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9:00 PM
@Jefffrey Hint, that's your claim. And not the almost part
 
building image of women as unreasonable, irksome, annoying, easily offended beings
congra-fucking-lations
 
congra lations?
 
@BartekBanachewicz Only among people who already want to see women as such
 
@jalf bullshit.
 
lol
 
9:01 PM
No reasonable woman around me would agree this whole thing was necessary
 
Here's the deal: a pretty big part of ESA's mission is to attract people to STEM fields. You don't do that by alienating women on national TV.
 
Alienating what
 
nobody alienated noone jesus
 
Where's the alienation?
 
@Bartek I like how you qualified that with "reasonable woman".
 
9:01 PM
Right, so people objected to it for no reason?
 
they did that themselves by fucking raging over a fucking shirt
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes No true scotswoman
 
@jalf Most women were not alienated. Silent majority, etc.
 
Scotsperson, please.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I know woman I don't consider reasonable and I won't speak about theri behaviour, obviously.
 
9:02 PM
Why would any women be alienated by such a t-shirt.
6
 
@BartekBanachewicz A lot of the criticism was from science teachers who felt that they could not in good conscience show this footage to their students.
 
because we have a fashion for being offended
 
It's like if I was alienated by a t-shirt displaying semi-naked men.
 
it's cool to be offended these days
 
9:02 PM
Or whore men, or whatever they are called.
Any person with an "adult" mentality wouldn't give a shit about the t-shirt the guy wore. No matter what it displayed.
 
@jalf the students should be left with their own understanding of the message. Or lack of it
 
@Bartek it's not about people being offended.
Don't build strawperson arguments.
 
then what is it about?
 
here's a crazy idea: look at your own fucking reactions, and tell me why a woman would go into a field where people act like this
 
OMG reason.
 
9:04 PM
ACT LIKE WHAT
 
He stopped to wonder what it is about.
 
I could argue that a t-shirt with a swastika would make me raise my eyebrows, but even then I wouldn't give a flying fuck.
 
@jalf oh and why a man would?
 
@jalf my reaction to something I consider an overreaction? Yes, I consider it dumb.
 
user1804599
 
9:04 PM
"Oh no, someone indicated that perhaps women would be more comfortable in a professional environment where they weren't reduced to sexual imagery. This is unacceptable, and anyone who thinks like this is wrong and must be driven away"
 
oh god
 
@BartekBanachewicz What is the overreaction? That people pointed out that the shirt was inappropriate for an appearance on national TV?
 
who is reducing women to sexual imagery
WHO
 
@Jefffrey women who call that shirt sexual imagery
 
@Jefffrey the guy wearing that shirt, and making the comments he made
 
9:05 PM
Also consider that everyone else in the room wore ESA attire.
 
@jalf what comments
 
If he'd been bullied and harassed and threatened, that would be an overreaction. But did that happen?
 
@jalf yeah, a 10 of people pointed that out - so fucking what?
 
@jalf I pretty fucking sure it did
 
WHAT FUCKING COMMENTS
 
9:06 PM
@BartekBanachewicz Could you show me?
 
@jalf Here's the real deal: women aren't all the same. Anything he says, does (or yes, wears) is almost certain to alienate at least a few of them. Some were, but there seems to be zero evidence that it's anywhere close to a majority of all women, or that it has or will reduce the number of women entering STEM by even 1.
 
finally home - looooong weekend that was
 
@jalf Because feminists these days literally go so overboard with being offended and objectified that I literally don't even.
@jalf I suppose you'd call that reasonable defensive reactions, eh?
 
I just linked to an article which tried to collect the actual responses, and which indicated that there were very few that crossed the line. Most were fairly reasonable
@BartekBanachewicz Uh, that's what you are doing
And you still haven't shown me where the evil "feminists" did it
 
@jalf I see no problem in that t-shirt except that maybe it's not "professional looking".
 
9:07 PM
I hate that article. It's a bunch of tweets strewn together.
Weird.
 
I see no offence whatsoever in that t-shirt.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I couldn't make much sense of it
 
It's not about people being offended.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes sure, but that's kind of unavoidable if your goal is to collect what happened on twitter, isn't it? :p
 
It's not?
Oh.
THEN WHAT IS IT
 
9:08 PM
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Was it fun?
 
