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1:00 PM
> "If you imagine it as a motorway, attacks try and put enough traffic on there to clog up the on and off ramps," he told the BBC.

"With this attack, there's so much traffic it's clogging up the motorway itself."
Car analogies.
 
@thecoshman Something about you being wrong
 
Also really, we all know an email should be created and send as: email = Email(subject = ..., message = ..., attachments); email.send([recipients]).
 
Hinduism describes cows as sacred for the most part (although, despite this, they are still slaughterable under certain circumstances).
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit QI vOv
 
Recipients should not be a property of the email object.
 
1:01 PM
@thecoshman IRL HTH \o/
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Jeremy Clarkson on DDoS? :P
 
An email is like an envelope, you can copy it, send it to someone, or destroy it.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes That's a pretty good analogy
 
user784668
GHC devs are literally Hitler
 
@Jefffrey How do you copy a letter without opening the envelope it's in?
 
1:02 PM
@Borgleader DDoS to Clarkson means 'caravans'.
 
user784668
LLVM backend is broken.
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit you Hindi?
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit I meant letter OK??!??
you put it in the envelope only when you want to send it
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Just fake it and make sure the recipients can't contact each other. (Shooting one of them works)
 
user784668
Goodbye reasonably fast number crunching :(
 
1:04 PM
the message itself should be separated from the recipient information
 
@Jefffrey Envelopes have a tendency to have the recipient's name and address on them.
 
exactly
 
Wait. Did you forget a not somewhere, then?
 
@Jefffrey Well, a reference to a recipients object should be.
 
Or had one too much.
 
1:04 PM
@Jefffrey encrypt it then
 
3 mins ago, by Jefffrey
Recipients should not be a property of the email object.
Because this is confusing me now.
 
message = Message(subject = ..., message = ...); envelope = Envelope(message, [recipients]); send(envelope)
 
@thecoshman Sure why not
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Probably because you are not getting all your emails 'cos bad recipient.
 
Or just: message = Message(subject = ..., message = ...); send(envelope, [recipients])
 
1:06 PM
@Jefffrey yes
Transport/delivery != content
@Jefffrey s/envelope/message/ # hth
 
In Django everything is all so tight together it almost makes me come.
 
Thank you for this wonderful imagery shudders
 
I had an idea for some recipientless messaging system. You each have a public key that you would use to decrypt your messages. Obviously, unless someone has the key for the message, it's meaningless. These messages are then bounced around nodes. Obviously it's not guaranteed delivery, but it's impossible for people to know what messages you have read, and more important who is really sending what. ie whistle blowing. #WIP
 
email = Email(subject = ..., message = ..., template_message = ..., recipients = ..., from_email = ...); email.send()
 
was more effort than I cared to spend, so it got as far as idea :P
 
1:09 PM
@thecoshman So basically you fill the network with messages that bounce back and forth with the probability of 1/2billion to reach the correct recipient?
 
@Jefffrey more or less. Obviously not designed for mass use. Might require some form non-encrypted data stored with it. such as age.
 
Why on earth would you do that, when you have the chance of directing it directly to recipient?
 
In a very short amount of time.
 
@thecoshman lol, global email bus?
good luck with that
 
1:11 PM
@Jefffrey one of the ideas is that you can't tell who is reading the messages, so you can't know which ones to track and see where they are flowing from.
 
@Jefffrey Because then both sender and recipient are obscured.
 
routing was invented for a p good reason hth
 
I see
 
> After paying € 8088.- euros
 
@Puppy Obscuring the sender and recipient isn't terribly useful. Ensuring content secrecy and integrity, is.
 
1:12 PM
@LightnessRacesinOrbit they are, but with it comes very clear who is sending to who
 
You can obscure the sender just fine.
 
There are some edge cases where complete secrecy is useful but then ... well, don't use the internet.
 
You don't need it to find the recipient.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes email comes from a source
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes No but you do need control over the nearest router.
And the one after that, and the one after that
Until you get to a place where you don't need the "sender" secrecy any more
That place is likely to be inside your ISP, so good luck
 
1:13 PM
did you people not see the #WIP?
 
