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2:00 PM
> Isn't RAII basically a [...] wrapper?
No.
 
RAII is a paradigm man.
It has to be embraced!
Embrace the paradigm that is RAII.
 
@StackedCrooked No.
the principle part of RAII is that the compiler does the work for you implicitly.
if you use a scope guard, you have to manually remember to scope guard in every place.
it's nothing more than manual free but it's better in a trivial fashion because it's exception-safe.
 
> manual free
 
you still have a giant pile of other maintainability problems.
 
2:07 PM
> exception-safe
 
BTW
CodeMentor sends mails titled "new chat message from X"
 
user1804599
Bracket FTW.
 
anyone about useless mails? :P
 
I applied yesterday but they haven't replied to me yet
 
they hand-pick candidates I think
 
2:16 PM
welp, hoping my three thousand answers speaks to something in my favour
 
hopefully
it's really ridiculous money when I think about it
 
is that like a freelance job?
 
@BartekBanachewicz How much did you charge per 15 minutes?
 
@Puppy $10.
 
hm
I think I set it at about £10/hour
which is about what I'd get in a juniour position here.
 
2:19 PM
I first set it at $5
 
if there's a lot of demand I can always put my rates up later.
 
and then looked at what others offer.
 
better to get a good reputation and it's enough money to start with
 
I think it gets better once you have some positive reviews
 
I think, anyway.
 
2:20 PM
@Puppy yeah
@AlexM. a bit.
Basically you help people ad-hoc for cash.
 
kinda like answering SO questions but the askers aren't shitfaced morons who want you to help them for free.
 
a code wending machine?
 
@Puppy yup.
That's why I think this business will kick off
 
and I also figure that if I get paid for it, it counts as professional experience.
 
I'd so not have to patience to deal with that, even for money lol
 
2:22 PM
@AlexM. I, for one, like helping/teaching people.
 
last time a colleague asked me to explain something I wanted to smack him after 2 mins
 
I really don't mind, if they've put some effort in.
and doubly so if they're paying for it.
 
I'm just not good with people :(
if you guys are, go for it, sure
 
@Puppy That's a shaky assumption :v
 
I mostly object when it's like, "i++ + ++i but I failed to Google it".
@CatPlusPlus If they're paying, I'm probably not complaining.
 
2:23 PM
@AlexM. haha well I am not sure if you could call me "good with people"
 
too much, anyway.
 
but I think I have a certain ability to communicate my knowledge to others.
and most importantly I like it.
 
I'd definitely appreciate teaching people some C++ that is not C with Classes.
 
Is all of boost c++ wanting to be C#?
 
no.
 
2:25 PM
no.
 
Yes, any shared or similar syntax anywhere is always someone wanting to be Microsoft.
 
ok watched a tutorial and got that feeling, it was probably meant for C# guys like me
 
@JohanLarsson Much of it predates (inclusion of similar classes with) C#, so you could argue that most of .NET is trying to make C# into C++.
 
I have added Django to my codementor profile
 
2:28 PM
been thinking about adding Lua to mine.
did it for some time
 
I did just add Lua too.
you can always say that you won't be able to help if someone asks for something more complicated.
I figure it's better that way than not getting any requests for it at all.
 
Can they order code reviews?
 
> I want to get started with Django. Walk through 2 full web app examples
well
@JohanLarsson there are options for long-term mentorships and you basically review what they do, mostly
 
If I inherit, say, std::pair, can I use using to define names for the first and second members of the pair?
 
A code review by a grumpy puppy is probably pretty awesome.
How do you want it? Grumpy, extra grumpy or raging?
 
2:33 PM
@rubenvb No.
 
@Puppy :-(
 
T& f() { return first; } is as close as you can get.
 
woah
the long-term requests are really nice
like, there's a lot of people who want to learn and they all seem reasonable
I should spend more time on that site.
 
@Puppy yeah, wanted to circumvent that :-/
 
and for polish rates, it's still absurd money
 
2:38 PM
well it's pretty decent money and I don't even charge much it seems.
just gonna see if they want me and if there's demand there
 
there's a lot of python requests right now
 
{standard input}:153091: Error: invalid operands (*UND* and .gcc_except_table._ZN12net_instaweb60ProxyInterfaceTest_UncacheableResourcesNotCachedOnProxy_Test8TestBodyEv sections) for `-'
g++: internal compiler error: Killed (program cc1plus)
 
flask/django/python in general
@Puppy I wonder if I could refer you somehow.
 
Flask is pretty easy to learn imo
 
if you don't get a response from them in a few days remind me and I'll contact them and ask if they accept referrals.
 
