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21:00
Should I be using JS to include snippets such as the sidebar or just leave it to PHP?
depends on a lot of things
if they're static elements let your template engine deal with it (whatever that may be)
if they're dynamic you don't really have a choice now do you
Hm I don't even have a template engine
Or is that PHP?
Haha
what fresh bullshit is this
fresh?
dude thats old af
daily 10,000 fam
21:04
we've been through like 7 major JS frameworks since its discovery dude.
old af.
Lol when you count time in JS frameworks
That was supposed to hit us in 2012 right?
Planet X
has some other weird name can't remember lol
planet nine
I remember that was one of the stupid 2012 theories
Nerobu or some shit
21:05
all I've ever known it by
user1596138
Nibiru
^ yep
> That would be a pretty quick path from hypothetical planet to confirmed world. The existence of Planet Nine was seriously proposed for the first time just in 2014, by astronomers Scott Sheppard and Chadwick Trujillo, of the Carnegie Institution for Science in Washington, D.C., and the Gemini Observatory in Hawaii, respectively.
shit @rlemon you must have some insider knowledge :P
@Loktar ohh yea, super secret information you can only get on wikipedia :P
It does if you look long enough.
21:09
lmao @Luggage
I thought you meant it was old af
2014 isn't that old is what I'm saying
@Loktar it is in JS world.
5 mins ago, by rlemon
we've been through like 7 major JS frameworks since its discovery dude.
React was out in like 2013
6 mins ago, by rlemon
old af.
that was like... before I had pubes maaaan
21:10
speaking of react.. what is after that?
(I did have pubes, I checked)
@Luggage hopefully some browser implementation of the virtual dom? idk
I'd have said react is still going strong
I've almost caught up on the technical debt converting to react caused. I need something new.
I'd really just like to see and use real web components
21:11
well, that's on the vendors, not the developers
web components for being able to distribute 'controls', but I think react does more for an application than they do.
They aren't direct competitors, I think.
react has the virtual dom and the automatic rerenders which is nice
I'd love to see that combined with web components
shadowdom, yes please
but tbf, with the way things are going right now, update optimizations aren't that useful, except for facebook or other overly crammed places (amazon?)
If you wanted to select a 3rd party control, and it wasn't written in react (or whatever you are using), then web components might be a better lowest-common-denominator.
I can see their use even in internal applications
21:13
My knowledge of web components is.. fuzzy.. though.
@towc when I was your age people never imagined any client 'apps'. wasn't a thing. more than 100 lines of JS was crazy to consider. going forward it's clear the trend is to pack everything you can into the browser
no worry about collisions with styles or JS
ohh, yea. useful.
apparently youtube is being done with web components
so these optimisations are important and useful
21:14
@rlemon yeah, which is why I think web components are the way to go
oh, I see...
sword is double-edged
Meanwhile, I'm still struggling against Chrome manifest jsons XD
I'm not saying web components are the future or anything, I think the hype was killed a lot with react honestly
but I think they are damn cool.
@Loktar React might push for them tbh, look how jQuery influenced the DOM apis
yeah that would be cool
I think I'm still missing what is preventing the browsers to implement react on their own, as to reduce load-time for the users and have it run faster coz not JS
21:16
@towc same questions were said over and over about jQuery
well, that's web components...
some browsers even toyed with the idea of embedded jQuery iirc
sort of @towc
components is one piece
user1596138
CSS Grid in Chrome?
21:17
but react provides render updates and a few other nice things web components aren't really built for
user1596138
Flexbox not even fully supported yet lol...
but... you could make a component that has react components
and they auto update lol
@rlemon the only good thing about jQ other than cross compatibility (which is the main reason people use it now I think) was selectors, I really doubt it was easier to read. Surely browsers can't help with cross compatibility like that...
@Loktar but they can
@towc you're missing a bunch of history then.
hum, most likely :/
user1596138
21:18
@Loktar tf is this developers.google.com/web/fundamentals/vr Grapple Hero ;)
FF has webvr too
user1596138
Yea first line says it's in Samsung Browser, FF Nightly and Chrome
maybe it's just me though, but I think VR's hype is dying a bit :?
I hope so. Makes me jelly
user1596138
Tbf, the market was extremely limited to begin with lol
user1596138
21:19
They'll have to make a comeback once more people have supporting hw
yeah 2nd gen headsets will help it I imagine
other thing is that cheapness doesn't even seem to be the issue
and phones that can do positional tracking
google cardboard was heavily available
can you lease one?
user1596138
21:20
I personally see no reason for ME to buy one..
user1596138
I want one, purely for the fuck of it tho lol
@towc google cardboard was more like a viewmaster though
I guess that major game companies haven't fully gone behind VR yet?
that's what's a bit frustrating
user1596138
@towc That was terrible..
