmm okay
 
user4433485
I messed up a simple if else statement, quite ashamed now :p
 
3:49 PM
@Katherina You only ever see one syntax error normally, though they sometimes get transmogrified into ImportError is the module is being imported rather than executed
@Katherina doubt you broke anything beyond repair, so why the shame? I've been programming > 40 years and I still make elementary syntax errors (though there are rumors this is because I'm a crap programmer they aren't true, I tell you!)
 
@Jon Kafka is set up on the server with a kafka user:group etc. Not started any instances of it yet though.
Need to set up the properties files.
 
user4433485
@holdenweb haha I guess it makes us human to make mistakes anyway, I'm new to Python:)
 
Air
must fix... non-alphabetical book... recommendations... uwaaaa
 
@Air go for it, I presume you have editor?
 
Air
Nope
Community posts only
 
3:52 PM
We're disregarding "the" in book titles when sorting, right?
 
Just a sec
 
Air
@Kevin Currently looks that way
 
@Air okay added you to editors list.
Do you solemnly swear to use your powers for nefarious reasons? Do you vow to always put your own skin before that of the common user?
 
Air
@Ffisegydd Sweet. I'm going to go complain about some minor formatting issue on SO and I bet they will make me a moderator.
 
Oh no wait that's the RO vow...
 
Air
3:53 PM
Just like they have nicael...
 
user4433485
what exactly is that cv-pls
 
@Katherina welcome. It's a fine language with a halfway decent community
 
user4433485
@holdenweb Thanks ! I must say, the community is far better as the webdevelopment community
 
No, no, that's salad. sopython.com/salad
 
DSM
3:56 PM
@Kevin: and the OP asked a similar-themed question before. Problem set, maybe?
 
means we're asking that others please look into casting a close vote on something
 
user4433485
ahh I see
 
Air
So many good recommendations on that list already, had to think for a moment to come up with a worthy addition
 
user4433485
3 minutes till weekend
 
DSM
We even have a set of guidelines here for when we should make cv-pls requests.
 
user559633
3:57 PM
tl;dr
 
user4433485
"You must have at least 3,000 reputation to cast a CV."
 
user4433485
I can help you to Close vote in about 20 years
 
DSM
We think long-term 'round here.
 
Air
Wait, clairvoyance costs rep?
 
user4433485
I can imagine @DSM
 
user4433485
4:00 PM
Well lovely pears and peaches, Rhubarb ! Weekend =D
 
It took me about a year to get 10k, mostly because I became horribly cynical way too soon.
 
I don't treat SO as a numbers game, having nothing to prove (though I'll immodestly note that I recently broke 4,000 rep). Which is liberating, I find
 
I'm more interested in privileges than rep.
 
It sounds bad when I say it, but my motivation for getting to 10k was so I could delete stuff.
 
Yeah I aimed for privileges/beating davidism to 10k more than rep.
 
4:04 PM
@Kevin that's fine. I hardly have time to exercise the privileges I already have, and when there's a fine team of peaches & pears such as your good selves I know the topic is in safe hands
 
Now that I have the privilege though, I don't really delete all that much stuff.
 
is just desperately trying to stay ahead of @davidism and @Ffisegydd
 
@Zero to be fair you bountied away a fair bit.
Otherwise you'd be much further ahead
So it's not too bad, just understand that we are coming for you...
 
DSM
I'm a little worried about my ratio. Lots of my recent answers have been 1-2 votes only. :-/
 
There are kinda-sorta selfish motivations for that: I'm not that fussed about rep over 10k, but would like a gold Python badge, and bounties attract attention.
 
4:07 PM
Yeah my next "aim" is Python gold. <200 score now.
 
DSM
There's one privilege I'd like: I'd like to have the choice to swing Mjölnir or simply to dup-vote, so that it's not entirely on me. My dup-voting has actually dropped off since I gained the power.
 
Heh, me too
 
Sorry - was just doing dishes
 
I feel especially weird hammering dupes of "asking for input until getting a valid response" since I'm obviously biased
 
All you have to do is blindly trust what we tell you, so that we can swing the hammer by proxy. :)
 
4:10 PM
I don't think stack overflow likes meteor :\
 
@DSM Yeah, you got serious ratio problems ;-)
 
Put your faith in davidism, he won't steer you wrong...
 
Going AFK for a while
 
rbrb :-)
 
Air
I don't understand why help('modules') complains about gtk in the interpreter.
 
