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11:00 PM
You know... on the net we don't usually ask to ask. Unless of course you know you're in the wrong place, in which case you simply don't ask.
(god, valgrind --tool=massif is massively slow)
 
if your programming language is not turing complete you should be ashamed
minecraft is turing complete
 
@sehe Pfft!

In C++, can you create a process and run a subroutine in the same way one might run a subroutine inside a thread?... Preferably without having to create separate program to run inside the spawned process...
 
That's a terrible interview question. — Mysticial 8 secs ago
 
It isn't even a question
 
@Charlie you can do anything - C++ is turing complete.
 
11:03 PM
@nightcracker - Yes it is!
@sehe - Lol!7
 
@Mysticial the question says: "you want to implement the code"
but that's total bullshit
you can't implement code
code is
 
Replacing std::string with boost::string_ref required a little modification (which means concession to usability, for now), and netted a perf win of **72%**(!!) and is likely to conserve much more memory. Mmm. Not too shocking, actually:
 
@TonyTheLion that was a great talk
 
Down from 164MiB peak to 133, meaning basically we avoided duplicating the source data by using string-refs. Now, in my real projects I don't always parse from buffers, but also from streams so I couldn't just do this. But it sure looks interesting
 
From what I've read so far, it's only possible, if you create a separate executable file to run inside the process you've spawned. But I suspect that has to be nonsense...

Perhaps I'm asking the wrong question, but I'm sure I've identified the crux of the issue.
 
11:07 PM
@Charlie I have no clue what you're trying to do
@Charlie You're mixing terms like process, subprocess, subroutine, thread and program without defining exactly what you mean with what.
 
@Charlie Why would this be nonsense? MPI is basically this. And you can fork/exec. Just google it.
@nightcracker That's on purpose.
 
@sehe ?
 
The whole question boils down to "can you do a remote procedure call". Of course you can.
It's gonna be some work, but nothing stops you.
 
That still doesn't explain why mixing the terms is done on purpose? To what purpose is it done?
 
@Nightcracker - What I'm keen on avoiding is creating a separate, accompanying program.
 
11:14 PM
@Charlie fork yourself (that's not rude, google fork)
 
@Charlie for what?
@Charlie you haven't even described to me what your original program is, or what it does
 
@sehe - Fork get you...
 
@nightcracker In order to mingle the concepts. That's what the asker is doing, on purpose. The question is "can I blur the distinction between local procedure and remote procedure invocation" but he doesn't know what it's called, so he goes on a fishing expedition blurring the lines between processes, threads etc.
 
This man knows what side the croissant is buttered on...
 
@sehe you can blur the distiction, but it's generally terrible design that spends 99% of the time blocking
 
11:16 PM
@nightcracker I don't see why. Why would you do things badly if you can do it well? And for good reasons?
 
@sehe I don't know
 
I mean, yes, it's exceedlingly rare, but not impossible
 
@sehe don't ask me
@Charlie what are you trying to ACCOMPLISH?
@Charlie and please save me from your XY problem, and tell me your actual intentions
 
-1
A: Returning Vectors standard in C++

Straw1239You can return a reference/pointer to a vector. vector<obj>* func(vector<obj>& input) Use STL when it is convenient. Dynamically allocated arrays are fine for some things also, but lack of bounds checking and size can easily cause bugs. I personally use my own containers because I dislike STL ...

o.o
 
@Martin I have your ticket.
 
11:18 PM
@nightcracker Just today I fixed a Java application that did just this: it ended up calling a RMI ~900x - slowing down to about 5 minutes. I made a batch method, so the same happens in 1 invocation, bam. Down to 1 second
 
> I personally use my own containers because I dislike STL naming
fucking fail
 
@nightcracker It's a bit late for that, don't you think? Also, from all the mixing of terminology I glean he doesn't know what he wants to do. He's just curious about something he heard. Mark my words.
 
