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12:11 AM
@tacoshy I was humming and harring about that; I don't think it is. Installing a single package (by whatever means) to me is a "general compute" question. That they're trying to do that on an inherently server centric distribution is irrelevant. It doesn't hinge on the server aspect in my opinion.
 
@tacoshy If the comments section is generally problematic, you can also just raise a custom flag on the question pointing that out and asking for a cleanup rather than flagging each problematic comment individually.
 
 
2 hours later…
@bad_coder Ironic that the tag that's being added via suggested edit there is...ambiguous.
 
@RyanM lol I noticed.
 
1:59 AM
@bad_coder It's about practical programming or about linguistics?
 
@Braiam not sure, e.g. FOL and deduction question's are common on philosophy.se The O notation questions are best asked on math.se
@Braiam linguistics.se is a great site but if you try searching for grammar there aren't many hits...
 
Reading the question it seems to be more about math systems than practical programming. It's way too abstract to be on topic.
 
 
2 hours later…
4:15 AM
@manro Bans don't "die" or expire. You have been told that, right? You need to actually take steps to address the issue, by improving your old posts.
@RyanM Sure, great, make it easier for the flagger by putting more work for the moderators. You know that you will soon be one of us, right? Gotta start playing for the correct team!
 
 
2 hours later…
6:47 AM
 
An answer edit that update code style according to Google Python Style Guide and doesn't improve much else isn't valid and should be rejected right?
 
I would say so, yes.
 
Some are reluctant to reject by fear to hurt the editor's feelings or have themselves the feeling that if doesn't harm then it can be accepted. Usually, I reject
 
Purely stylistic changes to code have little justification, especially as suggested edits. It's a different story if they're combined with other useful edits and/or if they're making wrong code correct.
 
7:53 AM
@Vega So do I, thanks. Felt the need to ask this time around because I've been seeing such proposals more often than before, and they do make the code look prettier.
 
Nothing wrong with approving it if you think it makes the code look prettier!
 
Cody I enjoy rejecting more because I'm evil
 
Sure; I get that, too.
 
@CodyGray Your new avatar makes it plausible ;)
 
8:46 AM
@CodyGray hello, Cody. I have an Idea. Can i fully rewrite my question and make "a new one from old one"? 🤓
 
@manro You can rewrite your old questions, but you cannot completely change what they are about.
And if your questions have received answers, then you need to be careful that your rewrite doesn't invalidate those answers.
Editing should be a way of improving the question, not a backdoor way to ask a new question when the system won't let you do so.
 
@CodyGray I have some unanswered questions. Because these ones can't be improved. One of them was stupid 😁
 
Why was it stupid?
 
@CodyGray this: stackoverflow.com/questions/69110160/… i tried to use an inappropriate function 😁
 
Making a stupid mistake (even if we assume it's stupid) doesn't make it a stupid question!!
 
8:56 AM
And wanted to reach a result
 
Other people might make the same mistake, stupid or not, and your question could be useful for them. Especially if it had an answer, rather than just a comment!
 
@CodyGray it haven't. Ok, i won't rewrite it. I need to add an answer?
@CodyGray and this: stackoverflow.com/questions/69404370/… i can rewrite it? Nobody was interested in it. No comments, no answers, only an ugly minus(
 
@manro I am not very familiar with R, so I can't really tell you whether it's a question that others would consider useful or give you any specific advice on how to rewrite it. However, it sounds like you had some confusion, and then Martin Gal posted a comment that solved your problem. What I would do in that case would be to post an answer to my own question that explains the confusion I was having, and tells how to solve the problem the way Martin recommended.
@manro Yeah... that question is much worse, in my opinion, than the other one. It is extremely broad. A lot of terms are thrown about without any real definition or clarity. And I cannot even imagine what a good answer to that question would look like.
 
@CodyGray thanks, then i add an answer to the first question and fully rewrite the second one (i have some questions in the R area). Big thx!!! 🤝
 
9:11 AM
Broad questions about object detection aren't really a great fit for SO, just so you know, @manro. Questions about R should be fine.
 
