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12:00 AM
During the day, I keep my curtains closed, and use dark themes
 
I always use the dark themes vOv
 
@Wes ever heard of rule 35? there's a guru of it
 
That's why my skin is so milky white and pure
 
Wes
12:08 AM
lol
 
configure: error: Cannot find imap library (libc-client.a) only happens when I change --with-libdir=lib to --with-libdir=lib64 when using --with-imap=shared. I saw a lot of posts about creating symlinks, but none have worked so far.
 
if the library isn't for the right platform (i.e. 32 bit vs 64 bit) it will say it can't find it
even if it is on the path you specified
so, when you run configure, what is the environment? is it trying to configure for 32 bit, or 64 bit? (regardless of what your underlying arch is)
 
Wes
!!? beer yoga
 
Search for "beer yoga" (https://www.google.com/search?q=beer+yoga&lr=lang_en)
• English - Bieryoga - BeerYoga is the marriage of two great loves – beer and yoga. Both are centuries-old therapies for b… (http://bieryoga.de/english/)
• 'Beer yoga' is a thing, now, and it's going inter… - 2 dagen geleden - Nothing like putting down an icy cold beer. Except, of course, achieving a higher… (http://mashable.com/2017/01/17/beer-yoga-comes-to-australia-of-course/)
• Afbeeldingen van beer yoga - No description available (/search?q=beer+yoga&lr=lang_en&tbs=lr:lang_1en&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&
 
Wes
it exists.
 
12:37 AM
@LeviMorrison can you explain what the benefits of the pipe operator really are? Apart from some syntactic mess... I don't see how it's any better than assigning a result to a var and then passing the var to a func (based on your "rules" email)
going to bed, night all
 
Wes
@Leigh sometimes it is just annoying saving stuff to a variable that would immediately become useless. it is hard to come up with decent names, they make programs bigger, etc. it's not a solution to something's missing, it's just about offering the courtesy of avoiding temporary variables if the user desires to do so
gn \o
 
@Leigh I'm trying to configure for 64-bit, it says the following when running configure:
checking build system type... x86_64-unknown-linux-gnu
checking host system type... x86_64-unknown-linux-gnu
checking target system type... x86_64-unknown-linux-gnu
 
1:18 AM
solved it!
 
1:36 AM
@Leigh Temporary variables make it difficult to reorder things. I mean, some people think it is so bad there is a named refactor called "Replaced Temporary with Query"...
But this allows you to avoid many one-time-use temporaries, often which have no value added with their variable name.
Consider this:
function normalize(string $name): string {
    $trimmed = trim($name);
    $lowered = strtolower($trimmed);
    $replaced = str_replace('-', '_', $lowered);

    return $replaced;
}
Those temporaries serve no purpose outside of their one-time use and their variable names aren't actually helpful.
And if you do re-order them you have to change which temporary you pass as a paraemter.
function normalize(string $name): string {
    return trim($name)
        |> strtolower($$)
        |> str_replace('-', '_', $$)
    ;
}
This has no such issues aside from the initial trim($name) which if you really cared to could be piped as well:
function normalize(string $name): string {
    return $name
        |> trim($$)
        |> strtolower($$)
        |> str_replace('-', '_', $$)
    ;
}
Make sense?
The biggest examples come from Sara's RFC which would also be valid with my proposed rules:
// this is awful
$ret =
  array_merge(
    $ret,
    getFileArg(
      array_map(
        function ($x) use ($arg) { return $arg . '/' . $x; },
        array_filter(
          scandir($arg),
          function ($x) { return $x !== '.' && $x !== '..'); }
        )
      )
    )
  );
// way better
$ret = scandir($arg)
    |> array_filter($$, function($x) { return $x !== '.' && $x != '..'; })
    |> array_map(function ($x) use ($arg) { return $arg . '/' . $x; }, $$)
    |> getFileArg($$)
    |> array_merge($ret, $$);
And again, many temporaries names wouldn't really aid with their names (though perhaps some of them might).
(And that example is fully compatible with my proposed rules)
Basically you can transform "inside out" evaluation into regular "left to right, top to bottom".
Simple examples like $trimmed = $str |> trim($$); are just silly examples used to give context to some other discussion point.
Here's an example of something that wouldn't work in Sara's RFC that is conceivable:
$data |> array_filter($Object->filter($$), $$)
The $Object->filter($$) prevents the need to do [$Object, 'filter'] and the second will be the target for data. In Sara's RFC this will error and in Hack this doesn't do what I just described (it sends $data to both).
/wall-of-text
(I guess one other thing to point out that is without partial application or Hack's weird special variable $$ that piping is not really that valuable because basically no functions in PHP return functions, so without $$ the |> is pretty limited)
 
