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13:00
Could maybe increase it. Doctor to nurse: "I don't understand, 112 years old, heart trouble, blind, liver failing and and all he can do is mumble about 'Qt slots' and type at that old laptop. He just refuses to die".
user142019
boo
user1357851
I hope technology will advance so much that I could be on the internet using my brain wave and join the forum/chatroom for 100+ year old technologists when I am 112
@Telkitty I really hope you don't.
@MartinJames After all these years, still waiting for a signal.
2
13:02
@Telkitty posting cat pictures directly into other peoples brains
yay
user1357851
@LightnessRacesinOrbit why? you know you will be over 100 if you are still alive then?
hi
people
user1357851
@melak47 text only, image uses too much brain power
@Telkitty Thank you; I can count.
do I have to set all DirectX 11 structures to {0}?
13:05
@SiPlus ..for what
@SiPlus what the fuck
user142019
@SiPlus wat
I know that I have to use {0} structures in CreateSwapChainForComposition, otherwise I get an error
user142019
Just set the fields to what you need to set them to.
@SiPlus uh
13:06
@SiPlus Starboard: 'TO HELL WITH DIRECTX!!!'
I want to know, do I have to create all D3D11 structures with = {0} or not
initializing to {0} is ok if you don't want to set all unused fields to 0 yourself I suppose, but you never have to do it
D3D11_VIEWPORT, for example
@melak47 no, it creates "Plain Old Data" structure
@SiPlus so?!
200
Q: What are POD types in C++?

ceretullisI've been following SO for a bit now, and I've come across this term POD-type a few times... what does it mean?

user142019
13:07
@SiPlus dafuq
user142019
2343
Q: The Definitive C++ Book Guide and List

grepsedawkThis question attempts to collect the few pearls among the dozens of bad C++ books that are released every year. Unlike many other programming languages, which are often picked up on the go from tutorials found on the Internet, few are able to quickly pick up C++ without studying a good C++ book...

@SiPlus the types are PODs if you initialize them with {0} or not..?
@melak47 I want to know, do I have to use ={0} for ALL structures of D3D11, or only certain ones such as createswapchainforcomposition argument
@SiPlus you don't have to use it AT ALL
user142019
13:07
You don't have to use = {0} for any of them.
@melak47 No, I do
user142019
No, you don't.
no you don't
I was getting a hresult error on CreateSwapChainComposition call until I added = {0};
13:08
@SiPlus so check what the error is
@SiPlus You may get warnings in some cases if you don't initialise it. Generally, as long as you assign to all members after-the-fact, you won't get that warning. I would call it good practice to zero-initialise such objects, but it really depends on the specific type as to whether there are any concrete practical ramifications of not doing so. In the vast majority of cases, I seriously doubt it.
I found ={0} in Microsoft's XAML shooter game sample
user142019
That doesn't mean adding = {0} is the only way to solve the problem.
@LightnessRacesinOrbit It's not warning, and it's initialized, I set every field
user142019
@SiPlus you did not.
13:09
I doubt that.
if you are certain, then tell us the error
DXGI_SWAP_CHAIN_DESC1 swapChainDesc = {0}; // NO CRASH
DXGI_SWAP_CHAIN_DESC1 swapChainDesc; // CRASH
Then you did something wrong somewhere else. Probably failed to set the property of some field.
all fields are initialized
Stop spamming
Those are assignments, not initialisations.
I did not ask you why do I get the error
13:10
I did not ask you to even come in here
Yet here we are
user142019
It would be nice if we had a whole Q&A site with thousands of active users just around the corner…
3
Soooo... you initialize all fields to 0 and then overwrite all of them?
paste your assignments somewhere?
I asked you do I need to set all D3D structures to {0} (LITERALLY, not memset(0)), or only some of them
@SiPlus and we answered: NO
13:11
@SiPlus And I am answering that question. Will you begin to listen at some point?
do we even want to answer your question
that's the question I'm asking
@DeadMG I don't want to answer your question.
gee gee
Ell
Ell
@R.MartinhoFernandes aww that's beautiful
13:12
Not enough for stars, it seems.
