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12:00 AM
Well that's the point of the channel from what I understand isn't it? Challenge the moderation and get better at answering/asking questions?
 
Oh god spider brb
Ok back
Yeah kinda
 
user4639281
Back
 
Reviewing your edit...
 
user4639281
@Mystra007 You modified the code which is an immediate red flag for reviewers.
 
@TinyGiant Check the comments, it may be a case of robo-reviewing
 
12:02 AM
I see - I felt that without modifying the code the question couldn't be understood
 
Mmmmh no even with the comments I still have no clue what's going on
 
user4639281
I would agree with "Changes the author's intent"
 
From my understanding the question was in essence asking if you can change the variable used for the switch in a case
 
yes but is your understanding likely to be the understanding of others?
If not, is your edit comment sufficient to turn the tables?
 
My understanding was based on OP comments
 
user4639281
12:04 AM
The problem is that the vast majority of users who are using the review queues may not necessarily be proficient in C++
 
especially this one: "case "file uploaded successfully: { Youtube_Uploader.fileuploadstatus = ""; return "upload completed"; } "
 
Oh wait I get it now
 
user4639281
Those edits really should have been done by the OP
 
Okay so yeah, the edit was sound
 
Yeah unfortunately he seem to have died in a internet traffic accident ;) never came back
 
user4639281
12:05 AM
You could comment along the lines of "You should [edit] your question to include blah, blah, blah...."
 
user4639281
Because it is such a massive edit, it would appear to reviewers that your edits deviated from the author's intent, even if it did not.
 
And being honest most reviewers are not going to check the comments of the question
 
What ticked off the mods is that the question could be understood in several ways and I chose a path right?
 
I don't think the question could be understood in any way o_o
 
user4639281
If the user doesn't come back, flag the question as unclear so it can be closed and automatically deleted unless the user comes back and edits their question into shape.
 
12:06 AM
At least not without the comments
 
user4639281
@Mystra007 You're saying "mods" but I see no moderator interaction on that post.
 
user4639281
The review queues are manned by regular users like you.
 
yep
 
Yes, there is a difference between Moderators (diamond users) and regular users with moderation capacities - everyone in fact
 
12:08 AM
Yeah I'm still confused by that - to me mods are peoples who have the power to close questions, accept edits, etc
 
You mean a question?
 
yep
 
user4639281
@Mystra007 I have the power to close a question, accept edits, etc. I am not a moderator.
 
If a question is not clear, flag it as so. However, if the user comments and adds information in the comments, ask him to edit it in
And, honestly, if the user is not able - oh hi @SmokeDetector!
 
user4639281
I am simply a user with enough rep to access the tools necessary for community self-moderation and interest in doing that.
 
12:09 AM
If the user is not able to click "edit" and add information in then what the hell is he doing on a professional programming website...
 
user4639281
^^^ That.
 
StackOverflow is not a good place for beginners
 
user4639281
This site is not for hand holding and there is a level of minimal understanding of the subject matter required to ask a question.
 
I wish that was more clear to everyone ;)
 
Which also means that yes, we are assholes to beginners sometimes
 
user4639281
12:11 AM
If I have to explain the very basics of a language in order to answer your question the it is most likely Too Broad for Stack Overflow, and should be closed as such.
 
Way too much graffittis on SO
 
If, for example, a user asks why his string comparison in Java throws a NullReferenceException
 
user4639281
Aug 10 at 16:03, by Tiny Giant
We bring out the best people, by crushing the worst.
 
That annoyed me when I first joined but now that I've been here for a while I understand why
 
He is going to see his question downvoted, badly-commented, flagged and closed and deleted
 
12:12 AM
I got bored on the train between quebec and toronto - that's 6 hours. SO has so much questions that I didn't even see time pass ;)
 
@TinyGiant There was also another one from @rene, I think "We spend so much time cleaning up the crap we forget we also help people sometimes"
 
It's mostly always the same 5-6 questions. At least in .Net
 
user4639281
@Mystra007 If a question has been asked before, find the previous question and flag the new one as a duplicate.
 