4:14 PM
@Air did you work out the virtualenv thing from yesterday?
 
Air
@davidism I'm still experimenting.
 
It doesn't really matter that the version is old, once the virtualenv is created you just run pip install -U pip setuptools to get the latest tools
 
DSM
@Air: unfortunately the import itself necessary for the introspection isn't necessarily side-effect free. :-/
 
@davidism did you want a david(ism)@sopython.com? Just thinking we might as well have you receive stuff for webmaster@
 
user559633
anyone want an @narcissism.me
 
4:17 PM
help("modules") just hangs on my machine. and sometimes spawns empty Tkinter windows.
 
You can make it, but I'm not sure what I'd use it for.
 
>>> help("modules")

Please wait a moment while I gather a list of all available modules...

4
No handlers could be found for logger "OpenGL.Tk"
Forcing DISTUTILS_USE_SDK=1
 
mostly because then I don't have to remember emails... can just @sopython a name :p
 
Followed by silence until I ctrl-C
 
@Kevin then I imagine a lot more silence? :p
 
4:18 PM
Could it just forward to my gmail account?
 
@davidism that's the idea
 
ok, that's cool, go for it :)
 
I haven't got the auth sorted properly... so it's forwarding only
 
Air
@davidism I was running into this bug with the version that apt had installed
So I couldn't create it to begin with
 
Can't say I like the anthropomorphization of the interpreter when it uses the word "I" there
likewise when the documentation uses first-person pronouns
 
Air
4:20 PM
Not a fan of Siri, I take it?
 
cbg
 
Huh, that's weird. I'm on ubuntu and have no trouble creating py34 venvs
 
No opinion, as I have an Android phone.
 
I remember @thefourtheye mentioning issues with it.
Something about Ubuntu borking something. Maybe it's been fixed in an update?
 
Ubuntu 14.10 has 1.11.6 installed
 
4:22 PM
Anyone know what does this guy want?
 
DSM
@vaultah: no. The code is syntactically invalid and if it were a typo, that still wouldn't be the error message you'd get.
 
@DSM I see you tried to email yourself? Anyway - should work now :)
 
Air
This is a 12.04 machine, and it was installing 1.7.1.1 as the latest version
 
DSM
@Jon: didn't know if I was supposed to forward a message from that account. :-P
 
Air
Anyway, I backtracked and tried sudo easy_install virtualenvwrapper and it was still getting dependencies when I left work yesterday
I think some of my problems might be solved by just forgetting the wrapper tool
 
4:25 PM
@vaultah He's probably actually doing myDict.get(some_list), but that little detail was lost when he chose to make up code instead of showing us the real thing.
 
yeah, it's not really useful on servers, it's more useful on a dev machine when you're creating a bunch of envs
 
@davidism right, davidism and webmaster forward to your gmail
 
I have to admit I was half-expecting this:
There is error coming in line 6 of tails function. I think keyword from is not required. Secondly when i am running the code print list(tails(data)),it gives me this [<generator object tails at 0x043CA918>, <generator object tails at 0x043CA940>] . Please help me out. — rombi 13 mins ago
... perhaps even to the extent of using yield from to see what would happen.
How do people in here generally approach using newish additions to the language in answers, when OP doesn't specify a version?
 
I always use the most recent version
 
I always use 2.7
 
4:30 PM
Side note: assuming that upvote came from in here, I got tanked :-)
 
Air
@ZeroPiraeus well, it's an 11 rep user, they can't uv
 
Ah, that'll be it, yes.
 
Heading home, rhubarb
 
Air
That discrepancy is a little weird, I've always thought.
 
@poke rbrb!
 
Air
4:32 PM
Mmm... rhubarb is almost in season. I wanted to bake a rhubarb pie for 3/14 but it was too early. What a tragedy.
Maybe in a week or two.
 
Like the answer says - the OP's code doesn't actually raise an error
 
2 NAA flags
 
Ehhhhh, "you are doing it correctly" is technically an answer to "how do I do this correctly?"
 
DSM
Best guess: indentation inconsistency in the source.
 
My guess is: user forgot to save when he most recently made changes to his source code.
 
DSM
4:37 PM
Mine's more fun.
 
