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5:09 PM
Do you think this is worth keeping alive? A broad question with a poor answer of mine that I'm unable to delete, unfortunately
 
I'm glad we are all still angry about the pro
 
What? Just rewrite the ast. Is it that hard?
 
Busy day cbg all
 
user559633
@idjaw not angry, just confused
 
@vaultah Yeah, It's quite good. Let it stay
 
user559633
5:10 PM
Can't focus on anything cbg :)
 
@idjaw cabbage
 
cbg @BhargavRao
@tristan we are mobbing today so it is helping with keeping me focused
 
@BhargavRao but it's closed :/
 
user559633
@idjaw oh cool
 
user559633
@vaultah good answers can exist on bad/closed questions
 
5:12 PM
@vaultah Err, It's fine. That's not a issue. There can be pearls on sand :)
 
I posted a community answer last night based off of someone's answer they put in the comments to a bad question because the answer posted was so bad it just could not be the only answer there
 
user559633
Not sure that I disagree with the closure on that question either
 
user559633
If phrased differently, that would be on-topic
 
:c
 
5:13 PM
I'll certainly vote to reopen if you can do that @tristan :)
 
to make it clear: I think my answer is bad and I can't fix it
 
user559633
@vaultah Does the answer work?
 
No
 
user559633
Can you edit the question to make it fit your answer? :P
 
I'd rather not do that :D
 
5:15 PM
Can anyone take a look at this comment stackoverflow.com/questions/40304487/… and confirm if the post is not a dupe?
 
AFAICT the OP wants to convert the function into a generator, by "replacing" the print statement with yield, which would mean lazy evaluation etc. My solution advises to capture the output of the print statement, split it by whitespace and yield the result. Ugh.
 
I edited the question without looking at the answers. Mostly just cleaning up and removing the "looking for use cases" statement.
Seems fine to me, not sure what that close reason was going for.
 
user559633
@davidism Well done -- yeah, that's how I translated it in my brain.
 
user559633
idk, i think it's a neat answer
 
5:28 PM
intermittent cabbage
 
cabbage
 
also, took my laptop for some clean-up, now <50 celsius baseline temperature D:
I didn't know its thermometer went this low
 
wim
πŸΌπŸΌπŸΌπŸΌπŸ„πŸ„πŸ
 
Cabbage @wim
 
wim
you don't make friends with salad, hello
 
5:32 PM
@wim pandas?
 
user6568562
cabbage everyone !
 
user559633
panda panda panda panda mushroom mushroom python?
 
user6568562
I'm wondering, is blogspot still a thing ?
 
user559633
no, i think they washed it
 
5:35 PM
@wim you going to PyCon again?
 
blogspot still exists, yes.
 
wim
yes, pycon
oregon again is it ?
 
@randomhopeful indeed
 
5:35 PM
@wim Yeah, registration opened a couple hours ago.
 
Capital One is a sponsor for PyCon?
interesting
 
wim
wait, how does a glamour Dachsund photoshoot prove that pycon registration just opened
 
They were last year too, I got an external phone battery from them.
 
wooo
 
5:37 PM
Ack, don't cross the conversation streams.
 
Rhubarb all, Time for me to leave.
 
user6568562
@AndrasDeak This is one cute blog : D
 
Yeah we want the slither hiss doggos not the fluff bork ones
 
@wim it's either that or half-life 3
 
5:39 PM
does Ubuntu come with a text editor preinstalled? I tried vim and emacs and both times it suggested using sudo apt install and I don't really feel like it
If I have to I will but if I don't I won't
 
@Kevin vi?
 
nano, iirc.
 
nano is basic usually, yeah
 
user559633
what, you're too good for ed and redirects now?
 
Ok I tried Vi and the splash screen says VIM. I don't understand why it said vim wasn't installed before.
 
5:40 PM
you just need to give an ls |cat ... kind of command in the right place, and awk that
 
@MartijnPieters coming to PyCon again?
 
@Kevin that's odd indeed; vim should also listen to vim
 
How nice of the intro screen to tell me how to quit.
I'd have been trapped forever, otherwise.
 
unlike stupid emacs
 
@davidism PyCon US? Way too early to tell.
 
5:41 PM
(as I seem to vaguely recall)
 
user559633
$ echo "def main():" >> my_enterprise_code.py
$ echo "    print('Hello world')" >> my_enterprise_code.py
$ echo "main()" >> my_enterprise_code.py
$ python my_enterprise_code.py
Hello world
 
user559633
look at big shot kevin too good for the built ins
 
If you try to ctrl-c in vim, it says at the bottom how to do it properly
 
ok, I've got nano too, and I can't quit that, despite it saying "^X: Exit" right on the bottom of the screen. Does "^" not mean ctrl? Does virtualbox ignore modifier keys when passing input through?
 