What was the purpose of this edit? stackoverflow.com/posts/8318911/revisions
 
12:14 AM
1) I don't understand how asp.net works which cause issue X 2) I need to use office Interop but the code sample I pasted doesn't work 3) I don't understand how OOP works so I can't do things between form X and Y 4) I didn't read MSDN about this usercontrol and I don't know how it works so it causes issue X
 
user4639281
The only thing that we can do is educate as many users as possible who are willing to help with community moderation and hope that they act as quickly as possible.
 
5) Can I do X in .net which I didn't even try or search because my dog ate my computer
 
Why did the 6k remove the snippet..?
 
6) I found a bug in VS can't find DLL X when it's right in the same folder. How could it be my fault?
That's the same 6 basic questions that keep coming again and again ;)
 
At least you don't do ^^
 
user4639281
 
I love how peoples says it's visual studio that has a bug when they don't even know a basic function like adding a reference to a project
 
@TinyGiant ty
 
user4639281
@Kyll np
 
user4639281
Although, you have the edit anywhere privilege.
 
I do, but I wasn't sure about it
 
user4639281
12:17 AM
@Mystra007 What people say does not matter as much as what the problem really and truly is.
 
user4639281
I can say that I think the problem is a bug in one part of my code, that does not mean that the answer should only address that part of the code.
 
user4639281
It simply means that through my debugging efforts it seems to me that the problem is coming from that part of the code.
 
Should I just mark those 6 basic questions as duplicate?
Duplicate of whatever question explain the concept best
 
user4639281
@Mystra007 Only if the answers posted to the dupe target answer the question at hand.
 
@Mystra007 If you know very good answers that should perfectly fit the question, then yes
 
user4639281
12:19 AM
If you think you can improve the answer to the dupe target to include the question you're reviewing, suggest an edit.
 
If you think the user has no idea what he's doing, downvote and move on
 
Ok I'll keep that in mind
 
user4639281
If the user isn't going to understand the answer to the other question because their understanding of the language is so minimal that the basics of the language would have to be explained as well, flag as too broad.
 
user4639281
200
A: Enable automatic deletion of old, unanswered zero-score questions after a year?

Jeff AtwoodJust to formally document the exact policies we have in place to remove old abandoned / dead questions, the Community user will delete questions in the following circumstances: If the question is more than 30 days old, and ... has −1 or lower score has no answers is not locked ...or... it ...

 
user4639281
12:22 AM
Based on the roomba rules listed in the post above. You can infer that the number of deleted closed questions is exponentially larger.
 
user4639281
The fact is that, while we currently have > 10 million open questions on Stack Overflow, we have far more that are closed and / or deleted.
 
Like, remember this 10 million questions thing? We're not even impressed
An dang it @TinyGiant beats me to it
 
user4639281
With the sheer volume of crap that comes in every day, we appreciate every small bit of effort put forth by those users participating in the community moderation efforts on Stack Overflow.
 
user4639281
And, honestly, the quicker bad questions get closed, the better Stack Overflow is for everyone.
 
user4639281
Quickly closing bad questions is one of the most educational things your can do for a new user.
 
12:27 AM
@TinyGiant I think I remember a bit of help about including all code and data in the body of the question, not outsourcing it. Do you have any idea where that might be?
 
user4639281
I'll see if I can find my discussion with easwee on here a while back. It would fit this perfectly.
 
user4639281
Aug 25 at 7:21, by Tiny Giant
@evc Honestly, from the face of it, your answer is basically "Use this code + <code dump>", without any explanation of why I should use that code, or how this code solves the problem without introducing others. I didn't downvote it myself, but from looking at it I can see that as a possible reason. However...
 
Never mind, it's here: stackoverflow.com/help/how-to-ask
 
user4639281
Follow the link and read that discussion, there is some pretty good information there.
 
It seems you have outsourced data crucial for the understanding of your question. Please post all relevant code, images and resources **in the question itself**, if the link dies or changes your question will lose most of its meaning! See [the help center](https://stackoverflow.com/help/how-to-ask).
@TinyGiant Didn't you spend waaaaay too much time on this?
 
user4639281
12:31 AM
@Kyll On that discussion?
 
How do I close a question for being too local? It seems to be gone
 
@TinyGiant Yes
Too local is so 2012
 
user4639281
@Mystra007 Simple error
 
user4639281
In most cases
 
user4639281
@Kyll That was basically an amalgamation of all of the comments I find myself repeating on meta questions.
 
