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19:00
They call them fingers, but you never see them fing. Oh wait, there they go.
@ExoticBirdsMerchant you have been asked, repeatedly, to provide your errors in text form (in a pastebin if they are quite long), not in an image
@ExoticBirdsMerchant Ah.
depends on dose and quality, as well
@Ffisegydd i agree but there are around 80 lines in cmd i cannot copy from cmd
I can copy from my cmd. I just have to highlight the region and press Enter.
Not the most intuitive shortcut, I know
19:01
@Ffisegydd sorry but what should i do when they are in cmd ?
ctrl-c definitely doesn't work
and they are a lot
@ExoticBirdsMerchant cmd as in DOS-box? or SSH?
Right click on the top of cmd, select "Mark"
Select what you want
well i type cmd and i get to the directory like DOS
19:02
Then right click it
and press Enter when you're done.
then it will be copied
Sometimes you can do [insert your command here] >> output.txt and it will put the program's output into the text file. Though, it doesn't work if it's outputting to stderr, IIRC
@Ffisegydd YEAH you are good!
Damn straight I'm good. I'm here all week.
Remember to tip your barman.
@Iplodman when you write code not according to PEP8 it is like
Like raiiiiiin on your wedding day
A FREE RIIIIIIIDE, WHEN YOU'VE ALREADY PAID.
"you have been writing python for as long as I have been alive, but I just know better how to format code properly"
like a black fly in your chardonnay (the only ironic thing in that song, btw, because it's supposed to be a mild insect repellent)
19:04
Alanis mistook dumb bad luck for irony.
@AnttiHaapala What, who are you quoting?
To be fair pep8 can go to hell and you can format it however you like as long as you're 100% sure you'll never need someone else to read it
or your code
Otherwise you should probably use the community style
19:05
yap, that includes ever asking for advice in python chat :D
I used to code in camelCase
"what is wrong with my code ... - formatting" :D
Just use whatever the teacher will give you the best grade for. But then switch back to pep8 for personal projects
"One of Guido's insights is that code is much more often read than it is written".
@AnttiHaapala Don't twist my words.
19:06
I code camelcase in js and java, lowercase in python :D
@Iplodman your code speaks for you ;)
on your behalf :D
@AnttiHaapala Because I format it in a different way, it means I think I know better?
Sigh
some programming languages have many styles
no one over another
python has 2: pep8 and those who ignore it:D
I don't take unusually formatted code to imply "I know better than you how to format code", but I will spend valuable brain power thinking "that's some unusual formatting", which is counterproductive when you're asking me for troubleshooting assistance
Don't try to make me dumber, I don't need the help :-D
@AnttiHaapala Yeah, but it still doesn't change the fact you've made me come off as arrogant -.-
19:09
If you start naming things OMFGawe3s0m3varNameDUD35 it won't win you any appreciation :)
@Iplodman so better follow pep8, I follow too, even though in the past I have written awful crap:D
methods == def, right?
Weren't we meant to be having a meeting or something?
@AnttiHaapala I'll work up to it - I've been coding under a year now.
maybe I should find my old turbopascal shit
19:10
@Jerry My guess is "yes"
okies :)
also, new pokemon game announced! :D
although I'm not so precise when it comes to terminology. I use "method" and "function" interchangeably, which may or may not be wrong
Guys just give a clue on WHAT KIND of errors are those? I literally have no idea!  C:\Users\Μαρίνος\Desktop\rdflib>python setup.py install
running install
running bdist_egg
running egg_info
writing rdflib.egg-info\PKG-INFO
writing top-level names to rdflib.egg-info\top_level.txt
writing dependency_links to rdflib.egg-info\dependency_links.txt
writing entry points to rdflib.egg-info\entry_points.txt
reading manifest file 'rdflib.egg-info\SOURCES.txt'
reading manifest template 'MANIFEST.in'
warning: no files found matching 'example.py'
@JErry :O link?
We are @Ffisegydd - but doesn't look like enough people around tonight... so errr, it can wait
19:10
@Iplodman when I had just started coding, i thought "image is nothing, funcitonality is everything" :D
@Kevin I believe a method is inside a class.
@Jerry Unless it's Pokemon Snap 2, I'll pass
google style guide is 4 space indentation ?