It's shift. (I think)
 
5:42 PM
I'm pretty sure shift-x is just the command for typing a capital x.
 
That does sound like a virtualbox problem. Perhaps you should just install linux over windows, I hear that fixes that problem
 
Maybe control+shift+x?
 
user6568562
@Kevin On my Debian ctrl - x works
 
I forget. :P
 
It works for me too. Did you type something and not save and it's complaining?
 
user6568562
5:43 PM
Maybe it's asking you if you want to save your stuff ?
 
@MartijnPieters yeah, registration just opened, already got my ticket. A little closer for me though. :-)
 
user6568562
ctrl o ctrl x
 
I typed a few capital Xes.
 
This is why ed is the standard text editor.
 
user6568562
@AndrasDeak emacs remind me of some crush I never was enough good for. But I know if I comply even more, emacs will see how truly kickass I am
 
5:44 PM
Oh, it only recognizes left ctrl. Got it working.
 
user559633
You use right-side control? O___O
 
I use whatever ctrl is on the opposite side of the keyboard from the letter that I'm typing it with. Mostly.
 
user6568562
Good biceps workout : D
 
Ok, I've got vi(m) and nano. ed takes me to an input loop but it just prints question marks. I choose to believe this is a prank the OS devs are playing on the userbase.
 
wim
gedit is for ubuntu users
 
5:47 PM
Bah I hate it when imgur ensmallens the image beyond legibility
 
wim
actually , ubuntu users should probably just buy a mac
 
If mac has as and ld and movl $1, %eax is still the kernel command for exiting the program, sure I'll switch
Otherwise I'll stick with this while I'm trying to run these assembly exercises
 
user559633
do you write a lot of assembly? OH okay ;)
 
user559633
5:50 PM
How do you test your assembly code?
 
Apparently by executing it.
I assume there are lovely tools for stepping through assembly and visualizing memory contents etc etc but the tutorial hasn't mentioned those yet, so.
Let's keep the horse firmly before the cart and see if I can get a Hello, World going
 
DSM
Unexpected-lunch-with-old-friend-who-writes-Ruby cabbage for all.
 
user559633
@Kevin Is this a "programming from the ground up" thing?
 
wim
 
@tristan Yeah.
 
user559633
5:55 PM
@Kevin Please let me know what you think of it and if you run into an alternative you prefer.
 
Needs more unnecessary use of jQuery / numpy
 
I had " Chapter 3: Your First Programs " open for three days prior to this. Couldn't follow along until I installed a couple gigabytes worth of operating system.
 
@wim are you talking about the view?
 
user559633
Well, "the official way to do this" is NAA
 
user6568562
@tristan Did you manage to start the Data structures & algorithms in C++ ?
 
5:58 PM
... But that's more my fault than the book's, really.
 
user559633
@randomhopeful Reading a different book on C at a rate that can only be described as glacial.
 
user559633
Most of the work I have to do is in JS and it turns out that nearly everything is more interesting than writing JS, so I procrastinate all day, then try to throw hours at it, leaving not much time for self-improvement
 
wow, my laptop's fan can operate in steps D:
 
user6568562
@tristan Haha I know the glacial rate : D
 
I really hope it won't revert to the original category-five typhoon mode in a few weeks
 
user6568562
6:02 PM
 
user559633
Doing so now. Thanks for helping me procrastinate
 
oh. This is exactly what I've been reading about over the last week. Not necessarily those articles.
thanks for sharing
 
user559633
> Theres no doubt about it. Node is leaner than Python when it comes to hardware (if written properly).
 
user559633
air moved out of my nose in a laughing manner (amoomnialm)
 
Well, node certainly doesn't suffer from the GIL.
 
user559633
6:05 PM
Yeah, and it's not like a single threaded event loop and callbacks can go wrong, especially when waiting for frames to return
 
You do a lot of waiting in javascript, so i can only assume it's good at it.
 
user559633
I'm pretty happy with my Python, C, C++ backend stack. Node will be entering this soon, but specifically to handle "server-side rendering" (making HTML strings) for React
 
That's a good approach. Fully investing your backend to node I find is not the best approach.
 
user559633
Oh, god no. Node is fine for small things, but then again, Golang is better for small things.
 
I just don't know what to say to some people who proudly explain that their full stack is running on node
 
user559633
6:11 PM
"Good luck"
 
do you just smile and nod?
 