21:21
the phone VR is nothing like "real" VR
I fear that I'll buy one, play with it for a week, then never use it again.
user1596138
And IMHO distracted from real VR?
@Luggage hah that would be cool
@Loktar how about R?
I would love to lease new tech rather than buy
Mine has sat unused 95% of the time :/
21:21
omg
VR headset rental
more like 98%
user1596138
@Loktar Doesn't even come with something to hold it on your head..... lol
Remember when blockbuster existed a d you could rent console?
oh,that's a thing already, makes sense...
@rlemon yea
21:22
blockbuster existed?
they had a case for the Virtual Boy that is sought after
user1596138
lol you could rent a last-gen console for like $60/night... Never was worth it at all
user2620028
@Loktar we have a video rental place in my area that does stuff like that, although i don't think they have done vr
user1596138
Family Video still rents shit like that. At least in 46725
user2620028
but they always have the new games / consoles on release day
user1596138
21:22
Yea, most difficult way to share a location ;P
user2620028
@Jhawins oh shit yeah im talking about family video
uh oh someone needs help
@Jhawins not for sleepovers it wasn't. rent the console + 2 games for 2 nights three days.
/me waits for it.
no one goes home
fuck those were the days
user1596138
21:23
@rlemon For renting it twice you could've bought it...
ours didn't have console rentals up in Northern MI
Hey guys, i know this isnt technically a full on JS Question. I just wondered if anyone had used flexibility.js for flexbox polyfill and whats their thoughts.
@Jhawins not really dude, no.
user1596138
It was literally half the price to buy the console to rent it for like 1 night haha
maybe at your shitty stores
21:23
^ ding there was the help I knew it :)
user1596138
Your store was better then.
user1596138
Mine was never economical.
@KirstyMarks check out autoprefixer
ok, thanks
works great for flexbox
21:24
autoprefixer cal polyfill flexbox?
it will polyfill back to IE9 or 10
well... idk if polyfill is the right word
oh thats cool!
but it will use the old prefixes based on the browser
user2620028
21:24
i never knew that family video was so widespread. i thought it was local to illinois
ohh. maybe you mean IE10, which has non-standard flexbox
IE9 has none
user1596138
@HatterisMad We are a few short hours from you...
so IE9 would need a polyfill, IE10, just prefixes
user1596138
Does yours have a Marcos/Little Ceasars in it too now?
21:25
yeah 10 good point @Luggage
interesting you say that luggage. Hence i was wondering.
user1596138
Our Family Video knocked down the wall for the porn section and put in a pizza shop..... Idk if I'd eat that pizza
user2620028
@Jhawins the family that owns family video lives in my town so i didn't really even think about it being a national chain
it's a film stage
they're just making new porns
user1596138
> In 2003, Family Video relocated its headquarters from Springfield to Glenview,
user1596138
21:26
Looks like you are correct lol.
user2620028
oh rip
@KirstyMarks what is the oldest IE you are supporting?
Give up now.
user2620028
@Jhawins yeah the hooglands are... special
21:27
try telling my company that .... its standard unfortunately. I was considering conditionals and floats (which seems to work somewhat) as a fallback.
yeah you won't be able to polyfill any sort of flexbox back that far unfortunately :/
the answer i got was as long as it renders ok ish, it stands :S
totally get that loktar. Thanks for the honesty
haven't seen you around here in a while
how have things been?
yea, i got banned from using this at work XD
ouch wtf?
21:29
The reason that isn't a good reason, is that it hold you back from using any newer JS libraries, that are often IE9+
same job?
yea its been good ta!! yep same job lol
user2620028
your job banned your best resource :(
Well, TBH I think staying away from chats at work is the only sane way to get something done ;)
well i can access the questions and ask, but my questions aint exactly been the best in the years, so i have to be careful Hatter XD
21:30
and makes you support a browser with 1% market share, that is insecure, costing you the ability to use modern tools
@Loktar wut? Surely the design can be implemented with tables on browser detection
find a new job
user2620028
@Zachiel just have to be responsible
@towc yeah that's using tables though
hahaha! Good outlook Luggage, i see your point.
21:30
@HatterisMad I don't think I am
I mean you could use tables for sure lol
supporting IE 8 is a costly choice
user2620028
@KirstyMarks constant name changes then?
user2620028
@Zachiel then yes chat can eat away your life
hahah no managed to stick to the same, ive just been lurking in the bg tbh. Got some sterling material a late!
21:31
@HatterisMad that assumes we have lives to begin with :/
we're sorry.