Whilst a function is not.
19:11
well, remake rather
I cannot just ask SO what error are these....
I wonder what they'll do as new this time
@AnttiHaapala I don't believe that, and never have. Even my first pieces of code were relatively neat.
also that's where mudkips were launched!
@ExoticBirdsMerchant ` undeclared identifier` is a C compilation error, if I recall correctly. Looks like it's failing to build SPARQLParser.c.
19:12
The pokemon will be in charge and they'l be forcing the humans to fight
@Xavier yup
Ohhhh @Kevin so is it solvable?
@Ffisegydd well, that happened to small scales in the anime, or something like that I think
it looks serious!!!
@Jerry Ugh, another Pokemon game -.- I wouldn't mind if they added something worthwhile to it.
19:13
@Iplodman Well... I enjoy them all right ^^
@ExoticBirdsMerchant I would ask a full question on SO. Give all the details of what you've done so far to get to that point, you'll reach a much wider audience than
the length of the error message is not a good indicator of the severity of the error. For all I know, you could fix it by changing one character in a configuration file.
@Jerry I'm not saying you shouldn't >.<
Good for you :D
but yea, in the end, it's just a matter of whether someone will like this or that feature or not
so, quite subjective
well @Ffisegydd that damn rdflib !!!!!! i have located thanks to Kevin that it has also an issue with building SPARQLParser.c.
19:14
after all, it's hard to please every single person
I'm starting to wonder if everyone in here is bent on world domination.... I was kind of hoping for less competition :p
@Ffisegydd the devil made that rdflib module
I should point out that you have ventured where I cannot follow. I don't do any C or anything like that. That's one reason to speak to the wider world, you'll get more expertise.
some pascal code from almost 20 yrs ago :'D
@JonClements Uh, I'm not interested in world domination, at least for now
19:16
yes i see your point
@ExoticBirdsMerchant I need to talk to you at some point about this stuff...
Agenda:

- Code stylings

- Server types (@fge):
- - How?
- - Anything on my side that needs doing?

- Who does what?
- - Iplodman - PR, Coder.
- - Exotic - Business, Coder.
- - Fge - Server Techie.
- - XXX - Find a GUI coder.

- Biographies/Autobiographies for the site.

- Group/Business name.

- Find a brainstorming app.
@JonClements I did have a bit of a "future world conqueror" phase in middle school. Seems like a lot of trouble these days, though. I'm not interested in legislation at all.
cabbage
@Hyper cbg!
cabbage
19:16
@Hyperboreus Cabbage!
So, world domination is the topic?
cabbage, potato?
banana
@Iplodman alright i am on Skype also. I need some type to sort this mess on rdflib + tommorow i will scan all the data i have on paper and pass them to the team
@ExoticBirdsMerchant Ahkay. Try to get me an (auto)biography by then as well.
*styling ;)
19:18
@Iplodman a very good name is Benefied for the name of the Business. Also by auto-biography you mean a CV
?
hey there, can some python guru give me an idea what's the best way to find similarity percentage of video files in different formats, lengths, and a chance that some are cropped. i have done my own research but i htought that this is a great place to ask.
@ExoticBirdsMerchant Nah, just one of these: thecodelobby.com/info.html.
Feel free to link to a CV if you want to.
Video similarity... That's like, a PHD level task
So, that disqualifies me
rhubarb..
rbrb
19:21
PHD = portable hard drive?
@ExoticBirdsMerchant did you try following these steps: groups.google.com/d/msg/rdflib-dev/DHyeGl3AqYc/AUpfeuDST4UJ
@Kevin Well, I'm looking for ideas, python lib and so on
You see catching the mood cannot be done by only a 15 sec game --> that would only be around 75% unbiased we need to see the heatmap patterns per person AND make comparison from the person next input to achieve a thourougly checked result @Iplodman
Unfortunately my PhD in physics means I am unable to help you with this PhD level task. If you had been studying the atomic structure of amorphous materials under extreme conditions then I'd be able to help you in a shot...
@XavierCombelle checking it now!
19:22
@ExoticBirdsMerchant I'm assuming we need a 3-game starter task for that app.
Let's start off basic, though.
