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11:00 AM
@R.MartinhoFernandes Not always feasible to avoid.
I won't go further than one nested loop though.
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit yea that makes sense
 
@TonyTheLion thanks
 
VS doesn't tell me what triggered the generation of this copy constructor so I can't see where the unwanted copy is happening.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Super fucking annoying, isn't it
 
11:04 AM
inb4 VS is a terrible piece of shit
 
I honestly don't get people that complain about verbose errors in C++.
The most annoying ones are the least verbose!
 
Verbosity isn't necessarily the issue, but the cryptic-ness
some of those template errors, are verbose, but then they're fucking cryptic. To me anyways
 
Log: ERROR: 0:10: 'assign' : cannot convert from 'uint' to 'varying int'
at least my errors are more helpful
 
... without book — user3544324 12 mins ago
I always feel a little guilty about going down this road because I have never read a C++ book. But, then, I'm intelligent. :)
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit he he
 
Xeo
11:08 AM
Oh oh, here's part two of the junk mail, just in:
> DF, November 20, 2000. Celtics were fading as NBA title contenders. GNR's remaining lines in Northern Ireland in 1958 and closed the halt in 1960.
 
Shame only two were made
 
Xeo
Why don't you just ditch MSVC?
 
@Jefffrey polymorphic_downcast<Limit *>
 
11:19 AM
well
 
user1804599
dynamic_cast
 
you can only have a decent compiler or a decent debugger/environment.
 
not both.
 
Ah, the feels
 
11:20 AM
@Xeo FTR, that's the "static assertion failed" error.
 
oshit that reminds me
I think I failed derived-to-base conversions in the case of null pointers.
 
Xeo
@R.MartinhoFernandes ...
 
It doesn't even say "static assert failed" or something. Only your message.
Which leads to befuddled looks when you see an error message with no message.
And when you look up the documentation, "The attribute references an undeclared identified". Yep, totally.
I doubt there a context where "The attribute references an undeclared identified" would make sense as a C++ error.
 
Xeo
what a mess
 
OH GOD I FOUND THE BUG
now I understand everything
 
11:27 AM
inb4 imperative language's fault
 
@BartekBanachewicz Bartek has become God.
 
user1804599
@LightnessRacesinOrbit haha
 
user1804599
dupe of book list
 
@Jefffrey of course
well, and a "method error"
 
user1804599
Imperative programming is nice.
 
11:30 AM
but the fact that imperative solution has (at least) 3x more lines than it could have doesn't help really
 
@rightfold that's... not what "duplicate" means.
 
@rightfold that was my cv, SCNR
 
user1804599
"This question already has an answer that can be found elsewhere" well :P
 
@rightfold links are not answers :P
 
user1804599
care :V
 
user1804599
11:31 AM
I like the idea.
 
WTF is a 'method error'? In my OO languages, you could describe just about any bug as a 'method error'.
 
@MartinJames Every error is a method error. It's an error with the method someone used to do a thing.
 
@MartinJames somebody forgot that Tesselation Evaluation Shader could be ran in 3, not 2 different ways here
and forgot that because the chain is expressed as 50 for loops writing commands
 
user1804599
Improve bad code.
 
yeah, doing that right now
 
user1804599
11:33 AM
Good Bartek.
 
getVertexShader(test_function, inTypes, outTypes, inputs, outFormats, testShaderType, case_type, glsl_version);
because fuck structures
funny enough, the author used boost::static_visitor too
 
Yo guys
 
user1804599
Hello.
 
user1804599
> 493 Questions
> 13 Answers
 
user1804599
Dat ratio.
 
11:44 AM
:)
Yeah, I know. Will try to be more active in answers
 
@rightfold yeah he's not an ordinary help vampire, he's like a Dracula
 
I'm developing a game and now there is a small question about objects
 
 
What do you think about splitting object to the separate template classes which can access method of each other?
class Object : Helper<Object>, Energy<Object> {};
 
user1804599
It depends completely on what you want to do.
 
user1804599
11:48 AM
You cannot make a general statement about this.
 
user1804599
Be extremely specific.
 