12:33 AM
I mean something has to be done for questions asking how to connect to FGJFJ8908924 that a company has done in the 1970s, sold to 45 companies and the only hit on google is a pdf from a museum and the question on SO right?
 
@Mystra007 Something is done
The system automatically deletes questions that generate no activity
 
user4639281
@Mystra007 If the knowledge to answer a question is too localized for there to be an expert on Stack Overflow, it will eventually be automatically deleted.
 
Ok last question
 
user4639281
If the question is more than 365 days old, and ...

has a score of 0, or a score of 1 in case of deleted owner
has no answers
is not locked
has view count <= the age of the question in days times 1.5
has 1 or 0 comments
... it will be automatically deleted. These are "abandoned" questions.

These checks are run every week across all sites.
 
If you ask a question about something so specific you gain no upvotes, no answers, no visits, then I believe after a year the question is burnt away
 
12:35 AM
stackoverflow.com/questions/32465654/… this seems to be offtopic on SO because it's asking how to use a software
yet plenty of peoples asks questions on how to use Visual Studio
where is the line drawn? are question about debuggers and code diassembly offtopic?
 
Questions about the use of programming softwares are on-topic and often pathetic but still on-topic
 
user4639281
@Mystra007 Questions about using a programming tool for programming are on-topic
 
Since the user has a lot of rep and could remove the flagging I didn't know what to do
 
user4639281
@Mystra007 No user can remove a flag.
 
user4639281
Besides a Moderator.
 
user4639281
12:37 AM
That question is on-topic for Stack Overflow because it is about using a programming tool for programming
 
I still flagged it
 
user4639281
Questions about basic usage like "How can I change the font size in Eclipse" are off-topic
 
Searching the relevant meta post
 
linqpad is like a notepad for disassembled code (which is arguably illegal too)
It's kinda between OT and not to me
 
user4639281
Questions about general computing hardware and software are off-topic for Stack Overflow unless they directly involve tools used primarily for programming. You may be able to get help on Super User.
 
12:38 AM
and he's not asking how it will help a specific code but how to see more things in it
 
user4639281
@Mystra007 We are not lawyers here, the legality of a question never comes into play
 
user4639281
He's asking how to use a programming tool for a programming purpose.
 
It does when you answers - most countries have rules about complicity ;)
 
user4639281
@Mystra007 It does not matter on Stack Overflow.
 
And from what I've seen nobody ever help virus writers on SO
 
12:40 AM
As I said, you're not in ...
 
user4639281
If the copyright holder wants to submit a DMCA complaint to the Stack Exchange team, they can do that.
 
> most countries have rules about complicity
And about copyright
But it takes years to become an expert in just one country
 
copyright isn't illegal in most countries except the US
 
user4639281
@Mystra007 Not true, I've seen questions about viruses with lots of activity.
 
SO is internatonal
 
12:41 AM
it's not illegal in mine - it won't get you arrested
but you might lose in civil courts
 
I have absolutely no way to know if a question is "legal" or not
 
user4639281
The fact is that you cannot be arrested for activity on Stack Overflow, never.
 
Pet peeve of mine - I hate when peoples confuse liability in civil courts and illegal things
 
user4639281
Even if a DMCA complaint is filed and validated, the most that will happen is that your post will be removed.
 
> The fact is that you cannot be arrested for activity on Stack Overflow, never.
Well there is those Chinese activists...
 
12:42 AM
Illegal things involve violating CRIMINAL law
not civil law
 
You're from the US, right?
 
no, Canada
 
user4639281
@Kyll That's just craziness, that's not legality in any sense.
 
user4639281
@Mystra007 Where abouts?
 
Okay, SO is in the US
So basically
 
12:43 AM
province of quebec - doesn't matter since quebec doesn't have it's own criminal laws
 
user4639281
Alberta
 
To know if something you post is legal for me to read, modify and stuff
We have to understand basic copyright laws of Canada, US, the state in which SO is based, Europe, France
Trade agreements between all that
And who knows what else
That's why there is no question of copyright on SO
 
user4639281
Unless you are actually a lawyer, there is nothing you can do. If you are a lawyer, the only thing you can do is advise the Company that holds the copyright of the infringement.
 
yeah we need universal laws ;)
 
@Mystra007 1984 much? =p
 
user4639281
12:45 AM
Now, that said, all content on Stack Overflow is CC-by-SA with attribution
 
wait the US pretty much says their laws apply everywhere on the globe
their banking laws does, their copyright laws too. Whoops
 
@Mystra007 They don't say that, and if they did that'd be stupid. There is international trade agreements
 
anyway I'm getting offtopic
 
user4639281
So, Stack Overflow can and most likely will put some kind of punishment into effect if you have a habit of copying content from Stack Overflow without attribution and posting it as your own writing on Stack Overflow.
 