I am having problems with the atomic structure of amorphous materials under extreme conditions? Does anybody here have experience with this topic?
@ExoticBirdsMerchant I don't know which version of rdflib you have apparently it is pure python
@XavierCombelle you see i have Python2.7 so i must have 2.4.2 rdflib and it has issues over compatibility
One 15 sec game, then we build up.
@Iplodman well i truly believe we cannot evade game theory in order to create solid heatmap over mood
19:23
Style question: do you prefer is not None or not is None?
is not None
same
@Iplodman excuse me a sec i'd like to torture myself trying to install arelle..xD
All other things being equal, I prefer code that looks like English
@ExoticBirdsMerchant No,but let's build up to more complex algorithms in updates.
19:24
yup not in the proof of concept
I imagined you guys would be measuring mood with like... a drop down list.
"Please select your mood" kinda thing
@Kevin well we will extract it but not by a mood bar
who will put a bad mood
?
I would if I was in a bad mood :P
People who are in a bad mood.
Bad mooded people
19:26
@Kevin thecodelobby.com/exod.html Has it all there.
Unless you can't trust people to self-report their own emotions - a valid concern
@Iplodman @Kevin we will use an incentive-based frame wrapped in a 15 sec task
@ExoticBirdsMerchant So a 'do game - get treat pat pat good doggie' kind of thing?
and we will double-check over historical periods on the person for concretness and statistical probability it can be done
@ExoticBirdsMerchant apparently the last version of rdflib is 4.1.2 and it seems to be compatible with python 2.5 to 3.3
19:27
@ExoticBirdsMerchant What are you doing? Sounds fiendish
Yes but will element of ambush and surprise not in a menacing matter sort af a dizz and clarity @Iplodman
@ExoticBirdsMerchant Ah.
And I already sent him that ;)
Like, a message up xD
@XavierCombelle i need the 4.2 the other i can install but arelle does not recognise em :P
So this is a happiness map?
19:29
@Iplodman and most important we need to have a luck-gamble thing in the game....
just like it , it will unlock frustration or good vibes
@Hyperboreus yup in a heatmap
@ExoticBirdsMerchant Good idea, although that could alter the mood before pinning one.
The close queue really got reduced a lot since the elections
@Iplodman in order to extract mood we need to challenge the subject somehow, conciously or unconsiously;
I'm a little unclear about this "element of surprise" concept. Surely the users will know exactly what's going on, since they knowingly downloaded the app, and knowingly run it when they feel like recording their mood?
Me as a potential user, what would I get out of this application?
@Hyperboreus The USP is not yet known - we're working on it.
@Kevin really? think an app-game-of-think.....you are at a cashier you win a coupon and the guy next to you wins or in the same place 10times more.....
Maybe a social aspect.
a computer would be happy
@ExoticBirdsMerchant you mean this question
0
Q: Cannot find module rdflib while installing Arelle

ExoticBirdsMerchantI am trying to install Arelle with the cmd on Windows 7. So i am going to the directory and type python setup.py install. However when the install finishes i get the following error: ImportError: No module named rdflib I already have tried two versions of rdflib rdflib-3.2.0.tar.gz and rdfl...

19:32
a houman would be jealous...
@XavierCombelle YEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEESSSSSSSSS
@ExoticBirdsMerchant Imma be AFK for a bit, I'll be back soon.
Any Qs about Exod can be sent to @ExoticBirdsMerchant ;)
Are you sure that is not a problem with your current setup not because the version is not the dev one
Exod being the app.
19:34
what do you mean is not a developed one? just a sec to look
@ExoticBirdsMerchant Ok, but what does that have to do with the element of surprise?
@ExoticBirdsMerchant 4.2 is not the stable one
@Kevin somebody expects to win not low-over-balled
i have tried 4.2 and 3.x but it does me not good so i discovered this one answers.semanticweb.com/questions/27932/… @XavierCombelle
it says for python2.7 you need and 2.x rdflib @XavierCombelle
so i did install Visual Studio that rdflib demands.... and now whenever i try to install it i get these errors
C:\Users\Μαρίνος\Desktop\rdflib>python setup.py install
running install
running bdist_egg
running egg_info
writing rdflib.egg-info\PKG-INFO
writing top-level names to rdflib.egg-info\top_level.txt
writing dependency_links to rdflib.egg-info\dependency_links.txt
writing entry points to rdflib.egg-info\entry_points.txt
reading manifest file 'rdflib.egg-info\SOURCES.txt'
reading manifest template 'MANIFEST.in'
warning: no files found matching 'example.py'
writing manifest file 'rdflib.egg-info\SOURCES.txt'
@XavierCombelle the CORE of the problem is: how can you know what edition of the module is right for something you want to install....for example what rdflib is good for arelle
?