@thecoshman #WobblyInformationProvided
 
#WTF
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit if you like to put it that way
 
I thought #WIP meant #Weep
 
Xeo
@BartekBanachewicz Hahaha, again no time for that - I'm off at the Connichi that weekend :D
 
1:16 PM
@LightnessRacesinOrbit I don't think I understand what you're trying to say. The sender info doesn't have to exist in plain text anywhere that is connected.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Never said it did. But every router on the chain knows the IP address of the router before it, and can (and does) inject that IP into the email's headers. You get a very good idea of the original recipient if the first routers' IPs are in the email's headers. To avoid that, you need control over those routers.
And when I say routers, I mean SMTP servers. Email routers. :)
 
I don't think cosh meant to use SMTP.
 
Ehm it sounded like you were suggesting TCM's idea was unnecessary because you can already "obscure the sender just fine" with SMTP?
It's self-evident that cosh's mechanism obscures the sender
 
I'm not doing anything
 
@Jefffrey work in progress nub cake
 
1:21 PM
FUCK
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Ah, sorry, then.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes of course not. Else it would just be SMPT with encrypted body, but you still are sending it (more or less) from A to B.
 
@Xeo srsly
 
Simple Mail Protocol for Transfer
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit and recipient
 
1:23 PM
alright tell me this
 
@thecoshman yes
 
if you tailor your CV to each job description, then what even is the difference between a cover letter and a CV?
 
are you serious?
 
@Puppy the level of tailoring :P
 
for that matter, what even is the point of a cover letter.
 
1:23 PM
One is a polite letter requesting the someone reads your CV. The other is a CV.
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit lol - thanks for the explanation:)
 
CV is more about you as a professional, CL is more you are a lame as twat.
 
You wouldn't blunder into a pub and start shouting at the landlord "SO I WORKED IN A BAR FOR TWO YEARS AND I CAN POUR REALLY GOOD PINTS THANKS"
You go "Hi there! I heard you may be looking for new staff?" then launch into your tedious and unimpressive job history
 
@Puppy CV depicts your life in a way meaningful to the recruiter. Cover leter states why a person with such life would want to work there.
 
user784668
@thecoshman CL? Common lisp?
 
1:24 PM
@Fanael context people! use it! ಠ_ಠ
 
Cover letters are mostly useless.
 
@MartinJames yw
 
It makes sense to rebalance the contents of a cv for a particular job, but as Lightness said it's still a cv.
@VáclavZeman I disagree; it's an overgeneralization.
 
Cover letter is a personal touch to the CV, you might get away with sending the same CV to a few different roles, but you do need a different cover letter to each role
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit It's difficult to go wrong with POP
 
1:25 PM
@BartekBanachewicz Fixed.
 
@MartinJames "Previously, On POP..."
or Personal Office Page
oh what could have been
 
would that be racist if I hated my own race?
 
@BartekBanachewicz Yes.
 
@BartekBanachewicz Yes....
 
interesting.
 
1:27 PM
Why's that interesting?
 
dunno, never thought about it that way
 
@chmod711telkitty Yeah, my CV has no personal touch whatsoever.
 
heh..
 
@MartinJames POP is shit in basically every way. IMAP or GTFO
 
1:27 PM
like I'm prejudiced towards text written in Polish on the internt
because typically it's crap.
 
user784668
@BartekBanachewicz No if you hate other races too.
 
Get The Fucking Onvelope?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes how can your CV be personal when you send the same CV to like 10 roles ... I mean it is personal to you, but others do not consider it's personal to them
 
@BartekBanachewicz I know that feeling (with Hebrew)
 
@BartekBanachewicz racist. clearly
 
1:28 PM
@BartekBanachewicz That's hardly "racist"
 
Fucking interwebs hopeless today. Mebbe it's that DDoS thingy.
 
@chmod711telkitty you should not be sending the same CV to 10 roles.
 
@chmod711telkitty It's personal because it's my CV.
 
oh hi @Benjamin
 
@BartekBanachewicz hai
 
1:28 PM
@LightnessRacesinOrbit he's presuming text is crap if he see's it is polish... pretty much the definition.
@MartinJames nah
 
user784668
@MartinJames it's honkies stealing your interwebz
 
@thecoshman Not really, no
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum ..but it's so much work making up 10 different ones.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum my haskell app can into http! <proud>
 
Presuming that the sender is stupid if he is Polish, would be approaching racism.
 
