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15:01
greetings comrades, I have a small Python question if anyone wants to help?
@jawrainey post it on SO
no
I can safely say that absolutely nobody wishes to aid you
damn you all!
give up now
0
A: Vague and unclear "Comment cannot contain that content" error

Lightness Races in OrbitI can't help you with this particular case but, in general, I'd really like to see better error messages here. If the rejection message was too specific about what's wrong, users would probably just do the simplest thing to bypass the rejection, i.e. add an asterisk in a suitable place or som...

15:02
I joke, but I was going to post on SO, but it's quite short
but I shall do as you say @Pris!
you're such a pris
@jawrainey If you post it on SO, then the next person who has that question will have somewhere to look it up
But if it isn't a question that people would ever look up, only then I think you should spam it in chat :p
I understand, but I think it's probably there. I just can't seem to word my problem correctly at the moment
Essentially, I just want to increment a number
> The memory allocated to array as two components: A consecutively allocated segment of memory boxes of the same type, and A Box with the same name as the array. This box holds the address of the base (i.e., first) element of the array.
Where do people get this nonsense from?
nfi
user1804599
15:07
@FredOverflow top kek
Does pytthon not have a '++' operator
but it's preceded with zeroes, i.e. 000014. Of course, I can come up with hackish ways to solve my problem, but they feel 'wrong'
user1804599
speaking of arrays I have no idea how to implement them
Don't use whython
@FredOverflow :(
user1804599
@Pris no; use += 1 instead.
15:08
@FredOverflow lol this is incredibly confusing
(Note: it's currently a string as converting to int etc removes preceding zeroes)
Ell
Ell
What can I have with steak?
I can perform string operations on it, but it's all quite hackish
user1804599
I could make arrays of different types if they have different lengths.
Another steak
15:09
@Ell fries
user1804599
Then the amount of memory needed can be computed from the type.
Ell
Ell
I already had chips yesterdy
who here hated fries again? was it bartek
@Ell I usually consume human flesh with mine
user1804599
yeah that's nice
user1804599
15:10
then you can also restrict a variable to a specific array size
user1804599
e.g. let foo: Array(Int, 42) = ....
Ell
Ell
I'll have a steak sammich
@FredOverflow what the hell
@Pris Probably. Bartek hates everything good and loves everything crap
@jawrainey Remove the zeros, convert to int, add one, convert to string, add zeros
user1804599
15:12
fucking awesome :D
@milleniumbug - That's how I am doing it, but thought that there may be a better way :)
@R.MartinhoFernandes impressive
@FredOverflow it's not wrong, is it?
user1804599
@StackedCrooked it's not specified by standard that it must be implemented that way
@jawrainey Alternatively, store it always as a number, and do a conversion "on-the-fly", as needed
user1804599
15:14
the address of the first element can be put in a register
add the zeroes for display only
user1804599
or not be there at all
@LightnessRacesinOrbit - the zeroes are required. (It's an ID in an ontology file)
@jawrainey required for what?
Indeed
I could remove them. Top thought @райтфолд, @LightnessRacesinOrbit
no, that's not what I meant....
I think you're interpreting the file's format constraints as constraints on your implementation that in fact don't exist
too late, if it fails it's all your fault!
15:16
a number is a....
You're right
complete the sentence, @R.MartinhoFernandes
12
A: Is there a way to take a series of zeros as an int input?

R. Martinho Fernandes"Three". "3". "Threeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee". "03". "003". "0003". "00000000000000003". "III". "٣". "11". "३". "三". "Γʹ". What do all the above things have in common? They're all representations of the number three†. Are the representations different? Yes. Are the numbers they represent different? No. ...

@LightnessRacesinOrbit scaled down, your avatar looks like a contemplative Gob from Arrested Development
@StackedCrooked sizeof(int[10]) is defined to be 10*sizeof(int). Where is the space for the additional box? Also, what purpose would it serve?
15:17
Thanks @R.MartinhoFernandes
0
A: How to get a header only library portably from version control using CMake?

gnzlbgI finally got it to work, this FindLibraryName.cmake tries to find the library and if it doesn't find it, gets it from github and sets it up as an external project: # Find the Library_Name include directory # The following variables are set if Library_Name is found. # Library_Name_FOUND ...

