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@HovercraftFullOfEels almost certainly spam but I'm definitely not willing to click on the link to find out!
 
@Nick ^ that's the problem
 
Why would that be spam?
It's VLQ but I see nothing that would even indicate this was meant as spam
 
The whole question is clickbait. If you don't click the link, you can't answer the question.
 
I clicked the link, but nothing happened
It was a legitimate link. I believe it's a vimeo version of YT streaming API. I don't see any reason why anyone would click the link (it's m3u8 after all) but the URL wasn't misleading in any way. Probably it should have been formatted as code and not as a link
That's a declined spam flag from me. (if I were a mod)
 
12:40 AM
Is that SD report NAA - there's sort of an answer if you remove the links but all the code is on the other end of the links...
 
 
2 hours later…
dbc
3:11 AM
@Yatin The question is specifically about taking a screen shot of the Windows Phone 8 for developers, see this link from the answer. So this sort of might be on topic.
 
@dbc Oh
@Yatin @Machavity please trash this request. The question might be on-topic.
 
@cigien Spoken like a true Python programmer! :-)
 
@AdrianMole :D
 
Thank you :)
 
3:43 AM
^ spam
 
Someone upvoted it.. :)
 
@Scratte Maybe they wanted an offshore investment licence?
 
Is there a meta about how Samuel's Bad Review chat room works? I can't find anything, and there's no information in the FAQ for that room.
 
4:02 AM
@cigien No. It was just posted in here at some point I think. Most rooms don't have a meta about how they work :)
 
@Scratte Right, but most rooms have something like a FAQ , right? What do you mean by posted in here? There's something about this in the SOCVR transcript?
 
I'm not even sure this one has a meta about how it works.
@cigien Yes, I assume Samuel posted a link in here when the room was created.
But.. there are links to the Bad Reviews room from a meta post about fixing triage. I'll find it.
 
Thanks, that would be very helpful.
 
If you come across an especially bad review, you can post a link to it in Sam's room, along with a brief explanation of why you think it warrants moderator attention. Then, something may or may not happen; Sam (or, indeed, another mod) may or may not reply to you.
 
4:07 AM
You can also use the room to 'appeal' if you have been granted a review vacation, though you can also do that on Meta.
 
@Scratte That looks like it. Thanks so much.
 
Or if you know of someone that was suspended, you can appeal on their behalf..
But, I'm not sure about no information in the room. It says "Room to discuss and report incorrect Stack Overflow reviews. Avoid one-boxing please."
 
I'm going to read that meta of course, but is this possibly why I was suspended from reviewing once for 16 days, with no warning? Is it just me, or is this system completely opaque to most reviewers? I'm looking at the links people are sharing in that room, and several are blatantly wrong. What's the accountability process for that? Do users get suspended from sharing links in that room? At first glance it looks like that needs to be done to several users.
@AdrianMole And how is one supposed to know about this option?
 
@cigien I just told you.
 
OK Adrian, we're going to need you to personally contact every new user that gains a review privilege and fill them in.
 
4:15 AM
@AdrianMole That's true, you just did. I hope you're doing this for the millions of users.
Ah, I see Ian spotted the flaw with Adrian's approach :)
 
To be fair, I'm pretty sure I learned about that room from Adrian too, about 4 months ago.
So it could work.
 
@cigien The thing is that moderators can suspend any user that's done a wrong review at any point. However there are way too many reviews done for anyone to be able to keep up. So if you notice a review that's really wrong, you can paste it in the room for a moderator to look at it.
 
1 is an anecdote, 2 is data, I always say.
 
... 3 is evidence.
 
4 is Adrian's Eighth Law of Reviewerdynamics
 
4:18 AM
But as AdrianMole pointed out, it's a paste it and forget about it. I've never had a reply from a moderator about any action they took on a review I pasted in there.
 
@Scratte Sure, I see the benefit for users who want to catch bad reviewers, but what about the bad reviewers? Do they know what happened, and that they can appeal it?
 
Moderators don't generally 'announce' any review suspensions they impose. Probably against de roolz.
 