1:29 PM
@LightnessRacesinOrbit o_0 it's prejudice and discriminatory... against text
 
@BartekBanachewicz isn't that like 10 LoC with Yesod?
 
But there are any number of reasons that written Polish may tend to be poorly-constructed that don't come close to a personal assessment
@thecoshman textist
 
@BartekBanachewicz That is not racism, that is reverse nationalism. :)
 
@MartinJames if you don't take your employment seriously - don't blame other people if you don't get in :P
 
@BartekBanachewicz What framework?
 
1:29 PM
@BenjaminGruenbaum it also has state! and and and stuff!
 
@Jefffrey BartekMS
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum you can, but you should not, you get higher success rate when you tailor it to the role
 
@Jefffrey I won't tell you because you'll say "fuck" again.
 
Although most people who have any web presence rarely need to write CVs.
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit rcasim doesn't have to be personal, in fact, it's hard to be racist and personal. I can hate a black person without being racist if it is not because they are black but just generally a dick.
 
1:30 PM
@chmod711telkitty You don't need 10 jobs. Just one.
 
@chmod711telkitty yeah, I think we agree on that.
 
oh i know
 
@thecoshman I didn't mean "personal" in that way, sorry
 
it's scotty
 
@thecoshman I meant "as relates to the people doing the writing, rather than the writing itself"
 
1:30 PM
@LightnessRacesinOrbit oh...
 
@thecoshman What, now black people are just generally a dick?
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit you don't need a specific job, you need any job that meets your requirements - if you have a favorite after the resume phase that's cool.
 
yeah, fuck scotty
 
yes, it's scotty, and I'm proud of it
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum CV*
 
1:31 PM
@LightnessRacesinOrbit yeah, but it's always nice to get all 10 offers then you can choose which one you want the most after you meet your future boss in person
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes ... can I respond without looking bad?
 
@chmod711telkitty Not really - why do I want to have to choose between ten jobs that I know I wanted in the first place?
 
"I heard you need cookies? TOO BAD MOTHERFUCKER" - Scotty
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit cv/resume, just different terms for the same thing in different parts of the world.
 
Yesod and Snap are both absurdly big for my needs
 
1:31 PM
@BenjaminGruenbaum No, CV is the only correct term.
 
@Jefffrey I DONT NOW WHAT
you're so keen on those goddamn cookies
wanna fucking biscuit?
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum "Resume" is not a term for this in any part of the world, and "résumé" is a term that is silly and stupid.
 
"Sessions? What are those?" - Scotty
 
cv/resume/restart/recommence/continue
 
Continue Vaccilating
 
1:32 PM
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Big deal, my keyboard doesn't have an accented "e". It's a perfectly fine term, althugh I use CV most of the time.
 
yes hate a minimal framework for being minimal
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes looks like you have a... halting problem (⌐■_■)
 
@BartekBanachewicz You don't what. You don't now?
 
user784668
@R.MartinhoFernandes they're a mere part of the giant dick known as "humanity"
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum My keyboard doesn't have an "é" either.
 
1:33 PM
@Jefffrey The only thing my app does is send stuff on get and process stuff on post.
It's dead simple.
 
It has only good, wholesome, unaccented Latin characters.
 
Resume ... perfect term for hoppers ... resume job hunting ...
 
My keyboard has an "ä". Pressing it generates a single quote character.
 
à
é
 
user784668
1:34 PM
ő
 
user784668
 
user784668
 
You lot..
 
1:34 PM
@MartinJames shaddap alcie
how many pints have you had so far today?
 
' does § on CZ/US keyboard...Just FYI. :)
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Coffee?
 
@MartinJames no
 
water, obviously ... are you hydrated?
 
great, now I have SOAD stuck in my head
 
1:35 PM
@MartinJames tomato sauce
 
I've only had about a pint of coffee to drink. No, it was not 'fortified'.
 
I'm doing too much.
I need to strip some code.
A lot of it.
 
I'm getting hungry. I'll go get my ice-pick.
 
@MartinJames too bad
@MartinJames what
guess I should get up and about
 
My code blocks in the middle of nowhere, according to the call stacks.
 