@CodyGray and how do you think, if this question will become a positive or zero rating one - ban dies? 🙏
 
nobody knows. The algorithm is secret
 
@rene 😬 hate secrets. But i must return my right to posting, it's a deal of the week!
 
9:30 AM
@manro If you do make revisions please add a sensible edit comment explaining what you did. Now it looks better ... I might hope so, yes. I don't expect it to look worse when you touched it ...
 
@rene yes, sometimes i wrote better comments.
@rene by the way! Can you see, when an any user has the last entry into the SO?
 
9:47 AM
@manro I have no idea what you mean. If you mean actions: then yes, all users can see all the actions on other user profiles.
 
I can see what you did last summer
 
@rene last authentication? i can say so ? Yes?
@CodyGray here - nothing 😁
@CodyGray i did really nothing, only degraded a lot 🍻🥃🍕😁🤒
 
10:06 AM
@manro not authentication but I can see last access date
 
@rene cheater 😚last_access_date": 1634464750 - how to understand it?
 
@manro If you hover your mouse over it you'll see 2021-10-17...
 
@Tomerikoo I'm now at my mobile phone, now i understand
 
I thought we all agreed to use unix epoch time
 
10:22 AM
@rene 1970+? You all use linux systems?
 
No, it has been deprecated. Does anyone know why?
 
Yeah, we had 10 beers
the rest is history
 
@rene Some people say me, that I can't be real IT-guy, if i can't use Linux 😟
And i can't (((
 
That seems like a pretty silly thing to say.
What if you maintain Windows systems? You aren't a "real" IT guy?
 
No. Clicking next, Next, next, Finish in a wizard is not maintaining a system
 
10:28 AM
@CodyGray i don't know, i was a laborer. And tired of it and want to change smth
 
 
1 hour later…
11:45 AM
@CodyGray Why lock this one and not delete? I mean, it is not that historically significant with only 5k views in almost 12 years.
 
@Tomerikoo It's fun? What harm is it doing to have it locked?
 
No harm having it locked. It is surely better than nothing. Just doesn't seem that useful as well... meh
 
I mean... no one says that historical locks can only be applied to stuff that's useful.
To be completely honest, when I decided to lock it, I missed that it had just been undeleted 2 hours ago... But that explains why it has low views: it has been deleted since March of 2013.
Clearly, though, a significant number of trusted community members thought it should be undeleted, so why not lock it?
 
I am very glad that is the only question with either of those tags. Although I wonder how long it would stay that way... any suggestions on a better tag that could be stuck on it so as not to preserve those tags' existence?
 
Oh I missed that as well. We don't want a delete/undelete war. I got to it through the new tags tool
 
11:50 AM
(I otherwise agree with Cody, but those are awful tags)
 
@RyanM Oh, tagging used to be awful.
I'm relatively surprised there's no "hello-world" tag.
 
You technically can be an expert in hello-world. It is after all the most basic program in every language...
 
maybe? To the extent that it requests bad architecture.
 
Thanks, @RyanM.
 
11:57 AM
 
"lost access to my other account so reposting here:" What to do here?
 
@Dharman It's an answer?
 
^ no
 
Ah, OK. It's a repost of an earlier question? Where's the original? Do you know it?
In such cases, you can raise a moderator flag on the reposted question. Best case, we can reach out to the user about merging accounts. Worse case, we'll just merge and delete one of them.
 
@CodyGray Not sure yet, but this is the previous account stackoverflow.com/users/17097407/refurb-sa
 
12:01 PM
I suspect it's stackoverflow.com/q/69584687, but not sure
 
yeah, that's it
unless they have a third account I don't know about
 
Do Unclear questions Roomba if they are answered? stackoverflow.com/q/69571568/2943403
 
yes
 
@mickmackusa Yes. As long as all answers have <= 0 score
 
as long as the answer is not accepted or positively scoring
 
12:08 PM
Cool cheers
 
@mickmackusa but please do not downvote good answers just because the question should be deleted. We have delete votes for these situations
 
12:28 PM
@Dharman are you referring to the js answer to the php question? I'm going to downvote answers that don't obey the required language.
 
