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1:00 PM
@BenjaminGruenbaum Why you give wrong answer? :(
 
(num) => Date(`January ${num}, 2010`)
^ now compare dates
 
So it's not a single task. it is a multi task. any way i will ask more money from my client from your answer. — Ramesh Rajendran 3 mins ago
ffs is anyone paying him
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum In a proper language, pass the method from the first step to sort and the last step becomes unneeded
 
@BartekBanachewicz Probably, yes.
 
1:02 PM
@copy what?
 
will work uptill 31
 
Oh, yeah, that'd work in JS too, I just didn't want to complicate him by making a comparator.
 
for rest, use years. Then go into 2004 problems.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum that's just... fucked up
 
I wanted to show him programming, composing subproblems.
 
1:02 PM
what a fucker
 
And you effectively caused the client to pay more???
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum I think he means like in Python: wordList.sort(key=wordToNumberConverter)
 
that q should be closed
 
the OP should be freaking banned
 
@CSᵠ I thought so too at first but I couldn't figure out why.
 
1:03 PM
disgrace to the programmers around the world
 
I went through every close reason twice before deciding to answer. When I did it was to show him a concept without giving him teh codes.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum code of course, he listed his requirement and added the codeblock with the requirement
 
and where's he from? India. Trying so far not to be racist yet again
 
@CSᵠ that's not allowed.
 
social hacking, trick
 
1:04 PM
@BartekBanachewicz I am offended, 3 special spam flags for you with PHP toppings.
 
he did not show effort at all
 
@BartekBanachewicz the fact there are a ton of terrible programmers from India isn't racist - it's a fact. We're all well aware that there are a lot of really smart ones too.
 
bu having a code block, does not mean he tried anyttjhing
 
@CSᵠ effort is not required, and he did say he googled and tried to .sort
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum Maybe it's just a sampling bias
 
1:05 PM
Maybe, but I doubt it.
 
!!s/from I.*?- it's/is/
 
@CSᵠ @BartekBanachewicz the fact there are a ton of terrible programmers is a fact. We're all well aware that there are a lot of really smart ones too. (source)
 
There are a lot of terrible prorammers in India. I don't think that's a subjective fact.
 
How come he has 5k rep?
 
okok has almost 10k
 
1:06 PM
@AwalGarg shitload of answers
 
@CSᵠ no, I meant India specifically.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum Probably because there are a lot of programmers in India
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum There are a lot of people in India, so no surprise.
 
I didn't say it's a surprising fact.
 
We have a lot of terrible people in every profession, programming is no exception.
 
1:07 PM
@BenjaminGruenbaum india has over 1 bil ppl, the world has ~7, there's rotten apples everywhere, that country just has more condensed ones...
 
yeah so it isn't wrong to say that a huge portion of terrible programmers on SO comes from India
 
I think the average programmer from India is also pretty bad, that's a much bolder statement. Then again, I also think there are more good Indian programmers than good Israeli programmers.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum Good Indian people don't stay in India. They move out.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum it's a matter of numbers and way how education=>eployment pipeline works
 
India is a big country with a lot of poor areas and understandably a lot of people found that programming is a way to escape that.
 
1:08 PM
what annoys me more is that IMHO bad programmers from India are bad in a different way
 
@BartekBanachewicz well.. i guess they make up more, so it wouldn't be technically wrong..
 
@AwalGarg some do, I don't have to tell you how big India is.
 
IMHO and IME bad people from India focus more on solving the problem in whatever way than learning what's actually to be done
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum s/some/most/
 
@BartekBanachewicz yep
 
1:09 PM
The fact people are bad programmers doesn't mean they're dumb or bad people. A lot of people in less privileged areas just didn't have the same opportunities.
 
bad people from other countries tend to have the idea that maybe going the easiest route won't take you too far more often
 
@BartekBanachewicz I attest that is true.
 
The culture seems to be a "do what they want you to" a lot more than in Western culture
 
@BartekBanachewicz it's harder to learn when your job and market make delivery critical.
 