@Borgleader that's fucking terrible
 
@sehe tadaa, 99% of the time was spent blocking/waiting :P
 
-4
A: Returning Vectors standard in C++

Straw1239You can return a reference/pointer to a vector. vector<obj>* func(vector<obj>& input) Use STL when it is convenient. Dynamically allocated arrays are fine for some things also, but lack of bounds checking and size can easily cause bugs. I personally use my own containers because I dislike STL ...

@nightcracker I'm telling you for a reason, you know
 
11:19 PM
@sehe in fact, 99.6% of the time in this example :P
@sehe don't tell me - we agree :P
 
@nightcracker Assuming my estimates had enough accuracy
@nightcracker You guessed it
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Great! Thanks for helping out. Beer/pizza/whatever will be your reward:)
 
0
Q: Likelihood of TCP failures

Eugene BeresovksyAs long as a TCP connection is established and data streams in from the socket, we expect that data to be a perfect copy of what was written to the socket on the other end. Of course there are errors in the real IP world, most of which are handled transparently by TCP (resending of lost or corru...

this isn't necessarily about programming
not sure if should close?
 
well
 
well
> variabl* variables[50000];
eeek
who the hell creates an array of pointers that size??!!
 
11:22 PM
first of all let's look at the core of his question: "what is the chance that network disruption goes undetected by the TCP checksum"
 
@nightcracker Actually, the remoting wasn't really the issue (and has a purpose here - heap isolation and privilege separation). In fact the real issue was the fine-grained API - it ended up rewriting a 5MiB XML file on each invocation. This would have been exactly the same bottleneck if it were in-process.
By the way, the remoting channel supports full async calls here.
@TonyTheLion Someone who recreates ASM.js in C++?
 
@nightcracker - I'm trying to circumvent an odd OSX bug.

What I have is an IO server of a kind. When I start that server, it gives me a count of all the available objects I have access to. But successive count queries do not work. Other server queries however, do work after start up, and if I kill the main process and restart the program just to get a new object count, then that would be wasteful, right?

I think a sub process will be the answer. I thought a thread would work, but it can't, of course, because it shares memory.
 
@sehe Well, almost, but no
:P
 
@Charlie well, there's your XY problem
@Charlie fix the counting - don't fucking start processes to circumvent it
 
XY?
 
11:24 PM
@Charlie "objects I have access to". Could you be a bit more vague, sil-te-plaît?
 
@Charlie if you don't fix it right here, you'll get bitten in the ass later, I GUARANTEE it
 
397
Q: What is the XY problem?

GnomeWhat is the XY problem? When asking questions, how do I recognize when I'm falling into it? How do I avoid it? Return to FAQ index

 
@sehe - USB devices...
 
397
Q: What is the XY problem?

GnomeWhat is the XY problem? When asking questions, how do I recognize when I'm falling into it? How do I avoid it? Return to FAQ index

 
slow poke :)
 
11:25 PM
@sehe is that a reverse "alot"?
 
"@Charlie if you don't fix it right here, you'll get bitten in the ass later, I GUARANTEE it"

I know... It's a potential technical debt of the highest order...
 
@Borgleader wow, lounge descends! -5 and counting
 
@Charlie then don't make the debt and fucking fix the problem
 
@qeadz: Actually, comments are for requesting clarification and for trolling people. — Lightness Races in Orbit 4 secs ago
 
@nightcracker - It's a third party dependency!!!
 
11:28 PM
If I was a lead developer and would find out an employee is trying to circumvent bugs by restarting processes everything a count of objects need to be done I would seriously consider replacing that employee
@Charlie and I'm supposed to smell that?
 
@Charlie also, please don't quote messages just to reply. Instead, click the reply arrow
 
@nightcracker - You badger!!!
 
@Charlie use my magic mind reading to know that?
 
45
Q: Can I use vodka to clean my keyboard?

user1068446I spilled beer on my keyboard a while back, and some of the keys are sticky. It's driving me crazy, and I don't have any isopropyl. Can I use vodka to clean it?

^ crazy ideas...
 