No, I am just saying in general, do not use downvotes when they are not warranted
 
1:06 PM
Maybe we need a new tag:
 
That could get big fast.
 
I agree. I just wondered if, in my request above, it already counted as a tag in the title ;)
 
1:42 PM
May I ask someone with +20K to click on 'delete' on this question? I don't ask to confirm the deletion, i.e. this is not a del-pls (yet), just a test to see if there is a bug or something else (like am I in trouble? huh). Do you have the warning which looks like you are about to delete your own answered question (the title and the button are red)?
 
@Vega done
no such warning for me
Firefox on IOS, mobile view
 
Same here (no need for 20k, 10k is enough). Chrome on Win10
 
Ah, that's strange, because now I don't have that message anymore. I have tried multiple times and always got the red warning. Thank you very much for the test
@Tomerikoo Thank you
 
@SurajRao Would say yes, but it seems like a legitimate account, so probably just some very, very confused. Gone now either way.
 
1:47 PM
I am a bit confused. Does it mean there a counter how many answered questions I voted to deleted and I deleted too many? I forgot to take a screenshot before
 
@Vega sounds vaguely similar to the reject message you get when you run out of close votes, but I don't think I ever managed to use up my delete votes
 
I still have 11 votes left. The message was warning me as it was my question because it was telling me that I will loose question asking rights
 
sorry, programming question after all
 
I tried to delete my own question I got the same warning. Probably a bug on the other question
 
2:02 PM
Is this question possibly on-topic?
 
@JeanneDark I can see no reason to think so; voted to close as lacking details or clarity but probably several other close reasons would also apply
 
@JeanneDark Not enough information provided to tell!
 
thank you
 
(a pity the cap is at three close votes; some questions really inspire you to declare a competition to find as many reasons as possible)
 
Oh, look, someone removed a screenshot that contained an email address. I bet that'll attract a bunch of flags asking a moderator to redact that information. Pity there isn't a moderator around who cares.
 
 
2:42 PM
@Dharman I am not sure that needs to be deleted...
The information it provides still seems to be current and potentially useful.
Asking for an API doesn't seem like an external resource request...
 
@CodyGray What information is that? All I see is "you can ask here" type of answer
It doesn't ask for an API
 
@Dharman "Where can I find/how can I join the help desk?" "You can join it by sending subscribe request to this email address..."
 
Yeah, but that isn't a programming problem, is it?
 
I'm not arguing it's on-topic. I'm saying I don't see why we need to delete it.
 
I don't know. All this information is available on the linked page. I see no reason to have this duplicated on SO, especially that it's off-topic
 
2:51 PM
APIs are libraries, aren't they? Asking for an API is quite similar to asking for a library. At least it doesn't make much of a difference for me.
 
If you are asking for recommendations, then it's off-topic. If you are asking how to use a certain API or whether there is an endpoint that will do what you need, then it's on-topic
 
It's on-topic to ask how to solve a problem.
It's only off-topic if someone is asking for recommendations. Hence the usage of the word "recommendations" in the close reason.
 
3:09 PM
I remember reading somewhere that when clicking on link to a duplicate with no answers, you are automatically redirected to the dupe target. Is that true? And if so, how come this one doesn't redirect?
 
It does for users who aren't logged in
 
And the with no answer is important - it's why we don't like folks answering dupes!
 
@AdrianMole ...not in this case. But yes, in completely different cases other than this one, you are totally right!
 
@CodyGray Ah thanks. That was the missing piece...
 
3:33 PM
FQQ is now down to under 1k posts ... but we're still being asked to do 60 reviews per day. Bug or feature?
 
Frustratingly Quirky Questions?
 
