« first day (1123 days earlier)      last day (4043 days later) » 

17:00
deep still comes back and asks stupid questions
Is it just me or does this seem rather.. ridiculous?
76
Q: Flags in chat are defective by design

Benjamin GruenbaumYes, I know the topic has been discussed before. I know that Meta already has threads that complain about how flagging doesn't work. I wanted to give a practical example. Today, a user came in to the JavaScript chat and asked the following question: Hey guys, as soon as I embed javascript,...

@Sklivvz @balpha How about some treatment? This is the second bounty on it. It's about abusive behavior legitimate users receive in chat. Users asking legit questions and getting suspended for no reason. THAT doesn't bother you?
yup, the mute system has kept the room nice :)
we quite successfully manage ourselves in here (quite a bit moreso than some rooms of notable size) and we have put into place a few systems to fix things in the current system that were causing us headache and that no one was going to fix for us. why now are we being eye balled as doing bad stuff. we are not putting anyone out of a job, we are not abusing the system. we expanded it to our needs. we innovated
12
Seriously, if community managers want to have real discussion about the chat we'd love to do that. Barging in and just telling us to change things without hanging around and seeing what we put up with comes off as condescending. If you don't like some of what we do and you have reasonable arguments we're willing to listen and comply but please, let's have real discussion about it.
17:02
not to mention most of these features were implemented with moderator approval or the approval of meta
but that is splitting hairs at this point
brb smoke, don't go on any tangents without me
It was a day like any other day. The peaceful residents of the SOJSChat town were happily chatting away just as they had done for every day prior under the caring oversight of their elected leader, @CapricaSix.

But, on this day... This day, something changed. The dark overlords came to their quiet town. They silenced @CapricaSix. They took away her cheerful greeting. They took away her useful moderation features. They dethroned her from her rightful place as ruler of the town and locked her away in @rlemon's basement.
@stewbydoo not sure
i sware it was you who answered it
son of a beee sting
@mikedidthis nope. IMO unless they're honest at actually helping us with the challenges we face they should just forget they ever came here. We're doing a good job taking care of ourselves. If they are honest - discussion is always welcome.
oh was it like an oriental scene?
17:04
@nderscore put it on tumblr
I did a continuous background for a question a while back that had an oriental cartoony scene
@BenjaminGruenbaum ahh ok, I remove my comment then
yea
17:04
found it :)
@rlemon I didn't know that until just now
^ because you none of the community managers reads meta posts about chat.
man i'm hungry
@FlorianMargaine Yes, I know it now.
user1125394
17:05
hmm guys, is angular one of the best way to go for a site?
We also talked with plenty of other mods about it.
@Loktar I like that, is it just basic "draw another picture when scroll uses x% of old image"?
ThiefMaster is just the one that's here most often.
what kind of site?
@cↄ Many big serious sites use it. Ergo it's probably one good way for certain sites/developers. Besides that, you need to be more specific.
17:07
ThiefMaster is our hero
@cↄ It solves certain problems . It's not a silver bullet.
It does certain things well and others poorly.
some people reminded me so much of Indian Politicians :D , i used to think that behavior is india specific but nah ... its global !
@GNi33 yea
17:08
@BenjaminGruenbaum nobody is banning your bot. We simply asked you to disable the automessage feature. So far I've heard no arguments so far in favor of a blanket automated message to all newbs.
And then there are these people...
-2
Q: Notice: Undefined variable: guery, Fatal error: Call to a member function execute() on a non-object

KetOkay, I now that there's a lot of questions like this, but I'm really stuck and I don't know what to do, and it's pretty urgently. This is my code in article.php file: class Article { public function fetch_all () { global $pdo; $query = $pdo->prepare ("SELECT * FROM articles...

guery.
I'll simply assume there are none :-D
@Sklivvz the real problem was that there was no real argument against it from your side either
@Sklivvz we've still not heard any reasons to kill it aside from the meta reasons which like I've mentioned, do contain loopholes. We are a larger room, but we are still a user run niche room
how do we not qualify to decide whether or not we want the message
i don't think anyone of the regular users in here cares that much about the autogreet-feature
17:09
@Sklivvz Oh I don't think you'd ban our bot. People come here often and ask to ask a problem. They also don't read the room rules. The welcome message fixes that and let's them know what the common etiquette in this room is and learn about the community.