@cigien The reviewer gets a notice about their suspension. Which is a huge improvement already. When I was suspended I wasn't even told about it. I had to actively find the URL that told me :D
 
Since a few months ago, users who get review suspensions get notified in their inbox, and can see an explanation of why/what in place of their normal review menu. IIRC.
Even ninjas who get vacations. :-)
 
I like to think that I take constructive feedback pretty well. When I got suspended, I spent a fair amount of time trying to figure out what I'd done wrong, and why I was suspended for a length that should be applied for the 3rd suspension, and I couldn't work it out. If it turns out that it was because of this "reporting" system, well, that's going to upset me.
 
4:22 AM
I believe that the meta you're reading now has a lot of indirect information that one can appeal a suspension. Note that most users probably don't go and look at meta. I expect some will not read a linked meta even if it's in the suspension-notice.
@cigien Look at it this way: If doesn't really matter if the review was reported or not. If your review was wrong, how a moderator came by it doesn't really matter, does it?
I mean, if I'm breaking the law and someone calls the police or some police officer just happen to catch me, doesn't change the fact that I'm breaking the law :)
But the entire appeal system is not very transparent. I don't think a lot of users do that. They did when that meta post was featured. Which it was for a very very long time.
 
@Scratte Well, it does matter. There are stated rules about how suspensions are applied, and when. If there's someone behind the curtain applying suspensions as they see fit, in a way that's different from the stated rules, and the fact that that's happening is not made clear, that's not right.
 
@cigien You mean a suspension due to reviewing "Looks OK" on a "HowTo" post?
 
@cigien indeed, that's like getting a penalty for drug trafficking when you were jaywalking :)
Of course, in some countries, jaywalking might actually be the more serious offence
 
As in the reviewer took the correct action in your opinion? But is handed a suspension because a moderator doesn't like the post that was OK'ed?
@Nick Sugar is a drug ;)
 
@Scratte No, I think I was suspended for clicking the option for "Needs community edit", when the post needed fixing by the OP. I looked it up, and I had reviewed things incorrectly. It's not the suspension that I'm upset about, that was correct. It's the duration of the suspension. I was told I would be suspended for 2 days IIRC, and that I could correct my behavior. My first suspension was for 16 days instead, and that's what I have an issue with.
 
4:29 AM
@Scratte but its legal, like some of my other favourite things e.g. booze, at least in my country
 
@Nick Yes. Good point :) So is nicotine and caffeine.
@cigien The user that reports the link have no control over what penalty is imposed or if any penalty is imposed at all. That's up to the moderator to decide. Even if someone posted a link to the review you got suspended for, they never asked for a 16 day suspension for you.
At some point a moderator went through the Triage reviews daily and mass-suspended users with no other users involved at all.
 
@Scratte Sorry, I'm not complaining about any users, or even the moderators for that matter. I'm only complaining about the lack of transparency about this system.
To be fair, my tone does make it look like I'm complaining about users. Sorry about that. I'll step back, finish reading that meta, and come back to this discussion with a cooler head.
 
@cigien I'm not sure we need it to be more transparent than: If you're reviewing wrong and someone notices, you may get suspended from reviewing for some amount of days. If you're caught by the system in audits, there's a preset set of days for your first suspension that's doubled every time.
@cigien No worries :) Take your time :)
 
@Scratte "... and someone notices ..." I have no recollection of seeing any such language when reviewing.
 
@cigien That's just the same as with everything else. If you post an off-topic post.. it will be closed, if someone notices.
For a manual suspension, someone will have to notice, no? :) Whether that's a moderator directly or a user that either 1. Posts a link or 2. Flags you.. that's just two different ways. At least if they post a link, you can track it down.
 
4:39 AM
@Scratte No, that's not the same thing. The difference is the scale of the "punishment". The analogy here would be, your off-topic post could get closed, and if someone notices, you might get a question ban.
 