... Yaakov's comment on his Meta answer suggested the threshold for the higher limit (originally 80) was 1,000.
@CodyGray Mostly, yes.
 
Oh, you're asking if there are bugs in the buggy thing. I see. Carry on.
 
Yaakov is generally pretty thorough when he sets himself on a task.
 
3:58 PM
 
@ekad Might be nifty if that tutorial link were edited into the tag wiki.
If anyone still remembers what a tag wiki is and where to find it.
 
That's the thing we all have to avoid like the plague, isn't it?
 
I think we're still supposed to be focused on avoiding the actual plague.
 
Is there a tag wiki for that?
 
4:41 PM
@bad_coder @CodyGray please move to dev/null my mistake
 
^ cc @rene
 
Oops
See, this is why you don't ping mods. We screw things up. :-(
 
LOL
 
@bad_coder See the FAQ rule #29: "If you want your request removed or retracted from the transcript prior to it being finalized, ping a Room Owner..."
 
4:45 PM
@Tomerikoo FTR, I am slightly biased when all the following conditions are verified: 1º OP never votes; 2º OP never accepts; 3º OP never responds to comments. That invariably leads to abandoned questions, which most of the time reduce overall quality.
 
There are only 5 active ROs, correct?
 
@JeanneDark uh, I know Cody has write access and was the last active user. But you're right, it should be an RO ping.
 
@bad_coder We might close it as missing MRE as it's only an image... The image is necessary to show the missing lines, but we don't have the code to verify it and therefore it might actually be a typo - somewhere else...
I convinced myself...
 
@Tomerikoo that's also a good call (no MRE and even the code in the screenshot isn't by itself MRE...)
(I also know I saw this as a duplicate on the PyCharm tag, but I can't get myself to search for it.)
 
@JeanneDark A CM once said that moderators are, by default, Room Owners in every room.
 
4:52 PM
All your room are belong to me.
 
... CMs are, too, apparently.
 
Oh, great, start pinging Catija for every message you want binned :-)
4
 
@Dharman There are only 5 ROs who are frequently in the room, and clean things up. A couple of the other ROs wander in sporadically.
 
@CodyGray Somebody did, in here, a short while back. Catija was ... bemused.
 
Isn't that her default state in here?
 
4:54 PM
I can neither confirm nor deny.
It's the italics what confooz peeps.
 
Maybe also the spelling
 
Nevva!
 
@CodyGray We tried that. It didn't work ;)
 
Heh - Looks like I just elevated Nathan to CM status.
 
5:01 PM
ninja'd by cigien
 
Yep :)
 
 
1 hour later…
7:01 PM
@AdrianMole While moderators have all the system-level authorizations which ROs have (and more), that doesn't mean mods have volunteered to take on the tasks involved with generally administrating how this room operates on a day to day basis (or even will understand what you're asking for when it's not a moderator-specific task). So, yes, technically a moderator could accomplish things like moving messages to /dev/null or the Graveyard, but that's not something they should be asked to do.
Unless, of course, the moderator has volunteered to act in that capacity.
 
I can't remember I ever volunteered for this ...
 
How about an alternate idea to the one I put forth yesterday:
 
@gparyani that is more than almost 6 to 8 years ago ....
I'm way over due
 
Allow moderators to remove a post from being eligible for use as review audits. (Precondition that the post must have been used as an audit once, and removal applies to all review queues, not only one.)
One reason this is useful is that spam is often used as audits in the low quality answers queue, and some spam answers were very subtle spam or troll posts that only a few users knew the details of. The workaround is that mods have to clear the spam flags to remove them from the audit pool, but it's better to have them in place for SpamRam and other things.
(@Makyen)
@rene I found it by searching for "has added rene to the list of"
There was only a month of messages before that, so I linear-searched to find your first message here
 
7:19 PM
@gparyani Without your precondition, I believe that's been requested multiple times.
I disagree with your precondition, because there are posts on which it's fairly easy for a moderator to determine before hand should not be audits. Basically, I see no real reason to prevent moderators from disqualifying a post from being an audit (or clearing such disqualification) at any time.
 