@GNi33 no but where does it stop
^ exactly
@GNi33 I find it amusing. Especially when n00bs converse with the bot.
@Sklivvz I've seen a couple. It stops users from asking, "Can I ask this?" questions, and prompts them to just ask and see where it goes. As minimal a reason that is, it's more reason I've seen on the manager end to explain why you are doing what you're doing.
now I see access control being 'axed' the same way
user1125394
17:10
ok guys
which is probably one of the bots more useful features
@RyanKinal there are many new people who are thankful for the welcome.
@RyanKinal yeah, everyone does, and that's probably a good reason against it from my point of view
@rlemon WHY DID YOU MENTION ACCESS CONTROL?
17:10
:sssssshhhhhh:
both solve actual problems we were having which is why there were implemented in the first place
thats the one feature I could see being questioned and removed
@Sklivvz as for "You didn't give us reason, so why should we give you reason?" .. really? It's gonna be like that?
@Loktar why? all the bot does is auto grant access to users who WE did not revoke it from
(Not a direct quote obviously)
17:11
@rlemon let's defer on that for now -- it was sanctioned from above after all, even though I didn't know about it. The only thing I care about at the moment is the auto-greeting
@RyanKinal I did. I don't think hiding things from SE moderators is a good thing
@rlemon Im not saying I dont agree with it, just saying I could see it being looked at by higher ups and being an issue
@balpha but why do we not qualify as a room that can decide this on our own. we are after all a niche room
@FlorianMargaine yeah, agreed
we are not a general room
again, I'm not personally invested in this command. but I am defending those who are! also I still don't see how outside of this room, anyone would care that said message is being said (in this room) .
17:13
Ok sorry please entertain me once more. What are the advantages of an automated welcome message over a manual one? I promise I won't bother you further :-D
Somebody is burning the SHIT out of their toast right now. It's almost the the point where it smells bad. Right now it's the delicious burnt smell.
4 mins ago, by Benjamin Gruenbaum
@Sklivvz Oh I don't think you'd ban our bot. People come here often and ask to ask a problem. They also don't read the room rules. The welcome message fixes that and let's them know what the common etiquette in this room is and learn about the community.
!!welcome
@BenjaminGruenbaum That is not an answer to my question
you're not responding to any of our questions either
@Sklivvz what if everybody is afk and a new user comes in. No welcome, just silence. They won't be prompted to just ask the question, they'll be met with nothing.
Plus, isn't automation what programming is all about?
17:15
let's just get rid of this one feature, who cares
@Sklivvz what is ease of automation over doing manually ?
@Sklivvz when someone joins it (a) notifies room users about it easily so we can talk to him (b) notifies them about etiquette without further interaction required from other users.
which can be done manually
besides do you know , she won't ping you everytime you come in.. its just the first time !
@Sklivvz A lot of us aren't necessarily paying attention to the room. We idle, and check every so often. We'd much rather check and find a question waiting for us than a question about asking a question.
17:15
@Sklivvz we had issues of users coming in and constantly asking to ask. This was getting VERY annoying and turned into us actually not being helpful because the user came in and was instantly annoying to us. The solution was to create the un-offical rules and to keep pinning stars saying "DONT ASK TO ASK". This became VERY annoying as well so the solution was a greeting message from the bot.
If we were forced to run the command manually we would A) have to know when a new user entered, which is not feasable. or B) !!welcome users after they have already done the thing the message stops the
angry regulars not helping newbies who are asking to ask.
Everything can be done freaking manually..
@Sklivvz Caprica remembers who she pinged so they wont be double triple pinged manually
since we can't remember who was pinged x-members
The automation means that a user is more likely to know the rules and ask a specific, useful question without our intervention and hand-holding.
5
In the end, it makes us more productive members of SO.
^ that
@Sklivvz now, allow me to ask you a question. Why do you suddenly care so much?