@ExoticBirdsMerchant that is not what says pypi.python.org/pypi/rdflib it says 4.1.2 compatible with python 2.7
try the latest stable
@XavierCombelle i really tried that one dozen of times
it installs with no problem
19:38
once it is installed
but once i try then to install arelle i still
get no module named rdflib
try python -c "import rdflib"
@XavierCombelle wow what is this hmmm
it has a difference and do i do it after i install the rdflib? @XavierCombelle ....i mean is this an installation command?
yes after installation of rdflib. it's the command line import of the rdflib library. If that work and not arelle, it means that arelle is doing something strange
@ExoticBirdsMerchant not that you badly installed rdflib
wow i get it.... and how can i understand what arelle wants in term of rdflib? i mean what version... @XavierCombelle it is really strange
maybe they have something in the documentation...i doubt it
19:41
@assume that he wants the latest stable usually it works
ok i'll give it a go
Does python accept smart quotes as comments?
@Jerry didn't think so
Guys when i install something for example edition 3.x and then i install edition 4.x Does the edition 3.x get removed because of installing a newer edition or it stays on the computer?
hmm, command line turns the quote into plain ones :(
19:45
@ExoticBirdsMerchant that depends on the "something"
@ExoticBirdsMerchant This should depend on your OS, your package manager, etc, etc
Most OS support multiple versions of library. Otherwise we wouldn't have the dependency hell or DLL hell.
@Ffisegydd @Hyperboreus i asked because i have made 23543643256432 attempts to install arelle
And did it install?
19:46
Yes we've noticed :P
@Hyperboreus Noooooooo it needs rdflib! arghhhh
@ExoticBirdsMerchant did you try the official download arelle.org/download
it has an executable version 32 bits and 64 bits for windows
try 32 bit version
because the git has an Excel plug.... i have the official also @XavierCombelle
@XavierCombelle the Excle plug is a stopped project as you can see here arelle.atlassian.net/browse/ARELLE-83
but you can use another python module to drop the data to Excel
The executable version does not have a switch to send the data automatically on Excel @XavierCombelle
@ExoticBirdsMerchant what makes you think that it will be enabled on github version after all the bug is open
@XavierCombelle well i can't find another way to do it and all those bugs are modules i need to install i was installing them one by one until i was totally stuck on rdflib!!!!
it gives me so much pain because whatever rdflib i install arelle does NOT see it @XavierCombelle
19:52
@ExoticBirdsMerchant but how you can suppose that the github version will enable you to export as excel ?
@XavierCombelle because it has an Excel plug + Add openpyxl to support xlsx, as an installed (un-pathced) package, and add to cx_freeze setup.
Provide option to save csv files viewTable*.py (such as conformance test reports, table file output) in excel format (with reasonable font, column width, etc) as done for html output.
It can be done i am just stuck on the hated rdflib
does this command: python -c import rdflib changes the game? i will see now although i dont have much hope.... @XavierCombelle
@ExoticBirdsMerchant apparently arelle is only compatible with python3.3 not python2.7
Wow!!!!! how do you actually know that!? ^^ ^^
omfg!!! @XavierCombelle god dammit i will slap myself for this!
damm it!
@XavierCombelle thanks i will be probably removing Python2.7 and putting Python3x bye bye python2x fun while it lasted!!!
19:59
@ExoticBirdsMerchant take care use python3.3 not python3.4 as arelle is not compatible with 3.4
A library that only supports py3.x. That's uncommon.