(hehe)
(inb4 Tomalak whining about my stars)
@SiPlus paste your assignments somewhere again
Or not and ask on Stack Overflow maybe possibly
inb4 no-helpdesk wah wah bitch bitch moan moan wah wah wah
..and probably the struct type.
.. 'cos it sounds like you screwed something.
13:15
@SiPlus Where do you assign to AlphaMode?
or Scaling
nvm
@LightnessRacesinOrbit oh
nowhere
@SiPlus yeah, "oh".
user142019
Chat looks so nice with hidden messages.
didn't see it before
13:16
@Zoidberg Heh
the {0} half-protects you from dumbass noob reading comprehension mistakes like that by ensuring that the values in the structure are at least legal
@LightnessRacesinOrbit ..if you're lucky.
in your case, more than likely, the uninitialised "value" of .AlphaMode doesn't match any value represented by the DXGI_ALPHA_MODE enumeration
@MartinJames Well, yeah. It'd be a pretty shitty library for zero-initialisation to result in an illegal value.
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Oh, I've got plenty them :(
@LightnessRacesinOrbit doesn't have to be an illegal value, but it may be invalid in the context of the other values in the struct
13:18
Yes, that was because of AlphaMode
Set it to DXGI_ALPHA_MODE_UNSPECIFIED, now works fine
user142019
The struct should have non-default ctor problem solved.
What a surprise.
do you believe us now? :)
@melak47 yes =)
Feb 11 at 14:17, by Cat Plus Plus
Old here? Do us a favour, and don't announce your plonks. Seriously.
@melak47 Indeed. It doesn't protect you from that, of course. You still have to populate the structure properly to get your desired results. I'd simply hope that zero-initialisation would be enough to avoid a crash, is all I'm saying.
user142019
13:19
@LightnessRacesinOrbit I'm not old, you guys all said it yourselves.
@Zoidberg Those famous C ctors.
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Which is an excellent reason to not zero-initialize the struct.
@Zoidberg Okay carry on then
user142019
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Yes, DirectX has a C API.
@DeadMG If the crash were guaranteed, that might make sense.
13:19
@Zoidberg Indeed it does.
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Tis true.
user142019
@DeadMG Wot. Last time I checked it was a C++ API.
@Zoidberg So how do you intend to make a non-default constructor in a C API?
user142019
@ScottW I plonked you.
@Zoidberg COM is C compatible.
it's not pleasant to use COM from C but it is doable, and they don't use any C++-only features.
user142019
#ifdef __cplusplus :v
13:21
yeah, they have done that for some parts of the API
user142019
@ScottW reserved.
there are some namespaces in Direct2D, and QueryInterface made into a pseudo-dynamic-cast template.
user142019
@ScottW ja
@ScottW Yep.
C and C++ have the same name reservation rules.
C++ would obviously break C code by reserving legal C identifiers.
user142019
@DeadMG I thought it was legal to have __ in the middle of names in C.
13:22
18 secs ago, by DeadMG
C++ would obviously break C code by reserving legal C identifiers.
Heh, I just discovered this in our code?
What about name mangling?
what about it?
@TonyTheLion Explicit instantiation.
it mangles names
13:23
@SiPlus Repeat after me: there is no name mangling in C++.
@R.MartinhoFernandes ah, so its not a specialization
Visual C++ adds stuff to function and variable names, you can't simply use C++ .libs in C
user142019
@DeadMG can't find a rule about __ in the middle in the C11 draft.
@TonyTheLion (Technically, that's exactly what it is, but I am not Tomalak)
hmmm
so it makes sure that foo is invoked with int ?
13:24
@SiPlus Actually, you can. What messes up are things like exceptions.
@TonyTheLion No, it just makes sure that that specialization is generated.
You could now place that in another TU and it would link fine.
user142019
All identifiers that begin with an underscore and either an uppercase letter or another underscore are always reserved for any use.
All identifiers that begin with an underscore are always reserved for use as identifiers with file scope in both the ordinary and tag name spaces.
Each macro name in any of the following subclauses (including the future library directions) is reserved for use as specified if any of its associated headers is included; unless explicitly stated otherwise (see 7.1.4).