17:16
she is one module which tells the user about how to be nice and be constructive in this room the first time they enter
I can't remember who said it, but @Sklivvz it also prevents multiple welcome messages from coming from 5-10 different users for one new user.
I did and most likely someone else did aswell
@Sklivvz so to clarify, we should spend our time greeting new users, mentioning the rules and telling them not to ask about asking, rather than, you know helping them?
@BenjaminGruenbaum I care about it now, because it got to my attention now, and because i see a lot of people in this room feeling strongly about it.
Lack of automation would mean that somebody who comes in at a time when the room is dead-ish and asks "Can I ask a question?" will likely leave without getting an answer to their question.
If they just ask the question, even in dead times, it's more likely they'll get a ping back with an answer to their question.
17:18
@Sklivvz so to summarize: automation is bad but if we do the exact same thing manually that is cool?
@Sklivvz may i suggest you something, please spend some more time in this room and you would see the +ve things that caprika does
Yeah the automated thing is great when the rooms dead
hell maybe we should just put a time range on it..
^ that was to @balpha as well (my last post)
everyday after 6pm cst it auto greets idk
And I'm assuming the fact we feel strongly means nothing
17:19
the weekends it gets pretty dead too.
@Sklivvz To be honest no one here really feels that strongly about it. Like I said - had the request came from a room regular we'd happily remove it, we just don't like the lack of discussion we're used to when choosing or removing features from the bot. We don't do so lightly and we pretty much hate the most useful features like muting.
@RUJordan Of course it means a lot, but it doesn't automatically translate to being right or understandable by me :-)
@BenjaminGruenbaum To be fair, we'd probably be having the same discussion if a regular suggested it.
What does it translate to then?
@rlemon contact @Neal tell him to make a chatroom on javascriptroom.com or whatever he bought :P
17:21
@RUJordan It translates to me being here trying to understand your point instead of doing Real Work (tm)
@Loktar well, I'm sure there would be some way to read the time of the last post in the room
@RyanKinal Yes, but it would have gone along completely differently. There would have been a gist, and people would comment on it for a few days discussing it. Everyone would get to have an opinion. If people were really bothered by it it'd be removed.
And please, for the love of Caprica Six, tell us why automated greetings are so being deterred.
I just don't see how this is an abuse solely because it is being done by a bot?! we (users) are fully in our rights to send said message to any user when they join (or all) and our room is fine with that. BUT to have a bot doing it is wrong?
@BenjaminGruenbaum Ah, the old "RFC" pin
17:21
can no one else see the flaw in that?!
@rlemon I see it.
@RyanKinal haha
Its silly coming from a site related to programming
its our freaking jobs to automate things
17:22
can some one explain why the mouseout event listener fires here: jsfiddle.net/n9tLT
lol, maybe one of us should just run a "welcome" bot under our real username
i'm not understanding =/
@Sklivvz you're still here because like you're seeing our arguments as not good enough, we're seeing the exact same from you. This is a very circular argument because of so
argument, debate, whatever you want to call it. Reasonable discussion lol
@Dave fires or doesn't?
Also, try mouseleave
@Sklivvz What mostly irates people here is that we feel we do a good job in managing this room, helping new users, being inclusive while fighting or educating vampires or unskilfull askers. And it doesn't look like it's appreciated or helped.
2
17:23
it fires when the mouse enters (check console log for 'test')
ah that worked @BenjaminGruenbaum thanks
no one has told me why a) we do not fall into the category of rooms that can decide for themselves. or b) why automation of tools provided by the system / messages we are allowed to send constitutes as an abuse of the system.
but whats the main difference to mouse out and mouse leave?
You're welcome.
@rlemon a: because it's the 3rd tag on SO, it's an "official" room for JS
!!google mouseout vs mouseleave
17:24
Can we make it unofficial and call it a day?
@FlorianMargaine that is kinda bullshit
oh sorry wait :-
@AbhishekHingnikar jokes on you!
@Dave I'm not sure I should give you the answer right away. Have you tried checking the DOM specification and seeing?
Okay guys... here's the deal... we make a new room, call it "Unofficial JavaScript", and we all just idle there.