So the code that's actually running doesn't have a self.conn = func line
FWIW, the raw text of the question doesn't indicate any tab/space mixing problems
 
DSM
Yeah, I checked that myself, but that's not always dispositive.
 
agreed
 
@ZeroPiraeus The tree in that question? That was the output of an answer (I posted) to a question that user asked earlier this week.
 
Ah, really? Cool :-)
 
4:39 PM
Take a look at the first 5 questions this user posted (all related). What's the best practice for dealing with such a series? Or is this what's supposed to happen?
I'm relatively new to posting to the site and still struggling to understand how I feel about various questioner behaviors.
 
@DSM Incidentally, this is the second time I've read the word "dispositive' today, having never heard it before in my life. Funny coincidence.
Or it's not a coincidence, because you discovered the word this morning from the same place I did, and wanted to try it out...
 
DSM
I can't prove it, but I've known that word for a long, long time. :-)
 
[insert suspicious Fry here]
 
@leekaiinthesky there's a line between an inexperienced programmer running into lots of problems, and someone effectively subcontracting their work to SO. The only thing you can really do is downvote/close where appropriate, and ignore otherwise.
 
Sometimes I feel like the first question maybe was a relatively good question but didn't get a lot of views, and then the shotgun method gets all the parts answered eventually, but the parts tend to be worse-quality questions (in addition to wasting some answerer time in overlapping parts).
 
4:45 PM
OP from the above linked question says he's running 2.6... Did __init__ work differently back then?
 
Do you think that happens often? Or just my personal feeling/in limited instances?
 
DSM
@Kevin: not in any way I can think of.
 
Yeah, it happens a lot.
 
Is there a keyword I should be looking for on meta if I want to read more about how the community feels about that?
/ possible solutions
 
Bleh supervisor script doesn't seem to have started Zookeeper. Will try again later.
 
4:47 PM
I don't think we have a formal name for this type of system-gaming
 
@leeka +1 for you for the answer to the serial asker's question :-)
 
My general litmus test when I'm working on the server is "Is sopython-site still working?". If it is, then everything is still okay.
 
Haha ok, thanks ;)
I mean I feel for the serial asker here, I'm just wondering how the system can deal with that better
 
Wow - this plane crash thingy is just getting weirder and weirder
 
Like in this specific case, "Q: Matrix creation from stanford parser output" is probably just going to get way fewer views than "Q: Matrix creation". But the people looking at the latter question aren't going to know where the data is coming from.
I mean I guess the answer is to make the initial questions better through the review process
 
4:52 PM
Apparently the co-pilot had a sick note for that day... and the pilot tried to get back into the cockpit by using an axe... where the heck do they keep an axe on a plane?
 
"Germanwings 4U9525 crash, the last 60s of CVR audio file" liveleak.com/view?i=505_1427393112#tuC7mePt3OeQE43Y.99
Not particularly interesting tho
 
DSM
Somewhat macabre for the room, I think.
 
I guess they'd keep the axe next to the fire extinguisher. Uh, assuming planes have fire extinguishers. Don't know if I've ever seen one.
 
@Ffisegydd boy you have a very good memory power. Anyway, its Ubuntu 14.04 and ensurepip module. thefourtheye.in/2014/12/…
 
@Kevin I'd assume there would be one? Or, I suppose, you could just open the door and let the air out...
 
4:55 PM
@leeka there'll always be people out there who try to take unfair adantage of others' generosity; I don't think there's much that can really be done about it.
 
But I don't think that's what this person's trying to do, you know?
Just trying to figure out how to get his/her question answered
 
I don't think there's anything inherently wrong with asking a chain of related questions, as long as each one is clear/interesting/useful by itself. For me, the ends justify the means; if SO gets some nice Q&A pairs, I don't really care what the OP does with the result.
 
Yeah, there's that too :-)
SO isn't very good at seeing those kind of patterns – a byproduct of the relentless focus on the question rather than the questioner.
 
Right, so in this case (the "shotgun" case for lack of a better term), the question ends up getting broken into worse-quality parts.
 
Hey, sadfsdfsdfsdfsdf — kidman01 26 secs ago
Umm... guess that answers my comments!? :p
 
4:58 PM
And those parts are not exact duplicates of the whole... it's almost as if there needs to be a [mark as part-duplicate]
 
Awesome. Zookeeper is set up with supervisor. Now just to add Kafka, Spark, and Cassandra.
 
Or like a way to put the shot back in the shell – don't answer this question – answer the better question that this is a subpart of
 

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