That's there so the team will be more likely to implement it. As an example, when the tool for mods to make questions ineligible for the Hot Network Questions pool was added, they decided not to make it possible for mods to proactively prevent questions from being added there in the first place.
From what I've seen, statistically, if the team disagrees with a small part of a request, the chances that the entire request will be declined increases.
stroopwafels
@Makyen I don't like that mods who aren't also ROs aren't formatted differently from mods who are ROs. Only the latter should have their name italicized.
 
@gparyani KLM used to give me them. That or Tuc biscuits ("Sweet or salty?", the Maidens-in-Blue would ask.)
 
I used to get mine from a vendor in Texas, they were really good
 
7:41 PM
@gparyani I don't disagree with that. However, my understanding is that it's not easy to do given how things are organized and still result in moderators being able to do everything they're supposed to be able to do. From the frontend's POV, I'm not aware of anywhere that data is easily obtained. It is available on the general room info and room access pages, so could be scraped from there, but that's usually not a good solution.
 
8:04 PM
@gparyani I don't think that would make it more likely for the team to implement the feature. Having that requirement makes it more complex, which would generally make it less likely to be implemented.
 
8:17 PM
@CodyGray glad you were eventually convinced by my charming arguments (and personality!) :D
 
8:50 PM
You know why mandatory comments when dowvoting would never work. This is why
 
9:32 PM
@CodyGray Hello, Cody. I fully rewrote my question, how it looks now? stackoverflow.com/questions/69404370/…
Cody is offline( maybe someone can say, how it looks now? ;)
 
9:48 PM
 
@desertnaut sorry again((
@desertnaut i look again like a dumba*** and my question was again closed(((
i need a break
 
@desertnaut Cody had previously interacted with @manro with respect to the linked question. So, in this case, pinging Cody was OK, as it was the continuation of an earlier conversation which Cody chose to engage in and I don't see anywhere that Cody asked for it to stop, although I could have missed that. Cody is welcome to bin the message pinging him, but it doesn't actually violate SOCVR's rules, so I'm not going to bin it.
 
@Makyen my sincere apologies to @manro then!
 
@Makyen we nicely talked today
@desertnaut no problems, im not touchy
 
9:59 PM
1 message moved to SOCVR /dev/null, by request
 
@manro touchy or not, I was wrong, so an apology was warrantied
 
@desertnaut Man, i found the answer to my question!!!
@desertnaut i reopen, moment
@desertnaut I need more votes
 
@manro see FAQ #10 "Do not ask for up- or down-votes on any posts."
 
@bad_coder It isn't an ask to vote)
 
Good to have that clarified :)
 
10:09 PM
@manro as @bad_coder says - glad to have this clarified, but then the question is why exactly post such a comment here
 
Ok, i edit my question and add answer there :) if it cant be reopened. Ok.
 
@desertnaut As a punishment, you will have to go and complete 10 reviews in the Help & Improvement queue.
... oh, hang on.
 
@AdrianMole :-O
@AdrianMole aren't you a bit too harsh, Your Honor? :D
 
My motto (or, one of the many) has always been: If it ain't hurting, it ain't working!
 
@AdrianMole Your Honor, please... no 10 reviews in that queue... :(
 
10:14 PM
15, then, for your impudence!
 
@AdrianMole LOL
 
You can see why I gave up on my aspiration to a legal career.
 
yeah, I think so... :D
@bad_coder out of CVs, sorry...
 
@desertnaut I corrected my question and add an answer, if you want - u can see. You have been already there today ;)
 
@desertnaut haha no problem. I've been out of CVs since the election week started.
@manro see FAQ #15 "Do not request action on posts or edits where you are involved or where you have a conflict of interest. "
 
10:19 PM
@bad_coder I can't live so. FAQ - FAQ - FAQ ;(((
Where is my ouzo
i will drink again
 
@manro What's an Ouzo?
 