@XavierCombelle wowwwwwwwww i must ready the installation instructions like a bible
i will install arelle
@Ffisegydd it's an application not a library
I thought it was also a library? Such that it could be scripted using python commands?
they are free to drop support of python2.7 if their dependancy are python3.x compatible
20:01
it is as a git repository @Ffisegydd but i believe it is an application AND i am sure it is writen in python
I don't know exactly what it does
@XavierCombelle i will tell you... it costs 25k/year to have a good financial data feed
BUT the last years
thanks to a group of coders and a law mandating all data to be put in an XML format in a DB
@ExoticBirdsMerchant by the way you can export your data in html and convert it from html to excel within excel
you can pull your data with arelle you can manipulate them and do stock analysis
@XavierCombelle WOW with the executable form or not?
@ExoticBirdsMerchant yes with executable
20:04
@XavierCombelle owowwooww why can't i find those....? eeeeerggg well where? xD
well i checked tools
@ExoticBirdsMerchant you have an option in the gui arelle.org/documentation/gui-operation file save
oh so you mean save as html and them of to excel. well that is a thing to try but i believe it will destroy transparency and positioning in the reports but i will certainly try it!!!!!! i will try first to install arelle with Python 3.3 though
@XavierCombelle download it and i will show you what it does! you will love it !
@ExoticBirdsMerchant now I have to go to bed I should be around here tomorrow if you have follow up question
I use python Tkinter and .next() method doesnt work as expected in treeview
before 2010 these tools were not for everyday people
@XavierCombelle god bless ya!!!!!!!
i believe i will make it today!!!!!
@XavierCombelle you must be very experienced!!!!
20:10
what are you talking about ?
@WalleCyril What does it do, and what do you expect it to do?
it does return the iitem of the second item but not of the next
Makes sense. I would expect next(first_item) to return the second item, not the item after the second item
I will push to github in 2-3 hours so you will be able to see
If you want the item after the second item, you should do next(second_item)
20:18
Hai guys.
but it does that too with all other items (4th 5th etc
Interesting. I look forward to seeing the code.
Out of interest, how comes accessing the 1,000,000th item in a list takes the same amount of time as accessing the first in Python?
yes I ll be back on this chat when I 'll push
Iplodman do you how to code in C
?
@Iplodman Calculating the address in memory of the millionth element in a list is simple arithmetic - just address_of_start_of_array + size_of_element*1000000
20:20
@WalleCyril Assuming you mean do I know, nope.
I know a bit of C++.
as Kevin said
Oh, that is clever.
I didn't think of that xD
@WalleCyril Why do you ask about C?
Not all collections have fast access time like that. For instance, in a linked list, accessing the millionth element is indeed a million times slower than accessing the first
@Kevin A linked list being?
Is it a 2D list?
If you know the size of 1 object in the list and all the objects are the same size you just make sizeof * index
20:22
Although it makes up for it in other ways. Inserting new elements halfway through the linked list is fast, but for ordinary arrays it is slow
In computer science, a linked list is a data structure consisting of a group of nodes which together represent a sequence. Under the simplest form, each node is composed of a data and a reference (in other words, a link) to the next node in the sequence; more complex variants add additional links. This structure allows for efficient insertion or removal of elements from any position in the sequence. A linked list whose nodes contain two fields: an integer value and a link to the next node. The last node is linked to a terminator used to signify the end of the list. Linked lists are amon...
In C you have to know such things
that s why I asked
What you said is mostly language-agnostic and has nothing to do directly with C
Know such things for what?
Lists?
what-ever, I have something to finish
Okay :l
20:36
@DSM Cabbage!
DSM
DSM
cbg.
Okay i've read this a couple of times what does he mean? (i have just installed python33) ` Start Arelle: double click unzipped file runGUI.pyw or scripts\runGUI.bat (you may also run from a shell prompt in the installed directory, cd to the top level directory (which has scripts and arelle as child directories) launch the GUI version by typing “\python32\python -m arelle.CntlrWinMain” or the command line version by typing “\python32\python -m arelle.CntlrCmdLine”.`
Which bit are you confused on?
Start Arelle: double click unzipped file runGUI.pyw or scripts\runGUI.bat (you may also run from a shell prompt in the installed directory, cd to the top level directory (which has scripts and arelle as child directories) launch the GUI version by typing “\python32\python -m arelle.CntlrWinMain” or the command line version by typing “\python32\python -m arelle.CntlrCmdLine”.
yup there is no runGUI.pyw in the file
Have you unzipped it? ;)
Try re-downloading it.