1:56 AM
o.o
course, I can't say anything, I've done the same
 
@LeviMorrison I don't see that as an improvement over doing something like reusing a single letter variable name. It seems like adding syntactic bleh just to avoid complaints from a static analyzer or the keeper of your local style guide
 
Wes
2:16 AM
that is a bad example imho. problems are stuff that you'd beg they were just one liners
basically stuff you would normally write by nesting parentheses
but without the visual mess that are the nested parentheses
the code you linked obviously should be written on different lines...
 
2:29 AM
@Wes do you have an example where |> f($$) is clearly better than $x = f($x)?
 
@PaulCrovella Reusing the same variable, particularly if it transitions types, doesn't make you feel icky?
 
Can someone make the return type of |> if not given a dot be a dot function? kthxbai
:D
Basically, if the first element of the chain is a $$, the entire thing returns a callable
but I'm probably pushing it a bit
 
@LeviMorrison sure it does, but sweeping it under |> and $$ doesn't change that - it just makes things feel more perlish which feels even ickier
 
Wes
any 2-3 functions that you would just nest. eg
$obj->setBar(true, $whatever->sanitizeBar($bar), 222)
that is already a huge visual mess for me.
$whatever->sanitizeBar($bar) |> $obj->setBar(true, $$, 222);
is just better
 
2:45 AM
@Wes whenever something is becoming a visual mess for me I'm already going to be breaking it up into multiple lines - there's nothing sacred about keeping it mashed onto one
 
Wes
2:55 AM
@PaulCrovella it's like ?: or ??. sometimes you don't want a full cumbersome if{}else{}, but just that.
 
@PaulCrovella It's not sweeping it away and hiding it somewhere; it's preventing it from needing it in the first place.
Big difference.
Also I'd prefer _ instead of $$ but that may not be possible.
(aka "fill in the blank")
But it looks nicer (to me anyway)
$ret = scandir($arg)
    |> array_filter(_, function($x) { return $x !== '.' && $x != '..'; })
    |> array_map(function ($x) use ($arg) { return $arg . '/' . $x; }, _)
    |> getFileArg(_)
    |> array_merge($ret, _);
Or with two underscores to make it more obvious:
$ret = scandir($arg)
    |> array_filter(__, function($x) { return $x !== '.' && $x != '..'; })
    |> array_map(function ($x) use ($arg) { return $arg . '/' . $x; }, __)
    |> getFileArg(__)
    |> array_merge($ret, __);
 
@LeviMorrison $$ (or _) isn't so different from any other variable, you're basically just assigning to it from the left instead of from the right
 
@PaulCrovella It's different because it's a function argument (not an assignment). At least under my proposal.
$str |> 'trim' is perfectly valid.
There's no "assigning to" the __.
Eval the left, eval the right, pass the lhs result into the right as a single argument.
 
I was ignoring that as I like it even less
 
My point is any callable works.
$str |> function ($x) { /* ... */ } works too
 
3:05 AM
I understand that. It's not helping.
 
There's no "magic assignment".
$x |> $f desugars to exactly $f(x) unless it can simultaneously desugar $$.
It should be obvious the intent there; instead of "inside-out" you do "left-to-right".
In a single case as in $x |> $f it is rather pointless; just write $f($x).
But in a chain? I promise you if we had this people would be doing it:
$array->filter($filter)->map($mapper)
This is not dissimilar at all...
Why would people rather method chain than do this?
array_map($mapper, array_filter($filter, $array))
Because of left-to-right. And where is the "magic" variable in method chaining? It's the $this variable...
 
"it's like method chaining" probably isn't a great sales pitch
 
It's not, but my point is there is something about the method chainging that is useful for non-methods too.
Do you disagree with the method chaining vs nested evaluation? If so why?
Right now you sound like a skeptic who has no justification for it.
"I don't like it"
 
I'm a skeptic of adding to symbol soup without strong justification. You're the one trying to pitch something, it's up to you to justify it, not me to justify why not.
 
Except when I justify it you just ignore it.
That's... not how it's supposed to work.
 