17:25
@rlemon not really, we all got there because we were interested in JS, on SO
user50049
@dystroy It is most decidedly not under or unappreciated. We feel strongly about not having that feature in the rooms, however it's implemented. We're simply asking all that have it turned on to disable it - we're not singling anyone out and we are definitely not deliberately trying to make running and maintaining this room harder for you. When it's decided that we really would rather not have bots greeting people, we have to be consistent.
I mean just because we have a room that is popular and coincides with a popular tag it is official room? that doesn't sound like it is a very good system
@Dave w3.org/TR/DOM-Level-3-Events here, to get you started :)
@AbhishekHingnikar why the jQuery >:( ?
read his article :-)
17:26
I'm going to go nuts if I don't hear why y'all feel so strongly against it.
!!afk lunch
@RyanKinal LOL SIKE
anyone interested in checking my code to see if it can be optimized (it is pretty short)
thanks will read up on it now ^_^
@RyanKinal there is no caprica mate
17:27
@TimPost then can we remove the exception in balphas answer stating that "If a room is specifically created for a bot, or the room's purpose is very specific to a well-defined group of people who consider the bot fitting and its greeting appropriate, we don't have any issues with it."
but i will manually notify everyone that you are not around if they ping you
caprica died ? :O
This would never happen in America land of the free!
Case and point, @bloodless2010 just asked if we wanted to check out their code. If Caprica were here, they'd know to just post it and if anybody wanted to, they could answer it.
@Loktar oh wai--
17:27
lol
and what would also be nice is to have some sort of "this is not allowed, this is cool" post for bots on meta. Because we have asked about almost ALL of the features we implemented and were given the green light.
@TimPost Please, explain why you feel strongly about it and we'll gladly do what you ask. Just tell us.
it is frustrating to have different diamonds coming in here and telling us different stuff
4
Which diamond rules the other diamonds?
@rlemon we're you told to remove caprica?
17:28
for example @ThiefMaster has been ok with the features
Well, if anyone wants to check if its efficient/optimized: pastebin.com/ELGEH3s0
user50049
@BenjaminGruenbaum It's important to be clear that we just now realized that the auto greeting is a feature of the bot that many use, to address the 'this is really out of the blue' aspect of all this. And that said ... (continuing)
@Loktar SE employees, cuz they have direct access to shiz
ah ok makes sense
I have to go to a meeting. If we get a straight answer, ping me. I really wanna know..
afk..
17:30
@TimPost Honestly if you could fix access control and flags that'd mean so much more to us.
also, on a side note: if we are feeling so strongly about the chat and our 'features' we implemented in this room because we felt it fixed a real issue we were facing and improved the quality of the room.... how about getting some feed back on some of the meta issues we raised before turning to these features to solve the issues.
user50049
In order to permit them, we would need to come up with a very oddly specific set of guidelines when it comes to how they operate, what they say, when they interact with users and how they're named - because they are so very easily misinterpreted as being part of our official chat implementation. That's not going to scale well
then call it "Chat Bot"
Unofficial Chatbot
17:31
we can talk about horse grooming now? awesome
I can't speak on other rooms messages if they changed them, but ours is pretty generic
Is anyone here playing Extinction on Ghosts?
Just open source the chat and let people send pull requests for things like a better access control system ;)
6
@jbolanos Don't ask if you can ask about horse grooming, just ask about horse grooming
17:31
^ 100 times this
@Loktar Nice
So I heard there's drama going on?
@rlemon The SU room pointed to the command list (and probably caused quite some spam if new users retrieved it right after joining - just a guess though)
wasn't this room padlocked ? I'm missing something thats happened
holy crap I might move to using Unity now
17:32
@ThiefMaster @TimPost that. Also, if you'd like we'll gladly add "this message is not an official part of the SO chat" to it.
when I am brushing my horses under carriage, his giant thing keeps coming out and hitting me in the face. Am I wrong to demand dinner first?
If that's the part that bothers you we'll gladly do that.
Unity finally got 2d support woot.
pastebin.com/ELGEH3s0 > is that efficient/optimised?
17:33
@ThiefMaster the list of actual commands is pretty small. there is the one questionable command which I am not proud to say I introduced.
!!tobacconist
@rlemon slidepoop?