@Jefffrey Good for you. I don't see how it is relevant whether or not you take offense to anything though
 
@jalf no, I mean that the author's own content is in tweets not "normal prose".
Tweetetry.
 
@jalf I don't see anything offensive in the t-shirt.
 
is there any smoking hot feminist out there?
 
@TonyTheLion It had its moments
 
9:08 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes Yeah, true. Let's call it a sequence of tweets then, instead of an article. :p
 
@AlexM. Don't be such a misogynist.
 
@Jefffrey I don't see how that is relevant
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Nice
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit you're a tarp.
 
It's not about people being offended.
 
9:09 PM
@Jefffrey Even the Che? :(
 
@jalf What is "that"?
 
Isn't that on the starboard already?
 
@Jefffrey That you see nothing offensive in the t-shirt
 
@jalf How is it not relevant?
 
user1804599
lol arguing about a T-shirt
3
 
9:09 PM
@jalf The fact that any woman (except perhaps his wife, GF, etc.) thinks it's their business to tell him what he should or shouldn't wear, under any circumstances, beyond what's required by applicable laws, regulation, dress codes, etc., is crossing the line. Their simply going so far as to say: "that's inappropriate" is, in and of itself, inappropriate behavior that none of us should tolerate. His sex is irrelevant here.
 
If only I had popcorn
 
user1804599
or people wearing stuff they like to wear
 
I'm pretty sure that there was no raging mob forcing him at gunpoint to apologize because "Jeffrey from the C++ lounge found his shirt offensive"
 
user1804599
who cares
 
@jalf Me and you are talking about the fact that apparently that t-shirt objectify women somehow and I say that I don't see it.
 
user1804599
9:10 PM
@TonyTheLion steal it from Michael Jackson
 
Hence, whether or not you found it offensive is irrelevant
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes It's become very much that. However, for people like you and I (presumably) it's about wearing a shirt like that for no reason at all in a place where you should be professional. However, good luck with the "professionalism" argument in the Lounge...
 
@JerryCoffin lol you're such a sexist
 
What is "objectify"?
 
How is that irrelevant that fact that I don't see the problem you are describing.
 
9:10 PM
@curiousguy RUN!!!!!1
 
e.g.
I will fight this "professionalism" disease as fiercely as I can till the day I die. — Cat Plus Plus May 16 at 23:37
:)
 
It's the most relevant fucking thing in our discussion.
 
@Jefffrey Because the issue is not whether or not you see the problem
Breaking news, the world does not revolve around you
As shocking as it may seem
 
Am I saying so?
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit lol
 
9:11 PM
When is woman treated as an object, except in anti-porn and anti-prostitution rants?
 
I'm asking you to show the problem you are pinging me about.
 
I'm a geocentrist.
 
How the fuck is that irrelevant.
 
@Jefffrey You are saying that the most relevant fucking thing in our discussion is whether or not you see any offense in a t-shirt
 
Just saying.
 
9:11 PM
@Abyx I guess it's sexist for me to believe they shouldn't tell him what to wear any more than some man should be allowed to dictate that all women should wear Burkas.
 
Love me some epicycles.
 
We're all "objects".
 
@jalf Yes. If I don't see the problem you are trying to describe to me, then there's no base for a discussion.
 
Space boats on epicycles!
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Cool. I liked Spirographs when I was a kid too.
 
9:12 PM
@JerryCoffin worry not, nowadays everything is sexist
 
Except I never had the patience to finish most of them.
 
You know what's really cool about spaceboats?
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Yes indeed. So whenever I refer to someone as anything, I "objectify" him.
 
@Jefffrey There isn't a problem, outside of insane MRA circles. The guy chose to wear an unprofessional t-shirt that made some people uncomfortable. Some people voiced their criticism that this is inappropriate, and that it undermined the effort to bring more people into his field of work. He apologized. End of story, as far as sane people are concerned. There is no problem
 
only saying that someone is sexist is safe.
 
9:13 PM
They're in space!
 
user1804599
Soon Player player(Gender::Female, Point(20, 30), warriorSprite); will be illegal because it objectifies a woman.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes You ruined it by fixing your spelling mistake
spaceboars were funny
 
@curiousguy Fuck you man I'm not an "object"
 
spacegoats
 
@jalf Ok, let's start over again. He shouldn't have apologized.
 