I don't want to pass pointers from component to component
 
Xeo
> David Lavender, University of Nebraska Press, 2001, pg 32, 90. Tanakh as a Jewish ideal. In his seven seasons with the Orioles he batted .
 
And that way allows me to use methods from Energy inside Helper
 
Xeo
SDAghapug
 
Xeo
I still wanna burn Adobe down for leaking my mail
 
don't piss us off
 
Xeo
fucking idiots
 
@Xeo Wut
Oh, you mean the address
 
Xeo
ye
 
user1804599
11:49 AM
@Xeo Use a railgun to fire a 15kg metal ball into their office at Mach 16.
 
Train your spam filters better and make it public
 
Xeo
it already recognized that mail as spam
 
@rightfold that almost sounds a bit excessive
 
Xeo
doesn't change the fact that I wanna burn Adobe down
 
@Xeo I get annoyed because of random Martinho Fernandeses leaking my mail.
 
user1804599
11:50 AM
> Gusen was the center of political strength of the SS and was a symbol of violence for the prisoners. If all the parts have much the same rhythm, the homophonic texture can also be described as homorhythmic. March 2011 with a grand opening ceremony to follow on 5 May, exactly 138 years after its original opening.
 
user1804599
@Xeo I got this one today.
 
Xeo
@R.MartinhoFernandes The worst thing is, that it's my work mail. :( And I only used it for Adobe account because of some Creative Cloud stuff
 
fucking copypaste programming
 
fuck this. unsubscribing from this newsletter spam requires login to their website
 
user1804599
The email address is probably discovered by spammers due to some stupid past customer having malware on his or her computer.
 
11:52 AM
@Ockonal wwhat
 
Xeo
@StackedCrooked IIRC that's not allowed
You should be able to unsub without logging in or something
 
user1804599
@StackedCrooked just create a rule that automatically deletes the thing.
 
I should tell the police.
 
user1804599
I always do that when unsubscribing requires more action than clicking one link.
 
What's the relationship between std::vector and incomplete types?
 
11:53 AM
@Ockonal you shouldn't pass pointers. State should be simple, and components should be represented as transformers over that state
component dependencies are harder to model that way, but possible
 
@Xeo You need some authentication token one way or another.
 
Xeo
@R.MartinhoFernandes 'theoretically yes, but standard says no'
 
"Yes" is not a relationship!
 
Not allowed
afair
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes vector is better
 
11:54 AM
I have 27 errors left. 27 instances of std::vector dtor not liking an incomplete type.
 
ITT Cat teaches Robot C++
 
@BartekBanachewicz Okay, let's imagine I have Physic and Graphics components. Graphics should know about physic position. That's why I need to attach them each other
 
@Ockonal no.
 
MY BRAIN IS GONE. Tell me how to proceed.
 
holy grail
 
11:54 AM
It's a common problem, but that's not the solution.
 
Whiskey
 
another entity-component-system victim
 
Xeo
@R.MartinhoFernandes Don't use incomplete types in a std::vector?
 
This is all that is standing between me and freedom.
 
:)
 
11:55 AM
Should I try to make the type complete or make it a vector of pointers?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes The dtor needs to destruct the elements and you can't destruct an incomplete type.
 
@Jefffrey I just can't find the best way to organize everything
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Alternatively, just delay the instantiation of the std::vector's destructor until the type is complete.
 
Xeo
@R.MartinhoFernandes Lemme guess, the type is forward-declared?
 
@DeadMG Yeah, but it should only be needed in my dtor definition.
@DeadMG Oooh! Right.
 
user1804599
11:56 AM
@Ockonal Decouple graphics from the entire thing.
 
user1804599
Make it separate.
 
@Ockonal al'ight, show me the code
 
ITT: Robot knows way less C++ than I expected.
 