user1804599
@R.MartinhoFernandes OP wants COBOL!
@gnzlbg Is that something we should be excited about?
@FredOverflow wat
15:18
@райтфолд Of course a language designed for use by accountants would fuck up the concept of number.
@FredOverflow I'm excited that it just works. Every header only library on github or similar should provide a FindLib.cmake that does that.
@FredOverflow Yeah. That doesn't seem right indeed.
It also works for non-header only libraries but i don't know what happens with dynamic dependencies.
@LightnessRacesinOrbit you do know who that is right?
user1804599
ok so
user1804599
array types will have a length
user1804599
and they'll be subtypes of lengthless array types
user1804599
Should Array(T, N) be a supertype of Array(T, N+1)?
@райтфолд Why not? Liskov principle is satisfied.
user3010322
@CatPlusPlus No heavy-hitting books I really want yet.
@milleniumbug Shouldn't that be the other way around?
also I don't really see why super/subtyping is required here.
@Puppy If a function wants to play with 10 elements, you can give it 11 elements, no harm done.
@Puppy No, not really. Array(T, N+1) can do all the things Array(T, N) can.
15:33
@Puppy Because rightfold loves type theory?
@райтфолд Isn't that kinda how D treats arrays?
user1804599
no idea
user1804599
Then N can default to 0!
@milleniumbug Yes, so wouldn't that make N+1 the supertype?
user1804599
no
ah, maybe I've just gotten "super" and "sub" mixed up. Can't people just use "base" and "derived"?
user1804599
15:38
let x: Array(Int, 5) = Array(Int, 3).new(1, 2, 3) would break
@Puppy Bjarne?
what about Bjarne?
That's exactly what Bjarne once said.
He could never figure out which is sub and which is super type.
So he uses base and derived.
I can never remember which is which either
sup and subber types
15:40
Super is superior, so it's up high, which is upcasted to.
that's cos u is dumb
In a normal UML diagramm, subtypes are found below the supertypes.
super is on top, think geneology, think parents, think inherited-from
not hard
yes but who gives a shit about UML?
I certainly don't
UML = U may laugh (now)
15:41
<sub> and <sup>
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Four minutes? Does that mean it's the docking sequence plus seven seconds of credits?
user1804599
@FredOverflow ⊤ is at the top of the hierarchy, and the _super_type of all types. :)
@райтфолд I have no trouble remembering it.
@R.MartinhoFernandes there are 3 seconds of docking sequence ;p
15:42
@LightnessRacesinOrbit So they removed 3:50 of essential parts of the movie.
:P
user1804599
Or: a supertype is like a superset; it contains all values of its subtypes.
A supertype is like Superman. It flies.
user3010322
A type that's too fly for its friends.
@R.MartinhoFernandes Exactly how does Superman fly, anyway? Python?
@райтфолд Why? Also, as opposed to the reverse not breaking (lol)?
N+1 is a superset of N
@CatPlusPlus What happens if you write to the last element of the array?
Ell
Ell
lol such appropriate images: i.imgur.com/UORp8mp.png
@FredOverflow He flies by impersonating Birdman.
@R.MartinhoFernandes Is Birdman the same as Birdperson from Rick & Morty?
15:45
@Ell wat
No. Birdman is unique.
Lesley, play with my balls.
@FredOverflow Eh
Eh = got it?
Yeh
The idea is dumb anyway
user1804599
@FredOverflow nothing
user1804599
15:46
let x: Array(T, 5) = ...;
let y: Array(T, 3) = x;
x(4) = 42; -- this is totally fine and doesn't affect y at all
It's probably one of those contravariant cases :)
Oh, a brand new calculator unboxing video. I hope it's as good as the other ones :)
Ell
Ell
I think I'll buy one of these... ebay.co.uk/itm/…
I think I finally figured out what I find so enticing about Birdman: it's a strange loop. /cc @AndyProwl
user1804599
@FredOverflow it is fine
user1804599
You can see an array as a homogenous tuple.
user1804599
15:55
struct Array0 { };
struct Array1 : Array0 { T x1; };
struct Array2 : Array1 { T x2; };
user1804599
^ This works just fine as well.
Cat "Hate this food." Me "Have this instead." Cat "LOVE IT." Me "Same bowl. I moved it." Cat "I am fire & the wind. Do not try to know me."
> ammonia and alcohol are substances that increase a user's strength.
Hypothesis: Any substance containing a nitrogen atom has the ability to increase a user's strength.
try cyanide
I highly recommend it
oh fuck
16:01
I'm coding in .NET and I have a sudden requirement to inherit from two classes.
who the fuck designs this shit
@Puppy what's a problem with that?
@BartekBanachewicz The problem is that the designers of .NET are too braindead to permit it
and on a related note, "Oh I'm sorry sir, we're too stupid to have a nullable of this T because it happens to be a pointer and our nullable<T> just isn't actually generic"
@Puppy wait why is this a .NET problem? Do you mean CLR? Or C#?
@Puppy it's not like C#'s type system is the greatest on the planet, no.
@Puppy that being said, a pointer has null value by convention
why do you need a nullable pointer?
well, it's actually an opaque handle that happens to be typedeffed to be a pointer.
@DonLarynx lol ammonia would increase a user's death. Where did that stupid come from:)
16:06
but I only found this out when like a normal person I decided to opt for nullable rather than rely on API implementation details for x86
@Puppy does its opaqueness consider assigning a null value?