1:10 PM
in most of the countries the people who study information tech and are bad at programming choose not to work as developers
 
@KendallFrey I don't think that's a part of Indian culture, then again I've only been there once and @AwalGarg lives there.
 
!!s/IM.*?dia/Mediocre programmers/
 
@CSᵠ Mediocre programmers focus more on solving the problem in whatever way than learning what's actually to be done (source)
 
@KendallFrey The culture is get shit done, take cash, and go home.
 
@CSᵠ well, that's not what I wanted to say, again.
 
1:11 PM
I also find that good Indian programmers tend to be exceptionally good
 
I also agree with the above
 
^
hides
 
India is a strange place. One one hand, the majority of their programmers are terrible, but the ones that are good, are really good.
 
there is also this problem that in India the above-average developers get pushed into management
 
@NickDugger The majority of people in any profession anywhere are terrible
 
1:12 PM
touche'
 
@tereško That's a fear of mine
 
I've heard in India is not polite to refuse (actually say No) and that's a big problem when hiring, since they'll accept anything even if they can't handle it
@AwalGarg ^ ?
 
I want to be very good at what I do, without being forced to climb the corporate ladder
 
@CSᵠ no (see then pun?)
 
@CSᵠ I've had Indians say no to me many times
 
1:13 PM
@CSᵠ That sounds a lot like what I see
 
What's that law called where you promote someone to their first level of incompetence?
The Peter Principle is a concept in management theory in which the selection of a candidate for a position is based on the candidate's performance in their current role rather than on abilities relevant to the intended role. Thus, employees only stop being promoted once they can no longer perform effectively, and "managers rise to the level of their incompetence." == Overview == The Peter Principle is a special case of a ubiquitous observation: Anything that works will be used in progressively more challenging applications until it fails. This is "The Generalized Peter Principle." There is much...
got it
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum for those "exceptionally good" people, the payrate is like 2-10% of what is given to dumber people in foreign countries. And thus, they do move out somehow.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum yeah
 
@AwalGarg look at @tereško he can make 4 times what he does easily and he still stays. It's not just an India thing - people like their countries and cost of living is usually adjusted as well.
@AwalGarg they can remote often.
 
@AwalGarg lol :) so you had to learn to overcome that actually?
 
1:15 PM
there's a lot of people from India on Freelancer.com
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum That is true but see the life in India? We have powercuts like hell, bandwidth sucks, resources specially for tech are very low, and education means academics here.
 
cost of living generally correlates with quality of life
shocker, I know
 
@AwalGarg I was in a bad part of India most of the time, so I can't make conclusions about all of it. I do remember quite a shock from the living conditions in those areas.
 
@AwalGarg basically, if you studied IT, you will work in IT
 
@KendallFrey I agree, also I'm really spoiled - I hate not having my things the way I like them in my day-to-day life.
 
1:19 PM
in europe at least 2/3 of people who get bachelors degree in computer-related stuff opt to work in some other industry
 
hah, I'll have to deal with it next month
I hear my quality of life is gonna decrease
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum The general condition is bad. Talk about the infrastructure - roads in India couldn't hold rains for 5 minutes without blocking all ways.
 
@KendallFrey ?
 
@tereško is that western or eastern europe?
 
@tereško here too, but it's not because they can't find a job.
@AwalGarg then get really good and then move :)
 
1:20 PM
@BenjaminGruenbaum travelling
 
You've improved tremendously since you first came to the room btw, been meaning to tell you that.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum hah, if only that happened.
@BenjaminGruenbaum I see it in a different way, actually.
 
I've moved multiple times for work, now. Never internationally, though
 
@AwalGarg how so?
BTW @Mosho don't forget about the meeting.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum The room has a culture, which I didn't adopt to initially. Now I do, when I am in the room.
 
1:22 PM
Maybe, but you've also gotten better at coding, at least JavaScript.
We've also been working on the culture so maybe there's that. I don't know.
 
True.
 