Let's talk about this again - I'll try to put into practice what I learned today
 
user4639281
12:46 AM
Because, when posting content on Stack Overflow, you immediately relinquish ownership of the content to Stack Overflow.
 
Come here any time
 
user4639281
If you have questions about the on-topicness of a post on Stack Overflow, this is a good place to ask.
 
I'm off to bed (add 6 hours to your time...), night!
 
user4639281
@Kyll G'night
 
See you all and thanks for all the info :)
 
user4639281
12:48 AM
@Mystra007 You're welcome, have a good night.
 
user4639281
I was just looking at that.
 
user4639281
 
user4639281
A little trick in there to avoid capturing the window.onresize event.
 
@cimmanon I want to know what he mixed in with his bourbon
sounds like quite a trip
(you can facepalm again, it's okay, I deserve it)
 
3:22 AM
@cimmanon When you said facepalm I thought you were referring to meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/305627/…
 
@Closey status
 
SOCVR ChatBot version 1.0.0.0, running for 4 days, 7 hours, 29 minutes and 21 seconds.
 
 
5 hours later…
8:31 AM
gone
 
Sam
9:29 AM
Morning
 
Yam
Yam v2 started (debug).
 
Sam
10:26 AM
@Yam search questions site:^stackoverflow\.com$ title:downvoting
 
Yam
@Sam No entries found.
 
Sam
Meh, worth a try.
 
Sam
10:36 AM
I would.
Or improve.
 
I have
yeah - could have improved, I guess
 
Well, I can't improve. Need 20k rep for that.
 
Sam
Just realised it's a tag edit. facepalm
 
There's only a newline missing but I can't add it as long as that useless other edit is pending.
 
11:29 AM
1 message moved to Trash can
 
11:48 AM
Good morning
 
Morning
 
Morning morning
 
Sam
Morning morning morning
 
12:07 PM
Err: print(' '.join(['Morning'] * 100), file=SOCVR)? :p
 
std::vector<std::string> foo(1000, "Morning");for (const auto & e : foo) std::cout << e << " ";
 
concat $ intercalate ' ' $ repeat "Morning" <- infinite, i win!
 
My favorite infinite loop construct in c++
#define EVER ;; for (EVER) std::cout << "Morning ";
 
12:25 PM
Yay. Serial downvoting reversed...
 
sweet
 
8
Q: Need a mentor for answer Guidance

Blakes SevenSo I am approaching three months now of general contribution here and have mostly been focusing on one "tag" in providing answers where I saw beforehand that the general answers were not of really good quality to serve the community as a whole, and have tried to provide better. Sometimes with su...

 
It's nice when things work as designed :)
 
werent you guys talking about this guy before? or was that the other chat room i am in?
 
Yeah yesterday. 10k rep and he has only been here a couple months
 
12:49 PM
I can't believe someone up voted this. it won't even compile: stackoverflow.com/a/32479531/4342498
 
1:10 PM
I hate cars.
 
@LynnCrumbling ?
 
Wife just called. P/S pump is making noise. Fluid is low. Puddle under car. sigh
 
Oh boy, if cars start to let go of their fluids it becomes bad quickly....
 
bummer.
 
She's at the garage now. They're diagnosing.
Ye$.
A bummer alright.
I love starting out my work day with calls like that.
 
1:15 PM
One of my coworkers got a bad call yesterday. lightning struck his house and started an attic fire. right now it is uninhabitable.
 
Jesus.
shudder We're supposed to have thunderstorms this afternoon.
 
yeah that is all i am thinking about for my place. Good news is they caught it quick so it can be saved.
 