Where did you download it from?
what does he mean run from a shell prompt? like cmd?
The first GUI that appears - the IDLE.
ohhh the IDLE
20:48
No.
The shell prompt is not the IDLE
Is it not?
YES BUT he says cd to the top level directory
#CodingScrub
The shell prompt is cmd/PowerShell
20:49
Aw, crap.
I just realized what I'm doing - I'm trying to thread time... which threads it's self -.-
#2ProHonest
@Ffisegydd @Iplodman and then it says strangely launch the GUI version by typing “\python32\python -m arelle.CntlrWinMain” HOW can this be?? we are supposed to be in the arelle file directory....
Don't ask me xD
we are cd 'ing there with the cmd
i;ll investigate it
Can anyone give me an idea for a thread based project?
Sewing.
20:53
Badum tish
But seriously ;)
Knitting.
@Ffisegydd -.-
Sorry :P
But seriously?
Stitchwork.
I'll ask you again, and if you say 'embroidery' or anything related to the physical thread, I will cave your head in with a brick.
;)
20:57
That's string/yarn, not thread ;)
Thanks, I wasn't aware of these subtle differences.
DSM
DSM
Minotaur hunting?
String is usually thicker than thread.
@DSM I want to YAMMING kill you all.
GIMME DAT' BRICK.
Got a threading thing on my site :D thecodelobby.com/2014-portfolio-b.html
@ExoticBirdsMerchant I think the python file you want is github.com/Arelle/Arelle/blob/master/arelleGUI.pyw
@Ffisegydd there is such a file in the downloaded unzipped file- in the directions it says runGUI.pyw
that discrepancy on the directions set the termites on me
21:01
It does. But then again a lot of the .sh files talk about Python 3.1 when it says it supports Python 3.3.
These haven't been updated in 3 years of course.
Let's face it, the docs are wrong in some way and that file seems to do what tou want it to do.
well update from source says to download python 3.3
that i think is correct
Yes that is my point. The old shell scripts talk about Python 3.1 because they haven't been updated.
Possibly neither have other scripts or the docs.
shouldnt python3.3 run them?
What I am saying is that if you physically go and read that Python file it seems to talk about doing what you want it to do.
aha i am opening every one of them now
HOLY MOTHER OF COW IT WOOOOOOOOOORKKKKKKSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS YEHAAAAAAAAAAAAAhHHHHHHHH
i control the executable throuth a py FUCKING YEAH~~~!!!!!!
21:05
Got to be my favourite Le Mis song: youtube.com/watch?v=urxk4mveLCw
@Iplodman funny you should say that I'm going to see the musical on Saturday :P
YES now it;s time for a song and i will roll a big cigarette too
@Ffisegydd Is it your first time?
Seeing Les Mis in the theatre? Yes. Seeing a musical in general? No
@Ffisegydd Oh, you are in for a treat.
@ExoticBirdsMerchant Is Arelle something that makes .PYs into .EXEs?
21:07
I've watched the 25th anniversary edition countless times
And the film of course
Oooh, I'm not too keen on the film.
i really dunno all i know is that by opening arelleGUI.pyw and pressing <kbd>F5</kbd> it opens the one that opens if you open the executable through python @Iplodman
I thought it was good. Certainly much better than it could have been.
@ExoticBirdsMerchant Ah. What did you need it for?
@Iplodman it is conpatible with Python33 NOT Python27
21:10
Right.
Got to go now, cya guys :D
if you try to do it with 27 it gives you PAIN from point one
alright cu tommorow
it works
yeah
@WalleCyril yes it works!!!
it works
youhoo
'''def next_():
if self.elements_in_treeview.get_children(self.elements_in_treeview.selection()[0]):#if folder of element
next_item=(self.elements_in_treeview.get_children(self.elements_in_treeview.selection()[0])[0])# we take the first child
else:
next_item=self.elements_in_treeview.next(self.elements_in_treeview.selection()[0])
if next_item=="":#if it was the last
#we take the parent's next,who is also a parent and then take the first child of it
next_item=self.elements_in_treeview.next(self.elements_in_treeview.parent(self.elements_in_treeview.selection()[0]))
why does indent not work
21:43
hai

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