Xeo
1:40 PM
@BartekBanachewicz Yes.
 
@Xeo suck. Deep, real suck.
3
wait that sounds wrong now that I've read it.
 
Xeo
@BartekBanachewicz vOv
I've been planning to go there since the beginning of the year
 
@Puppy here is a cover letter template:
Dear Sir/Madam,
I am writing to you to express my interest in the job vacancy: (job title) you have advertised on (date). A copy of my resume is attached to this application. If you have any questions, please do not hesitate to contact me.
Regards,
-(your name)
 
> I am awesome. Hire me.
 
1:43 PM
Best regards*
To whom it may concern,*
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit recommence*
 
I used it for years, it worked many times ...
 
s/job vacancy: /position of /
 
Xeo
@R.MartinhoFernandes Worked for me!
 
Yes you got the job through your cover letter
 
1:44 PM
récommencé
 
@chmod711telkitty oh I see a seasoned job seeker here
2
 
@Abyx I did have 9 professional jobs before
 
@chmod711telkitty "many times" implies you're not good at holding down these jobs
lol
 
@Abyx Doesn't being a seasoned jobseeker basically imply that you suck at jobseeking?
 
seems to me like if you were good at jobseeking, you would therefore not spend long looking for a job and therefore not become a seasoned jobseeker.
 
@chmod711telkitty you mean you were fired 8 times?
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Bubblé
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit We are talking about job hunting, not holding down a job
 
yeah
 
1:46 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes erm
 
@Puppy Well, but if you also do not spend long working a job, you end up jobseeking a lot.
 
@chmod711telkitty what is a "professional job"? I can only handle 2 professional jobs, myself
 
@Abyx nope, never fired ... retrenched with the rest half of the company a few times ... better opportunities most of the times
 
@chmod711telkitty the best half, I suppose
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit To whomever the fuck cares,*
Bad grammar fits better.
Nah, maybe not.
 
1:49 PM
@Abyx best for whom? surely not someone who wants to rip me off ...
 
@Puppy "if you were good at jobseeking, you would therefore not spend long looking for a job" is wrong
You might still land a job you want, but the delays introduced might not be on your side.
They typically aren't.
And obviously you don't stop looking after sending one CV
 
also getting unpaid intern job might be a good way to get you started
3 month on a decent role
than go from there
the keyword is: decent ... people need to train you
 
@chmod711telkitty that's illegal here :D
@Puppy I enjoy the chase.
Also, I hook a lot of people up, especially good friends - it's a great way to network.
 
My friends tried to hook me up with jobs before ... long time ago though, not in recent years
 
"hook up", "rip off" - wtf are you talking about?
 
1:58 PM
meaning when they are hiring or their good friends are hiring, they try to hire me, but always the wrong timing, also I don't like to work with friends because I have the fear that I would ruin the friendship
 
@Abyx it means if I know someone looking to get hired and I know someone hiring I introduce them to each other.
 
@Abyx she used the terms correctly
 
Speak of which, I have not applied a job for like ... a long long time. If you disregard the page on telkitty's website telling people I can be contracted to do their apps
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit I know
 
2:13 PM
@chmod711telkitty you should apply for more jobs.
 
then what if I got an offer? turning it down? ... not available for any role for the next 6 months ...
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum oh taking heroin vOv
 
from .email import * -> invalid syntax
Hmm...
 
I used to like job interviews, because I liked to meet people
 
you are a woman, of course you like socializing
* hides *
 
2:16 PM
@chmod711telkitty I still do
 
o_0 erm... why did vim decided to start indenting more and more when I paste some text in?
 
@chmod711telkitty why, are you hard to work with? :p
 
is that some funky mode it has?
 
@Jefffrey sexist! flags
 
why are you doing this to me python
why
should I report it as a bug?
 
2:21 PM
@Jefffrey first of all, wth are you doing from somethin import * ?
Second of all, what's .email and why does it start with a dot?
 
The most awkward interview happened when this company's hiring team came to Sydney, and their interviews were carried out in the hotel suites. Imagine people's looks when I was taken to a different room by a different man every half an hour
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum Because it's a relative path
 
@Jefffrey so you meant ./ instead of . ?
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum I'm trying to import everything from something
@BenjaminGruenbaum lolwat
 
@Jefffrey don't do that - it's bad practice and for a reason.
Wait, why the . to begin with?
 