1:39 PM
is there a limit to the number of Reopen votes per day you have?
@rene depends on what it is
 
Morning everyone
 
@TylerH other than windshield wiper fluid, i cant think of anything that wouldnt be bad (eg. expensive to fix)
 
It's time for the "why the heck didn't this flag get handled overnight, please reflag and downvote"
 
@durron597 morning
 
Sam
@durron597 morning
 
1:43 PM
@cimmanon water from running the A/C on full blast for one
 
@cimmanon No... I'm fully aware that I'm going to be lucky to get out of this for < 150.
 
@durron597 They're not actually asking for a tool, they're just asking for a way to do it...
 
@durron597 Seems like you have the dup line reversed; the question that you are flagging as a dup was asked in 2011; the one you're saying is original was asked in 2012.
 
@LynnCrumbling Duplicate is not always about age.
This late, it's about score and quality of answers also.
 
1:58 PM
^
 
No, but with 23 answers (one with over one hundred votes), it's not as if the question is less valuable in comparison to the other.
 
To elaborate, a brand new question by definition has worse answers than an older question because it has no answers.
@LynnCrumbling I'm not proposing deletion.
 
I know. I'm cranky. I haven't had my coffee. And cars suck.
 
@LynnCrumbling the target has much better answers, is structured better, and has more votes
 
Look, all requests in this room are always "cv-please" not "cv-or-i-stab-you". Do what you want, they're your votes.
8
 
2:00 PM
it just happens to be 3 years old instead of 4 :-)
@durron597 oh... oops
 
Perhaps ignoring me is the best approach today. I'll advise my coworkers too.
 
@LynnCrumbling Done
 
@durron597 I say no as from the other answers it seams like it would still happen as it is a VS issue. Could be wrong as I have never worked with that tech but that is my takeaway.
 
2:12 PM
@NathanOliver I'm on the fence.
It reads very spammy.
 
Yeah. It's not enough for me to do something about it. Ill let people in those tags handle it if they want to.
8 of his 36 answers mention his extension: stackoverflow.com/…
 
@NathanOliver C# room says kill it
 
@durron597 it's a low quality answer at least
if the link dies, it's useless
 
@durron597 Spam or NAA?
 
@NathanOliver the guy in that room flagged NAA
So did I.
 
2:21 PM
We should go through these then too: stackoverflow.com/…
 
3
A: Design-time T4 templates in ASP.NET 5 (VS 2015)

FrankThe ASP.Net 5 (vnext) project is a completely new animal and technically still in beta, its not scheduled for RC til November 2015. Also it's attempting to be completely cross platform so initially the team favored using razor templates instead of T4 for scaffolding. They had no plans to suppor...

> This guy's answers on this subject are bad enough to warrant extra moderator scrutiny. Honestly, they should all probably go. They don't answer the question, they don't explain how the tool should be used, really.
 
Mod flagged
> This user has 8 answers all like this that really don't answer the question and instead points out that he has an extension that will do everything they want. He does not tell them how to use the extension just that it will do what they want. I think this might be a misuse of self promotion. the answers I found are here: stackoverflow.com/…
 
And I'm out of flags by 9:30 AM. Wonderful
 
Well... $330 for a new p/s pressure line. sigh
Better than a burned-up attic, though, right?
 
Yeah. Is the $330 just parts or total?
 
2:35 PM
Total.. after tax. Part is 220, or so they say.
 
Not too bad. What type of car?
 
I started to see what I could get it for, but the fact that my wife needs the car today (read: I'd have to leave work and go home and fix it right away) means I'm sort of screwed.
'05 Honda Odyssey
It feels like they're marking the part up by about $50, and the garage is charging about $75 an hour.
 
@LynnCrumbling Aren't wives just demanding? ;)
 
@NathanOliver I should probably mouth.insert(this.foot); or something
^ oh Amy... what are you doing..
 
@LynnCrumbling Trying to log into FB, obviously :P
 
2:39 PM
hahaha
 
> I'm voting to close this question as off-topic because We are not Facebook support.
^^
 
^ this
 
That was me
 
I know ^^
nice one
 
2:40 PM
How is that still open?
 
It's nice when you can get a good custom close reason.
 
@LynnCrumbling well, smokey doesn't vote, and without him, we're only 4 people here
 
Low traffic tags?
 