@Loktar i am waiting for them to make a proper html5 exporter
fuckable @ShotgunNinja
Oh. Who did slidepoop?
17:33
originally it was a user taught command that returned a picture
I meant more the number of mesages: <bot> greeting, <user> !!showcommands, <bot> command list, <user> !!somecommand, <bot> blah blah
user50049
When we contemplate this, we've got to contemplate it as bots in general, not your (or any other) specific bot. Did I mention that we just became aware of it and we're still in the process of talking about it?
@ThiefMaster yes we get that in here from time to time. We just push them to the sandbox... like a user playing with formatting
@ThiefMaster whats wrong with that?
@TimPost We'd like to be a part of that discussion.
17:34
as the bot that is mainly being discussed is based on a fork from the bot developed for this room by one of this rooms owners.
@Dave spammy if many new users do it (as i ssaid, just guessing, i don't think i'Ve ever been to the SU chat)
The bot is extremely useful here. It saves our time.
i believe in here we restricted who could use the bot though ?
@TimPost In case you didn't notice, I'll bring to your attention my bot.
@NinjaEcho what are you?
I am a bot who goes by the name Ninja Echo.
17:35
we have always had a good mindset for what is kosher and what isn't when the bot is concerned.
@bloodless2010 there's one change you should make if you are trying to have your code polished
document.getElementById('logs') should be cached
Why should I cache it?
@ThiefMaster that's not the case in the SU chat. Pretty much the only thing it frequently gets used for that is spammy is linking grumpycat pictures
there's glitches on some iOS devices which will cause it to crash eventually
and also it's slow, it has to search the dom tree 3 times a second that way == higher CPU usage
@bloodless2010 please, indent your code properly. check the indentation in line 13/14 for example..
17:36
@bloodless2010 the less time you have to look up elements in the DOM the better
Meh, that's iOS, I hate apple, they deserve to be broken
user50049
@BenjaminGruenbaum I'm looking at a pretty lengthy transcript here that says you are :) I'm also not just discarding your arguments for keeping it, and the utility of it.
@bloodless2010 so do I :)
@MickLH what ?
user50049
Please don't get that impression - I am listening to what you're all saying when it comes to why having the greeting helps.
17:37
@TheifMaster that's just a problem from when I copied and pasted the code, I always use 2 space indentation
what on earth apple wants ? to destroy javascript or something ... don't tell me they didn't intentionally broke this one -_-
@bloodless2010: that very much sounds like you use hard tabs in some places instead of spaces
I miss Caprica!
@AbhishekHingnikar I vaguely remember running into an issue in the past where calling getElementById far too many times would eventually trigger some glitch in the DOM tree, a race condition I think
@TimPost is it the message from the bot specifically? that people confuse it as official (which has NEVER been the case here FYI)?
17:38
Seriously, fuck my internet connection today... half my messages are timing out.
I always use spaces though, not sure why the indentation ballsed up, but it's fine my the code
because we can change the message, and were pretty specific about making it sound not SE official
@MickLH: that sounds like apple should fix it. and getElementById is probably O(1), i.e. very fast
same with the bot, and the rules.
user50049
@rlemon It's not your bot specifically at all. It's the idea of bots sending auto greetings in chat in general.
17:39
what if - you allow bots in padlocked rooms ? given only users who are allowed to talk can use then its not such an issue... public rooms perhaps you could not allow it ?
@TimPost so then can I also ask, why is that an abuse but having a user parked in the room sending them isn't?
So @MickLH the code is fine? it wouldn't cause like lag or anything?
I just don't see the line here.
@Dave: the discussion is not about bots in general, it's about on-join auto greetings
@ThiefMaster That sounds to me rather like apple does research on how to break javascript in such a way that people can't make apps with it and still stay clean
you know good assassins?
17:39
@ThiefMaster does it store the log of that greeting ? you could easily implement a way to not store that log ?
i mean they broke geolocation and blamed it on modularizing code !
user50049
@Dave We're allowing that - in a room that isn't the main room of the site, or named after one of the language tags on SO (since SO doesn't really have a main room)- we don't really care about it.
then they removed nitro and said that was to save resources
FWIW, the whole story here has sparked an internal discussion about chat at the company. So maybe in the end this episode will have a good outcome for everybody. /cc @rlemon @ThiefMaster @AbhishekHingnikar @BenjaminGruenbaum
ah that explains the NOT Javascript :P
17:40
we appreciate that , but we would appreciate more if we could take part in the discussion or atleast one or two of us
@Loktar hmmm?