@Charlie Ah!!! Use fork!!! That'll help!!! Never fails!!!
 
11:29 PM
@Charlie report the bug upstream? provide a patch?
 
@nightcracker Find the root cause, feel victorious?
@EtiennedeMartel yeah, but .start() is so much better than .begin(). And you can still support range-based for by generically relaying to member .start() etc... (don't forget about rbegin() and const/volatile variations, noexcept()-correctness, but that's pretty trivial stuff; no reason to put up with standard naming that everybody-and-his-dog would recognize) — sehe 2 mins ago
 
@nightcracker Didn't you read his question? He said it's an OSX bug.
 
@nightcracker - No. The sacking bit!
 
> Refers to another post from 2011, proceeds to caption it "Yet another BGL's Betweenness centrality issue".
yeah we get shitloads of those
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit yes, that could mean multiple things, the most logical meaning to me would be "a bug in the application that only manifests on OS X"
 
11:32 PM
@Charlie Please use the reply arrow.
@nightcracker An odd way to read it.
 
@Charlie english is not my native language, I do not know what "the sacking bit" means.
 
@sehe why did you use >, there? #confusedme
 
@nightcracker the bit about sacking
 
@nightcracker "sacking" is "firing".
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit I do to make it clear that I'm referring to some outside event/happening
 
@nightcracker - "sacking"? Raping employees for exploratory reasoning.
 
@sehe It's supposed to be for verbatim quotes, IMO
@R.MartinhoFernandes bet I know what this is
 
Duly noted. I know, of course.
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit really? he mentioned the bug occurs when trying to "count objects", which is not a dedicated OS function AFAIK
 
11:34 PM
I'm a free man and I sometimes use stuff as I see fit.
 
@nightcracker Until he explains what "objects" are, you haven't a clue
 
@R. Martinho - Yeah... You'd get a kick out of working with me...
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit USB Ports!!!!7!
 
@sehe I get it. Sometimes you forget you live in my world. That's okay, though.
 
lol
 
11:35 PM
@sehe could be
@Charlie Please use the reply arrow.
 
@Charlie how is firing employees that produce technical dept "exploratory"?
 
@nightcracker Gosh. The exploratory blabla refers to the chatting here
 
@nightcracker technical dept is usually compensated with lower salaries
 
11 mins ago, by Charlie
@sehe - USB devices...
@HamZa dat punny reversal :)
 
@nightcracker @my workplace for example, we use threads for everything. Because it's in popular tech literature... For speed an throughput, we should be using processes...
 
11:37 PM
Whatever, I'll just stop this discussion - my english is too bad to see what people are referencing what in a typed form
 
@nightcracker ga slapen dan :P
 
@Charlie And!!! Interpunction... of course...???
 
Just like I'm terrible at detecting sarcasm over the internet
@HamZa ik ben net wakker :)
 
@nightcracker That's a brilliant combo
 
@nightcracker lolwut
 
11:38 PM
@HamZa #fuckedupsleepschedule
 
@nightcracker hint, you typo-ed debt as dept, which is short for department
 
@sehe it seems that it's also time for me to sleep
 
@HamZa LOLWUT You missed your own joke?
 
@sehe I didn't mean it as a joke :lol:
 
11:40 PM
Cargo cult programming is a style of computer programming characterized by the ritual inclusion of code or program structures that serve no real purpose. Cargo cult programming is typically symptomatic of a programmer not understanding either a bug they were attempting to solve or the apparent solution (compare shotgun debugging, deep magic). The term cargo cult programmer may apply when an unskilled or novice computer programmer (or one inexperienced with the problem at hand) copies some program code from one place and pastes it into another place, with little or no understanding of how th...
 
@sehe - Aye... I'm very fond of ellipses. As was Dostoevsky.
 
hahahahah rofl
@Charlie Then. Fuckin'. Type. Ellipses. …⋮⋯⋰⋱︙
 
"Hey Bob, we have this problem, what should we use to solve it?"
"THREADS!!!11!!!11!one1!1oneelevent"
 
@nightcracker Do you do much work on OSX?
Yes.
 