2:40 PM
If you guys would rate my C++ experience from 1-10, what would it be?
 
lol
 
honestly, you're not really in here enough for me to have an accurate picture.
 
OK. What did you rate yourself?
 
@rubenvb if 1 is ThePhD and 10 is Robot/Xeo...
 
2:41 PM
gave myself an 8 for now
 
@BartekBanachewicz Yeah, sounds about right :-P
I'll go with 6.
 
user1804599
> I ate my wife's placenta raw in a smoothie and cooked in a taco
 
You gotta love the internet.
 
@Puppy I gave myself an 8 too. I should probably drop that to 7 :P
 
@rightfold mmm taco
 
2:42 PM
@BartekBanachewicz what, in C++?
 
yeah.
 
I'd rate you more like 8.5-9
 
user1804599
 
user1804599
Doesn't look too bad TBH.
 
2:42 PM
I was thinking about going up to a 9 anyway.
you don't wanna write 10, of course.
 
Oh, you guys are giving each other grades. So cute.
 
@Puppy I was basing my own rating on my 4.44/5 brainbench score
 
I'll give my C a 5. Because well, it's just C++ but shittier.
 
@rightfold ¬_¬ that looks like just raw steak... that hasn't been aged
 
@rightfold Placentas are pretty nutritious really, eating them is super common across all mammals because it's nutritious.
 
user1804599
2:43 PM
I know, but I don't know whether they're tasty.
 
user1804599
And they're relatively rare as well.
 
honestly, there's no particular reason to eat it for a human since we already have plenty of nutritious food, but you could do if you wanted to.
 
@Puppy and stops them being smelt
 
@BartekBanachewicz where do you see the requests?
 
user1804599
@Puppy well, unless you don't.
 
2:44 PM
@Puppy waste not want not
 
@BartekBanachewicz I don't remember the brainbench stuff very well, but ISTR it was pretty light going.
 
@rubenvb If you write your C as a shittier C++, then you should probably rate it no higher than 2. Despite the syntactical similarity, well written C is quite different from C++.
 
user1804599
Not everyone lives in Vastly Superior Western Europeâ„¢.
 
at least, that's my vague memory of it.
 
@rightfold All hail the Southern Block and it's amazing geography skills!
 
user1804599
2:45 PM
Although the nutrition must come from some place. :v
 
user1804599
The woman must've eaten it.
 
@Puppy link to your profile?
 
@JerryCoffin If GSL and other C interfacing libraries are any benchmark of what good C code looks like, I think I'll manage :-P. Anyways, too late now, I already submitted. I'll change it later :-)
 
@JohanLarsson I don't have one yet, they haven't responded to my application yesterday.
 
@JohanLarsson top bar, "long-term requests"
@Puppy Xeo had like 4.9 because he made one mistake IIRC
 
2:46 PM
@BartekBanachewicz prolly behind login then
 
@JohanLarsson I suppose so.
 
well, I personally feel like I'm pretty on par with robot and xeo
 
> I am 42 years old and work in financial services.
I have no prior programming experience.
I have commenced learning python (2.7). I intend on learning Flask and front end after this.
My goal is NOT to change careers, but rather to be able to have the tools to build out/prototype any business ideas that I have.
I am working through some tutorials for python on Udemy/Learn Python the Hard way etc.
The problem I have is one of discipline and a lack of guidance as to my learning objectives.
 
Is it not the customers who rate the experts?
 
you rate yourself to begin with
 
2:48 PM
Or other experts idk, self rating seems a bit strange
 
@Puppy but that's a private rating vOv
it's not shown in your profile
 
@Puppy What did you write for your profile text?
 
erm
don't quite remember
 
you should be able to review your application
that's how a small profile looks
 
30 dollars per 15 minutes lol
 
2:50 PM
told ya.
 
eh
I'll raise my rates when I have too much demand
 
CodeMentor looks like an evil tutoring company that charges a lot of money for something one should be able to get for quite a lot less though.
 
I dunno, AFAIK personal tutorage has always been comparitively expensive
 
@rubenvb not really. Long-term mentorships have lower rates in general, and the website gradually reduces provisions (like freelancer.com does)
the /15min price is ad-hoc help
 
How much does te site take?
 
2:53 PM
How is the time spent determined?
 
@JohanLarsson up to 20%
@rubenvb the main way to communicate are shared screen/webcam sessions
but they've also introduced "offline help" recently.
 