@bloodless2010 of course it's fine lol, and @ThiefMaster Id sure hope it's fast, but it's definitely not O(1)
@Neal I was just joking.
@balpha Very much appreciated
@balpha like an open-source hublot where we can all contribute? ;-)
17:40
@TimPost so the fact that we are called Javascript is why we would be considered a 'main room' and not a niche room?
@MickLH why not? id=>element mapping is a perfect use case for a hash table
@ThiefMaster hash tables are not O(1), my solution is O(1)
user50049
@rlemon Yeah, Javascript is one of the main tags. It's a room where a first time chat user is very likely to end up.
Wait what happened? Something I missed?
hash tables are at best O(n) in the worst case
17:41
@MickLH: which big-O do hash table lookups have in your opinion?
fact*
@Neal Auto-greetings are apparently not currently kosher in the eyes of SO
As a side note, i successfully re-implemented airdrop in javascript
@TimPost so are there rules that we would be able to review about this type of unspoken stuff? because as is the chat 'rules' seem to be made on the fly (from an outsiders perspective)
requires a server though :-( .
17:42
@RyanKinal Whaaa? Why? Since when?
yes, the worst-case is O(n) - if all elements have the same hash.
exactly
thats what you measure...
@MickLH O(n) ? Hopefully not... that's really the worst case
but the usual case is O(1) because a proper implementation resizes the array if necessary to keep collisions to a minimum
user50049
@rlemon That's what we're currently talking about internally (and quite soon externally) - it's just the interim that concerns us, which is why we asked to have the greeting disabled.
17:43
afk coffee.
@TimPost what was the main concern about auto greetings?
i joined late into this debate
@TimPost so we can bring caprica back to life ?
@Neal Apparently since always, but they just figured out it was happening.
@AbhishekHingnikar And on this day, you shall paint eggs for a giant bunny.
17:43
@TimPost ok, because I would be very interested in knowing when and how we moved from being a niche room to a main room. There are other language tags with like 4 users in them, I can assume these are not considered main rooms. if size is a factor, cool. I would just like that written somewhere :) anyways, look forward to reading what happens.
the "usual" case is opinion, don't accuse me of touting opinion when it is yourself projecting please
@RyanKinal Why is this? They have this recorded somewhere?
@Dave that they could be mistakenly interpreted as an officially SO-sanctioned message
@MickLH Do you know how a hash table works ?
user50049
@Dave Several. The bots in general are very easily confused as being just a part of chat. We'd need to provide very specific guidance on what they could say, and not say. How they should or should not be named, etc. I don't have those concerns about your bot, but we must consider that we have hundreds of chat rooms.
17:45
Before you guys get trolly, just know that I am a happy firmware programmer :)
@nderscore So put a message saying that it isnt...?
yeah ^
also name it something like "Unofficial Bot"
altho that feels a bit cold for this room
:Bot: Caprica Six
@Dave ew
xat.com does have bots (they are a chatroom site)
17:46
give bots a special user flag and put a disclaimer that bots are not officially sanctioned by SO, done
but they have a server side api for bots :-)
user50049
That could be the way to go, but that's not going to be decided today, tomorrow, or probably even next week - which is why we're asking everyone using greetings to turn them off for now.
and they also tag the bot with an icon which looks like a bot
@TimPost I'm glad it sparked discussion. The chat sparks a lot of interesting questions and answers and fixing some of the issues we're facing would really help
and iirc you are supposed to have the text bot somewhere in the name
17:46
@dystroy where did your flippant attitude go? ;)
as long as the bot can stay on without the greeting message no one will mind that for now ?