@cigien I don't think that's a good analogy. I agree that your first suspension was too long. Mine was 4 days. I didn't start reviewing again after the 4 days though, since I didn't understand much. I had to dig through meta for months before I was comfortable doing it again.
The reason I do not like this analogy is that 1. After your suspension you're only one small step closer to a permanent ban (Your Question ban analogy) and 2. You don't get a Question ban as soon as your first post is closed. You get a notification and you're free to dig up information about why this happened.
It's also way easier to get a Question ban than a permanent review ban :D
 
Ok, sorry, I don't mean to stop discussing this, but I'm going to pause for now. I can feel myself getting upset about this, and that's not conducive to a productive conversation. I'll be back in a bit, no worries :)
 
OK. Sorry about that. If you want, you can scream at me in the Ministry.. :) Or in my room.
 
I don't want to scream at you. In any room. That's what brown paper bags are for ;)
 
Heh.. Ok :) But you can if you need to scream at someone/anyone, that's what I'm saying :)
 
4:47 AM
Not my preference, but I do appreciate the offer :D
 
5:46 AM
@IanCampbell Re the latest comment you posted, I don't see the affiliation in the shared links, at least as far as the contributors to the linked articles are concerned.
 
I'd be happy to discuss my concerns in another room.
 
Sure. Charcoal?
@JimGarrison I'm not sure I see a standard close reason in there. Could you please add a standard close reason to cv-pls requests?
 
I know the h word showed up in the request, but that question, to me, is 1) requesting a library, (the title is literally "suggest an algorithm") and 2) seems unclear because the "perl hash" is not described.
 
6:01 AM
@IanCampbell Sure, and "Seeking Recs", and "Needs Clarity" are both standard close reasons. What does that have to do with what I asked Jim?
 
More of a reaction to comment under the answer, but I'm probably misunderstanding.
 
@IanCampbell Ah I see. That's fair. The question seems reasonably clear to me, and it's definitely not requesting a library; that's not what "suggest an algorithm" means to me at least. Hence my comment under the answer. But I'm not disputing the closure here per se, I'm just trying to understand why the close reason in the cv-pls is not a close reason at all.
 
If I knew enough perl to write a perl hash of those network edges, and could reformulate the question to be, "How can I determine all of the unconnected communities in this graph in perl?", I'd be all for it.
 
@IanCampbell Isn't that what edit are all about? :)
 
Hey, one language at a time buddy, I'm working on C++
Now there is only an tag, I don't know what to do. I give up!
 
6:17 AM
@IanCampbell That's great :) You're expanding from R to C++? Next you'll be doing Java :D
 
Well, I only have 3 more votes until gold , I'll need another goal or I'll get board.
 
You could also join @AdrianMole in learning Haskell :)
 
Plus, plus, C++ is a logical extension of R
(Don't tell anyone, but I don't even know what Haskell is)
 
Haskell is like Swift for beginners. :-)
 
@IanCampbell If you feel like editing, go for it, I don't have strong feelings either way about this question. The reason I'm bringing it up is the homework meta, and the fact that Robert Harvey and I are going around in circles. Take a look at the latest comment from them under their answer, in particular, "Close voters must still use the set of close reasons that are provided to them, and the guidance in bullet 4 is not one of those close reasons".
I'm claiming that in fact, that bullet is used often by users to close questions, as evinced by Jim's cv-pls. Unfortunately, every time I bring it up, my question is completely ignored, and other reasons are used to justify the closure. While those reasons might be valid, my point is that they are post-hoc. I just wish users would admit they are using that bullet to close questions, and then there would be some hope that we could resolve the issue.
 
6:19 AM
Functional programming language :)
@AdrianMole How is it going with the learning? Or was it a joke that you started doing it?
 
Temporary hiatus.
 
@AdrianMole are any of those books in the canonical C++ post any good?
 
Sometimes temporary means a very long time ;)
 
I'm tempted to buy a... gasp... book
 
Dunno. I never really read a book on C++. I only read one about C, and just winged it from there.
If there are any by Bjarne Starstruck (or whatever the name is), I'd probably go with that.
 
6:23 AM
Yes, that is what I've been attempting to do, wing it. We'll see how that goes for me. It's not like I learned R from a book.
 
Just do a basic online tutorial and read all of AdrianMole's Answers :) You'll have wings soon enough.
 
I know I was supposed to read the C++ answers, but I got distracted by the Plant Cell papers.
 
Plants are nice :) Sometimes they're a little blurry.
 