@Ockonal it depends a lot on how the exact systems for graphics and physics are modeled
 
11:56 AM
This is already what the code does.
 
Describe your classes in a DSL above C++ and codegen this shit
 
@Jefffrey Unfortunately, not now :( I'm at work now, have no access to the code.
 
@DeadMG I don't know what MSVC calls C++.
 
This is p much the best way to write C++ anyway
 
then later
 
11:57 AM
@Xeo Yes.
 
@Ockonal you don't have a remote repository for that code?
 
user1804599
How can you have access to the internet, but not to your code?
 
2 mins ago, by R. Martinho Fernandes
MY BRAIN IS GONE. Tell me how to proceed.
 
Xeo
@DeadMG Don't be too hard on him, he has been haunted by C2893
 
11:57 AM
Been swimming on this MSVC shit since... Monday?
 
@rightfold :) I don't use repository for it.
 
You need a break
 
user1804599
lol
 
I ended up expanding variadic templates by hand.
 
@Ockonal then that's the first problem you should fix
 
11:58 AM
DON'T LOOK AT ME LIKE THAT.
 
user1804599
I hope your storage device crashes.
 
I created a separate small project
 
@Ockonal doesn't explain why it isn't hosted on a remote repository
 
@BartekBanachewicz I have a repo for the whole project, but now I'm working on a small example
 
11:58 AM
@Ockonal so branch it?
or dunno, create a new project
 
user1804599
Oh, crap.
 
@BartekBanachewicz You don't understand. I have a game, all object for now is a class that wraps Physic, Graphics for example
 
anyway, if you're using C++ you're doing it wrong already.
 
user1804599
Root nodes are seen as orphans, because nobody links to them. :F
 
@Ockonal which is as fucking vague as it might get
 
11:59 AM
Yep :)
 
user1804599
lol
 
user1804599
"class that wraps physic"
 
What's wrong is there?
 
store your position in a physics component and make rendering stateless.
 
@rightfold Not everybody stores their code on gitfuck like a 12 year old script kiddie vying for attention from the open source zealots
 
12:00 PM
@LightnessRacesinOrbit lmao. your code must be really terrible.
 
Class which hosts Physic and Graphics objects, has a render&update function. And it gets state from physic object and applies it to the graphic.
 
my private repo is on a private server that happens not be internet-facing (since I've never needed it to be)
 
user1804599
@LightnessRacesinOrbit exactly, that's why you can have private repositories.
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Private repos exist
 
@Ockonal why does graphics have to have state at all?
 
12:01 PM
@CatPlusPlus Yes, I'm aware.
 
user1804599
@BartekBanachewicz A vptr of course!
 
@BartekBanachewicz Er, device/context, textures, geometry, etc.
 
I have my private private stuff on a 5$ DO droplet
 
@DeadMG why does it have to have state facing the update method.
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit HEY
 
12:01 PM
Not everybody stores their code on somebody else's internet-facing servers. There you go.
 
you create an immutable graphical object
 
@CatPlusPlus Yo set up a git repo? :)
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes HI THERE
 
I gave you a CC0 gist the other day.
 
not much reason for there to be graphics state available for a physics update.
 
12:02 PM
@BartekBanachewicz What does that mean?
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit You can encrypt shit and only access it via SSH :v
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Yep you did and that was awesome
 
There's really no reason to cut yourself off backups
 
@Ockonal if you load for example an image for a sprite, you can well make sprite::draw accept position, then the sprite itself can be immutable
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes: I think it's clear that I don't consider you to be a 12 year old script kiddie vying for attention from the open source zealots
 
12:03 PM
Also only copy being on-site is bad
 
@BartekBanachewicz Ok, got it
 
Just sayin
 
@CatPlusPlus Or just host it yourself in the first place
 
I keep my private repos on a box I can SSH into.
 