@idjaw *snort* *point* *burst out in laughter*
 
What does that actually buy them? The "you can run the same code on the frontend or in the backend" always had such limited use cases-- react server-side rendering being one of the few legit ones
 
user559633
Node is fine and if you have people that are good at JS, it's not a terrible pick.
 
user6568562
@idjaw U welx, dude [ :
 
user559633
6:12 PM
@KevinMGranger Well, for webdev, input validation, algos
 
Ah, true
 
user559633
I'm certain that JavaScript and Node are still relevant because you don't have an option on the frontend.
 
it should all be haskell
 
@tristan I was saying something like this a couple weeks ago
 
6:19 PM
My favourite bit is "It must feel empowering to be totally responsible for the performance of your application. To be always on the lookout for blocking operations that should be split into little pieces each perfectly tailored for concurrent thruput. All the complexities of assembler with all the speed of javascript."
 
@PM2Ring oh these are good. thanks.
 
user559633
From my time in operations, I've found that developers confuse 100% CPU usage with "doing something useful"
 
@tristan True, but we don't have to like that fact. :)
 
as somebody who only has district heating: heating your room is very useful
(I know, I know, servers and whatnot...)
 
Is the first comma in movl string_start(,%ecx,1), %eax really necessary because It's causing me great pain
Much like mashed potatoes and apple sauce, left parentheses and comma should never touch.
 
6:22 PM
that looks like assembly
 
Yes it is.
 
I have just shared all the insight I have, sorry
 
DSM
I kind of want to try mashed potatoes and apple sauce now.
 
Ah, I see the issue. You're trying to make sense of x86.
 
@DSM Enjoy, but don't tell me about it.
 
DSM
6:23 PM
No promises.
 
user559633
β–Ά find app/ -name '*.jsx' | xargs wc -l | tail -n1
    7098 total
 
user559633
@PM2Ring oh, i know. too well :)
 
brb gonna write an AI userscript to block all apple sauce related messages
 
what about all the saucy news on the macbook pro?
 
"What is my purpose in life?"
"You prevent DSM from trolling me."
"Oh God."
"Yeah, welcome to the club, pal"
@KevinMGranger Looking forward to discovering why every command I've learned so far has an L at the end.
 
6:26 PM
I'm just going to guess "long", and there are 32-bit versions without
 
Unless 32 bit is "long"... but I've never done Intel assembler.
 
@tristan find app/ -name '*.jsx' -exec wc -l {} + | tail -n1
 
The l ones are the 32-bit ones, because the naming scheme dates back to when 16-bit was normal.
 
Oh good, I guessed right. :)
 
The tutorial says a long is "four storage locations".
 
6:29 PM
and the smallest addressable size is a byte, thus four bytes. 32 bits. Bingo
 
user559633
@KevinMGranger i stopped using exec after working in a place in which using it would error out
 
But what if I'm using decommissioned cold-war era Russian hardware that runs on mercury switches and nixie tubes and it uses bytes made out of five trinary bits. Better not make any assumptions.
Maybe a long is 20 trits.
 
@Kevin In that case, you're probably not going to be using Intel assembler.
 
What if the Russians shared a base with the military superscience division and the boys from the chrono-study branch came in and were like "we got this during a trip to the 2030s, thought you might like it" and they plunk an Intel processor down on the table, lightly charred by laser gun fire but mostly intact
 
6:34 PM
@tristan I often correlate staring at 100% CPU usage with doing something useful
 
And they reverse-engineer the instruction set (but not any of the materials because they're computer scientists not material scientists, hence sticking with nixie tubes), so it turns out it's forward-compatible with a standard that won't be invented for a couple decades
 
@Kevin I'd like it if the company that patents it was Arm, and so Intel never existed
 
Isn't this an unused plotline from Independence Day?
 
Feels more like Terminator
 
Yeah it's pretty much terminator.
 
6:37 PM
Although instead of a giant entity bent on world domination... Terminator was about robots.
 
user559633
> so it turns out it's forward-compatible with a standard that won't be invented for a couple decades

oh, so like unicode
 
potatoes with apples is a traditional dish somewhere, called "Erd und Himmel" I think.
 
There's a skynet-esque intelligence in the machine, gone mad from sitting in an abandoned bunker for sixty years. It's all set to destroy humanity but I accidentally wipe it when I forget to put a jump at the end of my loop, and it zeroes out the entire memory
 
I keep talking about food here, probably because I drop in when I should be going to lunch.
 
@cphlewis pommes de terre avec pommes? Bon!
 
6:41 PM
Google is correcting it to Himmel und Erde a German dish that is pretty much that. Neat.
> The dish consists of black pudding, fried onions, and mashed potato with apple sauce.
I'd totally eat that
 
Anything with black pudding in, potatoes and apples are going to be a faint following sound.
not bad, but probably not the thing I'm going to remember.
 