All identifiers with external linkage in any of the following subclauses (including the future library d
and in this case it doesn't need <> after template
user142019
Other identifiers are not reserved.
13:25
@TonyTheLion With <> after template, it is a slightly different entity.
@R.MartinhoFernandes oh?
user142019
@DeadMG C code using template as identifier will also break.
@R.MartinhoFernandes No, you're not!
@Zoidberg Didn't realize C++ did either.
Guy pulled the "pragmatism" card to justify giving misleading advice. Fuck it, I don't care if JavaScript programmers will keep on getting it wrong.
13:26
@R.MartinhoFernandes Who?
Doesn't matter.
@R.MartinhoFernandes It matters to me.
Kinda why I asked
user142019
@DeadMG Each name that contains a double underscore __ or begins with an underscore followed by an uppercase letter (2.11) is reserved to the implementation for any use.
user142019
:P
You made me reopen that tab. I hate you.
This comes down to pragmatism vs idealism, I have already edited the post to clarify that I am stating from a pragmatic point of view. — Esailija 13 mins ago
@Zoidberg I thought it had to start with a double.
user142019
@DeadMG that's in C.
I don't know why they changed that.
user142019
It seems silly.
int main() { int x__ = 0; } // valid C, borked C++
13:29
He's not that wrong.
user142019
libgit2 is broken in C++. :v
user142019
Not that it will break in any respectable fucking implementation.
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Yes, he is. JavaScript strings are not different than the others. C strings are strings of abstract characters, at least if you don't try to have non-basic-character-set characters. And so on.
how do I delete rasterizer state created with CreateRasterizerState?
in d3d11
> they do just work.
13:30
How do I read documentation
> you don't have to worry about that
I can only create 4096 rasterizer states, so I need to delete them when they aren't needed
@R.MartinhoFernandes I read your a where you say you use cl. does that mean you use use VS in daily work... if so I would like to know if 2012 is more stable than damn 2010... that freezes on me a lot and when it works feels like a slug ... huge sln but still
How does he know?
@CatPlusPlus there's nothing about removing it in MSDN
13:31
@NoSenseEtAl I don't use 2012.
@R.MartinhoFernandes ahh... lets hope that for 2014/6 theyll rebuild the damn thing from scratch :D
It's a COM object
Currently I have 2008 and 2010 installed (never fired up 2008 though)
You manage it like every other COM object
I mean, remove it from the video card
13:32
@R.MartinhoFernandes 2005, 2008, 2010, 2012 RC... though i only use 2010 for work
user142019
I have only 2012.
user142019
Not that I ever use it.
user142019
Vim. \o/
Nano. \o/
Ell
Ell
Gedit \o/
13:33
@R.MartinhoFernandes I think he's trying to say that JavaScript strings are more abstract than C strings, which are defined explicitly as a sequence of bytes. I find it hard to disagree with that assessment.
But Notepad++ is the best
For scripts
For C and C++, Visual Studio is the best
Visual Studio 2008
@LightnessRacesinOrbit My point about being misleading still stands.
user142019
@Ell ಠ_ಠ
Ell
Ell
but when I feel like it I'm trying to learn vim :P
(And I don't really see your point)
String value

primitive value that is a finite ordered sequence of zero or more 16-bit unsigned integer
@LightnessRacesinOrbit This is the definition from the ECMA spec.
13:35
lol dx.h sucks
Seems pretty much the same as in C, except with bigger "bytes" and known signedness.
@Zoidberg Visual Assist :)
Ell
Ell
Ahhh feck. I have to go on the radio on friday :(
(Also, the ECMA spec is missing a final "s"! UB!)
radio o_O
user142019
13:40
@Ell why
Ell
Ell
fo some school thing
oh
sounds like phun
@SiPlus lol you're still using that antique?
@DeadMG I would if it supported Metro development
13:42
I think everyone here will agree that for C++ Visual Studio 2008 is definitely not the best.
Exhibit A: missing C++11 support.
@R.MartinhoFernandes I write mostly in C89
Oh, a time traveller.
@R.MartinhoFernandes No, it's just enough to manipulate bytes
@R.MartinhoFernandes There are no structures in x86 assembly
13:44
C is definitely not "just enough to manipulate bytes". Exhibit A: structures.