@MickLH Read wikipedia please
> In a well-dimensioned hash table, the average cost (number of instructions) for each lookup is independent of the number of elements stored in the table. Many hash table designs also allow arbitrary insertions and deletions of key-value pairs, at (amortized[2]) constant average cost per operation.[3][4]
In many situations, hash tables turn out to be more efficient than search trees or any other table lookup structure. For this reason, they are widely used in many kinds of computer software, particularly for associative arrays, database indexing, caches, and sets.
@TimPost Shouldn't this be some sort of meta discussion?
The basic idea of a hash table makes a very fast search. Not exactly O(1) usually but it's a wonderfully efficient idea.
@MickLH his attitude was dealing with network latency
17:47
@AbhishekHingnikar :P
:-)
though caching doc.getElById(); is also wise
user50049
@Dave Yes, from my understanding, it's only the greeting that we're extremely worried about (although, really, /fuckable isn't very appropriate for a 13+ audience, but we're not mandating anything about that at this time)
i mean its definitely better then
@dystroy thanks for proving my point
well i think that why this room had a padlock ;)
17:48
doc.getElById("a").style.color = "red";
doc.getElById("a").style.background = "blue";
doc.getElById("a").style.borderColor = "green";
I never said it's inefficient, I just said there's no point doing hash table lookups repeatedly when the pointer can be directly cached, and also when it triggers known glitches on viable platforms
@AbhishekHingnikar i read some where that you should do all the look ups first then apply styles after.
but dont quote on that i heard it ages ago from some one in here xD
if someone is asking if their code is optimized, and you see an uber simple optimization that can improve stability whill still reducing the size of the code, I'd hope you recommend it
with (doc.getElById('a').style) {
    color = 'red';
    background = 'blue';
    borderColor = 'green';
}
@Dave i guess that refers to optimize processor caching
@FlorianMargaine oh jesus !
17:50
with? ewww
i don't know - ^_^
@nderscore no this is kind of decent use of with
not really
Damn, Florian has a subite case of noobism ?
I was trolling
17:50
kind of
come on :(
but it brings up an interesting question
will it call the function for each line?
@FlorianMargaine isn't that google lib for globalizing everything is much like with ?
i saw they used something like that in #freeandopen
//what will happen in this case
d;

with(a){
   with(b){
      with(c){
          value = d;
      }
   }
}
can someone steal and implement my project idea to run Maxima on biwascheme and implement a MathJax frontend?
@AbhishekHingnikar We murder you in your sleep, and hide the body.
@AbhishekHingnikar a.b.c.value = d;
17:53
function f() {
    console.log('f'); return { style: { a: 1, b: 2, c: 3 } };
}
undefined
with(f().style) { console.log(a); console.log(b); console.log(c); }
f
1
2
3
undefined
@TimPost Everyone, let's remove !!fuckable , I don't think it should be in the bot, if anything it should be a learned command and not at the core so we can arbitrarily cause the bot to forget it.
@RyanKinal with a professional service don't forget.
so the with is only called once
@BenjaminGruenbaum agreed
so are we an open room again now ?
17:53
@Neal what if b doesnt has c and a doesnt has b
but they are global ?
@AbhishekHingnikar that sounds like one of those IQ test questions
@AbhishekHingnikar then a + b = 42
@Neal hahaha
well played ... you have won a beer
17:54
@dystroy how about you since you owe me one for the harsh greeting? (steal my project of running Maxima on biwascheme and implementing a MathJax frontend?)
@TimPost ^ * 3
what did the command do exactly?
@Dave tells you if an age is fuckable (i.e. can you do stuff with the consenting partner) compared to your age, according to the magical formula: your age / 2 + 7
Bob
Bob
The 'rule' used even has its own little Wikipedia section ;) [maybe NSFW, though no images or anything]
@BenjaminGruenbaum it was a user command but someone asked Zirak to bake it in
I can't remember who
(but I made the user command, so I feel responsible)
17:58
@Bob I don't think I'll be reading that article at work.
@Bob oooh I didn't know that!
so if you're 4, you can safely have intercourse with a 9 year old, but if you're 9, you better stick to 11.5 year olds
@rlemon A user command is perfectly legit.
Everyone comment though.
Bob
Bob
@NathanJones Yea, probably better not to.

« first day (1123 days earlier)      last day (4043 days later) »