Slap on there. <grin>
 
@LynnCrumbling And summon the Skeet? ^^
 
2:42 PM
there needs to be a :)
 
definitely
 
that would be awesome.
 
@Siguza Hadn't thought of that... yeah, this time of day, he might peruse it.
 
1
A: Why are the time limits in here?

durron597Question rate limiting is in place for a few reasons. Spam. We want to ensure spammers can't post too much too quickly. When you have low reputation, we can't be sure if you're a spammer or a regular new user, but these restrictions lift as time goes on. Research. We want you to research your q...

 
Maybe OP's will see it and add it themselves
 
2:43 PM
@NathanOliver but it should be something like the red tags on meta, something that only 3k+ users can use
 
You know...
It would be interesting to come up with a custom format for comments that Closey could monitor....
 
@durron597 trying to get a reversal? ;)
 
And alert the room whenever someone adds a comment like $$close$$:dup
Somehow, I can see mgmt getting upset about that.
 
@NathanOliver badges Badges BADGES BADGES BADGES BADGES!!!
 
Since the comments are unlikely to be understood by anyone outside of the cv room.
 
2:46 PM
joking aside, I think more thought has gone into the time limits than you suggested in your comment.
 
Of course but it is still just an educated guess
 
@TylerH closed
 
3:04 PM
Laugh... taking a survey... they want to know what our preferred language is....
Choices include - "Ruby" ... "PHP" .... "C++" .... "VB6/C#/.Net"
Somehow, whoever wrote the survey decided that it was wise to group vb6 in there.
Because it's so much like .net :)
 
No Haskell option?
 
@NathanOliver It's a serious survey
 
Apparently node.js made the cut.
Their actual phrasing was, "preferred development environment"
 
I have heard good things about it.
 
3:08 PM
php is not a development environment :)
 
@LynnCrumbling VB6 is nothing like vb.net
 
@durron597 tell me about it...
@durron597 I'd love to know whose idea it was to even list it...
 
@LynnCrumbling clearly your php-fu is not strong
@LynnCrumbling it's probably an HR person who was given a sheet of terms and words by an IT project manager, or worse, a non IT project manager
 
@TylerH And I'm sure their next logical conclusion was.. hey, aren't both of those microsoft products? Let's combine them into the same option!
 
3:19 PM
"visual basic 6 is just an earlier version of visual basic .net! they have the same name!"
 
"they just changed the number 6 to the word .net... how different can it be?"
 
Apparently they forgot to consult the Skeet
 
@LynnCrumbling probably. "Microsoft languages? Let's lump them together"
which, in practice, is probably not that uncommon
most people in Microsoft shops will have exposure with lots of different Microsoft offerings
though not exactly VB6...
 
@TylerH That's definitely true of our shop...
@TylerH Sadly, this is also still true.
 
ouch
at least here we are starting to modernize
luckily Microsoft is ending paid support for old IE so all workstations here will be IE11 by January/February
all 3,000 of them or so
and we're also starting to develop using .NET 4.5+ rather than 3.5 or 4.0
 
3:26 PM
@TylerH Yeah, our new product is all 4.5
Which sucks for the XP people...
but hey...
 
14 year old OS
 
I'm in the process of rewriting the last vb6 product.
I expect to be done in mid 2016.
Then I can uninstall that mfg-forsaken dev env.
 
3:42 PM
Does that mean you have still a floppy drive in your PC so you can reinstall the IDE when needed?
 
@rene If by PC, you mean Apple //gs, yessir.
Sadly, vb6 would be an upgrade for that thing.
It actually has a 5.25 AND a 3.5"!
 
3:57 PM
@Deduplicator Thanks, edited it in
 
4:14 PM
@NathanOliver are you calling me a hipster?
 
@cimmanon Yes. I am making broad assumptions and ignoring all outliers :P
 
It was encrypted with ASCII.. in hex format. With an asterisk out front. — Lynn Crumbling 13 secs ago
 
@cimmanon That was a good laugh. Still not sure if I like C++ == fridgebike
 
Fridgebike! <3
 
4:27 PM
@SmokeDetector ignore- needs to be closed
@SmokeDetector ignore- rolled back edit
@TylerH BOOM
 
that was loud
 
forgot caps was on. I hate that our erp software is all in caps
 
Enterprise Resource Planning?
 
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