I'm not sure consuming black pudding is "eaten" as much as it is "your biological and haemoglobic distinctiveness will be added to my own"
 
"blood and iron" violates DRY
 
user559633
black pudding is dry. tests pass.
 
Argh I was trying to do that and got Kevin'd
 
6:51 PM
oh wait...jeez...2009....what is wrong with me.
how..why...anyway...whatever.
 
@idjaw H🍁ppy Friday! \o/
 
@rlemon right back at you neighbour
Definitely Friday
 
DSM
In [13]: unicodedata.name("🍁")
Out[13]: 'MAPLE LEAF'
How did I not know this was a thing?
 
Canada is an illusion
just like Finland
 
Why is it yellow.
 
7:02 PM
(ohh man if anyone likes a good conspiracy theory, check out the finland one)
 
DSM
Finnish goaltending is definitely an illusion.. #2-0
 
^ this came up while trying to see if flat earthers/ hollow eathers had any competition in the tinfoil area of life
it seems they do
 
Before today, I have seen one maple leaf or symbolic representation of a maple leaf, and it was red.
I don't care for this terrifying new reality where maple leaves can be yellow.
 
@Kevin they could choose green, brown, orange, yellow, red, or black.
all the stages of a maple leaf
 
I see it as black
 
DSM
7:04 PM
Moi aussi.
 
@KevinMGranger you use Chrome?
 
ok we have to ping @AnttiHaapala for this.....scroll up Antti to that reddit post. Have fun.
 
I assume those seeing yellow use dark theme and get syntax highlighting
 
 
user6568562
> 6- Why the name Finland?

A. The country was originally made for fishing. What do fish have? Fins. Thus Finland.
 
7:06 PM
I have chrome (w/o dark theme) and I see it as yellow.
 
@Kevin ohh wow
nvm then
 
user6568562
@rlemon Sold, man. I have a couple of words to have with @Antti
 
Nope, Firefox. I think it's a font thing
 
wait do you guys have a conspirator amongst you?
we have a few in the JS room. so these topics come up often
 
do you?
 
7:08 PM
I'm pretty sure the Kevins think, at least in part, that there can only be one.
 
because I don't think we have had any here
 
we have at least one flat earther
 
oh well yeah....The Great Kevin Cold War is a very real thing.
 
and a few people who think we never landed on the moon
 
that is amazing.
 
7:10 PM
I do believe in one conspiracy theory I heard--- I heard that the US government was behind the moon landing.
 
ohh and one kid who thinks there is a hardware level rootkit that has been snuck into every machine in the world.
his boss found it, but has no technical details.
kids like 16-17, I kinda feel bad for him
 
That's called a "trusted platform module", disregard it, citizen.
 
@rlemon I have no problem with a friendly ping to jump in on that chat when those conversations are happening. Just to silently observe the magic.
 
will do
usually evenings, between 7-9pm est
no correlation, just seems to be the time
 
beautiful. thank you
I love reading those things.
they're so entertaining
 
7:16 PM
@rlemon NOOOOO
those people are real?
I thought they were an urban legend, like vegans
 
@AndrasDeak ohh man, I try to watch most/all of the NASA live streams.... because I disable flash I have to go to youtube to watch them (stupid NASA)
the comment section is entertaining
er, the live chat
 
I probably couldn't handle it:D Too many fucks to give
 
not comments.
mostly people trying to get you to go to their channels where they debunk round-earth
THOSE are the entertaining bits
 
I get infuriated by pseudoscience, so it's usually me being trolled when I read up on these things
 
you should like this
 
7:19 PM
cbg
 
user559633
 
user559633
yep. 100% this
 
user559633
the other major one can be people not understanding when you're "at work"
 
Round earth is so 15th century. You've got to get on the concave earth theory.
 
earth is really a halo ring
 
user559633
7:22 PM
earth is a flat circle
 
#spreadTheKnowledge
 
 
@tristan Earth is a flat sphere.
 
Earth is flat, but it isn't a disc, it just goes on forever in all four directions. Explorers don't fall of the edge, they find somewhere more pleasant than here and decide to stay.
 
the earth is hollow, some jackass just filled it with rubble in the 1930's
 
7:25 PM
You think you can get to Asia by going west from America, but that's actually Asia 2.
 
user559633
@poke Ah yes, just what the flat earth theory needs, more accuracy in wording.
 