@BartekBanachewicz Not... really. You can have a null value, but it's not the null pointer specifically, just 0, so it could be an integer somewhere else, and in addition, the null value actually represents a specific hidden object and is therefore not useful to represent the nonexistence of a value of this type.
I could of course simply destroy all type safety and use a Nullable<System::IntPtr>.
value struct State {
    APISTATE state;
};
System::Nullable<State> state;
problem solved!
Isn't there a shorthand notation, State? state; ?
in C#, yes
not in C++/CLI.
16:11
and also that would not function anyway since APISTATE? is System.Nullable<APISTATE>, which is illegal.
@MartinJames google.com/…
I've personally used it to good effect. ("However, a high concentration of inhaled ammonia might burn the nasal or oral mucosa")
In other news
> In popular culture, the fantasy genre is predominantly of the medievalist form.
here's another fun- you can have internal members on classes but apparently not on interfaces.
at this rate I'll have to make Wide/CLI and use that.
> So, thanks Haskell. You made my head hurt more than anything I’ve tried learning since Physics, but apparently you’ve made me a better programmer.
@Puppy why the hell would you have members on interfaces? o.O
@Puppy Wide's never going to become a usable thing at this rate
as in, assuming you continue working on it, you'll die before that.
@BartekBanachewicz You mean, apart from all the reasons I might normally put them on a class?
also, after every year of development you put into wide passes, it becomes more outdated and irrelevant
@Puppy A class isn't an interface. The reasons don't hold at all.
Did you mean to say "an abstract class" instead of an interface, when you wanted members?
16:16
the problem with that is that MI is banned.
so even if there's absolutely no problem at all, then it's banned.
@Puppy you can implement multiple interfaces, but you can't have multiple base classes. Wanting to put members on an interface is another, unrelated, dumb and nonexisting problem.
yes
in a not-at-all kind of way.
as long as you can't have multiple bases, then it completely makes sense to want to put members on an interface.
@Puppy are you aware of a concept of mathematical implication?
its truth table, specifically?
I fail to see what binary logical operators have to do with the insanity of not permitting MI for shits and giggles.
@Puppy answer the question.
16:19
"what's a problem with that" "here's another fun"
how come you two have lost the ability to speak English?
well, no, I totally forgot which one of the many boolean operators I don't find a need for implication is.
one is permitted to object to an irrelevant question rather than answering it
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Not in Bartek's school of rhetoric.
@Puppy it serves as a very useful analogy here.
16:21
@R.MartinhoFernandes the Strawman Scientific Academy you mean?
Hmm. "Rhetoric" is a term that has been twisted into a demeaning meaning.
once you start with a statement P that's absolutely bullshit, like you can't have multiple bases (F), you can get to any Q, it being true or false, producing true in the end
That's not an analogy, btw.
@R.MartinhoFernandes what is it, then?
Commonly presented as "If false, pigs can fly". Though it's utterly irrelevant to anything you've been discussing so far.
16:22
well, when you can compile a program in C++/CLI which involves one ref class inheriting from two other ref classes, let me know, because I'd be quite happy for that right now.
I am not aware how to formally express implication in terms of logical reasoning.
I've found this
Logical consequence (also entailment) is one of the most fundamental concepts in logic. It is the relationship between statements that holds true when one logically "follows from" one or more others. A valid logical argument is one in which the conclusions follow from its premises, and its conclusions are consequences of its premises. The philosophical analysis of logical consequence involves asking, 'in what sense does a conclusion follow from its premises?' and 'what does it mean for a conclusion to be a consequence of premises?' All of philosophical logic can be thought of as providing accounts...
"I am not aware how to reason logically"*
@Puppy is there any reason why you can't compose?
A implies B means that, by the axioms, A can be converted to B.
Xeo
Xeo
THINGS WOOOORK, WHOO
user3010322
16:24
@Xeo 'Gratsu.
@BartekBanachewicz Yes. The shared logic involves implementing an interface.
@Puppy I don't see how implementing any interface is relevant here.
hi @Fanael!
yeah, no, the thing he's trying to do is not relevant
user784668
16:25
How do I select in mysql?
5
:) Lounge<Shitty Technologies>
well it's pretty fucking clear that if you compose from another class, you cannot magically make your virtual functions forward to it, it's virtual functions forward to you, gain all implicit conversions/operators/etc that are involved, and also make for example the GetType() and such return equal for both.
since they are two separate objects.
Ell
Ell
@R.MartinhoFernandes it's an allegory
the lion, the witch and the bartek
when in reality I have one object and one class.
16:27
you can't make one class compose from another but seamlessly appear to inherit from it.
user784668
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Obviously.