@KendallFrey From experience, aspirations do change over time. I used to only want to program for the rest of my career. Now that I've had a bit of a mentoring role, I feel slightly more ready for management, in the future. You just have to make sure to not be a shit manager lol
 
I want to learn and make things, I don't care what my role is called.
 
^ that
I'm not a people person, that's a fact. Me managing would be a mistake
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum it has improved greatly compared to a few yrs ago
 
1:25 PM
@KendallFrey Some companies let their employees go if they don't climb the latter; even just baby steps
 
@CSᵠ I remember coming to the room, @rlemon called me a troll, @Zirak called me a noob and @tereško told me I can't code. It was a lot of fun.
 
lol :) with proper attribution :) nice
 
I wish we could go back and be mean to everyone
 
I came to room -> Jan Dvorak made me realize that JavaScript is not terribly bad -> now JavaScript is one of my favorite languages :))
 
1:26 PM
Jan's a liar
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum I have never rescinded that statement =P
 
JS actually is terribly bad
 
Bartek has a tree up his arse
 
But... JavaScript IS terribly bad
 
@BartekBanachewicz have you had one before? ride one?
 
1:27 PM
@KendallFrey Only after you know Python(/PHP :P)/Ruby etc.
 
@KendallFrey meh, needs comparison
 
Compared to most popular languages, JS is bad
 
JS is pretty nice in practice.
 
Yeah, PHP is the best of all.
 
@CSᵠ nope. Is supposed to be first
 
1:28 PM
JS is actually the best for web
 
Missed it all day yesterday when using a shit language.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum depends on who does the practising ... I have lately seen a lot of shitty code at work
 
Also, I do a lot more coding in other language than in JS, I think JS is pretty nice though.
 
TS fixes most of JS awkwardness imho :P
 
I'd opt for a JS alternative in the browser
 
1:28 PM
~~ I started another language slapfight ~~
flies away on a little cloud
 
Oh wait, yeah.
Stop that.
 
@BartekBanachewicz you absolute.... :(
 
@tereško git reset --hard :D
 
I wish C# and JS had proper FP idioms
 
!!s/and JS//
 
1:29 PM
like function application with a space
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum I wish C# had proper FP idioms (source)
 
I wish C# and JS had more design-by-contract :P
 
@BartekBanachewicz that's actually silly.
@RoelvanUden Spec# and code contracts work, you know :P
 
yeah I also wish C# and JS were even more like Haskell
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum Even .bind is annoying when coming from Haskell
 
1:30 PM
Design by contract is just really tedious.
 
@BartekBanachewicz getting a SH, not the best condition would be best for starters, you'll learn what you need and how you want it for your first "real" one..
 
woah @Kendall is a serious convert
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum I use Contracts a lot. It's limited tho. I want more.
 
I love the language
 
have you received your ritual cape yet
 
1:30 PM
@KendallFrey use Ramda, autocurry functions.
 
I just wish I could use it
 
I wish all programming languages had a free 24/7 customer support with expert operators and I can shout at the operator.
 
@AwalGarg isn't that StackOverflow basically?
 
@KendallFrey I am hoping to land a serious Haskell job in a few years from now
 
Why wait for years?
 
1:31 PM
@BenjaminGruenbaum And where no one put the line down? (Close/Delete my question)
 
@AwalGarg post a new one :P
q-banned? new account!
 
:P
 
@FlorianMargaine Because I'm still too bad at Haskell, because I kinda like my current job and it pays nice for what it is, because I'd prolly need to move and I haven't even finished renovating my new apartment yet
 
Remember the SO Expert chat?
 
@CSᵠ so.
 
1:32 PM
last year for 1 apr?
 
yeah
 
Haskell has a lot of mental-model issues, things that are not obvious in other languages about performance are even less obvious in Haskell. Laziness and its type inference make debugging harder and error messages are horrible.
 
@BartekBanachewicz you'll become good if you have a job on it
 
Error messages got better, but it still feels old.
 
@FlorianMargaine Have you even seen all of the jQuery questions here?
 
1:33 PM
The typesystem needs a reboot, a lot of things are unsafe and a lot of things are exceptions rather than being expressed by type.
What's the Haskell type for non-empty list?
 