@rlemon That was my grandfather, sorry about that.
@Kevin Suddenly it all makes so much more sense!
 
we're all gonna be really surprised when we reach the bottom of the mariana trench and it's full of AOL cds
 
Like how the timezones to the west go all negative, while timezones to the east go all positive – are we supposed to believe that they suddenly clash?! What a crazy idea! So it just goes on forever!
 
maybe the earth was round until Fry sat on the box containing our universe and squashed it?
(it's a slow day, sorry)
 
7:29 PM
Earth is an infinitely long cylinder but you can't tell from space because all the parts above and below the ecliptic don't reflect any light
Explorers think they've reached the south pole when their compass goes haywire but that's just them reaching the spot where the van allen belts intersect with the terrestrial tube
 
Like this?
 
user559633
I feel deeply sorry for the child that asks "why is the earth round" to anyone in this room.
 
DSM
But when they can quote Earth's J2 and J4 from memory, their friends will be impressed!
 
Yeah p. much
 
7:33 PM
@tristan why is the earth round is an interesting question, "is it round" is not
 
@tristan Yeah....
 
I would love a chance to explain gravity to a four year old.
 
I'm waiting for the moment my son asks me why things fall down.
 
sounds kinda like an interesting challenge
 
@corvid this is for you :P
 
7:34 PM
You will require a trampoline and a bowling ball, and a first-aid kit for afterwards.
 
user559633
@rlemon we'll start a patreon for the bail money for when you fail to communicate why you're shouting a kid in the line of a baskin robbins
 
@Programmer a 404 page is indeed for me
 
Sorry I should have read the help first lol. I never get it right...
 
oooh I know this joke, it reminds me of another joke...
 
user559633
oof
 
7:36 PM
eeeesh
 
An American and an Australian are in a trench in world war I. The Australian says "I'm going in!" and charges out of the trench. The American frantically pulls him back down into the trench, and yells "did you come here to die?!". The Australian says "nah mate, came here yesterday"
Pro tip: read australian's text in australian accent
 
user image
3
 
user559633
Not sure what my brain just did.
 
Friday math.
 
note to self. Always ask Tristan for money.
 
user559633
7:40 PM
"Time has no meaning for me at this resolution" - Tristan, last night
 
I'd want to get more than just a nickleback.
@corvid That reminds me of the really awful joke about shearing
 
8:02 PM
@rlemon thanks, I'm still gathering willpower for the second half of the Flat Earth Documentary...:D
 
user7081143
what is abstract data type and why its important ?
 
user6568562
@AndrasDeak Your brain must not be thanking you for that torture
 
user559633
@maridlhr it's a way to talk about what the supposed type will do without having to implement it
 
user7081143
@tristan please make me understand with example ?
 
user6568562
@maridlhr It isn't simple to think of an example. Especially when you provided no context. But dig this : You need to perform operations on values to give your program a meaning. While designing these operations, you wish to understand what will they do, before even thinking about how they do it. Abstract data types are helpful to understand what's what
 
8:10 PM
@randomhopeful It's really stimulating, actually. I spent some time computing the Taylor series of the visible height of an object on the surface of the Earth after watching the first half
I didn't actually finish it, because I got distracted and have better things to do:P
 
user6568562
@AndrasDeak Oh, now I can see : D As in, if the earth were flat, how would mountains far away look ?
 
No, more along the lines of "how much can you see from an object of height h at distance x, and how does this change if your eyes are not on the sphere's surface but 1.9 meters above"
(part of their irrefutable, hard evidences for flat Earth is "you shouldn't see the Statue of Liberty from this distance")
 
user6568562
Haha I love me some shenanigans disguised as logic
 
user6568562
That's what happens when you sell high tech that evolved through so much blood and sh*t to the average human and tell them : "because you're worth it"
 
I don't see that causal chain:P
 
user6568562
8:20 PM
Dude, I can find you a causality between consumerism and anything. Especially people living in this century and believing in any bs. But I'm aware that my tin-foil-hat side : D
 
Maybe it's because I'm a reductionist by profession. My stance is "people are idiots"
 
user6568562
Well I believe that's true, too. I don't see maths or physics being the national sport anywhere.
 
user6568562
Erch, I sound like a pompous douche, but that's probably because I'm one
 
I won't cast the first stone:P
 
user6568562
: D
 
8:36 PM
@Kevin FYI I do remember that discussion, and while I didn't lose any sleep over it, I'm glad you shared the exact source now that you've found it:) Thanks
 
user6568562
> superman may have the power of flight and super strength but clark kent has the power of improv
 
user6568562
This is brilliant : D
 
user7081143
8:58 PM
Where algebraic data types can be useful? Anyone will give idea what actually they are?
 
algebraic?
and where do you find these questions?:)
 
heheh that's a weird one.
 

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