Nope
 
11:42 PM
You guys amuse the shit out of me. Imma' write more C++! XD
 
Damn why use OS X? Just use linux
 
Roh oh...
 
@Charlie why would this be relevant?
 
@nightcracker Different system level API's.
 
@Charlie So?
 
11:43 PM
@Charlie an API is an API
 
Last time I checked people were using OS X for professional applications. I hear, despite the system level APIs, they even pull of USB connectivity.
 
Waddya mean "so"? An API can be almost as complicated as a language in itself...
 
In fact, major DAW controller software prefers OS X
 
@Charlie so?
 
@Charlie All of which is relevant because...?
 
11:44 PM
@Charlie I have answers on SO in languages I have never even written anything in
 
"I must take shortcuts, because, naturally I can't learn another API just to support a new platform".
Well, if it's not bringing any revenue, just don't support the platform
 
@Charlie what I mean with "so", is that my knowledge goes beyond a single language or API
 
@Charlie What makes you say this? Are you worried about being taken seriously?
 
@sehe HE SAID THIS? LOL
 
@sehe I'm just thinking...
 
11:46 PM
ok, that kind of does make me not want to take him serious...
 
@nightcracker No, but it's the gist I'm taking from it
 
@sehe - It's not concrete. I can just see that people smarter than myself appear to be having the same trouble...
 
@Charlie And, it just so happens you are also "just thinking we're all SoB's". Interesting thought processes. Maybe you should, indeed, stick with the workaround o.O
@Charlie Yay. More fallacies!
 
@Charlie Hitler was pretty smart
 
@sehe Ignore the SoB thing, plox.
 
11:48 PM
@Charlie what is the exact operation that is failing on OS X?
@Charlie the most concrete answer I have gotten from you so far is "counting objects"
 
@Charlie → 1 message moved to bin Wokay, just this time then
@nightcracker The exact operation that is failing ig sh -c 'sensible-browser http://stackoverflow.com/questions/ask' (s/sensible-browser/safari/ if need be)
13 mins ago, by sehe
11 mins ago, by Charlie
@sehe - USB devices...
pffft
 
@sehe Dawww...
 
Nice progression. I'd expect another quoting in ~17 minutes
@Charlie You asked
 
@sehe prime numbers?
 
:)
 
11:51 PM
Good night folk
 
*s
 
The heck is going on?
 
@TonyTheLion sshhh
 
Don't fall asleep now
that would be a waste of time
 
11:52 PM
No. I'm kippin' and you can't stop me.
But thanks for the help. :)
 
<sad-trombone/>
Doesn't even recognize a Lounge in it's purest form
@Charlie Cheers
 
Must. Write. More. C...
 
Cǂ…, FTFY
 
@Charlie what on earth is "C..." is that the latest and greatest language where you index the C namespace thrice? :D
 
> index
cough
 
11:54 PM
:(
lookup?
 
Clearly, it's a pack expansion
@nightcracker You're looking for member invocation or reference indirection
 
aha!
 
Both don't work here though
 
@sehe lol
 
In other news, I'm also hitting the sack. I was hitting on the sacking too. Just, don't like it if anyone hit's my sack. Just so you know.
 
11:56 PM
I got lost reading about Windows drivers
 
Night all
@TonyTheLion ew *(hope it's for work)
 
hahaha
no, I don't need drivers for work
it was a mere spurt of curiosity, I guess
@sehe Night
 
I'm a driver /to/ work
 
ok so who is NOT going to bed?
 
I'm still here
 
11:57 PM
<3 you lion
 
'night all
 
jalf however is literally hitler
 
@nightcracker (those who know me know that with 87% probability that includes me)
@nightcracker so he's immensely popular and wields more power than any other European leader at the time?
 
@sehe all people that know you are statisticians?
 
They intuitively recognize this as a truth
 

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