I don't think I've ever seen a question go from -4 to -2 like that before.
 
It looks like insta-voting and then reading it. Kind of the opposite way of how I vote.
 
6:39 AM
Well, it was also edited in the grace period
@Scratte congratulations on 3000 helpful flags. That's a milestone.
 
@IanCampbell Thank you. That was actually a while ago :) I've taken a flag-break since.
I think you're going to get that dupe hammer today :O Only 9 months old and already Gold!
 
7:22 AM
sdc alive
 
7:39 AM
@PraveenKumarPurushothaman Are you about?
 
8:11 AM
@Scratte About what? 🤔
 
@PraveenKumarPurushothaman Could you take a look at this? You have a hammer in those tags, and there's a suggested dupe target in the comments.
 
@PraveenKumarPurushothaman Means "Are you here :)"
Yes.. some question as cigien's :)
 
You did a better job of asking it though :)
 
It was already prepared :)
My plan A failed btw..
 
@cigien Sorted.
@Scratte LoL. Okay. Hi.
 
8:16 AM
@Scratte Ah well, it was worth a shot. Thanks for trying.
 
How strange. It said the javascript tag was used as the dupe hammer.
 
@PraveenKumarPurushothaman Thanks.
 
Thank you :)
 
8:18 AM
Whattey crazy JS answer!
OMG hats are gone but @Scratte you still have! It's unfair!
 
@Scratte Why is that strange?
 
@PraveenKumarPurushothaman I had a double hat.. :)
@cigien I expected the jQuery to be used, since the target doesn't have javaScript.
 
@Scratte Oh, I see. No, the tags on the target don't matter at all. One doesn't need to have a hammer in any of them in fact, only the ones on the dupe. And I suppose it picks the tag one has more points in, so it picked Javascript, even though Praveen has a hammer in jquery as well.
 
I see. But then that widens the option for finding hammerers :)
@PraveenKumarPurushothaman Which one?
I tested the ones on the duplicate. Only one of them is idempotent.
 
@Scratte I'm not sure that it does. When I use my c++ hammer the target almost always has that tag. Sometimes it has c though, so you might be right.
 
8:31 AM
@cigien If the javascript tag was enough, then anyone with either could hammer it, no? PraveenKumarPurushothaman happens to have a lot of those golden tags :)
 
@Scratte Aah, that's why you were worried about finding a hammer. That makes a lot more sense. I was wondering what the issue was, I was fairly sure there were a bunch of javascript hammers around the place :p
 
Today I learned that if a post has been hammered and you don't have a badge in the question's tags, you can edit in a tag you do have, change the dup target, and edit out your tag. I wonder if people do that.
Anyway, I'm off for the night. See you tomorrow.
 
Night :)
 
@Scratte The Dupe I just dupe-hammered.
 
user10563627
8:47 AM
hi
 
user10563627
whats going on
 
business as usual
 
user10563627
yeah how's going on everything good?
 
it is good enough.
 
9:13 AM
Is this question suitable for SO or does it need more focus (or is general computing)?
 
@JeanneDark ansible scripting probably is on-topic. Is at the devops end of things you can do. devops.se is an alternative. The answer is NAA, the questions is on-topic.
 
@rene Thanks. I wasn't sure if it was maybe too broad.
 
I read it as an How to question and I don't want to be tangled up in a discussion whether it is or not and whether those need attempts or not. The question is not awesome.
 
9:31 AM
@gnat That looks very focused. OP wants to get the timestamps spaced every 5 minutes starting from the first one.
 
 
1 hour later…
10:47 AM
@cigien questions like this get tens different answers at Code Golf, even when additionally strictly limited in scope to meet their site requirements (objective winning criteria etc etc). If this isn't need more focus then I don't know what is
 
111,000 - it has a nice ring to it
 
@Nick congrats :P
 
thanks :)
 
11:13 AM
@rene didn't I post a cvpls for stackoverflow.com/q/65593246/2943403 ? I don't see it. My connection is bad. Maybe it didn't make it to the chat room.
 
@mickmackusa now eligible for del-pls
 
@Nick nice birds of paradise avatar
 
@mickmackusa obviously not .. I'm happy to blame your connection ...
 