Alcohol is my life
user2620028
@rlemon borrow against your video games
user2620028
use kerbals as collateral
@HatterisMad This is why I'm here rather than trying to test my manifest XD
21:33
Hi duudes
@Luggage unfortunately when i work in a big corporate company and IE8 is still being used it has to have some basic support
@BrianJ hey pretty lady
user2620028
everytime i read @loktar's about section i get creeped out and then read further and realize he is just a clapton fan.
Me too Kirsty 😭
You feel my pain Brian :(
21:33
@towc hey there
@KirstyMarks Right. But it's insecure and it uses outdated JS. So.. I literally mean it's a costly decision. More developer time, risk of security threats.
user2620028
i couldn't claim to know your pain. supporting ie8.. whew
@BrianJ doing anything tonight?
And it implies that your company is so behind on updates that they are stuck with it.
It's a bad sign.
@Luggage i get your point. Completely.... the last person i spoke to about IE8 support told me to run... and run and dont stop
21:34
HAMMERTIME!
user1596138
@rlemon Was thinking the same lol
So.. You need to learn to argue the business side. Not that just IE8 is disgusting.
user1596138
Web apps as ALL apps
user1596138
I don't like the direction.
@towc trying to figure out why adding doublescroll cuts off the final column on my datatable when I scroll to extreme right..is all
I mean holy christ i used bluebird a few months back on a project, getting that through was a nightmare!..... due to lack of support. Its a good job i had a fallback.
hey guys I have a bug in my code and I have no idea how to solve it
@Jhawins at least with native apps there was a layer of .. idk.. "this should be here"
21:36
I have been on it for an hour, and I am sure it's a small synthax problem
@Barnabe start from the beginning. Is there an error?
user2620028
@Barnabe is that like anthrax?
no
is there an error
you need to do it yourself, son
or daughter
@Luggage I get bounce back with UX and lack of W3C compliance even more so a late. My arguments fall on deaf ears unfortunate :S
21:37
the bug is probabl located in lines 112 and 113
@towc have you came across that before? A scrollbar not scrolling all the way horizontally
> index.html?editors=1010:2 Uncaught SyntaxError: Unexpected token }
@towc XD
did you see what causes this syntax error?>
lack of w3c compliance? wtf?
they support ie8. they can't care about that
21:37
I know this message
but I know know what causes it
@BrianJ what you on about?
don't know*
example?
yep, when i state that colour ways are breaking accessibility guidelines @Luggage.... im slowly being listened to.....
On ma phone @towc can try
21:38
aye babe
but the IE thing isnt going to go away yet. Although sister company has removed IE8 support i overheard along the grapevine. At least something is moving into the 21st century
btw just as a side note. I fkin hate flexbox....
By upgrading to IE9, you get ES5. A newer version of JS that many new libraries (React, etc) require.
Just that one bump means a lot.
@Luggage I was the one that introduced them to the validation checker for HTML..... yes, no words.
IE8 didn't even ES5? 0.o
In most situations IE support costs more than you will be making from people who use IE
21:40
No. It was ES3.
heh, that's news to me
it lacks getters/setters and other things that I forget
Totally see the point there. TBF, stuff that we often do isnt massively code orientated these days. I got excited when i got to do a randomiser recently.... although I think it could have been written shorter in regards to JS, but it did the job XD
@Luggage My time to shine, IE8-10 are falling out of PCI compliance
21:42
How do you hate flexbox
flex is amazing
@jake thats an interesting point. I wonder how my company would fall with that
@SterlingArcher I think its because i dont fully get it yet :S
:waves:
Wow I haven't been around here in forever. Hows everyone doing :-D
I read that June of this year is the deadline, after that all new apps CANNOT support IE10 and below
ugh don't do that...
@rlemon The problematic function should be the cursorSelect(..)
21:43
i hate it when people say "I hate something" and the reason is because they don't know it
Hi @SeanLarkin
I like it atm @SterlingArcher, finally got it working in IE10 and 11, which is great..... LOL
Hate with a reason you pleb
@KirstyMarks Let me go grab a recent email with my sources, we just dropped IE9
21:43
@phenomnomnominal hi!
thanks for webpack yo :P
Switched to a new branch 'webpack2'
Actually i kinda am @rlemon @Loktar will vouch for that
Oh heh, don't just thank me, its the community, our contrib base and the other maintainers. I'm just the flashy one.
@SterlingArcher Do everything with a reason
21:44
:-P
And thanks for using it!
@Barnabe okay - then your issues are caused by your use of inline events and html strings - which is why it is recommended to avoid mixing them.
@SeanLarkin AngularCLI is the best!