@SiPlus I thought you just wanted to manipulate bytes.
I suspect our time traveller is still suffering from jet time machine lag.
I write in JS using WebGL too
user142019
As long as my Internet connection is not suffering from severe lag.
I see C, JS and asm
I am out for half an hour and room goes bananas
13:45
@BartekBanachewicz Not even C. C89.
🍌
@R.MartinhoFernandes what. how.
@melak47 what do those 2 bytes mean?
3 mins ago, by SiPlus
@R.MartinhoFernandes I write mostly in C89
oh my
@SiPlus it's a banana.
13:46
not sure if trolling or a fossil
@SiPlus Those are four bytes.
Stack Overflow serves in UTF-8.
@R.MartinhoFernandes unicode char, cr, lf?
@BartekBanachewicz we did C89 in uni :(
@BartekBanachewicz why?
user142019
C89 is a bad language.
user142019
13:47
C11 is better but still bad.
@BartekBanachewicz it's very convenient to use
OH GOD NOT ANOTHER.
user1357851
@CatPlusPlus I don't think name changing will stop newbs from hitting this room - they will simply be attracted to the most active room, and usually it means this lounge. With that said, it did reduce their numbers (pity we don't keep stats)
PLEASE GET OUT OR STOP SAYING THAT. It doesn't end well.
We have experienced that before.
what is convenient?
13:48
@BartekBanachewicz STOP IT
All the bugs
user142019
Use Haskell or Python.
@BartekBanachewicz ANSI C
are very convenient
oh my fucking
13:48
I like this room because I have been an active C++ programmer in the past.
@Zoidberg lol python
it's for kids
And unreadable unmaintainable code
@SiPlus C89 is not ANSI C.
it's interpreted
Job security
13:48
@BartekBanachewicz mad bro?
ROBOT HE USED CONVENIENT AND ANSI C IN ONE SENTENCE STOP ME
@BartekBanachewicz Whoa, dude, calm down.
someone is wrong on the internet
user142019
@BartekBanachewicz ANSI C is not convenient.
user142019
I did too!
13:49
@Zoidberg what?
ANSI C is the opposite of convenient.
it is the anti-convenient
We all know that ANSI C is an inconvenient pile of language.
@Zoidberg you used "not convenient"
ANSI C is convenient.
@SiPlus If you think ANSI C is C89 you are indeed a time traveller.
13:49
The lack of pointers in modern languages is inconvenient
Don't laugh at debrained people
4
(sorry)
@SiPlus AHAHAHAHAHAHA
user142019
@BartekBanachewicz that's a superstring of "convenient".
@CatPlusPlus oh sorry too late
13:49
it's the epitome of convenient failures.
(pro-tip ANSI C hasn't been C89 for more than a decade)
i mean I wanted to say i am tired of bashing C
@BartekBanachewicz don't bash it
but this guy is hilarious
write code in it
13:50
oh my
he is trolling
Why would you want to write code in this piece of shit pray tell
user142019
Hey why do I see your messages again.
he wants us to have fun
user142019
Plonk feature y u borked.
13:50
@BartekBanachewicz no, I'm not, it's my personal opinion on C and modern languages
@Zoidberg whos?
@SiPlus noone is that stupid
user142019
@TonyTheLion SiPlus'.
so my conclusion is he is a troll and we should laugh
13:51
ahahahahahahahah
@BartekBanachewicz stfu
user142019
ha
@SiPlus That's agressive.
@BartekBanachewicz That H2CO3 guy thinks the same. He even came here to defend that stupid point of view before.
He's just bad at programming
13:52
@SiPlus you didn't allocate memory for that, you piece of C
Don't laugh that can happen to anyone
I take the red lazor cannon today.
Also we need better ammunition than "reverse a string"
C is actually better than C++, because you don't have to deal with RAII, templates, classes and inheritance. This stuff is only used in college anyway.
6
13:53
troll lol lol
user142019
GTFO
@BartekBanachewicz Did I mention that's a terrible example?
room topic changed to Lounge<>: In comes the troll, out comes the lol! [c++] [c++11] [no-helpdesk]

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