@bad_coder alcohol
@bad_coder like Arak
 
@bad_coder Ouzo
 
@manro may I ask if you are from Greece?
 
{Shudders at the ancient memory of a week-long hangover from drinking Ouzo.}
 
10:24 PM
@bad_coder nop
@AdrianMole do you like it too?
 
I used to like it.
 
@AdrianMole The Man!
 
@AdrianMole powerful stuff.
@manro It says here destilation starts from an almost pure 96% ABV. From what is that initial distillation prepared?
 
Every - how shall I put it - de-gassing - operation I performed for 7 days brought back the taste/smell of aniseed.
 
@AdrianMole lol, those herbal extracts are devious...
 
10:29 PM
@bad_coder i dont know, but anise a wonderful thing
 
@bad_coder we drink in Greece (or at least we supposedly drink in, according to the folklore)...
 
@bad_coder and some recipes are secret
@desertnaut Ελλάς !!!
 
@desertnaut I was at a distillery last week and tried the 40% ABV as it poured out the alambique. In this case the distillation was from grapes after wine fermentation. But after that initial "hit" the perfect balance is when it settles at 22% vol overall.
 
@bad_coder yeah, that's the idea behind ouzo, too; but it goes to 40%...
@AdrianMole now I can see why your legal career went astray!
 
@desertnaut personally I'm not a big fan of Anis. The herbs alone don't do it for me and it's frequently saturated with sugar to cut it's aggressiveness. It's also not a refined drink (I never heard of aged Anis). But I'd be interested in trying it as a local delicacy, especially the more sophisticated varieties (that come with a guarantee of no adulterated additives).
 
10:36 PM
@bad_coder well, don't look at me - I only drink Irish whiskey (preferably Jameson) ;)
 
@desertnaut Whiskey, Whiskey Take My Mind ;)
 
The French version (Pastis, I believe) is smoother (there are better varieties than the common Pernod); the Turkish version (Arak) has some serious attitude.
 
@desertnaut the Irish is good, I'm more of a Scotch guy for the fuller body.
@AdrianMole I see your attitude comes from a variety of influences :)
 
Fun fact: The highest selling Whisky/Whiskey brand in my local bar (in Glasgow) - by far - is Jack Daniels.
 
@bad_coder ... did you say his legal attitude??? :D
 
10:39 PM
My attitude is mostly illegal.
 
@AdrianMole everything is gentrified. And lets be honest, Jack Daniels doesn't have that much quality (no offense to any fans out there.)
@AdrianMole you are deviant, of anarchic inclination...
 
@bad_coder @AdrianMole @manro guys, I'm having a great time, but I got to leave...
see ya later
 
@desertnaut Good night, man!
 
@desertnaut good evening, enjoy o/
 
10:40 PM
Another bar I hang out in occasionally has an excellent selection of real Bourbon Whiskeys.
Many call JD Bourbon but it isn't - wrong State.
 
@AdrianMole now that's more like it :)
 
Guys, what is a meta post?
 
@AdrianMole And it has more "power" or same like everywhere?
 
Different topic coverage. Meta is for questions about Stack Overflow. Issues you have, things you don't understand, review audits that you failed, etc.
 
10:51 PM
@manro if you want your post reopened YOU MUST post a request on meta :)
 
@bad_coder I pushed a button ''reopen'' and have already 2votes ;)
 
@manro somebody make mistake...
 
@bad_coder maybe it was a moderator :)
 
Moderator votes are immediately effective.
 
@AdrianMole good bye 👋
 
11:00 PM
@AdrianMole do you think we'll get any last minute moderator nomination?
 
Maybe.
What's the deadline?
OK - 20 hours to go.
 
@AdrianMole tomorrow 20:00 UTC
 
If you want to be a moderator i vote for you
In advance
 
Last time, Makyen was the last to nominate (well, of those who stayed in) and came first in the vote. But not exactly a "last minute" nomination.
 

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