9:13 PM
The only people who claim there is a problem are raging hateful assholes with a grudge against women, who want to invent evidence that he was the victim of a brutal barbaric mob
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit What are you? A number?
 
honestly though I feel like women would feel more welcome in tech if they stopped fucking whining
5
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes If they're space boats, pretty much everything about (i.e., around) them is not just cool, but downright cold. Except, it's pretty much vacuum, so there's really not much of anything around them.
 
user1804599
Never apologise.
 
@jalf: I have only recently discovered Karen Straughan and Warren Farrell. I like what they say. :)
 
9:14 PM
I am not a free man. I am a number!
 
Men piss each other off all the time but don't go on tirades about it
3
 
user1804599
The guy should Apollogise instead.
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit omg are you trying to menify women?
 
I was working on a proof of concept implementation :) Oh well, he will probably never find a better approach
 
9:14 PM
how dare you
 
@VáclavZeman Good for you. I like what people who agree with my views say too
 
Hmm.
I often don't like what people who agree with my views say.
 
Wow.
 
@jalf That makes sense
 
What'd I miss?
 
9:15 PM
lounge drama
 
See above my criticism of jalf's initial argument direction.
 
a bunch of sexists
 
I also like when people try to show consideration for others, and when they at least pretend to have a minimum of empathy and understanding
 
Is it jalf x feminism again?
 
yea
basically
 
9:16 PM
lol whatever then
 
@Rapptz jalf ^ feminism I'd say
 
2 mins ago, by Lightness Races in Orbit
Men piss each other off all the time but don't go on tirades about it
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I'm pretty sure that wasn't an "initial direction". :) It was one of several points I made
 
The irony is strong with that one ^
 
someone added fuel to an already raging forest fire
 
user1804599
9:16 PM
Ik plonk moraalridders.
 
I say fuck those women that felt offended by that t-shirt.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Linky?
 
@jalf I admit I might have missed something.
 
(No, I'm not recommending rape)
 
@Jefffrey Someone probably will
@Jefffrey Oh
 
9:17 PM
Phone and gin tonic don't mix.
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit For some feminists, you would be an object iff you have sex for money, and this is very wrong.
 
(No, I'm not objectifying women)
 
yes
 
I feel it is worthwhile to point out if a site that is cited as a source is badly biased. That doesn't prove anything by itself, but it's worth keeping in mind
 
@AlexM. LOL (dat ninja edit)
 
9:17 PM
@Rapptz what for? I'm on a phone.
 
Oh okay. Never mind.
 
irta "I'm a phone"
thought this whole fake identity thing is going a bit too far now
 
My dad's not a phone!
 
@Jefffrey Yes, you are. And women objectify men. It is the way humans are.
 
Oh ok then.
 
9:18 PM
@Jefffrey I say fuck those men who felt offended at this whole thing
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes but is he on the ground?
 
I don't feel offended. I feel sad.
 
I don't think it's just a feeling
 
@Jefffrey You just act offended :0
 
9:18 PM
And my sadness is ruining my day.
So I feel angry.
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Anyway, images of you are objects in other people computers and minds. And this has nothing to do with porn.
 
gasp women voicing an opinion, requesting they be respected! How dare they. You suckers are so much more butthurt about this than all the evil feminists in the world who complained about the t-shirt in the first place
2
 
curiousguy reminds me of pawnguy :(
 
9:19 PM
It's curiousguy.
 
@sehe Nobody offended me.
@jalf LOL
 
@Jefffrey I didn't say. I observed something else
 
@VáclavZeman Men, and everything. When you think of someone or somethg, you need to construct mental rep or "objects". Hence, "objectify".
 
@Jefffrey I'm offended by that
 
I'm offended by your being offended by that.
 
9:20 PM
There's room
 
Weee we're both offended
lets move on with our lives now
 
@jalf Is there a "right to be respected"?
 
@Jefffrey seriously, here's your chance to show that you have thicker skin than all those dumb women. Show that you can tolerate living in a world where people don't wear shirts portraying naked women in a professional environment while on national TV. You don't have to like it, you just have to accept that it's probably not the end of the world, and it's not worth getting butthurt over
 
There's a difference between "whining" and "requesting to be respected".
 