11:32 AM
@mickmackusa thanks - decided I was not focused enough before :)
 
12:11 PM
 
12:27 PM
@JeanneDark I have edited an accepted answer with the new links. What should be done with the new answer now which is no more than redundant?
 
I guess it can be deleted.
 
@AmitJoshi Isn't the answer a NAA anyways?
 
1:01 PM
Morning
 
@Nick flower avatars are the mark of the best SO users. I'll get there one day.
 
@Braiam I was bit confused whether the question should be closed as recommendation or broad. I choose broad but other close reason looks applicable as well. If that is the case, providing the links in answer invalidates the NAA flag. So, instead of flagging NAA, I choose custom mod flag.
 
@Braiam After the edit definitely. But before - when the accepted answer#s links are broken and the new links do work and the question can be answered purely by posting links to external resources, then it's not necessarily NAA.
 
1:31 PM
@JeanneDark In which case the question should be closed and the focus on the answers is unwarranted ;)
 
@Braiam See my cv request.
 
@JeanneDark May be my fault then. I shouldn't have edited that answer in first place.
 
Yeah, the question isn't MRE. Without the answers, it no longer has a purpose so the whole thing had to go
 
@JeanneDark Yes, I know, but we should strive to edit questions to fix issues when we are able to do so.
@Machavity Eh? It isn't a debugging question.
 
1:47 PM
@Braiam Fair enough. Converted the answer to a comment since it's link only
 
2:02 PM
@Dharman Your flag yesterday (the downvoter comment) was more successful? It's gone now.
 
Yeah, it got marked helpful. It must have been a bug or a mod mistake. The comment definitely needed to go.
 
Thanks! Good to know.
 
Mods don't make mistakes. At best they are teasing us to see if we pay attention ...
 
No, my flags are mod audits ;)
21
 
Have the pin for 6 to 8 hours
 
2:09 PM
BRB declining all outstanding Jeanne Dark flags
 
suspends @Machavity from the mod-queue ...
2
 
Does this mean that there was only one editor for a year?
 
New curation metric: the number of questions asked on Meta SO regarding a moderator's mistake in flag handling.
 
@AnnZen Why did you change the OP's code? I understand that you tried to help them, but I feel it changed the OP's intent
 
2:20 PM
@DoubleExpresso nope, I was careful
 
@AnnZen It has barely been 6 days.
 
so it begins at new year?
 
Every year begins with Western New Year which is currently set to 1st of January.
In some cultures the year starts on a different date, but Stack Overflow uses Gregorian calendar.
 
@Dharman So the year tab doesn't calculate last year's edits, right?
 
It only shows the current year.
When you hover over it tells you the start date
 
2:24 PM
@AnnZen Still, the edits should not change the code. Can we have a third opinion?
 
@DoubleExpresso Why should the edits not change the code? I just removed all code from a question
 
@DoubleExpresso I merely removed irrelevant parts.
@DoubleExpresso The OP even agreed stackoverflow.com/questions/65596971/…
 
@DoubleExpresso assuming we now have a question with an MCVE and the intent of the code didn't change, iow didn't solve / hide the actual problem, shouldn't that be considered a win? Note that this only flies if you have full edit privileges. In a review queue that probably gets rejected.
 
But then we have to read both versions of a subpar question to figure out if the intent changed...
that's twice the debugging work
 
@rene Ok, thanks
 
2:38 PM
plus we still need to be psychics if there was missing information in the question :P
 
@AndrasDeak I have a question for all you psychics out there.
 
@TylerH the answer is yes
 
2:56 PM
How does that SD report how to calclute sum from FILE in c with values in commas needs more focus?
 
@Scratte codeword for requirement dump
but surely you know that
 
So.. it's actually focused?
 
yes, it's too localized
 
Get values from file and add them. How is that too narrow?
 
Not sure how to handle this one stackoverflow.com/questions/65597989/…
 
2:59 PM
@Scratte did you ever need to do that? Me neither :P
> Also addition of 1st element of each values such that:
I guess that's why it can also be too broad: they want two programs written from scratch
 
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