Ah, ugh. I'd prefer giving offline help though.
lol we'll see. Gimmick be gimmicky
Also, Israel is really crossing a line these days.
It's getting to be quite ridiculous.
 
@rubenvb latency vOv
 
they're really starting to lose support from the other nations I feel.
 
I really hope so.
(dutch, but you know, basic translation skills) standaard.be/cnt/dmf20140724_01190234
 
2:55 PM
> these days
 
I don't really know that much about the situation but Israel refusing to accept a two-state solution seems very bad to me.
 
Let's attack UN buildings
Let's attack the world.
F Fuck's S.
(they're still counting fucks per hour, right?)
 
uh oh
i have a pending request from 2 days ago :/
 
oh dear
 
You lost the game
 
2:57 PM
You'll get fired.
 
I've clicked "I want to help" now vOv
 
Expected time to reply: FOREVER
 
@Puppy Quite a few others seem to agree. nytimes.com/2014/07/24/world/middleeast/…
 
@CatPlusPlus :D
well those requests are in general "non-panic" I suppose
2 days could be not that bad.
> Budget: $160/hr
if this site grows I might well stop working regularly :P
 
lol
 
3:06 PM
lol this question looks like it's a dupe
 
> So, if flying probably won't kill you, what actually might? Bear with me here. (There are one to three bear-related deaths per year in the US).
@LightnessRacesinOrbit lol
 
Everyone who'd like to contribute I've asked a new meta question and I'd like your opinion/input. I know some of us here like people posting these here and some don't (sorry Puppy) but deal with it :)
 
> Debugger visualizers: Natvis debugger visualization files can be added to a Visual C++ project for easy management and source control integration. Natvis files that are added to a project will take evaluation precedence over visualizers outside the project.
fucking finally.
 
I only have one more GoT to watch
@BartekBanachewicz I can't clear the name from his revision history, I would if I could. This is "minimizing the witch hunt" as I'd really like to focus on fixing the problem rather than focusing on a specific instance. Any suggestions welcome. — Benjamin Gruenbaum 2 mins ago
eh? just put a white bar over it like you did with all the other names
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit the linked revision history still just shows the name.
 
3:12 PM
@LightnessRacesinOrbit he linked to revision history
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit EVERYONE DIES!
 
@rubenvb so what? then don't obfuscate any of it. none of this is an answer to what Bartek pointed out which is that he left just one name unobfuscated.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum India strikes again
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit he forgot and is lazy. Sue him.
 
s/obfuscated/redacted/
 
3:14 PM
It's not an inquiry.
 
@rubenvb why doesn't he just say that then -.- the reply comment is totally confusing
 
@ParkYoung-Bae It'd be great if we could keep this about SO and not about race...
 
@BartekBanachewicz No.
 
3:15 PM
@BenjaminGruenbaum You racistphobe!
 
lol
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum Typical Jew reaction
 
I get along with everyone, except racists.
 
@ParkYoung-Bae oh god
 
@ParkYoung-Bae I see you're getting bored of not being banned
 
3:16 PM
@ParkYoung-Bae Typical <fill in local minority here> reaction
 
@ParkYoung-Bae you're just like Hitler, as in you both have a mustache.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum you're just making him want to go on
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum You're just like Hitler in that you're literally Hitler.
 
If a highly-rated answer becomes community wiki, do you lose the rep you gained for it before that happened?
 
@rubenvb I thought CW died a long time ago?
 
3:17 PM
@Puppy Hitler is literally Hitler.
 
@Puppy oh, must have missed that.
 
@Puppy crap you've found me
 
@SamDeHaan Now that I think of it, I haven't been suspended in a long time indeed. Like a month?
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum By the way, may I commend you on your surprising longevity? You must be like, 120 by now.
 
@Puppy it's because I drink cool aid.
 
3:19 PM
3
A: What events trigger an answer to become community wiki?

animusonThere are no longer any automated triggers that will turn an answer into a community wiki. The only methods that an answer will become a community wiki are now: The person who posts the answer checks the community wiki box. A moderator manually converts it to community wiki for whatever reason....

Here it is.
 
@BartekBanachewicz heh
 
@rubenvb Have you hovered over the house picture in the linked blog? :)
 
CW triggers were the stupidest thing ever
Good riddance
 
-1: Well-written question but I disagree that we should do anything here. — Lightness Races in Orbit 5 mins ago
@Ben: +1, then, but still see my answer. — Lightness Races in Orbit 37 secs ago
@LightnessRacesinOrbit you're confusing me now...
 
@ParkYoung-Bae I think that's against the Lounge rules somehow.
 