Why is everybody allergic to storing their own shit nowadays? OMG MUST PUT IT IN THE CLOUD BRO
 
12:04 PM
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Yes, but not on-site
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit because it's more effort and it's less reliable
 
It's backups 101
 
@CatPlusPlus Indeed, or backups off-site at least
I like to keep my primary copies local
 
Well with git there's not much difference
 
12:04 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes I keep them on BB because student account.
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Storing it yourself doesn't require making it remotely inaccessible .
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes never claimed it does, but it does open up that possibility
 
Digital Ocean has 5$ VPSes that are perfect for stuff like this
 
@Ockonal in general making stuff immutable helps a lot
 
12:06 PM
Hell, if you encrypt it you can put it p much anywhere
 
Of course in reality I'm lying, and all my repos are on an off-site VPS that I use for all manner of things. I could access my source code from anywhere if I wanted to. But that's not the point!
 
Even in The Butt
 
@BartekBanachewicz Ok. I'm trying to improve my skills now. Thank you.
 
@Ockonal everyone is.
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Heh
 
12:06 PM
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Why do you need access your code remotely at any time?:)
 
user1804599
@CatPlusPlus I once edited an answer on Stack Overflow that contained the world "cloud" and the plugin changed it into "butt" in the textarea and I didn't notice. :P
 
Also I'm not averse to storing things myself, I don't buy <2TB drives for a reason :v
 
user1804599
So when I clicked save, the answer said "butt" several times.
 
@rightfold Shoulda left it
 
user1804599
I didn't notice it until somebody else edited it back into "cloud".
 
12:08 PM
@Ockonal why not.
 
@Ockonal I don't.
In fact, frankly I haven't touched that repo in several years. I just don't do hobby projects any more.
@StackedCrooked boring
@rightfold I find it important to write out the link to Stack Overflow, also.
 
he probably just did [so] instead.
it's easier than typing Stack Overflow.
what a useless Stack Overflowd
 
orly? didnt know Stack Overflow existed
nice
 
@rightfold lol
 
12:12 PM
@LightnessRacesinOrbit cool
 
Xeo
there exist a number of those for different sites
 
There's also Meta Stack Overflow and Arqade and stuff
 
I like how that's documented.
 
[meta], [X.se]
 
wow, they actually updated it ([meta.se])
 
12:12 PM
There's also hotmail.
 
and [facebook]
fail
 
Xeo
haha
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Chat is very well coded managed
 
@StackedCrooked don't you mean, hotmail?
 
[lemonparty]
 
12:13 PM
<small>(nsfw)</small>
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit dude, i did not want to see that
 
user1804599
@LightnessRacesinOrbit [so]
 
user1804599
 
sbi
So it's all the rage here in Berlin that the robot gave a talk. I seem to have missed his invitation, though, and didn't see it. What's that talk been about?
 
Xeo
Unicode
and hi
 
12:16 PM
I SLAYED THE BEAST.
I WON.
 
and left someone else to clean up the corpse.
what a fuckin' mess.
 
sbi
You slayed the Unicode beast? And here we wondered why Unicode stopped working suddenly.
 
you slayed the breast you say?
 
@sbi I forgot to invite you directly.
 
sbi
@R.MartinhoFernandes You gotta be kidding me.
 
12:18 PM
I mentioned it here.
 
@StackedCrooked I don't even know what's there
 
It's your fault you don't show up! whistles
 
sbi
@R.MartinhoFernandes Ah, I see. Since I'm here everyday, you thought I'd see it anyway.
Quite clever. For a robot.
 
A robot running Windows ME, evidently
 
sbi
12:19 PM
So what talk was that, which you wanted to hide from me?
 
Did you talk to your bad friend, yet?
 
Also, how do I persuade syslog to emit timestamps for messages echoed on stderr with PERROR?
 
@Lightness no.
 
perror doesn't go through syslog
 
Xeo
12:21 PM
gnaaaah, how hard can it be to have iOS tell me if there's an internet connection available, and display a nicely-styled error if not
 
I forget silly things all the time like say inviting sbi so I don't hold it on others too much.
@Xeo doing iOS now?
I have a headache.
 