@Jefffrey Yep. You're doing the former
 
9:21 PM
@jalf how much naked?
 
and "requesting to be respected more then men".
 
Shoe VS Penguin Round 1
 
@Jefffrey strawmen, wooo!
 
Strawperson, please.
 
user1804599
get room
 
9:21 PM
lemme take a look at which one is the strawmen fallacy
 
Are strawpeople people?
 
@Rapptz What is feminism, again?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes people with straws?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes No, this is Jeffrey I'm talking to. I'm pretty sure he prefer me to say men whenever possible
 
@curiousguy Make up your own definition.
 
9:22 PM
@Jefffrey Do show me where anyone did this
 
That's what everyone else does anyway.
 
user1804599
 
While you're at it, I believe I asked for evidence of, oh, half a dozen of your other claims too. You seem to be slow at providing any of it
 
lol
@jalf this one is a perl
 
user1804599
Perl is great.
 
9:23 PM
Anyway, I'm gonna go grab something to eat
 
@jalf I see you on the other hand have proven all of your claims.
 
@rightføld Shhhh! Not now! We are discussing more important things right now.
 
inb4 I didn't ask to prove the claims
lol
 
tch.
Why are you discussing this with jalf out of everyone?
 
@jalf You started off fine, but went off the rails in the first sentence. "I don't like your shirt" is an opinion. Anybody who chooses to do so is welcome to voice that opinion. "requesting to be respected" is an entirely different sort of thing. Concluding that their dislike for his shirt implies disrespect on his part is, frankly, complete bullshit.
9
 
9:24 PM
@Jefffrey well, you didn't. Is there anything I've said that you would like me to provide evidence of?
You only have to ask
 
@Rapptz Because I love the way he makes me angry.
 
Just don't bother.
 
Nah, I need to discharge some of the stress I've accumulated over the weeks.
 
Go find a hooker.
2
 
9:25 PM
lol
 
user1804599
@Jefffrey Use the syringe.
 
@Jefffrey Go take a walk
 
Also we all know that a lot of stars are assigned in time of "war". I'm just trying to cause a star inflation.
 
Fappity fap fap fap.
 
9:28 PM
I like how all this drama is completely manufactured. None of the people involved have turned this into a big deal in any way. The only people who are outraged, who want to create drama where none existed, are those who had no involvement, who are desperately looking for any evidence to support their childish preconceptions. How about we jsut give it a rest?
 
hi
 
@jalf man-ufactored ?
 
Sorry, person-ufactored
 
lol
 
9:28 PM
@sehe oh you
 
lol
 
user1804599
So first people say you shouldn't bottle up your emotions, but when you I exhaust them people don't like it either.
 
@rightføld ITT a lobster reposts his own reposts
 
BREAKING NEWS: Hypocrisy, nonsense in the Lounge<C++>
 
Hey, I like my childish preconceptions.
 
9:29 PM
I find it kind of odd that your proof you linked to in the transcript is basically a bunch of tweets.
 
user1804599
 
It's what I base all my postconceptions on.
 
@rightføld It's a good pun
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Day to day stuff
 
9:30 PM
@TonyTheLion innit
 
innot
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit You get sick of it eventually.
 
user1804599
NO STACK EXCHANGE I DON'T GIVE A SHIT ABOUT SERVER FAULT ELECTION
4
 
@Rapptz it's not "proof" of anything. It is an attempt at collating what actually happened. It's one piece of evidence we can look at. If you know of more sources we can consider, all you have to do is link to it :)
 
@Rapptz It can be quite entertaining
 
9:30 PM
@rightføld Serve a faulty lection!
 
thats about the only value I still see in it
 
inb4 erection
 
@Jefffrey you're generally supposed to get the erection first
you're doing it wrong
 
You're supposed to get an erection before going to an election?
 
Leave me alone. We are in the pissed off phase, remember?
 
9:31 PM
wat
 
user1804599
@Jefffrey So that's why elections in China are a joke.
 
@TonyTheLion no, before going in
 
@jalf ohhh h
 
@Tony aka politicians are whores.
 
oh boi
so many stars to give
 
user1804599
9:32 PM
oh gurl
 
user1804599
so many stars to take
 
"boi" is Portuguese for "bull"
 
I'm offended by that.
 
that came out wrong
 
Thanks for removing it.
Now please apologize.
 