Getting a job is the easy part. not being shit is the part that people struggle with, lol
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum lol gj with that
 
The biggest beef I have with Haskell is the way it uses all sorts of familiar concepts, but with different names.
 
Why is False incremented to True?
@KendallFrey remember, it's older than Java.
 
We should all use Idris
 
1:33 PM
@BenjaminGruenbaum yep, use Ada
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum then Java should have used those terms
 
@FlorianMargaine I'm saying what my been with Haskell is, not that it can't be solved :)
 
@KendallFrey there's a lot of things that Java should do vOv
for me the most annoying thing in Haskell are records hands down
 
There's more things that Java shouldn't do
 
well hey, haskell is open source...
:P
 
1:35 PM
Haskell records are one of the most broken features I've seen in any language to date
 
@BartekBanachewicz you haven't done much php, have you
 
the more I tried to use them the more broken they appeared, like PHP basically
@FlorianMargaine for 2 years or so. But I was a terrible programmer back then. I actually enjoyed it.
then I tried Django and never looked back.
 
There was a user in here recently who was trying to create a PHP wrapper for jQuery UI, because "jQuery is too hard for php developers"
 
Actually my first Django experience made me love Postgres too.
 
What are Haskell records in English exactly? @BartekBanachewicz
 
1:37 PM
@AwalGarg tuples with named fields
 
@AwalGarg haskell record, noun - the most broken piece of shit known to mankind.
 
not exactly, I'm sure
 
ah
 
@AwalGarg they are syntactic wrappers for data constructors and field getters
+ some syntactic extensions for updates
 
oh, so that's what Florian was referring to lol
 
1:38 PM
Moderator Nominations close in 6 hours.
 
    data Person = Person { age :: Int, name :: String }

    -- age :: Person -> Int
    -- name :: Person -> String

    let b = Person 10 "Bartek"
    let a = Person { name = "Awal", age = 20 }

    let a' = a { age = 21 }
short usage example.
you can't really do much more with them.
 
@BartekBanachewicz reminds me of struct.
 
THE
how can I movde absolute 3 to bottom of absolute 2 ?
 
> Open Source C# to JavaScript Compiler
http://bridge.net/
 
@AwalGarg it's an aggregate alright.
 
1:42 PM
ok.
 
THE
I want to place absolute just below absolute 2 (blue)
anyone good with absolute positioning ?
 
@THE you don't do that with absolute positioning. Wrap them in a container and set absolute on the container instead.
 
absolute positioning is the debil
 
@THE Only Sith deal with absolutes
 
But you will probably get better CSS help from the CSS room.
 
1:45 PM
!!s/CSS room/HTML/CSS room/
 
@CSᵠ But you will probably get better CSS help from the HTML. [(source)
 
wow
 
hah wat
 
@NickDugger The how manyth version is that? Arent there tons of C#=>JS already?
 
THE
@BartekBanachewicz can't find him anywhere
 
1:46 PM
position: absolute !important // anyone else reads that as position absolute not important?
 
no
I read that as "help I'm trapped in a CSS factory"
 
THE
@KendallFrey :|
i love absolute positioning
 
do bounties go through the rep cap?
 
1:53 PM
Yes as in, you can only earn 200 - bounty-rep rep right?
 
200 + bounties
 
I meant yes as in they circumvent the rep cap.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum no
 
Oh nice,
Wait, that's not what I meant, can I award bounties and still get 200 rep?
 
bounties shouldn't affect your rep cap in any way
that's just for votes
 
1:57 PM
yeah, even accepts and stuff do odd things to the cap
 
accepts do nothing to it
 
@RoelvanUden No idea; I've not used something like it. I've never had to write C#->JS, because I know JS
 
it's only votes I think
Jon Skeet can get like 500 rep in one day
 
my best so far was 238 in a day
 
2 hours ago, by Second Rikudo
Canonical idea: Write a canonical question and answer about promisifying XHR for a 500 bounty from me. Ping me for details. (Preference to folks under 10k)
 

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