2:23 PM
@BenjaminGruenbaum That module contains a single function. I'm lazy and I prefer to use * instead of that function name. Even if I change it to from .email import send_email that still triggers the error.
 
@Jefffrey what if you remove the dot in front of the word email?
Also, if your files are in multiple directories append them to your path, you can't just import <Some Relative Path> There's __import__ but don't do that;.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum same error
 
So import email is a syntax error?
 
from email import send_email is still an "invalid syntax"
 
You also need a __init__.py that gets imported if you import with subdirectories - but I have no idea what you were trying to accomplish with the . - also that should not be invalid syntax.
If from email import send_email is anything but an ImportError and it doesn't work your problem is elsewhere.
 
2:27 PM
@BenjaminGruenbaum There's utils/__init__.py and utils/email.py. In the former I say from email import send_email. That's a syntax error apparently.
 
Woot.
Adding an index reduced query time from 6 seconds to 0.7 seconds.
 
If you run email.py itself does it work? Maybe there's a syntax error there.
@PolymorphicPotato what a shocker...
 
and this is in an area full of real new apartments
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum It was an error there. Thanks.
Also I'm pretty sure about that .email thingy.
You can do relative module imports in Python.
 
@Jefffrey np. Also - yeah, you probably can I just didn't see anyone use .modulename I only saw d.modulename etc.
 
2:32 PM
@melak47 not according to yearly reviews, I got commented that I was very friendly a lot
 
so you think your friends are hard to work with? :p
 
no, I like my friends, that's why we are friends, and that's the reason why I don't want to ruin it
 
but if neither you nor your friends are hard to work with, what are you afraid of? :D
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum :D
 
because there would be conflict of interests for sure? ... hard enough with strangers, definitely don't want to deal that with friends
 
2:39 PM
@Jefffrey they are frowned upon.
See PEP 8.
 
"See PEP 8", lol.
 
PEP 8 is best PEP.
 
what is PEP?
Penis Enlargement Process?
 
committee papers for python IIRC
 
Fuckkles. Wifi at villa is web logon so I cannot connect my kindle. I'm gonna have to.. do something with my phone, maybe, to get books:(
 
2:42 PM
I hate CUDA+MATLAB+some supercomputer
 
@MartinJames Why don't you get them before the trip?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I will try, but I get through a lot of books.
 
Something always crashes :-(
 
> relation "models_signuptoken" does not exist
why are you looking the model with a models_ prefix
 
It would help if my phone did not have such an inglorious history of destroying hardware that it's plugged into:(
 
2:45 PM
you should be looking at appname_signuptoken you dickhead
 
owned by stringly-typed.
 
strangely typed
 
Retries... the reliabilty of my iwebs has been at a low for a week, now.
 
oh, I forgot the meta class
woopsie
 
my toesies are cold
 
2:49 PM
@Puppy if only there was some sort of foot glove...
 
there is, and it just walked into my room looking for attention
 
@Puppy lol - yes, he's been fed:)
 
lol
 
spent $419 on a car service today ... should be capped at $375 as advertised on their webpage, but re-balancing the wheel was not included in the cap so they claim ... how could re-balancing the wheel not included in the package when car wash is?
 
good good
 
2:51 PM
@thecoshman checks German word for sock
Oh wait.
The word for glove is already "hand shoe".
 
lol
 
I doubt they have "foot hand shoe".
 
I should apply for these jobs.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I don't know...
 
2:55 PM
apparently my phone will also get the android L update
 
my cheap android doesn't get any update
 
I really can't complain about htc's updates, they never make the phone slower and it seems they're ok with supporting previous flagships for as long as possible
 
and battery life is like 12 hours on standby ... sadness
 
Ah.. need to charge phone.
 
I was expecting my M7 to be forgotten wrt updates so the M8 is a more attractive product for people but the update to android L is really good news
 
2:56 PM
Need to seriously considering whether to get android or iphone now my current phone contract is set to expire in a few weeks' time
 
I should really get cracking on contributing to Clang.
 
Also need to finish my current android app & the paper work for my business
 

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