9:33 PM
No.
 
user1804599
removing what
 
user1804599
I missed it.
 
Watch out. I'm going on twitter...
 
user1804599
@R.MartinhoFernandes boishit
 
Yep. That's what a strawman argument looks like.
Seems you did look it up after all.
 
9:35 PM
What are you even talking about.
There's no opponent here.
 
says who
:v
 
user1804599
We are all opponents to the robots.
 
It's just me and that feminist of tony.
Not feminist. What's the term for "hating men"?
Not all people, just men.
 
@Jefffrey men hating other man?
 
misandrist.
 
9:37 PM
@JerryCoffin that wasn't my conclusion though. He listened to their concerns, and he even apologized. That implies respect on his part.
 
Did you see the apology?
 
Repost
 
9:38 PM
@Rapptz does that imply "men" as in "everyone human" or as in "men and women"?
 
Wait what
What do you mean, repost?
 
@Jefffrey Look it up
 
@Jefffrey As in "men". Jesus.
 
@jalf someone should definitely bully jalf and make him apologize for nothing
 
> a person who dislikes, despises, or is strongly prejudiced against men.
it doesn't say
 
9:38 PM
...?
Did you forget to take your drugs Jeff
 
@Jefffrey it says exactly what it should say
 
so it means both?
 
"men" can mean 2 very different things
 
@Jefffrey biblehub.com/greek/435.htm The Greek base of the word says man as in male.
 
9:40 PM
thanks
 
@Jefffrey If it was hatred of all people than it would be called Misanthropy
 
"base"?
the base is mis(os)
 
@TonyTheLion the heck do I know
I'm ignorant
 
learn shit
 
@Rapptz Root then? Dunno what is the correct linguistic term for this. Mis-andry, the second part.
 
9:41 PM
I can't read
 
@Rapptz You're telling me
 
user1804599
Miss Fortune had a misfortune.
 
Linguistics is totally radical!
 
@rightføld clever
I think I'm running a fever
 
9:44 PM
@Jefffrey If today is not Saturday then it is bad fever.
 
it's jalf's fault most likely
 
user1804599
 
my app looks weird
 
@rightføld DRY
 
user1804599
It is DRY.
 
pls no
 
I saw this posted as an image and didn't know it was real lol
 
user1804599
lol Sweden
 
@Rapptz lol, that is too much.
 
9:46 PM
@rightføld ++instructionPointer(); auto channel = pop(); is repeated
 
user1804599
@Jefffrey no
 
user1804599
Those snippets are syntactically identical, but that's accidental.
 
user1804599
They may change for very different reasons.
 
@Rapptz this is precisely what's wrong with this world
 
user1804599
Having to change one doesn't imply having to change the other one.
 
user1804599
9:47 PM
In fact factoring this out is more dangerous.
 
@Rapptz lol
 
Slowly trying to move over to solar power... but still so crippled by fear of pollution bringing in bitters
 
Czech national coat of arms (?) has two tailed lion with a penis...I hope feminists will never notice, lol.
 
well a lion with a mane is a male
though it is weird for it to have the penis showing
 
user1804599
Cis lions don't count.
 
9:52 PM
@Rapptz Penis is significant! "Once upon a time coats of arms containing lions without genitalia were given to those who betrayed the Crown."
From the linked article.
 
Lol
 
Our kids will study this "feminist movement of 2014" in school
 
Lions are pretty cool.
 
user1804599
@VáclavZeman Well Swedish government probably betrays crown so it fits well.
 
@Rapptz Don't tell tony.
 
9:53 PM
This reminds me, dudes, do you know the Sexmission movie? Watch it, it is fun.
 
does it show tits?
 
Hm
 
@Jefffrey Probably not, not much. It is not a porn. :)
 
I have an init class that handles SDL_Init
 
user1804599
Nice thing about this design is that I can also make channels work with Boost.ASIO.
 
9:58 PM
should I make an img_init class that handles IMG_Init?
or keep it in the init class?
I find it hard to extend the init class
 
user1804599
So I can have one I/O thread and it won't bother with VM's scheduling.
 
@Rapptz One of the first video games I played was a lion simulator :v
 
@Rapptz Keep it in one init class.
 
Oh I said that once already.
 
I should have just went with std::atexit
:c
 

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