Xeo
been doing it all the time
 
sbi
@R.MartinhoFernandes What the fucking fuck?! Have you ever heard about slides being made using a thing called "computer"? Makes them readable.
A bunch of Unicode chars hand-scribbled on paper. Not sure what to make of this talk from those "slides".
 
0
Q: How can I persuade syslog output on console to include timestamps?

Lightness Races in OrbitConsider the following program: #include <syslog.h> int main() { openlog("test-app", LOG_CONS | LOG_NDELAY | LOG_PERROR | LOG_PID, LOG_USER); setlogmask(LOG_UPTO(LOG_DEBUG)); syslog(LOG_DEBUG, "Testing!"); } Note the use of LOG_PERROR, which emits messages to stderr as well as wh...

@R.MartinhoFernandes just no? :(
@CatPlusPlus no but the function call may be configurable such that it can prepend timestamps, theoreticaly
I agree that it doesn't appear to be the case
 
They're plenty readable.
 
12:25 PM
Nice to have sbi back.
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Nah, it's really dumb
 
sbi
Ha, you wish. I'm on my way out into the sunshine.
I just dropped by to scoff the robot for forgetting to invite me. scratches item off list
 
I was joking.
@R.MartinhoFernandes It's actually nice to see presentation slides that don't contain the presentation. Not sarcasm.
This suggests to me that you're a good speaker.
Sunshine has gone away today :( Still, holiday in two weeks \o/
 
@sbi you bastard
Anyway you're the first person to express dislike for the slides.
 
You failed to apequately apepease him
You little monkey
 
12:32 PM
I just use the slides to establish topics, to provide visual aids and to provide stuff I might need to point at.
 
Like you should
 
OMG LastPass's installer asks for a language with options including: "English", "English (Australian)", "English (US)" <3 <£
@R.MartinhoFernandes Quite right.
 
There's a strong correlation between presentations being completely boring and speakers reading off slides
(Most are boring anyway but still)
Soon I'll be an expert on Importing Data From Obscure CMSes To Drupal
 
Put it on your CV so you can get more jobs like that!
Man, that pizza really hit the spot.
<Satiated>
Your hear someone cursing shoplifters.
 
You should do less MSVC and more Crawl
There's a tournament going on!
 
12:38 PM
I'm done
It compiles now.
I think I have some allergy or somerhing. I keep sneezing when outside.
 
I have an allergy to my own gastrointestinal tract.
fortunate that I have drugs !
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes what
 
> If outside is so good, why has mankind spent thousands of years perfecting inside?
 
@FredOverflow Because outside is only good some of the time.
"Too much of a good thing", after all...
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Is that why Microsoft's C++ is never feature complete?
2
 
12:43 PM
my head
it hurts.
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit nethack.wikia.com/wiki/Shop
When you eat a food ration in NetHack, there's a message "That food really hit the spot!"
When I said something similar my brain made the association and I had to make a silly obscure joke.
 
user1804599
@FredOverflow comfort.
 
@FredOverflow haha
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Ah, okay, I'm with you.
My parents call lemon squash "hits the spot", because they have funny phrases for things and they like to vocalise that the stuff "really hits the spot". I don't think they've ever even heard of NetHack, though.
(Obviously the phrase existed before that; just saying)
 
Woke up at 7 and noticed there was no water in the apartment. It's almost 3 pm and still no water.
 
12:53 PM
@StackedCrooked Usually you don't want water in your apartment.
 
Lucky I have a day off.
 
user1804599
@StackedCrooked Nu weet je hoe het voelt om een Ethiopiaan te zijn.
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit He's actually a fish
 
@rightfold how precious
 
12:54 PM
SticklebackedCroakered
 
user1804599
And it is your punishment for not having random installed on Coliru.
 

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