@SterlingArcher i do with a reason.... Its purely because it wasnt doing what i wanted it to. HOWEVER now because it is working, im happy. However i love the concept behind it. I use it in pretty much everything now days.
@Luggage how was the webpack 2 upgrade!? 👏
Does AWS s3 have a problem with storing tarballs?
21:45
@jake have they worked out the customisation stuff yet?
We moved away from it because we couldn't find a nice way to mess with the webpack conf
@jake Nice! I feel bad, its been awhile since I've been able to contribute to angular-cli, I know mostly advise and help support or troubleshoot webpack/angular stuff.
simple. I manually re-did all my loaders in the new format, which was the longest part.
@SterlingArcher codepen.io/enxaneta/full/adLPwv Im so loving this right now thou
Our bucket policy permissions are wildcareded, and one directory syncs and ls fine, however, the directory with a tarball in it yields access denied errors on the aws cli tools
@rlemon It's weird, I have used this kind of structure a lot of times (even if it's not very orthodox) and had no problems with it
21:46
@Luggage ours was pretty straightforward too
@phenomnomnominal soon enough they will expose it. Will probably be as a nodeAPI which is how we use webpack in the angular-cli.
@Barnabe wouldn't be the exact same structure. right now your escaped HTML translates to onclick="foo("bar")"
see the error?
Oh did I see someone drop @Loktar does he still lurk around here?
@phenomnomnominal I never had needed anything that the CLI did not already do, what was something you needed to change?
@SeanLarkin yeah, hopefully we can get back on the CLI at some point
21:47
@Loktar you ever make it back to Michigan?
@jake heaps. I think bundle hashing was one of the first stumbling blocks we hit
that was a few months ago though
@rlemon I think so, I am trying something now
We use Vue at my (real) job. Evan killed it when he designed that library. Made perfectly for webpack also.
@Barnabe simply replacing the conflicting quotes would correct it. but I'd urge you to avoid calling events and building elements like that
It worked

(var circle = "<i onclick=\"cursorSelect(\'O\'); \" class=\"fa sym fa-circle-o\" aria-hidden=\"true\"></i>";)
21:48
Coolest thing: any place where you can pass a child component, you can also pass a Promise that returns a child component. instant code splitting api built right into your library or framework.
I got an interesting linked in message from a recruiter with a job using wearable tech and nodejs/go
Not sure if I should reply just out of curiousity
@phenomnomnominal I use: ng build --aot --prod --output-hashing none --sourcemap true --verbose true
@rlemon Thank you very much. I will try to reformat it in a more efficient way
anyone else use Old Spice ? is it just me or are they making this shit last less and less time ??
Maybe you are over-doing it.
21:50
@jake oh that's cool
it's not even 5pm and I smell like a dirty mule
Get a co-worker drunk and ask them.
@rlemon hot
oh no, I'm not playing that game again
last time I played smell the lemon i ended up at the proctologists office
@phenomnomnominal Seems like a lot of recent features have been added, one think I cannot wait for is reverse-proxy support.
21:51
@SterlingArcher smell this 👉
To whoever was asking about IE: How the credit card industry is helping the adoption of modern web standards blog.silverorange.com/…
2016 sees Internet Explorer usage collapse, Chrome surge arstechnica.com/information-technology/2017/01/…
@SterlingArcher If a dog was a proctologist...
Customers on IE10 - older and Windows Xp & Vista are falling out of PCI compliance. No new work/apps can support these platforms and "All applications, old or new must support TLSv1.1 by June of 2018".

The day after this article, Microsoft announced Support for older versions of Internet Explorer ended https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/WindowsForBusiness/End-of-IE-support
@jake having any one browser at 50%+ (or approaching) isn't a good thing
browser wars benefit everyone but the vendors losing
!!afk home time
21:54
I agree, but less IE is always a good thing, even at the cost of a Chrome surge.
Edge has been very good at adopting web standards thus far.
does so dark them support edge
@KevinB only chrome extension support
then i can't use edge
but if someone is willing to help setup the build for edge / ff I'd be okay with that
only thing i hate about chrome atm is the backspace situation
21:56
Just installed the dark theme last week, great little plugin.
there is an extension for that
fortunately i can fix it with a flag on the shortcut at least
yeah, i hate the idea of having an extention for a basic functionatlity that should exist
eh, it's small and simple
restores a bad UX decision, so I'm okay with it
--enable-blink-features=BackspaceDefaultHandler
extensions sync
flags do not
afaik
21:58
I use the plugin that mimics Opera gestures. eg: drag-left right-click to go back
!!afk 🏠
Hi, I can use this to refresh a div on a page $('#thisdiv').load(document.URL + ' #thisdiv');
but how do i show the div when its refreshes
.show() when it refreshes?

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