3:22 PM
@SamDeHaan What is?
 
@ParkYoung-Bae you going that long without a suspension. It must be in the by-laws
 
Oh. I think it's only directly related to my usage of words such as "faggot" or "nigger" and the presence of LRIO in the room.
 
faggot
 
Come on Tony that's my line
 
temptations were above 9000
 
3:27 PM
@BenjaminGruenbaum see the comment in between those two...
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit will do
 
Apr 24 at 11:23, by Lightness Races in Orbit
we're famous (last image title)
Also thanks for cropping out my comment from directly above @Xeo's. Twat.
 
Xeo
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Teehee
 
> Those people are far too well-to-do to have come from the Lounge.
What does that even mean?
 
3:30 PM
I eat chickens, is that racism against the chickens?
 
@chmod711telkitty It would be if you only ate chickens of a certain race.
For example, I'm a rice racist, because I prefer brown rice.
(ricist?)
 
@FredOverflow ricinist!
 
dat flag
 
I'm having beans in 10 minutes. It's bean a while...
Will C++ lambdas ever get concise syntax like x => x + 1? Are there proposals?
 
Yes it's called C#
 
3:35 PM
@FredOverflow Not sure whether that's a nice racist or a nascent ricist.
 
Haha even more syntax in C++, great idea
 
@FredOverflow There was [](x) {return x;}. Not sure if it's completely died out or not.
 
@chris I want a syntax without the block and the return keyword.
 
what does the [] do?
 
Forget about it, never gonna happen
 
3:37 PM
@JohanLarsson lambda introducer and capture list
 
I do prefer C#'s terseness, really.
 
Last thing C++ needs is even more ambiguity in the grammar
 
But every other language has x => x + 1 lambdas dammit :(
Even Java is nicer in this respect than C++ ffs.
 
Can't have it all
But pls modules
 
@FredOverflow I get what you mean @FredOverflow ... all those racists who only eat white meat ...
 
3:39 PM
Java's are different.
x -> x + 1
 
big deal, -> instead of =>
x -> x <- x    // tests whether x is negative lol
 
Java's are arrower
 
They couldn't afford the fat arrow.
 
@FredOverflow Inb4 "what does the -> <- operator do"
 
x => x <= x
 
3:41 PM
@JohanLarsson You can shorten that to true.
 
@chris Should we ask-prank on SO? :)
 
already been done I think
 
@FredOverflow Wait until April Fools. Oh wait, it's forever from now.
 
abusing the std::string
good morning
 
3:43 PM
We are upgrading our HAProxy install to the latest code - there should be no user impact.
 
I wish someone could invent a compiler that compiles more than 1 language, so I could potentially throw in templates, regex, reflection, lambdas in one chuck of code ...
 
It's called Katahdin
 
then I can write everything in html :D
 
@chmod711telkitty ewww
 
0
Q: What does the -> <- operator do?

FredOverflowI recently came upon the following code: IntPredicate neg = x -> x <- x; What is this, some sort of reverse double lambda?

 
3:46 PM
You need to get out more
 
how do I get clients to stop being dumb?
 
@FredOverflow This should be interesting.
 
@Crow Impossible
 
Wait, if C++ was like those other languages, we wouldn't have beard smileys.
That's a deal breaker.
 
@chris What's a beard smiley?
 
3:49 PM
@Crow get smart ones to start with? ... wait, they wouldn't be your client in that case :p
 
Xeo asked that one
 
@Crow Become independently wealthy, so you no longer need or have any clients?
 
220
Q: What is this smiley-with-beard expression: "<:]{%>"?

XeoI came across the following program, which compiles without errors or even warnings: int main(){ <:]{%>; // smile! } Live example. What does the program do, and what is that smiley-expression?

 
@chmod711telkitty well, I am only a college student intern so yeah. But seriously people come here with NO idea
 
@JerryCoffin what if you are an attention whore?
 
3:50 PM
int main(){
  <:]{%>; // smile!
}
oh good god
 
@chmod711telkitty What if you are?
 
then you need clients regardless whether you are independently wealthy ...
 
I still like Richard Smith's proposal
 
I am an attention whore
 
Guess it got accepted, too. No more trigraphs in C++17.
 
3:52 PM
also you can try to charge your dumb clients more
 
@chris That won't affect the beards, right?
 
@FredOverflow Nope, the beards are still good to go.
But no WTF operator :(
doSomething() ??!??! fail(); is almost more expressive than doSomething() || fail();
 
Scala has a ??? operator. It means throw new UnsupportedOperationException :)
 

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