3:15 AM
I don't ignore it at all, I'm just not convinced by it.
 
2 mins ago, by Levi Morrison
Do you disagree with the method chaining vs nested evaluation? If so why?
Then respond.
 
with array map and filter? don't care either way really
the question generically though is a false dichotomy
 
@PaulCrovella Not just those, but generically.
Based on your experience in other languages, other programmers, etc, do you disagree that coders prefer the chaining to the nested evaluation?
 
a great deal of my experience in other languages and programmers involves other programmers' perl, which is where my aversion to symbol soup starts
 
You keep misdirecting the conversation. I'm done; later!
Night everyone!
 
3:23 AM
holy fuck dude, it's an aside. calm yourself.
some programmers do indeed really like chaining methods
some go so far as to build fluent interfaces 'cause they like it so much
I'm not a huge fan of either. And like I said, "chaining or nested" is a false dichotomy. Those are not the only options in reality.
 
Wes
let's just love each other, okay. apart @FélixGagnon-Grenier obviously, as he is french
Jan 6 at 13:33, by Wes
programmers are a strange species. i don't understand why they can't discuss stuff without getting emotionally attached to the topic.... :D
 
3:39 AM
hi is there any laravel programer here
 
@PaulCrovella ... you are the one swearing.
I also never claimed it was a dichotomy, yet you keep jumping to other things, which is why I quit. It's fine to stop a conversation...
 
can i ask some think here now it is related to laravel
 
Wes
@codenut try on reddit.com/r/laravel
 
*thing
ok
 
@LeviMorrison I gave one aside (which was a partial response to you earlier) while everything else was a direct reply. In return you've accused me of having no justification for my position, ignoring you, and misdirecting the conversation. Stopping the conversation sounds just fine to me.
 
3:51 AM
negative! i got an empty result for my search. i am trying to use laravel brodcasting but my shared hosting don't allow me to use node js so what should i do as their both pusher and redis works with node only if i am not wrong
 
4:05 AM
Morning
!!dad
 
I am terrified of elevators, I'm going to start taking steps to avoid them
 
4:39 AM
Too much cold..
 
4:55 AM
morning
o/
Hi @brzuchal @Linus
Serious help needed
:p
 
Hi
Ask the question
 
Is this possible that site being slow or responding late due to lake of resources of server?
 
Wes
@Akshay can you avoid pinging people randomly? thanks
 
Thanks @wes noted! ^_^
 
5:15 AM
For what it is worth, @Paul, I have no hard feelings. I just didn't want to continue a conversation that was unproductive.
 
mornin
 
Wes
\o
 
o/
 
\o
 
5:57 AM
o/
... shiite
@Wes much obliged
 
Wes
:B
 
user6061856
6:09 AM
:P
 
user6061856
I need halp
 
user6061856
XD
 
user6061856
What is a php kernel?
 
user6061856
I'm think it has something to do with a console. Not sure
 
user6061856
!!s php kernel
 
6:12 AM
morning
 
user6061856
mornin'
 
posted on January 20, 2017

New Cyanide and Happiness Comic

 
am I a bad person if I think about the offer from a headhunter more depending on if they're cute than if the job really interests me?
on the other hand, that card does seem to be played often.
 
user6061856
idk
 
user6061856
lol
 
user6061856
6:24 AM
Um, your not a bad person.
 
kiwis and cheese are badly underrated in salads
 
user6061856
XD
 
seriously! I mean... for no apparent reason I bought a s***tload of kiwis the other day, and have to eat them quick, so I added some in a green salad. well guess what, it's delicious
 
@FélixGagnon-Grenier and salads are overrated in kiwis and cheese
 
amen. and also.. true!
 
Wes
6:40 AM
with cheese you don't mean salty cheese, right
for us cheese is only salty. we call it cream generically if it's sweet
 
6:58 AM
@wes i have small doubt
 
Wes
can you avoid pinging people randomly? thanks
 
ok
any one help me
 
@Wes usually salty, but can be either. when sweet the type is typically specified. I wasn't advocating eating kiwi with cheese, but rather each individually without salad.
 
HELP ME
 
hi everybody
I have a apk file and run it in php.is there any android simulator in php?
 
Wes
7:13 AM
not usually a fan of this kind of things but we do a lot of these things here @PaulCrovella this must be the most famous mangiarebuono.it/wp-content/uploads/2014/07/… ham and melon. ever ate that?
 