lol, serious MySQL :)
My Serious Query Language
user3010322
MySeriousQueryLanguage
user3010322
16:28
Awww
user3010322
I was beaten to it. :c
user784668
@MartinJames I once seriously ran rm over mysql
user3010322
q_q rekt
Ell
Ell
Who knows anything about TeX rendering?
user784668
16:28
10/10 would rm again
Donald Knuth does
and I know some
Ell
Ell
I wonder how it knows how to render integral signs and the like
@Puppy thank god you like OOP and solving problems with it
what do you mean "how to"?
Ell
Ell
Are integral signs in the font?
16:29
I wouldn't know how to do that.
@R.MartinhoFernandes I downloaded it a few days ago, haven't watched it yet. That makes me look forward!
it doesn't like download them on demand from the internet if that's what you mean
@BartekBanachewicz You can't do that because .NET is a worthless piece of shit.
All those complicated inheritancies and objects and classes
Ell
Ell
16:29
I guess my question was about whos responsibility it was to render fancy symbols, the font or TeX.
C++ and Wide can handle this non-problem just fine.
@Puppy funny, I suppose that all of those programs using C# actually fake
@Puppy Best summary so far - have a star.
@Ell hi
@Puppy well Wide can't because it's esoteric
let's say that Wide hypothetically can do it
16:30
@Ell fonts don't render anything
Ell
Ell
Right. I know what I mean >.<
I'm bad at talking, etc.
but, yes, you're looking for this: fileformat.info/info/unicode/char/222b/index.htm
this is kinda the whole point of having lots of symbols in fonts
you only need one system
@BartekBanachewicz Well, actually, I have some tests for just this situation which are currently passing.
@Puppy Anyway, apparently it isn't the most important thing, considering that the number of .NET apps surpasses the number of Wide apps by... a rather wide margin.
@BartekBanachewicz It's... uh... just a plain description of an implication? I can't even tell what it is you are trying to compare here (the presence of such a comparison would make it an analogy)
user3010322
16:32
@LightnessRacesinOrbit This reminds me that I need to get Glyph Substitution working.
@R.MartinhoFernandes i dont fully understand the definition in the article I've linked; but ultimately that was what I wanted to compare it to
it isn't a bug in the browser... that is all im going to say. no point in getting into a debate if you don't understand the problem we're talking about. — self 23 mins ago
little shit
@BartekBanachewicz That's mostly because .NET has existed for 12 years and Wide hasn't.
and I think this is closer to the actual analysis of what puppy said that boolean logic implication
@Puppy Should we predict a similar number of Wide apps by the time it'd have existed for 12 years, then?
user784668
yes
16:35
go ahead.
12 years after Wide 1.0
@Puppy This is why I always design anything interfacey as interfaces in .NET. Classes are either sealed or just convenience bases that provide utilities or default implementations of interfaces.
user784668
bcuz Wide is awesomest language in the world
@R.MartinhoFernandes The problem with that is that you can't cleanly compose a default implementation.
@Fanael IKR
I see the ads already
@Puppy There's no way around it. The difference with that problem is that you can boilerplate it, while in the situation you have, you just can't anything.
16:36
Wide - the language without pattern matching!
I bet hundreds of people will be sold just after reading that
@R.MartinhoFernandes Well, instead, I simply changed the design to be more shit.
Ell
Ell
TIL about the buzzer
user3010322
The buzzer?
Ell
Ell
Why is nazi conspiracy stuff so interesting?
UVB-76, also known as "The Buzzer", is the nickname given by radio listeners to a shortwave radio station that broadcasts on the frequency 4625 kHz. It broadcasts a short, monotonous buzz tone , repeating at a rate of approximately 25 tones per minute, for 24 hours per day. On very rare occasions, the buzzer signal is interrupted and a voice transmission in Russian takes place. The first reports were made of a station on this frequency in 1982. Its origins have been traced to Russia, and although several theories with varying degrees of plausibility exist, its actual purpose has never been...
Ell
Ell
16:38
I wish they'd make a nazi zombie film already
There probably was one actually
user784668
I'd rather watch a Wide movie
@Fanael ain't nobody got time for that
user784668
@LightnessRacesinOrbit w/e, it's still the best movie ever
fuck it I'm not writing any more Perl today
3 lines is enough
let's finish sprite sheets
> sprite sheet management
user784668
16:41
Today I wrote 100 lines of Common Lisp.
user784668
And then I promptly deleted the file.
@Fanael what was it do... oh
@Fanael before it lays eggs?
or multiplies and takes over the world?
> If [the successful application of the law of attraction] is accomplished, you will have set up a miniature belief system, which, almost by definition, rejects any conflicting information (in the same way that someone on the lookout for 23 will all but ignore 1-22 and 24-infinity).
user784668
@BartekBanachewicz no, it's because I'm tired and unable to think straight
@Fanael Unless you said that you were stimulated to work and your thoughts were finesse.
How appropriate.
16:52
0
Q: Using a common project in several other projects in visual studio