I haven't
 
Wes
that's like one of the most classic appetizers. dunno why but it works :P it sounds like it shouldn't, though
 
i can see it working, ham works well with sweet
the proportions look off to me though, I'd want way more ham
 
3 messages moved to Trash
 
Wes
it's an appetizer so it's intentionally not too satisfying, i guess :P
 
7:21 AM
I also wrap pork loin with prosciutto when making pork wellington.. and stuff it with bacon
pigs are goddamn magical creatures
 
Wes
also typically parmigiano is consumed with pears. i don't like that but there's a whole bunch of people that love the combination
in fact we even have a way of saying. "don't tell anyone how good it is cheese with pears" :B
@PaulCrovella that is so hardcore :B
 
I like parm, I like pears... hell I think I have both in the fridge right now. I'll have to try that.
 
moin
 
Wes
\o
 
7:25 AM
heh, you should try the gorgonzola ice cream at my favorite restaurant. it's an epiphany. it's like gorgonzola really is captured in the wrong body when it's cheese. It wants to be ice cream.
 
mornin Joe,Paul,Wes
 
@Wes hmmm... well yeah, that cheese is more salty than not, but probably not as salty as you think. just old cheddar
 
Wes
@Gordon salty ice cream?
 
7:27 AM
@Wes gorgeous ice cream
 
@Wes and there I thought you european people knew about cheese
 
Wes
gorgonzola is salty. also french like cheese, we don't :B not particularly, at least
 
@PaulCrovella that they are.
@Wes what do you put on pastas and pizzas then?
 
@Wes gorgonza is gorgonzoly. I wouldnt describe it as salty. it's a very unique taste to me
 
ofc both these are not complete without cheese :D
 
Wes
7:30 AM
@FélixGagnon-Grenier cheddar on pizza? id kick you in the nuts :B
 
someone was reading my fork of phpng-xhprof and a pr was made to their repo from a commit I made last May, I didn't know you could do that ...
 
@FélixGagnon-Grenier oh, protip for the next pizza you make: try gouda on it
 
cheddar is great. especially the orange mature one.
@JoeWatkins what does your fork do? like what are the significant changes over the regular xhprof besides probably being maintained
 
@Gordon it was just to fix the phpng fork of xhprof, I made a PR of one commit, and then forgot about other work I had done, I guess ... the PR they made was to make it actually safe ... I'm not sure why I never done the PR myself
 
oh ok.
 
7:33 AM
I don't remember May, didn't remember I had the fork still ...
 
Wes
btw, cheddar seems to be very popular in britain and us, but here is almost completely absent. people would think it's fake cheap cheese with added orange in it :B
however we enjoy any kind of swiss or french cheese, apart ours...
 
@Stricted fixed pthreads+7.2, travis is green ;)
+uopz (if anyone cares about that) ...
and apcu doesn't need any changes for 7.2
 
o/
 
yo fab
where are you ?
 
Vietnam
Just rented a house, 3 bedroom.
 
7:41 AM
@Fabor good. sounds a big house ..!
 
Big ish I guess.
 
nice
 
I only pay $200 a month rent too
 
how long you staying there ?
omg
 
why that much cheap?
 
7:41 AM
6 months minimum. Will reevaluate during.
Living with these two Vietnamese girls.
There's ALWAYS food ready. o.O.
 
wow .. such a heaven you're living in :-)
 
this situation seems totally legit
 
I'm very jealous of all the fun you are having
 
however, I still prefer preparing food myself
 
7:44 AM
heh, they weren't random girls. They're friends.
 
@JoeWatkins isn't that exactly the same as pulling the upstream into your forked one through a pull request?
 
@JoeWatkins Yeah, it's an interesting situation to say the least.
@FélixGagnon-Grenier I'd cook if I got the chance. actually I made pumpkin soup yesterday. Ingredients here are lacking though.
 
@FélixGagnon-Grenier I guess ... I've don't think I've seen that happen either ... my git fu is weak ...
 
@Fabor I'm sure you do! I did not mean that as a diss on your culinary skills ;)
 
moin
 
7:46 AM
\o
 
@JoeWatkins well basically... when you fork something, and after three months want to get what other forks have brought into the main project
but in your case, seems it was the other way around?
 
@FélixGagnon-Grenier heh. Doesn't solve the ingredient issue though :).
 
Finally it's friday. The last 8h of work this week. :)
 
@FélixGagnon-Grenier yes ... I was just surprised that you can make a PR from a fork without the owner of the fork being involved
 
Now I just need a way to earn $1000 PCM with the least amount of hours invested.
 
7:49 AM
well, you have a body, and are in vietnam
 
would need to shave, and a push-up bra wouldn't hurt
 
cool, I sound almost as bad as it did in my head
 
Fab the Giant road show ?
 
(also people: please don't burnout. This is the worse thing that can happen to you. I'm only starting to feel better after my previous burnout/depression. Please don't do it.)
 
@JoeWatkins heh. Might work if they actually earnt okay money here.
 
7:51 AM
> Fab Programmer, basketballer, and meat-popsicle.
LOL
 
@Fabor yeah 1k seems like a tall order if rent is $200
 
well, 5 months?
 
@JoeWatkins Remote wouldnt be so bad. Bike rental is like $65 PCM. Then it's food, drinks and misc.
 
oh I thought you weren't programming at the moment
yeah, remote it will have to be ...
 
I'm not doing anything but I am willing to.
Just feel a little out of practice now, plus finding part time remote seems pretty hard. Not actively trying though so it's not something I can complain about yet :P
 
7:54 AM
@Fabor if you are looking for a permanent dev position, I can still hook you up with nfq in vietnam
 
NFQ?
 
Seems cool, I would guess I'd have to live in Saigon though
 
Probably. IDK. I just happen to know one of the General Partners and could make contact for you
 
@Fabor otherwise, I legit have need of someone who can jump in an undocumented, no framework-ish, corrupted codebase to save finish a project.
and can pay.
 
7:57 AM
Any idea Is this possible that site being slow or responding late due to lake of resources of server?
 
@Gordon Cool thanks. I'll keep it in mind.
@FélixGagnon-Grenier I'm listening...
 
@FélixGagnon-Grenier Listening too
 
well, it's a job I began before being hired at my present place. I lack the time to end it.
I have a plan, and the architecture is not totally borked.
 
at least you have a plan, which is better than 99% of the projects
 
Well I am free as a bird with internet now. So if you want I can.
 
8:01 AM
I inspired myself of the mvc as somewhat viewed in this room, use auryn/fast route/Patrick's Http and some custom event loop engine. If you're still listening, let's find a way to talk
 
ITSATRAP!!! inspired is a sure giveaway :D
 
lol
 
haha
 
I am. I'm on most chat clients. You got a preferred method?
OT: About to read How To Create A Mind. Seems like maybe your kind of thing @JoeWatkins?
 
8:04 AM
it really does
tell me if it's convincing when you've read it ... may give it a read ...
 
@JoeWatkins nice :)
 
@FélixGagnon-Grenier Cool sent. Granted I am Vietnam time (currently 15:07), we can talk it over whenever.
@JoeWatkins Will do.
 
@Fabor cool! for now however, I will get towards some sleep. (3:08 seems like alegit time for sleeping)
 
heh yes.
 
@JoeWatkins my patch was quite similar to your commit but i didnt got the "info[it].class_name = zend_string_new(old[it].class_name);" stuff right :/
 
8:09 AM
Bonne nuit
 
nn all
merci
 
Night Felix
 
afternoon gentlemen
 
@JoeWatkins gist.github.com/Stricted/1d4a8ff228d9bbf494335147f1d519c3 thats was my attemt to get it working :P
 
8:11 AM
pretty close ...
 
jep
and i see u failed :D
 
the yaml thing ?
 
@JoeWatkins github.com/krakjoe/pthreads/blob/… shouldnt it be old[it].type instead of info[it].type ?
 
lines above it should be info, but it doesn't really matter ... copied bitwise before there anyway ...
/me is afk, school run
 
Does anyone know what could be causing my PHP compile to fail? gist.github.com/KyraD/d93ad81900879c3e3a81162d3539d859 It's failing when it's compiling etc/intl
 
8:15 AM
moaning
 
@JoeWatkins i meant u override info[it].type with data from info[it].type isnt that wrong?
 
8:56 AM
@Stricted no
 
Morngins
 
yohaa
 
peehaa
 
router arrived @JoeWatkins
will sort out over the weekend and post on Mon, hopefully
 
@DaveRandom sweeeet, thanksyou muchly
 

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