ZorxI am working on a multi-solution project on VS 2013 in C (I must use C for this project). I implemented one "Common" project that I intended to use as a reference in another project. So I have one solution with a common.h and a matching common.c source in which I implemented all the common functi...

ugh
dat formatting
lol:
10
Q: How to stop the toddler from `deliberately` throwing things out of balcony?

TheIndependentAquariusThe girl is 20 months old, and it is not her fault that she loves her game of picking things from the room and throwing them out of balcony and watching them fall. She has been told in plain English not to do this, and she does understand that perfectly. But, she still does this on purpose - I k...

user784668
TIL register allocation is not a problem I should tackle when I'm tired.
Unless you believed that you weren't tired, and that your stamina was far greater than you imagined.
I created an account to comment this. My first thought on reading the title: 'Throw the child', my second thought was: 'I am a horrible person'. — James Massey yesterday
@Ell Meh. Hitler riding a T-Rex named Blondie sounds much better.
16:54
@MartinJames is that panda transport?
Ell
Ell
> Nazis on the moon was just scraping the surface
@R.MartinhoFernandes I was gonna say, that has probably already been done
@Ell hehe
scraping the surface of the moon
@sehe It's a pun on scraping the surface of the Earth, I think.
Because Hitler is hiding in Hollow Earth.
Ell
Ell
I was hoping for something more subtle, and in WW2 era :P
This just looks pure ridiculous
16:57
hm the new youtube hook is a thing
@Ell Sounds like they succeeded.
> Hitler
> More subtle
Contradiction detected
I thought it was embedded in the video
@BartekBanachewicz what is that about
so, how are sprite sheets usually stored
@sehe it displays video titles
don't you see it? in the chat
Ell
Ell
16:58
I was half expecting him to say "Mein neger"
@BartekBanachewicz ah. Onebox "provider" :)
user784668
@BartekBanachewicz The same way other sprites are. There's nothing special about sprites depicting sheets.
@sehe yeah that
@Fanael nah. A sprite sheet has more sprites in one, welp, atlas. Or does the word "sheet" imply they are all equally sized and I should differentiate?
It's really functionality/naming question
user784668
@BartekBanachewicz whoosh
16:59
9 mins ago, by Fanael
@BartekBanachewicz no, it's because I'm tired and unable to think straight
@BartekBanachewicz Typically all sprites in a sheet are equally sized, because it simplifies things.

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